What's So Funny?

This episode's guest is Mark Kendall — comedian, filmmaker, and co-founder, alongside Bill Worley, of the Atlanta production company Cool Cool Cool Productions. Mark's path into comedy started almost by accident: a college kid at Northwestern who just wanted to hold a camera, until a summer program built by Chris Rock dropped him into the writers' rooms of The Daily Show and The Colbert Report — and he pitched a joke that Stephen Colbert said on air that night.

What he brought home from that summer wasn't just a love of the craft. It was an understanding of how comedy actually works: that behind every laugh is a choice about how much tension to raise, and how much to let go. Mark has spent the years since putting that awareness to civic use — using comedy to talk Atlanta audiences into caring about affordable housing, gerrymandering, and public transit, one absurd, hyper-specific bit at a time.

Listen in as we explore:

• Why Comedy isn't decoration on top of a serious message
• The simple but fragile secret behind every effective joke
• How a comedian's own values are what separates "jokes for jokes' sake" from comedy that moves people.

Notable Mentions

People

Mark Kendall — Atlanta-based comedian, filmmaker, and educator; co-founder of Cool Cool Cool Productions and this episode's guest.

Bill Worley — Co-founder, COO, and producer/director at Cool Cool Cool Productions alongside Mark Kendall.

Chris Rock — Comedian who helped create the Comedy Central summer program that brought young writers of color, including Mark, into the network's development pipeline.

Jon Stewart — Longtime host of The Daily Show, where Mark spent a week shadowing the writers' room as a college student.

Stephen Colbert — Host of The Colbert Report; aired a joke Mark pitched as a young writer during his Comedy Central summer program.

Dr. Lonnie Johnson — Atlanta-based inventor and former NASA engineer best known for creating the Super Soaker; featured in Mark's comedic "Black Sustainability History" video series for PBS's Independent Lens, where he discussed a new heat-to-electricity engine he's developing.

Organizations & Institutions

Cool Cool Cool Productions — Atlanta production company co-founded by Mark Kendall and Bill Worley, making comedic and non-fiction content on civic engagement, public health, and community issues.

Northwestern University — Where Mark studied film and first got involved in sketch comedy, located near Chicago's improv scene.

Atlanta Regional Commission — Regional planning agency covering metro Atlanta housing, transportation, and land use; current partner on a comedy-based community engagement fellowship with Mark focused on affordable housing.

Fair Count — Atlanta-based civic engagement nonprofit (founded by Stacey Abrams) focused on census participation and fair redistricting; collaborated with Mark on a comedic Bob Ross-style video about Georgia's redistricting process.

MARTA (Metropolitan Atlanta Rapid Transit Authority) — Atlanta's public transit system, the subject of a comedic sketch by Mark exploring NIMBY fears around transit expansion into Cobb County.

Open Buffalo — Buffalo, New York-based organization focused on economic, racial, and ecological justice; collaborated with Cool Cool Cool Productions on video content.

PBS's Independent Lens — PBS documentary strand for which Mark created short-form comedic content, including the "Black Sustainability History" series featuring Dr. Lonnie Johnson.

Shows, Series & Productions

The Daily Show with Jon Stewart — Comedy Central news-satire program where Mark shadowed the writers' room during his college summer program.

The Colbert Report — Comedy Central satirical news program hosted by Stephen Colbert, where Mark pitched material as a young writer, including a joke that made it to air.

The Magic Negro and Other Blackness — Mark's nationally touring solo sketch comedy show examining the depiction of Black men in media and the comedic tools used to unpack harmful stereotypes.

Historical & Cultural Context

Muscogee (Creek) Nation — Indigenous nation whose ancestral lands include present-day Atlanta, acknowledged by Mark at the top of the conversation.

*******

Art Is CHANGE is a podcast that chronicles the power of art and community transformation, providing a platform for activist artists to share their experiences and gain the skills and strategies they need to thrive as agents of social change.

Through compelling conversations with artist activists, artivists, and cultural organizers, the podcast explores how art and activism intersect to fuel cultural transformation and drive meaningful change. Guests discuss the challenges and triumphs of community arts, socially engaged art, and creative placemaking, offering insights into artist mentorship, building credibility, and communicating impact.

