Have you ever wondered how successful entrepreneurs navigate ADHD to unleash their creativity?

What are the best strategies to manage ADHD while running a business?

How can you turn ADHD into a strength in your personal and professional life?

🔗 Read / Listen more: https://smartadhd.me/11

In this episode of The Smart ADHD Podcast, we dive into the unique journey of Ash Borland, a business owner, father, and minimalist, who has transformed the challenges of ADHD into his superpower. We'll uncover practical strategies and personal insights that can help you thrive, whether you're a smart creative or an entrepreneur.

Ash Borland shares his story of being diagnosed with ADHD at age 32 and how it has impacted his life. From dealing with impulse control and anxiety to utilising techniques like CBT, Stoicism, and time blocking, Ash gives a raw and real account of his struggles and successes. We'll also explore how structure, discipline, and external mentorship can play a crucial role in managing ADHD effectively.

🎙️ In this episode:

00:00 Taking Responsibility: My Fault and Impulse Control

00:34 Introduction to the Smart ADHD Podcast

01:39 Guest Introduction: Ash Borland's Mission

02:59 Ash's ADHD Realisation and Diagnosis Journey

11:59 Childhood Reflections: Early Signs of ADHD

17:59 Hyperfocus and High IQ: A Double-Edged Sword

23:50 Daily Structure and Discipline: Coping Mechanisms

27:00 Impulse Control and Binge Eating Struggles

37:18 Motivation and Ambition: Overcoming Challenges

44:45 The Role of External Influences

45:22 A Unique Relationship Dynamic

48:11 Mentorship and Hero Worship

50:09 Balancing Affirmation and Criticism

55:05 The Struggle with Comparison

01:01:28 Living with Anxiety

01:08:47 Practical Strategies for Managing ADHD

01:12:23 Facing Misconceptions and Stigmas

01:15:51 Future Plans and Personal Growth

01:20:39 Final Thoughts and Advice

🕺More about Ash Borland

Ash is a business owner, father, and minimalist. His mission is to simplify success, driven by his determination to thrive with dyslexia and ADHD.

Connect with Ash Borland:

Website: https://ashborland.com/

Instagram: https://instagram.com/ashborland

YouTube: https://@ashborland

LinkedIn: https://www.Ashborland.com/linkedin

What's your biggest challenge in navigating ADHD as a smart creative? Share your thoughts in the comments section below, and don't forget to subscribe and leave a review!

—----------------------------

🎤 About the Smart ADHD Podcast

The Smart ADHD Podcast is for smart creatives, entrepreneurs, and business owners who are navigating life with ADHD. We celebrate unique brilliance, whether we're intelligent, exceptionally talented, or both. Ian Anderson Gray interviews experts to uncover the real story of ADHD for smart creatives, busting myths and discovering effective strategies to improve our lives, unleash our creativity, and grow.

🔗 Find out more at [insert podcast URL]

—----------------------------

🕺More about Ian Anderson Gray

Ian is the host of the Smart ADHD Podcast and a live-streaming video coach and consultant. He helps business owners and entrepreneurs broadcast live confidently, communicate better, and set up the right gear and tools. Ian runs Seriously Social, a business aimed at helping others be more productive and level up their impact online. He's also a professional singer, web developer, and an international speaker. Ian lives near Manchester in the UK with his family.

—----------------------------

🤗 Connect with Ian

Website: https://iag.me/

X/Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/iagdotme

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/ianandersongray

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianandersongray/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/iagdotme

Threads: https://threads.net/@ianandersongray

It was my fault.

It was no one else's fault.

went to that environment I had misjudged it.

and I'd misjudged it as well because everybody was like super excited

to see me, but I hadn't really factored in this idea of great.

how do I talk with people?

The negatives of it are my impulse control is very, bad.

I didn't really realize that until later, but I have a, really bad impulse control.

And that came to light from binge eating, to be honest with you.

I need to find somebody and then I have to chase that person down.

And it's not for any reason.

I can't compete against myself.

I have to compete against someone else.

And they've got to be somebody who is out of my league significantly.

Hello, I'm Ian Anderson Gray, and this is the smart ADHD podcast.

Now if you're a smart, creative entrepreneur or business owner

navigating your life with ADHD, This is the podcast for you.

Now, I'm no ADHD expert, but I'm eager to share my story on what I've learned

by talking with experts, as well as digging into the personal ADHD stories of

successful creatives and entrepreneurs.

I was diagnosed at age 46, and it answered so many questions in my life.

But of course, that was in many ways, only the start of my journey.

So let's learn together.

Smart stories, smart strategies, smart ADHD.

Hello, this is episode 11 of the Smart ADHD podcast, and I'm joined

by my friend Ash Borland, who is a business owner, father, and minimalist.

His mission is to simplify success, driven by determination

to thrive with dyslexia and ADHD.

This is another Smart ADHD stories episode.

Let's get on with this episode.

Ash, welcome to the show.

It's great to have you here.

How are you doing?

I'm very excited to be here, Ian.

I'm really excited, actually.

I looked at my diary today and I was like, Yes, this is going to be a good day.

We are we and it's always great talking about well, you know getting

into the deep stuff, isn't it?

Because we were so we actually met in person for the first time a few weeks ago.

I and I'm really confused about this because I'm sure I thought we had

actually met in person, but we've known each other for a few years.

And we, you've, yeah, you've been on my podcast, my other podcast, my confident

live marketing podcast before we've talked a lot about video content and

confidence and that type of thing, but we talked about ADHD at this conference

that this is a tube fest in Birmingham and, We also talked about the fact

that we don't really do small talk.

We just like to get right into the depths, don't we?

And I think that's what we did.

In fact, actually, we've been talking for the last 10 15 minutes.

And I said, Ash, you need to stop because you're giving too much good stuff.

We need to get into the recording.

So I'd like to ask you, when did you first realize that you had ADHD.

So this is not so much like getting diagnosed, but are the

kind of the origin stories for you?

So I've always had dyslexia.

I've always felt different.

So that's, so I've had dyslexia and I always felt a bit different.

The way I behave.

There's always just a little bit odd.

there's uncertain when I say odd, just a bit out of the norms, everyone else.

I've always had that.

I didn't really notice there was something majorly not wrong.

Absolutely wonderful.

I love it.

But anything was majorly a problem.

like different to people until probably 2020.

so I'm 32 now.

So I would have been what?

Like the thirties, early thirties, late thirties, something like that.

Yeah.

No, late twenties.

and I started noticing that maybe I was just a little bit different.

It was maybe when I started doing my work, I started to be like, okay.

And then when my son was born was where it really happened.

So once my son was born and his development started going through, He was

born in 2020 and that's when, that as it started to develop and it's quite quick

once he started moving toys, playing, talking, it was just like, I do that.

I do that.

I do that.

And when you started putting it with other children, it was like,

maybe, there's something a little bit different about me because I'm doing that.

And my wife isn't like that.

And she was like, Oh, we're going to get checked.

And I went and got checked.

And that was, it.

That was the kind of the initial, but it was, it's always been there.

Yeah.

And I have very strange habits and tendencies that have both been a

detriment to my life and also a massive making of it, but it was only really

probably on my radar from about 2020.

that's really interesting.

Yeah.

And, as we've talked about a lot on this show in the past, ADHD has its

positives and it has its negatives.

And I don't want to, we're not about sugar coating.

We're going to talk about the negatives, but also there are some positives as well.

It's, we're not going to, it's not like a doom fest either.

So hopefully we'll.

We'll talk about those.

So you, so you said, you discussed this with your wife.

Who, which of you first came up with thinking that this might be ADHD?

presumably you were thinking that this might be ADHD.

how did that conversations happen?

so I thought it could either be ADHD, or autism was what I was thinking.

And, That was where it was.

and it was my wife, it was my wife that we, the discussion came across

was I was like, from like our son.

As I said, it was our son and we were talking about it.

And also my behaviours.

the way I live and the way I am is very, intense.

And that's always been, past partners always say gosh, I really, he's

great, but he's super intense.

Like when he gets into stuff, he's like into stuff.

yeah.

Probably got a little bit of it's not diagnosed this but OCD as well.

My sister is a psychiatrist and she was like, you want to check that one out too.

There's a little bit of a tendency there as well.

but it's, but it was her that said it.

She was like, I think when our son's called Paris, she said, I see

in Paris, he's doing these things.

You do those things.

Other kids aren't really doing those.

She maybe have a look at what that would be and then and also see

little things like I The way that there was just the way I live my

life my entire day We'll unpack it.

I'm sure as you go through but like my entire day is a very strange Structure

super over hyper focus structured day.

