Summary 

Welcome dreamers, seekers, empaths, and healers! My name is Amanda Lux of the Elevation Hive school and community for energy medicine and dreamwork. In this podcast, I share teachings, musings, poems, songs, and interviews with other amazing humans who walk the healer's path. 

In this episode 

Join myself and Kim Pinckley for a candid, hilarious, deep and personal conversation about the Ether Element and the space between things.

In this episode:

• I share about my recent break from the podcast
• I also share about the transitioning of the Hive Membership
• Kim shares about her amazing North Door retreat coming up in January of 2023
• We both explore the polarity perspectives and practices related to death, grief, and the importance of taking space.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Go to Elevationhive.com to learn more about upcoming polarity therapy classes

• Check out my art at AmandaLux.com
• Learn about Kim Pinckley and her amazing retreats
• Click here buy me a cup of coffee or show your support for this podcast. So much energy goes into the creation of this free content and I'm a one-woman show over here. I really appreciate your appreciation! 

Thank you for listening, sharing, reviewing and sending me your dreams! 

I love to read them. 

Songs used in this episode:

Alone/All One theme song written and performed by Amanda Lux

Music from Uppbeat:

https://uppbeat.io/t/dominique-charpentier/esquisse-i

https://uppbeat.io/t/tobias-voigt/eyes-closed

https://uppbeat.io/t/sonder-house/hemel-sjors-mans

https://uppbeat.io/t/vens-adams/i-can-hear-the-ocean

https://uppbeat.io/t/paulo-kalazzi/do-not-forsake

https://uppbeat.io/t/dan-barracuda/as-you-continue

https://uppbeat.io/t/dominique-charpentier/buda

If you think about our culture and you think about

our resistance to death typically.

, we have a little, you know, we have fear of death in our culture and at

that is, I would say at the root of the fear of pausing in our lives.

Like the same idea of slowing down, stopping being, still, being with

the nothingness, doing the nothing like, I think that that's a little bit

intimidating to many of us in our world.

Like what happens if we're just still quiet and what.

Will we have to hear

?

teacher, co-teacher of Polarity therapy, Kim Pinkley, and I'm so excited to

have this conversation with Kim.

It was inspired by multiple conversations we've had and just, it's also just

a conversation that's in the field.

Where the podcast has been, which is to say it's been on pause.

So , we're gonna be talking about ether and the space between things today and

what that means in the polarity paradigm, and also what that means just in life,

and how we probably all use a little more ether, a little more space than we're

getting so I wanna invite you, Kim, to introduce yourself and maybe a little bit

about your work and the different facets of healing work that you have studied,

and how these different perspectives have contributed to your journey with

the ether and to your healer's journey.

So good to be with you again.

, thank you for inviting me to talk about this like really special

subject that I feel doesn't get as much attention in our culture as I.

I think we could use, more of this in our culture, this ether element.

And just to give a little peace about who I am.

, I have been studying the healing arts I say for 25 years, but really

for as long as I can remember, I've been interested in how.

to process my life in a better way.

And I took the time to go and learn , polarity therapy and

cranial sacral therapy and.

Both of these modalities are a little bit of a hero's journey on their own

to learn them because you get to go through your own healing process as you

learn the teachings, as you experience the work, and this moment with you is

very interesting to me because we're both kind of in a pause place in our,

in our journey and being able to stop and just take a minute and digest.

And rest with it and be able to talk with each other around.

It just sounds like, you know, sounds so magical, So healing.

So anyway, , I again, started this journey many, many, many moons ago, and I not

only do this work in an office, I'm a practitioner, but I also share this work.

I teach it to other people to learn how.

For them to learn how to be practitioners and to take this

into their own lives as well.

I've had the great fortune of studying with a teacher , who walked with a

medicine man from the Cree tradition and experience , these teachings

through that filter as well, through this beautiful filter of how.

ether and all of the elements show up in nature, and then in

relation to your life as well.

So just, you know, that's my daily day is to be in my office tuning

into people and to their process and.

Them find resolution to challenge and to consistently be related to

how these teachings show up in nature and in my own life as a seeker.

Mm.

I

love that.

