109. Using Instagram as an Introvert with Brittany Verlenich - Podcasting for Educators: Podcasting Tips for Online Entrepreneurs

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109. Using Instagram as an Introvert with Brittany Verlenich

2nd August 2023 • Podcasting for Educators: Podcasting Tips for Online Entrepreneurs • Sara Whittaker, Podcast Strategy

0:00

Do you consider yourself an introvert? And do you find Instagram to be an overwhelming platform to use and maybe you even avoid it like the plague. If that's you, then you are going to love this episode because I have on my friend Brittany Verlenich. And Brittany is actually a repeat guest. She was here back in episode 42. And we talked all about using Facebook groups to build a podcast community. And in this episode, we're focusing on how to use Instagram as an introvert. Brittany talks about what exactly an introvert is compared to an extrovert and why it's not just a black and white comparison, we go into how you can still use Instagram as a tool for your business. Even if you do identify as an introvert how your strategy on Instagram can look different depending on your personality, strategies for promoting your podcast on Instagram, even if you don't like showing your face. What can set you apart from your competition on social media platforms and the idea of putting the problem before the product. Brittany is so good at what she does. And she's really great at helping you see how you can use these platforms in a way that works for you and works for your personality. So let's go ahead and get to the episode. Your Podcast is a powerful tool that serves your audience and your business. But how do you manage it all bring in new listeners and convert those listeners into customers. That's what this show is all about. Welcome to podcasting for educators. I'm Sara Whittaker, classroom teacher turn podcast manager, and I'm here to help you get the most out of your show, all while making an impact on other educators. Well, hello, Brittany, you are a return guest and we just did an episode for your podcast alive episode, by the way it was live in her Facebook group that she uses for her podcast, which was such a cool experience. So welcome back to the show.

2:00

Oh, thank you for having me, Sara, and thank you for being willing to experiment with me. I appreciate it. Of course.

2:04

Now today, we're gonna be talking about a really fun topic, we are going to be talking about using Instagram as an introvert and Brittany and I were just talking before we hopped on here that we feel like the word introvert is like super trendy right now everybody identifies as an introvert. And I think if you identify as an introvert, you might automatically think, well, I don't want to spend a lot of time on social media, or that's not a good place for me to be to share about my business, because it's a social platform, and I'm not a social person. So we're gonna be getting into all of that. And I'd love to start by defining what an introvert actually is, versus an extrovert because I definitely think there's a lot of confusion out there. So Can you fill us in?

2:58

Absolutely. Hi, by the way, everybody, so good to be back. So when I think about the difference between an introvert and an extrovert, I think of where you get your energy. So does being around people drain you? If so, then that's probably some introversion. Does it excite you, then that's probably extraversion. But I also think that it's important to remember these are scale. If you ever take a Myers Briggs test, and you'll probably see you have some kind of percentage. I love the visual graphs afterwards, because you can see how much of a percentage I'm like 90% extroverted, so I'm like, I'm 100% basically extroverted, really close to that. But that doesn't mean that I don't like my alone time, or that I don't enjoy being at home or that sometimes I just don't feel like getting my face on camera or going out, right. Like a lot of these things that we kind of have adopted into being an introvert just mean like a homebody or being shy or being scared. Even like maybe you're just scared to do something. And if so, that's okay. There's no shame in that. So I think that that's kind of what we were talking about is we often use being an introvert or whatever it is, it could even say, you can even say being shy as an excuse to not show up and get visible. When if it is fear. That's okay. Let's just address it and then do it scared anyway.

4:10

Yes, I absolutely love that. I think sometimes when we take these personality tests, it makes us put ourselves into this box. And that's what we identify as. And I love how you explain like, if you're feeling scared about something, that doesn't mean that you're like a scared person. It's just a feeling that your habit that you have, and I think it's good for all of us to be scared every now and then especially in business.

4:36

remote like Croatia has over: 1200

5:35

Yeah, so well said. And I think to a degree, we if we want to see our business reach newer levels, we do have to do those things scared and get ourselves visible and get out there and take advantage of different opportunities, even if it does terrify you a little bit. So let's talk about if you do identify as an introvert, and you have some of those qualities that Brittany shared earlier, how can you still be really successful on Instagram and use it as a social tool and as a tool that will help your business.