I'm obsessed with things to the whole new level this is my wife said she was

like, I think you probably need to get that looked at the time I didn't want

any I don't take any medication and it wouldn't want any medication But it

was more about, I'd always known there was something there, but it was her

saying it of we need to know because you need to know how to deal with our son.

And if that's going to come in, he's not being diagnosed, he's too young still.

But the doctor with the GP when I thought when we took the to the GP originally,

and we were chatting about and he was like, it's probably hereditary and then

the specialist and so on and so forth.

They're like, yeah, there's a very high chance in fact, nearly definite.

And my mom definitely is as well.

But it was my wife that was like, you need to, I think not you need to, because

we have a very like open relationship in this way, but she was like, I think

it's something you should explore to be able to help our son better.

And it has helped me to be fair.

Yeah, that's a similar story for me.

It was with our kids and thinking, I want to try to understand my

kids more and the way their brain works, but it has really helped me.

And there was a little bit though of, yeah, this kind of not wanting

to go down the putting myself, attaching a label to myself.

And I had to go through a lot of thinking about that.

Was there any of that?

Were there any kind of, I think you've mentioned this a little bit,

but were there any things that you were concerned about going down

this, route of getting a diagnosis?

Did, you worry that maybe the, there wasn't going to be anything

that you were, absolutely fine and what that would feel like?

No, I didn't think about that.

I knew there was definitely something.

I Yeah, no.

So I'm a big advocate of, Rightly or wrongly, it's my opinion, it's not

a personal, it's just my own self thing, is I don't like medication.

Now, jokingly aside, I am on meds for a d I have an autoimmunity,

so it's a separate thing.

I, but I didn't want a medication.

And the reason being, so for me, that was my biggest fear.

Was what?

Has made me successful and in all walks of my life.

I'm very being very People always you know, I was listening

to a podcast this morning.

They said people say you're built different And there's about this

individual and I was like I get that a lot people I don't understand how you can

do these things and I always say to you I don't understand how you can't and I

know that's because my brain is wired in a different way to a lot of people and there

was a fear of Please don't come in and you know It's working I'm happy with it now

And so as a fear of this idea like I don't want to lose that what makes me and what

makes me successful and makes me excited and like overly passionate because I am

Extremely overly passionate about things to the point which is what kind of barrels

me through work and success because I'm more into it than anybody else.

I didn't want to lose that, but I, and then I was worried about that.

But then what I did find as well, once I was dying, going through the

diagnosis process and seeing the specialist and all that type of stuff

that I, also realized there's lots of other things in my life that it was.

affecting and actually I should like as in a negative way and I should probably take

control of it and now like I say 2022 is a diagnosis and 2024 now like it's about a

year ish just over a year give or take and just yeah it takes months and it has been

a big difference knowing it I think you know what the it's nothing wrong with it

but it's just but I did think it was going to be I thought it was going to be autism

if I'm going to be honest, I was quite shocked with the ADHD because I'm not

like hyper, I guess I am, but like I'm not like, I was thinking oh maybe it's autism

but it's not, but it was ADHD, but yeah I find that I was a little bit nervous

about the, drugs and the labelling of everything and when the specialist I spoke

to was like you just, you don't have to take them if you don't want to, like it's

up to you, and I was like okay, I won't.

same kind of concerns about the, go down the medication route.

the, in the, ADHD thing is with the hyperactivity can be, it's a strange

thing because yeah, I'm not physically hyperactive, but what I've realized

since is that I am mentally hyperactive.

And it will, there are as many different types of ADHD as

there are people with ADHD.

It's important to say that.

And of course, if you're watching and listening and you have a different

experience, that's totally okay.

what we're not saying here is that medication is wrong.

It might absolutely be the right thing for you.

I'm not currently taking medication, but I'm actually in the process of thinking,

I've spent the last three, three and a bit years without medication, approaching

it from a holistic point of view.

But I am starting to think maybe, I should think about medication and it's

not, there's no right or wrong here.

If you are, if there's any kind of thing that we bring up in this

conversation today, then do, Make sure that you, see a medical professional.

we're not experts here.

We're, telling a story.

So thanks for that, Ash.

That's, really interesting.

I have

similar kind of, story.

That's really interesting.

so that was it.

So that was, when did you say you were, diagnosed?

Was that last year or the year before?

so

Okay.

and

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

So let's go back into the past.

Let's go back to Ash when he was a young boy.

Thinking about your childhood, like looking back now that you're looking

at looking through a kind of an ADHD lens, or you're looking through with

the benefits of clarity and insight, what do you see about, you as a young

boy that's knowing that you had ADHD helps you understand that person then?

I so much on this a really good question.

So I was I've always been somebody that finds things very easy.

So I find things very but then on the other side of things and this is where

the kid things that don't interest me.

I find very hard.

And I never really understood why I never got I just would

honestly at the stores lazy.

So you look at that.

I just think I'm very lazy.

And I would be in so examples would be I'd be in top sets for everything.

I'm quite and then one thing we found at the back of this I have

very high IQ, which I didn't know.

So I ended up having a much like Mensa IQ.

And, but it made sense looking back because I was in top set for all

things, but just wouldn't do them.

And yet in the same time.

Lie, I would go home and obsess on anything that would be at that moment

I would obsess on it to the point where I could tell I was like an

encyclopedia This is before the internet and everything like that, but it was

like, you know I would know everything about it and that was something that

the other kids, other friends of mine, no one was really doing that.

And it never really, it was never really noticed, I think, as a kid.

I was just always, my mum used to say he's very quiet, he's just very creative.

I come from a performing arts background, similar to yourself, so I

come from a musical theatre background.

you're not, you're a classical trained singer, but I, yeah, mine's MT.

But I didn't start and that's you'll get this actually the story I didn't start

doing musical theater till I was 14.

That's when this thing really started to happen Because up until that

point it was video games was my kind of obsession in star wars So I was

I knew everything about all of it.

And that was my heart.

That was my like hyper obsession Didn't care about anything else.

So that was where it was noticeable, but, hidden it's quiet in the corner.

No, I'm really noticed.

It then became very clear when I decided I wanted to dance.

my mom was a dance teacher.

I started break dancing and that's when all of a sudden that kind of

built different thing, just that hyper obsession of this is my thing.

And I, all my grades, everything just fell down and all I did.

was dance and sing and perform and act and that was it over and over again

and I just I blew through everything I got scholarships I got work I got

it was just it was like gone from this lazy person what I deemed myself

as lazy couldn't study couldn't do anything wasn't very intelligent to all

of a sudden like I was just knocking back every challenge that came.

it was actually, there's a video actually on YouTube of me, my wife, we found it.

My wife was like, gosh, that's crazy.

And I'm like 14 and I'm in front of two and a half thousand people and

I'm going, hi, and I'm super shy, but it was like, hi, nice to meet you.

Like I'm dancing today.

Cause I've done this and I've won this competition.

And she was like, you're like 14.

And you're doing and I looked and again, that's what you say when you look back

at the time, it was just in the moment.

But I look back and I was like, that's insane.

that's insane.

Like I was owning this thing as if and it was because of this

tunnel vision of focus of all there was nothing else that mattered.

Ever.

And I'd come home, I'd edit the videos, I'd edit the music, I'd edit the, I

just lived, breathed and slept it.

And I couldn't talk about anything else.

There was not like, for my entire 14 to 20.

Really, if you wanted to talk to me, you better talk to me about performing

arts or some and it just got deeper into classical into it just got more classical

ballet, classical singing classical just kept going and going and going and going

That's where I noticed the difference.

And then by the way, it just stopped and hid away for a number of years

until this started happening again.

I might before this, thing we do now, as in this creative job

that we both kind of work in.

But as a kid, it was, looking back at it then, it was this obsession of, doing

things that no other real kid of my age in my school and in my area was doing.

But it was always very intense.

And it was, and my son does the similar, he obsesses on things, but my mum was

like, you did that from a young age.

You always would pick something, repeat, watch things.

And that's what I do.

I watch things and I watch them over and over and over again.

And then my background in performing and, especially from an acting point

of view and will actually dance more than anything is you mimic.

So I would learn what people would, I just, if you watch something enough

and you pick up a skill of learning it.

You would learn everything and that, to me, looking back at it, you say about

going back to it as a child, all of it makes sense and all of it is like,

of course, you do what you do today.

Of course, you'd have, but it didn't feel like it when you're in the moment.

I'm sure it very similar.

I'm sure people listen to this with agency will all you.

I'm sure you had a similar experience.