, we are here in the middle of teaching a polarity therapy course

on the elements and embodying the elements and the chakras, that's

why you flew here from Arizona and.

And we're doing our third round of teaching here together

in the Pacific Northwest

on my family's land.

And we're looking out over the water and because that's the context, I

also wanted to invite you to just.

, , just a little bit about what polarity is to you.

Like what is polarity, what are the elements,

What is ether even?

Right?

Hmm.

That's one of my favorite questions, ? And I always, every single time I'm

asked, I stumble on it because it's so.

Dimensional this work and to just try and bring it down to

a little bit of a nutshell.

This polarity therapy is a very holistic healthcare system that relates to all

of our bodies, our mental, emotional, physical, energetic, structural

bodies tuning into the places where energy is not circulating optimally.

Making relationship to those places, tuning that energy so that it can

find its way into circulation and it can animate these bodies in a way,

We can be fully expressed emotionally and physically and mentally out in our worlds.

And one of the ways that we.

With this energy is through the chakra system, and the five chakras

are related to the five elements, and these elements would be ether

and air and fire and water and earth.

And each of these elements that are related to these chakras, they carry

different qualities and they govern different parts of our lives and our

bodies and different systems in our bodies, and they work independently and

together consistently trying to create and sustain a balance that helps us

be in that place of full expression.

That's be.

and in case you listening are like, Wait a minute, I thought there were

seven chakras, , or more than you are.

Correct.

There are, there are many more energy centers in our body than than these five,

but the five PR primary physical chakras each relate to one of the five element.

And Ether is related to the throat chakra and that is considered the

gateway to the upper energy centers.

So just listening to you, if I were to riff off of that for

a minute, ether is the place, the transformer between spirit and form, like

as source energy comes in through the crown chakra into our chakric system.

Ether is that gateway.

I love when you say gateway.

It's one of my favorite words, and I think about etheric energy as

the spark or the initiation or the invocation or invitation from Spirit.

That would inspire us to go out into the world and become expressed

or become manifest to make change, to do something, to honor spirit,

ultimately, to go out and be in this world in a way that serves ourselves,

our brothers and sisters, that brings something of source energy to fruition.

. Amanda Lux: How's that?

I think that's perfect.

We're discussing ether and the space between things and how, you know, I guess

this is a good moment to bring in sort of the general cultural relationship that

we have to space and to the pause between moments, between movements of our life.

There isn't a lot of honoring of the transitions or of the beginnings before.

The beginnings, even what's in the field before you embark on a new thing, right?

That's the ether what's in the field of your life, of your mind, of your

spirit, before you begin to create something there's not a lot of

ceremony in general, in most modern culture, , that honoring of that.

Initial spark and ether is sort of that, the hoop of the wheel, right?

So it also embodies the the final ending as well when, when something goes all the

way through from the ether to the air, to the fire, to the water, to the earth, and

finally is in physical form, and then it changes again and goes back to the ether.

And that's our life cycle.

And that's the life cycle of every creation.

And.

What we teach in polarity is that energy cannot be created or destroyed, right?

That's a Einstein quote, I believe.

Um, it's always transforming, so as soon as something has its full expression and

is comes to the end of its expression, it, it just changes form, and that's

what we do in our lives as well.

How do we honor the beginning and the end?

And even more interestingly to me in the moment is how do we honor the space

between the beginning and the end?

? How do we honor that etheric moment where we are between things where

we're not what we were and we're not yet what we're becoming, where we

haven't yet had the new idea, but we've let go of something that was.

What?

What do we do in that place when we're sort of free falling or we're

just suspended and we're not moving at all and there's just nothing.

I have a thought about that.

. I bet you do.

we listen.

Mm-hmm.

, it's a quality of Ether is about listening, and it's like, I'll

tell you where this brought me.

It brought me to, again, a teaching that came from one of my teachers, Heather

Principe, and she speaks about the moment of creation when we're talking about a

human being coming into creation, talking about when the sperm and the egg meet,

and that moment where in the ethers our.

Hear that spark of creation that happens and we hear that as our song.

Our song is being played, and we have that choice to come and follow

our song and come into creation and we, you know, you have to be

listening if you wanna hear your song.