Episodes delve into the realities of artist isolation, burnout, and funding for artists, while celebrating the role of artists in residence and creative leadership in shaping a more just and inclusive world. Whether you’re an emerging or established artist for social justice, this podcast offers inspiration, practical advice, and a sense of solidarity in the journey toward art and social change.

Hey there.

What if the best way to change someone's mind isn't a better argument, but a well timed joke?

From the center for the Study of Art and Community.

This is Art is Change, a chronicle of art and social change where activist artists and cultural organizers share the structure, strategies and skills they need to thrive.

As creative community leaders.

My name is Bill Cleveland.

Part 1 Once Upon a Time at Comedy Central.

Okay, we're going to open this episode with something completely different.

An advertisement.

Actually, it's a car ad.

Ain't nothing better than driving through the open road.

Nature is the way that I connect with myself.

It is so relaxing.

It has four wheel drive, excellent steering.

Control, and more important than that, you.

Need to vote in these elections.

You need to vote in these midterm elections.

They don't think we can do this again, Georgia, but we can.

Early vote, vote, absentee, go on election day, November 8th.

We got this.

Let Jesus take the wheel.

The voice you just heard is this episode's guest, Mark Kendall.

Mark is a comedian, filmmaker, and co.

Founder alongside Bill Whirly of the Atlanta production company Cool, Cool Cool Productions.

Mark's path into comedy started almost by accident.

A college kid at Northwestern who just wanted to hold a camera until a summer program built by Chris Rock dropped him into the writers rooms of the Daily show and the Colbert Rapport.

What he brought home from that summer wasn't just a love of the craft.

It was an understanding of how comedy actually works.

The that behind every laugh is a choice about how much tension to raise, how much to let it go.

Marcus spent the years since putting that theory into civic use.

Using comedy to talk to Atlanta audiences into caring about affordable housing, gerrymandering, public transit, one absurd, hyper specific bit at a time.

So let's get into it.

Starting with a summer in New York that changed the direction of his life.

Mark, welcome to the show.

Where are you hailing from today?

Yes, I'm Mark Kendall.

I'm hailing from Atlanta, Georgia, the ancestral lands of the Muscogee people.

So, Mark, have you ever had a handle or a street name that would personify some aspect of what you do in the world?

And if you haven't, what would it be?

I think if I were to have one.

Comedian.

What kind of comedian?

Sketch comedy.

Sketch comedian, yeah.

Okay.

Sitting down, you're hanging out with folks.

Maybe they're members of your family, but they are not really clear.

But Mark does.

How do you describe your Work in the world.

Yeah.

I use storytelling and comedy as tools to process the world around me, and I also use those same tools to help people tell their own stories.

So that's the path.

How did you get there?

You know, started filmmaking in college, went to film school, joined a sketch comedy group.

At first, I wasn't necessarily that interested in comedy.

I was just like, I just want a place where I can hold a camera or hold a microphone.

But then I started going to these writers meetings where people were reading these sketches out loud, and they're so funny, and I'm like, hey, this is.

This is fun.

And so the summer after my junior year of college, Comedy Central used to be very much, like, at the center of comedy.

And Chris Rock worked with them to create this summer program where instead of being, like, an intern getting coffee, they would pull these different writers of color from around the country, and they would fly you out, they'd pay you, they'd give you housing to spend a couple months going to different departments throughout Comedy Central to learn about.

Hey, here are writing jobs that are available to you after college if you choose to come to New York and pursue this field.

So I would spend time in their development department, right?

So, like, reading and evaluating scripts, or their promotions department, where they're figuring out how to advertise the programming that they're putting out.

Spent time.

They used to have a blog back in the day, so spent time with their blogging department.

But the crux of the program for me was I got to spend a week shadowing the writers of the Daily show with Jon Stewart.

And then I got to spend a week shadowing the writers of the Colbert Report starring Stephen Colbert.

So what that would mean is it's just like, I would literally just shadow them.

So it's like I'd go in each day, I'd sit in on all the writers meetings, and then I'd meet up with one of the writers and, like, write my own stuff.

They would read it, give me feedback.

And then on occasion, for some of those writers meetings, I'd be pitching.

So I'd be in certain rooms and pitching stuff.

And I was at the Colbert Porph.

And one of the days I pitched out a joke, and then they ended up using it that night in the show.

And it was a really big confidence builder for me because I was just like, oh, I pitched a joke, and then Stephen Colbert said it out loud that night.

