Have you ever lived abroad or considered spending an extended period in another country? I have, but my guest has done it a lot more.

Ruben Vazquez is a martial arts and English teacher I met while living in Vietnam. I asked Ruben to come on the show because we have had similar and different experiences with travel, but we both know how important it is to get outside of your comfort zone and experience other ways of life.

We talk about our experiences in Vietnam, how we both got into teaching English in the first place, the challenges and benefits of extended travel abroad, and a few stories about avoiding being ticketed by the Vietnamese police. Ruben also shares a few tips and ideas for those considering teaching English or travelling abroad for the first time.

If you enjoy the podcast, please share it on social media or leave a review wherever you get your podcasts.

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I don't know if the same benefits of travel would apply to just a short holiday.

I think the major benefit comes from going and living somewhere long term and really immersing yourself in the life culture, going overseas and seeing other ways of doing things. Sometimes I'm like, oh, that's great, I wish we would do that. Or I say, oh, the way we do it back home is actually pretty effective.

That perspective is always great. If you're used to everything being sort of the same, I think might be more appealing than to try someplace else.

And the longer you spend time there, the more you'll appreciate the differences.

Is you are listening to the Akkeri Podcast, a show about men and masculinities, the challenges that modern men face, and how to chart a better way forward. I'm your host, Matt Howlett, mental health coach and founder of the Akkeri.

Have you ever lived abroad or considered spending an extended period of time in another country? I have, but my guest has done it a lot more. Ruben Vasquez is a martial arts and English teacher who I met while living in Vietnam.

I asked Reuben to come on the show because we have had similar, but also different experiences with travel. But we both know how important it is to get outside of your comfort zone and experience other ways of life.

We talk about our experiences in Vietnam and how we both got into teaching English in the first place, the challenges and benefits of extended travel abroad, and a few stories about avoiding being ticketed by the Vietnamese police. Reuben also shares a few tips and ideas for those who may be considering teaching English or traveling abroad for the first time.

And if you enjoy the podcast, please share it on social media or leave a review wherever you get your podcasts. But for now, here's the conversation with Reuben Vasquez. Well, Ben, Reuben, I. I know you as Ben and all the students that we taught in Vietnam.

Thanks for coming on the the podcast, man. I appreciate it.

Yeah, no problem.

Was it really? Okay? Yeah. So we were there in the same spot for at least six months because I left April of the next year.

That was basically my first experience really living abroad. I had traveled abroad before that, but I had never really lived in such a different culture in context. But you had before that, right?

Yeah, this was fourth country I lived in. I'd only been doing it for a couple of years before then.

Right.

But before this I had lived in Thailand, which is obviously A different country and culture, but it was similar in that how. How foreign it was to me.

Yeah.

Compared to, like, living in Spain, which was similar to living in the States, just in Spanish.

Was Spain after Southeast Asia or before?

It was. It was in between Thailand and Vietnam.

Oh, okay.

So I just gotten back from Spain to the States at the beginning of that summer. I stayed the summer in the States, and then I was back out on the road. Next stop, Vietnam.

Right. At what age did you start traveling?

I was 34.

We're both teaching at an English center. Can you just give me an idea of, like, your background? Like, all. All I honestly know, or at least remember, is that you're from Chicago.

You were really into martial arts. I believe you had a black belt, and you were a deadly graphic design. Yeah. So just give me a Cole's notes.

So I grew up outside of the city, and then I escaped my small hometown as soon as I could, and I eventually landed in Chicago, and I lived there for about 10 years. And I decided to go back to school to get my bachelor's degree when I was 30, because I wanted to teach overseas. So that was a big motivator for me.

So I did that, and then I hit the road about a year and a half after that. My first stop was Thailand, and then I came back to the States for a bit, and that's when I started teaching martial arts.

And then I started doing that again. Most recently, now that I'm back in Chicago, I am doing that again.

Which one is it? What is it that you teach? What do you practice?

Well, right now I'm teaching karate, but I have a higher rank in hapkido. But I've also done taekwondo, boxing, Krav maga. I like all sorts of combat sports.

Right. Tell me about how you got into travel. Because for me, it was. It was pretty eye opening, life changing. It was. It was a lot of really good things.

It was a challenge. When I was in it, I had a lot of moments when I did not want to be in Vietnam. But looking back on it, I had a lot of good moments when I was there.

But looking back on it is the best perspective for me for what it did to me personally. But I grew up in a very sheltered setup. Right. I grew up in. On an island.

I grew up in a religious community and never really had anybody around me that Talked about travel, talked about the importance of travel. That encouraged me to travel.

And then even when I talked about what I was doing much later in life, I was, man, I think at 33 or 34 at the time, you know, nobody really encouraged me or thought those. Great idea. What was that experience like for you? Because you obviously did it a lot younger than I. You started a lot younger than I did.

Well, yeah, I mean, I grew up in a small town, and most people there really travel. Most people plan to stay in that town, and a lot of my friends from school are still in that town.

But I did travel a little bit with the family when I was a kid. We went to Mexico twice when I was really young.

