Episode 112 of the Fit Mother Project Podcast is about magic mushrooms — but not in the sense you may be thinking.

This episode isn’t about tripping at a Grateful Dead concert! It’s about using functional mushrooms to promote health and wellness.

Functional mushrooms don't contain psilocybin so you won’t see any psychedelic effects.

Functional mushrooms have adaptogenic properties and health benefits and can support memory, mood, energy, brain health, digestion, immune function, recovery, longevity, and more.

A recent Netflix documentary, Fantastic Fungi, shed light on functional mushrooms like reishi, chaga, lion’s mane, cordyceps, turkey tail, and more.

But there’s a lot of misinformation about mushrooms, so we brought on an expert to set the record straight!

In this episode, you’ll meet Robert Johnson, the founder and CEO of Mycroboost, a premium functional mushroom company. He’s a cannabis and hemp industry veteran, health product expert, psychedelic advocate, and seasoned entrepreneur. 

He has a wide breadth of experience in various plant medicines and is here to deliver the truth about how they interact with our health and help our mindsets when used properly. 

This fascinating conversation focuses on functional mushrooms, but we also touch on psychedelic mushrooms and much more. It’s a true eye-opener!

In this episode, you’ll learn about: 

• The different types of functional mushrooms and how they differ from other mushrooms.
• The various health benefits of functional mushrooms. 
• What to look (and avoid) for in supplements.
• The history of psychedelic mushroom use and what the future may hold. 
• And more!

So, to get the most from your health and fitness efforts, listen to this episode on magic mushrooms, take some notes, and check out FM30X! 

More From Robert:

• Mycroboost website — Subscribe to Mycroboost for 20% off your first order, plus first dibs on special offers, sweet deals, and fungi fun facts!

What is FM30X?

FM30X is a simple, sustainable, specific weight loss program designed especially for busy women over 40. With short metabolic training workouts, an easy-to-follow meal plan, and an accountability team there for you at every step, FM30X can help you lose 30, 40, or even 50+ pounds!

Click here to see what you get when you join the FM30X program today!

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[00:00:41] And in today's episode, we get into. The world of functional mushrooms, why you might consider taking things like lion's mane, Chaga, Rishi, Turkey tail, and the benefits that they do have. And we also talk about psychedelic mushrooms, some of Robert's experiences, as well as the legal landscape of these things and where he thinks things are going.

[00:01:15] And he's been kind enough to give our listeners a discount on his website. You can go to MicroBoost, M Y C R O Boost. com. That's M Y C R O boost. com and you can use the promo code fit family to get 15 percent off at trying any of these, uh, supplements. And I'll say this, like I have used functional mushrooms like lion's mane and cordyceps for a while because they give me an edge and a lot of mental clarity in the cognitive benefits.

[00:01:54] I'll see you there today. We're joined by our guest expert, Robert Johnson, who is the founder and CEO of [00:02:00] micro boost, a company that specializes in making very high quality functional mushroom supplements. So you've probably heard some of the buzz and maybe even seen it in your local grocery stores or health food stores.

[00:02:29] He has a wide breadth of experience in all sorts of different plant medicines, certainly functional mushrooms, but also through his experience in the cannabis industry. Um, and he basically is the guy that knows a lot about. These medicines, how they interact with our health, how they help our mindsets when used properly.

[00:02:55] Robert: Oh, thanks a lot for that intro.

[00:03:01] Anthony: Cool. So let's just get straight into it. I think this, this term functional mushroom seems a little bit like a. A buzzword, but what does it exactly mean? And like, what does it mean to be a functional mushroom? What are some examples and let's just kind of like unpack it at a high level.

[00:03:31] Uh, and then you have the psychedelic mushrooms, uh, as you mentioned. And then what functional mushrooms are also known as medicinal mushrooms or adaptogenic mushrooms. Uh, some of them taste good, uh, like lion's mane, you know, can be used as a, as an edible mushroom, but mostly they're consumed for their medical benefits and, and have been for, for thousands of years.

[00:04:15] Anthony: For sure. And what are some of the main functional mushrooms that.

[00:04:26] Robert: Yeah, definitely. When, when I start to have a conversation with someone about functional mushrooms, if they've heard of any of them, usually the most popular one is lion's mane.

[00:05:02] And the reason for that is because of its cognitive enhancing properties. So, you know, baby boomers as well as Gen Xers, Millennials, are all looking for, you know, to, to be on their game, to be sharp, focused. And, and so I think that, you know, across generations, people are looking for just different ways to improve their, their attention span and their, their focus and their drive, you know, without caffeine that can have, uh, you know, negative side effects or, or pharmaceuticals.

