Film Center discuss WGA and SAG concerns including pay, healthcare, and the exploitation of actors' likeness through body scanning technology. The difficulties of becoming SAG eligible as challenges in maintaining health insurance, marketing through social media, and the financial impact of the strike on studios. They address concerns about AI replacing jobs and the importance of being part of the union. They discuss the impact of the strike on podcasts and independent films and concludes with perspectives on solidarity and the complexity of the situation. Listen in as the Film Center talks about the depths of this strike!

this is Film Center, your number one show for real entertainment industry news.

No fluff.

All facts.

Now here are your anchors, Derek Johnson II and Nicholas Killian.

Hello everyone.

Welcome to Film Center, your number one place for entertainment news.

My name's Derek Johnson ii.

I'm Nicholas Killian and Nicholas, what are we talking about today?

Today we are talking about the SAG after strike.

The SAG strike, which is, so as of this recording, it is July.

And SAG has recently decided to, well actually they decided did last month,

but now officially they are on strike.

Yeah, with the W G A I honestly believe that , if the D G A would've

not settled their stuff with the producers and would've gone on

strike with the writers and sag this , strike would be over already.

, as a director, why do you think , they didn't do that?

' cause they get what they wanted.

It's that easy.

Yep.

, why do you think that the studios decided to say, okay, the directors are the people

that we want to give what they want?

Ego, instead of not give the writers what they want and not

give the actors what they want.

Some form of ego, I suppose.

, a lot of the studio executives kids, They wanna be directors, so

they just give 'em a free pass, like, oh, you're direct this movie.

And so Really?

Yeah, dude.

Totally.

I have, I'm not gonna name these studios, but, but I have been on sets in which

high up executive that's like the president or c e o of certain studios,

I Been on their sets as, key grips working on , their films and they're just

there just 'cause they want to be there.

Most people would fight to the nail to get this job and they just

kinda like have it right, because they're who of who their parents are.

I've only done it three times and after a third time I was like, this is enough.

And I actually now, before I go on set, I'm like, , who is

this person who's directing?

Because usually they're so terrible at it.

, I don't mean like, not only artistically 'cause this is, that's

kinda like a form of opinion, right?

. These people drink and are very intoxicated while they're directing.

Really?

Yes, very intoxicated.

I've been on like not only alcohol, on other substances that will be

unnamed, and it's kind of weird.

So how does the movie keep going forward?

Well, if they're so intoxicated, well, that, that's a

phenomenal question, Nicholas.

So basically I'll give you a specific example I was with, I'm wondering

how specific I can get with this.

, I was with a studio that is known for not making great movies.

. Okay, that's as close as I can get.

But that's the point is to not make a good movie.

What do you mean it's not the point to make a good movie, Nicholas?

I'm trying here.

I'll try.

So basically there are some studios out there where studios being plural, right?

They who try to make movies.

That are bad because it makes the movies that are actually coming out,

, it's like an advertisement for them.

, I also heard that studios make movies so that Hollywood keeps talking about them.

Yeah, basically.

So in this example I'll just, just to, just to be on, I'll say it

was a, it was a water-based film.

And because it dealt with water.

Water, yeah.

It dealt with water.

This, I, this is as close as I can get.

That's it.

, I can't get any further.

, because if I give you any more details, I feel like people are gonna know

exactly what we're talking about.

, I feel like I already know what you're talking about.

You do.

, I came home and I've told you these, some of these stories before.

Remember?

'cause I was like, oh yeah, they just dumped the water on the chick and she

didn't even know she was gonna get wet.

Remember I told you that?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

, she was all dolled up with bacon and stuff like that, and this director was like, oh

yeah, we're just gonna dump water on her.

I was like, oh, she didn't bring a change of clothes.

Like, are you gonna tell her?

He's like, nah, nah, nah, it's gonna be great.

I'm like, what?

Are you serious?

He was like, yeah, I just need you to set it up and don't tell her if you tell her

you're fired, and like, really, I don't wanna be fired, man, I have bills to

pay so, She was not happy, regardless of which, getting back to the point, right?

What will happen is that these directors, quote unquote directors, , somebody's

kid, they will go and hang out with the actors and talk with them or do whatever.

Well, we're actually out here doing everything.

The DP is the one making the shots and calling the shots.

