Not everyone can say "I own a town"... However, Mike Malcanas can. This week on In The Bunker Joshua sits down and talks with Mike about his adventure in business and how he is helping other businesses grow today.

Bio: Mike is the owner of a specialty Large Traveling Building insulation contractor focused Solely on the Largest Multi Unit Projects. We work with the Who's who of top apartment developer builders accross eastern US

Links:

• Website: https://www.mitoinsulation.com
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Olde-Towne-Overhaul-112848956950565
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelmalcanas/

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Welcome back.

Every business faces challenges, and we love to share those stories.

Today.

We have Mike milkiness in the bunker with us.

Mike was faced with the challenge of staying in business

through the great recession.

So many businesses can relate to having challenges and having dips in business.

But the great recession definitely stands out.

Mike has over 35 years of experience in the construction industry.

And he'll dive into that a little bit.

There's really so much to dive in here.

We were talking pre-show there's so much we can go through I'm just

super excited to dive in and dive into this topic a little further.

Welcome to the show, Mike.

Nice

to be here.

Let's get to know you a little bit further, what is your background?

Who are you?

How'd you get here?

I've been in mostly construction installation

construction to be exact.

So I've done installation, manufacturing, and installation

contracting for most of my career.

But recently I have been freed up Get into some real estate.

So we have done a bunch of single family, housing, rehab and rentals, and which

then has moved me into more real estate, which is from commercial real estate.

So I'm doing some redevelopment of an old mill town locally next to my businesses.

So it's all construction-related and I'm having.

Awesome.

Awesome.

It's always one of those things where, when when business lines

up with, if something you enjoy.

I'm not a big bookworm.

I like to read, but I'm not a big school book worms.

So I never, I don't make it far in the in college.

But I don't have, I don't have a fear of getting my hands dirty.

When it comes to renovating old houses or fixing old buildings and insulating

buildings I don't mind applying myself.

And getting in there with my guys to, learn and get things done.

So maybe where people be afraid of insulation and dirty buildings

it's an advantage of mine to not be afraid to get in there.

Yeah, I know.

That's definitely something for me personally, that sets

a lot of bosses apart, when a owner of a company or a manager.

Doesn't have a problem jumping in the trenches and helping out when it's

needed, not necessarily operating from the trenches at all times, but jumping

in, a little bit as the business needs and as the team needs, that shows the

willingness to get your hands dirty and understand the process a little further

and go through that, which is what.

I find that as a really great way of building camaraderie with

the men in the field and, your team, your staff, if you're to pump us to, you'll be

involved in the nitty gritty or to jump in when, the dirtiest work needs to be done.

You know what I mean?

I'm sure everybody like it's bothering them bosses.

They don't do that.

You know what I mean?

But when you are the boss who does that, they're like, wow, this boss

is a little bit different than.

When the shit hits the fan and people are happy to know that the boss was

there with them, cleaning things up with him and, I've always been like that.

I think that's why I have a lot, a real longevity and a real low turnover with

my key people.

Yeah.

I definitely think that's a huge key factor in that specifically in turnover.

I think it's also the element of, if you're in the.

Working on a bid as a business owner.

And you're working on a bid for a new project and you're

like, oh, this takes 20 hours.

And you have no idea what it actually takes.

You're going to back yourself into a corner.

But if you're like, yeah, I did that two months ago and it took

about four days to get this done while that's not 20 hours of work.

That's, that may be four days with five or six guys.

That may be a lot more time.

And we're talking multiples.

Of air

there.

Sometimes it's a disadvantage because you know how terrible the work is.

And then you put too much money on the job because you don't

want to, you don't want to do it.

Yeah.

That's true as well.

So I know, I know in your business you guys, during the recession,

obviously, That rocked your guys's business as, as well as many others.

What did that look like for you guys?

Yeah, what happens is, I had a fairly decent sized

business, five or 6 million.

But it was all over the place.

I'd, a real diverse customer base from all different, different

verticals in the construction.

But once construction, evaporated or housing starts to evaporated right by 75%.

You'll you, I giggle every time somebody cries that retail sales are

down a percent or two or something, or retail sales are flattered.

It's a retail apocalypse rights, I just laugh, you're like, oh, they're flat.

And it's an apocalypse, right?

