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Last Updated: September 2, 2024

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198: Katie Peabody's Answer to Outdoor Apparel for Children 12 Months to 12 Years Old

Also available on YouTube: https://youtu.be/yhOYpDY_7a4

What outdoor activity brings you and your children the most joy? For Katie Peabody and her family, it's spending quality time in the mountains.

As the Founder and CEO of KinderMountain, Katie noticed a gap in the market for technical outdoor clothing for children, especially kids under five. This discovery came about as she struggled to find suitable outdoor clothing for her three children.

As a recent graduate of The Rosie Network's Service2CEO Program, Katie's company aims to produce hiking pants, softshell jackets, and sun shirts for children, designed with the same technical features as adult outdoor clothing. She also plans to offer a trade-in program for outgrown items to keep them out of landfills and make them more affordable. Listen to Katie's passion for getting kids outdoors and sharing the benefits of outdoor learning!

Resources Mentioned:

• http://www.kindermountain.com/
• https://www.instagram.com/kindermountain/

Read our Monday, Nov. 4th, 2024 newsletter: https://mailchi.mp/649405ef0b0b/holdingdownthefort

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Jen Amos 0:00

Alright, hey everyone. Welcome back to another episode here at holding down the fort. Today I'm excited to be joined by Katie p body with Kinder mountain. She's a founder and CEO. Katie, welcome to the show.

Katie Peabody 0:11

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Jen Amos 0:12

Yes. So the first thing I want to ask you, and I feel like this can be a loaded question for a lot of people. So I'm going to try to be specific is for people that are getting to know you for the first time. Give us a quick snapshot of your life, particularly what keeps you busy or excited nowadays?

Katie Peabody 0:29

Jen Amos 0:58

my goodness, what a life. Yes.

Katie Peabody 1:03

And it is non stop all the time here.

Jen Amos 1:05

Yeah, well, thanks for sharing and, and more importantly, thank you for taking the time to just take a quick pause and hopefully use his time to reflect and maybe count your blessings at this point of your journey on the show today. I know the primary topic will be around Kinder mountain today. And I know that you know, being a mom plays a big influence into what you do. So let's just go ahead and dive into it. Tell me a little bit about Kinder mountain and how your startup began.

Katie Peabody 1:32

Jen Amos 4:19

no, absolutely. And, you know, it's one thing to ask like, what if, you know, what if we could have this what if we could have that, but it's another thing to actually implement it, right? It's like, there's so many people who have ideas, but it's another thing to actually yeah, it's actually like, it's a whole other thing to execute it. So tell us a little I know that you're fairly new with Kinder mountain, but go ahead and tell me about like the early stages of it. And I know that you have worked with the Rosi network as well to make this possible. Yeah, tell us about that.

Katie Peabody 4:47

So I am you know, I think there's there's two types of people. There's people who read and have the ideas but never action it. Then there's the people that jump in and kind of figure stuff out as they go along. I am the last her, my husband is the former. So it kind of helped to balance me out. And one of my investors is also the like, you know, it's great idea. But take a step back and like, give me more, where's your business plan? What are you doing? And that's when I found the Rosie network, which helped me kind of slow myself down. So I wasn't rushing to failure. I think taking action is great. But you have to have a plan to back up the actions that you're taking. So yeah, absolutely. You know, it started last February is when I had the idea, I got my business license, and kind of secured the name and social media and stuff. And then I started developing, I worked with a designer in England from there. And then I found the Rosie network, I think, in April or May and joined the summer cohort last year. And we developed my pitch deck, and which is essentially like I was able to grow my pitch deck into my business plan. And you know, so now I have three investors, my husband and I are also putting money into it. And I have been talking to manufacturers now. So we're getting closer to having the samples back. And it's, you know, it gives me chills thinking about it, like, Hey, this is actually it's coming to life, like so excited. But then it's also kind of scary, because it's like, hey, you know, this could fail, or this could just blow up beyond anything you were expecting for it. So yeah, it's a journey.