And then the last time I went as a teenager, I enjoyed those experiences as my first time out of the country.

But then when I moved to Chicago, I started meeting people from all over the States and occasionally from other countries, and that kind of piqued my interest.

I worked with a guy from New Zealand and then another guy who said he had just gotten back from Korea, and he was explaining the teaching overseas thing, and I realized, oh, that actually sounds pretty cool. That sounds like it's kind of attainable.

You know, all you need is a bachelor's degree, which you don't even need some places, and a clean record and a willingness to do it right. And so that's when I first started thinking about it, I guess.

And then from there, I started meeting other people who either did a year in Korea or they knew someone who did it and started hearing them talk about it, and it sounded more and more appealing to me.

Yeah.

And I guess I've always just been adventurous, too. I mean, it just sounded like most people don't do this, you know, maybe I should give it a try.

Yeah, I'm sure there's multiple reasons why you are like that or even were like that back in the day. I.

I can't say I wasn't adventurous, but it's like, if you don't have any type of influence that would make you think about the opportunity, you know, why would it even come to your mind? You know what I mean? Does that make sense?

Yeah, I mean, it absolutely does. But also, I think I was always a little bit dissatisfied with life here in the States.

Like, it wasn't awful, you know, growing up in that town was fine, but it felt limited.

And even from something like watching films and seeing people living in big cities or in other countries, you know, that was always like, oh, wow, that looks cool. But I Always thought, you know, there's a lot out there. And, you know, I've always been curious, too.

I wonder if maybe it has something to do with the way that I was raised.

That's something that I've never really had a deep conversation with anybody about, because there is something about growing up in a very religious, like, Christian context.

I don't know if it's purposefully taught, but you, you definitely absorb this thinking that what you believe and the work of the church and your involvement in that is enough and that should be your focus. Does that make sense to you? Like, do you have a church background at all?

Yeah, I was forced to go to church from a young age and never really. Never really enjoyed it and then never went back after being a teenager.

Right.

But, you know, I grew up around it and a lot of my family on my mother's side is still very religious. And I don't know, the whole thing kind of left a sour taste in my mouth as far as the experience.

So I don't have an overall positive view of it, but I understand the mindset and I think that absolutely would play into it a bit because I think a lot of people who are very religious, I think it limits the curiosity a little bit in some people. Like, why ask how something works when the obvious answer is, well, because of God, and not for all people, but for a lot of people.

And I think it, you know, it teaches people or attempts to teach people maybe to be content and try to make the best of whatever their situation is. And I don't know overall if that's good or bad, but that's just kind of the impression that I've gotten.

Yeah, that definitely resonates. I'd be interested to have that conversation, but I am more curious about your experience. Like, personally, what does travel like mean to you?

Do you promote it to anybody else? Like, to me, I think it's a must have. I think that, you know, specifically the podcast the Ocari in general focused on, on men, masculinities.

There are listeners and people who can benefit from the content outside of that.

But I think for every young man should get outside of their context in a big way and not simply move from a small town to a big city, but get outside of their context, like completely. Their cultural, like their social milieu. Get outside the country if they can, right?

Well, sure. I mean, outside of even travel, just variety in general has always been appealing to me and like I said, trying new things.

I don't know if I promoted it a lot I mean, I've told people that I've enjoyed my. Some people have expressed interest, but from people I've talked to, I don't know that any of them ever actually followed through and did it.

If they, you know, expressed interest in teaching, no one ever got back to me and said, oh, hey, I did that. You know, what we talked about. And I don't know if the same benefits of travel in general would apply to just a short holiday.

I think the major benefit comes from going and living somewhere long term and really immersing yourself in the life, the culture.

Yeah. 100. I. I think the. One of the major benefits comes from the challenge of being absorbed by a different culture.

Not knowing the language, not knowing the traditions. Like, dude, this is so random, but one of the restaurants that we frequented, Chung's place in Halong Bay, I.

I went there once and I was like, dying for, like, a donut.

And I went to this one bakery that, that Linda had mentioned to me, and I come back and I think it was like, the only option was to buy several and just try whatever, right? So I come back and I tried one or whatever, and like, they may have had one themselves, I'm not sure.

But then I go to bring the rest because I'm Canadian, right? I'm a nice guy, I'm generous. I go to give the rest to this random table of dudes. They don't speak any English. They're probably local guys.

And I come back and, well, I mean, first of all, they had a weird look on their face, like, this is unexpected. Why are you doing this? And that kind of threw me off. But I should have known, right? In a totally different concept.

And I had been there for not too long at that point. But then I come back to Lin and Chung, and they're like, why did you do that? They're almost like, not really disgusted, but pretty close.

It's like, you don't do that there, right?

Because it's like they think this is what Lyndon Chung told me, that if you're going to do that, they assume that there's something wrong with what you're giving them.

I mean, that's perspective we had as children at school. Like in the lunchroom, if somebody gives you some food, first question was, what did you do to it?

Right. Well, you had some mean friends, I suppose.

