100:: You're not failing! A pregnancy & postpartum mental health deep dive with Dr. Abigail Powell

Speaker: 00:00:00

Welcome to Wellness Fix the pod, a

bi maven media production where we

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believe you deserve real education

from real experts delivered

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in a way you can actually use.

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I'm Dr.

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Kelsey Vick, your board certified

orthopedic doctor of physical therapy, and

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this podcast was built for the girl who

is done feeling overwhelmed and frustrated

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by conflicting health noise and is ready

for something she can actually trust.

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Every week we have honest

science-backed conversations

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about your health, your hormones.

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Your brain, your body and

everything in between.

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No fluff, no fear mongering, just

the truth because understanding

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your body is the most powerful

thing you can do for yourself.

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A table full of experts built for

the curious girl who wants the truth.

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So welcome.

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Your seat is waiting for you.

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So a lot of it is that expectation

to still be able to do everything,

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the constant comments about bodies.

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And it's like everybody suddenly

has the ability to say, oh, it

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looks like you finally popped,

or, wow, you look so much bigger.

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It's just the sudden switch because

it's like, it's not that you weren't

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pregnant before you took a test, but

it's like in your mind you, you weren't

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pregnant and now you are, and now you're

expected to move on with life as if.

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As if nothing happened, as if you

didn't just make this entire discovery.

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It's that constant loop of comparison that

can honestly destroy a mother's mindset

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of who they are, how they're supposed

to be, how they believe they should be.

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What is the, what is the

purpose of this comparing?

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Is it to show that you're a good mom?

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Are you looking for some

external validation right there?

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Because then it's saying,

okay, well I'm not having that

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internal validation that I need.

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I always say that motherhood is like the

biggest form of delayed gratification.

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You are really not gonna feel like

you know that you did a good job

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until they are well out of the house.

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I.

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Kelsy: let's chat.

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Pregnancy and mental health.

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What are some of the most common

things that you see women struggle

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with during pregnancy when it

comes to their mental health?

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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So a lot of it is that expectation

to still be able to do everything.

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So.

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A huge part is like first trimester,

you're feeling really fatigue and then

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you are not really realizing that you

are, you know, like forming your baby's

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organs during that time and that it's

like one of the most important trimesters.

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All of them are important, but like this.

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This is when all the really

vital things start happening.

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And so a lot of moms are

like, why am I one so sick?

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But also, why am I so tired?

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And yet, because a lot of people don't

know that I'm pregnant, I, I now have

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to start acting like everything is fine

when I'm falling asleep at my desk or

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when I am just on the struggle bus.

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And a whole other thing is like,

for me, especially, I carry quite

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small up until the end, and so.

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The constant comments about bodies,

and it's like everybody suddenly

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has the ability to say, oh, it

looks like you finally popped,

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or, wow, you look so much bigger.

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When in reality we've spent our

entire life thinking, okay, well am I

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supposed to have like a small waste?

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Am I supposed to, you know, be

what society thinks I should

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be when it comes to size?

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Or should I be at the same

level of fitness that I was?

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And then knowing that you're

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Like, wait, I am not all belly.

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I, I am actually gaining like

blood volume and extra fluids.

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And so a lot of the time you're

saying, wait a minute, this is not

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how I was told it was going to be.

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And it can really mess with your mind.

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It can really start

making you doubt yourself.

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And it's like that's kind of the

beginning of, okay, am I cut out for this?

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Am I able to stay at

the same fitness level?

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Kelsy: I think expectations are huge.

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And I'm

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Yeah.

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Kelsy: the drastic nature of

going from, not pregnant to

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pregnant, like that's a huge jump.

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And like you

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Yeah.

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Kelsy: a lot of the times in

the first trimester, you're

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maybe keeping some of that.

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To yourself a little bit, and

you're choosing to share with a

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select, supportive group of people.

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But it's this like drastic jump from you

maybe don't look as pregnant as you feel,

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and you're going from you previously

used to function like physically without.

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Having a growing or growing

human inside of you.

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So it's this like delta between

the two that I feel can be

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probably very challenging to

deal with mentally for women.

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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100%.

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Yeah, I think that it, it's just the

sudden switch because it's like, it's not

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that you weren't pregnant before you took

a test, but it's like in your mind you,

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you weren't pregnant and now you are.

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And now you're expected to move

on with life as if as if nothing

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happened, as if you didn't just

make this entire discovery.

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And as if you weren't, you weren't feeling

like a completely new person because

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you're like, okay, hold on a minute.

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What's happening to my body?

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What's going on right now?

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But it's just me and my husband

and maybe a couple close friends,

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maybe like a parent, family

members, something like that.

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But you're like, wait,

this is now a huge secret.

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And so it's almost like when there's

a secret, it's this big deal and

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you, you are like, I'm gonna act

like nothing's wrong, and suddenly

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it's like everything's wrong.

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Some just,

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Kelsy: And you're

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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yeah.

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Kelsy: against it too.

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'cause you're like, okay, I have to act

like nothing's wrong, but like literally

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my entire body is changing and my

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Yeah.

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Kelsy: is changing.

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Like I have to act like

nothing's wrong, but

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Mm-hmm.