Jen Amos 6:20

I mean, I'm incredibly impressed that this is something you wanted to do less than a year ago, you know, like, yours coming up, and the fact that you already licensed and you have investors and manufacture and you had to design like you had all these things lined up, I just want to take a moment to commend you for the hustle that you you've done, you know, and then in the less than 12 months, considering how you work, you homeschool your kids, like there's just so many things that you keep that you do to keep yourself busy that to have this to have done all of this in less than a year. I mean, I consider that very impressive. Oh,

Katie Peabody 6:53

thank you. I feel like I should be further along. But I know it's gotta be realistic, because stuff takes time. It does. Yeah, especially if you want it to like go how you have it envisioned? Yeah, you can't rush at all. So it's, uh, you know, spending 15 minutes a day, or, you know, four hours a day, like, I put effort in a little bit every day, even if it's just updating social media, or working on the website, because I do a lot of that stuff myself. Like, I've been teaching myself kind of everything that I can and every aspect of the business. So that way, as we go to hire people, I can tell like, Hey, you're gonna run social media. This is how I like to have it done. If you have any other ideas, like, let's grow it. But, you know, the more I know about every aspect of the company, I think the better it's going to be as we grow.

Jen Amos 7:42

Yeah, no, I think that's a great idea. I feel like, you know, for me, I work with a number of like virtual assistants, but I only started to delegate after I felt like I had the experience and understanding and the strategy. And so it was more about like telling them what to do than it was to like asking them to be my strategist, you know, it's like, I know what I want. I know it's best, I just don't have the time to do this anymore. I need to delegate it. And so I think that's yeah, I need that. Well,

Katie Peabody 8:08

whoever you're in off to is kind of like, alright, like, kind of tough, because you know, everything that you have to get done, but they, they have to figure it out, and you're trusting them to do it for you. So, yeah, it's a lot like I even struggle with it. You know, my dad and my husband, you know, come in and help me a lot. I have trouble delegating to them. And I trust both of them completely. But it's kinda like, You guys aren't seeing my vision the same way. So it's been a great lesson in communication for me trying to get this startup going. Yeah, so absolutely. My husband was the talker. I'm the listener. So now it's kind of pushing my boundaries, trying to communicate everything that I see for the company. Yeah. So that they may action it.

Jen Amos 8:48

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, my husband and I, we've been in business together, this will be our eight years. And it just like the biggest thing I have learned, at least for me is communication, you know, is being able to articulate like is to advocate for what I believe in and be firm and you know, the things that I believe can help us move forward. And just knowing our different roles and our strengths. It takes time. And you know that on top of like, you know, right now we don't have kids, but like, this is basically our child, like our business is basically our child at this point, at least until like we're so fortunate to have kids but either way, I in a way, I feel like we are equipped to have kids because of just what it takes to run a business

Katie Peabody 9:25

how many occasion you've built. How long have you guys been married? Eight years.

Jen Amos 9:29

So seven years, actually. Yeah, yeah. So eight years in business

Katie Peabody 9:33

together for a long time. Yeah. Working on communication all the time. It's awesome. Yes. Congratulations.

Jen Amos 9:39

Thank you. Yeah. And it was actually when we met he was actually referred to me as a client. I had a social media business like back in. I don't know it was like some time ago now. Like seven eight. Yeah, basically, like almost a decade ago, I had a social media business and he was referred to me as a client. And long story short, like I got to a point with my business where I was like, okay, I can either like keep trying at this or or I can just lean in and work, you know, full time with my husband. And so that was like a fun transition. I'm going to say that sarcastically and yeah, we made it, you know, I mean, we didn't make it make it we're not I don't consider us like millionaires or anything. But right. More importantly, like, we have been able to build like a sustainable business together. And, you know, it's not just us to like, we do work with a team. And we're very fortunate about that. It's just, it is like that constant like trying to figure out like, what hat to wear during the time of day. It's like, Are we right? Are we like business partners? Are we like husband and wife? And you know, are we co parenting our pets? Like, what are we doing today? What are we doing in this very second, and some, you know, the thing with my husband is like, for him, the the lines are all blurred. Like, he just believes like, this is our life, this isn't our family. And for me, it's like, I like to have the boundaries. It's like, I like to have a social life, I like to do things that are not related to work, so I can keep my sanity. But you know, fortunately, it's it is good to have like a really ambitious partner. You know, like, that's what I find very helpful, because I think that I don't think we would be as you know, effective or productive if at least one of us wasn't as ambitious as he is. So I am very grateful for that. But you know, it's a journey. And I'm just happy to hear that your husband is very involved with your business. Yes,

