Welcome to our very special Thanksgiving episode of Free RANGE, where Luke and Erin convened a panel of local notables Joni Harris, Sara Dixit and Kai Teo — a cook, an organizer and a data journalist, respectively, to discuss the political disconnection felt right now by working people in Spokane and one idea the nerds at RANGE have had to try to help struggling renters feel more protected by and connected to community:

Political Engagement Challenges

• Working-class individuals often feel disconnected from political processes
• Service industry workers face scheduling barriers to traditional civic participation
• Many people are unaware of local political developments that affect them directly
• There's a perception that political engagement doesn't lead to material improvements

Renter Rights Web Tool Concept

• Proposed tool would allow renters to check if landlords are registered and compliant with local laws
• Features could include:
• Form letters for renters to use when communicating with landlords
• Explanations of next steps if landlords don't comply
• City Council contact information for further assistance
• Optional data collection on rent prices and housing conditions
• Tool aims to provide tangible benefits while potentially increasing civic engagement

Outreach Strategies

• Utilize existing community spaces and events (e.g., bars, trivia nights)
• Create physical flyers and place them strategically around the city
• Partner with local businesses to display information
• Host launch parties or social events to introduce the tool
• Leverage word-of-mouth and personal networks for distribution

Building Community and Solidarity

• Focus on creating "third spaces" that are neither work nor home
• Avoid demonizing those with different political views
• Recognize the importance of coalition-building in worker movements
• Address root causes of political disengagement rather than symptoms

Next Steps

• Develop the renter rights web tool with suggested features
• Plan outreach strategy using multiple channels (events, flyers, partnerships)
• Consider hosting a launch party or series of events to introduce the tool
• Explore ways to create more "third spaces" for community building in Spokane

You're listening to K Y.

2

Medical lake Spokane.

3

Luke: This is rearrange a

co-production of KRS and range media.

4

Broadcasting on Thanksgiving, but

prerecorded for your listening pleasure.

5

, if all goes to plan and you are

listening to this at 3:00 PM on Thursday.

6

I hope you're enjoying this day

in whatever way you want to.

7

I'm going to probably be sick to my

stomach before dinner even starts.

8

While I've been oversampling, the food I'm

cooking, that's usually the way I do it.

9

Erin Sellers: You're listening to

this on Friday after as a podcast,

10

hopefully you are feeling all right.

11

And Not doing black Friday.

12

I think that's kind of cursed.

13

Luke: I learned today that We are

officially right now in black Friday week.

14

Amazon declared this entire

week, the week of black Friday.

15

So,

16

Erin Sellers: Yeah, capitalism.

17

Luke: All right.

18

So today was going to be a little

bit of a different show for us.

19

We're going to do a bit of an experiment.

20

Joining us is a data journalist who lives

in Spokane, but does not work in Spokane.

21

Are we saying where you work?

22

Okay.

23

maybe just take a second

to introduce yourself.

24

Kai Teo: Yeah.

25

So I'm Kai.

26

I'm the data.

27

And in fact, if news editor at the

Dallas morning news once upon a time

28

I worked at the spokesman review.

29

So.

30

That my partner here and.

31

It moved back here.

32

Luke: Awesome.

33

love, a rebound.

34

joining us

35

Erin Sellers: here with some of them.

36

My local favorites, Sarah

Dixon and Johnny Harris.

37

Sarah Dixit: My name is Sarah Dickson.

38

My.

39

Problems are she her?

40

I wear a lot of hats in Spokane.

41

I've been here for 10

years, which is wild to say.

42

Julian California.

43

I'm the organizing director of

Patrice Washington, and I'm also

44

the board president for Asians

for collective liberation.

45

And the chair for the equity center

committee for the city of Spokane.

46

Luke: Johnny.

47

Joni Harris: I have been in Spokane for.

48

Four years.

49

I'm a line cook.

50

And just starting to get more involved.

51

With the city joining the

transportation commission.

52

Luke: I

53

Erin Sellers: representative.

54

Luke: Oh, really?

55

Erin Sellers: people's chagrin.

56

Luke: Are you a avid bus user?

57

Joni Harris: Yes, I, so my car.

58

Th three years ago.

59

So I'm in Boston and by again,

60

Luke: Yeah.

61

Joni Harris: Right.

62

Yeah.

63

Luke: So this episode, Was a

result of, Almost a month now of.

64

Trying to understand The outcomes of the

election, which it's spring a lot of

65

conversations around where we go next.

66

Sellers you Johnny and.

67

Sarah had a really interesting

conversation the other

68

night at a local bar.

69

Maybe we could just start there.

70

what did you guys chat about?

71

Joni Harris: I think I don't,

a lot of it was just about how.

72

There's a better word than separated.

73

But He silent.

74

Yeah.

75

Siloed as a even in Spokane.

76

And how the.

77

Blue liberal world often

lives in a cerebral space.

78

Has space in the cerebral

space for the working class.

79

Luke: Yeah.

80

Joni Harris: But I think that's hard

to portray to the working class.

81

Exactly.

82

Feels nice.

83

Luke: the best example of

that, that I can think of is.

84

Nationally.

85

The Biden and eventually Harris campaign

talking about how good the economy was

86

based on the legislation they passed.

87

But the fact that didn't necessarily

trickle down, especially to working

88

class Americans and a lot of places.

89

Was one of the things that's

been diagnosed as a key to

90

Harris's failure in the election.

91

How does it manifest locally though?

92

Sarah Dixit: This is Sarah.

93

I think the hard part is.

94

You might be able to like point to.

95

Stocks or like the trend.

96

But if people are spending.

97

Like 200 bucks on groceries

every week, like that.

98

Isn't the same experience, right?

99

So.

100

If we are looking at things

from too much of a macro level.

101

And the individual stories of families

and people who are just trying to get by.

102

And.

103

It was actually in a podcast

I was listening to from.

104

Marie.

105

Houston, Kevin Perez.

106

And her just talking about.

107

How she is done.

108

But often will.

109

Not necessarily on party lines.

110

And talking through like, people don't

really care about what the spreadsheets

111

look like for a company or for the nation.

112

Computer sound: Right.

113

Sarah Dixit: Can't put food on the table.

114

So I think really wanting.

115

Folks in that more cerebral space to have.

116

The understanding of what's

happening on the ground.

117

And how those things can really impact.

118

Individual people in the community,

especially based on where we live.

119

Luke: Yeah.

120

So as you guys were having

this conversation in the bar

121

you ended up chatting with

the bartender about this too.

122

What happened there and how did

he get pulled into the convo?

123

Erin Sellers: I think I was

terrorizing him a little bit shocking.

124

He.

125

seemed really friendly, asked

us some questions about, who

126

we were and what we were doing.

127

And I think based off of the vague

answers we gave, he assumed that

128

we all worked for the government.

129

And We all had to be like no, not exactly.

130

And also we were also

like you as a person.

131

Sarah Dixit: Yeah.

132

You could hear bits of our

conversation, but always the like,

133

Most salacious part of a sentence.

134

So.

135

He was like infused by

what we were talking about.

136

Erin Sellers: Yeah.

137

After we got them to engage with

little bit on city government stuff,

138

I started the little shtick of do you

know your city council rep you worked

139

downtown, what's your experience?

140

Because right now I hear like a lot of

really loud voices about what downtown

141

is like, but, the scope works down there.

142

He is really friendly.

143

And he starts telling us about

how, he's not just a bartender.

144

He actually owns the bar.

145

He's, working his nightly shift.