Yeah. I mean, growing up in the 80s, in America, kids were mean, you know, watch movies, bullies were a thing.

And everybody was always doing pranks on each other and being ridiculous.

Yeah. I just thought that these guys would, like. I don't know.

Obviously, looking back on it now, I think it's a little bit ridiculous, but in the moment, I. I mean, who knows?

It depends. Now, like, if I was at a restaurant in the States and some stranger gave me some food, I certainly would not eat it, because I'm suspicious. Sure.

And I would be thinking, like, oh, why are they doing this? But in a place like theirs, where everybody kind of knows each other and it's a smaller town, I think I would be fine with it.

Yeah. Yeah. And to clarify, this is not like you're walking into an Applebee's and, you know, you just go over to someone else's table and, like, be.

Hey, like, you should. This is great. You should try this shift. Right.

I mean, especially if it's food from outside of that restaurant. It would be different if you ordered something from there and then brought it to them, and then, you know, it's. It seems more legit.

Yeah. What's your favorite story from that period of time? From. From Honong Bay? You have anything that comes to mind?

I mean, there were some fun times, but I don't know. Some of the stuff I don't know if I want to admit to the world. All right, there was. There was an incident in traffic that was just ridiculous.

This guy moved up his car when I was trying to get through, like, perpendicular to him.

Y.

And all.

All he had to do was leave, like, a foot for my motorbike, and he saw that I wanted to squeeze through, and he inched up enough to, like, not let me, and so I just forced it. And, you know, my bike kind of rubbed against his bumper a bit.

Oh.

And I almost got stuck. And he hopped out of the car and chased me on foot for a moment, and then I just kept driving.

No way.

I mean, that was kind of funny, but that was a little bit dickish. And maybe I should have just let him win that situation and gone around him. But I was. It seemed, like, so deliberate on his part.

Yeah.

That I was annoyed, and I probably shouldn't have done that, but I was laughing at the time. But then later, I'm like, I stick out in that town. Like, if he sees me later, he's gonna remember me.

Yeah, I suppose. I don't know if anybody else. I mean, a lot of us stuck out. Like, I remember one of the South African guys, just really big dude.

You know, he was like, I don't know, maybe six, two, six, three. I stuck out, I found. But I suppose you would as Well, I mean, because heavily tattooed, you always have. I remember the chain.

Yeah, I still have that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I mean. Oh, dude, so many. I don't think you can go to Vietnam and not have a traffic story.

Like, if you don't have a traffic story, you didn't go to Vietnam.

Yeah, I had a couple of spills. Only one was bad, but definitely on a bike that at least fell over or crashed at least three or four times, I guess.

Oh, yeah, yeah. I've got a couple just because. Well, for one, the, the roads are so bad. Two, the traffic is unpredictable.

Like, I mean, you know, red means go, green means go, yellow means probably go.

Well, yeah, I thought it was bad. And how long. And then I lived in both Saigon and Hanoi and it was just like the same thing, but more so in greater numbers with a higher intensity.

Yeah, yeah. I, I didn't ride in Saigon, but I was there for five weeks. I was on the back of a couple. Like, was it grab bikes? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

On the back of a couple, grab.

And that's the story in itself, you know, when the little, you know, 120 to 160 pound Vietnamese guy shows up on his bike and there's like a 240 pound big white guy, like, just weighing down, like, just riding dirty.

I had that experience because I am the size of a typical Vietnamese man. And if I had a big foreigner on the back of my bike, I thought it was going to be more of a challenge. But it's actually, it wasn't so bad at all.

It was. I thought it was kind of easy.

Yeah, yeah. What's. What's your favorite place? All places that you've lived.

How long's got to be up there?

I really enjoyed my time there and I spent some time in Paris and, you know, I visited it whenever I could when I was in France, but I didn't actually live there. But that was one of my favorite places.

Paris.

Yeah.

Or just France in general.

I mean, France in general was great.

I spent more time in these rural as hell little villages, which, you know, is great for a little while, but a little bit goes a long way when it comes to something like that.

Right.

But I tend to like big cities or medium sized cities. It depends on if there's public transportation. If there's not, then someplace smaller. I mean, how long was ideal?

Because it never got so cold that I was miserable on the motorcycle.

So, you know, I really enjoyed that aspect of it because right now I live in Chicago and I rarely ever own A car when I've been here, just because the traffic is miserable, parking is miserable. So I just get by the buses and trains or riding my bicycle.

Right.

But you know, Paris and Madrid both have a pretty good subway system.

Right.

So it made both those cities very appealing to me.

Yeah, I enjoyed how long I Not sure if I had more fun in Koh Samui, but that was a very. In Thailand, that was a very shorter, more intense period of time. I was quite busy. Like we did well, I went there for the TESL course.

I didn't have to. I had an undergrad like yourself. But I just.

I wanted the experience of it because that was my main reason for going to Southeast Asia, was just to get out of the comfort zone, try something completely different where nobody knew me, meet a bunch of different people. But yeah, I don't know, man.