he's got about five years to retirement. So when my hey, if we can get this up and running, then you don't have to find a job after you retire, you could just come work with me. And we do that full time and go live in the mountains. And yeah, they take one. Yeah, no,

I hope that you all stick around. Because I, I know, like for my husband, he wouldn't want anything more than to like live in the mountains and like, have our kids be outdoors. So I hope that your business really, you know, takes off so that we can like, I it's like, it's cool, because with all the like a number of guests I've had on the show, they focus on, you know, serving kids. And I just think oh, these are like good things to keep tabs on like when we have kids and I can like reach out to these businesses and, and all that. But let's talk about the products that you hope to launch. I know you have like three layerable core products. Yeah, why don't we go through those and what you hope to launch in the springtime. Alright, so

hiking pants, that's kind of like that's my baby. Because as the thing I struggled with the most defined. So hiking pants is our number one, you know, that's the baby of the company. And we're looking to you know, add those who went through line and make them fleece lined so that way, they're a little warmer for winter. And then on top of that, we've got the sun hoodie, which is a long sleeve, lightweight, I actually just changed the materials in our tech packs, they're going to be bamboo. So it's a natural material. They're SPF or UPS because it's not sunscreen, it's a UPS material, that you know, kids don't get sunburned when they're wearing them, the hood comes up to cover as much skin as possible, their hands get covered. And you know, they're super lightweight, and you don't get too sweaty wearing them. And then in the wintertime, you can layer on top of them to keep yourself warm. And then the jacket that we would be releasing in our first launch is a lightweight hiking jacket. So you know, it's a light insulation layer. It's not meant to keep you warm in the winter months, but you can layer it under a puffer coat, or a rain jacket, you know, so it's it keeps you warm, especially for like spring summer hikes where you might get a light rain because we live in Washington State. And you never know when it's going to rain here. So you know, it'll, it'll keep the kid dry and a light rainstorm. It'll keep them warm enough on a cool spring day. But it's made for movement. So when you're out hiking and running around, they're not going to get cold, they're not going to get too hot. It's just a nice light jacket. And it works in a layering system. So winter time rolls around, we'll offer puffer coat, you know, in the winter, so they could go on a hoodie, light jacket, puffer coat, and then a hardshell like a rain jacket over the top to meet whatever challenges the weather is throwing their way. So it's options, it's layering, if you are into hiking or mountaineering, it's all the same layers that someone would wear on a mountain anytime of the year.

Yeah. I'm curious to know, like, why does this amazing opportunity opportunity exists? Like why is it that let's say, you know, most places that do sell outdoor gear don't offer this and sort of my my first assumption is, well, kids are going to outgrow it quickly. You know, that's sort of what goes in my mind. So what have you found in your research as to why, you know, like, this is such a great opportunity for you, you know,