Right.

And I just kind of like think about, we were just talking too, you're talking

about this evolutionary process.

An evolutionary process, how there's the begin the space before everything begins.

The space where if you're quiet and you're still, and you hear your song,

you can come in and then you come in and you do this whole thing and you, you

do this thing called a life a lifetime.

And then at the end of your life, there's a stillness that comes too, where

you're gonna hear your call back to.

and it is very much like this space between like, okay, we're alive as

a human being, and then there's this liminal space, and then we have this

transformational process called death where we then move into a different

form and we have all of the experiences that came through in this lifetime.

So we're.

We, we have a different frequency than when we came in as a thought.

You know, I speak that and I'm not sure if that's true, but I

have a thought that that's true.

We've just gone through something, a transformational piece, picked up

some things, let go of some things.

And you know, it's a kind of an interesting thing.

If you think about our culture and you think about our

resistance to death typically.

, we have a little, you know, we have fear of death in our culture and at

that is, I would say at the root of the fear of pausing in our lives.

Like the same idea of slowing down, stopping being, still, being with

the nothingness, doing the nothing like, I think that that's a little bit

intimidating to many of us in our world.

Like what happens if we're just still quiet and.

what Will we have to hear

? Amanda Lux: Right.

Good point.

, I love so much that you brought in the life cycle in polarity when we talk about

either when we teach about either as an element, as an entity, as a quality,

as a way Ether has both a positive and negative pull as all of the elements do,

as everything does, and in the positive pull of Ether is that blissful, euphoric

experience of oneness with everything and in the negative pull of Ether is grief.

and I think grief is something that is becoming a lot more

talked about in our culture.

I think it hasn't been talked about, there hasn't been space for

it for a really, really long time.

And that as we consider how we relate to death or how we relate to pausing

between things to sit and take them in.

Then oftentimes we have to meet grief.

, you know, and it's right there next to the euphoric experience of oneness.

They're right next to each other.

They're not, the opposite poles are are like on a circle where the one end

meets the other all the way around.

They're not far.

And so it's an interesting non-linear journey and.

I don't know.

I have, I have a lot of thoughts about that, about grief, but I, I'm

gonna pass it back to you and just see what you, what you have to say, Kim.

Well, I'll tell you what kind of came to me is

that it's, it's a thought that just coming here and incarnating

carries a certain amount of grief.

As we come into a more dense form and we separate, if you wanna say that word, it

doesn't feel right, but whatever level of separation we have from Source Energy, as

we come and become more in a human body, in a human form, and we meet the draws

and the the density of this world and that there's such a deep, longing to go back

to source, to kind of release ourselves from the heaviness of this place.

. Really, you get to feel the oneness or you will feel the longing.

Right.

And I think too about substances in our world and I think about

how alcohol and drugs, anything that brings us to a, a high.

In some way, shape, or form are a way of trying to reconnect to source energy too,

to like be in the ethers, to be higher, to be shedding the heaviness of this world.

And I think that this is, again, one of those things where if we do take these

pauses, if we do take these places of the space in between, if we do give

ourselves moments and even days, Of time to just be able to allow ourselves to

have our E it opens up the possibility to make relationship to these two poles.

Hmm.

Beautiful.

Right.

I do wanna interject here and just give a little plug for the fact that

you're offering a retreat in January, 2023, and I would wanna invite you to

just speak to, in case you listening are like coming to this before that

date and you might be interested, but also just as a mind blowing, you

know, little invitation to consider this in your life in whatever form.

So, speak about your retreat.

I would love to speak about my retreat and I wanna just talk

to you and tell you a small story here of how, where this retreat came to me and.

, It was in a vision quest.

I actually spent four days out on the land alone with nothing

to do, no reading, no writing, no food, no water, just me, right?

Doing this thing that we're talking about, taking space from

the craziness of my life, from the busyness of my life to make relation.

And I do regularly take four days of silence.

I don't do it to the extent of no food.

And, you know, this is, this was a held ceremony with my teacher

, and for me, what came up was giving

the time after I've completed something.

to honor it, to not just jump onto the very next thing.

