Shownotes
Langdon Tactical's vice president Amy Langdon joins John and Kaylee to talk about the part of gun ownership that does not get enough airtime: the on-ramp. Millions of people have become new gun owners over the last several years, and Amy's view is that the community keeps losing them at the door. She breaks down what inhibited her own concealed carry journey, from being handed a heavy revolver to being told she had to dress a certain way, and makes the case that you can be a responsible, proficient firearm owner without living at an extreme tactical perfection level. The conversation keeps returning to one question she likes to ask: who is responsible for your safety?
A large stretch of the episode is about raising kids around firearms. Amy argues against the instinct to hide guns and refuse to discuss them, comparing it to how we teach kids about fire and knives. She shares two real moments with her young son, a deliberate test with an unloaded gun on the bathroom counter and an unplanned encounter with a guest's holstered gun on a dresser, where he stopped, did not touch it, and told an adult exactly as he had been taught at age four. The hosts and Amy connect this to fear: there is healthy fear and there is bad fear, and education is what separates the two. They also dig into the realities of carrying as a mom, including off-body carry, accessibility, situational awareness, de-escalation, and the mindset shift that comes with choosing to carry.
The back half turns to choosing a gun and the culture around it. Amy lays out simple criteria, what fits your hand and what the gun is for, and pushes back on the older guys who tell every woman she needs a .40 caliber revolver. Both Kaylee and Amy talk about their inexpensive first guns and argue hard against shaming new owners over budget firearms, because telling someone they are wasting their money tells them their life is not worth defending. They cover training, competition as stress inoculation, the value of gun stores and the people behind the counter, paralysis by analysis, and the importance of being a supportive spouse rather than your partner's instructor. The throughline ties back to GOA's member-focused philosophy: a gun owner is a law-abiding American exercising a constitutionally protected right, and a welcoming, positive community is where the next generation of gun owners will come from.
Links
Questions this episode answers
What is the on-ramp to the Second Amendment community, and why do new gun owners get lost at the door?
The on-ramp is how millions of new gun owners first enter the community, and Amy Langdon argues the community keeps losing them at the door by forcing an extreme tactical standard and dictating how they carry or dress. You can be a responsible, proficient firearm owner without living at that level of perfection.
How should parents talk to kids about guns instead of hiding them?
Amy Langdon argues against hiding guns and refusing to discuss them, comparing firearms education to how we teach kids about fire and knives. Meeting kids at their maturity level and showing them what a gun does and what to do if they see one means they generally will not touch it.
Why are women's motivations for becoming gun owners often different from men's?
Much of what inhibited Amy Langdon's own concealed carry journey came from being handed a heavy revolver and told she had to dress a certain way, a different on-ramp than men typically face. The throughline is the question she likes to ask: who is responsible for your safety?
How does carrying change when you are a mom, and is off-body carry acceptable?
Carrying as a mom brings real tradeoffs around accessibility, situational awareness, de-escalation, and a mindset shift, and off-body carry is part of that practical conversation. The episode treats it as a legitimate choice rather than something to dismiss.
What criteria should a first-time buyer use to choose a gun?
Amy Langdon keeps it simple: pick what fits your hand and what the gun is actually for, and ignore the old advice that every woman needs a .40 caliber revolver. If you have never shot before, handle and shoot guns at a range or store first to feel how they operate in your hand.
Why should the community stop shaming people over budget-friendly firearms?
Both Kaylee and Amy Langdon started with inexpensive guns and push back hard on shaming new owners over budget firearms. Telling someone they are wasting their money tells them their life is not worth defending, the opposite of a welcoming community.
How does competition help you prepare for shooting under real stress?
Amy Langdon practices and competes, including tactical games, and treats competition as stress inoculation that prepares you to perform under pressure. It is one piece of the training picture alongside situational awareness and de-escalation.
Should you be the one to teach your spouse to shoot, or hire an instructor?
The episode makes the case for being a supportive spouse rather than your partner's instructor, since you do not have to fill that role yourself. Bringing in an instructor protects both the relationship and the learning.
Chapters
- 00:24 — Meet Amy Langdon and LTT Discover
- 02:05 — The on-ramp to the 2A community
- 04:47 — The middle ground beyond super tactical
- 06:46 — Why women's motivations are different
- 09:53 — Teaching kids about firearms
- 12:46 — Real-life tests with their son
- 15:38 — Healthy fear versus bad fear
- 17:45 — Choosing a gun that fits your hand
- 23:17 — Carrying as a mom and off-body carry
- 28:30 — Competition and stress training
- 38:37 — Situational awareness and de-escalation
- 50:18 — Permitless carry and more training
- 58:37 — Stop shaming budget-friendly first guns
- 1:16:07 — Gun stores and the people behind the counter
- 1:35:16 — Be the support person, not the instructor
- 1:48:35 — Where to find Amy and Langdon Tactical
About the guest
Amy Langdon is the Vice President of Langdon Tactical. The business has two sections: a product side that does custom gun work, sells firearms, and makes custom accessories and parts that go on guns, and LTT Discover, an educational site that meets gun owners where they are with tips, information, and training on becoming a more proficient firearms owner. She runs the company alongside her husband, a firearms instructor, and they have a son. She practices and competes, including tactical games, and carries a Glock 43X with a Langdon Tactical trigger job and stipple, a Hellcat, and a 92 compact with a red dot. She can be found on Instagram at @amy_hike.lift.shoot.
Key quotes
"there's a place to be a responsible firearms owner and be proficient with your handgun and know how to use it and want to have it without having it forced down your throat at this extreme perfection level, if that makes sense." — Amy Langdon
"if you can meet kids where they're at in that maturity level and teach them what to do if they see a gun and what a gun does and show them how dangerous it is, then generally they will not touch it." — Amy Langdon
"there's healthy fear and then there's dangerous, bad fear." — Kaylee
"if you've never shot a gun before, before you purchase a gun, you should go to a local range, a local gun store, or with some friends into a safe place and feel how guns operate, how they shoot, and what it feels like in your hand." — Amy Langdon
"If someone would have said, you know, you're wasting your money, you're wasting your time, what they would have been telling me, whether they admitted to it or not, is your life isn't valuable because you don't have the money to start." — Kaylee
"the last thing that we should be doing as a second amendment community is saying oh you can't sit with us like you, you can't be a part of this because you are less than." — Kaylee
"You don't have to be the instructor for your spouse." — Kaylee
Transcripts
How you doing today?
Speaker B:I'm good.
Speaker C:I got to sit on the beach for an hour yesterday.
Speaker C:It was great.
Speaker A:It's totally different than Arizona, right?
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:This desert lizard was very grateful for the ocean and the white sand.
Speaker C:It was not red.
Speaker C:It was fantastic.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:You're not over like the 120 degree days and the.
Speaker C:No, it was beautiful.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker C:But John and Kaylee, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker C:I'm Amy Langdon, Vice president from Langdon Tactical.
Speaker C:And we have two sections of our business.
Speaker C:We have the product section where we do a lot of custom gun work, sell firearms and then do custom accessories or innovative pieces and parts that go on guns.
Speaker C:And then we have a second piece of our business called LTT Discover, which is a educational site of kind of meeting the gun owner, where they're at, whether they're thinking about carry or they're already well versed and in their everyday carry life and kind of providing information, tips and education on how to be a more proficient firearms owner.
Speaker A:Yeah, and I really applaud you guys for doing that piece of the business.
Speaker A:I've watched some of the videos of you guys are getting a lot of different people or people with expertise in their field to do videos for you guys.
Speaker A:Like Lucky Gunner did an ammo video guys, for you guys.
Speaker A:So it's cool that you guys are pulling in different sections of the industry to help out and teach people those important things when it comes to becoming a new gun owner.
Speaker A:Because we've seen that spike ridiculously over the last couple of years.
Speaker C:Over the last several years, there's millions of new gun owners and it is awesome to be pulling in and working with a lot of people within the industry who are more educated on different topics than we are.
Speaker C:We don't know everything, but it's very fun to also bring in kind of that outside perspective of this is the non tactical, non law enforcement, non military perspective of, you know, everyday people.
Speaker C:How do we talk to them, how do we help and how do we make things more informative in a really constructive way.
Speaker B:I think that's so important because I think we always talk about what is the on ramp to the second Amendment community.
Speaker B:And a lot of people don't understand that for an everyday, average person that isn't thinking about their rights is, isn't thinking about how am I going to tactically sit at the restaurant where I have visual on the door.
Speaker B:All of those things that you learn over time if you want to be in that headspace.
Speaker B:And I encourage people to get in that Headspace.
Speaker B:But what's the on ramp to that?
Speaker B:And I think organizations and what you guys are doing is so critical to providing that on ramp because the jump seems difficult at times to people.
Speaker B:But when they see what's going on in the world with crime rates, or when they just feel a little insecure themselves, organizations and companies providing that on ramp is critical not just to the second amendment community as it stands right now, but where we hope the community.
Speaker C:Will be 5, 10 years from now, 100%.
Speaker C:I think that that is one of the key reasons we really started all this is that when you talk about being aware and being ready or being prepared, however you want to word that you have more people wanting to do that.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Who's responsible for your safety?
Speaker C:There's a lot of people that are saying, well it's me, I'm responsible for my safety.
Speaker C:And I don't know where to start.
Speaker C:And I think giving them a safe place to start and a safe place to be and a safe place to say, well, I don't know, but I'm thinking about it, that's okay.
Speaker C:You cannot know and you can think about it and you can still want a firearm, but it doesn't mean that you have to be this, you know, highly tactical and really regimented, follow all these rules and regulations and shoot.
Speaker C:That's the wrong way to say that.
Speaker C:But it doesn't mean that you have to be super tactical and you know, shoot a two inch group in one and a half seconds from a concealed carry holster wearing a, a vest in a helmet.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There's, there's a place to be a responsible firearms owner and be proficient with your handgun and know how to use it and want to have it without having it forced down your throat at this extreme perfection level, if that makes sense.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And we've seen kind of this like change over the last few years and there's kind of this middle ground that we're trying to find for the newer people.
Speaker A: old FUD stuff, fishing vest,: Speaker A:And then, or you're wearing like drop leg holster and all the super tactical.
Speaker A:There's this middle ground that a lot of people don't kind of talk about.
Speaker C:Where you forget about plaid shirts and tactical pants.
Speaker A:I'm sorry, I forgot about the plaid shirts and tactical.
Speaker A:But there's like the middle ground where you don't have to always be in a super tactical readiness ready to go shoot a 2 inch group and take down 12 terrorists in a hostage situation.
Speaker A:Like, there's a, there's a space for people just to be a firearms owner who carries from time to time or when they feel comfortable.
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, you're hitting on two really interesting points there.
Speaker C:One is dress and two is choosing when to carry.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Starting with the dress.
Speaker C:I think what inhibited my concealed carry journey the most was, was one, the type of firearm that I was told that I needed to start shooting with by my husband.
Speaker C:And while, yes, he's right, a revolver helped me learn a trigger and be a good shooter, it really inhibited my adoption of concealed carry because it was very difficult to move and operate.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:That mental transition of loading a revolver and having it ready was not.
Speaker C:It just didn't resonate with me.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:It was very heavy.
Speaker C:And then the second piece was, well, you have to dress a certain way.
Speaker C:You have to change what you wear.
Speaker C:And I'm like, excuse me, I wear yoga pants and racerback tank tops.
Speaker C:I am not wearing tactical pants in plaid.
Speaker C:You are barking up the wrong tree.
Speaker C:But you know, as part of that there's, there was so much information out there and so many different options that he had just not explored either because he was so tactical and came from that tactical environment that moving into the everyday carry.
Speaker C:Moving into the everyday carry aspect, as you know, this non structured person was very difficult for him to understand.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think that the motivation, especially behind women gun ownership doesn't get talked about very often.
Speaker B:And the whys can sometimes be very different.
Speaker B:I think it's, it's kind of standard or it's very clear cut for guys.
Speaker B:They're.
Speaker B:I'm the protector.
Speaker B:Like I've got this and I need to have this.
Speaker B:This is a tool and that's great.
Speaker B:And I don't want to take away from that.