and it is a great opportunity. And I've noticed a lot more of the bigger brands Cotopaxi, Patagonia, a couple of them have started adding kids stuff. But again, they only start adding kids stuff for five and older. So all the kids under five, there's not a lot options for him. So one of the things I've noticed with younger kids not having these options is that yes, parents are like they have determined that like, oh, kids are just going to outgrow it the like why would people spend money on it, but I want to offer a training program. So that way like you know, Hey, your lower income family or you don't want to pay full price for these items like hey, this one's slightly Use the kid hiked in it for a season, they outgrew it, here you go, it's half off. So you know, help keep stuff out of landfills and, you know, offer discounts on the people that trade their stuff in and offer discounted items for the people who don't want to pay full price for it. And don't mind it being slightly used. Yeah, and then, you know, finding materials that I can be better price points that because I'm not buying brand new it like recycled materials are great. The sometimes there's companies that charge double for recycled materials. So sourcing is always like I try to find the best deals that I can on my end. So that way I can keep a certain price point because I I don't make a million dollars a year I'm trying to keep keep stuff affordable for people because I know how important it is to me to find good deals on stuff. So yeah, you know that that's the plan. I think a lot of companies are just it's not a big enough market for them that they why bother? You know? Yeah,

that makes a lot of sense. It's it's the whole, like supply and demand kind of thing, where it's like if people are not demanding this, also, I think that maybe there's this perception for parents that we need to protect our babies, like for the first couple of years and not bringing them outdoors. And maybe that has part of it to do as well.

I disagree wholeheartedly.

Oh, yeah. I'm very well aware. And yeah, and I think like what I appreciate about, like, what you've been even sharing on your social media is the benefits of just having your kids outdoors. So tell us what that experience has been like, or at least with your socials like, you know, featuring your your kids and like what it means for them to be outdoors with you. Oh, okay. So

we were stationed in Germany. And then my daughter was fortunate enough to attend Forest School. So as you know, it's, you know, four and five year olds just running around in the forest all day. And I would volunteer there one day a week to help out. And just my favorite time, it was so great. Watching all these kids. They'd give kids like a little kind of dull hatchet or a saw, and they're like, go cut trees, go figure out how to do stuff. Yeah. And it was wonderful. So having the kids out there just their confidence soars when they're outside. They ask questions, they're constantly checking out different rocks and sticks and asking about plants. And would an animal eat this? Can I eat this? So you know, my now four year old at two, he could go out and identify different types of plants that were safe for him to eat those to my husband, you know, walking past something, he's like, Oh, that's a blueberry bush and my son, you know, at three years old goes dead. Those are huckleberries. Like, it's like, all right, he's, he's learning. He's remembering all of this stuff. Yeah. And they just soak it all in. And they're, you know, like I said, their confidence skyrockets, we came across a study that showed the average American kid and child in the UK spends seven hours a day on a screen. And my daughter was like, No, that can't be right. It was like the average kid. I was like, not you guys, the average kid. The average? Yeah. They gotta be outside a lot. And I was like, no, they're outside an average of two hours a week. So seven hours a day versus two hours outside a week. She's like, Why? Why are they doing that? So now she like makes it a point to try to invite her friends to come hike with us today. Now she's like, based in the car, can I bring in the neighbors? I was like, you can invite them. Like, you know, we can tell her whole family to come out. I don't care. I'll take anyone. And so yeah, you know, it's really cool. And my son, the youngest one, he is at the point now where he's like, are we going to the mountains today? Are we done with sports? Can we go to the mountains? I love that every now and then. You know, we'll have to divide and conquer my husband will take kids to the mountain all take kids to sports, you know, and then I just dread life while I'm sitting there. Like it's anxiety for me because I'm like, I'm inside. I need to be moving. Yeah, we we try to make it a weekly thing. So our homeschooling program Fridays is Mountain Time, no matter what my dad will meet us up in the mountains with the kids have been learning about avalanches and how to dig it avalanche pit and see if we're in a risky area for an avalanche and how much of it they're retaining. I've no idea but they're outside. They're moving around. They're digging in the snow. They're, they're playing they're hiking. They love it. It's great. So yeah, wouldn't for anything.