It all felt like a chaotic mess in the moment.

In the moment, I felt like I was just bouncing around.

Not focused, not anything, but actually looking back at it, it was

like, Oh no, I was hyper focused,

to a, detriment to a lot of things.

And this is where the phrase attention deficit hyperactivity disorder

is not helpful because quite often it's, not a deficit of attention.

it's like an overall over abundance of it.

And this hyper focus can be a good thing, but it also has its downsides as well.

Now you mentioned high IQ.

And that's one of the things that we talk about on this Smart ADHD podcast

because intelligence does play a role or it can affect the way ADHD is manifested.

Do you think, how do you think your intelligence affected your ADHD?

Do you think it made things easier, made things more difficult?

It's because I've heard, some people say that if you're intelligent, you're,

you find ways to mask your ADHD and to find ways around it more easily.

What's your experience with that?

Yeah,

knew me, and see me in my day to day life, you would not think I have

ADHD because I manage it really well.

It's only if you know me properly and the way I do it.

So I think, Yeah, so my IQ to give you a context, my IQ is 143, and it,

which was what it was when we had it all tested at that point, which

I didn't know was high or good or not, but it turns out it's very good.

It made more sense once I read, learned that because I was like, the thing

that I would struggle with is one, my, my focus, and I'll talk about

the masking there, but my focus was very high on things, so I could focus

on things a lot more than others.

And then I also found was that I could.

understand things that others couldn't seem to get.

And that would, I find that very frustrating.

So people would talk about things, oftentimes actually events

that we go like we met, people will talk about stuff on stage.

And I'm like, really?

really?

we Why does the general Why do we need to know that?

that's super obvious, and it's it took me a long time to realize, no, it's not

that it's not that everyone's stupid.

It's just Everyone's smart.

I just have a my brain is just that took me a while to figure that out Which helped

but I was very liberating because actually helped my business with that because then

what happened was I started having to?

Quote dumb it down because I was making the mistake of trying to

Show how I would see it instead of bring it back down there.

Also that really helped But I do think that having a higher IQ and having a

higher intelligence Makes it in some ways I can figure it out in better ways.

I can make sense of it in other ways.

And I just, so I have a, and again, I'm very open about this.

I have a rare kidney disease and I was with my nephrologist yesterday.

And the first thing he said when I came through the door, he had a couple of

people who were with him, like, trainees.

And he said, this is Ash.

Ash knows everything about everything to do with kidney disease.

And, he knows everybody who's had it.

And also he'll tell you all these other things.

And I was like, Oh, he was like going through it.

And it was like making a joke.

And he said, I think you just, you're too smart for your own good.

And he's cause I'll quote the measurements of the different things back to him.

And he's you don't need to know any of that.

Just chill out.

And I think that cause then it's all good.

Everything's fine.

But he's, and he always laughs about it.

So I do think that in a weird way,

it's good and bad.

It's good and bad 'cause I over overthink and then I'm overthinking

on such a molecular level.

I could, I start thinking and I get really into medical papers

and that sort of disaster.

Like I'll sit and listen and I'll speechify 'cause I'm dyslexic,

so I'll listen to it while I'm running at three speed listening

to the latest medical papers.

My mind.

Nephrologist sends me the papers when he's now because he's yeah, he's because

he knows that's what I'm like It's too much and if i'm honest, I don't think

it helps i'd be nice to dial it down I

yeah, it has its pros and cons.

But yeah, the overthinking thing is it can be a big issue, I think.

And that also means that those potential negative voices in your head that we

are manifested in different situations.

We were talking about this before we hit record.

They can almost be even more convincing, I think, because we just, we've

got over, we've already got overly active minds having ADHD, but if

you have high intelligence as well, it's that almost exacerbates that.

Yes,

don't think it's a gift.

I think that the as in not adhd.

the iq thing I don't think is I don't I of all of the things that I don't have

whatever it is the way we're built The iq thing is the one I would rather dampened

down than turn like that is the one I would personally I don't think it's a cool

thing to have I think it's hard to see things where people don't see them I find

that very hard like really frustrating

I suppose it depends like if you were like a scientist who's trying

to discover something new then it would probably be quite helpful, but

not so much in like my line of work to be honest in financial

services it attracts more money people than it does smart people

Yeah.

Yeah.

And, but, in combination with ADHD and, I think this is more of an

American term, but 2E this, this twice exceptional thing can be an issue.

And I think this is particularly an issue when you're getting diagnosed,

particularly if you're younger.

Or if you're female particularly, I've heard it can cause problems because the

people who are diagnosing you can say, Ash has got it all sorted, he's, coping.

Okay, that's the potential.

But

thankfully, you did see somebody who was able to diagnose you.

And that's been really helpful for you.

So My next question to you is, how has having ADHD affected you both

personally and professionally?

And you've touched on this a little bit, but I'm interested to digging

into both the pros and the cons, like how has this affected, how does this

affect you on a day to day kind of way?

The pros to it, how it's affect me on a day to day way

is, I live a very structured.

okay, let me, start that at the beginning to give you context.

So the way I looked at it when I was diagnosed was I was like,

okay, the way I see my brain is I see it like a bowling alley.

So you think about your, there's a goal we're trying to achieve.

The pins are at the end.

And the way that I described it to my wife and how I set up my life, I was

like, if I roll a bowling ball down the alley, I'm trying to hit those pins.

Ten is the best day, whatever.

It's most people can roll it down, that's fine.

I said, but me, I'm going to roll it and it's going to go in the gutter.

A lot of times because I get distracted and get things like that.

So I had to just try and find a way to effectively put those

guardrails up in my life.

So to try and find, the guards, when you put the rails up, when you bowl

and you can, then bounce it off.

You have your kids and you roll the ball and it bounces off as much

as it wants, but it's inevitably going to hit the pins at the end.

That was the vision in my head when I got diagnosed.

that's what I need to do.

I need to find a way of creating guardrails in my life that will allow

me to feel creative and feel, whatever my ADHD needs to feel at that moment.

But I am still heavily rooted in this parameters of, you can

and can't, you can't go outside of the, kind of the rules.

And that is how it has affected my day to day life, both positive and

negative, both positive and negative because my entire life is governed.

I'm very, strict, like super strict because I, want to be as successful

as I can be and provide for my family and have the best life I possibly can.

And so within that I, One thing I looked at when I started researching was that

discipline and structure seem to be the best thing for people with a DHD.

It is discipline and structure.

Forcing yourself to do the things when you don't want to do them can really

help even though it's painfully boring.

I still do it.

So I'm in my day-to-Day life.

I wake up the same time.

I do, the same thing every day, seven day, pretty much seven days a week.

On the weekends are a little bit more relaxed, but I eat the same food.

I do exactly the same thing.

I wear the same clothes like my entire life is like Groundhog Day.

And that has got more since being diagnosed because I'm

able to do a lot more with it.

Like everything I play the same video game at night.

I like everything.

So that's been a real positive because what's really funny

is when you start to do that,

you get very good at things if you do things every single day.

And so the net positive that has been, much better relationships close to my

kids close to my wife, which is why she when I met you, it throws me out in

those events because I'm highly stressed because I'm now no longer in the event.

I'm now no longer my daily routine.

So in my day to day life, embracing it has been massive and has actually

realized that's my superpower.

And it's what makes me significantly more of an output than other people.

And going more into it has been, has been a game changer.

The negatives of it are my impulse control is very, bad.

I didn't really realize that until later, but I have a, I

have, really bad impulse control.

And that came to light from binge eating, to be honest with you.

So I've lost this.

So they say, okay, give an example of this, but I'm now currently I've

lost 42 kilos in weight in 11 months.

so really fast.

It's six and a half ish stone.

I think roughly, I don't know the stones, kilos I work in.

So your American audience will be like, what is that?

but, that was because I'd just put on so much weight from binge eating.

And that was, I couldn't understand why there was no emotional reason behind it.

It was just, dopamine impulse, I've no impulse control at all.

And that's why I have to find these rules, these guidelines.

It's a new thing I put in place like a I'd like today I've

eaten finish at 12 o'clock.

I won't eat any food now until tomorrow because all I can think about that is

food my and it's just these weird things.

In my work.

It's not so much does cause me a lot of anxiety though.

I do get a lot of anxiety as well.

I'm quite open.

It sounds really miserable here.

I'm just being open about what it is.

But my biggest one is impulse.

I can't have something, people say just have something moderation.

I just don't.

And I never really knew why.

And when I say like moderation, the food I was eating was disgusting.