146

And even though he is ostensibly

progressive and has lived in

147

Spokane for most of his life.

148

He too feels alienated

from the actual system.

149

Like he's never felt like he could

just go down to a city council

150

meeting and testify like that.

151

Just didn't.

152

Didn't strike him as an option

for advocating for himself

153

for sharing his experience.

154

And then I think from there, Sarah and

Johnny, and I started asking him more

155

questions and then discussing Johnny's

experience as somebody who also.

156

Works downtown as a service

industry professional.

157

Luke: What was that conversation like?

158

Did he talk about how it's been for him.

159

Running a bar like that downtown.

160

Erin Sellers: Not exactly but he

did mention that this was one of his

161

favorite bars when he was younger.

162

Computer sound: Oh and

163

Erin Sellers: we're not sharing the name

of the bar or the owner, just to protect

164

his identity, he didn't know we were going

to be talking about him on the radio.

165

But he said that it was like the bar

that he grew up drinking in and he.

166

Sentimentally attached to it and was

then able to buy it later in his career.

167

And I've been to that bar multiple

other times and seen him working there.

168

So I don't think it was

like a one-off occasion.

169

Luke: Yeah.

170

Erin Sellers: That he just

happened to be picking up a shift.

171

Joni Harris: I might not be

related, but as you can say that

172

beyond silos in the way we think.

173

Like the actual physical.

174

The morning shifts night shifts.

175

It really.

176

Isolates you as a community.

177

So within the street, I'll usually

quite everyone knows each other.

178

That's all you can really hang out with

because you're working late at night.

179

And then you go out.

180

And you sleep in.

181

And I mean, you're gonna be working,

doing like a five o'clock city council.

182

Computer sound: Right.

183

Joni Harris: Or any events at the

library in the morning or afternoon?

184

It's just not convenient at all.

185

Luke: Yeah, there's just

not real cultural space.

186

I mean in Spokane, but really

most places for night shift

187

workers or swing shift workers.

188

It's really true.

189

K, what's it like for you?

190

you lived in Spokane for a while.

191

You left for awhile, you came back.

192

How did you find it changed?

193

And how did you find your community?

194

Connecting or not connecting around

election stuff and just economic issues.

195

Kai Teo: Oh, that's a big question.

196

I mean, I think the first thing

that struck me is just that

197

Spokane has grown so much.

198

Right.

199

It's just construction.

200

And everywhere.

201

And when.

202

When I left.

203

I left.

204

But brother behind.

205

Cause he was going to.

206

One of the colleges here.

207

And current prices have.

208

Just skyrocket.

209

And that's part of why we moved back.

210

Now he's living with us and we're

combining, Income and stuff like that.

211

Again.

212

Because I think his red.

213

Bye.

214

Hundreds.

215

A year.

216

And so.

217

That has been a challenge that

I've been I'm sharing more

218

and more through his friends.

219

So like in terms of finding community,

most of the folks that I used to

220

hang out with, they've all left.

221

A lot of my friends are now his

friends and they're all younger.

222

And just trying to find.

223

Their space.

224

And cost of living has

just finished college.

225

Yeah.

226

Spokane so purple, similar to Dallas.

227

I think, yeah.

228

And that hasn't been a.

229

An interesting contrast because.

230

Dallas feels like Aiden much.

231

Bigger version of Spokane.

232

Luke: Interesting.

233

Kai Teo: I don't know

how much that answers.

234

Luke: It does a little bit.

235

Yeah.

236

so you left the spokesman, what year?

237

Kai Teo: This would

238

Luke: have been

239

Kai Teo: End of 2018.

240

Luke: Yeah, you left during the.

241

I mean, it was getting more expensive,

but you left during the good rent times.

242

And then came back what,

like just a year ago.

243

Kai Teo: Yeah, I came back just last year.

244

When I first moved to Spokane.

245

I was making 48,000.

246

And I was paying for my brother's college.

247

And our apartment together.

248

Wow.

249

So.

250

I don't think that's possible anymore.

251

Luke: I would say not no.

252

I mean, I was thinking there's also this

generational thing, are we all millennia?

253

Sellers is the Zoomer.

254

everybody else is a millennial.

255

I'm like the oldest possible

millennial, I'm a gen X cusper.

256

And I mean, I bought a house back

257

buy than rent and rent was cheap.

258

And so that's the other disconnect like

you guys are talking about, it used to be.

259

pretty affordable to be young

and, figuring things out.

260

Working a service job going to school.

261

And now it's just not anymore.

262

And I don't even know if.

263

Elder millennials really who maybe got the

last vestiges of the nineties economy or

264

the early two thousands economy realize

how tough it's been for, younger folks,

265

So did the conversation.

266

That night at the bar.

267

is there a sense that there needs to

be like more of a welcoming in, or Like

268

Johnny, do you feel like you just go

lobby a council person for something to

269

help you with your rent or something.

270

Joni Harris: I think

less of an accessibility.

271

And more of what's the point?

272

Sure you could go testify.

273

Have your 62nd sign.

274

Second.

275

If you get

276

Computer sound: yeah.

277

Joni Harris: But I think

it's more impactful if.

278

Uh, Council member comes into your space.

279

You have an opportunity

to talk to them there.

280

think that's where I'm at.

281

Erin Sellers: We were talking about

the political and he was like, wow.

282

If I would have heard about that,

that would have been something I

283

would've gone to go hang out with

politicians at a bar, get to ask them.

284

Questions in a space that you

are more comfortable with.

285

And he also mentioned I think he

said something about the informality

286

of that environment would feel.

287

A lot less Scary or unfamiliar, like just

being able to have a beer and a pizza.

288

And if you're not having a

good time, you can just leave.

289

Right.

290

Where it feels weird to walk

out of a city council meeting.

291

And a different way.

292

Computer sound: Yeah.

293

Sarah Dixit: Yeah.

294

I think we were asking what are.

295

The types of events like

you would be interested in.

296

Going to, or attending

and bringing people.

297

And.

298

Maybe, or you remember this

better than I do, but he said

299

something along the lines of.

300

he wouldn't necessarily host

something because it would

301

be perceived as political.

302

Even though he himself is Pretty

politically involved and like, think.

303

A lot of things are coded.

304

Political, even if they're not necessarily

And I think like The separation

305

between political and partisan.

306

Has to be.

307

Outlined.

308

Sometimes so that people can feel

more comfortable about it, because,

309

I mean, if people are listening to

this on Thanksgiving day and being.

310

This gives them something to

talk about at the dinner table.

311

People are told to avoid

conversations like these,

312

Computer sound: right.

313

Sarah Dixit: And so

it's hard to break that.

314

Barrier that a lot of people

hold where it's we don't talk

315

about this kind of stuff.

316

Computer sound: Yeah.

317

Erin Sellers: I mean when I was

pitching the political, one of

318

the bars that was originally on my

route, turned us down and said that.

319

They did not want us to come because

they were worried, not necessarily about

320

us, but about their regulars, turning

it into a big national political fight.

321

And they said that.

322

They'd already been

having to tone down the.

323

The Biden Trump talk has at that

point, Biden hadn't dropped out.

324

Oh

325

Luke: yeah, that's right.

326

Erin Sellers: And they didn't want to open

that can't afford hymns or open themselves

327

up to political, arguing in their bar.

328

Luke: our political differences are

tearing our neighborhood bars apart.

329

Sarah, You're an organizer.

330

when you're organizing folks,

how do you break through.

331

These sorts of sentiments,

they seem pretty pervasive.