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Kelsy: struggling to get to

work when I used to be able

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to, run marathons or whatever.

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So there's this drastic shift in

our capacity to, even though you're

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also trying to fight against that

need to present normally because

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you're still maybe trying to keep

things a little bit of a secret.

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Right, 100%.

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And also it's like you are starting to

then ask people about their experiences

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and it's not adding up to your experience

and you're going, okay, hold on a minute.

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What's wrong with me then?

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If I'm not as sick, then that,

does that mean that I'm not doing

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a good job growing this baby?

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Or if I'm not feeling as great

as this other person, am I not

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doing pregnancy as well as them?

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It's that constant loop of comparison that

can honestly destroy a mother's mindset

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of who they are, how they're supposed

to be, how they believe they should be.

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It's like those should comments that

that can completely like drive them.

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Drive their joy down and make them

really not enjoy that motherhood

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and really increase that mom guilt.

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Kelsy: And I do think.

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you said, pregnancy is maybe the first

of that, but from what I've heard and

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what I've experienced with loved ones

close to me, it doesn't necessarily go

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away unless you have the right tools

to help fight against that comparison.

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Because parenting techniques,

schooling techniques, like

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you're constantly going to be.

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Comparing your experience to

someone else's and trying to figure

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out, and is what I'm doing okay?

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Is what I'm doing right?

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Like second guessing yourself.

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And I feel like you probably work

really closely with a lot of moms

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who struggle with this, not only in

pregnancy, but the throughout motherhood.

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How do you help people with

specifically that comparison piece,

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not only during pregnancy, but also

just postpartum and as they start

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to actually have to raise a human?

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Well, a lot of the time it's,

it's just kind of ask, asking some

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challenging questions as well, so I'm

not somebody who is just going to say,

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okay, yeah, that's really difficult,

and then just move on from it.

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Yes, we wanna validate because

I mean, motherhood is difficult.

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Yes, 100%.

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But it's also somebody going,

okay, but why is their baby

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sleeping through the night?

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How do you know that their baby's

sleeping through the night?

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Well, they told me, okay, but they

slept through the night last night.

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How do you know that they slept

through the night, the night before?

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Well, I don't know that I, are y'all

sharing each other's like sleep logs

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if we aren't keeping sleep logs?

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Why?

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What's, what's the purpose of this?

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Is this to track how

good of a mother you are?

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Oh their child is eating

more foods than mine is.

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Okay, but why does that matter?

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Does.

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Does they, do they have more teeth?

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Does that child roll over as

the same day that your sit?

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Well, I don't know that exactly, exactly.

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What is the, what is the

purpose of this comparing?

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Is it to show that you're a good mom?

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Are you looking for some

external validation Right there?

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Because then it's saying, okay,

well I'm not having that internal

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validation that I need, and so kind

of asking those challenging questions

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and saying, what do I need from this?

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And what purpose is this serving me and

is it actually helping me in this case?

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Kelsy: getting to that

deeper root, it might.

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Mm-hmm.

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Kelsy: my understanding of what

you're saying, it might present

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as comparison, but it really is

like wanting that validation as

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a new mom probably and wanting

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Right.

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Kelsy: I'm doing a good job sort of thing.

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And

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Mm-hmm.

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Kelsy: I heard it once from

one of my really dear friends.

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She's very type a high achiever,

she's also a physical therapist,

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so just very next step.

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Next step.

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Level up.

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And she said with motherhood, it

was the first time that she did not

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get the validation that she needed

from this human that she, worked so

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hard and sacrificed so much for, and

he wasn't even smiling at her yet.

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And I never thought about it from

that perspective as like she,

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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right.

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Kelsy: validation from her good

grades, from, her hard work

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Mm-hmm.

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Kelsy: She saw the

results of, and this was.

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One of those situations where she

struggled with that validation from her

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son, because it was like it's hard to get

that from a baby with even just a smile

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when they don't have that skill yet.

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And I thought it was eyeopening

for me as someone who's not a mom

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and who, who hasn't experienced

that to understand that.

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Sometimes you might need that

validation and comparison might be

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the way that's presenting to get

that validation from other people,

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but or from yourself, like you said

to check that skill for your child.

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But I think that's a very good

point, and I've seen it present

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in a lot of different ways.

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I.

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

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Yeah, I think that a lot of the

time, I mean, I always say that

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parenthood, especially just motherhood

in general, is like the biggest

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form of delayed gratification.

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You are really not gonna feel like

you know that you did a good job

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until they are well out of the house.

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They possibly have their own families.

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And then I'm almost thinking

that when you become a mother.

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You are almost re-parenting yourself while

you're parenting your own kids because

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you're kind of realizing what, like maybe

what your parents did for you that worked

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for you is not working with this child.

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Especially for me, like I have two little

boys and I was the eldest daughter.

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I mean, I was first born, so

it was definitely different

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scenario in my family.

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And so sitting through a meal maybe wasn't

as difficult for me, but for my kids.

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Oh my gosh.

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It is the hardest thing for them.

237

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I mean, it is equivalent to torture, to

sit down for two minutes and eat their

238

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food without having some sort of race.

239

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And so for me, I was going, oh my

gosh, I was able to sit through

240

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this meal at four years old.