Like, how cool is that?

That was crazy.

So do you remember the joke that ended up on the show?

I do.

It went.

It didn't go great, but it was like at the top of the Colbert Report.

You know, he had those opening lines where he's like, da, da, da, da.

This is the Colbert Report.

And my joke was like, you know, for every action, I have a superior and opposite reaction.

This is the Colbert, you know, which.

Is exactly what his character was.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

And I was, okay, so I can.

Be good at this.

But it was also challenging, too, because that joke happened to make it to air, but there are other things were bombed.

And so it was a very formative summer because I learned, okay, this comedy thing is this thing that I want to pursue professionally.

How do I get better at that?

Because at the time, as I mentioned, with my sketch comedy group, I was primarily behind the scenes.

I was writing, maybe holding a microphone.

And what I learned in these writers rooms is you got to pitch verbally.

It's not enough just to write words down on a sheet of paper and then hand them to someone.

You need to understand how it works verbally for another person who's not you for these words to land comedically for a television audience.

And that was a skill I hadn't developed yet.

And at the Colbert Report, I was really drawn to their inviting, inclusive nature.

And I learned that, hey, these people, they're improvisers, which is slightly different from standup comedy.

Improvisers are very collaborative medium.

It's very much that whole nature of yes.

And so the idea of someone throws out an idea could be anybody, right?

But we're like, all right, what's this idea?

How do we elevate this idea as much as possible?

How can we take what you've offered and make it as great as it can be together?

And I was really drawn to that environment.

And so I learned that a lot of them from an improv background, more specifically in Chicago.

And so I was going to Northwestern for school at the time, just in a suburb of Chicago.

So I was like, right there, I was already in the improv capital of the world.

So when I came back for my senior year, I started folding in performance.

In addition to writing that summer, we were in New York.

So my roommate at the time was a standup comic.

So I just started following him to open mics.

And I was like, oh, this performance thing isn't really that big of a deal.

Plus, there was no pressure.

I'm like, oh, I'm a writer.

I'm just trying to learn how to say this stuff out loud so that when I go to the writers Room the next day.

I'm more confident with it.

And I saw other writers doing the same thing.

So I'd follow.

I'd see the writers come in, they'd write their jokes for Jon Stewart, they'd write their jokes for Stephen Colbert, and then I'd follow them and watch the sets that they would do at the clubs at night.

I'd be like, oh, okay, so this is what you do.

So I started doing the same thing.

And after.

After college, I came back to Atlanta, which is where I'm from originally, and joined up with the standup and improv community here and have more or less been doing that in some form or another for over 15 years or so.

A lot of what I'm doing today, the beginnings of putting me on that path was that particular summer getting to be around those comedians that were looking at what's happening in the news every day and using their tools as comedians to process it and share their thoughts with other people.

So what I'm really interested in is that you've operated in an ecosystem of comedy, serious comedy, which is an interesting juxtaposition.

People who aren't just momentarily funny, but are intentional and.

And have a skill set that understands the difference between something that is situationally funny versus something that is more universally funny.

So could you describe what you learned about funny in that?

Yeah.

So I think something that I learned from watching the writers of the Colbert Report and the Daily show, as well as watching Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert during that summer, a couple things is that point of view is very important, especially at that time.

There are so many late night shows on tv.

They're all drawing from the same headlines.

But what makes them all so distinct is that you're funneling that comedy through Jon Stewart's point of view.

You're funneling that comedy through the character of Stephen Colbert's point of view.

And for any comedian, we might have similar experiences or we're all looking at the same major headlines throughout the day, but what do you personally have to say about that?

And beyond that, like, what do you care about?

I remember there was a moment where I was sharing some of my writing.

It's funny.

I haven't thought about this in a while.

You know, I was in college, very young, learning how to do this type of writing for the first time.

And so I was presenting these jokes to one of the writers at the Colbert Pour, and it wasn't working.

And I forget their exact words.

But it's like, you gotta pick something that you care about, man.

You're gonna be sharing that point of view.

It's gotta be important to you.

Just making jokes for joke's sakes.

There's certainly gonna be a place for that always.

Right?

But there's a certain type of comedy where in order to really make the most of your point of view, having a feeling behind it, having some sort of emotion attached to it, was very important.

And so that's really stuck with me.

Part two, Comedy and change.