332

And I don't, it doesn't

seem at least I don't hear.

333

A lot of discussion around community or

from a community organizing perspective of

334

like how to entice people or what are the

pre, preconditions that organizers find.

335

R there's just a, there's a sort of an

expectation again, maybe more in the.

336

Capital L liberal spaces.

337

And I includes, the traditional

liberals, like maybe, moderate

338

Republicans as well of a certain Stripe

of around like voting is your duty.

339

It's your civic duty.

340

You should just do it, whether it

means anything to you or not like a.

341

My parents didn't even watch the news.

342

They would do to flee vote

every election cycle, but they

343

weren't politically engaged.

344

And It seems like How I grew up is

become more and more common, And maybe,

345

more at the national level than locally,

because I feel like we're doing some

346

good work organizing around things

like, showing up at public meetings and

347

that's one of the reasons range exists.

348

But naturally the idea is like it's

your duty to vote and then, whoever

349

you elect, we'll take it from there.

350

And that's clearly not

resonating with people, right.

351

Sarah Dixit: Yeah, I didn't get.

352

Really.

353

Centered around community.

354

That should be first and foremost

when people are talking about.

355

Voting or civic engagement.

356

And also not assuming everybody

has the same knowledge because.

357

Or education.

358

Just isn't the greatest in terms

of explaining how to combat

359

the powers that be because.

360

You can earn interest.

361

And so talking to people

about what matters to them.

362

And like Johnny said, going

to where they are is huge.

363

And not necessarily trying

to make community events or

364

make messaging that can reach.

365

the most people, but like genuinely

hearing a community and speaking to them

366

about the thing that matters to them.

367

And Derek concerns.

368

Is really important to like

deep relational organizing.

369

Having people bring.

370

Friends.

371

Loved ones to events.

372

Talking to them about the issues

that are important to them.

373

So some folks.

374

Might say that the economy is

what's most important to them.

375

So talking through The different.

376

Things that were on the ballot, like

the sales tax, like it seems pretty low.

377

But it was a point, 1% increase.

378

Right.

379

But if you're someone who doesn't

make a ton of money, that is a

380

bigger hit on you than it does.

381

On folks who are make a higher income,

382

Computer sound: right.

383

Sarah Dixit: So I think just Boiling

things down as much as possible, too.

384

Language people understand because

a lot of it is confusing on purpose.

385

But I think.

386

Then talking about things and

how they're connected like,

387

if you care about this issue.

388

So for me, I purchased Washington.

389

It's a lot of talking

about reproductive rights.

390

So if someone is passionate about

abortion access, for example,

391

We can obviously point to.

392

The federal government

and show how they impact.

393

Some access to abortion.

394

So we would talk about,

President Supreme court.

395

All those things, but then trickling it

down so that people can understand how

396

that same issue that they care deeply

about is impacted at our local level.

397

And being able to.

398

talk to people.

399

Aye.

400

The perspective of the issues

they care about less though.

401

This is why you should vote blue

no matter who type the thing.

402

Computer sound: Right.

403

Sarah Dixit: Cause that's really not.

404

An inspiring message.

405

And I think even just like letting people

not necessarily like vote for a candidate.

406

And then still fill out

the rest of their ballot.

407

Like being able to tell people.

408

rather than not voting at all, People

can vote for the candidates or the

409

issues that they really believe in.

410

To just increase civic

engagement and like knowing.

411

How to be involved.

412

And also knowing that interim.

413

Is also so important.

414

So Following.

415

Politicians and candidates

after they've been elected.

416

And how do you continue to lobby them?

417

Because once they are in office,

once you got them into office,

418

like you're their boss, right.

419

They were creative,

420

Luke: theoretically.

421

Yeah.

422

Sarah Dixit: Yeah, theoretically.

423

So how do we continue that pressure?

424

And not just forget

the promises they made.

425

And hold them accountable to

the things that you voted.

426

Computer sound: Yeah.

427

Sarah Dixit: Yeah.

428

And it's mostly just.

429

Listening to people and like genuinely

hearing what they're saying and not.

430

Got flooding them and

telling them they're wrong.

431

Luke: Right.

432

Sarah Dixit: Because look at these charts.

433

Luke: K.

434

What was your, did the folks

in your friend group, your

435

brother other family, friends.

436

Did people by and large vote.

437

Did they see it as a duty and.

438

And did it, did they

engage in other civic?

439

Things like, public meetings

for letter writing or other

440

community organizing work.

441

Kai Teo: I think they voted.

442

Yep.

443

Not all of them can vote.

444

Like, you know,

445

Something that I kept hearing from.

446

It was how They logically understand,

and that local races are important.

447

Right.

448

But at the same time,

don't feel particularly.

449

I mean, we've talked about engagement.

450

Excite Lynn was something that

constantly came up there's

451

nothing inspiring or citing.

452

And the sense that I got.

453

From them.

454

Was a lot of.

455

a lot of disappointment.

456

something that I constantly wonder is

like, We seem to be looking for this.

457

You.

458

It has to be exciting.

459

It has to be inspiring as stuff like that.

460

And not maybe understanding

that this is a slog.

461

And it's the, the

accountability part, right?

462

Like even if you voted the person that you

liked is an office and stuff like that.

463

Yes, it's not the end of it.

464

Right.

465

It is a slog to constantly go back and be

like, are things changing for the better,

466

it's sometimes to search for it was.

467

That's back sometimes it's two steps back.

468

Yeah.

469

It's frustrating.

470

And.

471

To me that seems but I mean, politics

and Malaysia is really messy.

472

It always feels like it's

not really progressing.

473

So.

474

Maybe that's why the slog.

475

Part.

476

Is.

477

frustrating for me, but I get it.

478

I wonder if that is a lot more

good moralizing for other people.

479

Yeah.

480

Especially if you've.

481

If you've grown up.

482

So say aspiring Obama era.

483

Or Bernie's campaigns.

484

I hear that a lot.

485

That was very inspiring for them.

486

Erin Sellers: I was pretty

struck by something.

487

Johnny said.

488

Drinks about how your colleagues,

like they're politically informed

489

maybe, or Have a sense of politics.

490

But when it came to the national

election, it just felt like regardless

491

of who they cast their vote for, they'd

still be coming into work and going

492

home to their expensive apartments,

493

and nothing materially

would get better or worse.

494

Like that kind of disillusionment of

neither of these people care about

495

the working class and regardless

of my political involvement things

496

are gonna stay roughly the same.

497

Am I representing what you said correctly?

498

Joni Harris: Yeah.

499

And I was in response to it.

500

K said, and that I recently

learned about the term.

501

Horseshoeing.

502

So.

503

I'm using that word a lot.

504

I think that mindset.

505

Even if you hold.

506

Progressive values.

507

If you get in that mindset

of kind of nothing matters.

508

And it's you against the world.

509

I think.

510

It's pretty easy to horseshoe into.

511

I don't know.

512

Sarah Dixit: Understand what I'm saying.

513

That makes sense.

514

I think so.

515

I think.

516

To that point.

517

The more we feed into that.

518

discouraging plays.

519

The more isolated, you can feel the more,

it feels I'm not going to vote or Yeah.

520

If it really doesn't matter who

I vote for, I'm going to vote for

521

Trump or whoever is the most like.

522

Out there, candidate.

523

Yeah.

524

It's like nothing matters.

525

Anyway,

526

Joni Harris: I go ahead.

527

I guess I can't say this,

but you can enter it up.