[00:06:04] Uh, and this is just, uh, this is really good for any sort of, uh, uh, cognitive function. And so I think that, you know, a lot of, uh, a lot of people have had. Family members that have suffered from these neurodegenerative diseases. It's always a sad way to watch a loved one go. And, you know, we, we want to prevent that for ourselves and for more of our loved ones.

[00:06:47] And it just seems poetic to me that it also helps our literal neurons, at least Lion's Mane itself, make these powerful connections. I think that's very beautiful. So Lion's Mane is one for cognitive health and, and I can maybe speak to my own [00:07:00] experience having used it quite a bit. It's not something that gives you like the stimulant.

[00:07:15] Robert: That's a, that's a great qualifier for sure. It's not like a take a pill and you know, 30 minute immediate reaction, but it is building it up in your system and uh, and you know, working on your brain, working that it's a, it's mushroom magic through there over time.

[00:07:51] And, you know, if it helps with your arthritis, uh, you know, uh, and we're set up with the proper expectations and maybe be happy about that rather than I was trying to [00:08:00] do a back handspring

[00:08:14] So in any order, I'd love for you to kind of comment on some of these, and in any, I'm sure I missed some really heavy hitters too, but please go through these. Maybe start with Cordyceps.

[00:08:36] And won so many medals that the, uh, the Olympic judges, you know, had them drug tested and they passed all their drug tests and their coach, uh, credited cordyceps mushrooms for their increase in time. And so cordyceps is a natural energy booster and it's also great for your lungs. It's a respiratory enhancer.

[00:09:26] There's like over 400 different types of Cordyceps. And, uh, Cordyceps militaris, by the way, is what we use in, uh, in Lion's Mane. But the interesting thing about that, mushrooms are endlessly fascinating to me, is that, that fictional strain that's in that show, in the video game it was based on, is actually comes from a strain of Cordyceps.

[00:10:14] So that's just really cool. What, like you say, these really unique, not plants, not animals have the abilities to do. That is,

[00:10:34] And like, that's its legitimate lifecycle. Like that is crazy.

[00:10:57] You know, I, I, I like the attention that it gives [00:11:00] to, to Cordyceps, even a fictional version of it. Uh, but I'm hoping that it's not contributing to, to people's fear of mushrooms.

[00:11:15] I would say. Okay. So we also have talked to me about like reishi. I see this a lot in these products that people say like chill out or calm with reishi, like, is there, is there a calming effect of that? And then what's the benefit of that particular mushroom?

[00:11:29] It is, uh, there are studies that show that it can, can decrease anxiety and, uh, yes, calm the, the nervous system. Um, the Chinese call Reishi the mushroom of immortality. Uh, it's actually a really beautiful, um, uh, fungus as well. So yeah, the, the reishi mushroom, I think up there are so far we've gone through, uh, my top three, uh, and, and that one is, is endlessly fascinating [00:12:00] too, you know, one of the, one of the things about making, uh, supplements like, uh, like mushrooms, these alternative products.

[00:12:35] Affordable way to, uh, you know, invest in something that if it can really help with those things for you, then, uh, you know, you've really struck gold.

[00:12:58] Due to its, uh, effects in [00:13:00] cancer and, and helping with the immune system during cancer and people going through that. Can you speak into Turkey Tail, maybe some of that research or some of the takeaways from what we're seeing in a more cancer clinical perspective from that?

[00:13:17] Uh, that's a, that's a great one still on there now. Encourage anyone who hasn't seen that to check it out. But the main mycologist that, that, that documentary is centered on is Paul Stamets and he had, you know, he's been working with mushrooms for decades, but he had a really personal experience where his mother was diagnosed with stage four breast cancer, you know, given less than a year to live.

[00:13:59] And she ended up [00:14:00] living many, many years after that. And that's really what opened my eyes to it. And I started to find a lot of research, um, that, that suggests that she's not a, uh, uh, a one off or, or, or something unique. I, even people in my family, when I started. Making, uh, functional mushroom products. I learned that, that, uh, one of my cousin's wives, you know, has been taking turkey tail for years now.

[00:14:49] But some of the, like the wave patterns that they were measuring, they identified as words and, you know, so basically like scientists, the article The headline [00:15:00] was scientists have discovered that mushrooms can, can speak at least 50 different types of words. Uh, so, uh, what they're, what they're doing inside of our brain, you know, I think there's still fortunately going to be a lot more studies around it now, now that, uh, you know, there's a lot of funding going into, into mushroom research and, uh, and more interest, you know, the more consumer demand, I think the more there's going to be.