Out of all the places now that I've been, because I've been to a few other places that I haven't lived in, but yeah, how long Bay was was a good choice. I got lucky there because I didn't research that.

I just chose Vietnam because I knew that they paid well from my experience in Thailand and went to Saigon. Didn't love that place and just picked Halong Bay. The school actually suggested another town.

I don't remember the name, but then I just kind of pushed for. For Halong. How did you end up in Halong? Were you teaching elsewhere first?

Not in Vietnam. So that company, they let us pick up to three spots from a list and they had pictures and like a very brief description.

Yeah.

And I did really do any research either, but I just saw the beach and it sounded nice. And that was really lucky because, I mean, I enjoyed that town so much. And placement is huge on whether you're going to enjoy your experience or not.

And not only was that a fun town, but there were so many English centers there that, you know, there was a good crowd of people.

Yeah.

At one time on our little WhatsApp group for just hanging out, I think we had more than 40 people on that list. So, I mean, that helped make that experience great. Was there. Made so many friends there. There was always people to hang out with.

Yeah. Let me get your thoughts on something again. I'm thinking of Chung's restaurant, Wander Station. And written outside that place.

I remember, not all who wander are lost. I don't know if I thought this before going there, but I know a lot of people do think that there's actually truth to the wanderers being lost.

Like when I left, I Had a blog at that period of time.

And knowing my background, there was probably a lot of people who knew me, but I didn't necessarily know them here in Newfoundland just because of the nature of the work that I did at the time. When I left and did that first post, being in another country, that was the most popular blog post.

Like, I think everybody that probably knew me clicked on that thing because the traffic just went through the roof. And I never had that again for any other post afterwards. Right. But it was so out of the ordinary, you know, for. For Matt to.

To go and, you know, sell his things and go live in Asia. And I. I wonder. I just want to get your thoughts on it. I wonder how many people actually think that and don't value that type of thing.

Obviously, I had other. There was a certain. Certain circumstance to why I did what I did, why I left, why I sold my things and whatever.

But still, though, the value of that experience. What. What are your. Your thoughts on. On. On that?

I mean, I think if people viewed someone wandering as lost, it probably comes from the fact that most people want to put down roots and settle in somewhere.

Sure.

And some of us just don't want to.

Yeah.

And, you know, I. Even when I came back this most recent time, I didn't really plan on staying here this long. And, you know, I'm reluctant to put down roots.

The only thing I've done now that kind of keeps me here is I have a cat. I don't think I could take that to Vietnam, but that is the extent of my roots here in this country.

I feel like when I went to Vietnam, I talked to them and I took that job, and it was probably like two weeks from my first conversation with them to my landing in Vietnam. I've always been very quick to say, yes, I can take that job. Yes, I'll be there. I'll be there next week if you need me.

Wait. Two weeks from Chicago to Vietnam, or were you somewhere else?

I was back in the suburbs. There I was just returned to the States, and I was only there for two months.

I was going to stay for the summer, and I knew I wanted to go someplace else, you know, at the end of summer. Yeah. And, yeah, it was probably a little bit less than two weeks from my initial application and interview to already being here. Right there.

Yeah. Yeah.

And same with my first job in for Thailand. Like, I took that and it was less than a month from when I talked to them to when I arrived.

Yeah. So what is it for you if you don't mind me asking.

That keeps you from putting down routes that drives you to, you know, travel more, to explore more places. Obviously you came back for a period of time and you left again. You come back again, you're wanting to leave now.

You just don't want to abandon your cat.

It's a lot of things. I don't know. Sometimes things get a little boring in one place for too long. It depends on who is around you, I guess.

You know, you live somewhere you really like, maybe you're more likely to want to stay there. I really do like Chicago as far as the States go. I think it's out of every place I've been to or lived. I think it's a pretty good city.

But I don't know, maybe it's. I'm not as interested in hanging out with other Americans all the time.

Sure, I have a dim view of people in general, but especially Americans at this point in time. After this recent election, it's gone even lower, dude.

Yeah.

Well, election aside, I'm honored then that if you have a dim view of people in general that you would be willing to jump on and have a chat with me after not chatting for, geez, what, seven years?

No, it doesn't feel like it was that long ago. Although a lot has transpired since then.

But a lot of the people I met there, I liked most of them. And if any of them reached out to me, which occasionally, you know, we'll send each other a message or something.

But no, I like most of them, which is more rare. Generous than. Yeah. How I feel about people here.

Yeah. Yeah, I felt that to a certain extent. Not that I didn't like anybody.

It's just that I wanted to be around people then who had a similar mindset, at least when it. Well, I guess not limited to just travel and valuing that, but a more open mindset. And for me, at that point, I was.

Use the word, I suppose, transitioning out of my. My faith and organized religion and just my beliefs about the. Were very much in flux at that point in time. And I came back because my. My mother was.

Was sick, got a surprise like cancer diagnosis. You probably remember that because you were there when. When I was trying to figure all that out. And you know, do I go or do I stay?

How much longer do I stay for? And.