528

There was one colleague

whose colleague who was.

529

Seemingly very progressive.

530

But when I say things like I just

want a president who like at least.

531

You living life.

532

Yeah.

533

Luke: Yeah.

534

voting based on.

535

Joni Harris: It's like trying to give

back at your parents or something

536

when you're literally, you're like I'm

going to do this just to make you mad.

537

You know?

538

Like,

539

Luke: And do you feel like that's a,

among the colleagues of yours that have

540

historically been more progressive?

541

was that.

542

In some way, retaliatory against

a national democratic party that

543

hadn't actually delivered or.

544

we're going to pivot in.

545

to the second part of this here

but we keep bringing up rent and

546

just how expensive it is to live.

547

As working people.

548

Pretty much anywhere in

America, certainly the west and

549

certainly Spokane specifically.

550

And the idea of engagement this is for

everybody, like friends of yours who are

551

struggling with rent and stuff like that.

552

Are they aware It's illegal

to do actual rent protections

553

and rent control in this state.

554

But the city council is trying

to do things that make it a

555

little harder to raise rent or

to at least give people warning.

556

Are people aware of that?

557

This is Luke popping in here for

a second in the editing bay To

558

demonstrate the length of the silence

that came after this question.

559

Searching for examples.

560

Of government, not just doing

something for working people.

561

Which is step one, but then.

562

Letting people know that it's actually

happening, which is pretty important

563

Kai Teo: For context.

564

We're shaking our heads because.

565

No, I don't.

566

I know

567

like my friends are not aware of it.

568

Yeah.

569

It's definitely new.

570

Computer sound: Yeah.

571

Sarah Dixit: Of mine who know

are people who are also in.

572

The like political landscape

or law students that can zag.

573

So learning about.

574

The rights that they should have.

575

Computer sound: Yeah.

576

Sarah Dixit: But

overwhelmingly, I would say.

577

No.

578

Yeah.

579

Erin Sellers: I live with three

other renters and none of them

580

knew until I jokingly told them

oh, we're coming up on December.

581

We haven't gotten the six month

rent raise notice from our landlord.

582

Count those days down.

583

And they had no idea

what I was talking about.

584

talked to another journalist

in town who said that he got

585

a rat race from his landlord.

586

He's on a month to month lease.

587

And he got a communication from

his landlord that was like, we're

588

raising your rent next month.

589

And he emailed them back and was like,

no, you're not actually here's the SMC.

590

But it says that you have to give me a six

months notice before you raise my rent.

591

And they immediately paved.

592

But I think most people don't know that's

a tool that they have in their pocket.

593

And only if you're somebody who

literally Cover city council meetings

594

or engages with politics on a daily

basis, local politics on a daily

595

basis, you are not going to know that.

596

Luke: And so as you're like the personal

Walter Cronkite for your roommates, right.

597

You literally read the news to them.

598

Erin Sellers: Yes.

599

And then also more practical stuff.

600

The other day, one of them texted me

and was like, there's this really big

601

truck parked outside of our house.

602

And I'm worried they're going to shut our

intersection down for like road repairs.

603

And I was able to send them the

city website that's shows where

604

city construction is happening.

605

It'd be like, I'm too busy, but

check this list for intersections.

606

Not on it.

607

You're fine to be parked where you are.

608

Just little stuff like that.

609

I now have become the local expert for

my 20 something year old gen Z, friends

610

who do not want to pick up a newspaper.

611

Yeah.

612

Luke: So whereabouts are you go into this

little brainstorming session about a.

613

Tool that came out of this conversation.

614

And the reporting errands been doing

around these new rent control adjacent.

615

Things that the city council has been

passing since earlier this year, right.

616

So

617

Erin Sellers: there was.

618

In 2023, it was passed by the

previous council that required

619

landlords to register their rental

units and to get business licenses.

620

But that's legislation didn't

really have any teeth in it

621

besides a pretty small fine, right.

622

And so this current 2024 batch

of council members have amended

623

that old law from 2023 to include.

624

Uh, Penalty of if you do not follow

these restrictions, If you don't get

625

your business license, if you don't

register units, you actually can't

626

raise rent or evict tenants until you

have complied with the legislation.

627

And then there was a second piece.

628

Passed earlier this year that said

that landlords cannot raise your rent

629

without giving you six months notice

or raise your rent by more than 3%.

630

If they're raising it by $50.

631

That's okay.

632

But if they're going to give a big spike

and rent, they have to give you notice.

633

So that was passed earlier this year.

634

Luke: And so you left the

conversation the other night sellers

635

saying, Hey, can we host a party?

636

As range that helps.

637

Get people to come and look

up whether they're landlord.

638

is part of the registry

has filed his or her there.

639

Business license.

640

I mean, this was the thing that we

realized when the initial law was

641

passed earlier this year, that.

642

A lot of landlords don't visit.

643

I mean, these are businesses, right?

644

this is an investment property.

645

but A lot of landlords we heard

from that were against this that

646

very first law requiring registry.

647

I didn't even have business

licenses, which kind of blew my mind.

648

And I feel like I'm old.

649

So I've seen a lot of surprising things.

650

It was really shocking to me,

the number of landlords Who had

651

a sense of entitlement about

not needing a business license.

652

Erin Sellers: Yeah, there was a lot

of that at the council testimony.

653

But yeah, I left that conversation with

Johnny and the bartender and Sarah just

654

being like, we should throw a party.

655

Where you can just show up, get free food.

656

And we will tell you if your

landlord can raise your rent or not.

657

Give people resources to

advocate for themselves.

658

Luke: Right.

659

I want to do that party.

660

I also, and this is why.

661

Kai is with us here.

662

when you told me this story sellers, I

immediately thought we should try to build

663

a web tool that could do the same thing.

664

So people can't come to the party.

665

Or, people can share this among their

friends and see if we can build something

666

that would just allow people at a glance

and much easier than the city site.

667

We don't have to get into how hard

it is to search the city's website.

668

I failed at it earlier today.

669

Gosh, it's

670

Erin Sellers: so hard.

671

Luke: Impossible Cause you have to

look up to the different places.

672

So the law that was

recently passed, said that.

673

If you're a landlord who it hasn't.

674

Created a business license

for your rental business.

675

Or you haven't Put your individual

rental units on the rental registry.

676

If either of those, you haven't done.

677

You're not allowed to raise rent at all.

678

And then that compounds with the

previous law that you have to

679

give people six months notice.

680

So the idea would be that this

sort of a tool could at least

681

give folks who are renting.

682

Way to put off a rent raise that might

make them more housing and secure.

683

And if we could build something like

that and get it out to everybody,

684

that would be a pretty cool thing.

685

And I guess this is me.

686

Advocating for.

687

The ranges idea here, but

one of the things that you

688

guys were mentioning about.

689

Folks coming into.

690

Other people's spaces.

691

So, like you were saying Politicians

showing up to political sellers and

692

Johnny, you were talking about your

colleagues being like, why don't.

693

politicians come into our place

of work, where we're comfortable.

694

I've heard that in a lot of

different spaces over the

695

years in different contexts.

696

I wonder if that's true of journalism too.

697

That.

698

Newsrooms and maybe especially

range has to demonstrate.

699

They, one of the reasons I want to

build this tool is it feels like it's

700

a really tangible example and that

will take people like five minutes.

701

To be like, what is what's range about?

702

Oh, it's about helping you get the

information you need to live the life

703

you wanna live or, fight back against.

704

In injustices.

705

Or things that'll make

your life more difficult.