Speaker B:And I'm not saying that women can't have that aspect, but I do think that something changes for a woman when she's put in a position where it's insecure and she feels unsafe to step up and say, okay, I actually really do feel like I need something.
Speaker B:I'm on a college campus and there are reported rapes, not infrequently.
Speaker B:My security right now is to run and hit a button to alert someone that something is happening.
Speaker B:Like that's a lot of moving parts.
Speaker B:So maybe I need to look at something and kind of be my own first responder.
Speaker B:Or maybe you're a mom and you're sitting there and you're going, you know Human trafficking is a very big deal.
Speaker B:I have really cute kids.
Speaker B:How am I going to defend them?
Speaker B:And so, like, there are different motivations on why that I don't think are talked about often from the female perspective.
Speaker C:Yeah, I totally agree with you.
Speaker C:And I went to a big university and I'm laughing because there were several buttons along a mile long bridge, like, what's somebody gonna do in the middle of this bridge?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There's a deep river below me.
Speaker C:And it really comes down to who's responsible for your safety.
Speaker C:And I love seeing more women.
Speaker C:More woman women.
Speaker C:That was the plural.
Speaker C:I love seeing more women take responsibility into their own hands.
Speaker C:And I think that there are a lot of things out there that have helped women adopt firearms carry as an everyday carry, but also just being more safe in their home, feeling like they can take control if they need to, should something bad happen.
Speaker C:There's, you know, kids bring in a whole new layer.
Speaker C:I have one cute kid, but it does bring in a whole new layer of adopting a firearm and being ready to welcome that into your home and into your space.
Speaker C:Because there's so many different safety layers from, you know, having the firearm and having kids around, but also to you being confident and proficient enough to say, yes, I'm ready to do what I need to do.
Speaker C:And I know the rules and I know the laws and I know when I can take action and when I can't take action.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I know that you guys do a significant amount of training not only with women, but also with children.
Speaker B:Do you want to kind of share some of that?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So we have this whole guide, it's called teaching firearms or.
Speaker C:Sorry.
Speaker C:We came up with a guide of, you know, teaching firearms education to children.
Speaker C:And it's the one thing that as we've grown, it becomes with females the most consistent question of, well, I have kids, I can't have a gun in the house.
Speaker C:And the every time I have that conversation and I ask, it boils down to, oh, well, I need a safe.
Speaker C:Okay, yes, you need a safe.
Speaker C:It needs to be in a safe place.
Speaker C:It cannot be accessible to kids.
Speaker C:Of course.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There's rules and regulations that you want to follow in your own life to keep it safe.
Speaker C:But then it comes to talking to kids about firearms.
Speaker C:And I think that as a society, we've kind of trained that, oh, we should not tell kids what it is and we should not talk about it because it's dangerous and they shouldn't know about it.
Speaker C:And I kind of have a different mindset there Where I think that if you can meet kids where they're at in that maturity level and teach them what to do if they see a gun and what a gun does and show them how dangerous it is, then generally they will not touch it.
Speaker C:They will not use it.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You teach them about fire, and now they're scared of fire.
Speaker C:You teach them about, you know, knives and don't touch the knife.
Speaker C:Okay, I'm not gonna touch the knife.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Why is a firearm different?
Speaker C:And so I think that there's a really easy way to talk to kids about firearms, depending on their maturity level and where they're at, and teach them that this is dangerous, but this is what it is, and this is what it does.
Speaker C:This is why we have it.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:We choose to have it as a tool, or we choose to have it as a way to protect ourselves.
Speaker C:But it's for the just in case scenario.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And we see that.
Speaker A:And I like how you put that.
Speaker A:A lot of kids, the big thing is you're trying to get away from their curiosity.
Speaker A:Kids are curious.
Speaker A:If you go, no, you can't touch that.
Speaker A:They're gonna wanna touch it for sure.
Speaker A:And it's like the hot stove and the fire.
Speaker A:And just like you said.
Speaker A:And when I was teaching kids, it was the same thing.
Speaker A:Like, hey, take the curiosity out of it.
Speaker A:Teach them the steps.
Speaker A:Teach them how to be safe.
Speaker A:And when you start teaching that, they're less likely to want, like you said, to want to go and grab that and do things with it.
Speaker A:Cause they're not as curious as they were.
Speaker A:You know, I don't know about you, and I don't have any kids, but I've worked with kids in the past.
Speaker A:They will ask you, like, 40 questions on one topic.
Speaker A:And you're just like.
Speaker A:Because this is the way it is.
Speaker A:And they're like, well, why?
Speaker A:And that's by taking out that curiosity, you know, that's a good way to, you know, teach them.
Speaker A:And it's a good way to family bond and things like that.
Speaker A:And that's a good way to kind of build that family nuclear nucleus.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Well, it's a.
Speaker C:Curiosity kills the cat.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And I mean, my.
Speaker C:My son was 4.
Speaker C:And we did a test.
Speaker C:We had an empty gun.
Speaker C:It was unloaded, and we set it on the bathroom counter to kind of expose it to him, to see what he would do based on the fact that he was around it.
Speaker C:It was our business.
Speaker C:There were.
Speaker C:There were gun conversations happening all the time.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So he was hearing it.
Speaker C:And we didn't want it to be a casual thing where it was, oh, they just shoot guns, or he'd be out in the G. Seeing Ernest work on guns like, this is still a dangerous item that you don't touch as a kid.
Speaker C:And we did a test one time, and he walked into the bathroom, and he just stopped and he looked at the gun, and he was like.
Speaker C:And he turns around and he looks at us, and we were standing in the hallway, and he just looks at us.
Speaker C:And we were like, what's up, buddy?
Speaker C:There's a gun.
Speaker C:Like, yep.
Speaker C:And what do you do?
Speaker C:I tell you.
Speaker C:And it was, you know, it was startling for him because he had been told and taught at four, this is dangerous.
Speaker C:You need to tell somebody if you see it.
Speaker C:And he did that right now.
Speaker C:We did not leave guns laying around the house.
Speaker C:Disclaimer.
Speaker C:That was not the case.
Speaker C:This was a sheer test, Right?
Speaker C:But another thing happened with a gun in a holster sitting on a dresser.
Speaker C:We had a bunch of guys staying at our house training, and they were staying in his room, and RJ Walked in and he saw the gun sitting on the dresser, and he just sat down on the floor.
Speaker C:And we were like.
Speaker C:I mean, I knew right away because he stopped moving and talking.
Speaker C:I ran in there, and he was like, there's a gun.
Speaker C:I was like, yep.
Speaker C:You know, and the guy that was staying at our house was mortified that that even happened, because that did not happen in our house.
Speaker C:And, you know, thank God we had told our son what the rules were, and he understood it.
Speaker C:But that stuff happens, and it.
Speaker C:You know, not just with guns, but other things.
Speaker C:I don't know if you want to include that story or not.
Speaker A:No, I think that's a good story.
Speaker B:I think it all comes down to this, right?
Speaker B:It's personal responsibility.
Speaker B:It's personal responsibility.
Speaker B:As you as parents that have said, you know what?
Speaker B:We're going to lay out these rules, and then in a safe environment, we are going to test the understanding of these rules.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And we're going to go and we're going to revisit it, and we're going to make this a effort and a conscious effort in our house.
Speaker B:And those things are valuable, but they're.
Speaker B:They're more than just valuable because it.
Speaker B:He's safe right now.
Speaker B:It is a lifetime of value and something that he's going to be able to.
Speaker B:What am I looking for?
Speaker B:Duplicate this positive experience over again when he has children because he was taught well.
Speaker B:And the.
Speaker B:The thing is, fear is replicated Often.
Speaker B:And so I.
Speaker B:We get the opportunity to with goa, to meet our members all across the country.
Speaker B:And how many people have come up in the last two, three years and said to us, you know, I was terrified of guns forever and there's healthy fear and then there's dangerous, bad fear.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker B:And education will differentiate the two of those.
Speaker B:And so I applaud you.
Speaker B:And I think that you're an encouragement to all parents and grandparents out there that need to kind of maybe reevaluate.
Speaker B:What kind of fear are they instilling?
Speaker B:What kind of education are they instilling into their children?
Speaker B:And what do they want replicated in the next generation?
Speaker C:Well, and it's kids and adults alike.
Speaker C:And adults alike.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You have this, the fear based media, that world that we live in is that, you know, if a gun is here, the gun goes bang.
Speaker C:And I was one of those people.
Speaker C:It's so pathetic.
Speaker C:But I thought that if the ammo and the guns sat on the shelf together, they might go bang.
Speaker C:It was so dumb, knowing what I know now, all the steps that go into actually chambering a round into the barrel of a gun.
Speaker C:But that concept for me was so far fetched because I was scared and it was a scary thing.
Speaker C:And so I think that there's a lot of education and information that as a 2A community we can provide that helps people understand.
Speaker C:And if we understand, then there's not as much fear and there's more education based around this is what object A and object B does.
Speaker C:And here's what has to happen in order for these things to work.
Speaker C:Bless you.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:So when it comes to choosing a gun, you know, there's a ton of options right now out there.
Speaker A:You want a ton.
Speaker A:And there's more added every day.
Speaker A:So when, when Amy Langdon is choosing a gun or you, there's somebody who comes up to you and goes, hey, I'm thinking about this.
Speaker A:What kind of advice do you give them?
Speaker A:What are you looking for when you're choosing a new firearm?
Speaker C:Oh my gosh.
Speaker C:We get this question so much, not only because we sell guns, but because it's also a female.
Speaker C:I need a gun.
Speaker C:What should be my first gun?
Speaker C:Well, where do you want to start?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And that's a long list.
Speaker C:Think that there are some basic criteria that you should follow.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And I always use the term of what fits my hand.
Speaker C:You know, you have the grip of how big is your hand and how can you grip a gun?
Speaker C:And does your trigger finger actually reach the trigger?
Speaker C:Because some people are handed guns that are way too big and way too powerful for them that they don't even have a chance to actually grip and hold a gun.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:The second piece is looking at what is the gun for.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Is this for home defense?
Speaker C:Is this for my everyday carry?
Speaker C:Is this for competition?
Speaker C:That's going to depend on what type of gun that you purchase.
Speaker C:And then I think the third piece is if one more guy probably over the age of 60 tells a female that they should have a 40 caliber revolver.
Speaker C:I'm going to fly through the roof because I think that a, you know, a little.32 or 9 millimeter is not.
Speaker C:I think a 9 millimeter is the first place to start.
Speaker C:Let me rephrase that.
Speaker C:Rewind.
Speaker C:I'm going to fly through the roof.
Speaker C:A 9 millimeter is a great place for everybody to start, right?
Speaker C:There's32 caliber, there's.22 caliber.
Speaker C:Those are going to be softer shooting guns.
Speaker C:They're going to be easier.
Speaker C:Generally those guns are smaller so they're going to recoil less because of the weight of the ammo.
Speaker C:But it also depends on the size of the gun, right.
Speaker C:We live in a world of everyday carry.
Speaker C:There are compact and micro compact guns out there.
Speaker C:And if you shoot what is referred to as a full size gun, that's going to be slightly larger against a micro compact gun.
Speaker C:Those micro compact guns are snappy, right?
Speaker C:And they are.
Speaker C:If you don't have the grip, they are harder to shoot.
Speaker C:That being said, when you're factoring in your carry, your size, your concealment, a micro compact may be a great choice.
Speaker C:But you need to make sure that you know and understand control of a gun with a good grip before you go into choosing the right gun.
Speaker A:Well, it's funny you said so.
Speaker A:You and I were out at the range and I'm a big Browning high power fan.
Speaker A:I remember this distinctly.
Speaker A:I'm like, hey, you gotta shoot this.
Speaker A:And you're like, no, I don't like this.
Speaker A:I'm like, what are you talking about?
Speaker A:These are the greatest guns.
Speaker A:And it was because of the hammer bite.
Speaker A:It kept biting your, your, the palm of your hand.
Speaker A:And I didn't think about that until you shot it.
Speaker A:I was like, oh, well, my hand's different than Amy's hand and my grip's different than Amy's grip.
Speaker A:And it's, I'm like, I want to pass on this cool thing, but at the same time it's not for everybody.
Speaker C:Yeah, it really depends.
