Episode Summary: In this episode of The Future-Ready Advisor, Sam Sivarajan sits down with Ryan Frederick, founder of HERE, to explore the critical connection between place and longevity. Ryan advocates for "place planning," emphasizing how where we live is deeply intertwined with our well-being, especially as we age. This conversation touches on how financial advisors can guide clients in making intentional living decisions that balance financial, community, and health goals. Ryan shares insights on the evolving perception of home, not just as a financial asset, but as a space for creating a supportive and fulfilling lifestyle. He also highlights the importance of social connections, revealing how our environments can either foster or hinder the relationships that impact longevity. Ryan's thoughtful perspective offers financial advisors a new lens for client planning, one that goes beyond wealth management to encompass holistic well-being.

takeaways

• Life is not linear, and our paths can change unexpectedly.
• Our environment shapes us more than we shape it.
• Place planning is essential for healthy aging.
• Financial advisors should consider place as a key factor in planning.
• Social connections are crucial for longevity and well-being.
• Many people are unaware of the importance of their living environment.
• The financialization of real estate can skew perceptions of home.
• Intentional planning can prevent costly mistakes in living arrangements.
• Community living should encourage social interactions.
• Designing spaces for connection can enhance quality of life.

Sound Bites

• "Life is not linear."
• "We get shaped more by our environment."
• "It's much more about lifestyle and environment."

Chapters

• [00:05:45] What is Place Planning? – Ryan introduces the concept of place planning and its role in creating environments that foster longevity.
• [00:17:05] Financial and Non-Financial Considerations – How the decision of where to live extends beyond finances to lifestyle and social well-being.
• [00:28:07] Social Connections as Key to Longevity – Ryan shares the powerful role social relationships play in healthy aging.
• [00:39:11] How Advisors Can Incorporate Place Planning – Strategies for financial advisors to integrate place planning into client conversations.

Resources Mentioned:

• HERE: here.life
• Harvard Study on Adult Development
• Blue Zones by Dan Buettner

Call-to-Action:

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• Visit the Website: For more resources and episodes, visit www.samsivarajan.com.

I see it as two things. I I do believe that, not surprisingly, that one of the key levers for our society is creating like better places for people to thrive and at the same time helping people make better decisions about where to live so they can thrive at each stage.

We used to live been awesome for about Texas about five years, both previous to this, we lived in Baltimore.

In our ZIP code, which wasn't a large one in in Baltimore, our neighboring ZIP code had a life expectancy that was 20 years less.

I believe that there's really two key important levers. How can we create better places and how can help? How can people make better decisions around?

This is the future Ready Advisor, a show about transforming your financial advisory practice. I'm your host, Sam Silver.

Wealth management consultant, behavioral scientist and keynote speaker in this podcast, I dive deep into the real challenges advisors face and bring you insightful conversations with top industry experts. Together, we'll explore practical strategies grounded in behavioral science to help you.

Better serve your clients, optimize your time and build a future ready practice.

Hi everyone I'm your host Sam Sivarajan. Welcome to today's episode of The Future Ready Advisor. Today I'm here with Ryan Frederick, the founder of here, a movement he started to reshape how we live.

Brian, welcome to the show.

Thanks for having me, Sam.

Looking forward to diving into a really interesting conversation, let me quickly introduce you to our.

I should call Ryan, an environment specialist. His focus is on how we live and where we live, impacts our health and well-being, especially as we age. As the founder of here, he helps individuals and communities make informed decisions about their living environments during retirement.

Ensuring that they stay connected and supported in their later years.

This is such a timely topic, Ryan and I'm really looking forward to diving in in greater detail into it.

Maybe before we start you could share a little bit about your professional background and what really inspired you to focus on this intersection of health, longevity and place.

Yeah, Sam, we have 3 teenage kids, 11's a rising sophomore in college and two in high school and one things I've shared.

Them is life is not linear, and so if you asked me when I was graduating from high school or college, this is what I'd be focusing on. I would have been what I said to electrical engineering in college and and that in part I think was to avoid reading and writing. So and now I'm an author and and so on. I had shorter version of a longer.

Sorry, Sam, I.

Worked in Silicon Valley coming out of college and company went public as early employees like WOW, this business thing is easy, but then there was an ethical scandal in our company and it really made me some people went to jail and really made me think about Wow, where where I want to focus my energies and talents and went back to Business School at Stanford.

And and then decided that this is 20 years ago. Felt that there weren't many people thinking about all the implications of of living a longer life.

And one of those dimensions is place and so I've over the last 20 years of I've actually initially I lived in a senior living community. So I immersed myself. You know, if you're into design thinking, it's one thing to actually like be there with people. Needless to say, I was fairly popular being the only person under 30 and only male and my.

