Well for the Journey

In this episode, Greg talks about Well for the Journey, a spiritual wellness center in Lutherville, MD. The various programs offered in different formats and settings are focused on spiritual well-being, and center on the sacred conversation between the Spirit and a person's spirit, with the aim of bringing transformation and healing to the world. Changing the world, one person at a time, one heart at a time.

We are honored to have Greg Cochran as our guest on this episode. Greg Cochran is Executive Director at a spiritual wellness center, Well for the Journey, in Lutherville, Maryland. He is a program/retreat facilitator and a spiritual companion. Greg is currently a staff member of Shalem Institute’s Spiritual Guidance Program in D.C. and a mentor in Paseo’s Spiritual Guidance Program in Idaho. He recently completed his service as Associate Pastor at Woodbrook Baptist Church (1988-2022). Greg is a graduate of Clemson University and Southern Seminary. He and his wife, Carole, live in Baltimore. They have two children (26 and 24). Greg is a hiker, photographer, woodworker, and loves being with family – and is always desiring to be open and listening for the invitation of the Spirit.

Highlights:

[00:00:00] Intro 

[00:01:45] How did Well for the Journey get started? 

[00:04:59] How has the Spirit surprised you? 

[00:06:05] A Model for Listening 

[00:08:16] What is Spiritual Wellness? 

[00:10:15] Challenges  

[00:12:58] Faith and Trust 

[00:13:26] Moving Into the Surrounding Communities 

[00:16:07] Expanding the Reach and Impact 

[00:17:37] Hope for the World 

[00:19:12] How someone can participate in or support Well for the Journey 

[00:20:47] Thanks 

Resources mentioned in this episode:

• Well for the Journey – A Spiritual Wellness Center in Lutherville, MD

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© 2023 Listening for Clues

Jon: 00:00:12

Welcome to Good News being brought to you by Listening for Clues.

Lauren: 00:00:17

We are Lauren Welch and Jon Shematek Deacons in the

Lauren: 00:00:21

Episcopal Diocese of Maryland.

Jon: 00:00:23

We sure are, and today we've got some good news for

Jon: 00:00:26

you from Well for the Journey.

Jon: 00:00:28

We have a special guest, Greg Cochran, who is the executive director at Well

Jon: 00:00:34

for the Journey, which is a spiritual wellness center in Lutherville, Maryland.

Jon: 00:00:40

There Greg works as a program and retreat facilitator and spiritual companion.

Jon: 00:00:47

Greg is currently also a staff member of the Shalem Institute's

Jon: 00:00:51

Spiritual Guidance Program in the district, and a mentor in Paseos

Jon: 00:00:57

Spiritual Guidance program in Idaho.

Jon: 00:01:01

Greg recently completed his service as associate pastor at

Jon: 00:01:06

Woodbrook Baptist Church, and that was a long pastorate Greg.

Jon: 00:01:10

I mean, it was like 34 years, I think, if my math is right.

Jon: 00:01:13

You're a graduate of Clemson University and Southern Seminary.

Jon: 00:01:18

Greg and his wife Carol, live in Baltimore ... And they have two children.

Jon: 00:01:22

Greg is a hiker, photographer woodworker and loves being with family and is

Jon: 00:01:29

always desiring to be open and listening for the invitation of the Spirit.

Jon: 00:01:37

So, Greg, welcome.

Greg: 00:01:39

Well, thank you.

Greg: 00:01:40

Thanks for inviting me on.

Greg: 00:01:42

Thank you for what you all are doing.

Lauren: 00:01:45

Greg, we're really grateful to have you with us today.

Lauren: 00:01:48

Well for the Journey has been around for a while.

Lauren: 00:01:51

So , tell us about it.

Greg: 00:01:52

Sure.

Greg: 00:01:53

We're just a little over 20 years old now.

Greg: 00:01:55

It started with one person, May Beth Hudson who was in the Episcopal Church

Greg: 00:02:01

at Good Shepherd who had, she would call it probably a divine discontent.

Greg: 00:02:06

She's a lawyer by education and training but was feeling this stirring within her.

Greg: 00:02:13

And she went to her rector at the time Scott Slater, many people

Greg: 00:02:17

may know Scott, and Scott invited her to invite others to listen.

Greg: 00:02:22

And through that listening , the group grew to, outside of the Church of the

Greg: 00:02:28

Good Shepherd, and actually a program formed first called Women at the Well.,

Greg: 00:02:33

that preceded Well for the Journey.