Speaker C:I mean there's getting deeper into that the way that a gun operates and the way that somebody holds a gun, right, you get a lot of people that don't grip a gun high enough.
Speaker C:But then some guns, depending on how high you grip, you will get the slide bite where when the gun is, you know, when you pull the trigger.
Speaker C:And then the gun is cycling back, it's biting the back of your, your hand right here.
Speaker C:And then that pain is inflicting a shift in how you hold or operate the gun.
Speaker C:And so there's, you know, there's so many gun stores out there that have ranges attached where you can go shoot rentals and you can try different guns.
Speaker C:But I think that if you've never shot a gun before, before you purchase a gun, you should go to a local range, a local gun store, or with some friends into a safe place and feel how guns operate, how they shoot, and what it feels like in your hand.
Speaker A:Now I have this question because when I first met you there, you, you were complaining, what is Amy Langdon's edc?
Speaker C:Because I have, I have three that I go between depending on what I'm carrying, how I'm carrying, and, and what I feel like, my mood.
Speaker C:I have a Glock 43X right now that's outfitted with our Langdon tactical trigger job and our stipple.
Speaker C:And so I carry that.
Speaker C:I have a Hellcat that I carry super snappy gun, but I do love it.
Speaker C:It's great for EDC for me.
Speaker C:And then I have a bigger 92 compact with a red dot that I carry less frequently, but once in a while it happens.
Speaker A:Yeah, that was.
Speaker A:I remember the first day I met you, we were talking about that.
Speaker A:It was, I had to ask it because it was fun.
Speaker C:No, I know.
Speaker C:And it's funny, like it's not the core pieces of what we carry, but I do have different, I do have different guns and it also depends on what I'm wearing.
Speaker A:Speaking of carrying and what you're wearing and things like that.
Speaker A:Being a mom, I'm just kidding.
Speaker A:Being, being a mom, you have to consider different ways of caring compared to other people.
Speaker A:What, you know, what are those different ways to carry and things like that?
Speaker C:Kaylee and I were just having this conversation about off body carry.
Speaker C:I'm assuming that's what you're referring to.
Speaker C:Off body carry.
Speaker C:I'm gonna kick this back to Kaylee.
Speaker C:Kaylee, how has your Carrie changed being a new mom?
Speaker B:Yeah, well, concil carry was not an option with twins in pregnancy after, let's see, month two because there was just no room for all of us.
Speaker B:I'm a short person.
Speaker B:I was five foot.
Speaker B:Like it just.
Speaker B:It wasn't happening.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So off body became the only option.
Speaker B:And then, I don't know, it's kind of stayed in a lot of ways just because of dealing with infant car seats and all of the things.
Speaker B:No one talks about that, by the way, how much stuff comes with children, like physical objects.
Speaker B:It's quite.
Speaker C:And the tactical person would be like, you shouldn't carry if you don't have your hand ready to grab your gun at all times.
Speaker C:How am I supposed to carry twins and a diaper bag and my purse and my keys.
Speaker C:Keys and lock the car.
Speaker C:I mean.
Speaker C:Yes, yes.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker B:So you.
Speaker B:You always have to make sure that it's in a place where it's accessible.
Speaker B:Because if it's me versus, you know, let's go back to the human trafficking.
Speaker B:If it's me, can somebody want to hurt my kids?
Speaker C:Game over.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:No dice for you.
Speaker B:I hope.
Speaker B:I hope you're well acquainted with our Lord and Savior.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Mama's gonna take you out.
Speaker B:And that's probably gotta be edited, but.
Speaker C:No, it's perfect.
Speaker B:But it's one of those things, right?
Speaker B:Like you go in defensive mom mode.
Speaker B:And so I'm always very conscious of where it's at.
Speaker B:And you have to be with children and you have to know you can get to it.
Speaker B:But on body is a little difficult now.
Speaker B:I haven't quite snapped back to normal Kaylee size.
Speaker B:And so it's changing and it's a moving target through pregnancy and then immediately post pregnancy as well.
Speaker B:And so there's not.
Speaker B:I would never discourage someone from being able to defend themselves.
Speaker B:I've always found that argument very, very shallow.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:Yes, very interesting topic.
Speaker C:I think that there are best practices and then there are practical practices of what it is.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:For me, it happens.
Speaker C:I too, off body carry.
Speaker C:I also sometimes choose to go to the grocery store and not carry at all.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I think that there is a place for both.
Speaker C:I think that knowing where it is and it needs to be, you know, on you at all times is still.
Speaker C:What's the word I'm looking for?
Speaker C:Is still required.
Speaker B:Yes, absolutely right.
Speaker C:There's.
Speaker C:There's off body carry, which, you know, there's companies now coming out the crossbody bags where you can put it in there.
Speaker C:I mean, I've had a little crossbody that my Hellcat fits in a Kydex holster in there with my keys and my little slimline wallet and my phone and it's awesome.
Speaker C:And I'm, you know, I'm all about that sometimes.
Speaker C:There's the diaper bag carry, which I did for a very long time.
Speaker C:Not just because of body, just because of comfort and carrying a kid around.
Speaker C:And you know when you have little ones and they're running up to you and they're giving you a hug or they're constantly jamming a dinosaur, you know, up in your space, it's generally in your waist region.
Speaker C:And if it's not their head smacking your holster giving you a hug, it's the dinosaur or you're picking them up and now it's a foot.
Speaker C:And you can have the best retention holster out there.
Speaker C:If you pick up your kid the right way and you're bent over right, that foot can catch that the grip of the gun.
Speaker C:And I mean it happens.
Speaker C:And there are people, there are people that will argue that left and right.
Speaker C:But I think that off body carry is acceptable as long as you know where that gun is and you are being responsible with it at all times and it is not out of your site or away from you.
Speaker C:And then when your kids are old enough, you know, it cannot be accessible to them.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:And I think that those are key points for everyone to understand.
Speaker B:And I think it's, it's important, especially if you have that conversation with your spouse on why you're doing something and make sure that they also buy into it 100%.
Speaker B:And so it's going and it's practicing.
Speaker B:I'm a very big believer that if you're going to use a concealed carry burst, you need to practice with it.
Speaker B:Like it can't be a game time decision.
Speaker B:You know, you need to go and practice with it consistently.
Speaker B:You need to be confident in whichever way that you carry.
Speaker B:I think that there's a big kind of gap in people saying, you know, we need to go to the range, we need to go to the range.
Speaker B:You know, practice makes perfect.
Speaker B:Practice makes perfect, but it also makes permanent.
Speaker B:And so you need to know that you are practicing how you're carrying.
Speaker B:You're practicing in a way that gets your heart rate elevated.
Speaker B:Because if there's an attacker, if there is someone that is threatening you, your children, whatever the case may be, you need to know that you can operate under that stress.
Speaker B:And I had an eye opening experience with kind of stress training.
Speaker B:Was doing my very first competition.
Speaker B:I had never put myself under the pressure of a time limit.
Speaker B:And the first time I did it, I was like, okay, well we're training differently.
Speaker B:Because it changes.
Speaker B:And all of a sudden you're like, okay, well, I thought I was doing good.
Speaker B:I thought I was going to the range enough.
Speaker B:Yeah, I need to.
Speaker B:I need to adjust some things.
Speaker C:What kind of competition was it?
Speaker B:It was a GSSF event.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:That was my very first one.
Speaker C:That's awesome.
Speaker C:I mean, Tessa from Armed and Styled, I don't know if you follow her channel at all.
Speaker C:She puts out a lot of great content and educational information.
Speaker C:But we talk about competition a lot.
Speaker C:And I did tactical games.
Speaker C:It's kind of how I met these guys.
Speaker C:But I did tactical games, and I learned very quickly that that adrenaline, that elevated heart rate, not only do things happen differently, but the way that you're holding your gun when you're breathing heavy.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:It just changes.
Speaker C:So I think competition is a great way to spike that adrenaline and, you know, get you in that elevated heart rate of, like, now what do I do?
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:But it's also.
Speaker C:I think that you can practice that and just understand how your body operates differently with an elevated heart rate, even just at the range, especially if you're an outdoor range.
Speaker C:I mean, you can go run a hundred meters, come back, do a couple air squats, and go draw and try to shoot your gun, and just your breathing is gonna change how you're holding your gun.
Speaker C:So competition is awesome, and it's a great way.
Speaker C:And I agree completely that you have to practice.
Speaker A:I have a question for the two of you, and I didn't before we.
Speaker A:Because I didn't want to dive too deep into competition before I asked this, but you guys are both mothers.
Speaker A:How do you practice drawing if you've got a kiddo in your arms?
Speaker A:Like, I've wondered that.
Speaker A:Is that something you guys practice that you have to think about, is that, you know, do you have a plan if you have to do that?
Speaker A:What's.
Speaker A:What's the game plan kind of mindset behind that?
Speaker C:I mean, my.
Speaker C:I did not practice that.
Speaker C:My game plan was put him down and get in front of him if I ever had to.
Speaker C:It was not or not.
Speaker C:Hang on.
Speaker C:It wasn't get in front of him, because it wasn't that either.
Speaker C:It was shove him aside and move since I have the gun.
Speaker C:But I. I did not practice that.
Speaker C:And to be honest, I probably didn't really think about it a lot until he was older and he was able to move by himself of, you know, shit, what would I do?
Speaker C:And I don't.
Speaker C:I don't know that you can ever.
Speaker C:I don't know about you.
Speaker C:But I don't know that I've mentally even been able to grasp what I would do in that situation other than probably shove him away from me to draw the attention to me.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm not, I haven't, I haven't practiced holding my kiddo.
Speaker B:I, I would put him down.
Speaker B:I'm not trying to be gangster and shoot one hand.
Speaker B:He's too little for that.
Speaker A:Well, I just, I, I'm just wondering how many other moms have that question or, or that like it's a totally.
Speaker A:To me, it's a totally different mindset of having like I've gone around and I've carried with, with my wife and I know that I've gotten in some situations where I'm like, okay, if this is kind of weird, this guy's acting, get behind me.
Speaker A:Kind of like the game plan that you have with your, your spouse.
Speaker A:But I don't know how that game plan was with a kid who attendance man might not be in the moment.
Speaker C:Yeah, I mean, it's definitely a mindset thing.
Speaker C:Thanks for causing the mind to race even more now.
Speaker C:But no, I think that it's a, it's a mindset thing and I think that it is so situation dependent that it's hard to say what would happen and what you would do because I think that that really depends on where you are and what you have going on.
Speaker C:I mean, I do practice one handed shooting as part of competition.
Speaker B:I'll add that.
Speaker C:Thanks for that.
Speaker C:Yeah, it's great.
Speaker C:You'll be surprised, but I, you know, that's a.
Speaker C:You have my wheels spinning because it is very much a. I have.
Speaker C:It's not that I haven't thought about it.
Speaker C:I have thought about it, but I don't know what I would do because it's a different situation.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And it kind of goes into the awareness factor of where are you, what are you doing?
Speaker C:And are you aware of your surroundings?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:The reality is, and I think that this is something that we need to kind of touch on is kids are naturally going to get in a position that is safe in that kind of attack mode.
Speaker B:Like the average kiddo will probably grab onto your leg and hold on for your dear life.
Speaker B:Because there's that kind of, Mom's a safe place, dad's a safe place, like something's going down.
Speaker B:They're gonna naturally seek protection.
Speaker B:Any kid that has been brought to the doctor's office when they come in with a shot, like will immediately go towards their parents and they're like, no, Dice.
Speaker B:So you know, get me out of here.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:So there is a certain amount of understanding that in those situations, as soon as you perceive a threat, your kid has also perceived that threat and they're going to respond probably most likely by grabbing onto you and making you the human shield that you are meant to be in that situation.
Speaker A:Well, and maybe I just have like a different mindset because I'm like, my follow up question to that is like being a mom and being, you know, for, for me, like it's only me and my wife at the house, but we have like, okay, if there's a fire, here's the plan for a fire.
Speaker A:If there's like somebody breaks in, this is the plan for that.
Speaker A:Does that also change for you guys?
Speaker A:Like do you guys come up with different game plans because there's a kiddo in the house?
Speaker A:You know, that's.
Speaker C:Yes, that.