6:14

One thing I want to challenge you to share is that not everybody has to use social media in the same way. A lot of times you hear people pushing a certain thing. And I will say that, obviously these platforms, they want people to stay on them as long as possible, right, they are monetizing with ad revenue. That means to sell these ad dollars, they have to be able to say X amount of people are on at any given time. But with that in mind, you don't have to do everything that they do. Because sometimes you can do everything that the platform says and still not get the reach and results that you want. So So with that, in my intro, if you really want like sustainable success, you really have to enjoy how you show up on there. And that means a little bit of experimentation at first and trying some different things. Some things I found that work really well with some of my clients who are truly introverted. One is a static grid. And I've seen someone do like a nine grid or a 12. Grid. And it's kind of hard to show you if you're just listening. But if you envision your profile, having like either a big picture or having a series of pictures that all fit together like a puzzle, so where you don't have to update your feed every day, or ever again, which is amazing. And then when you feel like it, when you do have the energy, you can record a reel if you want. If that's not your thing, you could do a faceless real, or you could forego reels entirely and show up in stories. And maybe stories are more doable for you. Maybe you Never show your face. And it's just like text posts, there are accounts like that, that do really well. So in fact, actually, I'm just going to add, in general, whenever everybody else is digging, you should zag. Okay. So if everybody's doing this one thing over here, you are going to stand out and be visible by not doing what everybody else is doing. And I'm not saying you have to be a contrarian, but think about some ways that you can stand out. And that might be from doing things differently. And also, you're gonna feel better once the pressure is off, I don't have to post every day, you might actually find you like posting more, which is kind of funny how that works.

8:06

I just am like fascinated by this nine grid thing. Sometimes I'm like a little behind on the social media trends. So can you explain this to me? So is the idea. Because I love it, if this is true, is the idea that because people want they'd like delete all of their other posts or hide them somehow. And then it's the nine grid, and then they can still post reels that aren't posted on their feed, and then they put most of their energy into stories. Is that the idea?

8:35

Yeah, so you can choose how you do it. Because we have to think about like, where Instagram is in the whole funnel right of marketing. So usually, Instagram is either the first place they find us, if you're going heavy on reels or carousels, or maybe you're a photographer, you're doing lots of product photography, stuff like that. So it's either the first place they find you, or it's a second place they find you. And how you show up on the platform is going to be really different depending on which one you're focusing on. So if Instagram is a tool to get discovered, then I would say yeah, you might want to think about doing more reels or carousel posts right now or paying attention to trends, it's going to matter a little more to you. If that is your primary traffic driver. And it is for some people, I don't want to say it's not going to work for you, because I know some people who do really well with that, specifically sellers. And that's how they draw traffic. And I'll share some strategies for that that are working well for my clients in the TBT space. So yeah, you could do that. You could also archive the old posts. I've seen some people do like a three post grid that says something like check posts below or old posts Below are some things that when they can draw attention to the top. And you don't have to do a whole nine grid or 12 grid either. You can actually pin posts on the top row. So you could do like a three grid and say something like whatever your core call to action is you can have them like check my stories or DM me for X offer or whatever it depends on what you're selling. Usually with low ticket products like one to $3 on TPT. You can usually share the link it's a little less involved of you but I will We'll share the comment to customer strategy. And if you want to capture that now or

10:03

Yeah, go for it. Yeah.

10:05

So that one I would say is more if you aren't going to do the passive thing. So actually, I'll share more tips with the passive grid in a second, because I feel like a lot of people are hearing that nobody that's calling my name, I don't ever want to post again, five.

10:18

Sounds great.