Greg: 00:02:36

The group decided it wanted to incorporate itself into a nonprofit in July of 2002.

Greg: 00:02:43

So at that point, the Well was birthed.

Greg: 00:02:45

And here we are over 20 years later continuing and now we're

Greg: 00:02:50

reaching nationwide through online.

Greg: 00:02:52

So we're excited about that.

Jon: 00:02:56

Yeah, that was one of the hidden blessings of the pandemic for so many

Jon: 00:03:00

of us that we could expand our, reach.

Jon: 00:03:03

I was looking at your website recently and you have just an amazing

Jon: 00:03:07

breadth of programs that you offer.

Jon: 00:03:09

Can you talk a little about that, Greg?

Greg: 00:03:12

Sure.

Greg: 00:03:12

The creators of the Well, wanted to create a safe, sacred space where

Greg: 00:03:18

people could come wherever they are on their spiritual journey to be

Greg: 00:03:22

able to ask questions, to explore, to experience community and connection.

Greg: 00:03:27

And so with that, knowing that each individual has their

Greg: 00:03:32

own unique style of learning.

Greg: 00:03:34

We provide a breadth of ways that they can connect with the spirit in that way.

Greg: 00:03:40

So we have programming that uses art.

Greg: 00:03:43

We have traditional small group programming.

Greg: 00:03:46

We do pilgrimages.

Greg: 00:03:47

We use journaling.

Greg: 00:03:49

Kind of a trademark of the Well is a is small group so where people

Greg: 00:03:54

can have opportunity to talk about their experiences and, to learn.

Greg: 00:03:59

When we first started, it was really People who felt like from their

Greg: 00:04:05

own congregation, they needed, wanted something a little deeper.

Greg: 00:04:08

So they'd go to their congregation on a Sunday but then during the week

Greg: 00:04:13

would take programs at the Well.

Greg: 00:04:15

And as we have grown and expanded, we're finding people coming who

Greg: 00:04:20

have had a bad experience in their childhood or other times.

Greg: 00:04:24

in institutional religious community people who would be considered

Greg: 00:04:29

spiritual but not religious.

Greg: 00:04:31

Mm.

Greg: 00:04:32

People who may not claim any kind of spiritual tradition, but know

Greg: 00:04:37

that there's something within themselves that want to connect

Greg: 00:04:40

something bigger than who they are.

Greg: 00:04:42

And we have started having people from other faith traditions joining us too.

Greg: 00:04:47

So again, for us, the idea is, To provide a safe, sacred space and get

Greg: 00:04:54

out of the way and let Spirit do what Spirit's going to do in that space.

Lauren: 00:04:59

So, Greg, has the spirit surprised you in any ways?

Greg: 00:05:04

Oh, good question.

Greg: 00:05:06

Yes.

Greg: 00:05:07

So one of the things that I am learning, I have learned and continue to learn,

Greg: 00:05:12

and I hope I continue to learn is the idea of not getting ahead of the Spirit.

Greg: 00:05:19

When I decided to apply for this position here I wanted to be in

Greg: 00:05:26

the world, but not of the world.

Greg: 00:05:28

And so with that, that means not getting ahead of the spirit listening.

Greg: 00:05:33

So listening and discerning is very key to, who we are.

Greg: 00:05:38

There's been many times when I have not heeded that and I've

Greg: 00:05:44

found myself getting into trouble.

Greg: 00:05:45

Like things, we try things too quickly and they may not work out.

Greg: 00:05:50

And so really listening and being patient and taking our time that has been a

Greg: 00:05:56

learning and a good surprise for me.

Greg: 00:05:59

Something like I knew in my head.

Greg: 00:06:01

But you know, they say the longest distance is between

Greg: 00:06:04

the head and the heart.

Jon: 00:06:05

And so I'm wondering how that actually translates for people that

Jon: 00:06:09

participate in your, program.

Jon: 00:06:10

The listening, the discernment process is not I'm gathering is not just

Jon: 00:06:15

something that the facilitators do.

Jon: 00:06:17

But is this, is this something you, that you're modeling and

Jon: 00:06:21

teaching for folks that come there?

Greg: 00:06:23

Yeah.

Greg: 00:06:23

Yeah.

Greg: 00:06:24

So our board meets this coming Saturday and we have intentionally

Greg: 00:06:29

on our board, we have a.