Like it was at one point we were eating I was eating we I was eating two large

pepperoni pizzas a day, about four to five bars of 100 grams of chocolate.

a day, three pasties a day, like it was just ridiculous.

And it wasn't for any reason other than that, like when I looked back at

it and realize it's dopamine, which is dopamine, it was just sit, work, eat,

yeah, And so I noticed that in everything.

So I as obsessive as I can be on positive things, if I don't catch

myself, phone is a bad one, technology, YouTube, bad one, you can end up

getting that I've noticed that with me.

So I live a very restrictive life.

And, in that, I remember listening to a quote, from Checker Willick,

where it was, I listened to a podcast, but he said, and he, and his thing,

it's like discipline equals freedom.

And that's what helped me.

It was like, if I'm disciplined, I will be free and I can then feel happy about it.

And it works for me and it done my, and it might not, work for a lot of others.

but it, but I, have to be like all or nothing.

And, and so my life is a lot of nothing.

That's fascinating.

There's so many things I want to come back to you on,

Yeah, go for it.

I see you making notes.

See you

I know I've had to make

https: otter.

because this is the other problem with, with ADHD, you, just don't have

enough, that, but the prefrontal cortex, it has, that doesn't have the storage

for all this stuff you want to remember.

So like you mentioned, so this is really interesting.

The, fact that you want to have structure in your, life.

And I think for me, I know that's probably the right thing and I like the

idea of it, but it also makes me want to run in the other direction because

I think my flavor of ADHD, yes, I do like some structure in my life, but

I also like things to be different.

And I want to change things.

I might want to go out for a walk.

and also, I hate to admit this, but like a lot of my days of

it depends on how I'm feeling.

I'm very I'm let my emotions lead me.

So like on today, I might not want to do a particular type of job.

I might not want, I might want to wake up a little bit later.

so I'm interested and obviously we're all different.

We've all got different personalities, but how do you get that?

first of all, do you have that kind of feeling of wanting to change things?

And do you like to have that flexibility?

Or for you, is it just all about the regime and the structure in your life

and, that makes you feel less anxious?

I'd love to know a little bit more about your perspective there.

yeah, great question.

It is, both.

So I live exactly like my brain on its normal natural

default is like how you are.

That's what I like.

I'm left my own devices.

I am like, it's a great example.

When I first got a mortgage broker, my boss used to get so annoyed

because I would do six months worth of business in a month.

And he'd be like, Oh my gosh, we've found this superstar.

He's gonna make us millions.

And then I'd be like, and then I wouldn't do anything for I've

done six months worth of business.

I'll just watch Netflix for four or five months, and I just do

nothing else and it drive him mad.

But I'd always be a high achiever in the because it always hit my

target, but never my annual target.

So I'm naturally like what you are there.

I rebelled from structure.

But I also have a lot of anxiety and anxiety of new things makes me very angry,

like no new places to make me anxious.

And so the people I'm a big advocate.

This is I would, I, one thing I like is I look up to people a lot.

So I look up to, when you see people who I just think this, they're

just very disciplined, they're structured, they're, they, that's

the type of person I look up to.

And I always think, and I say this to my wife, because I speak

about this stuff all the time.

So I wanted to be that guy.

I wanted to be that person that people look at and go, oh, I wish I could

do what you, what that person did.

And I started realizing that it sounds so bad and I'm very open.

But that was motivating.

That was like, that was my new obsession there.

Would these people, you'd see people like David Coggins and be like, who would

do things that no one else could do?

Or, and it's not just that in any line of work, there's always that one person

you're like, how do they do that?

How do they just do something more.

And so for me, the new obsession.

About really dumped in about two years ago, but it would be started 2018 when

it really started to happen in the with the video content I was making But it

really ramped up about two years ago Maybe three years ago where I was like,

I want everybody to look at me and go He's just willing to do this is really

sounds really bad So I'm gonna open about it, but it's like he's willing

to do what no one else is willing to do and that motivating focal point

made everything else not really matter.

So now when I think I want, I work every day, I run five kilometers every morning,

I work out for two hours every morning.

And one of them is I do five kilometers and I do And I hate it every day.

It's the most boring thing in the world.

And I call it my boring training because it is literally that

I train myself to be bored.

And I keep trying to tell myself you can't do it.

Keep going.

You can't stop.

You keep going.

Because my new obsession, the overarching obsession is that

he's the guy that can do it.

And so using the ADHD to try and trick itself into going, no.

You're the person who's willing to sit through those things.

You're the person I found that's helped me it's like a weird kind of reverse

trick because otherwise I am a like down the youtube rabbit hole looking

at like My wife was laughing about it when she was pregnant and giving

birth She was having a c section for our daughter and i'm sat there and

the woman was like What is he doing?

Cause you allowed your phones.

We were like, what she can see on the C section.

I'm holding the phone to watch.

And they were like, Oh, he's just, she was like, he's watching a

documentary on, large cats in the UK.

And she was like, what?

And she was like, don't ask that's become.

and she said, this is like the ninth one this week.

Cause I go off, I can just go off on a down the rabbit hole.

and I, but I do realize that, if I want to be successful, how does it, if I

wanna be successful, then the real true path to success is to do the things

that no one else is willing to do for longer than willing than possible.

And having kids has made it a lot, for me, having kids changed a lot

of it because all of a sudden it was like, my wife doesn't work.

and so I'm the, as in she didn't, she can work, but we, she didn't

want to work and I didn't want it to.

We were like, okay, we'll, raise the kids.

We work from home.

Very involved.

So that helped me, push myself.

I'm quite harsh on myself at times in quite a lot of negative self talk in

a positive way, but like I am quite like, shut up, man up, keep going.

And then, I do reward myself with playing a load of video games and

having, a scheduled watch the documentary on the cats or the whatever it is.

and I do that daily.

I do that every day.

There's a bit in the evening and also at lunchtime.

I have, this, it's like a pressure relief where I'm like, I just let it

go and I watch, I was watching before this, I'm watching, a retrospective of,

The original Donkey Kong video game.

Like I had no idea.

I never played the game.

I just, that to me is one of those things that just, it's that

I need to watch random stuff.

And then I feel super energized and I'm ready to go and do this.

Isn't boring.

This is great, but like I'm ready to go and do speak to people about

financial services again, and marketing and consulting in that.

And then, yeah, I find that it's no little moments to just

release the pressure helps.

Sorry.

I rambled there.

Tell me.

no, that's absolutely fascinating.

And yeah, it's like I watch, there's a guy called James Hoffman and talk to

talking about coffee and I don't even

Yeah.

I used to love coffee.

But then I couldn't, it gave me heart palpitations.

So I had to give it up.

I'm still obsessed by that kind of thing.

And actually going back to you talking about impulse, and this is

one of the reasons why I gave up sugar, because I just couldn't stop.

So I think we have to find ways that it's going to work for us.

And that is really fascinating.

I think we're quite different in this respect, where you're

obviously quite driven.

So my question to you is, like, how does ambition and being a

high achiever play into this?

And I'm assuming we've talked about this, there's, there is this

voice in your head, that we've talked about this negative voice.

How do you, how does that work with You you've mentioned anxiety.

how do you keep going?

Like, how does this high achieving part of you?

take control and push you forward when sometimes there is that negative voice

that's saying you're no good, you can't do it, Ash, you may as well just give up.

how do you manage that?

great question.

I love that.

So just a preference just to pre thing.

So I'm actually I am.

I am a high achiever, but I'm not a very ambitious person.

This is a really so people think I am, but I'm like, no,

I, I've hit where I want to go.

I'm quite like, I'm, I don't want, I would never want a business.

as in, I have my own business, but I'd never want like real staff.

I'm quite like, I like my own bubble and to stay in my bubble.

but what I want to do is be the best at I want to be the best I can possibly be.

So my obsession is in like personal development.

So I want to be the best at what I do the best father, the

best husband, the best person in fitness, the best person of content.

That's my thing.

Now, which doesn't necessarily mean the best business owner.

But that's still, I would still argue that is ambition.

You might, because it depends on how you define it.

You might not be want to be like this eight figure, multi global entrepreneur

who's speaking all around the world.

Kind of thing, and I think in all our minds, that's probably what

we think of as like ambition.

You wanting to be the best version of yourself and be the best, this and

the best, that are still ambitious.

yeah, there's Yeah, I get you.

that's true.

That's a good way.

But it made me feel better now.

So I say to answer your then your first part of the question,

you said, how do I battle?

How do I deal with that?

And how do you so for me?