10:20

So I'll share that in a second. But let me share the comment to customer strategy. Because if you're posting every day, you need to be doing this, okay. And I don't like saying that to everybody. But this is really something I think you should do. So what you could do is your call to action on your post, if you are talking about a product, and when you talk about a product, by the way on Instagram, you are not making a commercial, I know feels like we have to, but you're not you're talking about the transformation that's going to happen by using the product, the product is the vehicle for the transformation. Okay. For example, I did a real for a client where we are talking about Africa. And we were talking about how maps have. And this is kind of a history lesson and sorry, how maps have been used as like a tool for colonization over time, and how sometimes they're not shown a certain way accurate, all that stuff. So we educated with real, but in the background, you saw a video of the product, right? So we were pitching the product without outwardly pushing the product, we were sharing value or sharing something interesting. Her followers are all history people. So it made sense for her niche. And she got a really a lot of engagement on that. But the core thing that we did was on the bottom, we said comment map, if you want me to send you more info about this resource that I have in the background. So that was the only time we mentioned it in the whole post. Everything else was just about the actual content. And what happens is people say map, you respond and say, Hey, love that you're interested, nice to meet you. I just sent it to you, you send it to them, you don't send them a link, because we send a link directly, it's going to be like a spam to go the message requests, I would send one message for saying, hey, thanks so much for commenting on my posts really appreciate it. If you can have some kind of personal connection, that's great, too. And then say, Hey, I'm going to send you a link to the resource. Here it is, let me know if you have any questions. I does a few things for you. One, since you had their comment, and then your response to the comment on the post, you are now pushing that post out to more people because it's getting more comments that shows Instagram people like this, I'm going to show it to more people, too, when people DM you because you DM them, and then they respond to you that increases your engagement rate that also makes sure that your posts get pushed out to more people. And then three, when we think about personal connections with customers, which is what sales is really marketing is what we put in the post, the sale starts happening in the DMS, right. So that conversation that sales conversation feels so good, because you are not just like pushing a link, you are addressing them first name, and like, wow, you're gonna stand out because I don't see a lot of sellers or people doing this because they're like, Well, my products are only a couple dollars, or my bundles are 20 bucks, I don't care. But imagine if you got five comments. I'm not saying all five were gonna buy right, but save five comments, and say two or three of them buy and you make 60 bucks, because you were selling a $20 bundle. And it takes you five minutes, right? And then not to mention if that person, if when those people don't buy, you might still get a sale later, because they're gonna remember that you took the time to connect with them. And I will even go the extra step for my own stuff. I will go look at the person's profile, and just see Is there anything we have in common? Like, oh, this person likes cats? Like oh my gosh, oh, and I will legitimately say that your cat is so cute, authentically a force like don't want it. But so yeah, so that's a really simple thing that you can do. And that's something you can do with with almost any post. So if you are going to use Instagram actively, I'd highly recommend that. Did you want me to share, like a variation of that strategy for the passive grid? Or did you want to add to that?

13:44

Yeah, I just had a question for these, like when you do things like comment with this, and then you send them the message? Or do you typically use I'm blanking on the name of that app that everybody uses that does it for you?

13:59

Do you mean like many chat?

14:00

Yeah, do you typically use that?

14:03

I don't, because I tried and I could not figure it out yet. So that's a future Britney task. But one thing you could do, so you could look into that if you want. But if you want something a little scrappy, or that's free, you could use saved replies. So if you create a safe reply on Instagram, and you have like, like, say we do save a message, the first message is, Hey, first name. So nice to meet you loved whatever I saw. So the hard thing about that is usually the first message is going to be more personal because you would have looked at their profile or you would have connected with them. And then it's hard to show you on a podcast. But when you look at a comment on a post, there's a place to respond with a comment and there's a place to message them directly. So a lot of times if someone has a private profile, you can't go to their profile and message them. So that is the only way to message them if they left a comment on your post so I message them there first. Usually that yeah, for some reason, and it could just be like a version Instagram would like to update it. So I can't do that. But I don't know, you know, different features roll out different times. But I've noticed this. So now I message people directly next to the reply on the comment, to start the conversation, I do not send the link there because I don't want to be marked as spam. And also because I want to connect with them genuinely, once you send that you're going to see a little notification pop up towards the bottom that says, See message or see chat, see, see whatever it is, you're going to click on that. And that will take you to the DMS where you can continue the conversation. Once you have a saved reply, you could like save for that example map to is what you save it as go to your saved replies. At that end, it'll populate everything that you would have said in the second step. And then map three, you send them the link. So if I do believe that you should save time as much with automation as possible, but that's a really easy way to like start with personalization, and then end with the Save reply. So you save your time, or you could do many chat. I've seen people do that where they have like a bill that like for workshops and stuff they have coming up and they'll be like, Yes, I'm in or like email it to me. So that's something else you could do too.

16:02

Yeah, no, those are all great. And I love that you mentioned like making sure that when you're commenting like if you do go over to somebody's profile commenting authentically, because we all I'm sure can spot those like spammy comments that, you know, people are just trying to like get their engagement in for the day. Now, I am curious for something like this, if you're going to focus on doing this. Is there a good amount of time that you recommend to spend on something like this? Or a certain number of posts? That would be good to aim for each week?

16:38

y goes viral like hundreds of: 1000

19:00

That was a 2 AM scroll.

19:03

But because they replied to the comment and sent me a message, that's just going to increase the likelihood that I'm going to see it Now bear in mind, I'm like a super user, I respond to a lot of DMS, you probably don't have that same volume problem. But that's how people are. We're just so distractible, so we really have to meet people where they're at as much as possible.