706

It feels like actually building

a tool or even hosting the party.

707

Like you're talking about sellers.

708

Coming into a conceptual space of Hey,

you're a renter and you're constantly

709

living in fear of your rent being raised.

710

Here's a tool that can

help you fight back.

711

Is that a meaningful political

intervention that would get your

712

friends to either be interested in.

713

Following along with some of the stuff

that's been happening politically in

714

Spokane and, or get politically active.

715

Joni Harris: I think it's a cool idea.

716

And I'm really excited about it.

717

I think the marketing of it

would need to be thought through.

718

And I don't know if I have

anything useful to say about that.

719

But my one request.

720

Would be that like, if.

721

Even putting information.

722

If give these results and

then if there could be a.

723

To call them.

724

And there's like a form

document, like an example letter.

725

I'm like something you can send

to your landlord or something.

726

I'm like for people who maybe don't speak

English, like how can you present this?

727

Or if you're really shy, And that's

his intimidating to go up against

728

authority and people who are housing you.

729

Computer sound: Yeah.

730

Joni Harris: even if I knew

all the laws and all my rights.

731

What's my, what can I do?

732

Small claims court.

733

I'm not going to do that.

734

I'm so desperate, but that's going to cost

money I'll just let them screw me over.

735

I'm not doing that.

736

Luke: Those are awesome.

737

Thoughts, Johnny.

738

do you think?

739

something like this.

740

could move the needle in terms

of getting people engaged.

741

Joni Harris: Yes.

742

But also.

743

I think.

744

More importantly, it's just a

really practical, necessary tool.

745

Computer sound: Yeah.

746

Joni Harris: And even if.

747

People don't get more engaged.

748

It's the right thing to do, I think,

749

Sarah Dixit: That's what I was

thinking too, is sometimes we,

750

especially in spaces where.

751

You have grant funds or there's something

that we have to tied to a tool or a

752

program or product recreate or resource.

753

And then there's always that tie in where

it's like, And then this will happen.

754

And sometimes I feel like our

expectations are very specific

755

to one aspect of the thing that

we're doing, not the thing itself.

756

Computer sound: Yeah.

757

Sarah Dixit: And so.

758

I think.

759

With the tool.

760

even if people use it

and then they're Forget.

761

Who ranges.

762

I think just being able to.

763

Hold space for those people who are

going to use a tool and be really

764

grateful, even if you never know.

765

Right.

766

Erin Sellers: I really resonated

with what Johnny said, this is a

767

tiny bit of a tangent, but I've been

following national party politics.

768

Around transgender issues and there's this

big conversation going on right now about

769

What do we win votes or would it be more

effective if we left trans people hanging?

770

If we stopped advocating for gender

neutral bathrooms and rights for

771

trans people, and I feel like the

question should maybe be more.

772

What is the right thing to do?

773

What is the thing that benefits

people, regardless of whether

774

it wins votes or attention?

775

I think offering people a tangible benefit

and commitment to values and mission.

776

Hopefully that will result in brand

engagement and like political investment.

777

And, maybe at the end of the day, like

boats or membership, But really, it makes

778

it clear who we are and what we stand for.

779

And it's doing the right

thing to do the right thing.

780

Luke: right.

781

Did you have any thoughts?

782

Cut.

783

Kai Teo: I.

784

I've been a fan of

range and all the world.

785

They all do.

786

And I try to help as much as I can.

787

Because there, there is a need, right?

788

For.

789

For the Spokane region for.

790

These kinds of space and thought and work.

791

It would be nice if

things were always viewed.

792

So transactionally.

793

Whether it's folding or with, the

labor that we put into to things.

794

And.

795

Back to the tool.

796

Building on Johnny's idea of

Automated Here's the letter.

797

Here's how you set it or a button.

798

You should just click out of sense.

799

But also after that Explaining to people.

800

What's the next step

that could happen, right?

801

You might shoot back.

802

You might not, if you need more

resources, here's where you go.

803

If you hear back and it's terrifying

because they're saying a bunch of mean

804

things about you or threatening you like.

805

Yes you are.

806

People you should reach out to.

807

Right, right.

808

Because sometimes there

are these tools where.

809

It just kinda goes off and

then you're like, oh, okay.

810

I'm sitting here.

811

What's that?

812

Luke: Totally.

813

Let's get into it.

814

let's start with where Johnny and

work high, started what would a

815

perfect tool like this or a the

best possible tool we could build?

816

Look like it would.

817

Allow you to easily put in the

address of where you live and, The

818

name of your landlord or the business

that you rent from and get this

819

basic bit of information of whether

they're on the registry, whether

820

they have a business license or not.

821

And then, sellers you

kind of ran through this.

822

When you were talking about this

law, you said SMC ball, all blah.

823

SMC is the, smoke in municipal code?

824

It's the book of laws that govern

stuff in Spokane specifically.

825

I don't think most people

know what SMC means.

826

And so having something that's Hey,

just so you know, landlord, you aren't

827

on the rent and rental registry.

828

so raising my rent would

be a violation of this law.

829

And also, even if you get on the registry,

you have to give me six months notice from

830

this date that you're telling me, you're

going to raise my rent per this other SMC.

831

In order for you to be legally

allowed to raise my rent.

832

So that's step one.

833

And

834

like you were saying, Johnny, It's

idea of like just the form letter

835

could just be copy and paste so you can

email this or print it out and send it.

836

That's step one.

837

And then you're what you're talking about.

838

Ty.

839

It's okay well, What if that isn't enough?

840

Like you were saying.

841

Sellers or their colleague in journalism.

842

Did that to their landlord, the

landlord immediately backed down.

843

Okay.

844

That's maybe the Best

outcome for this scenario.

845

What if the landlord doesn't back

down or what if you do have to go

846

to small claims court to your point,

Johnny Fisk, if this escalates Yeah.

847

Basically like an explainer, you're saying

hi, to be like, okay, here's step one.

848

it's almost like a choose

your own adventure if your

849

landlord backs down cool.

850

You've got six months either.

851

Figure out a new living situation or to

get a new job to help you afford that

852

rent or pick up more hours at work.

853

If that doesn't work, then here

are the other potential recourses.

854

What else could we add

to this that would help.

855

Erin Sellers: I think city council

contact info, because I've seen a

856

couple of times at council where

somebody living in a district comes

857

with a really specific problem and

is Hey, this is happening to me.

858

And council members have stepped in

to either solve that problem or email

859

somebody, and just having that weights

of an elected official behind you.

860

Can be pretty important.

861

Also, they don't always get to hear when

a policy that they've approved is working.

862

Usually they only hear when it's not

working or if somebody has an issue.

863

With it.

864

So I'd like to include something end.

865

I mean, this is part of the,

choose your own adventure too.

866

If your landlord doesn't back

down, you told us your address.

867

That means that we now know

you're in council district one.

868

Here's your council members.

869

Here's their contact info.

870

Here's a letter to send

to your council members.

871

That's Hey mom.

872

Allaying SMC, whatever.

873

What can I do about that?

874

Or I thought she'd want to know,

because this is your district.

875

Or if your landlord does back

down you can still send an email.

876

That's like, Hey, thank

you for passing this law.

877

It helped me get an

extra six months of time.

878

I really appreciate that.

879

The kind of gives them that

feedback about whether what they

880

were doing is working or not.

881

Luke: For sure.

882

Yeah.

883

And that would be a pretty easy thing

to pull off, I think again, not a

884

coder, but that would be pretty doable.