Greg: 00:06:31

Spiritual guide or director for our board.

Greg: 00:06:35

So if we are going to talk about this is the way we want

Greg: 00:06:38

to be, we need to live it too.

Greg: 00:06:41

And a good chunk of the board time is spent after we've had

Greg: 00:06:46

conversations around business or how we are invited to grow.

Greg: 00:06:51

Like right now , we call it B D E I, belonging, diversity,

Greg: 00:06:56

equity, and inclusion.

Greg: 00:06:58

Really trying to pay attention to that.

Greg: 00:07:00

So we'll give a good amount of time to that this Saturday.

Greg: 00:07:04

Our board spiritual director will help lead that.

Greg: 00:07:06

And then that kind of filters down that listening into our staff.

Greg: 00:07:12

Our staff meetings always start off with a, a quote or a reflection

Greg: 00:07:17

and then a listening piece.

Greg: 00:07:19

And then that kind of infuses our staff meetings where we each have our roles and

Greg: 00:07:25

responsibilities, but we collaborate with one another and it gets very creative.

Greg: 00:07:31

And there'll be times when.

Greg: 00:07:33

We have great ideas, but it's not time for those ideas yet.

Greg: 00:07:37

And there's times when spirit moves among us and , yes, yes, it's time for that.

Greg: 00:07:44

And then that even filters down into you're correct, our facilitators

Greg: 00:07:49

where we meet and we intentionally have small group guidelines that

Greg: 00:07:54

help form that safe, sacred space.

Greg: 00:07:57

So that people feel comfortable to share when they're willing to share, which

Greg: 00:08:03

then translates to hearing their own story and hearing other people's story

Greg: 00:08:08

. It invites us to change or decide what

Greg: 00:08:13

Mm-hmm.

Greg: 00:08:13

Mm-hmm.

Lauren: 00:08:16

So, Greg, as, as you were talking, one of the things that you

Lauren: 00:08:21

said in your bio is that Well, for the Journey was a wellness center.

Lauren: 00:08:27

How do, you describe spiritual wellness?

Greg: 00:08:32

Yeah.

Greg: 00:08:32

So I, I'm one and I think we here believe that we're all connected.

Greg: 00:08:38

We're whole people.

Greg: 00:08:38

So that includes the the emotional, mental, social, physical.

Greg: 00:08:44

And what makes each of us unique is that we have our, spirit who we are.

Greg: 00:08:49

So, and for me, I believe that is the thread that intertwines among all the

Greg: 00:08:54

others and helps bring it all together.

Greg: 00:08:57

So in our programming, we try to pay attention to that.

Greg: 00:09:01

We have a class on intuitive eating coming up and and one

Greg: 00:09:05

on intuitive cooking coming up.

Greg: 00:09:08

So the idea of how we eat feed ourselves, our physical self plays a part in

Greg: 00:09:14

our spiritual self and vice versa.

Greg: 00:09:16

We have yoga classes, and again, we, we have classes where we're outside and

Greg: 00:09:23

we have some woods in the back here.

Greg: 00:09:25

We're located on the campus of the Church of the Holy Comforter.

Greg: 00:09:28

There's some woods in the back where we will take walks in the woods through tree

Greg: 00:09:33

space, our, a program called Tree Space.

Greg: 00:09:36

So with time and space and silence and practice, we hope that that can

Greg: 00:09:41

move down to the heart where it's kind of naturally lived out in the world.

Greg: 00:09:46

And that is part of our, our mission and our vision and our hope

Greg: 00:09:50

is that people who come here is, it just, just doesn't stay here.

Greg: 00:09:55

But it's a change in transformation so that like you all are doing, It goes

Greg: 00:10:00

out into the world and hopefully to transform the world and heal the world.

Greg: 00:10:04

So that's for me the, the, how the spiritual part plays into the wellness

Greg: 00:10:10

of all of who we are and hopefully the world too, our community and world.

Jon: 00:10:15

Yeah, it sounds, it sounds like the Spirit sure has been

Jon: 00:10:18

active in, in the work that you've done all these over these years.

Jon: 00:10:21

I'm, wondering too if Well, for the Journey or you, yourself personally,

Jon: 00:10:26

have encountered any obstacles along the way and what those might

Jon: 00:10:30

be and how, you overcame them.

Greg: 00:10:33

Yeah.

Greg: 00:10:34

Yeah.