19:22

Okay, I love that strategy. Can you tell us a little bit about what that would look like if somebody was doing the passive grid?

19:29

Yes. Isn't that just such an exciting idea, right, like I put it up once and never have to post again. So if you're going to do that, if you're going to do that your captions matter probably even more than they do on a post that you're doing every day because you only get that one shot, right? And you don't know if they're going to click on the captions for every single post because if you have your whole image, it's less likely but it's possible. So what I would do again is I would look at your best sellers and I would try to choose evergreen resources. Whereas like, you know, by month or by season, you have different ones, especially, you know, depending on your niche, I would choose evergreen bestsellers. And I would have in your graphics for it. And there's so many templates. Now, if you look up on Etsy, like puzzle grid or Instagram static grid, you could find a whole bunch of them. And then you can pop in product photography or mock ups of your product if you're a TPT. seller, or if you have a course, like a signature course, or a signature membership, or some kind of, even if you're a service provider, if you have a signature service that you offer, have that highlighted on there, because you don't want it to be too busy, because then people won't be tempted to investigate. So on each caption, you're going to talk a little more about what you do, right. And there's a whole process for this. And I will actually, I'll share some resources with Sarah, because I don't have like templates for this. I wish I did. It's on my to do list. So

20:51

that's what I was just gonna ask you, yeah, have anything I could link to for like an example. I

20:54

know, I wish I did. But I'm not I'm not there yet. But I want you guys to get what you need. So I'll share some things that I recommend from other people. And you'll see on there, there's a certain strategy to it, that you kind of lead people on the customer journey with the posts that are on your static grid, because you're not getting that opportunity with the ever updated content. And then if you're doing that, that would be like, like I said before, that's usually when you're using Instagram as a second place, right? So they heard you on a podcast, they saw you speak at a summit, they saw your product in a collaborative bundle, and now they're following you on Instagram. So you have to think about those folks, they probably forget you exist, like after they followed you because it was like one interaction, and now they've moved on with their lives. So when they come back to your profile, it has to be able to make sense, right? You want it to be super clear, in each caption, like what you do and what they can get. So you might want to have one where you introduce yourself in the caption, and then you're gonna have one where you talk about what you do, right? Like, what why should they follow you? Right? What do they what are you going to offer them? Two or three, you're going to share where you show up? Mostly because you're not showing up on Instagram. Right? So where should they also look?

22:00

I'm gonna put your podcast you're gonna put Yes, yes, your

22:03

podcast, your email list. And we'll talk about list building in a minute, too. But those things are really important because like we say, Lincoln bio people are, it's again, the ad thing, like we don't even see it anymore. We just like ignore it. So you really have to think, what can you do to help them get to where they want to be? You have to kind of sell it to them. And I know, I know, sellers don't like the word sell, which is funny, right? You're a TPT seller, but you don't like selling these your printers. But you have to kind of like pitch it in a way that like why should I write it's that whole thing of like I'm on Instagram to chill out, I don't want to do anything I don't want to like I'm lazy right now, I don't want to do it. So you really have to give them a reason to either check your reel to DM you. DMS I think are like gold, DMS and stories. If you do nothing else, that is like the the place where you have opportunity to convert a follower into a lead, which we're kind of getting into list building now or to a customer, because you have the link sticker, you also just have the intimacy of a story. Like when I'm doing lead tracking, which ideally attraction for my clients. I'm like when I'm managing their accounts, I pay attention to people who are checking stories of that person every single day, because that's a hot lead for something, right? So I'm like managing this. And you could do this on a Trello board, or a CRM if you have a CRM platform. So I'm tracking okay, this person is interested in this. So I'm gonna make sure I message them on her behalf about x offer. And you don't have to get that fancy yet, you can just like see, okay, a lot of people are checking my stories. When I do X, or a lot of people respond to my stories. When I do Y like you can use that as your data. Story. Stickers are great because of the engagement, which you were just mentioning on the episode that we were recording together on mine. And DMS are great because you can have the conversation again, that connection that they're not having with other people, right. So that alone will make you stand out is having those connections with people and delaying the ask right like not just going to allow a product for that, like, actually figure out what their problem is. Why are they struggling with whatever it is if if they're saying my kids don't listen, or my kids won't sit down in class, okay, well, what are you trying? Right? And so you're not offering anything yet. You're really listening and figuring out what do they actually need? Do I have something for them? Or maybe actually a podcast episode? Oh, my gosh, one of the highest converting things that we've done is sending them a podcast episode that specifically answers that question. And it takes a few more minutes to go find like, which podcast episode it was, and send it to them. But that time, they're just like, wow, I can't believe you just took the time to go find that for me. And you've made that so easy for me. We've built so much brand loyalty for clients doing that. So it's those little things if, if everybody else is egging us ag or what are some extra special touches, what are things that nobody else is doing? And now that I've said this on the podcast, maybe everybody I'll do it, but hey, if everybody does that, and we're all building relationships with our customers, there, everybody's going to be better off