It took a long time to to try and figure out the way that like I How to keep

myself motivated What I found in this and again people will find this please

like people understand when i'm saying this is just the way my brain is and

the way I think I always have to preface this because people can get triggered

by And it's not there's the carrot and the stick and I am very much as i'd love

to say I was the carrot I'm, absolutely the stick like I need negative self

talk and I need, options off the table.

I need to, for me, I didn't start losing the weight until I literally

looked at myself in the mirror and went, you fat insert swear word.

What are you doing?

and I, and it led me to, for me, it's been an absolute, life changer for

me has been, this actually, which is, stoicism, which is what happened for me.

So Daily Stoic by Ryan Holiday.

being strong, resilient, that type of stuff that helped me and my wife actually

both of us read that we both read that every day and we both journal about it

every day and it the shift for me was in being like I want to live by example for

my children and my son having it which is absolutely he's not diagnosed yet but

he absolutely is like he's three and a half now and it's so obvious already is

that I want to show him what you can do.

And I speak to many people who, and so that's what like, speak to many

people who have it and then also like they're, they may be not achieving what

they would have liked in life or, and I think no, you can't, I'm not going

to be a statistic, I'm going to be thriving at this and I'm going to show

my son and my daughter if she has it as well, that they can be that too.

And That motivates me more than anything.

And do you know where the original motivation came from?

That was, and you might know him, Oh, in video.

so I know I've had him on my show a few times and when he had that thing

going with, when he got diagnosed with cancer and it all went like that,

I just remember being in awe of how he just fought it and how he just.

Did it, he just beat it.

Like he just beat it into submission.

It was just such an incredible thing to witness.

So anything, when I'm meeting him, I remember thinking, if anything ever

happens to me, and this was before diagnosis of this kidney disease, all

this other stuff, I was like, if anything ever happens to me, I want to be the

guy that meets it like Owen met it.

And, and he didn't make a victim out of himself.

He just carried on.

He just pushed forward.

and, I'll give you the props to that guy.

I've said it to him before.

I did a video on it before, but he changed my life by doing that, by seeing somebody

do that and go, Oh, I've been obsessing on business and this and I just looked

at the man and thought that's a man who's willing to do anything For his family to

be here one more day to fight for one more day and that to me that hyper obsession

That's what kicked in then I was like i'm gonna be that guy and that guy is the

guy that when i'm on the gym every day and working every day and reading every

day and You know doing an hour of content every day and all this stuff I do Is

it's can you go to bed every night going?

did you fight to be alive today and that to me it sounds so extreme When

I say out loud, but it is genuinely, it sounds like a motivational, like

rah, but it is genuinely how I feel.

And I, and yeah, that's I get to talk about forever.

Yeah, that's where I'm at.

Owen is an inspiration.

he's such an amazing guy.

And then to see him go through that, I think that if I was diagnosed with

cancer and given, I can't remember,

Six months or something.

Yeah, it wasn't very long.

Yeah.

Six months, like nine months, less than a year.

here years on and thriving.

and that was the second time, at least the second time

that he had to go through this.

And, I think, we don't know what we would be like until, if something

like that happens to us, but I think, I would probably just.

Give up,

Yeah.

Keel over.

That's what I thought.

I

those people that inspire us is so important.

And so I wanted to ask you like how you've done a lot.

You, you seem to be like, there's a, there is a lot of self-motivation there.

It's the way you are wired and, you wanna be the best version of yourself.

And just to say to you like, I find that inspiring, that actually really

excites me and it makes me want to.

I've always wanted to be able to do that, but hearing you say that is so important.

And so for me, I know, although I'm an introvert like you, and I love working

by myself, I know that I need people.

I need cheerleaders in my life who are encouraging me.

And you said to me before, you heard me speak last, whenever, it was, and

you said some encouraging remarks.

And I, need that because of, the negative talk in my head, who thinks

Ian, good at this, good at that.

So I'm

just to put a pause on that.

I didn't just say it was encouraging.

Ian's speech, by the way, for everyone listening, was the best speech by far.

It was so good.

It was so funny.

It was educational.

I have to give you props and flowers for that.

It was amazing.

Like I said to you off air, but I'm going to put it on here so that people

can hear it, because it was brilliant.

so good.

so, good.

Carry on anyway.

Oh, thanks, Ash.

yeah, I'll send you the fiver in the post later.

So like how much of,

the, in the encouragers, the mentors that those people.

You've mentioned Owen, who was an inspiration.

How important to you are those external people in your life to help

you get on with what you're doing?

So very important.

I have two types of things.

The most important person to me in my life and my biggest critic and cheerleader, and

I've mentioned that many times is my wife.

So with the relationship we have is, is wonderful.

But we are people find us a bit strange.

We have less of a romantic relationship and more of a business relate.

It's very, she's like my coach.

So she will literally hold me accountable.

To everything.

if I come in, we, I have tasks to do lists and I do that, and she'll sit

down and go, did you do all your tasks?

I'm like, and I have to show her.

And she's could do you think?

And if I didn't do, if I didn't do the video that day, she'll

go, why didn't you do that?

And then I'll go, oh, I did this.

And she's you happy with that?

do you, and she never goes, you should have done it.

It's always are you happy?

Do you think that's enough?

And if it is, if you say it isn't, that's cool.

I don't care.

She doesn't care, you can do what you want.

But she, meeting her was the thing that changed it.

And the two of us are the same, we like that together.

So she was my, I bring everything to her, she brings everything to me.

It's very, a lot of people probably wouldn't want our relationship.

It's pretty intense in that way, If I'm fat, she'll go, you're

putting weight on, you're fat.

And if I think she's putting weight on, I'll say, she's looking fat.

Like the two of us are very, It's so intent, like people don't get it at all,

but that's the way we're wired, like she doesn't work She wants to be a full time

mom and she was like you're gonna make money I don't want to know about it, but

she was like, but I'm not good But you she was like, but you'll never have to

change a nappy and I was like really?

I'm happy.

She's no Don't wanna, that's our job.

She was like, in our world, that's how it is.

CEO, CFO, she's I, wanna, she just, she's very wide that way.

She's, not English, she's Cypriot, so they're a bit different, and it's, and,

that to me, having that strong, someone who believes in me, is what it was.

It was someone who believes in me no matter what, and

then is willing to hold me.

So if I go and say I'm gonna have food, she'll come in and go, no you're not.

you don't have him for you to, and I need her to do that, I'm not, it's not

and it's, and so I had coaches, but none of them were ever as good as her.

they're two of us, but it requires a sacrifice of a lot of, she's super

wonderful in event, she's like certain things where she'll be like, you

don't, you're not good in that social situation, so I just won't take you.

It's no point.

You become a burden in that situation.

So I won't take you.

And I know it just drives you mad.

So just don't and it's like this.

We don't, it's a very good thing with that.

So she's my number one in my, my, in my guidance for that.

and and I would be lost without her.

I do think about that quite a little bit.

what would I do without because other than that, I was just gonna

say bad, not be more like you.

But I was like, naturally, I'm not like how I am now.

I'm I was very much just Free for all do what I want.

and then regards to mentors outside of that is I normally have a like a Sounds

quite strange again, everything i'm saying is i've never actually said a lot of stuff

on podcasts or anything It's really weird.

So

on the Smart ADHD podcast.

It's all strange.

It's all good.

I'm glad it's just so weird because it's not something I talk about so

it's I would, normally I need maybe like a hero worship, but like a target.

So it's like a, I need to find somebody and then I have to chase that person down.

And it's not for any reason.

I can't compete against myself.

I have to compete against someone else.

And they've got to be somebody who is out of my league significantly.

and they are a mentor in that way.

it's never a negative competition, but it is like a I need to know so I could

pick a person in the past and it'd be like You're the person I want to do what

you're doing I'll obsess on you watch you listen to you talk to you become

friends with you and still stay forage afterwards but i'm studying you I need to

study this person and how do they move?

How do they think?

How do they do?

And then I will soak it all in and then normally what happens is I overtake

them Which is never what I wanted to happen, but normally that's what happens

is over time because i'm obsessed with things You And I just keep moving

the bar as to who the person is.

and I would say it's it's like, a slight mentorship, slight hero

worship, slight competitive thing.

Hmm.

and I've always, I've done that since I was a child.

You go back to your very first, one of your first questions of what was

the thing that I've always done that, which also then leads into some, stuff

of Also then seeking the approval of that person is quite a bad thing.

I then go, Oh, I really want that person to sign me off.

And if they don't, which is what I said to you when we're at the events, I find

those things quite strange because these are all people I massively look up to.

And then it was like, I want them to all like me.

And they do.

They are, but it's just a weird feeling.