I know having been a public speaker for a long time, sometimes people will laugh at things I had no intention of being funny about.

And sometimes people laugh at you as you, as you fumble around.

And sometimes you can invite that, you can be self depreciating, and other times you can pull the curtain back on things that are obviously absurd or weird that everybody already has in their head.

And I feel like both Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert did that on a regular basis.

They would take, well, this is something that just happened today.

Let's really look at how insane this is, or weird or out.

But one of the things both of them did is they were highly entertaining, but they also had content that was true and aligned to their characters.

And I guess what you'd call is the overall mission of their show, which was to be humorously informative and influential in, in some ways.

Can you talk about how that has seeped into your own work?

Sure, yeah.

Currently, my friend Bill Worley and I, we have a production company called Cool Cool Cool Productions.

So we create a lot of comedy content as well as other nonfiction content to encourage civic engagement, encourage community building.

A lot of what we'll do is collaborate with organizations that are doing really great work around, like community building, public health, climate, justice, all kinds of things.

They themselves may not be comedians, but we understand that, like, comedy could be a great path for them to make their work more engaging.

So, like, let's say they're trying to get information to their audience about, like an election coming up, or they're trying to educate their audience about the benefits of electrifying certain appliances in their home because it'd be better for the environment and for their health or something, that you're trying to drive someone towards an action.

And so comedy can be a great tool to make some of that work more engaging.

And so what I learned from those earlier lessons is that finding that right balance, and that balance is different every time between how do you make something engaging and entertaining while also making sure that the information is as clear and as actionable as possible and accurate.

A major element of comedy Is hyperbole.

Right.

Exaggerating.

And so in some ways, you do translation.

Here's an organization that doesn't think of it as Comedy Central.

Right.

They have something in mind that they want to share with people, and they understand that a PowerPoint presentation or a handout or whatever just isn't going to cut it, particularly in this day and age.

So you do that translation piece, but the other thing you do is you have your own gigs where you perform.

Correct.

So could you talk about those two Personas?

One of them is in service to something, and the other one is I'm here and I've got a set I got to do, right?

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Yeah.

I can give you a couple of examples.

So the Atlanta Regional Commission is an organization here in Atlanta.

They do a lot of work around city planning and the connection between, like, housing and transportation and just how the region overall is doing.

I'm doing a community engagement fellowship with them right now where I'm using comedy to learn how to communicate ideas around affordable housing.

So I've been doing standup shows around the city where I go up as a character talking about affordable housing.

And in those shows, I see my job is twofold.

One is like, I have to be entertaining at the base level.

The audience has to be laughing more than they are not.

But I also need to make sure I am centering topics of affordable housing enough so that when they come away from that, they're like, they're at least thinking about affordable housing.

They're asking themselves a question about affordable housing.

So in that one, I'm balancing, disseminating information end up being entertaining.

But other times, me, myself, Mark, as a standup, going up to do a show, and those times I trying to deliver on the comedy and own personal development, making sure that I'm true to that point of view that I mentioned.

So my craft can grow in a way that's true to myself, true to my values.

So it's not like just getting laughs at any cost.

So those are the two ways that I look at points.

Yeah.

So I have to say I'm really, really love hearing about this, and I'm curious about it.

And there's a thing that I watch happen with what I think are masters, I think John is one of them, is that first of all, I think the reason they have an audience is because people trust them.

So that means that the space they've created around themselves for saying and doing things, some of which are outrageous and some of which are deeply serious within the same moment Almost.

It's a high wire act, it seems to me.

And I just want to ask you about the skill of taking on a subject that's really hard.

Violence, feelings of betrayal, the kind of things that are going on in our streets, and being able to translate stuff that's so absurd that we just have to laugh.

Right.

And then pivot into this place where you don't let people get away with just the laugh, if you know what I mean.

I do, yeah.

And could you talk about what that is?

Because I feel like.

That's a pretty.

Powerful skill set to have.

Yeah.

That approach is going to be different for each comedian because each comedian is going to be received by an audience in a different way.

You're bringing a different lived experience.

You're bringing a different voice each time.

Overall, I think it is a function of how you choose to raise and break tension.

So if you're talking about something serious, like violence, by speaking on that, you're raising tension.

And then you can break that tension by introducing a punchline, a joke, surprise, a cultural reference with a laugh.

And your point, Bill?