Greg: 00:10:34

Another good question.

Greg: 00:10:35

Well, both personally and, for the Well.

Greg: 00:10:39

I think what moved me toward my contemplative way of being and helped

Greg: 00:10:46

me discover that that's kind of who I am at, heart was an experience

Greg: 00:10:50

when I was a teenager working with my uncle who was killed in a construction

Greg: 00:10:55

accident that was right beside me.

Greg: 00:10:58

I grew up in a very evangelical conservative tradition in South Carolina

Greg: 00:11:04

where the thinking was dualistic, you know, black or white, right or wrong.

Greg: 00:11:09

And that experience didn't fit in with that.

Greg: 00:11:11

So that began my questioning and invitation into a deeper conversation and

Greg: 00:11:20

relationship with, who I would call God.

Greg: 00:11:23

And that has changed me for sure and invited me into exploration.

Greg: 00:11:30

And compassion for others who may be in that same space who may be questioning

Greg: 00:11:36

or I think the kind of code or fad word right now is deconstruction of

Greg: 00:11:42

your faith and then a reconstruction.

Greg: 00:11:45

So been through that for sure.

Greg: 00:11:47

And the Well there's been some lean years for sure as we have grown.

Greg: 00:11:52

And we, talk about ourselves as an organism instead of an organization,

Greg: 00:11:57

something living and growing and breathing and, and that's what it's felt like.

Greg: 00:12:02

There's been times when.

Greg: 00:12:04

It is felt like we've been on the brink of like, oh, I'm not sure how financially

Greg: 00:12:09

we're gonna be able to make it.

Greg: 00:12:11

But it's again, for me, leaning back into what I learned personally and

Greg: 00:12:16

what we're learning collectively here at the well is leaning into

Greg: 00:12:20

and listening to, and not getting ahead of the Spirit in our movement.

Greg: 00:12:25

I am not a pie in the sky kind of faith person, like, you know but that's, I guess

Greg: 00:12:32

Lauren, you're asking, being surprised.

Greg: 00:12:34

That's where I've been surprised too.

Greg: 00:12:36

That being patient and waiting, and that's hard to do at times

Greg: 00:12:39

or that waiting things have.

Greg: 00:12:42

Come about and have happened, not in ways that we have thought, but they've

Greg: 00:12:46

happened to help keep the Well sustained both financially and as a community

Greg: 00:12:53

too, so with energy and synergy.

Jon: 00:12:58

So there's faith and trust there as well as keeping a practical eye on things.

Greg: 00:13:03

Oh, for sure.

Greg: 00:13:04

And I think that's the bigger part of it all is the faith and the trust that

Greg: 00:13:08

goes into waiting and listening and moving through the world in that way.

Greg: 00:13:15

And that's a way of, for me, of being different in the world,

Greg: 00:13:19

which you all, I'm sure you, you practice as well and know well too

Greg: 00:13:23

as deacons of the Episcopal diocese.

Lauren: 00:13:26

Is there anything else that you want to tell us about

Lauren: 00:13:29

the the Well for the Journey?

Greg: 00:13:31

We have a mobile well that we take out to other communities.

Greg: 00:13:35

For example we recently started doing some programming out at

Greg: 00:13:40

Mercy Ridge retirement community.

Greg: 00:13:43

There's a Lutheran retirement community in Catonsville that

Greg: 00:13:47

we're starting to work with.

Greg: 00:13:49

We work with Villa Assumpta.

Greg: 00:13:51

The School Sisters of Notre Dame mother house there we worked with

Greg: 00:13:57

congregations and actually even some businesses to provide some programming.

Greg: 00:14:03

But we also through grant grants that we've been able to obtain work with

Greg: 00:14:08

places like Marion House in the city.

Greg: 00:14:12

Marion House is a.

Greg: 00:14:14

Organization that provides residential housing for women coming

Greg: 00:14:18

off of addiction, incarceration and trying to learn skills to

Greg: 00:14:22

get back out into the world

Greg: 00:14:24

. We've connected with

Greg: 00:14:28

We're having a free program for caregivers taking care of our

Greg: 00:14:31

caregivers to help people out and, and minister to people in that way.

Greg: 00:14:37

We have a clergy program that is a, as a clergy person,

Greg: 00:14:41

myself, knowing the need for.

Greg: 00:14:44

Self-care.

Greg: 00:14:45

We wanted to provide just a space where clergy could come and

Greg: 00:14:49

they don't have to do anything.