The.

I feel when you're 73 quarters of your sales completely evaporate off the planet.

You just now that's an apocalypse, right?

We had some real soul searching to do, it was just like, okay.

You just, you could have lived, you were just like everything that had to go.

I had to go right here just like in a sinking ship and you're

just throwing stuff overboard.

Things got to go.

It's we're not going to make it.

If we don't deal with things, don't start to let you know, start going.

It's funny how, a year or two leave it when things were still going fine.

I had dreamt of throwing stuff overboard, but just never had the

nerve to take on such a challenge.

I would see the, an efficiency.

The thing we would do redundantly.

For no reason, just as such, that's what the last lady told me to do.

And that's how we always did it.

Then I'd walk into the next office and I'm like, are you doing the

same thing, the girl in the office next to you, we're doing right.

And they'd be like, because they're doing the same information,

the same data entry, right?

Just crazy stuff like this, I'm just, oh my God.

It's you just want to.

That's why I thought I need to just burn this all to the ground.

I know what to do now.

I've been in business long enough.

I said, but what do you do?

You're like, it's in the middle of the football game, like I can start

a new draft in the middle of the third quarter of a football game.

So you just could never make the moves.

So I got trucks.

Sorry, my alarm just went off here, got trucks, and deliveries and customers.

So you just could never make those hard decisions.

So once the recession came it it did obviously prod me along very quickly to

have to start making these decisions.

Then I always knew where the business needed to go.

But that doesn't, there's only 25 or percent of the, of my actual.

So I basically had to start jettisoning everything else, everything that

needed to go other than what I knew, where the business had to go.

So it was contracting, was installing installation versus manufacturing

installation, which was the bulk of the business for 20 years.

I had the.

Sending guys home and balling crux and all the mothballing warehouse

space that I didn't need and right.

Sending people home and rent, it was just portraits.

But I knew contracting was the way to go.

It was more margin was a bigger market, bigger, vertical, bigger marketplace.

I w I was better at it.

I could.

I could separate myself from competitors, right?

So they deal, there was a lot of ways I could differentiate myself.

I could beat like really large competitors at, at the game,

even early in the process.

So I knew that Hey, with some refining, this is, this could be some.

So that's what we had to do, but, it took me burning the forest, basically lighting

at a blaze with the help of the recession and then spending the next couple of

years systematically doing nothing.

The vest divested myself of every thing, non sales related

and spent my time in the field.

No chasing down these customers, right?

This chasing down this vertical saying, Hey, this is the future.

I divested myself from everything else.

And this is, like Columbus burning the boats, right?

There was no other, there was no going back.

I basically couldn't call any of the other customers.

I had mothballed that equipment, those machines I had sent those

trucks got repoed, had sent them back.

So there was no way to deliver material anymore.

So there was only.

This contracting and these new customers that I had hitched my wagon to.

And so I had to find more of them and, and sell to them to get my way up

and get my way through the recession.

And it wasn't easy because I'm in Pittsburgh and these customers are in

Boston and Philly and Virginia, which is, fairly irregular for an insulator.

Chasing customers in different states, but that's just the, that's where they were.

And that's what I had to go find them.

had to go get them.

Yeah.

I know so many businesses or business owners we'll talk about,

if I was to start over today, this is what I would do differently.

And you literally had sadly had that opportunity a little bit, in some sense.

And I know.

Business owners, oftentimes we'll look at, and if I was to start over

today, this is what I would do.

Or if I was to change things, I would, alleviate this or I

would get rid of this service.

And it's hard to make those decisions when you're profitable, when your business is

bringing in money and you, as the owner are making a decent income and things

are good and your employees are happy.

When things flip upside down and your business, you being open

a day is costing thousands of dollars out of your own pocket.

You quickly start to figure out where to cut things and how

to make things more efficient.

And it sounds like that's a lot of really what happened through, through this.

Yeah, and I, and and I had a good business, like I said, and

I made a good living and I was by no means, starving, and I was doing well.

Yeah, but th the effort and the time spent to generate the amount of money that I

was making, it was a young man's game.

So sure.

If I could stay 25 to 30, that type of energy for the rest of my life, then sure.

Then I guess it'd be fine.

They used to while ours today, and you could generate a good living.

But you know what.