241

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Why can't they, I, I'm

not understanding it.

242

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And then realizing, okay, well.

243

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They have so much more going on.

244

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Not just because they're boys, but

also because like, they're not just

245

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me, but they're also part my husband.

246

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And so I jokingly, I'll jokingly look

at him and be like, that's your fault.

247

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That's you.

248

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'cause it completely was him and that

that's exactly how he was as a child.

249

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And then I kind of see the beauty

in it because I love who my

250

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husband is and how he turned out.

251

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And so if he turned out this

way as a man in his thirties.

252

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And he was like this at four.

253

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Okay, great.

254

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He somehow found out how to utilize it,

and so I'm gonna parent the way that my

255

00:13:41,428 --> 00:13:45,808

kids need to be parented and not the way

that other people parented their kids.

256

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Kelsy: I feel like all of these

phrases that you're using and

257

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just different things, different

reframing of your own mindset, like

258

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

259

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Yeah.

260

00:13:52,535 --> 00:13:55,715

Kelsy: see that you've also had to work

through this, and it's really healthy

261

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for me to see all of the, different

steps that you take to get to your

262

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ultimate, the most healthy way to reframe

the current situation that you're in,

263

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because you also probably have had to

do some work to understand okay, if my

264

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kid is maybe not behaving as well in a

restaurant as someone else's kid, that's

265

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not necessarily a reflection on me.

266

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It's not coming back to

my worth and my identity.

267

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There are these individual differences

that exist in these children and it's not

268

00:14:21,728 --> 00:14:21,729

Dr. Abigail Powell:

269

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Yes,

270

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Kelsy: to my own worth.

271

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

272

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100%.

273

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And I don't parent the same way.

274

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Like each kid, it's having three,

especially having both genders and

275

00:14:32,238 --> 00:14:35,748

having completely different ages,

each kid is gonna need something else.

276

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And I really don't feel like I actually

got to the point of knowing that the mom

277

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guilt, like the mom still, it still comes,

the mom guilt is still there sometimes

278

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because I'm definitely not perfect.

279

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But I realized that I kind of conquered.

280

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That ultimate mountain of

shaming myself when my 2-year-old

281

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was jumping on the couch.

282

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I took him off multiple times.

283

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We talked about it multiple

times, and then he bunks his

284

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head and it created an ER visit.

285

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And immediately when I told one of my

friends about it, she goes, I hope that

286

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you know you did everything you could.

287

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And I go, no, I know.

288

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I don't think I'm a bad mom

because my child made a mistake.

289

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And in that moment.

290

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I almost kind of felt this weight fall

off my shoulders because I, I was not

291

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going to the ER thinking I messed up.

292

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I did this, this must have been me.

293

00:15:25,683 --> 00:15:27,213

This wasn't a reflection on me.

294

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I did everything in my power to do

that other than basically baby wearing

295

00:15:31,983 --> 00:15:34,593

my 2-year-old, which I couldn't do.

296

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I was baby wearing my seven month old,

so I was too busy, baby wearing, but.

297

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Kelsy: The bubble.

298

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The bubble can only go so far.

299

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Dr. Abigail Powell:

300

00:15:41,959 --> 00:15:42,308

Right.

301

00:15:42,313 --> 00:15:47,013

Like he cannot piggyback on me even

though he wants to at all times.

302

00:15:47,373 --> 00:15:50,643

And so kind of having that moment

of realization of, okay, this isn't

303

00:15:50,643 --> 00:15:54,063

me, these kids, yes, I grew them.

304

00:15:54,153 --> 00:15:57,393

Yes, I see myself in

them, but they are not me.

305

00:15:57,393 --> 00:15:59,583

They are their own people with autonomy.

306

00:15:59,583 --> 00:16:04,803

It almost kind of like the world opens up

for you and you're starting to go, okay,

307

00:16:04,803 --> 00:16:07,443

it's, it's not because I'm a bad mom.

308

00:16:07,488 --> 00:16:07,548

Yeah.

309

00:16:08,178 --> 00:16:11,658

And so I think that that also

kind of goes into parenting

310

00:16:11,658 --> 00:16:13,248

of I parent my kids that way.

311

00:16:13,248 --> 00:16:15,768

If they make a mistake, that does

not mean that they're a bad kid.

312

00:16:16,218 --> 00:16:20,388

So if we are talking to our kids the

same way that we talk to ourselves,

313

00:16:20,598 --> 00:16:24,528

we're gonna see that they are also

going to turn out the same way as us.

314

00:16:24,558 --> 00:16:25,788

More regulated.

315

00:16:26,945 --> 00:16:28,680

Kelsy: I think that's when you know

you've made it, you know when you

316

00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:30,210

have that light switch moment of

317

00:16:30,260 --> 00:16:30,261

Dr. Abigail Powell:

318

00:16:30,261 --> 00:16:30,740

it was like,

319

00:16:31,172 --> 00:16:31,382

Kelsy: my

320

00:16:31,730 --> 00:16:31,731

Dr. Abigail Powell:

321

00:16:31,731 --> 00:16:32,030

yeah.

322

00:16:32,132 --> 00:16:33,722

Kelsy: go to this shaming myself.

323

00:16:34,082 --> 00:16:35,782

I understand that it's okay.