How much do you allow the audience to be off the hook with the laugh?

It's your choice how much you want to break that tension versus how much tension you want to remain.

You've probably watched a show, someone raises tension and then they break that tension with laughter.

But then you can reintroduce that tension right afterwards.

Like, I saw you laughing at that.

Are you laughing about that?

The way in which you choose to, like, play those notes?

That's up to the particular comedian.

I had a solo show that I toured the country with for a number of years called the Magic Negro and Other Blackness.

It was a satirical sketch comedy show examining the depiction of black men in media.

What's a Magic Negro, you ask?

You've seen me before.

I'm that kind old black man in the.

Uses his wisdom and supernatural powers to help guide the white male protagonist through the narrative of the film.

And so a lot of the show was about using comedy to point out the absurdity of certain stereotypes that exist, but then also at the same time questioning, why do I even need to use comedy as a tool to break tension?

Can I just say that this is bad?

Like, why do I need to use comedy to broach these topics in the first place?

So it can literally be, like, where you introduce tension, you break it, but then it's just like, whose tension are we talking about?

Like, why does it need to be broken in the first place?

And you can ask those questions on stage and ask those questions of the audience.

With comedy, so much of it is trial and error.

Very rarely in comedy do you come out with a joke and you say it to an audience the first time, and it stays that way.

That's typically, at least if we're talking about stand up, we're talking about sketch comedy.

That's pretty rare.

And so I think that a lot of the process is going up in front of audiences again and again and again and playing with the line of how far is too far or not.

And it's not like being edgy for the sake of edgy.

It's just simply learning how the words fit together to communicate what you're trying to say.

And so there is a lot of trial and error in that.

And being in Atlanta, I will say it's a really great place for that because you can get in front of so many different audiences in the same night, and I'm grateful for that.

Part three Fair Count and MARTA.

So.

I'm interested in the space where comedy becomes a vehicle for elevating consciousness, awareness, interest, motivating and mobilizing.

Are there any particular stories, projects that you've been involved in that you feel really worked well?

Yeah.

One that comes to mind was a collaboration with Fair Count, which is an organization based here in Atlanta.

They do a lot of great work with civic engagement.

And we collaborated on a video project because a couple years ago, new redistricting lines were being drawn in Georgia, and Fair Count wanted people to take action to be involved in the process.

But gerrymandering can be a very depressing thing to talk about, and especially when you're putting content out onto the Internet and you're talking about some of the realities of our politics, what can happen is, like, you give someone really good, accurate information, but if it's depressing, they'll stay at home.

And so it's like, if it's a situation where you're trying to encourage or empower someone to take action, you need to make sure that the messaging is, in fact, empowering.

And so something that I think worked really well for us is using comedy to imagine what could be and giving people to dream up the world as they would like to see it.

So we did a video where I played a spoof of a Bob Ross like character.

So I had the fro and the paint, and we had a painting of Georgia.

And so I was painting, like, what would Georgia look like if we had Fair District?

You know, Mark, I really love that spot.

Let's.

Let's Give a listen.

Well, I still got Georgia on the mind, so let's get back to seeing what we can do with fair districts.

And add a little nice, happy blue there.

Ain't that nice Oak is a couple little dirty birds there.

They're gonna become lemon pepper wings a little later.

Flick a little extra seasoning on it.

Gonna put some base right here.

Oh, we got some potholes.

You know what?

I'm just gonna fill those up with some peaches there.

Problem solved.

Uh oh.

Looks like we got some gerrymandering going on.

Now, when lawmakers draw lines through communities of interest during redistricting, it dilutes the power of those communities.

So we're just not gonna let that happen.

So at this point, you take your.

Brush and just slide a wet line.

Of green over that redistricting red line.

See?

Much better.

We just turned that into a school with better funding.

Pandemic relief.

Redistricting is a people power process, and getting fair districts is gonna need you.

So when we use our voices, every community in Georgia can be the happy place we deserve.

Visit faircount.org for more and join us next week as we paint outcast on.

The front of Stone Mountain.

And we were hyper specific and hyper local.

It's just imagining this ridiculous but also joyful world and using the joy of absurdity to do that.

I'll give a slightly different example, too.

Another video sketch we.

We did that I was really proud of.

You know, in Atlanta, there's a lack of public transportation.

And that lack of public transportation affects housing.

That affects public health, affects so much.