Wing and my wife decided not join me, so a lot of unsolicited gifts and and brunch invitations and so on. But what started from that has led to experiences as a as a private equity investor, as an executive for different housing companies in the space, and consulting with dozens of companies in the US but abroad as well. And then and then more recently.

Writing a book in this space and just.

Appreciating Sam.

That for whatever reason, places this really big decision.

You know that we make the average, you know, American or Canadian adult moves a dozen times and we get shaped more by our environment than than we shape the environment. So it it in some ways, if we want to.

Determine who you want to be. Look at the type of people that are where in a given place, because odds are you're gonna adopt some of their habits and lifestyles.

Ryan, that resonates with me on so many levels. I love this concept of non linearity. Now I'm in the same stage of life that you are. I tell people that I've mentored that what I thought was important or what my priorities were or what my definition of success in Mighties was different than in my.

These then different than my different. I won't keep going on.

For no other reason than not to depress myself. The other point that you make about place really resonated only in the last few years for me.

It's.

How important that is. I grew up all over Canada. I went to the UK for my early part of my career. I came back to Canada. My wife is Austrian. She comes from a small town in Austria and as we get older.

Wow.

Everything that we wanted to leave behind the guest growing up, we all want to go to the big city.

Go to these exotic places. I think some of those are being reevaluated for us personally as to what is important and this concept of place or environment and that's the physical location. But I think the community around it, the people around it, certainly for me.

My situation this is resonating more today than it ever did 1020 years ago.

Yeah, it's interesting, Sam, about 20 years ago, Dan Buettner wrote a book called Blue Zealots.

MHM.

And part of National Geographic. And they went to different places, had a half dozen places where people live longer, healthier than than other places in the world. And it resonated at the time. But as you may know, there were subsequent books and then more recently, there was a Netflix series on kind of living to 100. And insights from these blue zones.

And so I think you see this interest that you're describing that people have, I think what is?

What does it look like to not just live longer, but live healthier, longer, live, better, longer? I think you've that trend that's happening right now. And I think at the same time you have another trend, which one might argue we're we we're in the midst of the biggest global migration ever, which is this move from.

Physical world to this online world.

Umm and the you know, the conversation that we're having right now is a function of the online world that's made available.

But if our lives are fully consumed.

Instructed in this virtual world, like what do we miss by not having a sense of of kind of groundedness and rootedness, and you see it with the digital natives. You know, our kids are their generation and and. And how do they navigate this? But I think.

MHM.

For.

Gen. Xers and boomers, and so on. There's a displacement that's happened both literally, where we've moved from place to place, but also figure.

Are we necessarily as tied and rooted in a place that our, you know, ancestors used to be? And as you look at the research or in healthy longevity, it's pretty overwhelming how important it is to have this sense of being known and being part of the social fabric of a community. And so they're place is much more than a place to hang your hat.

Places much more than something that shows up as a material line item on your expenses. Or perhaps you know a line item and your assets on your balance sheet, it's there's so much more that's wrapped into it.

And because we have these different chapters in life, we really.

We're looking out for our future selves. We should be mindful. Are we really in the best place for each?

Chapter.

I love this multidimensional construct of place. As you say, it isn't just a roof and four walls, and you talk a lot, Ryan, about place.

Planning. Can you explain what you mean by that and how you've seen this importance of place evolve in the context of healthy aging and longevity over the past few years? Exactly what you've been talking about?

Yeah. Again in that same thinking of non-linear, nonlinear thinking and just the way life unfolds, hey.

So I had this background in the housing pieces really for second-half of life, so 55 plus communities age, targeted community senior housing like I'm an expert in this. I've.

Got.

Work with dozens of companies, know a lot of people.

You would think that I would see all these dimensions of place, but it wasn't until I wrote the book and really did the research around it that I realized that the significance the the ramifications of this of this decision.

And and as I thought more about it and and as the book right place, right time kind of created these ripples in in different circles. I realized that a lot of people aren't planning for place the same way that they plan for other things in their life.

So you know, we're living a long life. You want to make sure, probabilistically, you know, want is you want to make sure you don't run out of funds. So you know, what do you turn to? Will you turn to financial advisors? Wealth advisors help me think through this. Am I the Monte Carlo analysis?

You know like.

What are the different scenarios that I need to be weighing in this and?

And then you, you know you for healthcare, you turn to doctors and and you know primary care and specialists. And my concierge doctors, you know am I am I doing this the right way.

And and then you've got on the health side, you've got nutritionists and gyms you might join and and and personal fitness coaches. But for whatever reason, this place thing, it's like really big decision. You know, you go back to the science of longevity. It's especially for people in the second-half of life. It's much more about.

Lifestyle and environment at least 70%. Most studies I've seen, it's north of 80%. We have agency in than our genetics. So it's much more about and my lifestyle decisions in this environment.

Yet when we're thinking about place, it's almost like it's it's hidden in plain sight. And so for the most part, it's really a it's a do yourself exercise, people sharing advice with each other, Google searching, learning from when people make mistakes, you know, cause real estate brokers. They're really only there when there's a transaction.

