00:00 Meet Pastor Marc Cogan

00:46 Pastor Mark's Journey and Role

02:34 Shoutout to Pastor Mark's Wife

02:58 The Role of Pastors' Wives

04:44 Introduction to the Book of Habakkuk

05:59 Habakkuk's Struggles and God's Response

11:47 Theological Discussion on God's Sovereignty

16:45 Closing Prayer and Final Thoughts

17:53 Outro and Podcast Information

Find out more about Compass Bible Church.

Learn more about our Bible Reading Plan.

Questions or Comments? Email us podcast@compassntx.org

Welcome back to the Daily Bible Podcast!

2

We're so glad you've joined us.

3

And now your hosts, Pastor

PJ and a very special guest.

4

Hey everybody.

5

Welcome into this very special episode.

6

As you just heard Bernard tee up.

7

You've got me the normal guy.

8

I'm here, I'm old news.

9

I've been around for a while, but we

have a very special guest in to call it

10

a studio is a little bit too generous.

11

We won't quite do that, but in

the office here, and it is not

12

other than Pastor Mark Kogan.

13

Hey guys, how's it going

Pastor Mark, you are.

14

Catch everybody up and we've got some

listeners from outside of our church.

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People listen from South Africa

and Mexico now New Zealand and

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Mexico, and all over the world.

17

This is a global phenomenon,

what we're doing right now.

18

So for those that aren't part

of our church, catch 'em up.

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Tell us a little bit about yourself.

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So I've been part of Compass NTX since.

21

The beginning, but in

different capacities.

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So just recently it's been

the most formal, but going

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all the way back to 2023.

24

Yep.

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Is when I first joined the staff

as a kind of part-time role doing

26

kids ministry, which I still do now.

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But yeah, came from Southern Seminary.

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So I moved rather than from California,

moved from Kentucky, Louisville, Kentucky,

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where I was at Southern Seminary.

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So I joined the church plant

here actually on our very first

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pre-launch, like soft launch Sunday.

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That's right.

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Yeah.

34

I didn't get to see any of those

bible studies in the portables in

35

the port with no air conditioning's.

36

That's right.

37

Yeah.

38

Some people just parachute

in and have it easy.

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Yeah.

40

That's right.

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It was easy.

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Yeah, totally.

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It was easy.

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Totally easy.

45

Totally.

46

Yeah.

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But most recently as of the beginning

of this month, officially I guess a few

48

weeks before that, but officially at

the beginning of this month, I am now.

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Pastor Mark Hogan.

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Yeah.

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Which is incredible privilege and honor.

52

Yeah.

53

We're glad to have you on the team.

54

And he undersold it because he came and

joined our team and started serving in his

55

role as the kids men director at the time.

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He said as, I think even as part of

the staff not really, 'cause we didn't.

57

We were a church plant, so we didn't

really even have the ability to bring

58

him on staff formally at that time.

59

Thankfully, later on we were able to

bring him on staff and then finally get,

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got him full time on staff recently.

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Pastor Mark has put in

the hours, the labors.

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He's committed himself

to, to serve the church.

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He loves the church, he loves

this church and we love that.

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And he's in with us today

because Pastor Rod is in class.

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So he had some required class on how to

write better and he's practicing in our

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staff meeting notes even we were noticing

that he's putting periods on his sentences

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in our notes now and everything else.

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That's right.

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Even though he didn't seem to able write

a sentence with all the proper components.

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That's true.

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He was a period with just

two words with no verb.

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That's right.

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Yeah, that's right.

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Hey, can I shout out my wife too?

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No, we don't do that.

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On here.

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Yes please.

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She has just been such an awesome part of.

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All of this and to make it possible for

me to serve this church as we believe God

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has called me to over the past few years.

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Julia has been awesome.

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She's great, and she's largely

the reason why I was able to do

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everything over these past few years.

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Culminating in this point

where I got to become a pastor.

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So I just wanna shout out.

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That's awesome.

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That's great, man.

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That's great.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And that's huge for us.

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And that's something, when we hire.

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New pastors when we're

looking for pastors.

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And this was even back in Anna Elis

when Pastor Rod came and sat down

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with me even before we, the plant

was like, Hey, what if I came as your

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associate, we always are very clear,

like we're not an egalitarian church.