But it, yeah, it's,

Now that's, that's really interesting because like you said you're

more of a, in terms of carrots and stick, you're more of a stick person,

you, the relationship with your wife, you're very honest with each other.

It made me laugh, when she said to you, you're fat, you need to lose weight.

And I remember I was, I, when we got married, like a couple of years after I

got married, I was like, you do you put on a bit of weight, and I was feeling a bit

fat and I was maybe trying to get Helen, my wife to say, No, Ian, you're fine.

But she said, I said, Oh, that's what I said.

I said, I feel like a bit of a beached whale.

And she said, No, you're more like a rounded dolphin.

she's trying to be nice.

And, and I like I laughed at it.

But I did.

I did.

I did crumple a little bit.

And I'm the kind of person that does need that encouragement, whereas I think

for you, it seems like you're that kind of, that's motivated you, what your wife

though, don't get me wrong, it does hurt at the moment, like I'm still a baby

with it, I'm still going, don't you call me fat, like I'll still get triggered by

it, but I do then walk away and go, okay, cool, I need to do these on about it.

and actually I did too, but, I think like a lot of ADHD

people could be quite sensitive.

there's, once you call it rejection sensitivity disorder, whatever that can

be part of it, but I'm just interested.

So, on one side, you've got that, kind of motivates you, but then you

also seeking the approval of others.

And so there was the affirmation side of things then.

So how do you reconcile those?

How much of the stick do you need and how much of the affirmation do you need?

Because it sounds like you need both, but I'm not sure how that works

It's a brilliant, it's a brilliant question.

The more and more I keep talking today, I'm thinking, God, I'm

just, this is all over the place.

Is it good in a good way?

As in for me, so I think that, I can over index.

To both too much at different points in my life.

I can, if I go too far into the affirmation and wanting the

approval of the other person, I can put that person on a pedestal.

And then I put up and then that pedestal comes crashing down when I

realized that they're not, and it's gonna sound very honest, that they're

not doing my stupidly ridiculous.

over the top Structure that I held myself to there's I don't know anybody who does

what I do But I assume that I must be worse than everybody else I'm starting

to try and accept that okay I must be like a 1 percent of the 1 percent but

like I don't know I've never met anyone who does what I do the way I do it.

I don't mean my job I just mean the way I live but then I get let down

when the others don't so I have to not Do that so I can that's quite can be

a real problem, and then I feel like betrayed and let down and upset by

that, which is, and it's my own doing.

I just happened to, they never, pretended to be anything they

were, and I just built them up.

As my wife said to me, she said, the job isn't, anything you do is never

as good as you think it's going to be.

It's never as bad as you think it's going to be.

And she was like, and you just always go from one to the other

of how bad it is or good it is.

And it's normally just nothing.

it's absolutely fine.

and then the other side is I, the kind of negative self talk can be

really good until it becomes too much.

And it doesn't come too much to me, I can keep going, but it, but there

are times where I'm like, you need to stop now, you need to stop now.

This is so that self punishment of go more, do more, be more, that was

literally recently, actually, where I was in the gym, and I was wearing

a weight vest, doing a stepper.

So I did 30 minutes of a stepper with 15 kilo weight vest on.

10 speed.

It was ridiculous.

And I'm dying.

And my heart rate is like 197.

Like it's, I was going to pop.

And that was one of those moments.

I've used every day, literally seven days a week.

And I just, was like, one of those moments of Oh, what are you doing?

that was like, what, what are you?

And I'm listening to music, the motivational speeches of you can

go, you keep going, don't give up.

And I'm thinking if you keep going, you'll have a heart attack.

Like what?

there was that, there's those moments sometimes where I'm like, Come on

too much and I am like that a lot.

I like that with all the time I do that a lot.

So so it's a real hard thing and I just yo Between so that'd

be like you say about this.

There's no structure still a yo between the two and sometimes I'm super needy

to this person and sometimes I'm so self motivated that I'm You know running on

like broken feet type level, and then it's and then and really the best time is when

I'm in them in the middle, which is hard.

but it sounds like, since, particularly since diagnosis, you've

learnt a lot more about yourself.

There's that, self, what's the word?

Self awareness, I think.

It's fascinating what you said about how you, compare, it's not, you didn't use

the word comparing to others, but you're using other people that you look up to

and you're using that to motivate you.

But I did want to come on to comparison because you're using

comparison in a really positive way.

And I love that being inspired by others.

And I always try and do that.

But in the past, I'm much better at this now.

But I used to have that I call it comparison syndrome when I'm

comparing myself to others thinking, Oh, I could never be like that.

They're much better than me.

I may as well give up.

That can affect a lot of people with ADHD, I've heard.

has that been an issue for you?

And I suppose we're, potentially this can lead into imposter

syndrome or that kind of stuff.

What's been your experience with that?

yes, it has.

It has.

I, I'm, yeah, it does.

It does.

In fact, yeah, it absolutely does.

It still does now.

I probably achieve a tenth of what I could actually achieve because

I don't think I'm good enough.

it's, that's that's the truth.

It does.

And I think that what people, the biggest thing I've always struggled with is what

people see of me is not who I actually am.

like they have a perception of what I am and versus what I actually am.

Like I'm actually naturally an introverted, very quiet,

very creative kind of guy, And actually the external factor is people see,

and you'll probably hear it from this.

People when you listen to this will think, this guy is like a rah, rah.

Keep going, keep, like the David Coggins who's gonna carry the boats.

I'm not like that.

But I have API I, but I can mimic that as we said earlier, like about,

I can mimic that trait because I think it will be positive in my life,

but I'm not naturally like that.

I'm naturally actually quite a recluse, quiet self.

not self aware, very, nervous, very anxious person.

So, yeah, like I find the comparison thing, that was very hard.

Coming from a performing background, you'll get it yourself.

That was a little bit of baptism by fire.

Some of that has helped, and some of it has also probably left some scars.

So there's, and I'm sure that's been a very similar thing to you,

like that industry is, brutal.

and, and there is no like HR, none of that happens and people would actually like.

Can't believe they said that to you.

I'm like, who am I going to tell?

who am I going to tell that they said that was this or that or the other?

all in all, yeah, I think that I am a, I do struggle with, I do

struggle with that comparison.

I'm getting a lot better at it.

And a lot of this has got a lot of this has got better and I said about daily

stoic It was from like extreme ownership For me, it was that extreme ownership.

I toyed with it I've played with it, but it was the ownership of I am 100 in

control of the way I think and feel and That has helped massively, but and it's

still and I am a working progress on it.

I am not like at any means I think but I felt and I felt like

I didn't, I don't like those sides of me, those traits of me.

And I didn't like what I was seeing in society of the traits of that as well.

And bringing a child into the world and children into the world.

And, I, and the, the economy is how it is and everything is how it is.

I was like, we need, I need strong people.

And the only way that my kids are going to be strong is if I'm going to be strong

and that, and the strong, and then I was like, strong people don't, do that.

They don't compare.

They don't do that.

They keep going.

It keeps going back to what I said before.

It's not my kids are the biggest motivator.

It's a hard one.

I still feel those things.

A journal about those things happens to me all the time.

It happened to me when we're at that event.

Like I feel, and then, I get back up and go do it anyway.

that's not, this is what, like I have to see, like you said,

this goes back to the Owen thing.

I have to see myself as.

That's gonna sound really strange.

Maybe.

I keep saying this, but I don't know, because it's like

inner workings of my brain.

I, don't know if you've ever had this, Ian.

It'd be interesting to hear yours.

Like me, might not, but there was always a thing of me with, I

always said this to my best friend.

I said, when I got married, I was always having this fear of if you always

think as a husband, I was like, if someone tried to jump me and my wife

or pulled a knife, what would I do?

This is the thing that used to go through my head in this

kind of like weird ADHD thing.

I'd be like, what would I do?

Because everybody talks about being chivalrous and protecting.

I said, but I'm not somebody that could.

I'm not a fighter.

I'm not strong.

I'm quite a coward.

I'm, and I was like, what about kids though?

how would I protect them?

How would I don't know what I'd do.

And there was this, and this would, this plagued me for years.

I says, my friend, I was like, I said, so I'm saying this, but I don't know if I

could protect them, or if I would, or if I'd run away, or if I'd, and when I saw

Rowan, it was like a, Okay, he's not this super mega macho man, which is what we

see these things in and I'm not like that.

I was like, but he's done that.

And then, and so when I started going against that's what motivates

me and keeps me going is Will I be that guy who would stand up?

And I said this to my best mate about a year and a half ago, I said,

I'd fight to my dying breath to save my family now, because I know

that, because I've built that habit.