And honestly, there to help you think about it. So I kind of realized in the process that what we're really talking about in this is.

Is is as an analogue with financial planning. It's it's it's place planning. Ohh am I make how I'm making sure. Not only not only am I in the right place for every chapter.

Life am I also activating that place? So I live in Austin, TX. We live in a in a technically it's a city. It's really a suburb of Austin. It's a 10 minute E bike ride to downtown so.

That's we have certain address. Technically that's where we live. But it's not just where we live. How much do we activate it? Like what? What are? What do my friendship circles look like? How often you know what? What ways am I engaged in the community? How physically active they're they're. It's not just again, what place? It's in. What way does your.

Life follow what you're looking for out of that given place. So this place planning thing. Sam, I think it's a, you know term I've coined in the process of this thinking as it's evolved. But I believe that there's a a significant opportunity for people to.

To give be intentional and give some time and energy to this, this this big decision. So you're, you know, you're optimizing it or close to optimizing it for each chapter of life.

There's some really interesting concept and.

I wonder how much do you believe that the financialization, if you will, of real estate, that it's an asset that you can build up equity, that you go, then trade it in to get the next bigger home or what have you?

How much of that has changed people's outlooks from the home as a place in the broader context that you think about it?

To OK. It's an item on my balance sheet or my personal balance sheet and the the only objective is to maximize that size that that how big of the the balance sheet that it is.

I think it's a great question. I think it's a timely.

Question I.

You have a number of people that are asking.

I'm living this longer life. What do I really want it to look like? And even questions about you know, how much do I want to leave for my kids or family? I know there's a book came out of year ago, you know, die with zero. And the argument was wait a second. You know, maybe maybe as a society, we're we're focusing too much.

On just like network.

Earth.

And I'm by the way, and I'm not to suggest in any way, financial security matters a lot. And people that for a longer life that don't have that, there's a lot of stress associated with it. But I think I believe that there's more people, Sam, seeing this lens of these different dimensions that drive healthy, purposeful life longer.

Great.

Life.

And they recognize that being in the right place can drive a lot of that in that in that thinking.

MHM.

It raises questions about, you know, per your question, if I look at this only as a.

Financial asset, let's say, Oh my gosh, I've had this house. I've been living in California on the water and Oh my goodness. Like, look at the value of this House. However, if it turns out you're socially isolated, if it turns out you know your friends aren't around you and you're not eating well, you're not active the way you could be. Then it may be the right place, perhaps from a financial balance sheet perspective.

But.

Maybe nudging you down a path that actually won't help you live. You know your best life for that chapter. So I do think there's some some people recognizing that it's it's broader.

You know, than just a financial asset or a place to hang your app.

This and I.

Think I actually think blue zones has.

Been really helpful for.

This I think it's because of the mainstream work through Netflix and so on, and there's more people saying, wait a second, this matters. Maybe I don't want to move to Sardinia in Italy or or to Japan or Costa Rica, but how do I?

Effectively create my version of a Blue Zone in in an area that they're more familiar with, but that.

That that happens through planning, it just doesn't happen by accident.

So that is a conversation that financial advisors should be having with their clients to get them to think about their place in, in, in a broader construct than just the financial element of it. What do you suggest that financial advisors do with clients or what are you doing with your clients? Like what key considerations are you emphasizing that they should think about?

When deciding whether to stay in their current home or move as they approach retirement.

Yeah. You know, Sam, I think it is. I'd say step one is for people to understand, like we were talking earlier. This is a multidimensional thing and it's foundational for your healthy longevity. So if you don't appreciate the ways in which place impacts your life, you're more likely.

To make a suboptimal decision, and so for those you know, get these key transitions, empty nesters, pre retirees, retirees. And then I would say people really in their mid 70s or so we're now there's more consideration about healthcare that people start to think about and so.

Hmm.

Understand it's a big decision. Understand it's a multi dimensional decision and then recognize that whether you decide to go somewhere or not, that's a decision.

So one thing that's happened with the work that the courses and coaching that we've been doing, Sam is.

That.

There are a number of people that their intent is to age in place. Stay where?

They are.

MHM.

And then they go through a process, they do the planning, they have a plan on the other side and they decide to do the same thing. They do want to age in place.

But it's one thing to say it.

M.

The different thing to actually have a plan.

To show that actually it's feasible under number of different conditions and that it's something that that that is the best course part of the effort too, Sam is, is to recognize that there's a multitude of different options.

Because it's not. Just stay where you are. There's an option, says stay where you are and do nothing like same life. No physical changes, no change in friends, whatever. Although regardless, just life changes like places change and you change. So what might be fine in in one.