Although the recession was the most painful thing and, a blow to my ego and

just a complete, disaster, at first.

It was the best thing that has ever could possibly have happened to me.

It was just one big disaster and took all of my lumps, all of the pain that

I could have had on the businesses and just condense that all into a

year and a half or whatever that was.

And just, okay.

You're just take all your torture and all your pain right now.

Get rid of every possible thing.

And then it just.

Everything was gone.

All the fat was gone.

All of the negative energy was gone.

All the redundancies were gone and then it was just me and those five or

six key people and the future and the new business venture and the, low,

efficient, overhead, with the new business model and like the margins on the new

business, like bust first year in, I was already making right the same margin.

That I was making it for 20 years and the old business ran that.

I mean a year in, wow.

So by, by the third or fourth year it was, I was triple the margins.

And I couldn't get any, I couldn't get past five and 6 million after 20 years.

That's right.

It went just from, it just went 4 million and then 6 million and then 8 million and

then 12 million and the right, it just went because I was just in the right zone

and the right business and the right, and this is with me putting in like less

than like less and less effort right.

Each year.

So it's, it's now, and I.

All right.

Then if the business still runs, it's the same people that I divested all of my time

and energy to back during the recession.

And they're all still there.

They're all still running and doing all the paperwork.

I kinda just sit on top and, but all those customers are there that I spent

those two or three years cultivating and finding they're doing such a great job

that we're, it's repeat business now.

Which is one of the reasons we got into that business because we knew.

If you did good work, you could get this repeat business.

So it's not a lot of constant new, low margin work.

It's a lot of big repeat.

I It's still not guaranteed repeat work, you do a really good

job, but a really good customer.

And, you tend to get, we tend to get a lot of repeat.

And that has afforded me to move into the positions that I am, which is buy

and remodel a hundred, four closed homes, which we have built out and

renovated, which I spent three or four years doing that, which was a super fun

and exciting time, which then gravitated me into buying a town of 50 buildings,

which I have 50 retail spaces downtown, which I am now actively in the middle.

You're buying out and building and leasing and building out spaces in the town.

After that, we, my businesses in now.

That's cool.

it's the element of allowing you as a business owner

to step away from the business.

There's this element and I've discussed this with other guests,

but there's this element of if you can't take a 30 day vacation, You

don't own the business owns you.

Yes.

I could never have done that pre recession.

Now I used to think because my phone rang all the time and I was so actively

involved in a business, then I thought, okay, then that made me a success because.

Yeah.

All right.

Hey, look at me.

Look, my phone never stops ringing.

Everybody is calling me every second.

It was a, I tell you what the quiet an adjustment.

After you worked through the recession, I spent a couple of years with,

I, doing all of the adjustments necessary and then, all the sales,

generating the business and stuff.

And then it came a point when.

No.

I went back to the office and like nobody needed me over there.

There was nothing for me to do.

I was gone for a couple of years.

Everybody had buckled down, took care of everything.

And I'm just walked around over there.

I'm like, nobody was asking for my baby.

So you.

You did feel lonely and left out, with a real kind of don't

you guys need me over here?

And they're like no, we're fine.

We've got me, so you want to go back and metal, at first that was my first

inkling, but I knew it went wrong.

I'm like, no, look, you're out.

You're where you've always wanted to be.

You're disconnected, man.

It's just get out of the office and don't go back there.

There's nothing back there, but paperwork and, things that you hate, which is why

I wouldn't want to spend other time doing other ventures with the single families

and the other properties because I could, which I never could have done, that just

disappeared for, they of course call me and, problems or issues or whatever, but

it's, it's wonderful to be involved in.

So now with.

And then I of course, started a brewery in the town that I

started right before COVID.

That was like starting an airline right before September 11th.

You know what I mean?

2001.

So that was not really, that was not a really great business idea of

mine.

You know what I mean?

It was a great idea.

Just the timing which.

Who could predict?

It's oh, there's going to be a worldwide pandemic coming.

That's never happened.

That's impossible.

But it's actually been a really great catalyst for the town.

It's like the showpiece that's when everybody comes down to the town for, it's

why I rent all the buildings, but it is certainly a challenge to keep it operating

efficiently under those circumstances.

But it is actually a necessary evil to showcase.