No, I think that sounds amazing. You know, most of my life I've lived in a city of sorts. So I definitely am one who doesn't go outdoors enough I even have this light therapy box for like indoor like fake light to kind of mimic like the sunlight in

Washington in the winter. So we have one also because it's just so dark and gray here all the time. Yeah,

absolutely. And you got me thinking about I have these friends at my church who it's funny because like they're in the film industry, but they grew up never having TV like the mom, the mom homeschooled them. And whenever school was down to like, just got go outdoors and these two friends I'm thinking in particular like they're very just they just seem very confident in themselves and very present and communicative and just in engaged in life and also to just know and also incredibly intelligent and I think that's like, from what I'm hearing that is part of the the benefit of like, you know, being outdoors because like you said, you have to engage with nature, like it's living, it's breathing, it's alive. And I feel like that's a difference between them versus like, you know, my other friends were in between our downtime at church, everyone would just be on their phones. And so you could just see like the clear difference between people who are looking up and trying to engage versus those who are just on their phone on like social media or like sharing the latest Tik Tok video, and there's a clear difference.

There is there is and it's, you know, the benefits is like, besides confidence, there are learning leadership skills out there, you know, they will take them up, and it's like, Hey, you're in charge today, you're making all the decisions, or my daughter, she she got lost in the woods, technically, she ran ahead of us stepped off the trail to go to the bathroom, when my oldest my 16 year old did his like, little whistle call that he does. And she wouldn't respond because she was embarrassed because she knows that she's not supposed to go off the trail without us being aware of it. So she didn't respond. And my husband and son passed her where she was on the trail, she gets back on the trail and goes the opposite direction that we were heading. Oh, no ads, works. initely I was hiking it two year old pace. So she ran into us. And she was like, Oh, good. You're still here. I was like, why are you coming back this way? Like, you're going the wrong way. And so she was like, Well, yeah, but I knew that you and Jamie weren't hiking fast enough. So I knew I'd catch you still. I was like, oh, yeah, but you know which way the car is and you were heading in the wrong direction. She was like, yeah, why I made a decision. And I stuck with it. I was like, okay, so we always like troubleshooting. Like, hey, what if you didn't run into me? What was your plan then? Like, so you know, we want them thinking, you know, that, that survival, and they each carry a small backpack that, you know, for her, she's got her lair, she's got water snacks, she's got a whistle. And she has a fire starter, because she we've taught her how to start fires at nine years old, you know, is enough for her to feel safe in the interim. And fortunately for her, that's a busy enough area that if she did get lost, another party would probably run into her. But it's you know, teaching them some basic survival skills builds their confidence, it builds their leadership and helps them make better decisions. And they don't get the decision fatigue the same way that someone who's constantly like sitting in front playing video games, because, like I say, video games are great to an extent, they can help build reaction time and help with decision making. But your decision fatigue is going to be there a lot faster. Because there's constant, there's feedback all the time you're Go, go go. We're in nature, one of the favorite things I have is when my husband's had a stressful work week with her. He'll be like, you know, getting snippy with people, especially me. And I won't even talk to him on the trail. And then you can see him about a mile in, there's like he relaxes, and then all of a sudden he's nice and is like, like everything that was bothering him is just gone. Like, it's so much better now. And I was like, I'll talk to you again. And part of that is because in nature, there's no hard shapes. You know, you're not looking at the rectangles of the building. You're not like, you know, none of the trees are the same. They're all kind of different edges and not everything flows and the sounds like I love hiking in the complete quiet. I like being able to hear stuff I like the different birds and the sounds of the water. And you know, even your feet crunching on leaves. I love it all. Yeah, you might have been wants to like sit there and look for like, hey, what can we go do that's gonna be really cool out here. Like, let's go climb that rock and the kids. Yeah. But I still have it. Because because my job like my husband grew up in a city like this from Chicago. I was a military brat. So I grew up everywhere. But my dad, being from Oregon, we always tried to choose somewhere where hiking was going to be easier to do. So we would go hiking every every Sunday and my job is to kind of teach the family how to do dangerous things safely. Whereas my husband wants to find the dangerous things for me to try to teach them how to do safely so Oh, I love that. He's like he's like to we rappelled down a waterfall. I'm like we can as I don't want to do kids but we can.

Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, I was even thinking about the relief that your husband gets like an hour into hiking and I imagine that also being the benefits of being outdoors as you get more oxygen you know, because you're around nature and it's a lot more you know, the the air is less polluted you know, because you're like away from the city even for a little bit so I imagine that really plays into the overall well being and health benefits of you know, being outdoors. What and we joke you know, I'm big into Uh, mountaineering so, you know, I've

climbed Mount Rainier and Mount Adams Mount St. Helens, and we joke I, after I climbed Mount St. Helens note, Mount Adams over the summer, my husband and I were getting on an airplane and I was feeling kind of lightheaded and fainted. And he was like, are you okay? I was like, I just have low altitude sickness. I was like, I need to get back on a mountain as soon as possible. That's been our joke now is like every time I start feeling not very good. I'm like, Hey, I just need to get up on a mountain.

That's like so like ironic, right? Because it's like, you have less oxygen as you go. Yeah, higher elevation. So I love that. You're just like, I just can't go on a mountain right now.

A mountain would fix this.

Yeah, you're like, I'm suffocating. I

need to go on a mountain. Too much air down here.

Yeah, no, I love it. Yeah, I mean, it's very admirable, like what your dad had set, you know, how he set that example for you the benefits of being outdoors. And I love how you have how you're passing that down to your kids. And then now, you know, you're you're really supporting other parents who have young kids that want to be taken outdoors, you know, with Kinder mountain and so so yeah, tell me a little bit about I know that you already have some things planned out for this year for 2024. So tell us like, I guess what you hoped the execution is going to look like, I know the launch is supposed to come out. And then you're supposed to go to a vendor event. Tell me the planning for that? Well,

that timeline has kind of been pushed back a little bit. So we were still trying to lock in our manufacturer. So you know, I talk to so many different companies, and I found some that I really clicked with, there's no way I could hit the price points. Like I wouldn't be losing money on every item. And I'm, you know, not trying to do that. Like, yeah, trying to be like super wealthy, but I'm also not trying to pay people to take my clothing off my hands. So yeah, you know, trying to find the right fit for a manufacturer has been my biggest struggle with getting this launched. I think I found someone but they're heading into Chinese New Year, because they're in Cambodia. So the pause for you know, about a month, and then hopefully, we'll pick back up and have our first samples back in April, early May. I think with the samples, I can go to my vendor show still and and you know, show the samples and do all of that. It's a huge show in Salt Lake City area. And we went last year just to check it out. It was last it was amazing. It was at a ski resort. And like my kids had so much fun just because it's outside. So of course, they're running around the rightness left to go up to the top of the mountain. And I was like, Yeah, we're gonna be here next year, as like, this is my goal. Were to set up a tent around booths here. And you know, even if we don't have anything besides some teat like screen printed T shirts and samples to show people were coming, so I will be there in June in Salt Lake City. So if you're in that area, come check us out. I don't know what ski resort we're at yet. But it'll be awesome no matter what.

Yeah, no, I love that determination. And, you know, I think that's sort of what we have to face as business owners are in your case, the startup is like, you have this ideal timeline. And then, you know, there's so many people that have to be involved that, you know, in this case, you have to push it back by month. And I think it's just part of the process of being a startup. Yep.

You just make it work, where you can plan for things to not go on the exact timeline you are playing, but you have to be flexible and adaptable and, you know, maintain a positive attitude about it. Because if I got really grumpy that, oh, it's Chinese New Year, like, that doesn't help anything. Like I can't control that. Like, like, cool. Like, I'm gonna research Chinese New Year now because I don't know too much about it. Like, I didn't realize it took a month off of work, but they do. So like, it's cool. Yeah. How do we institute like, have that in the US now? Like, I want to take a month off work. But I know wash, right?