It's just a habit of self talk to yourself to say, when you say you're

going to do something, you do it, you beat it, you win, you do it, you beat.

And I know I would now.

I'm not a fighter, I wouldn't know what to do, but like I would, but it

was one of those scenarios where I was like, okay, And that ate away at

me, talking about self doubt, that ate away at me more than anything else.

It was like, how would I prefer, how would I in this weird world, do the

one job I'm supposed to do as a man is to protect my wife and my kids?

I don't think I could.

And now I'm like, okay, I probably could.

And that's great, and that's that.

I don't know if that's a weird thing, only I think about that, or is it just a

No, I haven't thought that exact thing, but I have thought similar things.

And again, I think this is partly that, overactive brain overthinking

Mm hmm.

and then doubt creeps in.

I think having kids can change.

It certainly changed a lot for me.

I, I've, I realized how selfish I was before.

And now I, have a much clearer purpose.

And part of that is that protection, I think maybe as well.

so you've mentioned a few times today, anxiety and how that plays a role.

And for a lot of people with ADHD, anxiety is it's there.

And when I got diagnosed, I was really surprised.

He says, yeah, you've got ADHD with anxiety.

And I used, I think he might have even used anxiety disorder, which,

isn't very nice when he used the word disorder in there, but really do you

have to get, do you have to go there?

But then I've since realized how much anxiety plays into it.

And, working with my coach, my ADHD coach has been really interesting

to see how anxiety feeds my ADHD and how ADHD feeds my anxiety.

And it can be quite debilitating at least for me.

So i'm just interested for you.

You've mentioned anxiety How does I anxiety play a role in your life?

when, I suppose in comparison to ADHD or in conjunction with ADHD.

crippling.

To be honest, it's my biggest crippling and not, but it is.

It's in my life all day, every day, all the time.

And it has been since I was a kid.

I just, I don't remember not being anxious, terrified of everything.

that's what I said.

I got, I have a, I'm like, It's that you know that scene in the avengers when he

says what's the trick of being how you could you know How do you control your

anger and he's like the trick is i'm just always angry Like it's like that.

Like I just i'm always in a state of anxiety And I actually have been opening

up more and more about this within clients and stuff Every morning I wake

up and this sounds like every morning.

I wake up for me.

I'll be being honest.

He's And I don't know if you have this or not every day.

I wake up and think, I look at my diary and go, okay, I love my clients.

I work, one to one with people.

I love it.

But every day I think, which one of those are going to tell me they want to,

they don't want to work with me anymore.

Every day that happens to me.

I've worked with some of these people five years.

They send presents for my kids on their birthdays.

These guys are like, some of these people are like family.

And I look at their names and go, okay, today's the day they're going

to tell me they don't, want to.

work with me today.

I have a waiting list close to 300 people.

I only work with 20 people.

My wife made a joke.

She said, you've got nearly 100 years worth of stuff.

And I still think, and if they leave, what's going to happen?

I'm going to never get like it just every morning, this plays through my mind.

And then it plays doubly on a Sunday when I look at my diary for the week,

I go, Oh, and every single call, even this one, I'll feel like this.

Every single call, I get off the call and go, why did I worry?

It was so good.

They're great.

They're lovely.

And it is like Groundhog Day every single day.

And it's never gone.

And I'm getting to the point now where I'm like, even though I say my, my say,

I keep talking about my kidney disease.

So I have, like I said, kidney disease and this blood pressure

is one of those things.

Blood pressure increases is increased by anxiety.

Whenever I go into the doctors, my blood pressure is through the roof.

I have normal blood pressure every single day.

It's off the charts when they're in there.

And that's where I say my consultant laughs and he's he's

not even look at your results.

I said, I do because it increases my insurance payments.

So I'd be really great if you could just get that to come down a bit because

it doesn't, but it is it just, and I, and so yesterday was when my, my, my

most recent one, and I came away and again, I ran my wife on the way home.

And I was like, I just got to accept that.

I'm just always going to be anxious in these appointments.

It's never, I'm not going to get to the point where I don't feel anxious.

I still feel anxious for everything.

So it is, it's just every, it's more, I would say it's more than, they said I

have, so when they did my diagnosis it was, I have dyslexia anyway, but it was

ADHD, I had a high IQ, which was something I did separately to it, but it was but

it was also, but it was also anxiety and OCD tendencies, but not an OCD disorder,

which is obviously apparent in my daily routine of doing the same thing every

single day, but That the anxiety for me is more debilitating than the ADHD.

The ADHD doesn't really, I just, it's like a, I notice it.

It's just, I'm like, oh, I just think a bit different.

But with the anxiety, it affects everything.

Every single

And I'm sure everyone who's had anxiety knows what that feeling is like.

Every time I see you nodding when I was saying about that client thing.

Every person.

And I've been talking to my clients about it.

And they're like, oh, first of all, don't worry.

It's okay.

And then they go every time I think because I know you've got such a

long waiting list You're gonna kick me out and I'm like no and they

but I found that people were more related to it No, I open up about it.

That's fascinating.

it's a little bit going into the world of cosmology, it's

do you love what I did there?

it it's a bit like black holes feeding off stars.

I think the anxiety feeds off the ADHD and also the ADHD feeds off the anxiety.

I think they exacerbate each other.

And, Yeah,

I don't know about just sorry I'm jumping in there because I want to

ask you a question I don't know about you once it starts if it really rolls

out of control Yeah, I don't know.

There's no bringing it back I don't know if you're like that if

I can go to like panic attack level Pretty quick if I don't control it

if I don't catch it fast enough.

I don't know if that's similar to you.

similar thing.

And I think what's really helped me is first of all, knowing that

it's there, understanding the signs, and I don't always see

them, but I'm getting better at it.

But also, this is something that Tamara was talking about on the show

about personifying that anxiety.

So for me, My anxiety is a, librarian called Lawrence.

He likes everything sorted.

He wants everything just so he's wanting to protect me.

He wants, he's got my best interests at heart, but he tends

to overthink things and, start to give, feed me negative stuff.

And then there's another kind of part of my brain.

I haven't given him a name yet, but

he's, my camera's going, he's, and he's like the amplifier.

He's an amplifier.

So he, amplifies what Lawrence is saying.

And so I think it's really important to, I think it's really helpful at least to

come up with a, way of understanding it.

If that makes sense.

No, I love that.

I've never heard that before That's a really good point because it's a bit CBD.

Is it CP was it cognitive behavioral therapy?

Yeah, CBT is my what my sister always talked to me about It's very that and

it's not that but it's a similar kind of like when you're creating something.

I love that I'm gonna try that now

Definitely.

I'm just, I'm just sorting out my camera.

Sometimes it does this.

I think when it gets hot

to, we'll see what happens.

It might, stop in a minute.

Cool.

Okay.

So we've talked a lot about the negatives, but that's really interesting.

I, and you, but you have, over the time you have talked about how, you

kind of strategies and tools that you've used to help manage that.

You mentioned the, whole idea of the, the Stoics as has helped you.

You've talked about other ways.

Are there any other kind of strategies or tools that you've found most

helpful in managing your ADHD?

Not that we haven't really covered, I don't think.

I think, For me, yeah, for me, I just, Oh, yeah, so I would say, I just, I do,

a weird kind of three, it's a three part thing that I do, which might help people,

might not, depends on how we go, but it's, I, it's like past, future, present.

So I note everything.

So I have a AI thing that records all my meetings, that notes everything down.

And I use that religiously because without it I won't remember what I said.

That's been something I realized so I have that and all my notes are

stored And I keep them for everything.

So every appointment I just open it up and everything is

there the video recording there.

The whole thing is all saved there.

So it's about note keeping has been really life saving to be successful

and run a business with it.

Then my then it's time blocking.

So that's my past present is time blocking, meaning that I do everything

religiously via time blocking because otherwise I will not know what's going on.

And I meticulously do that.

I won't go too deep into that because it's like a whole thing on its own.

And then I have, so past future and presently so past sorry future I

mean if that was actually the diary one and then the present one, sorry

is tasks So I have a to do list.

Oh to do list open on my phone all the time So if you ask me

ash, can you do this for me?

I'm like, yeah cool and I put it on there and my night every night.

I have to make sure they're ticked off So i'm always keeping notes of everything.

We spoke i've spoken about with every person even my friends They have a

folder on my OneNote that's me and Albert just had a chat, we spoke about

this, so that when he rings me and we chat, I go, cool, open it up, and

go, oh, he's done this, he's worked some, I keep note of everything.

And and then same with, like I said, then the tasks and the diary.