Speaker C:And that is something that I think if you have guns in the house, that is something that you and your significant other are working through, right?
Speaker C:And you have a plan, hey, if something happens and it were to happen in, you know, a couple of these scenarios, what are we going to do?
Speaker C:I do have that plan with my husband, or we have that plan rather.
Speaker C:But it's not, you know, it's not the end all, be all, but it is stuff that we have talked through.
Speaker C:Through for sure.
Speaker C:My kid doesn't know though, because he doesn't need to know.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Yeah, I just figured that was a great.
Speaker A:Sorry to get your wheel spinning.
Speaker C:No, no, I think it's a great question because I think that, that, you know, you're talking about mindset, you're talking about something of at the end of the day, at some place we all came to this subconscious or self conscious level of we're taking responsibility into our own hands and we're choosing to want to be able to protect ourselves if we need to if the situation were to arise.
Speaker C:And so what is that mental process that we're going through to make that happen?
Speaker C:And it is, I think that, you know, the what ifs are things that we all think through.
Speaker C:And being proficient with your firearm is going to help you from a place of confidence, right?
Speaker C:If you know how to operate the gun, then you won't be concerned about the operation of it.
Speaker C:But if you also have thought through some of those what ifs of, hey, if I were in this scenario, right, you go to a restaurant or you go to the store, what I'm gonna do, you walk out of the store and you don't just tell your kids to get in the car.
Speaker C:You know, you're walking around the side of the car and unlocking it and making sure that they can get in safely.
Speaker C:It's just, you know, little things where if you change your layer of awareness and confidence, you can also become less of a target.
Speaker C:But it forces you in your mind to go through those exercises.
Speaker C:Did that make sense?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:No, that makes sense because, like, when you're in this community, normally you hang out with, like, kind of like minded people and you're all kind of caring.
Speaker A:And I know that I've been to restaurants with Kaylee and it's like, I don't want my back to the door.
Speaker A:And it comes this, like, shoving match of who doesn't want their back to the door, right?
Speaker C:Oh, I'm well trained.
Speaker A:But it's all like, it's all like that mindset thing because you're like, I want to see the door, I want to see the threat.
Speaker A:But it's the same thing.
Speaker A:Like, and I don't know, because we have all these new gun owners trying to teach them that mindset can be hard because most of them are like, six months ago, I didn't want to touch a gun or this.
Speaker A:It was this evil thing.
Speaker A:And now I realize that I need this thing to protect myself because when I pick up the phone, they could be 20 minutes out before they even show up.
Speaker A:So learning that mindset.
Speaker A:And I don't know about you, but it took a while to kind of change my mindset of, okay, this is how I'm doing or my situational awareness when I'm walking around.
Speaker A:Like, last night I left the hotel and there were two guys, like, standing by the parking garage.
Speaker A:And like, I'm not walking that way.
Speaker A:This alley's a little dark.
Speaker A:I'm going to change my path.
Speaker A:Change the.
Speaker A:I don't like, how does that change when you have kids and things like that, like, your situational awareness is it heightened you.
Speaker A:You got this like, mom attack bear type thing?
Speaker C:Of course, yeah.
Speaker C:Once your mama bear always comes out.
Speaker C:But your example of the hotel and changing your path, that's huge because that is your awareness.
Speaker C:There's a, a book.
Speaker C:It's called the Power of Awareness by Dan Schilling.
Speaker C:And then there's the Institute of Power Awareness.
Speaker C:It's a kind of online hour and a half training of just things to think about and things to think through.
Speaker C:And I always kind of talk about that as the.
Speaker C:Before the gun, right.
Speaker C:Is you can choose to carry, but generally, if you're choosing to carry, you are getting into a different layer in your mind of what is around me.
Speaker C:And subconsciously you're more aware because you're hypersensitive of what is going on.
Speaker C:And so I think that just that exercise and that process of understanding safety, your own personal safety, where you are, the environment that you're in, the people that you're around, is all part of it.
Speaker C:And that, you know, the power of awareness, as Dan calls it, of leading up to having to make those hard decisions is, you know, 99% of it.
Speaker A:Well, I think we see this like whenever a state goes to constitutional carry or concealed carry, the narrative is always like, there's going to be a bunch of these gun ho people gunning people down in the street and things like that.
Speaker A:Where in my experience, and I think a lot of gun owners experience, is that's like the last thing you want to do.
Speaker A:And most of the time it's, okay, I've gotten myself into this situation or how do I avoid this situation where, you know, hey, I took somebody spot by accident in the parking lot.
Speaker A:They're getting all angry at you and you're kind of like, oh, I'm sorry, kind of backing away, kind of keeping.
Speaker A:And I think that's what a lot of people don't understand is that as a gun owner, as a concealed carry, as an edc, you know, person, you are more likely to just kind of like, be chill and de escalate because you don't want to lead to that.
Speaker A:Because there's a lot of stuff that happens after the fact, and it's a lot of things.
Speaker A:I mean, I don't want to go into that because that's.
Speaker A:I don't think he'll like that if I talk about it.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But there's a lot of things you have to think about of the.
Speaker A:After the mindset of going from, okay, I'm here to protect myself, I'm going to de escalate the situation to now it's go time.
Speaker A:And that mindset could be.
Speaker A:It could go like that and it's very quick.
Speaker A:But to, you know, knowing your situation, knowing what to do, knowing what to back off.
Speaker A:I mean, you've driven Phoenix.
Speaker A:You know how crazy people are.
Speaker A:And there's a lot of.
Speaker A:I mean, the sun bakes our brains and we get a little angry.
Speaker A:But there's a lot of.
Speaker C:But we're happier.
Speaker A:We're happier.
Speaker A:We are happier.
Speaker A:But there's a lot of road rage.
Speaker A:And you've been on, you know, the The NASCAR track of the 202.
Speaker C:As you, you know, people stay out of the left lane.
Speaker A:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A:But people get angry.
Speaker A:Very.
Speaker A:Like they have the short fuse.
Speaker A:And most of the time I'm just like, I'm just going to back away, go into another lane.
Speaker A:Just let them do.
Speaker A:They're mad.
Speaker A:Just let them go be mad.
Speaker A:And then eventually they get mad at somebody else.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:I mean de escalation is.
Speaker C:Is obviously huge.
Speaker C:And then there's, you know, Craig Douglas does a managing unknown contacts class and he calls it muck.
Speaker C:And I got a lot out of that couple hour class because he really focuses on eye contact, making eye contact, understanding what's going on and then kind of putting your hands up and being non.
Speaker C:Being confrontationally.
Speaker C:Non confrontational.
Speaker C:Like.
Speaker C:Hang on, what do you mean?
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:And there's a difference there of you can choose to get in road rage and keep cutting them off and engage, or you can disengage and you can drop back.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Or you can walk away, whatever that is.
Speaker C:And I think that it, you know, where you see the escalated gunfights, people just want to fight.
Speaker C:And if it's not a gun, it's going to be a knife.
Speaker C:It's not a knife.
Speaker C:It's going to be fist.
Speaker C:Like they just want to cause a ruckus.
Speaker C:And so I think that if.
Speaker C:If you're associating it with carrying a gun and that de escalation.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:It all comes into that awareness of I don't want to get in a gunfight.
Speaker C:This is not good.
Speaker C:Can I walk away and can I be safe?
Speaker C:Right, because it's not your job to keep everybody in line.
Speaker C:Does that make sense?
Speaker A:Yeah, we just gotta stop telling people that they're number one.
Speaker C:Participation trophies.
Speaker C:Even when you get last place in the football conference.
Speaker A:I mean, we all wave at number one every once in a while to the crazy drivers.
Speaker C:Oh, I get what you're saying.
Speaker C:Oh, yeah.
Speaker C:My son, actually, I'm an idiot.
Speaker C:I'm also blonde sometimes.
Speaker C:So I apologize.
Speaker C:But yes.
Speaker C:And my son, he'll be like, hey mom, that guy need one of these.
Speaker C:So guilty.
Speaker A:Well, and that's where like de escalation and situational awareness, like, and a fun.
Speaker A:You know, the hotel story was funny.
Speaker A:My favorite story is I met up with Mike Mills from tactical consideration over at Chandler Mall.
Speaker A:And if anybody knows him, he's a big boy, like big muscular guy.
Speaker A:And we got slow rolled by a car full of people because my windows were down, cars unlocked.
Speaker A:We're in between two cars Nobody can see us.
Speaker A:They're trying to just steal the car.
Speaker A:They see a car there and Mike's like, grab your shit.
Speaker A:I'm like, what?
Speaker A:He goes, just be ready.
Speaker A:So we're sitting there, doors open, ready, like tactical, and they see both of us and they bolt off.
Speaker A:It was just his situational awareness was higher than mine, but it's like, okay, I would have hit zero out of zero on that.
Speaker A:Mike would have taken everything and it would have been good.
Speaker C:I was actually at the park this last weekend and I was doing a 60 minute hill sprint workout and I was dead.
Speaker C:And there was a car with, I'm going to call a spade a spade.
Speaker C:There was a car with some thugs in them or some.
Speaker C:A car with some thugs sitting in it.
Speaker C:And they kept kind of getting out.
Speaker C:And they were definitely watching my every move.
Speaker C:And I was running.
Speaker C:I was at a public park, but I was running.
Speaker C:I did not have a gun, I did not have a knife.
Speaker C:I didn't have mace on me.
Speaker C:And it was the middle of the day.
Speaker C:I didn't think about it.
Speaker C:Well, I was driving the Jeep with all the doors off, and I started to leave and as I was grabbing my stuff and I was headed back up to the Jeep, they kind of rolled the window down and two of them had their doors propped open.
Speaker C:And I was like, what is.
Speaker C:Like, I'm actually nervous right now.
Speaker C:And so I put my stuff down and I ran two more sprints and there was a car that was not sitting not far away.
Speaker C:And I walked up to that car and I was like, hey, I'm a little nervous right now.
Speaker C:These guys have been watching me for about 30 minutes.
Speaker C:I'm going to go get my car.
Speaker C:I'm in that Jeep over there to the right.
Speaker C:Can you just do me a favor and be observant should something happen?
Speaker C:And she was like, absolutely.
Speaker C:And her son was kind of like, did that woman just ask that?
Speaker C:And sure enough, I went and got in my car.
Speaker C:As I was walking up, two of them got out of the car.
Speaker C:She came driving up right behind them.
Speaker C:They got back in their car and I got in the car and I drove away and took a long way home.
Speaker C:But it was the first time in a long time that I was like, dang it, I had nothing on me and I didn't think anything of it.
Speaker C:And I still wouldn't change that.
Speaker C:I'm not going to go to the park and run with a gun.
Speaker C:It's not going to happen right now.
Speaker C:I may think twice about bringing some Mace or something with me next time.
Speaker C:But it was the middle of the day and I just thought, this isn't going to be dangerous.
Speaker C:And it was a very real perspective shift for me of how else are you going to be prepared?
Speaker C:Because it's not necessarily the gun.
Speaker C:It may be something else.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker A:Well.
Speaker A:And you and I live in.
Speaker A:Basically we're in the same area.
Speaker A:It's a nicer area of Phoenix.
Speaker A:And you don't think about those things until it comes up and happens.
Speaker A:You're just like, I live in this beautiful, nice neighborhood.
Speaker A:It's quiet.
Speaker A:We've got parks, we've got this.
Speaker A:And then next thing you know, you're.
Speaker C:Like, oh, this is thousands of illegals coming across by the week.
Speaker C:And you're like, we're not far from the border.
Speaker A:No, not at all.
Speaker C:We should be careful.
Speaker C:You should probably edit this photo.
Speaker C:When the border patrol's like, you guys should be loaded and ready, you're probably not wrong.
Speaker A:I mean,.
Speaker B:They'll hit your house first.
Speaker C:You're further south than I am.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, man, Tennessee is looking better by the second.
Speaker C:Oh, gosh, yes.
Speaker C:I mean, it's, it's insane.
Speaker B:Other than.
Speaker C:I digress.
Speaker B:I mean, they're not all bad, right?
Speaker A:Had.
Speaker A:We had a meeting with some people in the neighborhood that just opened the casino down the street.
Speaker A:And we're like, what's this gonna bring in?