885

And I think sending that email

and saying I need help I think

886

you'd get good outcomes from that.

887

Or, Hey, thanks for doing this.

888

This really helped me keep my, housing.

889

Could be the sort of positive interaction

that leads to more engagement over time.

890

Right?

891

I mean, am I fully myself to think

that if you get a good response, you

892

might, it might lead you to do it again.

893

Sarah Dixit: Yeah.

894

I think that is.

895

A good way of thinking of, but

I think also like, How council

896

currently gets a lot of its feedback

is through neighborhood councils.

897

Computer sound: Right?

898

Sarah Dixit: The issue with

those is they're not often filled

899

with people who look like me.

900

Or people who are.

901

working multiple jobs

902

yeah.

903

People who

904

Luke: work late, you were talking about

Johnny people with young kids who don't

905

have ready access to, daycare and stuff.

906

They're just so many roadblocks

to participation in things

907

like neighborhood councils.

908

Yeah.

909

Sarah Dixit: Yeah.

910

So I think Really trying to show.

911

Council members and other people who are

making the laws that like that isn't an

912

accurate reflection of the full district.

913

Computer sound: Yeah.

914

Sarah Dixit: And each.

915

It has so many neighborhoods

and each one are so different.

916

Like we are both district one.

917

I live.

918

In BMS.

919

So just outside of Logan.

920

And before Hillier,

921

Computer sound: right.

922

Sarah Dixit: And she lives downtown.

923

very different experiences

and oftentimes down to.

924

Isn't considered a neighborhood.

925

legit is right.

926

Right.

927

So I think the hard part is.

928

Even though it's nice that

we only have three districts.

929

There's so many different types

of communities in each one.

930

Right?

931

So.

932

Experience.

933

Isn't always going to be

relayed back to council.

934

So how do we collect that data?

935

Computer sound: Yeah.

936

Sarah Dixit: And make sure that.

937

Data points are accurately

representing the individual

938

experiences of people in the community.

939

Luke: That is a.

940

Perfect segue to my next question,

which was there's the things that

941

we need to provide the folks that

would be using this tool and this,

942

all this information would be.

943

Optional for people to

add, I was wondering CA.

944

what are some data points that you would

want to know as a journalist around like

945

optional stuff for people to add in?

946

I was thinking.

947

how long have you lived, where you live?

948

What was the rent when you started what's

rent right now and what are what's?

949

What are they trying to raise it to

would be a really fascinating data point.

950

And again, we would make this

all optional for people, but

951

I would really want to know.

952

I mean, I've got a, I've got a

a family member who's on a fixed

953

income recently retired, but

working class, her whole life who.

954

Got affordable relatively affordable.

955

An apartment.

956

On the south hill by target.

957

And is struggling to pay her rent and Is

like the thousandth person on the list

958

for vouchers and it's, she even lives in a

complex that could, that accepts vouchers.

959

And it's just very unlikely

that she's going to get it.

960

And so, What are some other pieces and

she's lived there for a while, right?

961

So it's people aren't

becoming precariously housed.

962

From a drastic change in circumstances,

it's just like the water's slowly

963

turning up and the frogs are

boiling a little bit in some cases.

964

So What are the things that

you would want to know?

965

Or you would be even willing to offer

as a renter that you think would be.

966

Helpful for people to understand

967

In Spokane.

968

Kai Teo: In terms of data

that they're entering.

969

And I'm not sure this would be

information they would want to track.

970

Just because, Privacy reasons.

971

Stuff like that but knowing the

number of bedrooms they're renting.

972

That's important.

973

Computer sound: Right.

974

Kai Teo: Listening to you talk like

something came up to mind, right?

975

Like there, there's always this

huge information asymmetry.

976

When it comes to renting.

977

And buying houses and stuff like that.

978

Yeah.

979

Right.

980

Like we rely on,

apartments.com cylinder con.

981

It's stuff like that.

982

But years ago I worked at a

different news organization.

983

We have access to CoStar.

984

Which.

985

If y'all have not used it before it has.

986

Commercial real estate data.

987

And.

988

And all that jazz, you can track

it by zip, by neighborhood.

989

You can find.

990

The actual owner of a building

is instead of just, It could be

991

Luke: the random MOC B.

992

Sorry.

993

Like of the random, like some

nameless LLC that it's actually under.

994

Yeah.

995

Kai Teo: Yup.

996

Yup.

997

And you can find historical

information and all that jazz and.

998

CoStar.

999

Prides itself.

00:40:19,174 --> 00:40:22,624

If I remember correctly on

helping people maximize rent.

00:40:23,284 --> 00:40:23,584

Right.

00:40:23,734 --> 00:40:24,904

Whether it's commercial or

00:40:24,962 --> 00:40:25,474

Luke: residential.

00:40:25,864 --> 00:40:27,034

Maximize their rent.

00:40:27,064 --> 00:40:27,364

Right.

00:40:27,610 --> 00:40:28,030

yes.

00:40:28,090 --> 00:40:28,300

Yeah.

00:40:28,434 --> 00:40:28,674

Yeah.

00:40:28,870 --> 00:40:29,320

Kai Teo: Yep.

00:40:29,423 --> 00:40:33,053

So, so if you're a business, you

have access to those information,

00:40:33,053 --> 00:40:34,223

like inflammation like that.

00:40:34,733 --> 00:40:38,603

Exists out there, but it's not something.

00:40:39,203 --> 00:40:41,903

A regular person can get access to.

00:40:42,833 --> 00:40:46,403

If it becomes so hard for

you to advocate for yourself.

00:40:46,863 --> 00:40:50,253

Even if somebody registers to

business and stuff like that, they

00:40:50,253 --> 00:40:52,353

raise it by 200 bucks and they do.

00:40:52,353 --> 00:40:54,123

You don't know if that is.

00:40:54,933 --> 00:40:59,133

Extreme cause you can't see

the unit right next door.

00:41:00,903 --> 00:41:01,293

And.

00:41:01,843 --> 00:41:03,613

I think that is a frustrating part.

00:41:03,613 --> 00:41:05,953

Like working on the data side

is there's a lot of it out

00:41:05,983 --> 00:41:08,563

there, but there is such a high.

00:41:09,113 --> 00:41:11,963

Financial barrier for

people to get access to.

00:41:12,293 --> 00:41:12,623

Luke: Right.

00:41:13,053 --> 00:41:13,353

Kai Teo: So.

00:41:13,353 --> 00:41:14,343

It's hard for.

00:41:14,513 --> 00:41:16,043

People to advocate for themselves.

00:41:16,140 --> 00:41:23,280

Even if we create a forum for people to

ensure that data, it is still going to be.

00:41:23,602 --> 00:41:26,362

It's not going to be as strong as.

00:41:26,725 --> 00:41:28,015

What's already out there.

00:41:28,285 --> 00:41:28,585

Luke: Yeah.

00:41:29,965 --> 00:41:30,565

It would be.

00:41:30,985 --> 00:41:33,415

And this would be in a world where

we somehow got a couple thousand

00:41:33,445 --> 00:41:34,975

people to use this tool or something.

00:41:35,005 --> 00:41:36,595

It would be pretty amazing.

00:41:36,595 --> 00:41:38,785

So we would have zip code

data In neighborhood data, we

00:41:38,785 --> 00:41:40,375

would be able to anonymize.

00:41:40,375 --> 00:41:42,085

This would be like, Hey yeah, rents are.