The town and, but you know what it can be, and it's fun to own a brewery too, but

then yeah.

Yeah.

That's cool.

That's cool.

So it's a lot, like my manufacturing, the fed takes all

my time and doesn't make as much, it doesn't make any money, but

I've reverted back to the old ways.

I'm not.

Yeah.

I But at the same point, it's still something that it's.

Not on the large scale necessarily that, the other manufacturing was

potentially, and it's also something that

is a very small hobby.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Which is good.

It's good stuff.

So what would be your advice to someone who is recovering from.

Obviously, everything over the past, two years or so, that's been going

on with COVID, so many restaurants and service-based businesses and

contractors have dealt with being closed for periods of time and trying to

figure out where do they go from here?

And it's not necessarily a full-on recession per se, but it's,

some industries have definitely felt more or less the same.

Yeah.

I think the supplies pretty much at any time I am in the brewery

business hospitality business.

So although I'm not a restaurant tour and I'm still learning and certainly

in that arena also, But there's just, there's only one way out.

And then you gotta sell your way out of everything.

So in the restaurant business, we are, events, it's just, we're just spending our

time setting up one event after another rank, trying to it's drag queen bingo.

And then it's wrestling studio wrestling something rather.

And then, if he's just had, like girls just coming up with any.

Outdoor dog days.

You know what I mean?

On the, this and live music and it just, like corn hole tournament, is there

anything setting up food, pairings and beer, food and beer pairings, right?

It's just, Hey, you got to sell your way out of, you gotta bring people in.

You got to have some kind of event to have people come in and

free beer, eat food, be together.

Of course that works at anytime.

I hear business owners belong to a couple of different business groups,

tab and entrepreneurs, organization, and yeah, entrepreneurs are always business

owners are always complaining about the bog down in the weeds, in my office.

And I can't, it's and so divesting yourself.

Of all non sales related activity, finding somebody to do that is so much easier than

finding some mythical unicorn sales guy.

Who's going to come save the day and sell your way out of the problem.

There are no, there are no mythical sales unicorns, right?

Those are you, the business owners, us, the business owners.

We are those guys.

There aren't any other, these magical guys.

So it's like our time can't be spent in there managing spreadsheets,

looking at daily reports.

We have to be out there engaged with customers and finding these new

opportunities meeting with all of these.

New opportunities and, trying to bring in these new, big accounts and big customers.

And once I did that, once I stopped, you have nothing else to do.

There was just no other excuses.

It's you couldn't go back to the office.

You had to go.

I just, every single day, I just drove out of town every Sunday night I left

town and I just stayed out there and going from one customer, looking for one

opportunity after another, or, I knew I had last time I did that when I was 20

or whatever 19, this is a new sales guy.

But, Hey, it was a shock when you're 40 doing that or a 45, but Hey, as a

business owner that's the only way.

And that worked like a charm because it was when you're the business owner

and you have passion and you have the need to change your business.

Nobody can sell like you, nobody has that type, but you can exude that type of.

Passion and commitment for your business.

And everybody wants to be dealing with the business owner.

Everybody wants to know the business owner, right?

People don't want to be fluffed off by some new, salesmen of the day.

You know what I mean?

Okay.

Salesman of the day, whatever.

But people love to, oh, you're the owner.

Come on in, let's talk to them.

See what you can, so it made a huge difference.

It totally transformed my business.

Quintupled my, bottom line when tippled my top line.

And I have value, I sit on top of now, five functioning businesses.

And I still go to work whenever I want or not.

And it's completely opposite of it was 10 years ago during the recession.

And that's all because of.

Divested.

The great recession made me divest myself of everything.

And I just spent my time, focusing my sales on, obviously

I'm the right vertical.

So you gotta have the right business vertical to go to, but that

would be, that'd be my advice for everybody, for any business owner.

And I see them all of the time, make excuses on why they can't do that.

I can't do that.

Nah, I gotta be in the office every day.

Maybe flipping through these papers.

And I just hear my friends of mine, like personal business owner, friends

of mine, making excuses of why they just can't leave the office.

I gotta be in here.

Okay.

Then that's why you're never going to get a lot of sales.

Yeah.

I'm you and I connected via tab.

And one of the think it was either one of the members or our tab

Group leader was talking about basically having a, not to do list.