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And I think all of our listeners know

that we are complimentarian, which means

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we believe that the office of pastors

reserved for a man, and we believe

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that's the biblical qualifications.

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So we know when we're hiring a

man for the role of a pastor,

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we're not hiring his wife, but.

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Saying that does not mean

that our wives don't have

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responsibilities placed on them.

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That's right.

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And you've brought up a huge part of that.

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And I think I would say the same

for my wife and also I know that the

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same is true for Kristen as well.

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Pastor Rod's wife.

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Our wives really enable us to go and

do the ministry that we need to do.

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And God has gifted all of

us on this staff and that's.

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One of the things that we consider

when we're thinking about bringing a

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man on for ministry, and that's one

of the biblical qualifications too,

113

is that he manages his household well.

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That's right.

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That he has a wife that's a believer.

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That's that's a huge thing for

having a strong pastoral staff.

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And if this is your church, if comes

to Bible church in north Texas is your

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church, just know that you have not only.

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I trust solid pastors in place but

their wives are a huge part of that,

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and all of us have great wives.

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So Julia is certainly

no exception to that.

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And she's not only doing this, but

also has a young baby boy now that

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is new to the family, Warren is here.

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Not little.

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Nope.

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Not a little boy at all.

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He's he's a baby.

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Yeah.

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He's grown two inches since he was born.

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He's two months old.

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It's crazy.

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He's grown two inches.

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It's crazy.

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And he is close to 18 pounds.

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He's dunking a basketball

palming it I saw the other day.

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That's right.

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That's right.

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Yeah.

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The recruiters are out

looking to pick him up.

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That's also mean.

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Scholarships are huge.

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That, especially in ministry like

you, he, if you can get your kids

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scholarships, get 'em scholarships.

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Hey, let's jump into our DBR today.

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We are in the book of Habakkuk, and if

you were with us during our minor profit

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series, this is one of the ones that I

preach because it doesn't start with a Z.

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And so we, I won't give

you grief for that.

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Thanks, man.

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I appreciate that.

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I did myself I sold

myself out on that one.

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But still, no, this is such a good

book and it's, I think I said when I

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preached it and I stand by this, probably

my favorite of the minor prophets.

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It's a book that's unique because it's

not Habakkuk and anyone else other than

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Habakkuk and God, and it's a glimpse

into the mindset of the prophet.

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And so this is a good reminder to

us that our leaders are mere men.

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And and that's so good for you to be

aware of, even as we've just been talking

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about the fact that we're thankful

for strong pastors at our church.

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It's good that you remember

that we are simply men.

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We're fallen men at that.

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And Habakkuk here is a reminder to us

that sometimes even those that are given

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the responsibility to be the mouthpiece

of God, to be the Oracles of God.

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And that's not our responsibility.

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We're just here to herald the

already completed word of God.

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Habakkuk was, God was putting

his words in Habakkuk's mouth.

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And and Habakkuk is a guy

that struggled and he does.

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So in this opening of Habakkuk one, the

book just three chapters, not super long,

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but Habakkuk one, he's gonna be sitting

there saying, God, what are you doing?

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I'm looking around seeing that this world

is going to hell in a hand basket, that

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there's evil all over the place, that

it looks like you're not doing anything.

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And God responds to him in chapter

one saying, oh, Habakkuk buckle up.

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I'm doing something.

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I'm bringing Babylon.

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And Habakkuk, again the glimpse

into you expect this man of God

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to be like, okay, I trust you.

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I'm gonna sit down and just ride this out.

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But still again, we see Habakkuk's

internal struggle again, one of the

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reasons why I love this book, 'cause

he says, God, you can't do that.

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And and says you're of eyes that

are too pure to look on evil.

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How can you use such a

wicked nation to do this?

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And he even says at the end of

chapter one, beginning of chapter

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two, I'm gonna stand here and

watch to see what you're gonna say.

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I'm gonna, I'm gonna take my position.

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And it seems like it's a little bit

of a, an impetuous man standing there

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going, okay, God, what are you gonna do?

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Because he even says that

I'm gonna think about what my

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answer's gonna be concerning this.

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You're gonna respond to me, but

I'm gonna, I'm gonna already

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be formulating my answer.

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And then in the rest of chapter

two, God unpacks, Habakkuk.

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You need to understand that I see things

in a way that you don't understand

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them, and justice will be done.

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Justice is gonna be done

in how I judge Israel.