[00:15:39] Anthony: Nice. I think this is a perfect segue out of those kind of hero mushrooms into a little bit of mushroom history. And I want to kind of guide us into the psychedelic realm of the mushrooms as well, because I see, at least in the psychedelic side, this is an area where.

[00:16:13] You know, there's this idea that humans Deep in, you know, the plains of Africa would discover these mushrooms on cow patties and stuff like this and started to experiment with them. And, and, and that helped our minds and our brains expand and that, you know, we had mushrooms a long, long time back. And what's kind of the history, at least you'd like to explain it as a psychedelic side of mushrooms.

[00:16:39] Robert: Yeah. I mean, I think in general, there's, there's two kinds of history. There's Uh, you know, what has been going on forever. And then there's when white people figure out about it. Right. And so, you know, the, the Chinese have been using the adaptogenic mushrooms.

[00:17:19] And he had a little satchel that contained, uh, adaptogenic mushrooms and the scientists, the anthropologists, uh, presumed that they were using them either for, uh, religious ceremonies and, or, um, some sort of like antibiotic. But, you know, uh, psychedelic mushrooms have been used in, uh, shamanic and religious ceremonies for millennia.

[00:18:09] Uh, was Albert Hoffman, and there was this, this Life Magazine article, I think it's from 1957, where Hoffman and a couple other scientists went to visit Maria Sabina in her, her small village in Oaxaca where she is administering psychedelic mushrooms to, to the locals there. And the Life Magazine article kind of like really blew out.

[00:19:00] So tons of minds, research, investment dollars were being put into understanding, you know, what these could do for us. Um, unfortunately, some of that, that tech and research got co opted by the CIA. And, you know, we're using LSD on, on soldiers and, and Vietnam. And then ultimately, uh, Nixon, uh, criminalized, uh, all of these, these psychedelics and, uh, the early seventies, you know, He called them one of the biggest threats to, uh, to the U.

[00:20:00] And I grew up, you know, really fascinated, uh, by writing. You know, I, I, I write now. I write for, for Rolling Stone about, about mushrooms, both psychedelic and And functional, um, but some of the writers that really inspired me at an early age were from the beatnik generation. The Jack Kerouac, William, William Ginsberg, William Burroughs, Allen Ginsberg.

[00:20:51] Uh, but, but, you know, he also grew up Catholic, which I did as well. And, you know, he started to have a lot of interest in, in Eastern philosophy and [00:21:00] religion. Particularly like Zen Buddhism. And so I found that really fascinating as well. And so I think that, you know, the, the, for me, it's not the, uh, the recreation, uh, as much, although it can be a lot of fun, but, but the ability to connect deeper, you know, really consider, you know, the philosophical questions that we all, we all ponder about, about life and existence and, you know, the meaning of everything.

[00:21:51] Uh, it's also great book is, uh, you know, baby boomer guy who approached psychedelics from a complete skeptics point of view. And by the end of the book, [00:22:00] you know, his, his perspective, it completely changed, pretty much tries every psychedelic there is known to man. And, uh, you know, in documents, a ton of, of not only his own experiences, but the people he met along the way.

[00:22:37] You know, sometimes now because of the popularity, people think, Oh, yeah, micro dosing, you got depression, forget about it, you know, you got anxiety, this, this is the cure. Well, while I think that it is like the most powerful tool for fast change, right, you know, if we all put our minds to it, and, uh, you know, have the right [00:23:00] support, the right, the right environment changes possible is my, my belief anyways, but I think that that psychedelic mushrooms just allow people to just have a little bit more awareness.

[00:23:28] Anthony: Hey, it's Dr. Ray. I want to quickly pause this episode to thank you so much for listening to this Fit Mother Project podcast.

[00:23:55] So from my heart to yours, deepest thanks. For those interested, [00:24:00] the types of psychedelic mushrooms that I know are very popular is Psilocybe cubensis, which is like the one that people take. And I don't know how to describe what it looks like, but it kind of looks like a long skinny mushroom with a cap and it has some blue stuff on it.

[00:24:33] Means for the longest time happens to be a psychedelic mushroom that grows in cold climates like Siberia and in reindeer actually eat these recreationally, uh, which I think is fascinating, uh, and people actually drink the reindeer pee because it gets them high. So like, not that there's a point of sharing that other than it's like.

[00:24:52] Robert: fun factoid. Reindeer pee. I actually hadn't heard that one. That's, I gotta take some

[00:25:03] Robert: around. Uh, yeah. I mean, the, the, the folklore is that, uh, you know, maybe even the whole Santa Claus came from, uh, I've heard that too.