324

00:16:35,782 --> 00:16:39,202

I did all that I could and

things happen, so I feel

325

00:16:39,310 --> 00:16:39,311

Dr. Abigail Powell:

326

00:16:39,311 --> 00:16:39,670

Exactly.

327

00:16:39,982 --> 00:16:44,932

Kelsy: a, an I made it moment as far as,

your own mental state regarding certain

328

00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:45,161

Dr. Abigail Powell:

329

00:16:45,161 --> 00:16:45,700

Mm-hmm.

330

00:16:45,712 --> 00:16:46,852

Kelsy: just out of your control.

331

00:16:47,705 --> 00:16:47,706

Dr. Abigail Powell:

332

00:16:47,706 --> 00:16:48,055

Right.

333

00:16:48,220 --> 00:16:48,850

Exactly.

334

00:16:48,850 --> 00:16:49,150

Yeah.

335

00:16:49,150 --> 00:16:52,270

And I mean it was, that was

like a core memory moment,

336

00:16:52,270 --> 00:16:54,460

but it took so much training.

337

00:16:55,060 --> 00:16:56,650

To say, okay, this isn't you.

338

00:16:56,770 --> 00:16:58,180

This doesn't mean that

you're a bad parent.

339

00:16:58,180 --> 00:17:00,940

This just means that the kids,

they're now finding their

340

00:17:00,940 --> 00:17:01,840

own autonomy and that's okay.

341

00:17:03,242 --> 00:17:06,137

Kelsy: So switching to postpartum a

little bit, are there certain things

342

00:17:06,207 --> 00:17:10,021

that you see in your practice with

your clients that women struggle with?

343

00:17:10,252 --> 00:17:14,271

Differently or maybe in a different way

than what they did during pregnancy or do

344

00:17:14,271 --> 00:17:16,402

some of those challenges they experience.

345

00:17:16,402 --> 00:17:19,612

Are they completely different than

the challenges during pregnancy?

346

00:17:20,410 --> 00:17:20,411

Dr. Abigail Powell:

347

00:17:20,411 --> 00:17:25,150

I think that a lot of women especially

have these plans of how they want

348

00:17:25,150 --> 00:17:28,224

their postpartum to be, and then they

go, wait, I did not prep for this.

349

00:17:29,425 --> 00:17:35,575

And so, I mean, I have an entire program

where I am kind of studying that, that

350

00:17:35,575 --> 00:17:40,645

mentality for postpartum and almost

helping them kind of create a game plan

351

00:17:40,645 --> 00:17:44,695

that's realistic because a lot of the

time they'll say, okay, dad's gonna

352

00:17:44,695 --> 00:17:47,665

take the first half of the night, and

then I'm gonna take the second half of

353

00:17:47,665 --> 00:17:49,945

the night, and I'm going, okay, great.

354

00:17:50,005 --> 00:17:50,755

However.

355

00:17:51,130 --> 00:17:55,600

You may not know how you're feeling

postpartum, and you, with you being so

356

00:17:55,600 --> 00:18:00,330

inflexible about this, knowing that you

want to have like these specific shifts.

357

00:18:00,510 --> 00:18:01,710

Okay, what if dad is sick?

358

00:18:01,830 --> 00:18:04,770

What if dad has to go back

to work earlier than you do?

359

00:18:04,770 --> 00:18:08,040

Then, like, how are we

going to handle this?

360

00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:09,600

And they're going, well,

I didn't prep for that.

361

00:18:09,810 --> 00:18:12,690

Okay, well, what if labor

was more difficult than you

362

00:18:12,690 --> 00:18:13,830

thought it was going to be?

363

00:18:14,100 --> 00:18:15,540

How are we going to handle that?

364

00:18:15,660 --> 00:18:17,550

And then they'll go, I

didn't think about that.

365

00:18:17,790 --> 00:18:19,590

But instead, what we're trying to do is.

366

00:18:20,715 --> 00:18:24,825

We're trying to almost prep in a way of

saying, I'm gonna be flexible with this.

367

00:18:24,825 --> 00:18:29,805

We're gonna write down what we think that

we want, and then postpartum, we're gonna

368

00:18:29,805 --> 00:18:31,605

allow ourselves to change our minds.

369

00:18:32,595 --> 00:18:41,745

We're we're gonna say, okay, I know

that it's okay if I, like, if I decide

370

00:18:41,745 --> 00:18:44,535

that I I'm not gonna pump at night.

371

00:18:44,565 --> 00:18:46,545

I'm just going to nurse

something like that.

372

00:18:47,385 --> 00:18:51,795

I'm gonna be okay with that, or it's

okay if we have decided to co-sleep,

373

00:18:51,825 --> 00:18:55,365

even though we said that we were not

going to, that was me with my first kid.

374

00:18:55,785 --> 00:18:56,985

I was like, no, co-sleeping.

375

00:18:57,100 --> 00:18:58,545

I, I wouldn't know how to do it.

376

00:18:58,545 --> 00:19:00,585

I, I didn't know.

377

00:19:01,065 --> 00:19:04,005

I didn't know how to safely do it,

and so therefore it couldn't happen.

378

00:19:04,005 --> 00:19:07,155

Instead of, oh, I can learn, I can switch.