And it's like the DP is basically the director in this

situation is working with.

The key grips and stuff like that to actually get it done.

And then the director hobbles out of wherever he's coming from

and he is like, oh, okay, yeah, yeah, I guess this looks fine.

Action and cut.

And they just leave again.

They have no care because you would think it would be the actors that of

these high producers and presidents.

I'm sure a, plethora of them do wanna be actors and actresses too.

But in my experience, it's directors.

I usually wanna be directors.

I think at one point in time it was the actors.

It used to be like that where they used to wanna be actors and actresses

and now everyone wants to direct.

Why the shift?

'cause it seems like it's the most powerful position.

You gotta think about it like this.

Like that's simple, huh?

If my dad's the president, I want the best position, and if the best position isn't

acting, then I wanna be the director.

But the actor gives you the most exposure, if you're narcissistic or you're ego.

Yeah.

Thing ego, ego driven thing.

In, in today's world, there are so many influencers that

are just as famous as actors.

So it's like the prestige of it has has dropped significantly.

True.

I think that's part of the reason why the producers.

We're probably a lot more lenient with the Director's Guild.

That is my theory.

That is not confirmed.

Let's not pretend like a billion and a half people locate grandfather.

Then me and Nicholas were unfortunately not one of the grandfather people.

We weren't lucky enough.

We're just a bunch of country bumpkins that happened to have talent.

Right, right.

And accidentally bump into somebody.

. Anyway, so the strike does involve two major unions, right?

SAG AFTRA and the W G A.

? And as of today, I.

July 17th, 2023.

About 160,000 actors, voiceover artists, singers, and other performers.

And the W G A, which represents, about 11,500 screenwriters TV writers

and video game writers, which is a significant help at 11,000 is a

way different number than 160,000.

. It's a significant help.

, it's about pay, it's about ai, , it's about technology., residuals,

streaming, royalties, healthcare, diversity, inclusion, workplace safety.

And since our last W G A Episode, there has been a lot of inappropriate

talk coming from the producers where they're like, we're going to starve you

out and we don't care about you guys.

, you would just think a stereotypical, cartoon villain

would say comic book villain, right?

, we're just gonna wait till they're starving.

When they come crawling back to us, , they weren't gonna give 'em a worse deal

'cause they have to take something right.

The So, which is an insane thing to say to strikers, especially in Hollywood.

It was reported by deadline on July 12th that the article claimed that

the producer's union was waiting.

For the W G A to fail, they wanted to run out of money.

They wanted to bleed their war chest dry.

, obviously the quote was considered vile and cruel.

, they were like, yeah, we're going to starve them out till they are out of

their apartments and they're homeless and . Ron Perlman comes on social media.

The man, the myth, the legend.

Hellboy.

. Is like, so you know, there's multiple ways for you to lose , your house.

Now the producer remained unknown and unnamed, I guarantee

for obvious reasons, right?

They were at dinner or lunch or something like that.

His friend is in Dateline, before all the politics stuff, right?

They're just hanging out, chilling.

He tells 'em what the producers are really thinking and what they're

really planning, and then he runs the story and I'm sure his producer friend

is like, dude, why'd you do that?

What are you doing, man?

What?

I told you that like as a friend, that's a incompetence, but like

when you say something so vile like that, are your friend who's gonna be

like, , I can't, dude, , I'm obviously like questioning our friendship.

That's really evil.

People have friends, they have families.

Yeah.

They have kids.

Yeah.

And you're just like, you don't care.

, I cannot believe that after all this is over, the writers and

the actors are gonna go back to working with those same producers.

Yeah.

Like nothing ever happened.

It's been more than 60 years since the actors and writers

joined forces on the picket lines.

I just wish it was a king adora situation with the D G A.

That's all I wish.

But like really with SAG and writers, it might just be enough.

. And do you know the crazy part about the last time?

That the writers and the actors got together.

You know?

Who was the Screen Actor's Guild?

President Ben Who?

Ronald Reagan.

Ronald Reagan.

That's right.

Ronald, oh my gosh.

Ronald Reagan.

Ronald Reagan was the Screen Actors Guild president at the time.

The only president, the only actor president.

I, well, no, that's not true.

Trump has actually acted in stuff before, so I guess

technically we've had two actor.

Presidents.