And so one of the videos that we did was again, using absurdity to flip certain narratives on their head.

So when the prospect of public transportation is brought up in the metro area in Atlanta, you will hear people say, oh, I don't want public transportation coming to the suburbs because I don't want crime, which is.

Which is, of course, code word for black people coming to the area.

And so while I know that that's a specific thing in Atlanta, it's also very much like a very broad, universal narrative.

So we did a sketch where I'm in a basement talking with my BO.

All right, y' all have a seat.

Now, in a crazy turn of events, they have decided to build MARTA trains straight to Cobb County.

So you know what this means.

We are finally taking black crime to Cobb County.

This is something we have always wanted to do, but it's only possible now that we have trains.

Many a night, I've sat up and I've been Like, I wish I could rob Cobb county tonight, but all I have is my Escalade.

So tonight we're gonna go over the plan for our first robbery.

We're all gonna meet tomorrow morning at Five Points Martyr Station at 8:00am what is it, Ricky?

Well, can we stop the Five Guys before we.

Oh, my bad.

I don't have a watch on.

It's all right, man.

Now we're gonna hop on the goal line northbound, headed towards Doraville station.

At around 8:20am Just to throw them off the track, we're gonna switch over to the red line and we're just gonna be switching back and forth, back and forth.

Now, after the train ride, we're gonna have to hop on the 10 bus.

The 10 bus is gonna take us all the way to Fair Oaks.

After our bus ride, it's just a short six mile walk to the house that we want to rob.

That's easy.

Now, once we're inside the house, we only have time to go after the good stuff, all right?

I'm talking about Xbox controllers and pianos.

But if we have extra time, we're gonna mess around in their house.

All right?

So we're gonna go into their refrigerator, take off that Chobani yogurt, right?

We're gonna go upstairs, ride their peloton bike, we're gonna log on to their Netflix account and watch the Netflix original movie the Princess Switch starring Vanessa Hudgens of High School Musical.

Back to robbing this piano.

All right?

We're gonna take all the stuff and we're gonna go six miles back to the bus stop.

Now, once we get back to the new Cobb County Martyr Station, that's when things get dangerous.

You're gonna be a black man riding the Martyr train holding a piano.

So be prepared for someone to walk up to you and ask you, excuse me, sir, are you Stevie Wonder?

And the answer is always yes.

And that's another way of again, using comedy to really explore the logic of some of these harmful narratives that are out there and got a lot of them to choose from.

That video resonated with a lot of people.

Again, because of the specificity to Atlanta, made it more universal.

And also that topic of public transportation intersects with so many other issues that we are experiencing in our city.

Part four Passing it on so you.

Were young, you got to hang out with some folks who were masters.

And I'm assuming that you find yourself in the opposite position.

And there are young people who come to you and say, mark what you do is so wonderful.

I like to do that too.

Right?

Yeah.

What do you pass on that you want them to think about as they begin their comedic journey?

Yeah.

If I'm working with new comedians and sharing things that worked for me or were helpful for me, I share things like develop your voice and do that as much as you can.

So if that means getting up on stage as much as you can, if that means making as many videos as you can, just finding ways where you can try and fail a bunch of times, because that's largely what the process is.

And not being afraid of comedic failure, because comedic failure is different.

It's not like failing a math test.

Comedic failure is good.

It's progress.

You know, I'm a big fan of journaling, and through journaling, writing about, like, hey, what makes me happy?

What makes me angry?

What do I fear?

And for yourself, what your point of view is, because everyone has one, you just may not be quite as aware of what it is.

So a lot of times I'll tell people, like, write down some things that you might take for granted.

Like what?

What are some of your happiest memories?

What were the times that you were most afraid?

And then you might find that you have something that's different from other people.

Like, an exercise that I'll do is, like, write down five of your happiest memories and don't think about the right answer.

Think about the answer that's true for you.

So if everybody in the class is like, oh, man, my wedding day.

That was the happiest day of my life.

But then, you know, another person is like, oh, man, the happiest day of my life was when I had, like, this really great peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

That's amazing, because that is a unique point of view that you have on that topic.

And then your job as a comedian is to help people understand that point of view, because you see comedians do it all the time.

It's like, you'll go to a standup show and they'll be like, man, everyone loves ice cream.

I hate it.

And here's why.

And at first, the audience is booing.