379

00:19:07,515 --> 00:19:11,355

Because a lot of the time, I mean, even

as somebody who was childless, I was

380

00:19:11,355 --> 00:19:13,785

going, my kids would never do that.

381

00:19:14,295 --> 00:19:17,385

My kids would never act

that way in a restaurant.

382

00:19:17,715 --> 00:19:20,415

My kids would never yell no at me.

383

00:19:21,225 --> 00:19:24,795

And then I was thinking, okay,

things need to shift, mindset needs

384

00:19:24,795 --> 00:19:27,525

to shift on that I can do better.

385

00:19:27,615 --> 00:19:35,475

And understanding that, oh, okay, I, I

maybe had different expectations here.

386

00:19:35,535 --> 00:19:38,985

And so it's like a huge part is

that really expectation shift and

387

00:19:38,985 --> 00:19:41,565

being flexible with that and knowing

that you didn't just mess up.

388

00:19:41,685 --> 00:19:42,075

It's okay.

389

00:19:43,292 --> 00:19:46,037

Kelsy: And knowing too, I feel

like especially going from zero

390

00:19:46,037 --> 00:19:49,697

to one, you don't know yourself.

391

00:19:50,392 --> 00:19:54,082

As someone who's pregnant with or

with a child like you are setting

392

00:19:54,082 --> 00:19:55,432

these expectations probably during

393

00:19:55,620 --> 00:19:55,621

Dr. Abigail Powell:

394

00:19:55,621 --> 00:19:55,830

Yeah.

395

00:19:55,912 --> 00:19:59,182

Kelsy: when you don't have a little

one and all that goes into that, and

396

00:19:59,182 --> 00:20:04,462

you don't have this hindsight of how

your postpartum experience is gonna go.

397

00:20:04,462 --> 00:20:08,002

Maybe your birthing your delivery method

was a little bit different than what you

398

00:20:08,002 --> 00:20:09,472

thought and what your expectations were.

399

00:20:09,472 --> 00:20:13,362

Like all of these shifts that

might happen once, baby is

400

00:20:13,362 --> 00:20:14,622

actually earth side and being.

401

00:20:14,997 --> 00:20:19,717

Flexible to shift your own expectations,

towards that, but also understanding

402

00:20:19,717 --> 00:20:22,947

like you didn't know what you didn't

know, and it's okay to be able to

403

00:20:22,947 --> 00:20:25,077

have that flexibility in that mindset.

404

00:20:26,095 --> 00:20:26,096

Dr. Abigail Powell:

405

00:20:26,096 --> 00:20:29,530

Right, and I didn't know anything.

406

00:20:30,100 --> 00:20:33,250

I didn't prep at all my first time around

because I was like, we're gonna have a

407

00:20:33,250 --> 00:20:34,540

baby and we're gonna walk out of there.

408

00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:38,770

And now I have my poor sister who

is not even close to having children

409

00:20:39,070 --> 00:20:43,810

who, it's not even in her horizon and

she's going, oh, there is no way that

410

00:20:43,810 --> 00:20:48,250

I'm going to allow visitors after the

furs, two weeks or something like that.

411

00:20:48,250 --> 00:20:53,890

She goes, I am now seeing you do it

three times and I know what I need now.

412

00:20:54,205 --> 00:20:58,675

And she's like, I need you in the room

because I know that I could just look

413

00:20:58,675 --> 00:21:03,445

at you and say everything that I need

to say, and so I'm gonna make sure that

414

00:21:03,445 --> 00:21:05,605

you're going to like, it's the big sis.

415

00:21:05,665 --> 00:21:08,665

It's like you're gonna be that

big sister and you're gonna let me

416

00:21:08,665 --> 00:21:11,725

have the birth that I need so I can

have the postpartum that I want.

417

00:21:12,617 --> 00:21:14,627

Kelsy: Are there certain, I'm thinking.

418

00:21:15,632 --> 00:21:20,042

Of expectations, and especially

friends of mine who have had certain

419

00:21:20,042 --> 00:21:24,302

expectations before pregnancy

that have shifted after pregnancy.

420

00:21:24,602 --> 00:21:28,442

And I'm thinking of one example,

primarily career related where I

421

00:21:28,442 --> 00:21:32,762

would've said she's very, high achieving,

would've definitely been a working mom.

422

00:21:32,792 --> 00:21:34,162

And then she shifted.

423

00:21:34,507 --> 00:21:37,717

Postpartum and realize I

just want to stay at home.

424

00:21:37,717 --> 00:21:40,267

I love being a stay at home mom.

425

00:21:40,267 --> 00:21:41,407

I don't see any other

426

00:21:41,525 --> 00:21:41,526

Dr. Abigail Powell:

427

00:21:41,526 --> 00:21:41,815

Yeah.

428

00:21:42,337 --> 00:21:48,757

Kelsy: Are there actual sort of brain

changes that happen during pregnancy

429

00:21:48,757 --> 00:21:53,747

and postpartum that might, lead

towards us needing to be a little

430

00:21:53,747 --> 00:21:57,107

bit more flexible with some of the

expectations that we thought we had

431

00:21:57,137 --> 00:21:59,567

during pregnancy or that trimester zero.