[00:25:36] Uh, but the ibotenic acid can be poisonous when taken in too much dosage. So the real way to, to prepare, uh, amanita is to, to heat it, to convert that ibotenic acid into muscimol. So that's just one thing, you know, that I would, would, uh, warn. But, uh, but yeah, the history behind it is really fascinating. Uh, you know, there, there's some [00:26:00] documentation that Vikings would eat a bunch of amanita muscaria before, you know, going and.

[00:26:30] But they're always looking for something that has some sort of. you know, immediate, usually intoxicating effects. And so they're, they're just in the past year, really gravitated towards these Amanita muscaria products. I, I get a little nervous about it one because of the ibotenic acid and making not, not knowing if there were prepared properly and, uh, and two, just because I think a lot of people rush into making products, you know, for the, uh, for the dollars or [00:27:00] the, the profit that can come from it.

[00:27:15] Anthony: And that's, that's a great, I think, reminder for everyone is these mushrooms are no joke quality matters.

[00:27:43] Certainly no professional supervision. I've I've, they've, they've helped me psychologically in many ways, but I am interested in seeing this whole new world where we're having a lot of people with PTSD issues, clinics popping up where people are doing assisted psychotherapy. With, with psychedelics, like what's happening in the legal front right [00:28:00] now, at least in the United States with a relation to that side of things.

[00:28:28] However, uh, these psychological or these psychoactive, uh, psychedelic compounds found in, in mushrooms, like you say, psilocybin, psilocin, uh, they're. Publicly traded companies right now are working on making synthesized versions of these that are slightly different For a couple of reasons one you can't patent nature.

[00:29:18] psilocybin, psilocin, and remove the psychedelic part of it. Uh, so, you know, for, for people excited about the, the recreational part of it, that would kind of be taken away. Uh, but, uh, legally, you know, to address your question more specifically, there's two states so far in the United States that have legalized.

[00:30:02] So people are seeking out these treatments from all over different parts of the world, different parts of the country. You know, the, uh, the cost associated with it, uh, seems pretty high. And I think, you know, one key element to, you know, the full on Uh, incorporation of this, especially from the pharmaceutical point of view is whether insurance would cover, um, sessions like this.

[00:30:52] And, you know, still to this day, there are people, you know, who learned either they're, they're part of their lineage or, you know, people go to Peru [00:31:00] stutter study under these shamans and generations of shamans that have been. administering this, you know, extremely powerful medicine to people. And now, uh, there, there's, you know, groups like maps, uh, new wave that their, their business is training, uh, you know, psychedelic therapists.

[00:31:42] And so there's a little debate, you know, mostly between the people who've been practicing this for a long time. Um, you know, I'm sure there's, there's plenty of therapists and, you know, people with, with their own experience that will get these licenses that have, you know, years, decades of, of psychotherapy.

[00:32:26] Um, but, uh, but beyond that, you know, there's a lot of cities that have decriminalized. And so that has, uh, has opened the door, you know, it's kind of, uh, the same path that cannabis followed, right? You had it illegal for years. I was first decriminalized for medical use in California in 96. Uh, then, you know, we, we had, uh, the medical dispensaries and then ultimately adult use, you know, full on recreational use it, uh, responsibly like alcohol, tobacco.

[00:33:24] And now that we're having a more of a open conversation about this, um, you know, in this country and in the world. You know, when someone tries a 4, 000 therapy session and they find some benefit from it, you might want to continue micro dosing. And if there was no copay on insurance and these things are prohibitively expensive.

[00:34:11] Anthony: That's great rundown. Um, and just, I mean, they are very accessible, like explain how accessible they are, and this is like the big caveat, by no means suggesting anyone should do this, like even take them or try them, but like, it's very simple for people to grow these things. I mean, they're really like mushrooms on dung or cardboard or like, you know, explain that to people for context that they understand.

[00:35:19] You just have to have a, a sterile environment. And so yeah, for, for 45, 50 you can buy the materials online to, to grow it yourself. And, uh, you know, have an ounce or so of mushrooms. And then also beyond that, you teach yourself how to make a spore print. Like you can just with one mushroom, make a spore print and continue to make liquid culture from that forever, as long as you store it correctly.

[00:36:01] Anthony: Okay. I have one last question on the psychedelic side. Then I want to get back to talking about micro boost and some of the things that differentiate a very high quality, um, functional mushroom product that we hear the term microdosing thrown out a lot, and we mentioned it a couple of times in this scenario, like.