But yeah, I definitely remember coming back and even you know, after all that got sorted out and I left Newfoundland again, I Wanting to be around people with more of an open mindset didn't matter to me if they grew up the same way that I did. I wanted them.

I wanted to be around people who were explorative, who, you know, had an open mindset about all the things that would just about try anything once.

I think a lot of people, their first time traveling, a lot of it sometimes is wanting to make a big change in their life because something has happened.

Maybe they lost their job or maybe a relationship failed or any major sort of upsetting change in their life, I think can motivate people to travel, take off, try something new.

But a lot of the people we met in Vietnam, I think a lot of them, because a lot of them were from South Africa, a lot of them probably chose that more out of necessity. They always talked about, yeah, the situation back home, how difficult it is to find work. And I think that's why there were so many of them there.

And, I mean, a lot of them did seem to enjoy it, but a lot of them felt like they didn't have a lot of other options.

Yeah, yeah, I remember those conversations. I think that's fair.

We had a couple of other people there as well, but they were a little bit younger and probably had, you know, hopefully, I suppose, influences pushing them to do something like that. Or maybe it was just similar to yourself, movies and whatever.

I can't say that movies for me were an influence because of that mindset, because of the, you know, the way that I grew up. Which is kind of wild to think that it was that.

That limiting that, you know, whenever I saw a movie or read a book that it didn't make me think about, oh, I should go there, you know, I wonder what that place would be like, you know what I mean?

Well, I'm such a huge film nerd, and I've always loved literature as well. So the amount of books I read and films I watch in a year is ridiculous.

And adventure films, you know, I'm thinking back to some of my favorite movies as a kid. Something like Indiana Jones. Obviously, going to Vietnam is not the same as exploring a temple. And, you know, well, they have those there.

A large boulder.

Yes, sir.

But, yeah, those types of adventure films and even the books. So I started reading a lot more, maybe in junior high, but even the assigned reading in grade school, there was lots of great adventure stories.

And, you know, that was appealing to me. And, yeah, it was a big influence.

I think Yeah, I, I, I don't remember feeling that draw. Yeah, I, I don't know.

And, and you know, I don't mean to dump all of that on organized religion and Christianity, but like, maybe there, there is something about me that I just needed a certain influence or whatever to think that way. I, I really don't know, but I don't know. That's a, that's a different podcast altogether.

The specific opportunity of teaching English abroad, you've done that now far more than I have in different, different places, different setups. Do you think that that is almost a no brainer as an option, as like your, your initial experience, your, your gateway into traveling abroad?

If you're on a limited budget, it is easily the best option.

Yeah, because the barrier to entry is so low and it is a very easy way to get whatever visa or semi permanent status to stay in the country for up to a year. Like it just makes everything so easy and so simple. I think it's, for most people it's going to be their best choice.

I'm not sure how much you know, because it's, it's not overly complex, but could speak to that process just a little bit because I know there are people who consider it, I mean, who are definitely are considering it now.

But I know of like one guy at least that I've talked to recently that has thought about it a bunch and kind of kicked it around for an extended period of time. How simple is that to get into? And where would you start? Not, not just in the process, but where, like geographically?

Yeah, I mean, I guess it depends on where you want to go. If you're going to go someplace completely different. I mean, Southeast Asia is a first consideration for a lot of people.

You could go through the government and get like a better job, more official job, or you could go to private schools over there. They call them hagwons and those could be shady, but the qualifications are lower.

Okay, but if you want to go there, something like that, like in different countries you can go through a government sponsored job. But I mean those are going to be like a more respectable job generally.

Like where we worked in Vietnam, that was like a private after school language center. Those types of jobs are great because it's less hours.

Like where we worked it was like around 20 or a little Bit over a little bit less depending on the time of the year or whatever, but working 20 hours a week is ideal. But if you're going to go to Korea, you're going to be working 40 hours a week.

And part, part of the appeal for me of doing this is to get out of the States is to get a better work life balance.

Right?

To me, working 40 hours a week, I mean, everyone I know who does that is so exhausted when they get home from work that they don't want to do anything. And then they complain about getting all their chores and errands done on the weekends. And you know, most people don't seem happy with that.

So that's a big part of the appeal for me. And it depends on where you go in the world, on how many hours you're going to work. This last time I left Vietnam and went back.

I went back two more times. And the last time I had an interview and a job lined up in Korea and Jeju island and it looked fantastic.

They kept selling it to me as the Hawaii of Korea. Everything I checked out, it seemed legit. But at the end of the day, the, the pay was the same. One was 40 hours a week and one was 20.

And the cost of living was a huge difference.

Right.

So I just couldn't, I couldn't go there.

But as far as the process for doing it, if the easiest way is to go to a website, something like Dave's ESL Cafe, and talk to a recruiter or talk to a school directly, and if you're talking to a recruiter, they'll do most of it for you. I mean, sometimes they're going to take a fee from the school that, you know, they place you at, right.

When sometimes they'll expect something like a fee from you. But you know, if you don't know what you're doing, that's a pretty easy way to get in.