432

00:22:00,475 --> 00:22:00,476

Dr. Abigail Powell:

433

00:22:00,476 --> 00:22:04,045

Yeah, so there's actually been studies

that have come out that have shown

434

00:22:04,045 --> 00:22:09,835

that mom's brain has changed throughout

pregnancy in the first two years.

435

00:22:09,835 --> 00:22:15,775

Postpartum meaning like mom is losing gray

matter, especially in her frontal lobe.

436

00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:18,120

Her limbic system.

437

00:22:18,120 --> 00:22:22,800

So that has our hippocampus,

so memories and connects to our

438

00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:24,270

amygdala, so that fight or flight.

439

00:22:24,300 --> 00:22:27,750

And there are temporal lobes

which are important for like

440

00:22:27,750 --> 00:22:29,800

processing what we hear.

441

00:22:30,100 --> 00:22:34,230

And so I wanna really focus on

that, not because it's like the

442

00:22:34,230 --> 00:22:37,230

biggest shift, but because it's

really what you can kind of see.

443

00:22:37,470 --> 00:22:41,500

So throughout the first two years,

that's when, baby's becoming more verbal.

444

00:22:41,710 --> 00:22:44,200

And there's always kind of a

running joke once you have kids.

445

00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,620

I didn't know it before kids, but

maybe you know it where it's like a

446

00:22:47,620 --> 00:22:49,780

mom understands what the baby's saying.

447

00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:54,850

So like baby is babbling,

saying, you know, whatever.

448

00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:59,650

And everyone else is gonna

look and they're like, I have

449

00:22:59,650 --> 00:23:01,150

no idea what he just said.

450

00:23:01,510 --> 00:23:06,520

And I will, like this morning,

right before this, my 2-year-old

451

00:23:06,850 --> 00:23:08,770

was like, I wanna go for a barrah.

452

00:23:09,130 --> 00:23:14,440

And my mom looks at me and she goes,

Abby, I I need you to speak his language.

453

00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:16,060

I was like, he wants a bike ride, mom.

454

00:23:16,120 --> 00:23:18,640

Why didn't, why couldn't you hear that?

455

00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,580

And she was like, I, I didn't know.

456

00:23:21,580 --> 00:23:25,060

And it's because those two

years after having him, my

457

00:23:25,060 --> 00:23:27,250

brain is able to know what cry.

458

00:23:27,900 --> 00:23:29,310

Is dangerous.

459

00:23:29,310 --> 00:23:33,330

And what cry is just him wanting to

get attention because he totally has

460

00:23:33,330 --> 00:23:36,930

that cry where he will, he will cry

and then he'll stop and he'll look

461

00:23:36,930 --> 00:23:38,250

at me and he's like, is she looking?

462

00:23:38,730 --> 00:23:42,270

And then, and then he'll continue

crying as I'm kind of watching him and

463

00:23:42,270 --> 00:23:43,410

I'm like, I know what you're doing.

464

00:23:43,770 --> 00:23:47,100

But then he has his own language because

they're learning how to form words

465

00:23:47,490 --> 00:23:49,680

and my brain is forming to help that.

466

00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:53,940

So the more children we have, the more

different our brain is going to look.

467

00:23:54,090 --> 00:23:57,660

And so with three, I have no

idea what my brain looks like.

468

00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,680

However, I do know that I

need a calendar a lot more.

469

00:24:02,370 --> 00:24:05,280

I cannot think of the

grocery list in my head.

470

00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:09,570

Instead, my husband and I have

to keep like a mutual calendar

471

00:24:09,630 --> 00:24:13,740

of when we go grocery shopping,

when our Walmart pickup order is.

472

00:24:14,505 --> 00:24:17,505

What exactly we need to do in

the phone calls we need to make,

473

00:24:17,535 --> 00:24:18,855

everything needs to be scheduled.

474

00:24:18,855 --> 00:24:19,095

Why?

475

00:24:19,095 --> 00:24:23,655

Because I'm totally going to forget

about it because I'm so busy thinking

476

00:24:23,745 --> 00:24:25,470

about what my child needs and.

477

00:24:26,205 --> 00:24:27,825

I would not have it any other way.

478

00:24:28,035 --> 00:24:34,175

Yes, I may forget about like filling

out a form until the last minute.

479

00:24:34,175 --> 00:24:35,015

Professionally.

480

00:24:35,375 --> 00:24:39,035

However, I know that I'm never going

to forget the symptoms that my child

481

00:24:39,035 --> 00:24:43,355

has when they're sick or like the

moment that they showed those symptoms.

482

00:24:43,355 --> 00:24:45,155

And I think that is so

much more important.

483

00:24:45,677 --> 00:24:46,757

Kelsy: It's an adaptability.

484

00:24:46,757 --> 00:24:47,597

That's super

485

00:24:47,735 --> 00:24:47,736

Dr. Abigail Powell:

486

00:24:47,736 --> 00:24:48,335

100%.

487

00:24:48,347 --> 00:24:51,597

Kelsy: to know because yeah, it's you

hear mom brain or whatever, and it's

488

00:24:51,597 --> 00:24:53,387

this thrown around term and I'm like.