Cuz usually I'll be doing that before the last thing's over.

You know, I'm already on the next thing and so that's normal.

Like in our culture, I don't know if it's normal to nature, but I would say that

we all have a little bit of a challenge of just pausing after, you know, you can

do this from your dinner, you can pause after eating dinner and allow yourself

five minutes to just be with the meal.

You just.

And you can be in a space of blessing the nourishment that has

just come through your system.

This is a way to, a simple way to make relation to your e in

your, your etheric energy in your life, or to cultivate it more.

And so back to my vision quest as I was on the land, I.

Had this thought come through about holding a retreat,

which is something that I do.

I, I love holding retreats.

This retreat was inspired by taking space though.

And so in the native world, they talk about the four directions and the.

How they relate to the four seasons too.

And so if you take this northern door, which would also be the winter, and

you think about what happens in nature during the northern door and everything

goes down, there's hibernation.

We get still, we go and get resourced.

We take naps.

We should like, You know, that's a thought, right?

But nature, that's what happens is that there's not a lot of movement.

We're not doing anything new.

We're relaxing.

We're, we're resting.

We're taking the space between the fall and the spring.

And the spring is the place of the new, But in the winter months, it's

the place of the non-doing, just being.

If you're a seed, you're just waiting underground to crack.

You're not doing.

And so I thought to myself, you know, what about holding a retreat

where the invitation is to just come and be in that space with others?

Be in this space of unplugging, of not needing to respond to your

phone or to your boss, or to your spouse, or your children or your

partner, and just being and taking.

of yourself, Like eating what feels right, doing what feels right, and most like, I

don't know if this is most importantly, but I feel like it's something that,

you know, again, just doesn't get its space in our world, especially as adults.

I wanted to invite play, and I wanted to.

, just say, Let's laugh.

Like, you know, we do all this work on ourselves.

We go inward.

We are doing the hero's journey.

We're tuning into the places that need healing and the things that

need to get met in our lives.

Well, what is it like to just sit around and maybe play a game and laugh with

each other and you know, go to bed as early or as late as you want, and really

just tuning into you the being of.

Hmm.

I love that.

So just to say, Coming out of a pause for the podcast itself, , , I

didn't know how long the pause would need to be, but I knew I needed a

little break and I had an idea that I would start at the beginning of fall,

but we had a really long summer here in the Pacific Northwest and fall.

Really, just started . And that's when I was like, Oh, it's time.

It's time to pick this up again.

I was hearing the, the soul of the podcast speak to me and suddenly I was

inspired, but I kept thinking throughout this, few months that has gone by

where I have not put out an episode.

, what will happen if I take a break?

Will it die?

Will it go away?

Will it be hard to pick it back up?

What will happen if I step away?

What will happen to me?

What will happen to the podcast?

Will it stick around?

Will the spirit of this creative thing, you know, continue to choose

me to move through ? I wasn't really totally sure, but I just knew I

had to honor my own need for space.

Yeah, so I did, you know, and part of that came through my dreams too.

I just heard it in my dreams.

It was time to close the computer.

It was time to reengage in my teaching in a more in-person way.

It was time to start running outside more and just doing some things

differently than I was doing them.

And in addition to pausing the podcast I also heard that it was time

to transition the membership and my entire platform for the Elevation.

Hive Dreamwork community with its own app and all of these courses and

forums that I had developed and poured myself into for the last two years, it

suddenly was telling me that it was time.

So there's the flush of the toilet

. Kim Pinckley: That's so on point.

I don't

know if the mic picked that up, but right as I said that

suddenly there was this flushing of a toilet in the in the background.

From who knows where, The proverbial toilet just got flushed, so I flushed

it all down the toilet and everything I made, everything I created, I pulled

the plug, you know, and I said goodbye.

And it was one of the most like intense grieving processes.

It's been really, really sad because to me, providing a space

for people to share their dreams.

and come together regularly to create art from their dreams and to learn

about dream work and energy medicine, you know, from anywhere in the world

has always been really important to me.

It's for a very long time, it's been my dream, but I was hearing

that it was time to take a pause.

It needed to transition, and I could have resisted that very easily.