24:51

for it. Yes, I love when you can answer a question with a podcast episode, which is why you need to have some sort of master spreadsheet Just a little side note, so you can quick pop in there, do a search get the episode that you're looking for. So you don't have to be scrolling looking for that episode. But I love that you said that such a good strategy and just such a great way to show people that you took that extra couple of minutes to get exactly what they're looking for. And then that's an opportunity if they didn't know about your podcast already. Now they do. So that's great. Question. If you go the passive grid route, I would assume that you do need to be like, if you want to be getting something out of Instagram, you need to be fairly present on Instagram Stories. Do you? Is that the case? Do you think?

25:43

gy that like it was so hot in: 2018

27:07

Totally agree. I totally agree. It's such a great way to get in front of new people. So okay, I love all of these because pretty much everything that you've mentioned, you can do without showing your face. If you're somebody who really does not want to show your face on video, like you can do a real without showing your face. You can do a post you can get on stories talking about your podcast episodes, or whatever it is that you might be offering. Do you what's your take on sharing your personal life? Do you think it's still good to do a balance of work and personal? Yeah, it's such a good question.

27:41

And some people will leave either way. Let me let me also talk really briefly about the different kinds of like accounts that you can have, right? So there is an account that you can have that is completely faceless. And you could just have carousel posts and writing posts. I know a copywriter who does this. I have no idea what this copywriter looks like or sounds like but their account is amazing because they're a writer, they are showcasing their talent and skill with the posts right? But they're not an influencer. They're not trying to get brand deals. They're a service provider. They are looking for clients for copywriting that is specifically what they're offering right there are teacher influencers if you're a teacher influencer, then naturally you're going to be sharing more about your life you're going to be showing your face and by the way, I know some pretty amazing teacher influencers who are introverted, but they push through the fear because they know that what they have to share is so valuable you know because it's not about their face it's about what's happening in their classroom they want to share what's going on. So teacher influencers one route you're going to be showing your face and I would even say that if you look at my account, my account is kind of influencer II. I mean, it's not really like the the main model. But the reason I do that is because my goal for Instagram is actually not just to teach you how to use Instagram because you could listen to my podcast and learn the social media strategy and the tips, right? My Instagram account is to inspire you to put yourself out there so all of my content even though I have some strategy stuff there, my main goal is for you to just push through the fear and do it and so showing you stuff showing you examples to of showing your face is important for me because my clients need that. So again, I have a different goal than maybe you do if you are just trying to sell your products, then you may not have to show your face at all you could show your product photography, your mock ups. I don't love putting your covers as Instagram posts. I don't love that. But you can think of what are some other ways to highlight it and to kind of show it off without making it a commercial right like tell the story of the resources. I feel like I talked about this girl all the time. She's gonna eventually know who I am. Amy's adventures, Amy's adventures, she is such a She's so good with Instagram she's more of an influencer but she sells her products in a very creative way like she has this this storybook resource about like the pencil isn't no no the day the crayons quit. That's what it was the day the crayons were But she has this like activity thing. She teaches like little ones. And she has this whole story, she starts off saying, like, my kids were not treating the pencil or the crayons, well, they kept breaking out. And she was like making this face to the camera. So it's cute. But also she tells a story. And teachers can relate because they're like, oh, my gosh, I'm so sick of buying crayons and pencils, like that's driving me crazy. She's not starting with the product, she's starting with the problem. And she's addressing the people, which I think is a good to do with any content anyway, no matter how you deliver it. And then she positions her resource as the solution to that problem saying, this is a book you need to read. And by the way, here's a resource to help you with the book. Okay, so it comes at the end, you get value from the resource, even if you don't buy her stuff right from from the video itself. So I think she's really masterful at that. But you don't have to show your face even, you could just do even stock videos, oh my gosh, I can't believe I never mentioned this, you can go on Pexels, or your sites like that. And you could find stock videos to embed into your videos to like do filler for when you don't have like a video clip or something. And that's, that's really what worked really well, too. So yeah, you can do that. And then just tell the story of the resource. That's the most important thing. I think your voice is really powerful, figuratively, but also physically. So if you don't want to show your your face, still do some audio, if you can do a voiceover with the Instagram reels, because that's going to build such an intimate connection. And if you don't have a podcast yet, but you maybe want to practice that skill of speaking, because it is a skill of trying not to, you know, mess up on your words and have vocal crutches something you have to think about still sometimes use that as your entry point for that. And you're going to build that relationship so much more quickly. And if you're the kind of person who you're like, I don't want to sell like, I don't want to sound slimy, I don't want to sound sleazy, or like a salesman, or car salesman or something, then this is what you're doing. You're telling a story, you're taking the person on a journey. But even more than that, you're helping them become the hero. We're not the heroes, we're not the heroes really guide. The person who is watching the video coming across your posts. They're the hero, they're the main character of their own story. They want to know how they can be the excellent teacher who all the kids love. They want to be the one getting the accolades. So we have to really think how can we position our content in a way to get them the win, that they're the hero, they're the main character, and then showing them what we can give them on their journey. If you think about like, a castle dragon story, right? Like they're the knight, we're giving them the sword to go fight the dragon, right? Like we're not tonight, we're just giving them the sword. So yeah, if you could think of like that your content will be so much better. And that's a skill to telling a story of your brand and your product. If you haven't heard of story brand by Donald Miller, that's a really great resource to help you start creating content that tells a better story.