Or, you know, if you want to go outside of that, do it a different way. It requires a little bit more research.

You can go to message boards for whatever country and start looking to see who are the major schools hiring, you know, what are the rates, what is the process. But I don't think it's overly complex.

Yeah.

And there's different requirements. Like in Vietnam, our school wanted us to have a bachelor's degree, but a lot of people there did not.

A lot of people there didn't have an official TEFL certification or if they did, they did a very cheap online one that you could do in a week for like $40.

Right.

But that is changing now because mine was a combination, a hybrid of in class and online work.

Okay.

And a lot of. In the last few years, what I've seen is most.

A lot of places anyway, are asking for it to all be in person and for it to be over 100 or 120 hours coursework. So, you know, I'm not interested in going back and doing another one.

I would think that my years of teaching experience would absolutely be more than enough. But no. I had employers in Vietnam. This last time I was there saying no, because yours is only 100 hours and 40 of it was online. We can't accept you.

Right. They're just looking to check a box. Yeah, yeah, yeah, That's. That's too bad. Yeah, it's definitely not complex or even really hard.

I'm from my experience, I did the TEFL and heard that Vietnam paid well, and that was that, you know, 20 hour week, kind of average.

Showed up in Saigon and got myself an Airbnb and just basically went and chatted with the like four or five different English centers that I had, like, put onto, like a note on my phone. Right. Just found their addresses, got on the grab bikes, bounced around. I didn't have anything. Londo.

Yeah, A lot of people have said that they did that they just went to the country first and then found a job second. I mean, I'm glad it worked out for some people, but I would never do that unless I had to.

Is that because things have changed now as opposed to then, or.

Well, I'm very picky in my employers and so many of these schools, there's. Private language centers are shady as hell or, you know, they want you to work more hours a week sometimes.

A lot of them only offer one day off a week.

Right.

And yeah, even if you're working still 20 hours a week, one day off is not acceptable to me.

Sure.

Again, why would I leave here working five days a week and go somewhere else to work six?

Yeah.

And, yeah, I just. I wouldn't want to get stuck with a. With a placement or school that I didn't like.

And then once you leave a company, you know, the clock starts ticking on your.

On your visa or, you know, whatever time you have, because that has led to me leaving a couple times and then just going home for a little while and going back and sorting out another job rather than just trying to scramble to find something there.

Right. Okay. So there's definitely some questions to answer. It's smart, I suppose, to do a little bit of research ahead of time and ask some questions.

You've mentioned a couple resources for that. Where are you heading to next?

Right now I'm planning to stick around here for a while. I. My current job, teaching martial arts, it is very few hours and the most I've ever been paid, so it's hard to give this up. And I have a.

A place, an apartment here in the city that I'm pretty happy with. And I have my cat, so I guess I'm gonna be here for a while. But I'm actually looking at getting citizenship in Mexico. I don't know.

The process of even just making appointments to figure out the paperwork has been frustrating.

Yeah.

But there's teaching jobs over there. They don't pay very much.

But there's also options to further my education there Because I only have a bachelor's degree, I could potentially get a master's degree very cheap. So Mexico is on my list of possibilities.

But for other people who are interested for their first job, if they're Canadian or American, I would recommend Spain, because the government hires the people and you have to be from one of these two countries. It's called, like, the cultural ambassador program, but you can find it. And it doesn't pay a lot, but, I mean, it's.

It's an official job and you can stay. You contracted for one year with the option to stay for a second year. And you are, at least on paper, you are the assistant teacher.

So you're not supposed to be teaching the classes by yourself.

Okay.

But most of the time, you end up doing it anyway, which I did when I was there, but I was working 12 hours a week.

Right.

And the only problem was they had an age cut off at the time was 35 years old, but then they upped it to 40, which was perfect because I was 35, so I was right on the cusp. But then I believe now it's 40. And the Spanish government is not super organized, so people were paid late occasionally. But you do get.

You do get paid. Like, even if it's late, you know, they're not going to just rip you off like some shady private school. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I.

I like the experience there. Most of the people were fresh out of college or taking a gap year in college, because I don't think you even really need the bachelor's.

I think maybe an associates will do okay, but. And it won't be as jarring of a change to, say, Southeast Asia. And a lot of Americans will speak a little bit.

Maybe a beginner level of Spanish just right from being here. So I think that's a pretty good option for a lot of people and I definitely recommended it to people.

Sounds like an easy way in for Americans specifically.

Yeah, I actually, I met someone in a bar here in Chicago. I don't know, I just started chatting with her and she said she just got back from Spain and she explained the program to me.

And then I looked it up online and applied to it and yeah, I took that job almost right away.

I've never been. I would love to go. We're. We're hoping to do a Southern Europe trip at some point in the next year.

One of our friends actually is looking at getting married in Spain. Wait, are they engaged at this point? Yes. I can say this over the Internet. Yeah, they are pretty sure it's. It's a done deal. So we're.

We're going to try and get over there. I've been trying to learn some Spanish on Duolingo because I did not grow up learning Spanish. French is our second language here.