I could have said, No, I've built this thing.

I wanna keep it going.

, but I just had to honor the movement of the, soul of this project and this thing.

And so in the midst of the pause of the podcast, I also closed down the

membership and I let it transition into something new, They say that when

someone dies, there's this window of time,

? Where it's not time to get

? And then finally you get rid of the body, but the soul's doing its work.

In many, many cultures throughout history, there are sacred processes to hold that

space for those who are transition.

, maybe not so much in this culture now, currently in this day and age, but

some of those are being remembered and.

Reenacted rejuvenated brought back, thankfully, , respectfully.

And, , we're starting to get more consciousness , we're

starting to learn that babies have feelings when they're born.

They can actually feel pain

you know, we, they didn't even know, you know, at that point there wasn't

the consciousness that babies feel things and that maybe we feel things

after , we go and leave this body, you know, maybe it's not in the physical.

We're feeling them in different ways.

There's different reverberations the energy goes through and maybe it's not

always the same, but there are processes.

So I feel like I'm in that place with the hive.

It.

, I'm honoring the process of the death of that thing that was, and I'm listening,

you know, I'm really listening.

How does it want to be reborn?

How does it want to take new form and what is the course of its carmic

journey or whatever it is, you know, that's that, that creative spark.

How does it wanna keep.

And how can I foster that?

How can I be of service to that?

But more importantly than even asking those questions, there's the, just

sitting with it, being gone and feeling the hole where that place was, where

I used to have a place to share dreams and to read others' dreams every morning

when I woke up and that place is gone.

And rather than filling it with something, I've really been sitting

with that, sitting with my own dreams in the silence of my morning and

sitting with the emptiness of not having others to share them with and

honoring the grief and that hole, , that place was filled up with beauty and

connection and, and it isn't now you.

And there have been moments where I could, touch it and I could say,

Ugh, it hurts . It really hurts.

And then, but then I don't have to label it that because in the

next moment it's joyful because I'm free to do other things.

That energy is still moving through me.

It's just moving in different directions.

and I can also be in that quiet stillness and just be curious with it,

you know, and observe the hole that that place used to fill up for me.

And I know that everything is in a constant state of

transformation, so it's not over.

And I certainly know that my mission of being of service on the planet,

Bringing people's dreams and awareness around energy and sharing these sacred

practices and, , ways of living and perceiving are, they're not going away.

And I'll keep doing that, but I don't know yet what it'll look like.

So I love that you're doing that retreat, Kim, and that I appreciate you coming

onto the podcast and helping me initiate this pick it back up because I heard in

the quiet space between what was and what hasn't yet become that new thing.

I heard that it was time to talk to this, to like, to give this voice , to inspire.

Maybe for the listeners out there who are listening, who are listening to

their own energy, who are listening to our collective energies to inspire that

appreciation for the space between things.

Oh, my , oh my goodness.

I really just have to take a minute and really honor that whole piece.

There's something about.

, just where you started with this, like the, the little

fears, like what will it be?

What will I be, will spirit still talk to me in the same way?

Is it gonna come through if I let this go?

And, you know, I, I frequently relate ether to this idea

of floating in space and to.

Vastness.

The infinite possibility.

The clean slate.

And . The vastness like the untethered.

Like, which way will it go?

Which way will I float off into, and for how long and for how far will I

just keep going and going and going out into space and to consciously and

willingly go into that place is a thing.

And I heard so many, I heard you just speak to all of the qualities of either,

I mean, I can tell you I heard listening and I heard space and I heard freedom

and I heard grief and I heard, I heard my version of your connection to spirit.

I heard solitude.

I heard, you know, I think that might cover like most of the.

of Ether, and it's a beautiful story and it's a beautiful journey.

Me sitting here, getting to watch it with you, witness be with you,

and to some degree, , even if it's just, , in witness and, hmm.

Again, I just, I really, really honor your willingness to go there and that

for me, , talking about this with you, with this subject with you, , that I, I

would hope that there's an inspiration that comes from this piece for all of us.

To just take a little bit of a deep dive into outer space, , , and

just be there and see where it goes, and see what happens.