32:43

Yes, yes, that is a great resource to check out. And I'll make sure to link that in the show notes. I love the idea of putting the problem before the product. And I think you can use that framework when you're sharing about your podcast episodes to like we talked about this before. But like instead of starting with, Hey, I have a new podcast episode. It's like, do you have this problem, and then you can tell them at the end, I have the solution in this podcast episode that you can listen to. So I love that. And I have I'm glad you brought up stock videos, because I've seen people take clip like audio clips from their podcast episodes, and put it over a stock video. And it turns out really cool. I think it's really neat. So that's a great option of a way to share about your podcast without showing your face to

33:39

what's so funny too, is like, you know how when you do something, you start seeing everybody else doing it, right? Like, oh, I know what they're doing there. So I found these amazing people's, what I see is like big time people, and I see it and like that videos from Pexels. I know exactly what they're doing there. Because they have some of their own video, they're using that as filler, they're doing transitions, and then you start seeing everybody doing it, and you're like, oh, this person isn't better than me. This person isn't above me. They just figured out how to do something. And now I figured out how to do that. And I'm gonna do it. That's really all it is, is you're just watching what people are doing. So we don't want to copy people's content, but we can look and by the way, if you want to be a better marketer, which I know it's like a little marketing, but if you want to become better at it, you want to build a skill. Pay attention to what makes you stop in your tracks. What makes you stop scrolling, what reels catch your retention, what is it about it like? I love inspirational, aspirational content, like I can almost tell you the formula. There's a girl looking at the camera, she looks away over this beautiful landscape is a drone that zooms out if she's got that going on. I'm gonna I'm gonna watch the whole thing. So I just love a good landscape. I love the idea. It sounds so cheesy, but it's like, it's just how I am right and then I'm like, Okay, I know that content captivates me. So I know that's going to captivate somebody, maybe not everybody but my audience. But I try to show that in my content too because I want people to see no matter how you look, no matter Like I talked about this, my teeth are great. I'm Plus Size doesn't matter those things really don't matter. Your people want to see you put your face out there, they want to see it. And honestly, if you don't look like the quote unquote Instagram influencer, and if you feel really uncomfortable, that's going to be even more relatable because they're not comfortable either.

35:19

Yeah, no, I love, love, love that you brought that up. I mean, I think we can all relate to not wanting to get on camera, because we don't like the way that we look, whether it's like every day, or there's certain days that you don't feel great. I know, I felt like that all the time. So I think that that's really important. And it is even more of a reason to get on camera and let people know how relatable you are and give other people the courage to do the same. It's a ripple effect.