Well, that's actually great for Canadians and because I had a friend who taught in France and one of the requirements there is they want you to at least speak a. A maybe not completely fluent, but a beginner to proficient level of French.

Right.

And those jobs are also, I believe my friend worked through the government there as well. And so that's another option that one does. It didn't pay quite as well as Spain, but I mean, France is just a nice place to live.

I think a lot of people would jump at that opportunity if they can speak French.

Yeah. Well, dude, listen, it's been great catching up with you. You've got a ton of experience in this.

I think this is going to be, at worst inspiring and at best, like, this is probably just some of the information that you need just to get going.

Sure, yeah. It's been great catching up with you. I haven't seen you in forever.

Yeah, but I mean, when you said the topic, the benefits of travel, I was thinking about it a lot and I don't know that it's going to be beneficial for everyone. I think if you're a curious person and you're interested in the world around you, it will absolutely benefit you.

But there was a great SNL skit a couple years ago and Adam Sandler came back and hosted and it was called Romano Tours.

I recommend people watch that because the great bit on it is he's dealt with so many people who didn't enjoy their trip to Italy and so he keeps giving out these warnings that if you're unhappy where you are now, you're still going to be unhappy. You're just going to be unhappy in Italy instead.

And I would recommend people watch that before you make a life changing decision, thinking that, you know, you're going to escape your problems and they're not going to follow you.

Right.

But, but if you are interested and you are curious, I do think travel would benefit a lot of people.

Yeah, that is hilarious. But that is great life advice and I love that it's coming from Adam Sandler SNL sketch because, I mean, that's, that's the truth.

Like, you know, for me, I just wanted something different. I needed an experience like that to help me process what I was going through. I wasn't necessarily an unhappy individual.

That was, you know, just kind of going to a different place to be unhappy there. But I get exactly what you're saying because that is, that is so true.

I know so many people who just do like a, you know, a short cruise or they'll go to an all inclusive or whatever, but that has its own benefits. But in no way are they the same, like, to go and live somewhere. Geez, I don't know, man.

How long do you think you'd have to live somewhere to really reap the benefits that we've kind of been talking about here?

Anywhere from a couple of months to a year.

Yeah. Yeah, that feels right to me.

You got to be there long enough that there's, there's some rough edges, there's some challenges, there's some things that you got to figure out that just don't make sense, that are different and your, you know, your worldview is, is challenged.

Yeah. I mean, if, and if you grew up somewhere that. I think the US Is generally kind of the same. Yeah.

Little cities and regions are a little bit different, but if you're used to everything being sort of the same, I think, you know, it might be more appealing than to try someplace else. And the longer you spend time there, you know, the more you'll appreciate the differences and maybe appreciate your situation.

Because maybe, like, I definitely thought, oh, there's a lot of things I hate about the States and they still are for sure. But going overseas and seeing other ways of doing things, sometimes they're like, oh, that's great, I wish we would do that.

Or I say, oh, the way we do it back home, it's actually pretty effective. So just that perspective is always great.

Yeah, it definitely would change your perspective on the. What's Going on back home, I. I missed clothing sizes when I was there. I found it very difficult to find a sweater.

That was my biggest challenge because Ha long got a little colder than I expected it to because I'm thinking, you know, Southeast Asia, they don't have winter, but they sure do. Like, it got like, I don't know, maybe five. So on the bike, that feels a bit crisp. So I was trying to find a sweater. I found one at one point.

Yeah, I was an off the rack guy in Vietnam. But definitely, if you're a big guy in either direction, you might want to pack accordingly.

Pack accordingly. That's the next bit of advice from this episode.

Like I said, I didn't do a lot of research and I didn't have any, you know, big negative effects for that. But because, yeah, my size was ideal.

But yeah, definitely look at the climate, the weather, safety, all of these things, and be on your best behavior.

Yeah, no doubt.

You're a guest in their country and the laws might be different. So try not to go there and be an. And then, you know, just do a little bit of research.

Yeah.

Talk to some people, watch YouTube videos. I've noticed in the last few years.

That's what I did.

Any country you go to, there's going to be dozens of people who've made videos about it and we'll tell you their view of it and, you know, tricks and tips and stuff like that. Those videos are great.

Yeah. Be on your best behavior until you learn what the norm is in the place that you were living in.

Exactly. We weren't always on our best behavior, but we had.

Yeah.

I mean, I heard stories like after.

After a few years when I started to meet different people and people who had better connections because that city was very strange and that everybody knew everybody's. And Facebook was like this huge place for people to gossip. But, yeah, it was interesting.

But then eventually someone told me that all of the police in that city were bribed by the businesses to leave us alone. Which is why anytime I didn't want to wear a helmet, I never got pulled over. If I was going through, like, I never heard that there was a roadblocks.

They would set up occasionally. Yeah. In the night. And when I would roll up on my bike, they would look at me and just wave me through.

And everyone else had to take like a breathalyzer and talk to them. Where was this? That was in Halong, dude.