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Justice is gonna be done in

how I judge Babylon for their

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crimes against Israel too.

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And then the book ends with

Habakkuk casting himself on

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the Lord, trusting the Lord.

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This great prayer where he just goes

through the way that God has been so

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faithful to his people, the phenomenal

statement that he has there in your wrath.

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Remember mercy it's such a good

picture of a man who's gotten the

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picture Now he understands now.

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And the final concluding paragraph of the

book is just one of the most just thorough

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statements of trust in God that you're

gonna find anywhere in the scriptures.

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Basically, he's saying in an.

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Apocalyptic landscape still, Lord,

I will trust you no matter what.

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So that's the general thrust of Habakkuk.

206

Pastor Mark some of your

thoughts on on this book.

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Yeah.

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How far do you think

you can take complaints?

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We see other places like Job

where God specifically condemns

210

job for his complaint, and we

don't see that here obviously.

211

The Lord is answering Habakkuk, but we

don't see him criticizing him for anything

212

that he said or his complaint itself.

213

Is there a line where we go from

a complaint that, that God is

214

graciously gonna answer to one

that he may still answer, but.

215

Might be offended in, in, in some sense

in the right understanding of that word.

216

Where it's inappropriate to

approach God in that way.

217

Is there a line?

218

Yeah.

219

Yeah.

220

It's a great question.

221

Great observation.

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I think the reason we don't see God

chastising Habakkuk in that same sense, or

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judging or condemning Habakkuk, is because

Habakkuk's concern the whole way through

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seems to be for the character of God

as opposed to other situations where we

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see it's more about the person like job.

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By the time that Joe really begins

to cross the line and take more

227

of a sinful attitude towards the

Lord, which is a progression.

228

He doesn't have that at the beginning,

but he eventually gets there.

229

Joe becomes.

230

Self-focused.

231

It's about him.

232

It's a pity party for job.

233

And you look at job and

you're like, okay, I get it.

234

Your life is I wouldn't want your life.

235

And so I understand how you can get there.

236

I think when we read Habakkuk, Habakkuk,

even in his rebuttal to God is still

237

concerned with God's character.

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He's saying, God, you shouldn't do

this because you are of two eyes

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that are too pure to look on evil.

240

And so I, even though I think

Habakkuk is a bit impetuous.

241

I do think his concern is

the, is in the right place.

242

He's concerned for the character of God.

243

Yeah.

244

And I think some of it too

is the heart behind this.

245

We, throughout the Psalms,

David often making complaints.

246

You think about a place like, like Psalm

13 where he, you directly ask How long,

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oh Lord, will you forget me forever?

248

But we see throughout the Psalms, it's.

249

David being truthful about

how he feels and the struggles

250

that he's actually having.

251

But his heart always returns back

to, to like at the end of chapter

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13 of Sal Psalms 13, he says, I

will sing to the Lord because he

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has dealt bountifully with me.

254

And you see the same thing

going on with Habak, right?

255

Yeah.

256

Towards the end of this book, right?

257

As you mentioned, there's really

a beautiful statement about.

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What's true about God.

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And so I think there's a heart

matter that, that you can approach

260

these things and be honest.

261

Yeah.

262

But as long, you also have to be honest

about what you know to be true about God.

263

Yeah.

264

Yeah.

265

Yeah.

266

Habakkuk is a book that reminds us

that none of us are fully baked.

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He is learning that here you have

the prophet of God learning in these

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three chapters and we get a bird's

eye view to see that as he's learning

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more about the character of God.

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And that should encourage

you out there, that, that.

271

It's okay if you're in a place where

you're going, man I feel like I, there's

272

so much about God I don't understand.

273

Join the club.

274

Habak was there too and had to be brought

along and Habakkuk had the advantage

275

even of having God converse with him.

276

We pray to God and God

responds to our prayers, but

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differently than he did Habakkuk.

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So if we're here today and we're

looking around going, okay, God, I.

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I'm looking at the abortion rates.

280

I'm looking at, same sex marriage.

281

I'm looking at all these same things.

282

I could say a lot of what Habakkuk

does, even though our, there's some

283

good signs of things turning around

a little bit in our nation, we can

284

still point to plenty of things and

say there's evil all around God.

285

What are you doing?

286

God is not going to audibly say, okay,

pastor Mark, here's what I'm doing.