35:45

Yes, exactly. And I think that's, that's again, that's my really my goal with my Instagram is like, it's like teaching. Yes, there's teaching that happens on there. But I care more about you putting yourself out there and overcoming fears. And I think that getting visible, there's a lot of fear in there. And it's understandable What will people think of me? What will happen if I do have a video go viral? What if my principal finds out I have this thing? I've been trying to keep secret for the longest time. I mean, there's all kinds of reasons that you might not want to go viral or get visible. And by the way, just because you get visible doesn't mean you have to go viral, like I don't have a lot of followers have like 600 Something, although it's growing a lot, which is cool. But that's not my main goal with that. Like, I'm not trying to be an influencer on there. I want to be a person of impact and influence. And that is different. Yes, seeing someone have impact and influence is not the same as being an influencer. So I think if you can leave with that and think, what are some things I can share? Like, what am I going to say that really matters? What's going to stand the test of time, even if I changed my niche or something? Or even if someone didn't buy from me, what is one thing I want them to hear. And my idea is put yourself out there, whether that means taking a trip, or getting more visible, or dating somebody I don't know, whatever it is, I feel like that's general advice that you could just have for your life. And so many people miss opportunities, because they take themselves out of a race before it's even started. You know, so it's like, if you've never started a podcast, you'll never know whether or not you were good at it, because you'll never give yourself the opportunity. Same thing with being visible on Instagram or showing yourself, don't let being an introvert if you are actually an introvert, be your excuse for not putting yourself out there and not being successful with your marketing because you're scared because that's what it is. It's like, if you're introverted, if you're shy, people are going to love that they're going to love seeing the real you. You don't have to be super boisterous and loud like me. So yeah, just be yourself and put yourself out there and try something a little bit at a time. It doesn't have to be seven reels a week. You know, that's, that's too much for basically anybody start small, sustainable grow from

37:41

there. Ya know, it's such great advice, like, just because you see something, you know, see somebody dancing, like, for me, it's always, yeah, I'm entertained by all of these reels, and they capture my attention of like, these funny reels where people are dancing, or I don't know, I can't think of anything right now. But I'm always like, that's not me. So I'm not I'm going to stop trying to make myself feel like I need to be creating that kind of content, because that's not me. And that's okay. Like, show up as who you are. And that's all you can do.

38:19

Love that. And I think if you show up as Oh, sorry, I'm gonna cut you off. Sorry. Go ahead. As you say, showing up as who you are. That takes practice, too. Because I mean, if we want to even go deeper, do you know who you are? Which is such a hard question. But I think it's one of those things that we wonder we almost try on these personas, when we're becoming an entrepreneur. arcs are like, as this me is this. Is this me? I don't know. Especially because we tend to follow other people and whether or not we realize that we're soaking in things that we learn from them, you know, that's, that's just going to happen naturally. So you might need to take some time off of social media for a while or from consuming other people's content to figure out what is the message you want to share? Who am I? Because I had to really accept that. Even in the travel space, I had to eventually share like, I'm not, I'm not the person you follow for cute outfits, that's just not me. I dress like an assassin when I travel. I wear the same like five leggings all the time. Like we're all black, you know what I mean? So it's just, you just have to think about like, Who are you in this space, and then you have to own it. You have to be okay with that. Because you're gonna stand out just by being yourself because so many people are too scared to be themselves. So if you can overcome that fear, that'll put you apart too.

39:27

Yes. And it's so funny. Because when you say like, just be yourself and then you realize that can be a hard thing to do. It's like, it shouldn't be hard to show up as yourself, but it is and I mean, yes, that could be a whole nother conversation about like, do you even know who you are? Do you know who you want to be? That's something I think we're all constantly trying to figure out. But I hope that so far this conversation is giving you encouragement to put yourself out there a little bit, do things a little bit scary. hard to show up on social media even if that feels really scary to you. And it's something that you really haven't tried before, because there's lots of perks of being on Instagram. And as Brittany has shown you, there's lots of different ways that you can go about it in a way that feels true to yourself. Now, one thing that we wanted to touch on today also is using this platform as a way to drive leads to your email list, because we know that email is obviously another good place to nurture your audience. But in my opinion, it's the top place that you're going to see the most conversions for sales of things that you're selling. So what are some things that we can keep in mind when it comes to that?