He's not, he wasn't really classified as an actor prior

to, he was like a reality star.

Yeah.

Turn president.

, does Trump have a SAG card?

Reality tv That's still acting.

You still would, you still would get a card from that?

Yeah, I guess so.

Yeah, dude.

Is is Sag Trump is SAG man.

Yeah.

I, I've never thought about that before.

I'm kinda rethinking.

How Wow.

How much, yeah.

Trump, Trump would have to be sad, right?

He would have to be, and not only that, he was also in, he's also been in movies.

He was in home alone too.

Right.

That's the only way they would let him film home alone too.

Yeah.

Is if he was in the film right.

As he was in the movie and he's been in other movies.

Yeah.

So Trump's sagged, Trump has to be, sagged is Trump's.

I wonder if he's still active.

I have no idea.

, he was president, so probably not,

, interestingly, there's a lot of people online defending studios, and I'll

just say this right now, you're not gonna get hired for defending a studio.

Right.

They have billions and billions of dollars.

You're not gonna get any brownie points, no one's gonna give you anything.

Defending rich people, I don't know what it is, this mentality

that's going on right now.

A lot of 'em are like, , actors get paid, , average 27.

75 an hour.

Yeah, but that's like for that week or for that month.

, it's not a full-time job where you are working 40 hours a week.

It's not a consistent basis.

This is a medium, meaning that there's a bunch of actors

that you don't see who get.

Paid way less.

And those actors up there that are earning like a hundred million dollars, they're

throwing off the balance significantly.

And you see those posters and it's like you could earn up to $20 an hour doing

this job, but what they don't tell you is you only work like 10 hours a week.

Right.

And if you were to spread it out, To a full-time job, you'd

be making like $10 an hour.

Right, exactly.

If you did it.

, it's not designed to be that way, but yeah.

Actually usually only get somewhere around 50% of the checks anyway after

their agents and their managers and their lawyers have taken everything.

There are some actors out there who get paid a lot.

Not gonna act like there's not the rock being one of them.

Last year making $270 million, he claims that most of it actually came from his

business ventures outside of acting.

Right.

But if they're legally a subsidiary of his, his production company,

that rents him out as an actor.

Right, right.

Then technically, I guess they would be.

One and the same.

, you're splitting hairs, right.

, he doesn't need an agent really.

That's how big the rock is, right?

Right.

But most actors do.

Most actors need help finding work.

Most actors are straight up background actors.

Yeah, like statistically, like that's how that works.

When Fran Drescher went before the studios , background, actors, , one

of the conditions that the studios wanted to pay you one time, body

scan you, and then use your likeness and image and voice indefinitely.

Throughout the universe and all through the dimensions, get paid

once for that and get paid one time.

And then it essentially you doing an unlimited amount of roles past your death.

Right.

And you only get paid once.

Right.

That's, that's like they were saying it's all these elderly people

who think that AI is just magic.

And then they just keep throwing money at the problem thinking that it'll fix it.

, let's say the actors agree to that, right?

Which they wouldn't once.

They wouldn't.

But in this example, let's say they did.

Now all that work.

Falls upon the editors and the visual effects artists just

'cause you body scan them.

Doesn't mean they just move by themselves.

Right, right.

Or doesn't make the movements look realistic.

Now all background actors are gonna be c g I.

That's gonna be terrible.

Either they're gonna spend any money to make those c g I

background characters look good.

No, no, no.

And then they wonder why people aren't going to the movies.

, you could stream it for $19 a month or you could go spend, if you're taking a family,

you have the husband, the wife, and the two kids.

That's like a hundred bucks right there for to see one movie.

Right.

And then knowing for a fact that that movie out there, if it's not

Marvel, it's just gonna look like.

Not good.

Basically, it's just, it's just gonna caret.

Right.

The fact that these actors, they have to make $26,000 a

year to get healthcare, man.

Yeah.

So let's say that you're a full-time actor and you don't get hired every month.

You're not gonna make this almost $30,000 a year to to qualify for health insurance.

So you're still gonna get paid, you're getting paid like 20 K a year and you

don't qualify for health insurance.

So if something happens, it's too bad.

. You should not join SAG , until you're ready to join sag.

Do non-union until , They'll kind of force you to be in the union.

Yeah.