00:41:42,115 --> 00:41:45,895

We've I saw a thing that said in,

in Spokane county, the average

00:41:45,895 --> 00:41:49,195

bucks or something of that effect.

00:41:49,195 --> 00:41:52,555

And, but how does that break down

neighborhood by neighborhood?

00:41:52,885 --> 00:41:53,665

Like you were saying.

00:41:53,965 --> 00:41:58,125

Johnny and Sarah need to leave in a second

before y'all go, the final thing I wanted

00:41:58,125 --> 00:42:01,105

to ask about this tool is if we were

to make this, or if we are going to try

00:42:01,105 --> 00:42:02,935

to make this once with once it's ready.

00:42:03,782 --> 00:42:05,252

How do we get this in front of people?

00:42:05,262 --> 00:42:09,321

What are the lanes we should use to try

to, obviously we would, we'd send it

00:42:09,321 --> 00:42:12,951

out in the range newsletter, but that

only goes to 5,500 people right now.

00:42:12,951 --> 00:42:15,441

So what would we do to.

00:42:15,758 --> 00:42:18,488

Try to get this in front

of every renter in Spokane.

00:42:19,217 --> 00:42:21,347

Sarah Dixit: I feel it a lot, so good job.

00:42:21,617 --> 00:42:21,917

Thank you.

00:42:22,997 --> 00:42:24,677

I think like sometimes like old.

00:42:25,337 --> 00:42:25,877

Old school.

00:42:25,877 --> 00:42:28,357

I'm going to put that in

quotes more so you see it?

00:42:28,417 --> 00:42:29,077

In larger cities.

00:42:30,457 --> 00:42:34,087

But being able to like flier on poles,

00:42:34,447 --> 00:42:35,527

Luke: physically flyering.

00:42:35,527 --> 00:42:35,797

Yeah.

00:42:36,127 --> 00:42:38,347

Sarah Dixit: Deeply firing,

there's so many times.

00:42:38,377 --> 00:42:40,477

We're like walking by

something and being like, cool.

00:42:40,747 --> 00:42:41,287

That's funny.

00:42:41,697 --> 00:42:46,707

And oftentimes in businesses, like

when you asked the flyer, it's

00:42:46,707 --> 00:42:50,337

always in a weird place, so then it

sometimes doesn't feel effective.

00:42:50,727 --> 00:42:54,987

So I think just like knowing where

community boards are and where you can

00:42:54,987 --> 00:42:58,557

put it in the window, or maybe even

asking a business, if you can put it.

00:42:59,067 --> 00:43:02,937

Like a little thing on the cash

register, like around there.

00:43:03,037 --> 00:43:07,897

I think like knowing which

businesses are cool with that.

00:43:07,987 --> 00:43:08,257

Yeah.

00:43:08,827 --> 00:43:09,697

And especially with.

00:43:10,357 --> 00:43:14,257

Hopefully all of them have experienced

what it's like to be a renter and

00:43:14,257 --> 00:43:16,267

how difficult it is to like, no.

00:43:17,077 --> 00:43:18,217

What anything is.

00:43:19,267 --> 00:43:21,417

Into the humanity of just listen.

00:43:21,597 --> 00:43:23,037

Like we need to get the word out.

00:43:23,037 --> 00:43:24,417

This is a really great tool.

00:43:24,447 --> 00:43:26,037

This isn't partisan.

00:43:26,847 --> 00:43:28,537

And you don't need to pitch it to anyone.

00:43:28,597 --> 00:43:30,547

It's just like having this

information out there.

00:43:30,577 --> 00:43:30,967

Computer sound: Yeah.

00:43:31,477 --> 00:43:34,897

Sarah Dixit: And I think if

we did something like a party.

00:43:35,497 --> 00:43:35,977

Like habit.

00:43:36,127 --> 00:43:39,217

Things that are social events

where people don't have to

00:43:39,257 --> 00:43:41,177

give anything or do anything.

00:43:41,357 --> 00:43:42,437

They can just be there.

00:43:42,977 --> 00:43:44,117

And you're just like, great.

00:43:44,117 --> 00:43:45,977

This is our launch party for this.

00:43:47,207 --> 00:43:50,357

And here's the information, but that's it

like take it or leave it type of thing.

00:43:50,867 --> 00:43:54,107

And I feel like in Spokane,

it's been very word of mouth.

00:43:54,527 --> 00:43:58,967

So like the more people feel like,

oh, this helped me like the Mo the

00:43:58,967 --> 00:44:02,597

more they're going to talk about it

with their friends or on social media.

00:44:03,107 --> 00:44:03,437

And.

00:44:03,947 --> 00:44:06,497

And telling their friends

via social media, we'll have.

00:44:06,997 --> 00:44:10,177

Higher impact then coming

from a publication,

00:44:10,207 --> 00:44:10,447

Computer sound: yeah.

00:44:11,377 --> 00:44:13,657

Sarah Dixit: So I think

that using multiple ways.

00:44:14,347 --> 00:44:15,127

And.

00:44:16,597 --> 00:44:22,417

Doing so in a way that understands

the different lifestyles people live.

00:44:22,477 --> 00:44:24,247

And for not everyone is going to be.

00:44:24,847 --> 00:44:25,537

At an event.

00:44:26,377 --> 00:44:27,217

At 3:00 PM.

00:44:27,577 --> 00:44:27,757

Computer sound: Right.

00:44:29,077 --> 00:44:29,317

Yeah,

00:44:29,377 --> 00:44:29,737

Sarah Dixit: right.

00:44:30,397 --> 00:44:34,807

Or like even after work hours since work

hours, but very different for each person.

00:44:34,807 --> 00:44:35,107

So.

00:44:36,187 --> 00:44:39,997

I think just being able to

think about events that like.

00:44:40,687 --> 00:44:42,727

You would have wanted to go to.

00:44:43,387 --> 00:44:47,257

As a young person, or as someone who

like was a renter or working multiple

00:44:47,257 --> 00:44:48,817

jobs, like what would get you.

00:44:49,537 --> 00:44:50,047

To like.

00:44:50,827 --> 00:44:52,417

Something else on your plate.

00:44:53,407 --> 00:44:54,037

Pretty full.

00:44:54,727 --> 00:44:55,237

I can see.

00:44:55,597 --> 00:44:56,437

Those being.

00:44:57,097 --> 00:44:58,417

Like fun opportunities.

00:44:59,227 --> 00:45:01,417

I like fun bars popping up.

00:45:01,747 --> 00:45:01,987

Luke: Yeah.

00:45:03,397 --> 00:45:07,027

Yeah, maybe we could do like a

multiple little, engagements at

00:45:07,027 --> 00:45:09,127

different bars around the city.

00:45:09,247 --> 00:45:11,257

Reserve obviously is a

pretty working class bar.

00:45:11,257 --> 00:45:16,227

PJ's other, I mean, our pub crawl bars

would probably be a minimal to that.

00:45:16,797 --> 00:45:17,067

I mean.

00:45:18,037 --> 00:45:21,817

Sarah Dixit: Bar's already have so much

programming, like going to trivia night.

00:45:22,447 --> 00:45:25,777

Packed and just being like, can

I just make a quick announcement?

00:45:26,317 --> 00:45:26,557

Computer sound: And

00:45:26,887 --> 00:45:28,087

Sarah Dixit: seeing what they say.

00:45:28,507 --> 00:45:30,037

I think you using the.

00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:34,380

subcultures that already exist using

the infrastructure that already exists.

00:45:34,920 --> 00:45:37,140

And meeting people where

they're already at.