And being able to have, This is another one faith, you know?

Mm-hmm.

, just tuning to your, to your source, to your relationship

with your creator in the floating emptiness that has such possibility.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh, Kim, you totally like sparked something when you were just

speaking to that, but I suddenly had this thought that like, the

positive and negative pole.

, that they're all inclusive.

That we can't really experience one without the other.

That the entirety of our experience is meant to contain them all.

Right?

And we have this aversion.

We as in sort of culturally there is an idea that it's, we don't wanna

go to the negative poles of things.

You know, We don't wanna be in grief or we don't wanna be in.

And yet I thought about this and how for the negative and positive

pull of the earth . So the ether is the fifth element, right?

The fifth chakra, the throat, and that's the beginning of spirit coming into form.

And it moves down through each of these elements into denser and

denser qualities or frequencies until it reaches the earth plane.

And that's our root chakra and the.

The positive and negative is fear and courage and oh my goodness, you can't

have courage without fear because courage is not the absence of fear, right?

It's about, you know, facing our fears.

It's being afraid and doing something.

and that feeling of oneness and connection with all things is not

about not grieving or not having grief.

It's about moving through grief.

It's incorporating grief and the, and the longing.

Mm-hmm.

It's, it's, it's all of that.

Right?

So that, I don't know.

I just had this, uh, this great feeling that, that full body

epiphenal feeling of just how.

in those moments when we don't resist the negative pull of something and

we really just welcome it how we get to have this ecstatic, wonderful,

joyful experience of grief.

Even like I loved my grieving.

Mm-hmm.

, right?

These months of grieving or these weeks of grieving, you know, I mean

literally the platform just poof, disappeared yesterday officially.

I came to a close a few weeks ago.

It was really just literally yesterday that it disappeared.

That the, if you go to that website now, there's just nothing.

It'll say there's nothing here.

It's in the ether.

But like sitting with that and really going into that feeling

of the, ugh, this is so sad.

Or to the, to the non-existence of a.

and welcoming that, grieving and welcoming the emptiness or welcoming the fear.

If we can welcome the fear with trust or with faith or with.

Maybe some neutrality.

Can I please?

So I just love this.

Like, you, you can never make it up, right?

This, this evolutionary process of energy.

We, we've spoken about it a few times about how the energy becomes

more and more dense as you come down from spirit to matter.

And then we spoke a little bit about how once you hit the.

Yes, there's that idea that the energy then transforms and comes

back into the ether element, right?

It's, it's transmuted or however you wanna like be with that idea.

And I hear that if we speak to the positive, like another way to look

at the positive and negative polls of Ether with there being this idea

that at one poll it is invocation.

Inspiration inception, and at the other poll it's integration.

And I just heard you come through this whole piece and just talking

about how to just be accepting of the quote unquote negative, Right?

How to be with the grief, and what that comes to for me is you've integr.

this piece in your life.

And you know, this whole idea of being able to go to the website now.

And see this piece and make relationship to that and go on with your day.

Yeah.

You know, not like in a way of dismissiveness or I'm not gonna deal

with that right now, but of inclusion.

Right.

And that is integration.

And integration again, is something that I think we fight in this world

because it it, it absolutely involves us being able to be with both poles.

I think one of my favorite tools within Polarity is to really

be able to see that continuum.

Mm-hmm.

and witness that continuum from a place of neutrality.

Witnessing myself in the negative poll and the grieving there and

the hole in my heart and the empty webpage that comes up when I type in

my, you know, it makes me wanna cry.

Right.

But I can be with that simultaneously on the same continuum as the joy

and excitement and freedom and who knows what's next and the space.

I have to get up and do something else , right?

Instead of get on my computer, which I was really craving, ? I just was

so busy, ? And at the same time, I'm missing that, I'm longing for that,

but I'm also so joyful about it.

So yeah, that continuum, the simultaneous experience of both

ends, it's a really ecstatic thing.

It really is.

It's like when you're, when you start laughing really hard and suddenly you

start crying and sobbing and then you start laughing really hard cuz you're

crying and sobbing and then you cry some more and it's like . Do you know

that thing, that hysterical place?