489

00:24:54,077 --> 00:24:57,617

This is a sort of positive

reframing of mom brain because

490

00:24:57,800 --> 00:24:57,801

Dr. Abigail Powell:

491

00:24:57,801 --> 00:24:58,010

Yeah.

492

00:24:58,217 --> 00:25:03,047

Kelsy: heard of our brains after

actually shifting to allow for us

493

00:25:03,047 --> 00:25:07,607

to be able to better communicate

for and with our, growing child.

494

00:25:07,607 --> 00:25:08,987

So that is so cool.

495

00:25:08,987 --> 00:25:09,017

I.

496

00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:10,281

Dr. Abigail Powell:

497

00:25:10,281 --> 00:25:14,420

Yeah, so I mean, I think it's

kind of a superpower personally.

498

00:25:14,810 --> 00:25:15,710

I know for me.

499

00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:20,370

I've had to learn how to like,

regulate myself to understand that my

500

00:25:20,370 --> 00:25:22,080

children are not gonna be regulated.

501

00:25:22,110 --> 00:25:22,740

So

502

00:25:22,867 --> 00:25:26,737

If somebody's crying and

hyperventilating, it's not gonna work.

503

00:25:26,737 --> 00:25:30,607

If I just look in their face and I go,

stop crying, that doesn't work for me.

504

00:25:30,847 --> 00:25:31,027

Why?

505

00:25:31,897 --> 00:25:35,767

Why would it work for my poor toddler

who has no frontal lobe, basically?

506

00:25:35,797 --> 00:25:40,467

And so knowing that I need to regulate

that we can co-regulate together.

507

00:25:40,797 --> 00:25:42,627

And that I am the example for it.

508

00:25:42,987 --> 00:25:44,757

It has made a world of difference.

509

00:25:44,757 --> 00:25:48,957

And I've noticed that my moms, especially

that I see, they'll email me and

510

00:25:48,957 --> 00:25:50,187

they'll be like, Abby, oh my gosh.

511

00:25:50,187 --> 00:25:55,527

I thought that you, I thought that

you were crazy for doing a breathing

512

00:25:55,527 --> 00:25:58,467

technique in front of the child.

513

00:25:58,617 --> 00:26:03,957

However, it worked and I noticed

that my, my baby is suddenly so

514

00:26:03,957 --> 00:26:05,787

much calmer because I am calmer.

515

00:26:07,044 --> 00:26:08,454

Kelsy: I have to know

the breathing technique.

516

00:26:09,294 --> 00:26:11,274

mind sharing what is

this breathing technique?

517

00:26:12,387 --> 00:26:12,388

Dr. Abigail Powell:

518

00:26:12,388 --> 00:26:16,077

So eight's different because everything

that I do with every single mom,

519

00:26:16,077 --> 00:26:17,667

it's gonna be tailored towards them.

520

00:26:17,727 --> 00:26:22,137

But a lot of the time what I do is I

kind of go in for four out for six.

521

00:26:22,507 --> 00:26:26,737

So we'll do like breathing in for

four, then we'll hold for four,

522

00:26:26,737 --> 00:26:27,907

and then we'll go out for six.

523

00:26:27,907 --> 00:26:30,397

Sometimes it's out for

eight, depending on.

524

00:26:30,727 --> 00:26:32,137

Mom's athletic ability.

525

00:26:32,137 --> 00:26:35,287

So if mom's a runner, she could

probably breathe in longer and then

526

00:26:35,287 --> 00:26:39,877

breathe out longer, but it's activating

that parasympathetic nervous system.

527

00:26:39,937 --> 00:26:44,017

So it's activating the calm

and the way that the body is

528

00:26:44,017 --> 00:26:46,087

saying, Hey, you are in control.

529

00:26:46,997 --> 00:26:49,697

A whole other thing is I, I

call it the parental pause.

530

00:26:49,847 --> 00:26:55,637

So stopping for a moment, assessing

the situation, because typically, like

531

00:26:55,637 --> 00:26:57,527

I said, we know our babies cry, so.

532

00:26:58,532 --> 00:27:02,432

If we do not hear a dangerous cry,

however, we heard a loud noise,

533

00:27:02,612 --> 00:27:04,622

typically a loud noise plus crying.

534

00:27:05,492 --> 00:27:07,742

It usually a loud noise plus silence.

535

00:27:07,742 --> 00:27:10,832

I'd be more worried, again,

two boys, but that's just me.

536

00:27:11,192 --> 00:27:15,602

But a loud noise plus some crying, I'm

gonna walk instead of just absolutely

537

00:27:15,602 --> 00:27:21,152

sprint because then my sympathetic nervous

system is ramped up and I'm going to

538

00:27:21,152 --> 00:27:23,402

know that I'm reacting versus responding.

539

00:27:23,792 --> 00:27:24,422

So.

540

00:27:25,182 --> 00:27:27,737

I, I show up, I assess the situation.

541

00:27:27,737 --> 00:27:31,127

I say, okay, hey, what happened bud?

542

00:27:31,277 --> 00:27:36,167

And then typically they see a calm figure

instead of, oh my gosh, what happened?

543

00:27:36,527 --> 00:27:38,357

When they see the, oh

my gosh, what happened?