Chapter may be the wrong place for another chapter, but but nonetheless, it's not. Just stay there and move to one place. Part of the exercise is helping people understand there are a range of different options. You could go choose to go do, and especially for those that are intent on going somewhere else and they have resources.

And they have the ability or a willingness to go to number different places that can be a, you know, a challenging problem because where do you start, you know, trying to trying to figure this out back to the the wealth advisors and financial advisors it.

There's an important role, Sam, in this, because in the work that we've done, partnering with Wealth Advisors is that there's a there's a subset typically of people's clients.

Where place is on the mind and for those people like.

Mm-hmm.

I think they.

Can occupy a lot of their mind share actually, because maybe they feel like their current place isn't the right one. Or maybe they have family that somewhere else. I want to be closer to them and I think one of the opportunities for for financial advisors, Wealth advisors is the more that they can be kind of in tune.

With those people, the more that they can kind of meet them where they are. OK, I get it. This is an important decision for you. It's financial, but it's also non financial. So I like to describe as quasi financial.

And in those situations, wealth Advisors, financial advisors, can, I think, add more value by meeting where they are and trying to find, you know resources that can help them ultimately make a better decision. There's a.

Wealth Advisory Group and RIA in Maryland and they they've started actually to to do work in place planning. We've partnered with them because what they found is a number of people, in their case, people more in their midst. We're making bad decisions around place.

And so we're starting to compromise the the financial fidelity of their planning. And it was also impacting their quality of life.

Mm-hmm.

And they recognize, wait a second. If we're really trying to help people be ultimately successful in their lives, this is an area that we probably should lean into. So it's, I think, like I said, I think first step is this is a big decision. It's multi dimensional, understand that and I think to some degree people.

Can.

Self select. Is this something in my mind right now or not? And for those where it's not, maybe it shouldn't be. Maybe they're in a perfect place right now.

They got bigger things to focus on.

But for those where it is an issue or should be, then I think there's an opportunity to come alongside people and help them.

Planning.

Look, you're absolutely right. And I would add to that, is planning of any sort is forward thinking, right? So if you are thinking about moving because this isn't the right place, this is a role for that wealth Advisor, financial advisor to play is meat, as you say, meet your client where they are address the fact, OK, why are you doing this? Why do you want to do this? OK, maybe it's a financial reason.

But part of that non financial element of planning that the advisor can sit there and and and help the client think through is OK what about for?

What about your community? What about the the gym? What about the the religious institution that you belong to? Like, how are those things going to be impacted and what are you going to do about it? And this is where to your point where look, if the client isn't ready to talk about it.

OK, they're not ready to talk about it, but these are things that from a planning perspective because it impacts the financial plan, it impacts when you retire, the timing and everything else. These aren't things that you can think about putting into place or you shouldn't be thinking about putting into place after you've done your retirement.

You want to think about it and do some of that work a year or two years, five years beforehand.

That's exactly right. And it's not again the thing about place which makes it more difficult in some regards. It's a big decision. So especially if your decision is to do something you want to do your research, you know there's stories I I.

There, as part of the work that we do where people have these ohh whoops moments.

It's OK. You know, gosh, maybe I should have worn blue jeans instead of black jeans. You know, that's not a high risk decision, but if your decision is to pick up shop and sell your possessions and move to a new place and then find out that that what you thought it was isn't what it is like, that's financially.

Costly. It's emotionally costly. It's can be relationally costly.

And for the for, I would say for the individual or couple, but also for the advisors you don't want to have your clients make these decisions they have. I have a small example I use in Austin. We've got an acquaintance of mine lives lives in our broader neighborhood. His kids gone. They're empty nesters and they wanted to.

Be the cool.

Kids and and move downtown. There's a number of new.

Apartments and condos are being built in Austin and and so they did that like, you know, we can do this. We're gonna sell our house and and and they found this cool condo. And of course, the furniture they've had for, you know, decades in their suburban Austin home didn't fit the vibe of the condo downtown. And and it was also probably a 1/4 or 1/3 of the size of their house.

In in the suburbs. So they sold the furniture, sold their house, sold the furniture, you know, bought new stuff. And and, of course, the friends are largely in the suburbs. And and the guy he he works for law firm, he can walk to work. That was part of the allure.

And their friends would come see him. You know, first few months. Oh, we need to go see.

Your friends and we'll go, you know.

Hip restaurant grab drink that hip bar and but then after a few months and the friends weren't coming as much they were. It was easier just to stay in their neighborhood and hang out with other friends and the people in their condo building were friendly, but they didn't really hit it off as much. It was hard to make some friends there.

Hmm.

His wife was more of a green thumb than necessarily. She fully realized they had no, you know, space in their condo to to, to support plants.

And about about a year into it, they kind of looked at each other and they had a a whoops moment. They said we shouldn't done this, so they then went to the process of selling their condo and then finding a house back in their old neighborhood.