Maybe that's just me.

. Kim Pinckley: I love it.

No, I know what you

mean.

But like, can we do that, you know, in a conscious way, be with the

cry, be with the laugh, be with the forgetting what you were crying or

laughing about, be, be with all of those aspects in a sort of simultaneous.

I think the more what we practice, then the more simultaneous it becomes.

That's how it's been for me.

And now I just love that I can hold space for myself to, to have those processes.

And it doesn't have to define.

. You know, I can say, Oh, I'm grieving, but that doesn't mean that's all I am.

I'm just having an experience of grieving, simultaneous to loving my

life, you know, and loving myself and loving the space and the possibility.

So Maybe for the listeners out there wherever you are in your

journey on your healer's journey, , I invite you to try that on in your

own way, whatever that is for you.

And maybe you already.

and you have your own wisdom around it.

That piece about being with the fear or the uncomfort of going

into that space, in the deeper way?

You know, it's, it is, It's an evolutionary process.

It's something that I've certainly met in different ways before, and a

lot of times, especially with grief, it's not something that you ask for.

Like it comes and you have to deal.

Right.

You don't have a choice sometimes, you know when you lose people in your life.

Right.

And so there's been times where I've had to meet it like that.

And there's some things, like I said, just so for me, so powerful about

you talking about going into this space when you didn't have to mm-hmm.

like you chose to, you chose to do this thing for yourself.

And that is inspiring to me, and I'm really hearing that

and listening to it and tuning.

And grateful for your share cuz I'm tuning into that energy of it and

That's what I can speak to right now , I just really have such an honoring

for you to show up to that by choice.

And it's a big deal.

Hm.

And I also hear this piece too, that I think about your grief that

you spoke to around your process.

And under my understanding of polarity, my understanding of the

universal truths is the amount of energy that is in that grief.

It is impossible that there isn't the same amount of energy in the positive.

Like that's what we're talking about, this continuing this, this positive and

negative, and the inclusion of the all.

And this idea of like how do you be with that?

How do you sign up for that?

Right?

How do you sign up for being in love with your grief?

And when I hear that, I think about how much love you had for the thing that

you lost or that you chose to let go of or whatever the context was, right?

And that they are absolutely equal.

and you can't escape that.

And if you couldn't have one, you couldn't have the other.

It's like that age ageless saying, Right.

And.

For some reason it feels like harder to be with this than like, Oh, if you don't have

night, then you don't have day . Right?

This is a little bit more intense.

And so I just, again, for me, with you right now in this space, it's

an honoring and, , I wanna just tell you that I'm inspired and thank you

for bringing me here and sharing your story and allowing me to speak

and articulate and move through my process even just a little bit more.

Mm.

Thank you.

Mm.

Thank you so much Kim.

That like really, really touches me so deeply.

And I've also just, you know, to say like I have totally gathered inspiration from

observing you and your walk with Ether and space and just our conversations

or my observations of your life and how you do that and how you speak.

and it was definitely your voice in my ear when I was like, Oh, I wanna do this.

It's time . First of all, I could hear the podcast speaking, but

it was like Kim in there too.

Like, Oh, Ether, . How do we honor that space?

How do we do the stillness?

How do we do the non-doing?

How do we do that and how do we.

better.

You know, how do we do that as a practice, with commitment to it?

And for me, I, I think anybody that knows me, I'm a.

Doer, like, whoa.

Both of us are actually . We're both very like fire constitution,

air fire going for it.

And somehow you're anchoring that ether finding balance.

And it's just totally magnificent how you're doing life and how you're doing

the non-doing in between and within.

Right?

And we kind of get to that place too.

If we practice, I think we can practice that even while we're

running from thing to thing.

We're holding that space for ourselves, right?

Even when we're in the moment of deep grief, we're experiencing ecstatic joy.

, ? That's the practice is how can we hold it all and how do we be with nothing?

Aho,

You know, just that.

That's just that

Yeah.

Thank you.

.

participating in this episode of a Lone Traveler's Guide to the Divine.

May this deepen your own inquiry and exploration of your energy and your

soul's path, and I am so, so grateful to be in sacred community with you.