And he goes, you need to have a not-to-do list and you're not to do list should

be longer than your to-do list, always.

And it's all the things that you're not supposed to do, that you need to

hire someone or find someone else in the company to take off your plate

because you shouldn't be doing that.

And it's.

Yeah.

And it's essentially the same thing of what you're saying.

It's finding all those elements that you shouldn't be doing, moving

them off your plate and having someone else take care of them.

And I know, you think about if it's a task that you do every Friday and it

takes two hours and you spend one time, training someone or you train them,

every Friday for a month, and now they take that task and they're gonna do.

For the life of them being with the business.

Now you've freed up two hours and then you do that again and again.

And your schedule instantly, comes to the point where you walk

in the office and everyone goes, what the heck are you doing here?

You're not supposed to be here.

Get out of the office.

I

joke with my engineer, but my engineer, business owners,

and I tell them all the time they're at a disadvantage, right?

I'm like a high school dropout with no college degree, credentials

and they're an engineer.

So they're better at everything that everybody so they can never

leave the office or delegate anything because they're so much.

Everything, every piece of paper and making every schedule and, he didn't

do it, all the estimates and stuff.

So I'm not burdened with that.

So I figured that everybody is probably more educated than me

and probably can do it better.

So it's very easy for me to delegate pretty much anything.

All I can do is go out there and sell stuff and convince people to buy things.

So it's, for me, it's very easy.

But when I tell other people that we like, oh my God, no, I

can't, I, I can't delegate that.

I can't delegate that, but I think it's but yeah, there was one.

I think it's good advice.

And most people would benefit from most business owners, whether

it's seriously benefited from it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I know.

It's definitely something for me and my business.

I tried hiring a salesperson a while ago and it is the most challenging

thing as a small business, because like you said, you're trying to

find that unicorn, you're trying to basically find you, you're trying to

find yourself who is going to work just as much or more than you work for.

The same amount of money, less or commission.

And it's not possible because if that person exists, they

probably have their own business.

And they're probably doing something similar that you are.

And so it, like you said, they did, it's finding a unicorn.

It's going to be almost impossible.

And you're competing into you and everybody else in the world.

So hopefully you got a lot of money.

You got to hang when you do find them, it's going to be you against

the old field, the begging for the old fighting for this guy.

And then of course he knows it.

He knows that he's the one good sales guy and he's got a hundred opportunities.

It's very difficult to, yeah.

And that's

not going to be not going to be cheap.

Yes.

Awesome.

Super good chatting enjoy the conversation.

And I think there's a lot of really good elements here.

Know that business owners can digest and process through.

And I know, both the aspect of getting rid of all the things off your plate

that you shouldn't be doing, and on the sales side, as well as is really

good thinking through the aspect of.

What are things that your business might not be a good

idea that your business is doing?

Maybe it's a service that the business is offering.

You don't necessarily have to go through a recession to eliminate a

service or change verticals or do that.

It's obviously a little easier when the businesses not making money to shift

directions, but if the business could potentially change and be exponentially

better, That's something to consider.

We do, oh, we do one thing now.

And I did, they used to that used to be, we do everything for everybody.

And I used to think that was actual, the way to go.

Hey, the more things I can do for people, the more opportunities

I have, but it was the worst.

And I still hear people say that it's like the worst possible strategy you can have.

We pick one vertical.

I do one thing only.

We do big wood apartments.

Only anybody calls me, I put it on my business card.

We put it on our phone.

I go, if you're calling for anything other than a big wood apartment,

don't even leave a message.

You know what I mean?

Oh I guess you're not going to come give me a bit on my garage.

I'm like, okay.

So I guess I won't leave a message then it's yeah.

Don't bother because I'm just telling you right now, don't leave it.

Bother us.

This is all we do.

It's we don't do it all.

We don't do small, big wood studs.

It's all we do.

We say it, we put it on our shirts.

It's on our mind.

You know what I mean?

People would just like, how can you be so arrogant that's all you tell people.

It's look, this was, this is all we do.

So don't even bother with anything else.

It's what we're good at.

It's there's enough customers that do this.

And the good news is when those customers hear you singing that particular month.

It's like angels are singing and bells are ringing in their ears.

They go, oh my God, this guy is exactly what I need.