And which the markets calmed down a bit. But at the time this was happening, it was. It was hard to find house and constantly and all these things, and they would have been much better served. Instead, what if we, you know, do an Airbnb for a week, two weeks? What?

MHM.

We, you know, rent our house for a year and then we ran an apartment. Really test it out and and so these these are big decisions. You don't want to get them wrong. It doesn't mean you shouldn't try but like use some elements of testing and design thinking is the term that number of companies use universities around innovation and so there's some ways to use some of those.

Hmm.

Lessons here. So yeah, it's it's.

It matters. You know, it's for these big decisions that matter that are costly if you get them wrong, I think that behooves people to to play.

I love that example. It's so vivid and this idea of testing and learning is so bang on. I remember more extreme than your stories, but I remember having wealthy clients who could afford for tax and other reasons to decide they're leaving Canada and they're going down to the.

Caribbean and they're going to have the island lifestyle.

And that's a bigger move than your your couple that you talked about going from the suburbs to downtown, but they up and moved and again six months a year, it's great the weather is great, but after that they realize that their family, their community, their whole I guess essence was back.

Home.

If you will and it is a question of why did we do?

This everything can be reversed, but your point about testing and learning so that you don't have to undo it is probably a prudent course of action. If if you can, if you can.

And just add that for a second, Sam, for in some cases in some situations it's not reversible.

And let's say there's a house that you really have the strong identity as how?

And you know, you sell it, you move on, and then you realize you make a mistake. It's going to be difficult for you to literally buy your old house back. Neighborhoods change. Social networks change.

And so I know sometimes people think, my gosh, I used with some friends that you lived in Dallas for a while and they moved away. And then they came back ten years later, maybe seven years later. And the Dallas, in their mind that they lived in was different than the Dallas.

Hmm.

They moved to.

MHM.

And so they only lasted their year, went back to where they were before.

It it's it does. It's not. It's not to say you can't rectify pieces of.

That, but there are elements of this that you know you can't fully reverse depending again, depending on your situation. In particular, it doesn't mean you shouldn't. One shouldn't think about ways to make their lives better by contemplating scenarios that involve a move for sure and acting on some of those like it shouldn't make people risk averse.

But I think it also just helps people appreciate these are just like any decision like they're different doors and you know, which door do you want to go?

MHM.

Yeah.

It's a great point. It reminds me of the burial Greek, saying that you can't cross the same river twice because the next time you come to that river, it's not the same river, right? But the the couple that for the Dallas it's not the same, Dallas.

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Not exactly exactly correct.

So one of the things that we've been talking about, Ryan, is the concept of connection as being an important aspect for healthy aging. So what advice would you give financial advisors to get their clients to think strategically about their living arrangements and the sense of community and connection in retirement?

I had this fascinating conversation with the head of an office of a very large RIAA recently. We talked about longevity.

And I said, you know, how much do you talk to your clients about the importance of of relationships and long?

Somebody. And she said what? No, we only talked about like supplements and and working out and things like that and it it it shocked me because we're reading different articles apparently.

There's a Harvard study. It's a one of longest running studies. It's been running for 85 years, and it's been tracking the impact of of of this cohort of men initially. And then their families. And then their kids. And the way it's.

Hmm.

See.

Pretty fast things. There's several books have been written about it now.

And in that study.

They point the number one factor to people living long, healthy lives.

Is the quality.

Of their relationships when they were 60.

What they found was for the people that had strong relationships, a strong sense of connection.

With those that you know, care for them and so on.

They were more likely to to pursue the type of lifestyle attributes that are indicative of a healthy long life, so it's not that they weren't eating healthy things, it just happened to be because they were. But it just happened to be that it was the connection, it was the the tie of these relationships that mattered so significant.

And going back to our conversation, earlier elements of our conversation earlier, we're in such a unique place in time because you know it used to be a few generations ago that you, like, knew your neighbor if you knocked on their door, you you weren't assumed to be a solicitor.

Or answer the.

Door answer the door and if you answered door and it's likely your neighbor like knew your name. Knew your story.

And so we're because of a range of different things that have happened, we actually have to work at friendships in a deeper way than we have had before. At the same time that people are living longer. So when we're younger, we got college, you know, early, you know.

We.

Shenanigans in our first jobs and cities, or whatever your story is. And then when you have young kids, that tends to be a time that bring people together.

The places of worship often are gathering spot, but we've also seen that the the regularity of people going to a place of worship at a regular that's that's been, you know, kind of going down in the process. And so there are fewer places now in our home environment that we we connect with people and it's an issue for.

I think it's more it's a harder issue for people midlife and beyond. It's a particularly challenging issue actually for men.

As it's played out and so I think it's a really key question that that now and I know some financial advisors may lean into those sort of questions you know more so than others. But if we're trying to ask people are they position themselves to really thrive in this longer life asking questions.

Hmm.

About, you know, the health of their.