And those three things have been a game changer for many people, but they're

for me, because I just do not remember.

I just don't, but in the moment, I massively do, I'm sure you might

have a similar thing in the moment.

I'm giving you the best advice I could possibly give you or my,

my, I'm very deep conversation and they'll say, I think you said, I'm

like, no, I don't know what I said.

I don't remember.

So now I'm like, yeah, I do.

Here it is.

We said this, we said that, or if I said to you, I'm going to do something,

then I'll do it because I just, and people, and then one thing I would say

as well with the ADC that I found with that as well is working within, finance

and things like that is that by telling people, If I don't do this, send me

a reminder, please don't be offended.

please don't feel bad that I like, that you have to remind me.

I have ADHD, I won't remember.

So if I, if you're like, I said I was gonna do it today and I don't do it by

the day, send me a reminder saying, Ah, she said you can do that thing today.

I'm not going to get annoyed.

That helps me.

And so that I found that being open and honest with people that has really helped.

That's more of a practical, a couple of practical things

Yeah, no, that's.

helped.

That's really helpful.

And I've found similar things, having systems and processes,

tools to help to counteract that.

And yeah, certainly listing things and to do lists and apps and

things like that has really helped.

Now you've mentioned like mentioning that you have ADHD.

to your clients.

And that's, for some people is quite a scary thing.

it's it's like coming out, and I was quite nervous about saying I had ADHD

because there were so many misconceptions, so many myths, so many stigmas.

And yes, Things are, I would say at least, a little bit easier and there

is more understanding out there.

have you faced any misconceptions or stigmas about, saying that you have

ADHD and how have you addressed those?

to be honest, no, not really.

Like I don't really know, so I, again, it goes back to extreme ownership.

I, some people might not like this.

It's not my client's fault that I have it.

And that's something that I am a big advocate of.

It's not my client's fault.

I have dyslexia.

It's not my client's fault.

I have ADHD.

And so if they've come to me for a specific type of service, It's my job

to, to, make sure they get that service.

Now, my service has been built around the fact that I have it, so so I

build my brand around it, and that's what kind of, but I don't find that

anyone has really cared about it.

and for me, I, that's where I, always find coping mechanisms be

like, okay, how can I still deliver?

'cause I think sometimes we can be like, not we, but some people,

and I've seen this in friends and family members who have it, who have.

Other things as well as ADHD and they can go.

Oh, poor me.

I can't do it because of this or I can't because of that.

that doesn't really sit well with me.

So I don't really like, like being dyslexic, dyslexic, but I've became

a mortgage broker and passed all my exams and did all just find ways.

So I think the biggest part of it being transparent, but I do get It it depends

on the industry you're in as well.

I guess I got the event where everybody's going to say

ADHD, like in creative spaces.

It's my superpower in where I work because it's a it's an industry that is naturally

not that way in the creative in the marketing space where we're all in and

the coaching so That was one thing that reinforced me when I was at that event.

I was like I am never trying to try and be a coach for coaches Because that's

there's just i'm the same as everybody in this room, but in my line of work.

I'm the only one Sounds like Winnie the Pooh song, that's

my brain going through there.

I'm the only one.

they're all tiggers, isn't it?

But the, yeah, that's good.

So it hasn't really been a problem yet.

I have had, the dyslexia one was though, I'd have people say things

like that, that would be a, so I guess I'd maybe learn how to deal with

it with the dyslexia so the ADHD is

Yeah, that could be the case.

We've all got different experiences.

For me, when I was trying to explain to people that had ADHD and there is the

element of sometimes we can overshare.

So I've went through a period of Ian, shut up.

You did.

They don't need to know you have ADHD, but,

oh, I do

that.

That

oversharing thing.

some people said to me like, Oh, ADHD, what's that?

And, I've heard of that, and you don't seem to have ADHD.

So they, become like a, psychiatrist straight away.

And then I said, they say, what do you struggle with?

And I say, chronic procrastination and stuff like that.

And then they say, surely everyone struggles with that.

And, that kind of feed fed into my self doubt about it and stuff like that.

I think since then, I've, learned a lot more about how to, respond, but,

it can, I think it's less of an issue.

I think there's a lot more understanding about it, which is good.

So just before we finish, we've talked for quite a while and it's been so

good getting into really deep stuff.

moving forwards with you, so the certain things that you still find hard, like

you mentioned this, conference going to that, if you were to go to a similar

conference in a couple of months time, knowing what you know about yourself,

that you're an introvert, that you start to maybe overthink, you start

to, And the other thing of course we haven't talked about is that as ADHD

people we tend to be very intuitive.

We read the situation really well and that can be an advantage and a disadvantage.

So like knowing what you know about yourself.

What are some of the things that you're going to put into

place to help you move forwards?

Not, I'm not just talking about conferences, but just generally

speaking, what's, the next stage for you?

be fair, conferences and networking is probably the next stage because I've

very much got a handle of the site to master the how to do it in my life.

So it's really moving into how do I take what the life I've built

in my own little world that's really, far in North cylinders

and how do I start to create that?

So it can expand out and so I can go to that's probably gonna be it.

And one of the things I would say from those events, I would come away from was a

big, thing for me was I was like, I should have, if you are in this, I think this is

anyone listened to this, who, if you are introverted, nervous, going to events,

what I should have done, looking back, was reached out to all of you individually

and gone, Hey, Ian, really looking forward to seeing you at the event.

Just a little heads up.

I am a little bit of an introvert.

So if you do see me, I might need a little bit of a, just an arm

around me and hey, how are you?

Because I am a little bit like that.

And I might not come across that way, but I really do want to chat with

you and get to know more about you.

I should have done that because I did the post about it afterwards

and everybody messaged me going, Oh, I couldn't, I wanted to see you.

And I thought, Oh, you idiot.

what?

That's what I should have.

There was a stare me in the face.

It was so obvious.

And I think that Goes back to being open about your ADHD.

It's like walking away from it.

I was like, that's what I would've got more out of the event.

I would've got a lot more out of the event because there was lots of

people I wanted to hang out with and talk to, but I will not make that

first move because the anxiety in the back of your mind going, oh my gosh,

Why would they want to speak to me?

Whereas if you did, but if it's that thing of, and I always say this to

my clients, a lot of this stuff is stuff I say to people and then I

go, why did you not tell yourself?

Show you the same thing.

You take your own advice.

Is I always say to my clients they talk about that when they're doing mortgage

stuff and I'm like If you don't tell the client what's going on Don't get annoyed

when they can't they have no idea what's going on, Like they think you've done

nothing because you haven't told them what's going on and it was that thing of

like I didn't expect you guys to be you know, you mean you chatted and it was

really good but That was that thing and I don't expect it to be a mic again That's

why I go back to this extreme ownership.

It was my fault.

It was no one else's fault.

I went to that environment I didn't really, I had misjudged it.

I'd, and I'd misjudged it as well because everybody was like super

excited to see me, but I hadn't really factored in this idea of great.

how do I talk with people?

And as I said, Oh, I'm a deep talker and I'm prone to oversharing and that.

you still there?

Yeah.

I'm here.

I'm just going to say you can edit if you don't want to

okay.

you, carry on.

Cause I'll, just.

I didn't know I was going to do a descript little,

so I thought I'll be quiet.

yeah, no.

So that, that to me was those things, I think with the whole, expecting

people to just be able to read my mind, I should have looked at hindsight.

That was my, it was my job to do that.

I should have, should have just done that.

And if I'd done that, I tell you what, I had a wonderful time anyway.

It was a great time.

I'm definitely going back next year, but it.

If all the speakers are cool, so no, it's no pressure Mike

No,

But like I Yeah, I think yeah, like I'm sorry not Mike Matt, but if

I would say Mike was a guy I spoke to yesterday I was like, oh but I would

say That yeah, taking ownership of it again It was that was the thing I

would do and trying to navigate that in the real world And also realizing

that other people feel all the same way that's something that's really helped

as well as i'm like you feel the same

and putting that post out, I think was great because it is, People

actually, I think, came out with very similar stories and that's good for them.

It's good for you.

It's good.

It's a bit of bit of honesty.

we're almost out of time.

I just wanted to ask you this final question before we find out

a little bit more about how can people find out more about you.

And that is for anyone who's been watching or listening and really identifies

with some of the stuff with your story.

What would you, what would be your advice for them?

if they're struggling with ADHD and they're wanting to, to, to

move forwards and, what would be your biggest takeaway for them?

My biggest takeaway honestly would be just grab it by the horns and just

deal with it like that sounds so Over the top, but it's that ownership of it