Speaker A:Yeah, luckily it's been, it's been quiet, but like, I'm friends with people on Chandler pd, so I'm like, hey, is there.
Speaker A:Do we gotta worry about this?
Speaker A:Like, it should be okay.
Speaker A:They kind of keep to them, you know.
Speaker C:Well, and to kind of go back to the, you know, de escalation conversation that we were talking about.
Speaker C:There's more kids who are young who are learning how to fight and bad things are happening.
Speaker C:There's a 15 year old that was just beat to death at a Halloween party and kids were recording it.
Speaker C:And nobody's coming forward because the police came out and said, if this is on your phone, you recorded it, you're going to be prosecuted.
Speaker C:So all these kids are staying really quiet.
Speaker C:And from that aspect, like, if even just one kid was like, hey, this wasn't okay, and tried to get in the middle and break that up, chances are that kid would be alive today.
Speaker A:Well, and what was it a couple months ago?
Speaker A:It was in Phoenix.
Speaker A:I can't remember exactly when, but it was a couple months ago.
Speaker A:The two guys broke into a house and the mom, it was a mom and her son.
Speaker A:And the mom had her gun and couldn't pull the trigger.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And the son did.
Speaker A:Do you remember remote?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:He was 13.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:I was like, yes, mom saw.
Speaker C:Oh, wait, way to go, buddy.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:I want to kind of go back to something when we were talking about the constitutional carry states and being more situationally aware, I also think it's important to note that mentally the training that you need changes.
Speaker B:I don't know what it is, but the amount of people, and this is anecdotal, but I'm sure there are plenty of studies out there that would support this.
Speaker B:But the conversation in Tennessee, because we so recently got permitless carry in the state, went from, okay, well, we need to have these state minimum classes to the ranges opening up.
Speaker B:Handgun one, handgun two.
Speaker B:And they're filling up with additional training.
Speaker B:They're filling up with people that go, okay, well, I know I don't need a permit, although I need it for reciprocity reasons, so maybe they go ahead and get the, get the class.
Speaker B:But now the amount of ranges that we're seeing that are offering additional trainings that are filling up with people that go, yeah, I want, I want more training because I think it takes away that this is all I need.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker B:And people go, you know what?
Speaker B:I want to be as good with this firearm as confident with this firearm and whatever other ones that I, I gather in my career as a Second amendment community member, which I'm positive is more than one.
Speaker B:You know, people want additional training.
Speaker B:And people, I think it changes the mindset of going, this is all I need to, this is a starting place.
Speaker B:And I don't think that that aspect is talked about enough because it goes against the narrative of, you know, constitutional carry is dangerous.
Speaker B:And it shifts it to, wow, you know, people are taking that personal responsibility.
Speaker B:People are taking an interest in not only being able to shoot their firearms at whatever the distance your state regulates and have however many rounds downrange, hit a piece of paper to, okay, well, how am I going to be effective in different situations?
Speaker B:How am I going to be able to, you know, when, when the person isn't directly in front of me at a perfect standing still, you know, 25 yards or whatever the case for your state is, people start thinking about it differently and their mindset changes.
Speaker B:And I think it's to the betterment 100%.
Speaker A:Has Ernest seen an increase in people coming to class or more interest in it?
Speaker C:I mean, he's a different kind of instructor.
Speaker C:He's not.
Speaker C:He doesn't teach, you know, entry level classes and we don't.
Speaker C:That's not a huge focus of the business.
Speaker C:But I will tell you at ranges and stuff, I think that the amount of classes being offered and the amount of people saying that they want to go take a class or they're going to get together, that there's a lot more community build around the two.
Speaker C:A community of just being more proficient, more educated and more experienced.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I like to equate it to the fitness world.
Speaker C:In the fitness community of you don't just say, hey, I want to start lifting and walk into the gym and try to deadlift £400 off the ground.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:You, you start somewhere and then you generally progress.
Speaker C:And I think that we're seeing that a lot more in the firearms community and that while the narrative that is kind of pushed the agenda, we'll call it of it's not okay.
Speaker C:I think that there are a lot of people that are the agenda that is pushed and that narrative that is pushed of, you know, constitutional carry is bad.
Speaker C:There's a lot more people saying, oh, I can do this.
Speaker C:So I'm going to go become more proficient and I'm going to understand this so that I know how to operate just in case.
Speaker C:Yeah, well.
Speaker A:And I think it is like me personally and maybe I'm different because I've been in the industry, but I try to go to at least one or two training classes a year and most of the time it's with another guy out of Phoenix, Fred Masterson, who's a great instructor and I always plug his name because he's a good friend.
Speaker A: or pistol: Speaker A:Like I've taken from him concealed carry mindset, which is kind of like more of a hand to close quarter kind of it's like.
Speaker A:How do I want to put it?
Speaker A:It's kind of close quarter, kind of like, hey, if someone's right on top of you, how to get them off of you, how to make sure that you can reach and grab.
Speaker A:I've taken this vehicle tactics class which is very interesting when you think about vehicle tactics.
Speaker A:When you're in a vehicle and you, you're carrying, because I don't know about you, but when you carry like appendix and you're trying to draw from vehicles seating with your seatbelt on, that's kind of difficult.
Speaker A:And then Just knowing how to.
Speaker A:I like taking those weird classes now because it teaches me something or adds a piece to my arsenal that I didn't have.
Speaker A:I don't know if a lot more people are going to start seeking that more advanced class or is it more like intro classes and then kind of sticking with that?
Speaker C:To put it crassly, probably not.
Speaker C:I mean, good for you, right?
Speaker C:You're trying to further your education.
Speaker C:The, the commitment, the, the time, money and you know, time away from your family, away from work.
Speaker C:Commitment, I think is what inhibits a lot of people from attending other classes.
Speaker C:The, you know, we talk about, we talk about this a lot at work of, you know, I have a bunch of guys that they're gone guys, they love going to classes, they love doing that.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:But most people aren't going to do that.
Speaker C:So how can we as a community provide as much helpful information and encourage going to practice without saying that you cannot do this if you don't attend these classes or if you do not attend these classes, then you're not proficient.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There are going to be people that naturally progress into wanting to learn more and then they will start attending some of those classes.
Speaker C:But I think in general a lot of people will not make that investment.
Speaker C:Does that make sense?
Speaker A:No, that makes sense.
Speaker A:And that's what I figured is because I'm weird as most guys in the industry are in gals, we want to get the most education we can so that we can become somewhat Internet experts on, on the subject.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So you can kind of argue but like, but we, we've seen that.
Speaker C:It's gonna be a hole in my tongue.
Speaker A:Yeah, but you know, I've taken a long range class just because I wanted to learn that and maybe that's just me different but I'd love to see as a community as we're growing that to kind of go, encourage people to go, hey, maybe you should try that advanced class.
Speaker A:And I guess it is kind of expensive, but I'd love to see you,.
Speaker C:You're encouraging proficiency, right?
Speaker C:And I think as much as you're encouraging the proficiency and people to become more educated, it's also, you know, what happens before the gun.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Encouraging just that awareness and that, that personal confidence.
Speaker C:I think that naturally leads to people wanting to do more.
Speaker A:Well, and that's what I'm going to go stand on my soapbox now.
Speaker A:Sorry, Kaylee, I'm stealing your soapbox.
Speaker C:Take it.
Speaker A:But that is my biggest issue with parts of the community is that they instead of encourage, they push down Hate, Yes.
Speaker A:And we've seen this and I've gotten hate from some people and especially in the.
Speaker A:The competitive side, going, well, your gun needs to shoot super flat and you shouldn't see the slide move.
Speaker A:And it should be like this.
Speaker A:And I'm like, bro, I hit 10 out of 10 center mass.
Speaker A:Like, what's the issue?
Speaker A:So what?
Speaker A:My gun moved a little bit.
Speaker A:And it's the same thing with, you know, we jokingly do this a lot and I.
Speaker A:And I think it's very discouraging and a lot of us need to stop and it's hard.
Speaker A:But like, the budget friendly guns, we are very quick to point out that that's a budget friendly gun or that's a high point or that's a this and kind of put them down for that.
Speaker A:Instead of putting them down, encourage them because they took the first.
Speaker A:First off, they took the step to purchase a firearm and go, hey, let's go to the reins.
Speaker A:Let's try this.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:This is your beginning because that's all you could afford.
Speaker A:Let me help you.
Speaker A:Let me show you some other options.
Speaker A:Let's move on down the line.
Speaker A:Let's grow together and become this community and get everybody together.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Like, this is my soapbox.
Speaker A:Because I'm like, stop.
Speaker A:Doesn't.
Speaker C:You know, I love that it's easy.
Speaker A:To make fun and like, I get it.
Speaker A:It's easy to make fun of it if you've been in this for a long time because you're like, ah.
Speaker A:But like, encourage them because they took.
Speaker A:We're seeing all these new gun owners come in.
Speaker A:Let's keep them in.
Speaker A:We don't want to push them away.
Speaker A:Because if you start pushing them away, then we lose maybe a couple gun owners.
Speaker B:No, 100%.
Speaker B:And, you know, I'll be the first one to say, you know, my first gun was a Bersa 380.
Speaker B:I bought it for less than $300.
Speaker B:It was in the clearance section at the gun store.
Speaker B:It sat there for a little while.
Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:I was in college and it was all I.
Speaker B:All I could afford.
Speaker B:It was an option, one of one in my price range.
Speaker B:And that started me on this journey.
Speaker B:I still have the firearm.
Speaker B:Do I reach for it?
Speaker B:No, I. I found things that I like better that work better for me.
Speaker B:But am I glad I made that first step?
Speaker B:Am I glad that there was something that I could afford at the ripe age of 21?
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Like, those were decisions that I made.
Speaker B:And talk about a sacrifice.
Speaker B:When you're in college and you have.
Speaker C:Not funding $380 was my rent.
Speaker B:Like, yeah, like it, it was, yeah, it was incredibly like it was, it was a, a big commitment to say to myself, your life is valuable.
Speaker B:There is something in your community that made you feel unsafe.
Speaker B:By the time that I bought the firearm, the holster and the ammunition, like my bank account was like okay, well you have ramen this week and next week.
Speaker B:Like there wasn't, there wasn't that I didn't have a bank account that would support one upgrade more.
Speaker B:And if someone would have said, you know, you're wasting your money, you're wasting your time, what they would have been telling me, whether they admitted to it or not, is your life isn't valuable because you don't have the money to start.
Speaker B:Because that would have taken my defense completely away.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And, and your self value.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And we have to, we have to take that into account especially when it comes to, to young men and women who are sitting there and saying, you know what, like I don't, I don't like this environment that I'm in.
Speaker B:I feel unsafe.
Speaker B:That is the, the last thing that we should be doing as a second amendment community is saying oh you can't sit with us like you, you can't be a part of this because you are less than.
Speaker B:And that culture shift, if we truly unlock that.
Speaker B:You want to talk about millions of new gun owners, that is where it's going to come from.
Speaker C:I agree.
Speaker C:It's being a welcoming community as a two way community and I think that it has shifted over the last couple of years of the number of people and the number of people choosing to want to move into firearms ownership, but also the number of people willing to invest in, in their self value.
Speaker C:And I think that as a community we need to do a better job WELCOMING in people 100%.
Speaker C:And it's not just in knocking it down, it's helping guide and provide a place that is willing to assist.
Speaker C:And there are so many organizations standing up and trying to help that and truly building communities of a place to teach and lead, which is really cool.
Speaker C:You know, are they the best organizations?
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker C:You don't know who's to say that it is or it isn't.
Speaker C:It's like minded people coming together for the betterment of the 2A community.
Speaker C:And I think that that is really powerful because you know like you guys are doing with GOA is you're, you're trying to bring people together and educate and help them understand.
Speaker C:And I think if we do that Then it leaves less room for the arguments and the political media outlets because now more people know the answer.
Speaker C:Sorry, hang on.
Speaker C:Now more people know the answer versus, you know, the lie that they're choosing to believe.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And in no way, once you get into the 2A community and once you, you go to some training and you start participating more and I think participation is a huge part of this.
Speaker B:You have to go and meet people and find your friends or educate your friends to become part of the community as well.