Yeah, I'm always like, I know. I know very little about Chinese culture. But like for the friends that I do know who celebrate it. I'm like, I'm just like, wow, like, because I think Chinese new year starts later. Like, it doesn't start the same New Year as

February 10. Is what okay, I saw so

yeah, and I'm just like, I always around the time the year I'm like, oh, yeah, like it's it's technically a New Year for, you know, for China, but for us, it's like we you know, we're already like a month into the new year. So

months into the like January's lasted like 14 weeks already.

Yeah, it's like really? Yeah. And I also think like, the benefit of running your own business, and you kind of hinted at this earlier is just doing a little every day, you know, like the fact that you are persistent. And you're kind of building you're building one brick at a time sometimes if you're lucky two or three bricks at a time a day. And I think just that attitude in that, you know, consistency makes all the difference. Like one of my favorite books I read a long time ago was called The Slight Edge He talks about basically it talks about, like, the difference between successful people and unsuccessful people is just people who do the things, like do the little things every single day, you know, and if not every single day, just like, consistently, whatever that looks like for you, if that's once a week, that's once a week, if that's like, you know, maybe 15 minutes every day, then that's great, you know, but I do like that for you. This is a marathon, it's not a sprint. And even if you have to print out some, you know, examples by the, by the vendor event, then so be it, but you are building your building, so to speak, you are building it one brick at a time, even if you have something like the Chinese New Year. I can, that's gonna, like, hold, like push things back by a month.

Yeah, but it's, I mean, a lot of outdoor companies, they're, they're manufacturing in places that celebrate Chinese New Year. So it's not just me that's running into that issue. It's every outdoor company. So you know, like I said, just gotta roll with the punches sometimes. And yeah, like, like, it doesn't I mean, that's just money in my pocket for the month of February. So there you go. Yeah, I can save up some more to invest into the company. Yeah,

I think that's a good attitude to have. And it kind of reminds me of there was this Instagram post you shared with your kids and like about your kids, and like the number one thing they learn being outdoors and you that being out there as a parent is that to be a parent already is to deal with a lot of chaos, but it's a different kind of chaos outside? Can you can you elaborate on that? If you recall that post? Oh,

yeah. So I think it was, it was a post that was going around, I got to look at it really quick. Pull it up.

No worries.

But yeah, so you know, it's talking about, like, you know, life is gonna be chaotic. So you can choose where it's going to be chaotic, they can be tearing apart your house, or you can just have them in the woods, where they're just running around and wasting all their energy and not like hurting anything, you know, if they're breaking sticks, like it's okay, just just to be out there a lot of be chaotic on the trail, they wear themselves out, and you know, 90% of the time they pass out as soon as you get in the car. So you got your quiet time eventually. And when when they're outside, it's just, you know, they're using their body like it's intended to, at all, one of the things that that I've noticed is like the childhood obesity rates have have gone up drastically, you know, just in the past 15 years, the kids are just spending so much less time playing, like not even, you know, out in nature, just add a playground, in your backyard, doing anything that requires like movement. And, you know, it makes me sad, like I don't, I don't want to see kids having those struggles at such a young age. Like it doesn't take much effort to get out and go play like play is fun. You know, my kids even you know, I'm big into the I worked as a personal trainer for a long time before I started getting into more of the business aspect of life and the way either with my 16 year old, you know, he's like, oh, I want to go to the gym. As Eric cool. Do you want to lift weights? He's like, no, no, I don't want to lift weights. I'm like, so he'll just take a soccer ball and go like on the basketball court and kick a soccer ball around the whole time. And like, you know what you're moving, you're, you're doing something, it's working towards your goal of being a soccer planter. So like, you know, movement is so important to life. And, you know, if I can encourage, you know, just a handful of kids to get up and move more, it's like, I feel like that's a great start. Because they're setting these little milestones to be healthier in the long run down the line. And, you know, I, I just want to take all the kids out in the mountains, because like, I love seeing kids learning out there and seeing what they're capable of, and like, Oh, what happened? Like, what's under this rock? If I lifted it up? Oh, look at all these bugs, like, what kind of bugs are these? Like, let's check it out. So I'm constantly like, ask whatever questions you want to out here. I might not know the answers, but I can figure it out. Like, you know, we've got all sorts of, there's a great app that I used to identify plants and animals and bugs and snails and whatever. But it's called Seek, and you know, they can take a picture of something, and it'll tell them the regions where that plant is found if it's edible, like the scientific name for every whatever they want to know about it, they can look it up now. And you know, it's it's great, because there's so many things they can learn out there that just help them be a better person overall. So yeah, yeah, I'm all for it.