For social connections matters, there's a friend of mine that recently came out with a book and and she she she summarized she calls it social health. 1/3 of the people in the US are lonely. The surgeon general described roughly half people don't know their neighbors. Surgeon General came out last year, said we have an epidemic.

Loneliness. So there's definitely a portion of people where their lack of social connection, their perceived lack, is such a big deal that it truly is impacting.

Their health.

No matter where you are, this idea of investing.

In your relationships is it's part of the key to a long, healthy life. And so I think there probably is a role for for well.

To ask these questions.

You know, if they feel.

At least I think it could be insightful to meeting where their people are, and but it also Sam. Some places make it easier to make friends than others, so if you're in a spot where.

You know you don't know anyone and you don't the the general psychographics the way people think is not consistent with who you are. That can be a real challenge. You know, one just short example, it may be not quite as heightened in in Canada as it in the US, but you know we we're we've got a presidential campaign few months away and and if you're a blue person.

Where there's a lot of red, it may be hard, you know, to to make friends. So if and and vice versa. So just understanding at the macro level, are you in a spot where people like you are there to make friends? It matter.

There's so much there, Ryan. I totally agree with that. And yes, we are watching the US presidential election closely and.

That level of I I guess if you will, polarization that exists, perhaps in pockets of the.

US.

It is starting to exist in parts of Canada, and the interesting point that you made and I just want to touch on it a little bit, I I think the book was bowling alone by Robert Putnam.

Yeah.

And he talked about a lot of the things that you highlighted here the the fact that places of worship aren't things that people go to, that community organizations, whether it's things like the kiwanas, the Rotary, the Lions Club, local sports teams or whatever. There is this concern.

And I've.

Written about it that we.

Take it for granted, right? That we have this Community that this is part of the fabric of who we are and.

The challenge is, and it's it's ironic that we're living in this world right now, like we're talking across the Internet across North America, and we have so much connection because of what social media and Internet and everything has provided, which is great. At the same time, we have this level of loneliness and depression and anxiety that.

Is again off the record charts, right? Right. And you talk about men. I mean, you know, the stat I heard is that the the average man, middle-aged man is like if they can count 3 or.

Yeah.

We're good friends. I think we again, I I think your point is valid. I don't know that a wealth advisor is going to solve that problem. And I think a lot of wealth advisors are going to shy away from being that therapist, if you will, of asking.

That question.

But I don't think that's what you're saying. These are questions that are deep.

And don't necessarily have an answer.

But what a wealth advisor can do.

Is be that person that asked that question puts that thought in that clients head and say you should think about this, maybe you know the answer, maybe you've been giving it some thought, but just recognize that here are the statistics and if you don't want to be one of the statistics, these are the things that you should think about.

Yeah.

So totally so I write a lot about social capital, which is really a term that that was was coined by Putnam. I met Putnam in his offices, probably about a decade ago. We talked about some of this.

Hmm.

And he's funny because the. So that particular book he wrote around, I think 2000 or so. But when it happening was it's only become more and more popular because unfortunately he was too right. Like, it's like his thesis around it around the social fabric has become more and more true, unfortunately.

Mm-hmm.

And so these terms like, yeah, more people are talking about Putnam now. In fact, there's a documentary called Join or Die that's out that some is is former classmates made. I'll send you a link afterwards, but nonetheless it's this is it's it's a big.

All right.

Thing and and I think here's what I would say. This is one of the interesting things about place is for most people.

Your living expenses.

Our material line item in your financial longevity plan for most people, your primary residence or your secondary residents that you own are material in your in your asset.

Line of your balance sheet.

When you ask questions about place.

Those are inherently financial questions.

Offer more and I would hope that most financial planners are and wealth advisor. Ask these questions anyway. But I believe that the intake form when you have new clients coming in there should be specific questions about plan.

Mm-hmm.

Part of the annual review. There should be specific questions about place where.

Things as simple as hey, do you feel like this is the right place for you now? Do you feel like this is the right place for you 5 years from now? Why or why not? And in those in and especially if people understand that the multi dimensional components of place means that there's an invitation for them to say.

M.

You know what, Sam?

I used to know all my neighbors used to, you know, golf, but I don't now the things have changed. Same address, but it's a different.

Now we probably should think about this in a way that we haven't before or or also something that happens too is going back to the social connection piece of people's friendship. Networks change.

Especially in retirement, because people do move to different.

Place so of course the northeast, and I'm sure parts can it, maybe it happens more often than if you're already planted in Florida, but but just think recognizing that there's enough change over A5 year period, let's say that what you think might be true now might be different down the road which may require some planning. So there.

Could be a Trojan horse, I would say, with the place dimension that that could be an invitation.

For better insights with your clients and and could give you a perspective to help them in a way that might be different than than that says, OK Sam list your 5 best friends. Where are they? You know people, hey, well, a second that's you know, I'm not gonna you. I'm not gonna answer that but but there could be ways to get to some of that that may be less.