Greg: 00:14:54

And be a part of someone facilitating a program for them.

Greg: 00:14:58

So there's a lot of things like that.

Greg: 00:15:00

August 6th, we're going to have a Well in the Woods, since we have some

Greg: 00:15:05

woods here, just a community event where people can come and we'll have

Greg: 00:15:09

some music and sit and, and their lawn chairs bring something to eat.

Greg: 00:15:14

And just enjoy some time together . So we just want to provide things like

Greg: 00:15:19

that for our community as well.

Greg: 00:15:21

Again, all driven by that desire to help change the world through people coming

Greg: 00:15:31

to be more aware of themselves and the, their connection with their spirit.

Greg: 00:15:36

And I call it The, deep conversation with the Spirit Capital S and our little

Greg: 00:15:43

spirit, that's always, I believe, always going on within us, and the goal is to

Greg: 00:15:49

help me, help myself, and to help others become more aware of that conversation

Greg: 00:15:54

and live out of that conversation.

Lauren: 00:15:58

And it's so wonderful that you're taking it out to a

Lauren: 00:16:01

broad range of the community.

Lauren: 00:16:02

It really is developing relationships all around.

Greg: 00:16:07

Yeah, and, and Jon, you mentioned earlier about the pandemic and online,

Greg: 00:16:12

and that was one of the challenges for sure is when the pandemic first hit,

Greg: 00:16:16

because we were not online at all.

Greg: 00:16:19

And we have such a great staff here, they help pivot pretty

Greg: 00:16:23

quickly and get us online.

Greg: 00:16:25

And now, we have online programs and in person programs and we are not surprised

Greg: 00:16:32

when we have registrants from Washington.

Greg: 00:16:35

British Columbia, Puerto Rico the northeast southwest

Greg: 00:16:41

southeast, all from all over.

Greg: 00:16:42

So that's been a, a gift for us and, and something we do not take lightly,

Greg: 00:16:47

and a responsibility that we, have.

Jon: 00:16:50

So anyone anywhere in the world, English speaking person, I assume

Jon: 00:16:54

can participate in programming from the Well, that's fantastic.

Jon: 00:16:58

Yeah.

Greg: 00:16:58

Yeah.

Greg: 00:16:59

We had actually one time we did a online pilgrimage with a person

Greg: 00:17:04

that portrays Harriet Tubman.

Greg: 00:17:07

And with that we had someone from Liberia join us online that was deaf.

Greg: 00:17:14

And so there was an interpreter on screen that was interpreting

Greg: 00:17:17

for her while she was joining us.

Greg: 00:17:20

And that was another surprising thing.

Greg: 00:17:21

It was like, again, a gift to us.

Greg: 00:17:24

I mean, it's not that we're just helping people live into transformation, but

Greg: 00:17:31

that's the way it's supposed to be.

Greg: 00:17:32

Right?

Greg: 00:17:32

We're being transformed too.

Greg: 00:17:34

I know.

Greg: 00:17:34

It's a, it's a mutual thing.

Greg: 00:17:36

So,

Lauren: 00:17:37

so everyone is growing in the spirit.

Lauren: 00:17:41

Well for the Journey, the community and worldwide, the, relationships

Lauren: 00:17:45

that are being forged are bringing the world together.

Lauren: 00:17:50

Together in the spirit so that we, really can have hope in our world.

Lauren: 00:17:54

I mean, what I'm hearing from you and what the well offers is just a

Lauren: 00:17:58

lot of hope, so I'm really grateful.

Greg: 00:18:02

And it, thanks Lauren.

Greg: 00:18:03

And, and that's funny that you mentioned that.

Greg: 00:18:06

Well, maybe not funny, but if we talk about spirit moving that just,

Greg: 00:18:10

we have another series that we do.

Greg: 00:18:13

It's called Well Said, it's, actually our fundraiser, a speaker

Greg: 00:18:16

series, and this past April we had Maria Broom, who's in the city.

Greg: 00:18:22

So I see you shaking your head.

Greg: 00:18:24

She was our guest speaker and it was on the Dance of Hope.

Greg: 00:18:28

And you're exactly right.

Greg: 00:18:29

It was trying to help bring hope into the world.

Greg: 00:18:32

And so she did a wonderful job with, and then great questions

Greg: 00:18:36

from those who were there.