I love it. It's like mother nature helps you with the teaching, and also exhausting your kids, you know, and I just really appreciate hearing, you know, all the benefits and also how your family has especially benefited from it. And yeah, I'm just I'm just taking it all in and I appreciate, you know, just hearing hearing that. I was actually just

reading a book called guns, germs and steel is talking about how you know, Western culture. The kids spend time sitting at a desk, they spend time on screens, and they're they learn ways to learn, but they don't necessarily They understand how to learn. So then they compare him to like Aboriginal kids and, and the Aboriginal kids are outside doing stuff from a young age, you know, hunting, like learning how to hunt. They're learning how to build shelters and make their own weapons for hunting. And those kids are actually better. Like, they understand how to learn. So they're actually smarter. Like, if you compared their lifestyles, they're smarter, because they, they understand how you're supposed to be learning not like that you have to learn. And you know, like, as a homeschool parent, I'm like, Hey, like, I think it's important that you're learning stuff about how the world works. But I also think it's important that you're understanding how to learn and what you're capable of doing. Because it's going to translate to your schoolwork, or your schoolwork stuff is going to translate into the nature stuff. So like, let's just combine all of that, and you guys can be super humans, maybe one day, we'll

Yeah, yeah, it's like, it's a difference between just having knowledge versus applying that knowledge. And that's what it sounds like you're you want to instill in your kids is like, you know, like, be hands on with life. Like, you're better you learn better that way. Like, I don't think we were really designed to just like sit and take in information, you know, and it's like the difference between like reading a textbook versus going to the location that you're studying, you know, it just you just take it in a lot more differently, and it brings to life what is in the texts, you know, so I think that's, I think that's great. And I, you know, I just want to say kudos to you and your ambition to make Kinder mountain possible, I just want to wish you the best of luck with this year. I know, this is a big year for you. And I also just want to make sure that I've asked you everything I wanted to ask you or was there any is there anything you feel like I should be asking you that I haven't asked you yet? Not that I could think of good, then I feel like I've done my job. Awesome. I love it. Well, yeah. Katie, as we start to wrap up here, any closing thoughts? Before we go?

Closing thoughts? I'll share one of my favorite quotes is from Edward Abbey. And, you know, he's a big environmentalist, not in like a hippie way he's conservationists more or less. And, you know, his quote is, the average person will see more in hiking one mile than they will and driving 100 The so just some food for thought of like, you know, think of everything you see when you're on a road trip versus everything you see when you just go for a walk even in your neighborhood. And you notice small details about like, Oh, hey, like my neighbor's grass? Like, How'd they get it to grow that way? You know, just take it all in and figure stuff out and, and always be willing to be adaptable and flexible? Because that is how you grow a business.

Yes. I mean, I feel like it's a good lesson for life. It's especially important to be in business. Yeah,

that is true flexibility. Always be willing to learn stuff. Because, like, I went to business school, like I have a degree in business. I feel like everything I learned doing that degree, I'd learned nothing from that. I've learned more just sitting down and actually starting a business than I did doing four years of college for business. So amazing. Like, you know, I make it a point to sit here and like, teach myself a new skill at least every month, because, you know, why not? So yeah, for sure.

I think that learning and applied knowledge is life. It's lived on breathing, and I love it. Well, that was a great quote. I don't want to like one up that in any way. So I'm going to stop right there. You know, Katie, it was a pleasure having you on our show. Thanks again for joining us.

Thank you.