Speaker B:You're going to eventually get to a place where you're not that starving college kid and you're going to invest and you're going to find something that fits you better and you're going to have.
Speaker B:I mean every single person at this table has a wish list of man, if I could just get this and this and this.
Speaker B:Oh man, my collection would just, you know, it'd be so much better.
Speaker B:We all have that.
Speaker B:We all have the wants and desires.
Speaker B:You know, this optic or, or this firearm or this holster.
Speaker B:I mean my Christmas shopping is.
Speaker B:The list is endless.
Speaker B:Yeah, the list is endless and my Christmas list is ever growing.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But that's a reinvestment in your self value.
Speaker B:And so they're not gonna stay at that place forever.
Speaker B:They're just not, they're going to, they're gonna get something that they want.
Speaker A:I've had a thing on my list since it came out.
Speaker A: Was it: Speaker A:Did you guys launch the gun?
Speaker C:Which one?
Speaker A:The LTT Elite.
Speaker C: Oh, that would have been: Speaker A:Yeah, this has been on my list since I'm like, oh, I really want this.
Speaker C:This is nice to shoot and that, you know, as a.
Speaker C:We sell a higher end gun that is very custom and people are coming to us to make it more shootable.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Changing some different things and doing work to the internals so that it is smoother and it does operate better than a Versa 380.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:That, that's just going to happen with what we are.
Speaker C:But what I've come to learn is that, you know, yes, these guns are expensive and there is an investment and it is going to shoot flatter, it's going to feel better, it's going to be more fit to my hand.
Speaker C:I mean that's some of the customizations that we do and there, there are advantages to that.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:But I still choose to carry a hellcat or a Glock 43X because I want to have the varying options in my portfolio.
Speaker C:But a small micro compact polymer frame gun is going to be lighter and Easier to carry.
Speaker C:And so I think that as firearms ownership evolves, it's kind of like, you know, buying your first pair of running shoes.
Speaker C:You may go buy the pair of Adidas that are walking shoes, and you try to start running in them, and then pretty soon you're like, oh, I actually need to invest in a pair of running shoes that are a little bit more expensive.
Speaker C:And, oh, I've been running for six months.
Speaker C:I need to upgrade these so that I stop getting shin splints.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There's this natural evolution that happens in gun ownership as well.
Speaker C:And we really see that on the firearms side of the business, the product side of the business, because it's not just the gun.
Speaker C:It's a holster, it's a belt.
Speaker C:It's as you get more comfortable or you're dressed a certain way or you're doing a certain type of thing, you now have this option that you're choosing from.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I love to watch the progression in other people, and I've enjoyed watching it myself from my own perspective, because your.
Speaker B:Your taste, as you get older, your body changes, your budget changes, like, all of these variables in your life, and it's nice and exciting.
Speaker B:And I still get excited when I.
Speaker B:When I go to the gun store and I.
Speaker B:And I get something that I've been.
Speaker B:Have had on the list for a while, and it's like, there's that sense of pride and accomplishment, and then there's that sense of man.
Speaker B:I can't wait to take this out on the range.
Speaker B:I can't wait to have the experiences with this firearm.
Speaker C:Well, you experience the improvement.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Sometimes, I guess.
Speaker C:Maybe not always, but for the most part, right.
Speaker C:When you're making a different investment, you're experiencing the improvement or the value that that change brought to your gun life.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker A:I have a question for both of you.
Speaker A:Do you guys still have your first handgun?
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker A:Is it.
Speaker C:See, I'm doing the safe.
Speaker A:Yeah, I still have mine.
Speaker A:That's the funny part, because I've asked a lot of people that, and some of them are like, yeah, I still have it.
Speaker A:Like, it was my first handgun.
Speaker A:I still.
Speaker A:It's still sitting in the safe.
Speaker A:And to watch their progression from, like, their first handgun on, like, you had a Bersa and then you kind of moved on from there.
Speaker A:I sold my soul and everything.
Speaker A:I bought a Glock 17 as my first gun.
Speaker A:I did, like, scrape money together as a college student, but I also learned a lot from that.
Speaker A:On what my progression is, is what I wanted to do different and what I wanted, you know, it changed a lot over the years of things.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:But if people are gonna buy their first gun, that's a great gun to buy because you can find Glock parts everywhere.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I mean, Glock has definitely hit the ground running and maintained running ground.
Speaker C:Because even through Covid, what's the one gun that you could find, no matter where it was, it was a Glock.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:They emptied their warehouse.
Speaker A:Like, I was talking to people in the industry and they're like, glock found stuff that they didn't.
Speaker A:It's not that.
Speaker C:I mean, everybody did.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:They found stuff that had been sitting.
Speaker C:There for a while.
Speaker C:I think every gun company and gun manufacturer did.
Speaker C:So did all the ammo people.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:Oh, we got this ammo.
Speaker C:What gun goes with it?
Speaker C:Boom, let's sell it.
Speaker C:But as, I mean, my point of that is that, you know, it.
Speaker C:You may have you.
Speaker C:I feel like you're positioning it negatively and you need to reposition the positivity of the fact that you bought the Glock because you can get parts for that thing anywhere.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:And then go back, going back to what our earlier conversation was with Glock, you immediately can start training, you can start doing competitions.
Speaker B:Like, you have a phenomenal world that they have kind of, kind of built.
Speaker C:They did build it.
Speaker B:And so it is.
Speaker B:I always encourage people, like, if you're nervous about competition shooting, like, there is no better stress free competition that I have found outside of gssf.
Speaker B:And I will sing their praises because that was such an eye opening experience for me.
Speaker C:Well, and even in competition, I mean, I. I shot tactical games and that community is absolutely fantastic.
Speaker C:I went to shoot my first USPSA match and.
Speaker C:And this was in Phoenix.
Speaker C:And I will tell you, it was not a great experience.
Speaker C:There were some old fuddy duddies that were not about a first person.
Speaker C:And I finally, the second stage, I was like, all right, guys, this is my first competition of this type.
Speaker C:So I just am kind of learning the lingo.
Speaker C:And some people will be like, oh, well, your husband knows this or whatever.
Speaker C:It doesn't matter.
Speaker C:I'm not even going down that path because I'm really mad.
Speaker C:But there are some old fuddy duddies that made that experience really negative straight out of the gates.
Speaker C:And that kind of ties together the community piece of.
Speaker C:I showed up to push myself to do something different.
Speaker C:And you're being a grumpy old curmudgeon because you didn't like one word that I said.
Speaker C:Like, you know, yeah, be Welcoming.
Speaker A:I like that.
Speaker A:Word choice.
Speaker A:That's a good word choice.
Speaker C:Grumpy old curmudgeon.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker A:So I'm going to tie this around.
Speaker A:So I. Cataclock 17.
Speaker A:I shot about 10,000 rounds of that gun.
Speaker A:Still sit in the safe.
Speaker A:But then how many?
Speaker A:10,000.
Speaker A:Just.
Speaker A:Well, as a.
Speaker A:That was in college.
Speaker A:By the time I swapped.
Speaker C:It's broken in now.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's broken in now.
Speaker A:It's not even.
Speaker A:It's still a baby.
Speaker A:But then while I was in college and I bought my first handgun, it was right before the first ammo scare.
Speaker A:So my second handgun was a 40 because I could train because ammo was still available.
Speaker A:I want to tie in ammo real quick because as a new gun owner, I didn't know better.
Speaker A:I thought all ammo was the same at the time when I was a new gun.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Of course.
Speaker C:Why would you think it's different?
Speaker A:I'm like, cool.
Speaker A:I've got.
Speaker A:And I remember the first person who, like, instead of, like, explaining it, just yelling and getting mad because I had fmjs in my gun instead of hollow points.
Speaker A:And I'm like, I don't know any better.
Speaker A:I just know, like, cool.
Speaker A:I'm supposed to.
Speaker A:Okay, so this is.
Speaker A:This is what I use for defense.
Speaker A:Like, I can't afford a $20 box for 25 rounds.
Speaker A:Am I supposed.
Speaker A:And I'm supposed to go test it in the gun too, right?
Speaker C:I can.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker C:Ownership is an investment.
Speaker C:It is expensive.
Speaker A:I bought an $11 box of 50 of 9 mil, and I. I'm ready to go.
Speaker A:And that's another educational piece that a lot of people don't know.
Speaker A:It's like the ammo side, like, hey, you know, nine mil is great.
Speaker A:It shoots sweat and.
Speaker A:But, you know, during the scare, 40 was cheap, and I could get it.
Speaker A:I could train, but I hated it.
Speaker A:I wanted.
Speaker A:Why?
Speaker A:Why did they ever make that?
Speaker A:Sorry, Smith.
Speaker A:It wasn't.
Speaker A:No, Like, I don't.
Speaker A:Like, I don't.
Speaker A:That's a.
Speaker A:It's a personal thing.
Speaker A:Like, I.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The round is snappy.
Speaker A:The guns are not designed for that amount of pressure.
Speaker A:They just.
Speaker A:It's one of those things where, like, yeah, I could still train.
Speaker A:And that was important to me.
Speaker A:But at the same time, like, I think I got rid of all my 40s because of 9 mil.
Speaker A:Came back.
Speaker A:But we saw that again during the pandemic where you're talking about, like, hey, there's this ammo.
Speaker A:Here's this gun.
Speaker A:Like, I think glock finally sold every.45 gap.
Speaker A:They've ever made during that time because we have ammo, we have gun.
Speaker A:Go.
Speaker A:So, you know, how do you.
Speaker A:How do I want to say this?
Speaker C:Do you.
Speaker A:Would you rather encourage people to buy something that they may not like and train with it, or because that's all they can get at the time, or is it, hey, get something that you're gonna like?
Speaker C:I mean, I think that goes back to Kaylee's earlier comment of your.
Speaker C:If you're choosing to buy a gun and you're wanting to make that decision, right, you're putting a value on a decision that you want to make for yourself, for your life, right?
Speaker C:So what is that?
Speaker C:What is that answer?
Speaker C:If it's, I need to have a gun and I need this now, and I'm gonna become proficient with this now, then it has to be that decision that is right for you for what you want to do.
Speaker C:When you make the decision to buy a gun, you're making a life, death, and financial decision, right?
Speaker C:If you choose to use that gun, it's all of those things.
Speaker C:And the.
Speaker C:You're opening yourself up for the potential of having to make one of those three, if not all of those decisions, right?
Speaker C:So I think that it's a.
Speaker C:It's a personal decision of what it is you're trying to achieve, right?
Speaker C:What is the.
Speaker C:What is the problem that you're trying to solve with making that decision?
Speaker C:And why is that decision important to you?
Speaker C:I don't know that there's a right answer.
Speaker A:And I. I don't think there's a right answer either, because it was the same thing during, like, I.
Speaker A:And during the pandemic.
Speaker A:During the beginning of the pandemic, I was working for a firearms company, and I would go into these shops that were my dealers to kind of, you know, I would.
Speaker A:There was a local dealer down the street from me, so they would order.
Speaker A:I'd pack up the guns in my car, drive them up to them to drop them off, and I'd sit there and talk to them.
Speaker A:And they're like, yeah, I had a guy order this such and such in this odd caliber because that's all they could get and that's all the ammo.
Speaker A:So they made that decision.
Speaker A:And I, I just wonder, like, do you.
Speaker A:They made that decision, do you.
Speaker A:At some point, or do you talk to them?
Speaker A:Or do they become more educated, where they end up trading that in for something more that they like than what they bought?
Speaker A:Because they.
Speaker A:They made that decision at that time to get something.
Speaker C:I mean, I think you're kind of headed down a path of paralysis by analysis.
Speaker C:Yeah, right.
Speaker C:Of your, you're analyzing it to a point where who and what is the decision?
Speaker C:And they're, to a degree, you know, just because people buy a firearm or they are making the decision to want to buy a firearm, they may not know or understand all of those differences.
Speaker C:They may not understand all of the inner workings of what happens and they may not understand what they're buying versus what's available.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I mean, there's how many tens of thousands of guns out there that you can choose from?
Speaker C:So I think that it, I don't know what you're trying to conclude there.
Speaker A:I don't think so either.