Greg: 00:18:38

To help us think more deeply about what hope means and when things seem hopeless

Greg: 00:18:44

sometimes, or when we bump up against what seems like something that may not be

Greg: 00:18:50

able to change like in our system, but, but hope is what helps us move toward

Greg: 00:18:55

that and make that change to keep going.

Greg: 00:18:58

So, yes, yes, hope.

Greg: 00:19:01

Yep.

Jon: 00:19:01

You, this is changing the world.

Jon: 00:19:03

One person at a time, one heart at a time.

Jon: 00:19:05

I mean, that's how I think that is how it's supposed to be.

Jon: 00:19:08

So

Greg: 00:19:09

yeah.

Greg: 00:19:09

Jon, thank you.

Greg: 00:19:10

Yes.

Greg: 00:19:11

Yeah.

Jon: 00:19:12

And so, Greg, I did notice your speakers in the past.

Jon: 00:19:15

You have that on your website and it, looks like an amazing collection.

Jon: 00:19:19

I'm just wondering, I know some of our listeners and viewers are

Jon: 00:19:21

probably thinking, gosh, I'd like to learn more about the, Well, or,

Jon: 00:19:25

I'd like to participate in some way, maybe volunteer or donate or attend

Jon: 00:19:30

a program or suggest a program?

Jon: 00:19:32

How, what's the best way for people to learn and to give?

Greg: 00:19:37

Sure, sure.

Greg: 00:19:38

We have a website, Well for the Journey.org.

Greg: 00:19:41

So that's the best way to first start with us.

Greg: 00:19:45

On that you're able to sign up.

Greg: 00:19:46

We have a weekly e-newsletter comes out Wednesday evenings around seven o'clock.

Greg: 00:19:52

That gives a list of what's coming up on the Well's docket what

Greg: 00:19:56

programming we have coming up.

Greg: 00:19:59

And also we have a weekday daily faith reflection that comes out at

Greg: 00:20:05

6:00 AM . So when you get up, you're welcome to read that, and you can

Greg: 00:20:09

sign up for the e-newsletter and for the daily faith reflection.

Greg: 00:20:13

For free.

Greg: 00:20:14

And it is just a quote that comes out in the morning, so

Greg: 00:20:17

you can do that there as well.

Greg: 00:20:19

And we have a Wellbeing Wednesday.

Greg: 00:20:22

It's a weekly reflection through a call in.

Greg: 00:20:26

It's just all you do is dial a number and you're on mute, and

Greg: 00:20:30

all you have to do is listen.

Greg: 00:20:32

It's at 8:00 AM on Wednesday mornings for 15 minutes.

Greg: 00:20:36

And just hopefully to start your day that way.

Greg: 00:20:39

And right now our theme is compassion and self-compassion.

Greg: 00:20:44

And you can find out that information as well on the website.

Jon: 00:20:47

Great.

Jon: 00:20:47

Yeah.

Jon: 00:20:48

So one place to go, Well for the Journey, and we'll put the link in the show

Jon: 00:20:53

notes so people can find you easily.

Jon: 00:20:55

And Greg, I've gotta tell you, this has just been, this has been great.

Jon: 00:20:58

I feel I feel better.

Jon: 00:21:00

I'm getting well.

Greg: 00:21:02

Thank you all.

Greg: 00:21:03

Truly, truly.

Greg: 00:21:04

Thank you all for what you do as well, because again, Right.

Greg: 00:21:08

It takes a village and when people like you work with others and get out

Greg: 00:21:14

the word about others, like the Well and others places too that helps.

Greg: 00:21:19

Right.

Greg: 00:21:19

That one, one person at a time.

Greg: 00:21:21

Well, thank you for what you both do.

Jon: 00:21:23

Thanks so much for being here, Greg.

Greg: 00:21:25

Oh, thank you.

Lauren: 00:21:28

Jon and I also want to thank all who are watching and listening.

Lauren: 00:21:32

We cannot spread good news without your participation.

Lauren: 00:21:36

Please take a moment, comment like, and share on all your social

Lauren: 00:21:42

media that will help us spread the good news to even more people.

Lauren: 00:21:47

And again, thank you for the gift of your time with us today.

Lauren: 00:21:52

Until next time, peace and blessings.

Jon: 00:21:56

Good news is being brought to you by Listening for Clues.

Jon: 00:22:00

You can find us on our website, listening for clues.com, our YouTube channel,

Jon: 00:22:05

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