40:47

Yes, absolutely. And I will say that, you know, a lot of people expect a social media person to say that social media is the best, but I really think they all work together, you know, like having a podcast, and email and social media, they all work together. So some things you could do the comment to customer strategy that I mentioned earlier, you can actually tweak that for freebies as well. So instead of pushing a product at the end, you can say like, say you're talking about a problem, like science of reading, for example, you're talking about a problem, you've noticed, like, everybody says that there's reading levels, but we all know that's actually not true, which again, that would be a great hook. Because be like, do we know that. But like, once they once they watch the reel, or see read the carousel posts, or whatever it is, you can say, like, comment book, if you want my resource to learn a little more about science of reading, because if that person is truly interested, you know, they may not be ready for a resource yet. And the kind of content matters too, right. And this is discovery content, they're learning about it for the first time, they're in a different place in the customer journey than someone who's already on board with science of reading, right. But if they're still learning about it, that would be a good time to say, comment, book or comment read to get my freebie to learn a little more about science of reading. And that's a really easy ask. So same thing, you would message it to them and then eventually send them the link. So instead of a product link, you would send them the freebie link. So that's one thing you can do. And then for links, really good timing, because Instagram actually just released a feature this week where you can put more than like five links on a profile, if you have a creator profile. So that's that's the one estrus there. So I tried on my business account, couldn't do it went over to my travel creator account. And I could. So it looks like as of right now, it's limited to creators, but depending on your model for Instagram, that could work. So you can put your freebie there, I usually don't use a link tree, not to say that I'm against them. But I just find best practices, I've seen that when you have just one link in Instagram, that tends to work best. Because again, any any time you have to ask someone to make a decision or think more of that was like Nano, you know, on Instagram, so I try to keep it really easy for them. If there's an event happening, then I usually have the freebie leading to that or the link leading to that, like I have the hiring of VA Summit. Well, I don't know when this is airing. But you know, depending on when you're listening, I have a certain event coming up. So they'll go to that. If I have an affiliate promotion that I'm really focusing on, then you might get that next. Otherwise, it'll be too a freebie. And then with that, too, your bio is a living document on Instagram, right? So make sure that you have a line on there that says like, don't just say get on my email list because nobody wants another email, right? Like, we don't want that. But what but what are they going to get? Right? So like, click below to get more information on science really, or to get your free checklist on whatever it is right? What am I going to get. And I will say you can position your newsletter as a place to be if you feel like you're really putting in the content, like you're almost using that as like a long form content medium, like a blog almost for email marketing, which is really good. Something else you could do is also use product photography, just like you would for products or mock ups for your courses and things do that for your freebies, I don't really see a lot of people doing that of like actually showcasing what their freebie looks like just like how Yes, for a product, you have to know what it looks like before you want to buy it, I have to know what it looks like before I'm gonna put my email in because that's still that's still an ask, right? So anything you can do to highlight that or show the transformation, even with the freebie, which if you feel like you're not gonna be able to offer some kind of transformation, even if it's small with the freebie you might want to rethink having it like Is there something you can change about it because the freebie should get them a little closer, you know, maybe not a to z, right? But A to B or A to C right to the point where they're ready for the next step of DEF so on.

44:22

Yes, no, that is such good advice. And even like highlighting testimonials from if you do any kind of follow up with people who have used your lead magnet or have you know, sometimes somebody might message you and say, Oh, I downloaded this and it helped me with this highlighting that on an Instagram post would be kind of cool. I did a post that was a mock up of my main lead magnet and it did really, really well. Yeah, that sounds so I yeah, I totally agree with that. That's perfect and that. I mean, all of those things are so doable, even for all of you introverts

45:00

Love it. Yes, very doable. And it doesn't require you really showing your face. I mean, you can show the product, you can show the testimonial if you have one. And I will say testimonials that's a whole other episode. It's you know, it's it can be hard to get testimonials. But even if you just have screenshots of things, you know, like messages, you get those work really well, too.

45:17

Yeah, absolutely. Well, Brittany, thank you so much. Is there any last bits that you wanted to add? Before we wrap up?

45:26

I think I've shared, I think I've shared a lot. But I also have some other resources for you, too. So like I have these traitors to subscribers guide, I'll make sure that she gets that that kind of walks you through this process of taking someone who may not even be a follower yet to getting on your email list, because that might be the only time that they see your profile. So I'll make sure that Sarah has access to that. Otherwise, if you like learning stuff like this, so really like my Facebook group, I really dive deep into like social media tips, and we have live podcast episodes in there. So all kinds of stuff you'll learn there.

45:55

Yes. Awesome. We will include all of those links in the show notes. Brittany, thank you so so much for being here. I know I learned a lot and I'm sure the listeners have to. Yes, thank

46:06

you for having me.

46:08

Thanks so much for listening to today's episode. To keep this conversation going connect with me on Instagram at podcasting for educators. I'm always looking for an excuse to talk about podcasting. If you're looking for support and launching, managing or growing your podcast, check out my online course the podcasting for educators prep school at podcasting for educators.com/prep school. I'll see you here next time.