I don't want Joe Schmo from Eskimo who does everything for everybody.

Only this guy who does only big, giant wood apartments

that has an army of insulators.

And that'll work seven days a week on my job.

Cause that's all I do is big giant apartment buildings.

And I want a big giant apartment building insulator.

So it's like music to his ears when he hears my shtick.

Which then very gets them interested really quickly.

And then the differentiator differentiates me very quickly.

So if I have a good piece of advice, I would give to any business owner, simplify

your business down to the smallest shortest, vertical, what's the most

profitable vertical that has the biggest marketplace you have, and focus on that

one the most and just makes life so much.

And it's exactly that it's focused.

It's, I've heard that as well from people that they're like, oh, you just

feel, you feel, overconfident, or it feels just that you're coming off.

And you're just like, oh, we won't work with you.

The person who has a garage, like we won't work with, it's, you're focused,

you're laser focused in what you're doing in business to the sentence

that, Exactly what your customer needs.

Exactly what your customer, is going to be asking, the questions they're going

to ask, the elements that they if you had to quote every type of house build

and every possible state in the U S then.

The number

you're missing everything.

You're constantly doing shit wrong.

You're constantly, always, oh, she's I missed that.

Oh, I didn't know about that.

I didn't do it.

Whereas now I know everything there's no, I never run into anything new,

every job we bid, we always, we know the answer before, before, even

the people you'd ask the question.

And I

imagine that you can almost get to the point now with a project.

Focus like you guys are aware.

If someone comes to you and says, this is the rough square footage of the building,

you can probably say, okay, this is a rough window price range based upon

your just generic square footage, where.

If it's, oh, it's a five story building.

Here's the square footage or this many units or whatever that looks like.

They can give you some very basic details and you can at least probably ballpark

that enough so they can start to figure out what that's going to look like.

Obviously you guys probably look at your drawings and all that

plenty of variables, but yes.

You can there's no doubt you can.

The less variables you can have in construction well, in any business, right?

Rolling there and find a whole bunch of, mystery.

Oh, I didn't know how to do all that.

That's going to cost me another 10,000 or whatever rhinestone

and it makes a huge difference.

Hey that's I learned that from good to great, that's number three item.

It's like the hedgehog concept, right?

It's The hedgehog that he's good at one thing, rolling up on a ball

and stick around his little spines and fighting against whatever, any

predator and nobody can beat it.

He was like, Hey, he just sticks with it.

He goes, it works, stick with it.

So we like it.

This is what we're good at.

If I'm the business, I'd find one good customer vertical, and I would stick

with it until it doesn't work anymore.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Super true.

Super good.

Good to great.

That's a good book.

Definitely.

If you're an entrepreneur or a business owner and haven't read,

it would highly recommend it.

Grab it from Amazon, your local bookstore or local library.

That's also a good option as well.

So

some strategies, my other favorite, I have not read that one.

That is my second favorite.

The other one has helped me build my whole contracting business

model.

I devised basically from my book because it was just fantastic.

Got it.

That's good.

That's good.

Awesome.

It's been super good chatting.

Appreciate the time.

What is the number one spot for people to find you online?

Presently it's Old town overhaul is my latest business venture.

So that's what we're spending most of my time.

So you can check us out on Facebook.

That's where we were posting most of our stuff, so that's old town over home.

O L D E.

And so that's old, wouldn't an in town.

Wouldn't be overhaul.

Cool.

And

I'll grab, make sure to grab the link to that.

And we'll have that in the show notes as well.

And then show all the buildings that we're rehabbing

and they'll projects we're doing.

And that'll link you to the brewery that we're doing in town and shows

you and realize that when you try to fix up buildings in the town ended up.

Fix the whole time.

So I have to fix the whole structure of the town and elect the right

councils and make parades and clean the town and fix the buildings.

But yeah, it's been very fun and challenging at the same time.

That's

cool.

That's cool.

Awesome.

Appreciate you having you on the show and your time with us today.

Thanks

Josh.

Nice talking to you.

Thanks for listening to this episode of, in the bunker.

As always we can be found on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter

at, in the bunker podcast.

Be sure to share this episode and what you're going to apply from it.

And how that can affect your business, make sure to tag us in that post so

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But before you go.