Because they're like, ice cream.

We all love it.

Boo.

You're wrong.

But then by the end, they've convinced you to their side, and they're like, man, I hate ice cream, too.

This person is hilarious.

Yeah.

And I feel like.

But in order to get to that point, you kind of have to do a little bit of introspection in terms of figuring out what that point of view is.

And a lot of that trial and error you got to do in front of an audience, you know, you got to go in front of an audience and see, like, hey, where are these moments where I'm connecting?

Where are these moments where I'm not connecting and why?

And so I just encourage people to find that path, find that journey in a way that makes sense for them.

Yeah.

So right now, in a journey of American history, I think we're in a particular moment, at least in terms of my lifetime, I have not known a moment like this.

And I'm wondering, given your skill set and your orientation as an activist comedian in service to your community, what you see as the challenge on the stage of America?

Yeah, that's a great question.

I think that comedy is uniquely suited to get someone to maybe change a behavior or consider new information for the first time.

So if I'm a comedian, I'm trying to share this new information without having you run away.

It's like I'm striking this balance of being honest about the challenge of taking on a new perspective, taking on a new behavior, but then at the same time using, like, that power of joy and comedy, sometimes absurdity, to make that new choice as attractive as possible and try to do both at the same time, where you're, like, you're honest about the risks that are at hand, but then also being like, hey, on the other side of this new information or this new choice, or encouraging you to be involved with your community, that is also worth that change.

I'm just sitting here realizing, particularly if you're talking to me about something that I've already made up my mind about, okay.

And I know this isn't some random thing.

You actually are trying to provide another point of view.

So I know I'm in that setup.

So my stuff is up.

Right.

To me, you're putting yourself on the line to say, I can be clear.

I can be hyperbolic, I can be humble, I can be empathic, I can be nice, I can be ridiculous.

I can be all those things just like you.

If you can identify with me enough to hear me.

Really hear you, right.

Then a momentary window opens.

You know, I think the minute someone laughs at somebody else's joke, in a sense, they're saying, oh, oh, yeah, right.

I'm there with you.

Right.

That's an extraordinary moment of connection, particularly for people who are predisposed to being disconnected.

You know, like, yeah, I wasn't going to listen to that guy, but that was.

That was right on.

Right, Absolutely.

So, you know, MARTA Coming to Cobb County, I've done that bit in Cobb County.

Two audience members that probably voted for MARTA not to go to that neighborhood, but made them laugh.

I'm not under the impression that I got them.

Next time they're going to vote different.

I'm not thinking that, but.

But what I do know is that for that moment, they did consider that different perspective.

And over time, you know, they might be more open to other perspectives like that.

So it's not like, man, with the joke, in a moment you're gonna be thinking differently.

It's not that at all, you know?

Yes.

However, what you said, Bill, is right on that laughter is at least a momentary agreement that we are both finding this thing funny.

And I do think that there's a.

Lot of power behind that.

I think it's extraordinary, and particularly now in this moment.

And there is a predisposition to fear mongering.

And it's hard to laugh when you're scared or angry.

And if you are laughing, the epinephrine that is making you fight or flight is put to the side for that moment.

And there's a joy button in there.

You know, serotonin and dopamine are flowing, and it feels good to laugh.

It's healthy, you know, and it feels really good to turn someone who you think is your enemy into someone that you're nodding your head with.

Right.

And laughing at the same time.

That is so powerful.

So powerful.

And I just have to say that it's not like comedy is some weird side thing that a few people invented.

It is intrinsic to who humans are.

Right.

Absolutely.

So final question.

What's exciting you right now that you're engaged in?

Oh, I love it.

Yeah.

A couple things.

We're creating some short form content for PBS and independent lens for the Internet.

So I've really enjoyed that challenge of creating things for those channels.

And he has just such an amazing story, just like this prolific, brilliant black inventor who created this hugely successful toy.

He has such an amazing story, and we were able to use comedy with a couple short videos telling that story.

And that was really inspiring.

Welcome to black sustainability history.

Whether we're out there reusing plastic bags, this one lasted longer than the Confederacy or using these cookie tins to hold anything but cookies.

A Jordan jersey.

Ha ha.

I'm your host, Mark Kendall, and on.

This segment Every time we celebrate black folks for being awesome and sustainable, today we celebrate entrepreneur, former NASA engineer, and the prolific inventor Dr. Lonnie Johnson, most famous for creating the Super Soaker.