287

I'm doing this.

288

Buckle up.

289

But we do have passages like

this that can inform us.

290

Habakkuk's a great book for us.

291

Right now as you're looking around going,

God, would you really use something like

292

what's going on up in Minnesota with the

the refugees that were originally refugees

293

that are now so fast and populous that

they've got somebody that they're pushing

294

into political office up in Minnesota.

295

Same thing going on in New

York City with the mayor.

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And we're sitting here going, God,

would you really turn this nation

297

over into the hands of the Muslims?

298

And we read a book like Habakkuk and

we're reminded, okay, the Bill of Rights

299

is not the Biblical Bill of Rights.

300

That's right.

301

Yeah.

302

It's part of our constitution.

303

We're thankful for it, but man,

there's no guarantee that God won't

304

take this nation and judge it.

305

We need to be able to read a book like

Habak and walk away like he does at the

306

end, saying, Lord, if you do everything,

if you shatter this country, you know

307

what we're gonna, we're gonna trust in you

we're gonna pray that you don't do this.

308

We're gonna pray for revival.

309

We're gonna pray against the

spread of evil, but man, we're

310

gonna trust you nonetheless.

311

Habakkuk is such a good

book for us in that regard.

312

Yeah.

313

So how do we deal with the fact

that God is sovereign in these ways?

314

He is taking.

315

Responsibility for raising up the

Chaldeans in this response to Habakkuk.

316

How do we begin to

think about that, right?

317

Because God is sovereign over what's

happening in New York and in Minnesota.

318

And.

319

In Ukraine and all these different

places where there are evil actors.

320

How do we start to think about that

in a way that, that, that's helpful.

321

Yeah.

322

I would say no matter where, what we

have to approach this with humility we

323

talked about this during our shepherding

meeting on Friday a little bit.

324

That's part of the reason

I'm bringing it up.

325

Totally.

326

Yeah.

327

And I, yeah, appreciate you bringing that

up because we didn't have a good answer at

328

that meeting and I don't know that we're

gonna have one that's satisfactory now.

329

I thought you would have one by now.

330

I worked on it all weekend.

331

I still could not resolve it.

332

Man it's, we.

333

100% affirm God's complete

sovereignty over mankind.

334

And that is something that

I will go to my grave on.

335

I just, you cannot escape that.

336

God is sovereign and God ordains

everything that takes place, which

337

means that he's even sovereign over and

ordaining over the evil that takes place.

338

Even we read in the prophets recently

you ordained calamity, right?

339

That's the word, rah, in

Hebrew, which is the word evil.

340

And yet.

341

Like we've talked about on the

salvation side of things, it's

342

saying it's true over here as well.

343

Man is entirely responsible for

his own wicked deeds and evil acts.

344

And so sometimes in theology, in

theological circles, you'll hear about the

345

immediate cause and the proximate cause or

the primary cause and the secondary cause.

346

And so the primary cause being

Nebuchadnezzar, in this case in

347

Babylon and the wicked that they're

per carrying out perpetrating.

348

The secondary cause being God's

ordaining that to take place.

349

And some will do that because it removes

God from the immediate culpability

350

of things that are carrying out

the thing that we have to confess.

351

And this is where humility has to kick in.

352

God is a hundred percent sovereign over

everything that takes place in the world,

353

and yet God can never be charged with sin.

354

And we know that scripture

teaches both of those realities.

355

And the outworking of that is, is

really difficult to figure out.

356

For sure.

357

Yeah.

358

I would summarize it.

359

By saying God's relationship to

evil is indirect and permissive,

360

and that's uncomfortable.

361

But what I'm, what I mean by that is

God is not directly, and this is echoing

362

what you already said, but God is not.

363

The author, that word is often used.

364

He's not the author of sin.

365

He's not the one who is committing sin.

366

But he also is sovereign over it

and part of his intention and plan

367

for creation, whether or not we can

resolve that tension in our own minds.

368

We do know that he

permitted Satan to fall.

369

He permitted Adam to fall.

370

And does that mean that he likes sin?

371

No, certainly not.

372

And we know that from scripture,

but we also have to wrestle

373

with the fact that there's some.

374

Yeah, there is some elements that

we could look at and understand

375

as God being responsible for sin.

376

I'm gonna use the words indirect and

permissive as opposed to direct and

377

applauding or direct and willing.