I never got stopped. I rode maybe once or twice with a helmet and I just got sick of it. Just the heat, I couldn't handle it. I couldn't see, like, periphery. Right.

And I never got stopped.

Well, there was a time when they were doing, like a national push to try to enforce DUI laws because I saw a few accidents, and people. People there tend to be a little more cavalier about driving after having a few drinks.

So there was a time for like six months when there was a constant roadbloc trucks late in the evening, like after midnight on the highway in between the two parts of town.

Yeah.

Where they would just have roadblocks. And they always just wave me through. I never had an issue there.

No way. But I never heard that the businesses would pay the police. Are you serious?

Well, if people are getting tickets and getting, you know, with for a little. Sorry, probably you're good.

If they're getting messed with up for, you know, piddling little things, you know, it's not going to be as big of a tourist destination, but people know they can go there, they can drink, they can have fun. This actually reminds me at the beginning, you asked me one of my favorite stories from Vietnam.

Oh, here we go.

Now, I. Now I remember one.

There was a new bar that opened up in Halong, like a small little one, you know, not anything that's going to draw the fancy tourist crowd, you know, like a dirty little bar with a pool table. But everybody knew since it opened that that was a place you could buy weed.

Okay.

And I don't really smoke, so I wasn't very interested in that. But all my friends were going, and so I decided to go.

And I was there with my roommate, and he brought his bong, and people were, you know, packing up, passing around in a circle. And this. There's Westerners and Vietnamese people together, smoking. And this guy, this Vietnamese guy passes it to me, and I'm like, oh, no, thanks.

And I pass it along, and then he starts chatting me up, asking me, you know, where I work. And I told him, and he's like, oh, you must know my sister. She works there. He mentions her name. Yeah, I know her. She's great.

And I'm like, what do you do? He's like, I'm an undercover cop. And I'm quiet for a moment, and I'm like, oh, that's probably interesting, right?

Yeah.

And we start chatting. He's got weed. He's putting it in there, and he's packing it, smoking it, passing along. And, you know, you don't know. Is he joking? What's going on?

So I went to work the next day, and I Talked to her. I met your. Your brother. She's like, yeah, he told me. He said this. You were. You were a good boy. You didn't smoke anything.

And I'm like, you're a good boy.

Yeah, I. You know, I don't really smoke, but. Is he an undercover cop? She's like, yeah, yeah, he's undercover cop.

Just so nonchalant. Geez.

All right, well, he blew his cover because now I know.

But yeah, yeah, I found all that very interesting there, man. I like. Like I said, I never got stopped. I went past cops often.

Actually, my only experience, like, where I actually had an interaction with the police was on my way from Hanoi to Ha Long. I bought the bike there, and what happened was I was planning on using my phone for GPS and just riding to Ha Long.

Never had ridden a motorcycle, really, in my life up to this point. But my phone. I had, like, a little rain accident in Hanoi where I put my phone in an exterior pocket on my waterproof jacket.

Of course, waterproof jacket caught all the water, and it's waterproof, so it just held it. And so my phone was in this, like, rain bath for however long I rode around, ruined the phone.

Didn't have gps, just guessed my way and kind of charaded it out with a couple people whenever I wasn't sure and made it there just fine. But along the way, I was on a highway that apparently motorbikes weren't supposed to be on the new one. Yeah, yeah, I didn't. I didn't know that.

I'm not sure if I ignored the sign. Dude, it was a while ago. I don't remember. It doesn't matter. Anyways, this.

This cop pulls me over, and then within 30 seconds, there's five other cops there. One guy spoke a bit of English, enough to basically tell me that you're fine, you're not in trouble. We all just wanted to stop you and talk to you.

That's all it was. These guys were smiling, asking questions like, who's the big guy on the bike? Right.

Yeah.

I mean, if you had a helmet on, though.

So if you're in between Hanoi and Ha Long, some of those people might not have ever seen someone that looked like you before.

Yeah, yeah, that. That happened in a couple places, but.

And once you leave Ha Long, you're no longer under that free zone of protection. You will get pulled over. You don't have a helmet. You will get pulled over.

Yeah, I hung out with a couple people in. In Hanoi who were very aware of that. I remember one guy saying that he knew, like, a spot that was common for blocks that we just went around.

But, yeah, I never got stopped, dude. Again, really enjoyed catching up with you. Thank you so much for just sharing your experiences and being so, so open with it all.

And I really hope that this inspires someone to pull the trigger and just try something different.

Sure. Let me know if you're ever in the States. Chicago's not that far.

Yeah, I honestly, I would love to, man. And if you ever want to come. Newfoundland, summer, beginning of fall. This place is great. You want to see some icebergs in spring?

Maybe even come then?

Yeah, I've never been. It sounds great.

Yeah. All right, brother. It's great to catch up with you. I'll talk to you later.

All right, later.

Yeah. See you. Thank you for listening. I hope you found some value in this episode.

If you have, be sure to share the Akkeri podcast with a friend and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. You can find the Akkeri on socials at the Ocari and on the web@theAkkeri.com.