544

00:27:38,987 --> 00:27:42,887

They're less likely to run to you

and look for co-regulation when you

545

00:27:42,887 --> 00:27:45,047

say, Hey, bud, noticed what happened?

546

00:27:45,047 --> 00:27:46,367

I noticed that something broke.

547

00:27:46,997 --> 00:27:47,567

Come over here.

548

00:27:47,567 --> 00:27:50,807

We're gonna calm down because I

know I don't know about you, but I

549

00:27:50,807 --> 00:27:52,967

cannot take any sort of feedback.

550

00:27:53,282 --> 00:27:56,192

If I'm in fight or flight,

neither can our child.

551

00:27:56,642 --> 00:28:01,922

And so even when we have a baby, even when

we're in postpartum, if we start hearing

552

00:28:01,922 --> 00:28:05,492

a cry, maybe it's not even the cry where

it's saying, Hey, there's an emergency.

553

00:28:05,492 --> 00:28:11,372

But if mom is really worked up versus

when she comes, maybe 10 seconds later

554

00:28:11,372 --> 00:28:16,622

regulated after doing that breathing

technique really quick, you notice

555

00:28:16,622 --> 00:28:21,212

that baby's able to calm much faster

and you're, and you notice that mom.

556

00:28:21,722 --> 00:28:23,882

Is staying more regulated as well.

557

00:28:23,882 --> 00:28:25,082

It's truly amazing.

558

00:28:25,274 --> 00:28:25,944

Kelsy: Which is amazing.

559

00:28:25,944 --> 00:28:28,164

I know you're also big

with food as medicine.

560

00:28:28,404 --> 00:28:28,704

Are

561

00:28:28,907 --> 00:28:28,908

Dr. Abigail Powell:

562

00:28:28,908 --> 00:28:29,327

Mm-hmm.

563

00:28:29,394 --> 00:28:32,934

Kelsy: sort of fueling or nutrition

strategies that we should think about

564

00:28:33,174 --> 00:28:35,649

to promote that calm in our brains?

565

00:28:37,092 --> 00:28:37,093

Dr. Abigail Powell:

566

00:28:37,093 --> 00:28:42,882

So big thing is when mom is newly

postpartum, I try broth based so.

567

00:28:43,792 --> 00:28:47,842

Warm broth based just because

it is, it's promoting healing.

568

00:28:48,252 --> 00:28:52,922

And so big on that along with

making sure that we're always

569

00:28:52,922 --> 00:28:54,452

choosing a protein first.

570

00:28:54,782 --> 00:28:59,202

So making sure that we have that

long-term stable energy as well as a

571

00:28:59,262 --> 00:29:03,462

fat and a carb because we really need

to make sure that our glucose is steady.

572

00:29:03,492 --> 00:29:08,232

So, I mean, you know, where we have

the carbohydrate that's gonna spike

573

00:29:08,232 --> 00:29:10,812

our blood sugar, and then the fat

and the protein's gonna carry it on.

574

00:29:11,382 --> 00:29:16,472

So really making sure that, you

know, we are having well-balanced

575

00:29:16,472 --> 00:29:18,212

meals every single time.

576

00:29:18,302 --> 00:29:19,872

I have a breastfeeding mom.

577

00:29:19,872 --> 00:29:23,892

I say just take a small snack with you,

like handful of mixed nuts when you're

578

00:29:23,892 --> 00:29:27,922

eating or when you're breastfeeding,

and that's gonna help as well

579

00:29:27,922 --> 00:29:29,422

because you are burning so many Cal.

580

00:29:32,030 --> 00:29:32,270

Kelsy: Dr.

581

00:29:32,270 --> 00:29:33,020

Abigail, thank you.

582

00:29:33,110 --> 00:29:36,740

So much for coming on and sharing

your knowledge, your expertise, your

583

00:29:36,740 --> 00:29:41,270

passion, and especially some practical

examples for how you've helped your own

584

00:29:41,270 --> 00:29:42,890

clients and patients in your practice.

585

00:29:42,890 --> 00:29:43,970

I think that's wonderful.

586

00:29:44,180 --> 00:29:47,090

If you guys are wanting someone like Dr.

587

00:29:47,090 --> 00:29:50,870

Abigail on your team, I will leave

her link to book with her below.

588

00:29:50,870 --> 00:29:54,140

She takes virtual clients in

Texas, if you're in Texas.

589

00:29:54,170 --> 00:29:56,510

If not, I will also

leave her socials below.

590

00:29:56,510 --> 00:30:00,110

That way you can follow her content

and education and information that

591

00:30:00,110 --> 00:30:02,120

she puts out for all moms and also.

592

00:30:02,140 --> 00:30:07,300

Stages and I find so much value in it

as someone who is in trimester zero just

593

00:30:07,300 --> 00:30:08,890

thinking about pregnancy and postpartum.

594

00:30:08,890 --> 00:30:10,600

So I know you guys will too.

595

00:30:10,690 --> 00:30:13,120

I hope you guys learned so much from Dr.

596

00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:13,510

Abigail.

597

00:30:13,510 --> 00:30:16,000

You enjoyed this episode and I

will see you guys again on the next

598

00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:17,710

episode of Wellness B exists the pod

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