Speaker C:I know, I mean I, I understand what you're saying, but I think that as this kind of goes back to let me tie this all together, what I think you're saying, right, is people are making a choice to buy a gun and they're not sure what to buy.
Speaker C:And well, should I do this or should I do, should I do that?
Speaker C:We can analyze this 18 different ways from Sunday.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:But the reality is, is what is it that you're trying to achieve?
Speaker C:What fits that accomplished goal and how can you then make that purchase and move on?
Speaker C:Most people will not go through learning and understanding all of the pieces and parts that go into it because you don't know what you don't know.
Speaker C:And if you're a first time gun buyer or you're even a nine year gun owner, like I could not take my guns apart and figure out what's inside.
Speaker C:I have a gunsmith for that.
Speaker C:Like, I just, I'm not interested in knowing that.
Speaker C:I'm also not interested in taking my car apart to learning how my car works.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I know what I need to know to make my car run, but I don't know all of it.
Speaker C:So I think you can start to dive into the weeds of making these decisions about a gun at these minute individual levels where you're talking about shit that doesn't really matter.
Speaker C:Right, Right.
Speaker C:What's the problem you're trying to solve and what are the best options out there for you to solve that problem?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think that we live in a time where when we don't know everything, it bothers us.
Speaker B:We're used to being able to plug in the answers into the Google machine and we're able to, you know, search YouTube and find, you know, thousands and thousands of people all giving their opinion.
Speaker B:And for someone who is again going back to what is the on Ramp.
Speaker B:Sometimes as individuals we can get that paralysis of, you know, is this, is this something that I should do?
Speaker B:Is this something that I should get?
Speaker B:You know, this, this says it's a great gun.
Speaker B:This says it's an okay gun.
Speaker B:This person didn't like it at all.
Speaker B:This person, you know, this person has ads running for them like, I don't know.
Speaker B:And ultimately I think this comes down to going, renting a gun, trying it out, seeing if you like it, if it's the only thing available in your price point and you're saying, you know, I need something.
Speaker B:If you want to get it, get it, get it for your safety, get it for your security, get it for your own peace of mind.
Speaker B:Train with probably won't be your only firearm that you get.
Speaker B:Eventually you'll be coming to get a custom firearm that is 3, 4, 5, whatever X the original amount is that you purchased your first gun from.
Speaker B:For and with inflation, those X's can just keep going, keep going, right?
Speaker C:Keep finding what works for you.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And so I think that it's important when we talk about what's bringing in these new gun owners and how do we get them to a place that we don't ever discount what happens behind the counter at a gun store and what happens behind the rental counter at a range.
Speaker B:Because those places are still so fundamental to how the second amendment community grows.
Speaker B:And that's why hopefully the conversations that we get to have on podcasts like this help the people working behind the counter to see the needs, see the desires, and understand maybe the philosophy behind why someone is choosing to become a new gun owner.
Speaker B:Today.
Speaker A:You, you guys deal with a lot of brick and mortars.
Speaker A:Do you think that the person behind the counter, since you started buying guns nine years ago, do you think that person has changed that they're more well educated?
Speaker A:Because I feel like they, they're getting a lot better.
Speaker A:But there's still some of those, like the coffee pot guys that they're kind of discourage you and you need an.
Speaker C:I mean, I think it depends on, it depends on where you're going.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I think that what Kayleigh is saying is true.
Speaker C:If you're going to the gun store, right, you're likely to have strong people there that know a lot of information.
Speaker C:They have a lot of options that you can choose from.
Speaker C:Depending on if it's the kid behind the counter or it's the, you know, market funded sales group that has a goal to meet that month, they're going to force, you know, a certain type of brand.
Speaker C:There's, you know, there's definitely different lenses that you have to look through there.
Speaker C:As a gun buyer, I think that the fact that we have a place to go as a 2A community, these stores that are investing in providing and investing in educating and giving training, I think that that is the best place for people to start if they don't know where to go.
Speaker C:Yes, YouTube and social media is also a great place to start getting information.
Speaker C:But as you said, you know, you can hear that this is, the sky is blue, and then tomorrow the sky is going to be turquoise, and then from somebody else, it's purple.
Speaker C:And God forbid you argue with any of them because it's all colors.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:So it just, there's so much information out there.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker C:I am very supportive of gun stores because I think that they, it's hard to be a gun store owner and because of the people who are either older and think that they know everything and nothing new is functional, or you've got the really young kids coming in because they're excited and they love it and they think that this little trinket is the best little thing and it has nothing to do with, you know, form or function of how you're going to shoot your gun.
Speaker C:Those two dichotomies aside, the gun store brings it all together and they, they're supporting the 2A community the most.
Speaker A:Well, and I, and I've said it on this podcast before, and I'll say it again, the guys behind the counter and the brick and mortars are the lifeblood of this industry.
Speaker A:Without them, our products go nowhere.
Speaker A:I mean, there's online, there's online stores, but they still have stores, but you.
Speaker C: hip it to a store to get your: Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And those guys like, and I've said it before that I personally feel like the guys behind the counter are getting more educated.
Speaker A:They seem to be more welcoming, they seem to be more engaged, inclusive to, to the two A community bringing more people in.
Speaker A:But if they're not trained in, in your product or trained in anything, they're.
Speaker A:They're not going to push it, they're not going to do it.
Speaker A:But without them, like, this goes nowhere.
Speaker A:This is, it's a hard stop.
Speaker A:Like, I can watch 120 YouTube videos on one gun, but I can't buy it from that YouTube video.
Speaker A:That's just telling me, like, cool.
Speaker A:This guy thinks it's great, this guy thinks it's good.
Speaker A:This guy's thing is good.
Speaker A:Until I put it in my hands at the store, you know, then I don't know if I like it or not.
Speaker A:All I know is that I'm gonna watch a video before I go buy it.
Speaker A:I'm gonna buy it, I'm gonna shoot it and I'm gonna go.
Speaker C:And then you're gonna make your decision if you like it or not.
Speaker A:And then I'm gonna go back and watch more YouTube videos on that gun just so I can justify my purchase.
Speaker A:And that's, it's, it's our, it's our societies.
Speaker C:So you need a gun counselor.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker C:That I think is a huge industry opportunity is gun counselors.
Speaker C:Because so many people want to talk about all the nuances and watch them when some people.
Speaker C:And I will tell you, yes, we own and run a firearm store, but if I like how that gun feels when I shoot it, you just want a new customer.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:I mean, I, I'm not gonna watch 18 million videos.
Speaker C:Like, I don't have time for that.
Speaker C:And I could care less.
Speaker C:But it's one of those, like what works for you.
Speaker C:And if you're in a store and you've got people helping facilitate, find that for you, your, your experience is so much more positive and then you don't get the paralysis by analysis either.
Speaker A:Yeah, well, I, it's the dopamine hits, I guess.
Speaker C:But you're a gun guy, right?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And most people, most people, the millions of gun owners that we have are not super gun guys.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Like I say, I'm not a gun guy.
Speaker C:And people are like, yeah, you are.
Speaker C:I'm like, but I'm not like, I, I like it and I will practice and I will train, but if I have to choose to go to the range or go hiking, I'm gonna go hiking.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Like, I'm not gonna choose that gun experience every day.
Speaker C:And so I think as a 2A community, bringing in the support for the everyday people is where we all become more educated and welcoming and have gun stores that we're supporting who are promoting, you know, the two A community.
Speaker C:Good word.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think that that kind of goes into goa's philosophy.
Speaker B:Not to say that other organizations don't have fantastic members.
Speaker B:Many people choose to be members of, of all kinds of organizations.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But GOA has always been incredibly member focused at all walks of life.
Speaker B:And we're constantly saying, how can we make our systems smoother and easier for someone to be able to get educated on what's going on, take action on what's going on and how do we Defend the places where they are having positive experiences and being focused around, you know, the Second Amendment community.
Speaker B:It's why we have a zero tolerance case fighting the Biden administration zero tolerance policy, which is trying to shut down these gun stores and ranges.
Speaker B:It's why we do what we do is because a gun owner doesn't mean that you are all tactical all the time.
Speaker B:It means that you are a gun owning American.
Speaker B:You're a law abiding citizen.
Speaker B:You are someone who understands that these rights are constitutionally protected.
Speaker B:They're not government granted.
Speaker B:And so those, those philosophies means that when we can have these conversations and it's not something that's going to be jarring for our members to see that we're saying, you know, hey, moms, carry a little bit different.
Speaker B:Hey, you know, there's different aspects, there's different trainings, there's, there's different moments in your life where you're going to be able to purchase and understand firearms differently.
Speaker B:And it's so exciting when you welcome in a new gun owner.
Speaker B:It is such a, we talk about the dopamine hit of watching YouTube and to feel good about purchases that you've made.
Speaker B:But I'm telling you, if people took their neighbor, their child's, you know, their child's best friend's parents out to the range and they went from somebody who was, you know, very apprehensive about firearms or thought they were the devil, and you educate them and you get them on the range for the first time and you see their eyes light up, that's the best dopamine hit that any gun owner can have.
Speaker C:I agree with that entirely.
Speaker C:And watching somebody go from, I can't, I'm scared, I'm scared, I'm scared to, oh, okay, okay, okay.
Speaker C:After every shot, right?
Speaker C:And then they fire their first mag in their magazine and they're like, okay, okay, I can do this, right?
Speaker C:That starts the desire to want to learn and know more.
Speaker C:And I think that it is motivating and I think it is what empowers a lot of the communities to keep things going in a positive direction for the two.
Speaker C:A community.
Speaker A:Well, shooting a gun doesn't always have to be about training and being, you know, hitting a, like you said, a.
Speaker C:Two inch square and a two inch circle in one and a half seconds.
Speaker C:And if you can't do that, you can't have a firearm.
Speaker A:But it's about having fun.
Speaker A:Like the most fun I've had.
Speaker A:Like last weekend we went to an event and we did Some night shooting and I got to put on nods for the first time, which is going to hurt my bank account so much.
Speaker A:But just.
Speaker C:Your poor wife.
Speaker A:I know, but shooting with nods like that was an experience I had.
Speaker A:Or we did the.
Speaker A:The coolest thing we did was they set up black lights and did glow in the dark clay shooting, which sounds.
Speaker A:It was just fun.
Speaker A:It was hard because you can't judge distance in the dark as easy, but that was just fun.
Speaker A:And I think my going to range days, and I've been doing this for so long, it's like I'm at a range day.
Speaker A:I just want to hang out or this is not as fun.
Speaker A:And I feel like I'm like this person.
Speaker A:Like I'm a Debbie Downer because.
Speaker C:Well, you're differentiating.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Between the sport and the hobby.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Versus the, you know, everyday carry.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Right, right.
Speaker A:And we.
Speaker A:So now it's more.
Speaker A:For me when I go to range days, I want to take, like, a person who's never shot a machine gun and go put their machine gun in their head and watch them, like, shoot it and light up and giggle afterwards or shoot a suppressor or shoot this or shoot that.
Speaker A:That's more fun to me than actually going around booth by booth by booth to try everything, because I want to see them, the experience, their experience.
Speaker A:And then the other part about doing these big industry events is you're hanging out with the community.
Speaker A:You get to hang out with your friends, you see your friends.
Speaker A:And that's what I think makes the Second Amendment fun.
Speaker A:Because we can do that and have fun and have a good time and sit there and run into old friends and giggle and joke and go, heck, you can't hit that target over there and make a game of it.
Speaker A:And I think that's what we really.
Speaker A:Another thing we need to do is just encourage people that this is fun.
Speaker A:It doesn't always have to be about 2 second splits while doing a handstand and singing the national anthem, you know?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:It can be a hobby, and it can be practice, and it can be education, or it can be proficiency, like you can.
Speaker C:It doesn't have to be super rigid, you know, focused effort all the time.
Speaker C:You can do fun things, and there are fun things that can happen, and there are fun guns to shoot that are not practical to have at all, but they're in your arsenal because they're fun to shoot, and you're choosing to spend your money on the toy.
Speaker A:We had that experience this weekend.
Speaker A:Kaylee got to shoot a Barrett for the first time.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:50.
Speaker C:Oh.
Speaker A:So our buddy Steve's got one.
Speaker A:And I'm like, bro.