I remember when I directed a short of mine recently that was sag, but, and it was

like, okay, well, If you're non-union, this is about to be a SAG project.

You have to do so many union projects before you're sag, right?

You also have to get vouchers, right?

You have to get SAG eligible vouchers, right?

Vouchers.

And a lot of this is, a lot of this is like a catch 22.

How can I get SAG vouchers if I can't get on SAG productions?

Yeah.

So what you usually end up doing, which is what I did, which is you have to

know somebody and you have to go do some extra work on a SAG production.

Usually it's like a Disney show, Disney, and they'll give you something

that has a lot of background actors, like a, like Any zombie show.

Right.

They'll give you these SAG voucher.

. And you have to get three of those.

And then you can go to, 'cause I went to the office to be like, Hey, am I eligible?

Just to make sure.

And they're like, yeah, it'll be three grand.

I was like, no, no, no.

I'm not trying to pay for it right now.

, , I even have a teacher of mine who is one of the best makeup artists in the game.

His name is Robert Maverick.

This man has been doing this over 33 years and he is struggling to get healthcare.

, it's wild.

, the details to keep healthcare.

'cause there's a certain amount of hours, right.

That you have to have as well, right.

To keep this healthcare.

It's almost as if it's like that time of which like, oh, making

movies is fun and you like it and there's money that's kind of behind.

Right.

That's kind of over with.

, it's kind of like how flying used to be a whole event.

Right.

Yeah.

Used to have dinner.

Used to be glamorous, right.

And drinking and champagne, and wearing suits and cocktail dresses.

Now you see everybody at the airport in sweats with headphones.

Don't talk to me.

Don't right now it's like, it's like taking a, a airbus, right?

Basically.

But, and obviously they want more representation for more people.

We just saw the , the new Transformers movie?

Yes.

The leads are Hispanic and African American.

The strike has happened.

Now no promotions are available, right?

Right.

Actors can't do any promotions, can't do anything.?

Who are they going to go to next for their promotions?

, what Disney did is they, they hired.

Mascots.

Yeah.

Or like characters.

Yeah.

To promote their productions.

And then what other studios are doing is they're going to like TikTok Creators.

Yeah.

To have their productions be marketed.

, I remember I was watching a video of Elemental Disney's Elemental.

I have not seen Disney's Elemental.

, their marketing team , made a fake video where they faked an

audience's reaction to a character.

, it's like this little wood character seems like Clyde or something like that.

Okay.

Do you know who Clyde is?

No.

No.

Most, he's not even in like the trailers, I don't think.

Because I've seen a trailer for Elemental.

You see, she's a fire person.

He's a water guy.

They kiss it's steam.

You get it right?

. I don't, there's like no mention of this Clyde person, and yet in this

fake video they make this Clyde comes on screen, he's like a little wood guy

and they go, oh my gosh, it's Guardia.

You can start hearing the, and the screams that they use to fake

the screams, they're prerecorded.

Right.

So they are just like, oh, we're just gonna use social media like it's magic.

Once again, these elderly people think social media and AI is

just basically just magic.

, it's kind of like the laughs, right?

So there was a bunch of laughs that were recorded in the forties and the

fifties for laugh track for laugh tracks.

And they're used to this day.

So they're using laugh tracks of people who have been dead for over 50 years.

Yeah, and you know what's crazy though?

They're probably getting residuals.

They, they probably, their families are probably getting paid for this because of.

Old, old contracts, right?

So according to an article by the deadline you would think to yourself, okay,

well how much are they really making?

How much are these studios really making?

Well, last year, Disney led the domestic box office with almost $2

billion, 26% of the market share.

You have 20th Century Studios, 1.3 billion.

You have Universal 1.3 billion, 18% of the market share.

, they're making billions of dollars.

. And you would sit there and you would think, okay, well if they're

making this much money, Well, how much are the unions asking for?

Right?

It must be something crazy, right?

Nope.

Nope.

The W G A estimated in its contract proposal, which was rejected by the

studios, would cost the industry $429 million with 343 million of that

directly attributed to the studios.

And that's according to Indie wire the union.

Also broke down these projected costs by employer showing Disney would incur

$75 million annually while Netflix would pay $68 million and Water Brothers

Discovery would pay $47 million.

And this is annually.

Now, mind you, I just told you, they're making billions.

Right.