More natural, I guess.

It's a great point and so that your example is right there where like look, an advisor will already ask a client and they're fact finding or whatever. OK, well, tell me about your home. Is it paid for? What's the size of it? So that's the 2D thinking or the 2D?

Like that.

Questioning the questions that you're suggesting, is this the right place for you now?

Yeah.

Do you think will be the right place for you in five years from now? Why, you're right. It's just a shift in thinking to move from that financial to the non financial element. It's more open-ended question. I don't think for most advisors that should be too far out of their comfort zone. You're not getting into how many friends do you have?

And are you?

Active in your religious community or whatever, you're not going in any of those decisions. You're just getting them to start thinking a little bit more holistically if you can, if I can use that overused word.

About what? Retirement and place and assets and you know, community and everything else need.

I love that. Yeah, totally agree.

Ryan, maybe the last question for you is what is your vision for the future of healthy aging and community living and how do you see that the work that you're doing is contributing to that vision?

Yeah, ending with a softball. I see it as two things. I do believe that, not surprisingly, that one of the key levers for our society is creating, like, better places for people to thrive. And at the same time, helping people make better decisions.

About where to live so they can thrive at each stage. We used to live been awesome for about Texas about five years, but previous this we lived in Baltimore, MD in our ZIP code, which wasn't a large one in in Baltimore. Our neighboring ZIP code had a life expectancy that was 20 years.

Less.

So.

We've got places in the US maybe less so in Canada, but we've got places in the US where you could have dramatically different.

Life expectancy and I would also say, quality of life outcomes based on where you live because so much of it translates to your lifestyle and different decisions, quality of education, quality of food, you know, et cetera, et cetera, so.

So I think that there is an enormous societal opportunity to put more of a focus on place as a key driver for healthy longevity. People in the healthcare space talk about the social determinants of health and housing being part of that.

So my work really contributes in two different ways, Sam. Part of it is personally do keynote speaking and strategy Consulting 2, I'll call it the supply side, helping real estate developers, certain municipalities, health systems and so on. How can we just create better place?

How can we create apartments for example, that think about the impact of a long life? What would that mean for the design of the apartment? What does it mean for the integration of universal design features? I recently joined the Advisory Council of Stanford Center on Longevity. These are the things they think about. How do we create a society that's designed for this longer?

Life. So I think we've got a real opportunity globally to create better places.

At the same time, I believe there's an opportunity for people to make more informed decisions about am I in the right place at the right time and back to much of our dialogue here today. Am I thinking about it in this multi dimensional way? Because if I decide to age in place, which is most people, that's their default.

MHM.

You know, at least in the US.

That may work, or it could be an invitation for social isolation could be an invitation for lack of.

Purpose could be an invitation not being physically active the way that you could be or eating as well as you could. So I believe that there's really two key important levers. How can we create better places can help? How can people make better decisions around this? What I often find is that people consumers as they're thinking about this, whether they're working with them directly or through a wealth advisor.

Hmm.

They're like, man, I wish there were better options and just to end on that piece, what I think's gonna happen, Sam, is you're gonna see.

More, it's expensive right now because interest rates are higher and cost of construction is higher and so on. But in general, as things normalize a bit, I think you're gonna see.

Or homes.

Single family homes, more apartments, more condos where where people are thinking about two things. One, how does this work for an older population because it's going to represent a higher percentage of what we've had in the past. And the second one is in what ways?

MHM.

And we make it easier for people to live healthier lives in this place.

And that may mean.

In which places are designed to facilitate getting to know each other? For example, in apartment buildings, making little easier to have one place where all the mail is, and that's where people have this serendipity.

Kind of connections, but has social implications for connections as ways in which how can we make just being active by walking?

You know easier to happen. I I I know I'm a big biker, so being able to have bike lanes in places that people use for bikes or ebikes I I just think you're gonna see more infrastructure to say wait a second. We're gonna do more to just make make health easier for a longer life. So I'm hopeful that these levers will.

Will be pulled on more in the.

Sure.

That's a great point, Ryan, and maybe I'll just add this one point is that when you are talking about this idea of thinking about designing places where serendipity occurs and people have the social interactions, I couldn't help but think how grocery stores are designed right now, right? Like so the staples that you have.

There's milk and eggs or whatever that you go pick up.

On a regular basis, they're always put in the back corner of the of the grocery store so that you the the the you know the designers want you to go through all.

Yeah.

The.

Aisles to your point, that kind of thinking to come in to say, OK, how do we encourage social interaction amongst this group that may not otherwise do it? It's a selling feature for.

Yeah.

You know, for a condo or a housing development, but it also solves this.

Existential question that we've been talking about for this, this conversation.