Speaker A:He goes, I sold my house in Phoenix.
Speaker A:I had extra money.
Speaker A:I bought a Barrett.
Speaker A:And then she shot it.
Speaker A:She's like, I get it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Oh, that's a good time.
Speaker B:You get to enjoy those experiences.
Speaker B:And it's still.
Speaker B:It's still fun.
Speaker B:Like, and that's.
Speaker B:I think, and this is the last point that I'll make is the Second amendment is supposed to have an element of fun.
Speaker B:Like, you're supposed to be able to train in a fun way.
Speaker B:And, you know, a date night can very easily be a trip to the range, and it can be something that you just incorporate.
Speaker B:It doesn't have to be like.
Speaker C:And it doesn't have to be an argument between a husband and a wife.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:It can be meeting your spouse, where they're at on their journey.
Speaker B:Yes, yes, absolutely.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:And I think one of the best advice for all of the husbands or wives that are listening to this podcast.
Speaker B:You don't have to be the instructor for your spouse.
Speaker C:Wait, can you say that again?
Speaker C:Can we spell that out?
Speaker A:Can it be louder for the people in the back who didn't hear it right?
Speaker B:You don't have to be the instructor for your spouse.
Speaker C:Wait, really?
Speaker B:You can just be the support person in the room, and maybe they want to attend a class that's all female.
Speaker B:That's fine.
Speaker B:Maybe they want to attend a class with you there as just another participant.
Speaker B:That's fine.
Speaker B:But their journey is their journey.
Speaker B:Support them.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:And I say all of this, and my husband's very encouraging, and we've never had that.
Speaker B:This issue, but so many of our friends are like, I won't go to the range with them.
Speaker B:And I'm like, oh, that's not a good president.
Speaker C:No, you hit the nail on the head with.
Speaker C:You can be the support person in the room.
Speaker C:And I think that that is huge because people ask all the time, like, oh, I'm going to take my wife to the range.
Speaker C:What should I do?
Speaker C:Or, I'm buying this gun for my wife.
Speaker C:Well, has your wife felt it?
Speaker B:Has she?
Speaker C:You know, she's 5 2, and her hands are small, and you're trying to buy her a.40 Smith Wesson, you know, whatever.
Speaker C:And you're like, she's not able to shoot that.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So I think being the support person in the room is huge because at the end of the day, if.
Speaker C:If there has been any pushback from your spouse of going to the range and Shooting a gun for the first time, there is a layer of fear that they may not know how to communicate with you, and they may not know how to express that.
Speaker C:And so going there and just being supportive and showing them how.
Speaker C:And when they get upset, and I just saw this at the range a couple weeks ago, they get upset and they're like, well, it's not comfortable in the.
Speaker C:Well, it's not supposed to be comfortable.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker C:That's not what we say today.
Speaker C:Like, okay, you know, try to help make it happen and just let the experience be positive versus judgmental and negative, and it will be better for your home life.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:Oh, I agree.
Speaker A:I learned that very early.
Speaker A:So my wife, the first time she said, I kind of want this, we went to store.
Speaker A:She really liked the feel of.
Speaker A:I think it was a sky CPX2.
Speaker A:And she put it in her hand.
Speaker A:She's like, I really like it.
Speaker A:I'm like, do you want it?
Speaker A:She's like, yeah.
Speaker A:So we bought it.
Speaker A:And immediately, when I was working in a range at the time, immediately I was like, listen, this is how you rack.
Speaker A:I'll teach you how to rack it and everything.
Speaker A:I'm gonna pay for some time with an instructor for you to go learn.
Speaker A:And she's like, well, why don't you teach me?
Speaker A:I'm like, listen, I love you, but we argue over how do the dishes get done sometimes or who does this.
Speaker A:I don't want that.
Speaker A:Let's go.
Speaker A:So she learned, and as time has progressed, she's gotten away from that gun.
Speaker A:She really like the 380 ez from Smith and Wesson.
Speaker A:Got into that.
Speaker A:She really liked that gun.
Speaker A:So the last time we were out, I went out with Kurt and a couple and his wife and a couple people.
Speaker A:She started doing.
Speaker A:She's watched me do these drills and things over time.
Speaker A:So she started doing the transition drill and changing mags and all the, like, going, so transitioning to target.
Speaker A:And I'm sitting there, I'm like, this is a proud moment.
Speaker A:I'm so happy because you're encouraging her.
Speaker A:Because I'm not telling her what to do.
Speaker A:I'm just encouraging her.
Speaker A:Like, I'm your support person.
Speaker A:I'm going to be your cheerleader.
Speaker A:You did great.
Speaker C:I mean, I live and work with one of the top instructors in the world, I would argue.
Speaker C:And we had to, very early on, set up the tone for going to the range.
Speaker C:And it was, okay, today we're just going to the range to shoot.
Speaker C:Or is this a student instructor range moment and we both had to kind of put those hats on of this isn't about tone or emotion.
Speaker C:What is, what is it that people say, like, what's your tone?
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker C:It's not about tone or emotion.
Speaker C:It's about this objective that we're trying to achieve.
Speaker C:And I think that there's a lot of support that can be had.
Speaker C:But I also think that if you are self aware enough that you know that you cannot shut that off for you internally, hire an instructor or work with somebody who can help make that introduction because it will be way better for the other 22 hours of your day and probably next six days of your week.
Speaker B:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker B:And another thing that I think, you know, while we're on date night and having your spouse on the range and all of the things that come with that, when the time is done and the range time is over, your.
Speaker B:We kind of have this rule at our house where like your next three sentences matter the most.
Speaker B:So once we're done and everything is put up, give me three positive things.
Speaker C:Positive?
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker B:Like that, you know, take a picture and be like, look at what you accomplished.
Speaker B:Like, we were at the range, we spent this time together.
Speaker B:You know, you got more comfortable with this firearm or you did, you know, great.
Speaker B:And I'm so happy that we got to spend this time together because you will carry whatever those endorphins are out of the range, whether they're positive or whether it's a bad attitude from whatever was just said that is going to.
Speaker B:Regardless of how great your range time was, that trip home and how you frame the experience after it happened is going to have such a mental effect.
Speaker C:100%.
Speaker C:That's that self positive talk, right?
Speaker C:We were talking about that earlier of being positive and structuring positivity around what shooting and firearms ownership is.
Speaker C:I love that.
Speaker C:I absolutely love that.
Speaker A:You guys are a manufacturer, you work with a lot of gun stores as a community.
Speaker A:How do we better evolve to be more inviting for these new shooters and new 2A people?
Speaker C:Oh, the list is long, John.
Speaker C:The list is long.
Speaker C:I think that, you know, in a conclusive way, being more welcoming and being more positive are the two places to start.
Speaker C:We've talked a lot about, you know, spouses supporting one another, people supporting one another, being positive on the Internet.
Speaker C:At the end of the day, that people are listening to podcasts, they are going to YouTube, they are watching comments on what everybody is saying.
Speaker C:And I think being welcoming and educational versus judgmental, negative and just downright rude can change the narrative about the two A community and firearms ownership.
Speaker C:I think that there's so much happening in the media and politically to try to fight against what the two A community is about that the more education we can provide to the people that don't have the time to go to the range and train for hours a week or hours on a weekend to, you know, the, the moms and dads deciding that they want to take responsibility for their family in their own hands to the, you know, single guy or single gal that are tired of walking into their work building, you know, early in the morning or late at night and they want to be protected is provide the tools and the education to them that makes it okay for them to be a gun owner in, in their journey and meeting them where they're at and ready to accept what firearms ownership means to them.
Speaker C:Part of making the decision to carry and learning where that is.
Speaker C:Sarah and John Hutman from Filster and the Filster Education Channel.
Speaker C:They do a fantastic job of talking about carrying concealment and finding your peaks and your valleys on your body of, you know, as women, we generally have boobs and hips that add different curves in places, right.
Speaker C:Men generally run into waist or belly issues.
Speaker C:And there's a place on every person's body where you can find the valley where your gun needs to sit.
Speaker C:And trying to carry on your peaks right directly in front of, you know, your gut or at the widest part of where your stomach is or the widest part of your hip is not going to be conducive to concealed carry, right?
Speaker C:And so I think experimenting with what works for you so that you can a be confident in where it's positioned because if it's not, if you're not confident it doesn't feel right, then you're not going to want to carry.
Speaker C:Two is, you know, there may be another holster or a wedge or a different belt.
Speaker C:Like, there's so many layers that go into finding a way to carry that is as comfortable as carrying is going to be, right?
Speaker C:At the end of the day, carrying a gun is not comfortable.
Speaker C:And anybody that tells you that it is, they're just used to it being there all the time and they know what it is, right?
Speaker C:So finding, finding all those things and educating yourself on how to be a better concealed carry gun owner will make you as an individual 10 times more confident, right?
Speaker C:No matter what your body shape, body type, body size is there, there is a way to make it work.
Speaker C:You just need to make sure that it is safe.
Speaker C:If you're going to choose to carry.
Speaker A:If you are a concealed carrier and you do it long enough, you will have a bin filled with holsters and belts and.
Speaker A:And mag pouches and everything.
Speaker A:I have a large bin filled with, like, 15 holes.
Speaker A:Well, because I. I tried this gun, and I wanted to carry this gun, and I want.
Speaker A:I tried this holster type and this holster type.
Speaker A:You will have a bin full of them.
Speaker A:Just know it now.
Speaker A:And then you will like, maybe I'll go back to that holster.
Speaker A:I want to try that one again.
Speaker A:Or this holster was okay.
Speaker A:Or the other thing is, and I learned this early on, is don't be afraid to tweak the clips, right?
Speaker A:And move them around like, and try different angles and see where it feels comfortable.
Speaker A:Because at first I was like, break this or something's not going to fit.
Speaker A:I'm going to mess this up.
Speaker A:And I. I messed up a couple holsters by doing it or tightened too tight, but finding that right level of.
Speaker C:Where it's at and the power of a wedge, man.
Speaker C:Oh, yeah, Wedges are phenomenal.
Speaker C:And I did not.
Speaker C:I. I think I vehemently fought against my husband because he kept telling me, add a wedge.
Speaker C:And I was like, I don't want.
Speaker B:To add a wedge because you're telling.
Speaker C:Me to add a wedge, right?
Speaker C:And then Tessa from Armed and Styled, she's like, amy, just at.
Speaker C:And I was like, oh, why?
Speaker C:My husband literally was like, what are you talking about right now?
Speaker C:And I was like, well, Tessa said it was really funny, but I have to fall in a big sword on the holster thing, earn it.
Speaker C:I was like, why do we have all these holsters in these magazines?
Speaker C:This is ridiculous.
Speaker C:And he's like, oh, you just wait.
Speaker C:You just wait until you start liking guns and it's gonna change.
Speaker C:And now he's like, do you want me to put this in my holster bin, or do I need to start one for you?
Speaker C:And I'm like, it's yours.
Speaker C:It's all yours.
Speaker C:So I now understand that.
Speaker A:I think I've gone through, like, 20 or 30 different holsters of one gun.
Speaker A:I think I went through five different holsters.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker C:And it's just like, it depends.
Speaker C:And as you start carrying and you lear what you like, it's going to change, right?
Speaker C:You don't wear the exact same pair of shoes every single day.
Speaker C:Okay?
Speaker C:There are some creatures of habit that do, but most people don't, right?
Speaker C:Like, you just have to find what likes what.
Speaker C:You have to find what you like.
Speaker C:And if you like it and you feel confident, then it's the right decision for you.
Speaker A:Well, this has been a great two hour conversation and I expected that from you.
Speaker A:We've known each other long enough that I know that.
Speaker A:But where can people find you?
Speaker A:Langdon?
Speaker A:Any socials, anything you want to plug while we're wrapping this up?
Speaker C:You can find us online on the product side of our business@langdon tactical.com or you can find the education tips and training videos@LTT discover.com and then we are on YouTube and Instagram and Facebook at Langdon Tactical.
Speaker A:And where do they find you?
Speaker C:Well, you can find me on Instagram if you want a mom hiking, lifting and shooting Life at Amy Underscore hike, lift, shoot.
Speaker C:And if you don't like the dancing videos in the gym, don't hit, follow.