[00:36:25] Robert: Yeah. So by definition, uh, a micro dose is supposed to be sub perceptual. I mean, all

[00:36:36] Robert: Right. Yeah. And so, you know, if you, if you take enough, uh, psilocybin, psychedelic mushrooms, you know, you start to have, uh, Uh, just noticeable distortions or, uh, or even improved mood. But, uh, a microdose, by definition, is supposed to be such a small amount that you're not noticing the, uh, physical effects, but it's still working on your brain in the [00:37:00] background.

[00:37:23] I know for me, uh, you know, it's, it's about, I think part of the awareness that mushrooms have brought me is really teaching myself that while I can, uh, I can't control the actions of others, I can control my reactions, uh, to, uh, to, you know, what life or, or other individuals throw at me. And so that has been, you know, a huge, uh, improvement in my life that I, you controlled by.

[00:38:13] Anthony: a lesson that I feel like we'll all struggle with until we figure out.

[00:38:39] Robert: Well, thanks a lot. Yeah. Micro boost. We, we spell it with a Y cause that's how you spell mycology. But, uh, you know, I think I kind of have a backwards approach, uh, as a, from a business perspective, when it comes to supplement manufacturing, you know, I think, uh, most businesses will work on, okay, this is, this is [00:39:00] what we can sell the product for.

[00:39:24] We also, you know, we have, if we're going to keep giving these people, people, these products, you know, we need to stay in business, but, but that's always the. The, the beginning of, of how I do something, and then I'll buy like the, you know, the top 10 best selling products from, from different mushroom companies and, you know, really try and understand what's out in the market.

[00:40:22] Um, so mycelium is, is fascinating and, uh, you know, the biggest living organism on earth. There's places in Oregon that have like two, three square mile mycelium, uh, living organisms and they contribute a tremendous amount to our ecology, uh, but in specifically adaptogenic Mushroom supplements, the beneficial compounds are found much more prevalently in the fruiting body.

[00:41:11] The volume of it, right? You know, you have this, this eight pound block and mycelium grows through it, you know, it might make that eight pound block now, 8. 4 pounds. And so the, what myceliated oats companies do is they'll harvest the fruiting body. Use that for some other more high end product and then pulverize the entire mycelial block and then market that as the mushroom product.

[00:42:12] There's, there's now a petition to the FDA right now for truth and labeling with mushroom products and their. Their ask is that if you're going to label your product, mushrooms have mushroom imagery on the packaging that you should be using fruiting bodies, right? We don't sell the roots of apple trees in a grocery store and try and convince people that that's apples or even worse, a bag full of dirt that that apple tree was grown in and, uh, you know, trying to pass that as a delicious Fuji.

[00:43:01] And I'm, I'm excited that people now know about micro boost and, um, NYCRO boost, and you can check out those products and they come in those great soft gels too, which is a nicer formulation than people just having. Regular encapsulated. So, I mean, you guys are definitely premium quality in the space. So I would say if people are going to give it a good shakeout to try functional mushrooms, it would be a good idea, particularly if you're going for like the cognitive aspect of these things, like, like a lion's mane, like you have that lion's mane cordyceps combo, which would be a really good starter product for people who want to feel like a boost.

[00:43:35] Robert: Yeah, absolutely. I start my day with, uh, that Lion's Mane Cordyceps product. It's called our Brain Supplement and then a cup of MicroBoost coffee, which actually tastes really good too. So that's, that's another key, key difference, right? Not only do we want to have, uh, the, a great medical benefit to it, but I want it to, to taste great because if it tastes terrible, you're not going to replace your, your coffee habit [00:44:00] with, uh, with mushrooms.

[00:44:23] Anthony: and is it, is it coffee beans in there as well?

[00:44:26] Robert: there is a, there is a small amount of coffee in there. So there's a 55 milligrams of caffeine per serving, which is the equivalent of about a third of a cup of coffee or like a roll gray tea. Yeah,

[00:44:44] I like that a lot. Awesome. All right. Well, Robert, this was cool. I appreciate the landscape that we got to traverse here. People have definitely learned a lot about mushrooms. Um, give people a couple like resources, not that they have your website and there's a lot of great blogs on there, but you mentioned a couple of things in recap.

[00:45:13] Robert: Yeah, I've got, uh, eight articles on, uh, rollingstone. com about mushrooms. If you search Robert Johnson, psychedelics, Rolling Stone, you'll find all of those. Uh, and most recently, I, I, my ninth article, I have a, a two part series that's just about, um, mushroom vocabulary. And there's a lot of, in there about functionals that, that we talked about now.

[00:45:56] I just want. People to, uh, to be able to know which ones are [00:46:00] best.

[00:46:05] Robert: Enjoyed it. Have a great day. Thank you.