But did you know that Dr. Johnson is developing climate friendly technology that we.

Mark, would you like me to tell you about it?

Dr. Johnson, you're right here.

I would be honored.

Well, Mark, I'm developing a new engine that converts heat directly into electricity with no moving mechanical parts.

It's almost like magic.

What's good about it is that it produces energy from waste heat.

We have a lot of engines in the world, like your car engines.

Those engines are not as efficient as we'd like them to be.

In fact, only about 30% of the energy that's available in those heat sources produce produces power or electricity.

So I come up with an engine that will use the waste heat from those systems to produce additional energy, reduce our dependence on fossil fuels.

So it'll be just make the world more sustainable.

This has been black sustainable history.

That was awesome.

Can I get my chair back?

This is my laboratory.

What do you mean?

Also, we've been doing some video work with Open Buffalo, which is this awesome organization.

I got a shout out based in Buffalo, and they're all about economic, racial and ecological justice.

And we've been creating some video content for them around ecological justice and the work that they've been doing.

And I just love that partnership.

Right?

Hello, I'm Dr. Justice reporting from the future with an important message for y'.

All.

Y', all, the future is lit.

Buffalo won so many championships, is now called the Buffalo Bowl.

In the future, the air is so clean, there's no more asthma.

So now the only time you're coughing is when you're smoking that good.

And we all know Open Buffalo fought for legalization.

That's a big reason why everyone has.

Access to whole foods and clean water.

So now people say, I'm living B for 150 years.

Yeah.

How about that?

That's a long time.

This future is possible because of all the amazing work y' all are doing in the present with ecological justice.

I know what you're thinking.

What is ecological justice?

Ecological justice is about us living our best lives without destroying the planet.

Think of it as a roadmap to existing in harmony with the earth and all living things.

In your present, the way of living is out of balance with nature, community, and even your body.

The increasingly frequent blizzards and superstorms that trap you in your house for days without electricity are just one.

One sign of that but the good news is the work of ecological justice will help restore that balance.

How do you restore it?

It's all in the training.

You'll come together and learn to build the liberated communities that you want to see and build new systems where communities of color don't live on or near toxic land.

So, in short, y' all gonna kick.

Environmental racism in its ass.

It's true.

So to recap, the future is amazing because y' all are gonna take a world that's out of whack and restore balance and harmony.

This work is all about connecting with our ancestors of the past to our present day communities to build a brighter future.

So no matter what zip code you're born in, you're set up for Success.

So visit openbuffalo.org and sign up for Eco Justice Action training.

And so that span from everything from comedy sketches to really impactful short nonfiction documentary work.

I have to believe that when you.

Work with organizations like that, groups of people who are trying to make serious change in their communities, if you just come a little bit closer to helping them find their sense of humor inside, their work with each other, let alone communicating with the world, is an enormous benefit to what they're up to.

Because taking yourself too seriously can be as dangerous as not taking anything seriously.

Right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Absolutely.

Mark Kendall, thank you.

This has been great.

Bill, thanks so much.

It's great to be on the show.

Been enjoying these episodes.

So honored to get to be a part of it.

I appreciate it.

All right, so before we go, a few things I'd like to leave with you.

First, laughter is a momentary act.

Agreement.

You know, if for a few seconds strangers or adversaries are nodding at the same thing, well, that's a door left open just a crack.

Second, the specific can be the thing that makes something universal.

Mark's most resonant material was hyperlocal.

A Bob Ross parody about Georgia redistricting, a sketch about black residents writing the new MARTA line.

The more precisely he aimed at Atlanta, the more people everywhere recognized themselves in it.

And third, maybe the most important thing Marx said was that comedic failure isn't like failing a math test.

It's progress.

You don't learn by getting it right the first time.

You learn it by bombing over and over until you find the version of your own point of view that actually lands for you and the audience.

Finally, please know that you can find a link to all of our conversations, mentioned resources in our show.

Notes.

Art is Change is a production of the center for the Study of Art and community.

Our theme and soundscape spring forth from the head, heart and hand of the maestro.

Judy Munson our tech.

This editing is by Andre Neve.

Our effects come from freesound.org and our inspiration comes from the ever present spirit of OOC235.

So until next time, stay well, do good and spread the good word.