Yeah, Starbucks is under pressure right now. I don't know. I think I saw something. The CEO may be out, I don't know. But nonetheless, there's been pressure on Starbucks. Starbucks when it, Starbucks worked really well. It was a third place, a third place place to gather outside of the 1st place, which is your house or?

Mm-hmm.

Home 2nd place is your workplace, which is under a lot of pressure right now with hybrid working and so.

On the 3rd place is these other spots.

And and and.

Starbucks, in its drive for efficiency.

The in a number of locations has squeezed out the.

3rd place dimension.

And with that, it's I think impacted some of their financials. So I agree with you. I think you're going to see some groups, some communities rally around models that's you know what this is, this is better for me and maybe I pay a little bit more for it. Maybe I give up different trade-offs, but I I think there's going to be more and.

More recognition, like we've been saying earlier.

Some of these healthy habits or lifestyle things actually take work, and if I'm in a place where I'm just nudged in certain ways to live better, have better makes for better friendships, that's a better decision for me. So I'm optimistic. I know we're gonna have some bumps along the road, and I think there's a really important role for place planning and wealth advisors to come along.

MHM.

Guide clients say wait there are options out there, so here's how to think about it.

Awesome.

Brian, we're coming to the end of our podcast. So I have a few final rapid question fire questions for you that I ask all all of my guests. So #1 professionally, what is the most important lesson you've learned?

Over the years.

Well, we touched on earlier do as an entrepreneur and and been involved in other not number of adventures in this adventures, it's lifes nonlinear. That's the biggest piece. So recognize it's nonlinear recognize there's pivots that happen in life.

Also recognize what what you believe in is true, and stick to that I I've seen that really play out significantly in my life.

That's great advice and #2 what is 1 practical tip you would offer listeners keen on applying your insights.

You know, as we've talked about, Sam, I would say the biggest thing, the biggest thing for your audience, both personally and for those you know, active in the wealth advisory financial planning business is.

Is give place the respect that it deserves, meaning. See it as foundational for your health and longevity. More than just a place to hang your head, it's more than just something, either an expense or asset. See it as this gateway to either help you.

MHM.

Be the person you want to be or you know, hold you back from that. And I think the more that you're aware of that individually.

Or else so as.

A wealth advisor, the more likely you'll be able to see ways in which your place is.

Perhaps the right one for you, or ways in which it may not be.

Ryan, this has been a fascinating discussion.

If listeners want to learn more about you or find your work, where did they go? Yeah, two thing.

Yeah, two things I would suggest visiting the here website which is here dot life HERE dot LIFE and there you'll see a content around what we've just talked about, there's an asset.

People can take to help you see this in this 3 dimensional way that we've been talking about and allow us just based on your own input, to get a sense. Are you in the right place for a given chapter that you're in? So that's a that's a key spot. Also there are gateways for individuals as well as wealth advisors to get more involved in place.

Planning the 2nd place is active on LinkedIn, so it's Ryan E Frederick on LinkedIn. You can find me there. Regular content around these issues, some of which is geared towards wealth advisors, some of which is broader than that, and that's a good way to get plugged.

I think as we've as we've talked about, it's in some detail, but not at great length. I'm not the expert in this. You're much, much more than I am. But I do think the wealth advisory space and financial advisor space is in a moment of flux.

Mm-hmm.

And and the more that groups look to add more value to their clients, I think that's an area of opportunity to retain business as well as to add business. And I believe that place planning is a can be a nice add-on for people to just add more value, you know to their clients especially for those where this is a.

You know it's an important issue.

Awesome, Brian, this has been great and thank you for joining us today on the Future Ready Advisor.

Yeah. My pleasure, Sam, really enjoyed.

In this episode, I spoke with Ryan Frederick, the founder of here and the proponent of place planning. Here are my three key takeaways.

Number one, the concept of place planning, just as people consult financial advisors for Wealth Management, Ryan advocates for the intentional planning of one's living environment. Advisers can play a crucial role in guiding clients through place decisions that balance lifestyle.

Community and financial goals.

#2 the changing importance of home.

Ryan and I discussed how the perception of home is shifting from a mere financial asset to a core element of our well-being. As people age. The decision of where to live is no longer just about building equity, but also about creating an environment that supports a fulfilling and healthy lifestyle.

#3 social connections are critical. Strong relationships are a major determinant of longevity. Ryan highlighted how our living environments can foster or inhibit these connections, making it vital for financial advisors to discuss social, health and community engagement with clients. As part of long term.

Planning.

You've been listening to the future Ready advisor. If you enjoyed the show, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or a rating on Spotify, or share your feedback wherever you listen. Be sure to follow the podcast so you never miss an episode. For more insights on how to keep your practice future ready, visit.

Www.samsivarajan.com you can find the link on the show notes. There you'll find free tools and resources along with exclusive bonus content from these podcasts. Thanks for tuning in and I look forward to sharing more strategies with you in the next episode.