And these, and once again, those numbers were from box office.

This's, not talking about whatever other things that they might own.

You know what I'm saying?

, a lot of these studios own have their thumbs and a lot of different

buys, including music, right?

Theme parks books as well.

, this is a drop in the bucket for these studios, right?

These studios are losing, , a hundred million dollars a week?

Yeah.

It, 'cause of the strike, they don't even care.

They said they're gonna starve them out even though they're

losing a hundred million a week.

They are, they're losing a hundred to $150 million and there's a potential

for the fallout to be between three and $4 billion, and they're

just willing to just wait it out.

. And then according to the Verge the unions are fighting for contracts that

prevent AI from replacing their jobs.

, this is overall what we are fighting for is that we don't want AI to

replace us because we all know that the quality is going to suffer because

we know the studios only want it to be profitable Also, it's not like, Now

that we can't, AI is just gonna get better and better, better and better.

But they don't wanna work with it.

They just want whatever is cheapest.

Right, right.

Which, once again, this is why I, I've said this in our last ver on

our last episode about the W G A studio is eventually gonna go away.

They're eventually, 'cause when you have independent creators,

they actually care about how they look and how their products are.

And the audience, , is more forgiving whenever stuff happens

because at least they're trying.

Right.

Well, but they also, because they have a direct connection.

Right.

Which is why students are hiring influencers.

Yeah.

, that's why you have a-list, actors and directors, 'cause

people like those people.

But now in the age of influencers, anyone's that likable I sitting

here, both of us have made things that have gone viral, right?

Several times in fact.

, if a studio was like, oh, well I know you made this viral ways of content and

you're in this niche, then it's like, okay, well I'm gonna give you all this

money 'cause I know that your audience directly wants to communicate with you.

Right, exactly.

Like you're an actor, like you're an a-list actor or like you're

an an A-list or like you're a big time director or something.

The article cites an example of a Netflix series that paid musicians

16,000 for 40 minutes of music, but no residuals, none note, none whatsoever.

What is not affected?

Because we obviously have Barbie, all their promotion is completely killed,

Oppenheimer, all that kind of stuff.

What is not affected by the SAG after strike?

And that would be any work.

Performed under the union's TV and television contracts theatrical contracts

that are separate from SAG aftra actors.

Here's the thing.

Actors can still work on commercials.

Yeah.

And they can also still do podcasts.

The thing is, is podcasts that operate under SAG after contracts are still

free to continue as long as it's a micro budget independent film.

Is what they classify themselves.

There's a lot of people that Nicholas and I both know who have decided, oh, because

they're on strike, I'm going to quit too.

Please read the W G A website.

Please read the sac after a website.

Not all production needs to stop.

If you're not in the union, you're not even close to being in the union.

You might as well keep working on your skills, right?

So that way one day you could be a part of it and it can actually matter to you.

Right.

But it is about the future of our industry, but there's not much you can

do unless you're part of the union.

Right.

TikTok creators, with it being the biggest app pretty much in the world there's a

creator, . A lot of people are giving him flack online for the studios coming

to him and saying, Hey, we need you to advertise our products, because obviously

the strike is going on and everybody is really mad at him because it's like, Hey

man, we're supposed to be in solidarity.

And he's like, but I'm not a part of the union.

Yeah, no, I totally agree with that.

, if you're not part of the union, , , you shouldn't say that.

It doesn't matter.

It's not important to you.

'cause it is about your industry.

But if you're not a part of the union, it's really not your issue Exactly.

As you, as you try to make it seem.

'cause once again, these are about union jobs.

So if you don't work union jobs, it's not really about you.

That's just the way it is.

And a lot of these unions and one of the, one of the defense points was

like, oh, okay, well they didn't care about me when I was trying to join

their union, and I needed help when things were going bad for me, which

a union would've protected me for.

But now that you're on strike, I should stand up for you when

you wouldn't stand up for me.

Yeah.

So, you know it's bit of a gray area because it depends

on person, per person, right?

' and until this thing's all over,

Hey guys, it's Ben Film Center.

I'm Derek.

I'm Nicholas, and we'll see you on the next episode.

This has been Film Center on Comic-Con Radio.

. You can follow the show at Film Center News on all major social media platforms.

Tune in next Wednesday for a.

Fresh update.

Until next time.