378

Yeah, it's so difficult and this just,

this is giving you a glimpse into those of

379

you guys listening, just how complicated

and messy this all gets because.

380

I agree with you.

381

There's the permissive will of

God and there's the decreed will

382

of God and our desired will of

God versus decreed will of God.

383

And it's, you get into some of the New

Testament language that, for example,

384

Peter uses in the Book of Acts when he is

preaching about the crucifixion of Jesus.

385

And it's hard to get away from the

fact that I think Jesus or God the

386

father, was ordaining the steps of

Judas in the betrayal of Jesus, right?

387

I don't think he was just

permitting Judas to betray.

388

Jesus, I think he was saying,

Judas, this is what you're gonna do.

389

You're gonna go betray Jesus.

390

And that was all part of his

perfect and sovereign plan.

391

Yeah, again, this just gets into just how

messy this trying to understand this is.

392

And where we get into trouble is sometimes

where we need, where we try to draw.

393

Thick borders where the Bible

doesn't allow us to do that.

394

And when we try to compartmentalize

and fit God into our rational boxes, a

395

lot of heresy has been committed over

the course of history when people have

396

tried to fit God in rational boxes.

397

And it's just a reminder that can

frustrate us or comfort us, and

398

it can comfort us in this way.

399

If I can explain everything there

is to explain about God, then God is

400

simply a figment of my imagination.

401

I've created him.

402

But if there's things about God that

I can't fully explain that I can't.

403

Totally come to grips with it's a

reminder that he's God and I'm not,

404

and I'd add a third layer to that.

405

If there are those things that exist

and you still believe in him, then

406

that's an another reminder that God

has been at work in your heart to

407

open your eyes to see the truth of his

word, and to see the truth of Christ.

408

'cause there's a lot about it that would

otherwise cause you to throw up your

409

hands and give up and say I'm done.

410

I don't want anything to do with this.

411

Yeah.

412

And based on that.

413

If that's where we are, then

we can, as Habakkuk does, we

414

can weep over evil, right?

415

We can be distressed when we see evil.

416

We can rightly understand that and

we should, even in its proper place

417

in the Christian life, we should

fight evil in the public setting.

418

We should be advocates

for truth and for justice.

419

Even when.

420

Even when we live in a world full

of evil and ultimately we need

421

hope in the coming of Christ when

these evils will be completely

422

undone and justice will be served.

423

Yeah, for sure.

424

For sure.

425

Let me pray and we will

be done with this episode.

426

God, we are grateful for just

pastors on this team, thankful for

427

Pastor Mark being able to jump on

and record with us as pastor Rod's

428

out and not able to be in here.

429

And thank you for his wisdom and the

education that you've given to him

430

and just the life experience, his

insight into the scriptures we're.

431

Grateful for that.

432

We're thankful for the book of aba.

433

That is such a good reminder

to us of these things that

434

we've been talking about.

435

We readily confess and admit our finitude

that we can't wrap our minds around

436

the way that you work and the way that

you orchestrate and ordain things.

437

And I'm sure even in eternity

it's going to be a long time

438

of us trying to understand.

439

How you operated and the way that

you did things and why you did things

440

the way that, that you did things.

441

And yet we'll get to have that time

with you, which is really cool.

442

And we do know a few things.

443

We know that you are good.

444

We know that you are sovereign,

and we know that all that you do in

445

perfect accordance with your will.

446

And because of that, we will trust you

and we will always trust you, even when

447

we can't necessarily see what you're

doing, even as Habakkuk concluded there.

448

So we pray that this book would

be useful in our lives and that

449

we would apply it as appropriate.

450

We pray this in Jesus' name.

451

Amen.

452

Keep your new Bible tuning again

tomorrow for another edition

453

of the Daily Bible Podcast.

454

Bye bye.

455

Bernard: Well, thank you for

listening to another episode of

456

the Daily Bible Podcast, folks!

457

We're honored to have you join us.

458

This is a ministry of Compass

Bible Church in north Texas.

459

You can find out more information

about our Church at compassntx.org.

460

We would love for you to leave a

review, to rate, or to share this

461

podcast on whatever platform you're

listening on, and we hope to see

462

you again tomorrow for another

episode of the Daily Bible Podcast.

463

Ya'll come back now, ya hear?

464

PJ: Yeah.

465

I would agree with

everything that you said