00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:39,540

And like the plans that they already have.

00:45:40,050 --> 00:45:45,450

And just being able to let them know of

this opportunity to use this resource.

00:45:45,850 --> 00:45:49,440

But not necessarily having to

put a huge workload on you or

00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,300

sellers to like, create this whole.

00:45:51,660 --> 00:45:54,090

It's funny a lot of time.

00:45:54,700 --> 00:45:57,490

I think using the resources

that already exist.

00:45:57,850 --> 00:45:58,210

Awesome.

00:45:59,278 --> 00:46:02,188

Luke: I was thinking like, this is totally

the sort of thing my mom would have

00:46:02,188 --> 00:46:03,448

sent to me if she would have seen it.

00:46:03,448 --> 00:46:03,628

Right.

00:46:03,628 --> 00:46:08,038

So I think there's a potentially a

generational thing here too, where it's

00:46:08,038 --> 00:46:11,548

If you read range and you own your home,

you probably know a renter, I guess.

00:46:11,818 --> 00:46:13,888

Do you feel, I mean, Johnny's the only.

00:46:13,888 --> 00:46:15,538

The renter left on the

call right now, I think.

00:46:15,538 --> 00:46:19,638

But is this the sort of thing you would

pass off to a friend who's a renter or.

00:46:19,927 --> 00:46:20,317

Joni Harris: Yeah, I.

00:46:20,847 --> 00:46:23,957

I'm trying to imagine how you

get this into The break room.

00:46:24,254 --> 00:46:25,184

Franz bakery,

00:46:25,304 --> 00:46:25,544

Luke: yeah.

00:46:25,887 --> 00:46:27,927

Like those big kind of

working class employers.

00:46:27,957 --> 00:46:28,227

Yeah.

00:46:28,479 --> 00:46:31,615

Joni Harris: And I don't know exactly

how you do it, but I feel like it's

00:46:31,645 --> 00:46:33,085

something that will, if you can.

00:46:33,237 --> 00:46:35,487

I just start it with

a big group of people.

00:46:35,915 --> 00:46:36,905

Like word of mouth.

00:46:37,235 --> 00:46:38,795

I mean, who wouldn't want to share that?

00:46:39,185 --> 00:46:39,455

Luke: Yeah.

00:46:39,620 --> 00:46:43,430

Sarah Dixit: And I think also like then

showing the tangible thing that it does.

00:46:43,430 --> 00:46:43,610

So.

00:46:43,850 --> 00:46:43,970

Right.

00:46:44,450 --> 00:46:47,900

You wouldn't mind see this tool and

be like, cool, but not necessarily

00:46:47,900 --> 00:46:51,380

like compute in their mind what

it means for their paycheck or

00:46:51,380 --> 00:46:54,740

like what it means for near costs.

00:46:55,290 --> 00:46:56,750

So I think even if it's.

00:46:57,300 --> 00:46:59,280

Sellers or Johnny or whoever.

00:46:59,940 --> 00:47:02,750

Could be like, this is, it helped

me to save X amount of money.

00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:09,580

Or it prevented my rent from

increasing for 120 days or whatever.

00:47:09,610 --> 00:47:09,850

Computer sound: Yeah.

00:47:10,060 --> 00:47:15,000

Sarah Dixit: I think having something

that people can visually see and get

00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:17,400

a lot of information really quick.

00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:18,210

Computer sound: Yeah.

00:47:18,570 --> 00:47:21,840

Sarah Dixit: I would prioritize

that because it's two minutes

00:47:21,870 --> 00:47:25,620

of your time and you could

potentially save X amount of money.

00:47:25,710 --> 00:47:25,890

Luke: Yeah.

00:47:27,270 --> 00:47:28,560

At least you have put off here.

00:47:28,830 --> 00:47:29,310

See a few.

00:47:29,340 --> 00:47:29,580

Yep.

00:47:30,390 --> 00:47:33,580

Put off your rent going

up for six months even.

00:47:33,580 --> 00:47:33,790

Yeah.

00:47:34,090 --> 00:47:34,270

Yeah.

00:47:35,770 --> 00:47:36,100

Awesome.

00:47:36,100 --> 00:47:37,330

I want to let, y'all go.

00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:42,700

We're a little bit over, but closing

thoughts, any sort of feelings of hope,

00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:46,690

fear, trepidation, not necessarily tied

to rent, but just the world in general.

00:47:46,690 --> 00:47:47,050

We've.

00:47:47,617 --> 00:47:51,247

We're about a month out from the

election we're in this holiday

00:47:51,247 --> 00:47:55,237

season, that's complicated for

folks, but it is a general rule.

00:47:55,417 --> 00:47:59,497

This is the beginning of the time

that we reflect in America, starts

00:47:59,527 --> 00:48:00,637

now and goes through new years.

00:48:00,687 --> 00:48:03,227

Do you guys have any closing

thoughts around the year to come

00:48:03,257 --> 00:48:04,637

in the year that's been and.

00:48:04,919 --> 00:48:05,519

Joni Harris: I feel like.

00:48:06,299 --> 00:48:07,169

Isolation.

00:48:07,379 --> 00:48:07,799

Fear.

00:48:09,229 --> 00:48:09,769

Issues.

00:48:10,159 --> 00:48:10,429

Computer sound: Yeah.

00:48:11,059 --> 00:48:12,619

Joni Harris: Things like this.

00:48:12,769 --> 00:48:13,489

I like this.

00:48:13,819 --> 00:48:15,289

Like these practical tools.

00:48:16,159 --> 00:48:19,769

And my grade as an entity,

I'm part of starting this.

00:48:20,369 --> 00:48:21,629

Really long game.

00:48:21,929 --> 00:48:25,189

Building community and

A tiny thing of someone.

00:48:25,699 --> 00:48:27,649

Not any toy about their rent.

00:48:28,669 --> 00:48:30,229

A whole year or something.

00:48:30,679 --> 00:48:33,439

I mean, you can care about something else,

00:48:33,619 --> 00:48:33,919

Computer sound: right?

00:48:34,789 --> 00:48:36,049

Joni Harris: Or for someone else?

00:48:37,639 --> 00:48:39,229

Starting here is exciting.

00:48:39,649 --> 00:48:39,739

Right.

00:48:39,769 --> 00:48:40,009

Yeah.

00:48:41,389 --> 00:48:43,339

Luke: That's a really, that's

a really interesting point.

00:48:43,339 --> 00:48:45,619

We, you mentioned that earlier

and I'm glad you came back to it.

00:48:45,619 --> 00:48:48,979

The idea of we have a finite amount

of time and the more we have to work

00:48:48,979 --> 00:48:53,599

to just put food on the table, the

less time we have to do the sort of

00:48:53,929 --> 00:48:55,879

organizing work that you spend your.

00:48:55,929 --> 00:48:57,159

Your day is doing Sarah.

00:48:57,589 --> 00:49:02,839

And it's It is that kind of austerity

and a misery ration that becomes a

00:49:02,839 --> 00:49:05,869

negative cycle, discouraging engagement.

00:49:05,869 --> 00:49:06,529

And so.

00:49:07,489 --> 00:49:08,029

Can we the.

00:49:08,089 --> 00:49:11,299

The question, I guess, that we've

been asking this whole episode

00:49:11,299 --> 00:49:16,489

is can we create a positive cycle

that leads to greater engagement?

00:49:16,489 --> 00:49:18,409

And it sounds like Johnny

you're saying that.

00:49:19,182 --> 00:49:22,872