At every WWIA event, there is a certified WWIA Guide present. WWIA Guides are an essential part of accomplishing our mission, as they have been recommended by their fellow Purple Heart peers and are certified through our WWIA Guide School. WWIA Guide School is the world’s first multidisciplinary adaptive sporting guide program and prepares our Guides to lead and serve their fellow Purple Heart recipients and assist the event Hosts on each WWIA mission we conduct across North America.

On today’s episode of the WWIA Podcast, WWIA Founder and CEO, John McDaniel, is honored to welcome Purple Heart Hero and WWIA Guide, Gabe Fierros to the program. Gabe, along with his wife and son, reside in Long Pond, Pennsylvania. Gabe joined the Army after high school and was deployed to Iraq three times during his service. After being medically retired from the Army, Gabe worked in Anchorage, Alaska as a contractor for the Army. He later relocated to northeast Pennsylvania and took a federal position with Tobyhanna Army Depot, where he continues his career.

Gabe initially heard about WWIA from one of the guys in his unit and soon after attended his first duck hunting event in southwestern Ohio. He found it both relaxing and cathartic to be around like-minded people who understood his experiences and found that the camaraderie and experience was just what he needed. Gabe now proudly leads WWIA events as a Guide and enjoys giving back to his fellow combat-wounded Warriors. We hope you enjoy getting to know Gabe and hearing more about his story. Let’s join the conversation with John and Gabe now.

Takeaways:

• The WWIA Podcast focuses on bringing honor and healing to America's combat wounded veterans.
• Gabe Fierros shares his journey from soldier to guide, emphasizing the importance of camaraderie.
• The WWIA Guide School prepares veterans to support their peers during outdoor events.
• Gabe's experiences highlight the therapeutic value of outdoor activities for healing.
• The foundation creates a space for veterans to reconnect and bond over shared experiences.
• Gabe's story underscores the significance of mentorship and support within the veteran community.

Links referenced in this episode:

• wwiaf.org

Hello and welcome to the WWIA Podcast. We're honored to have you join us in our mission to bring honor, connection and healing to America's combat wounded Purple Heart heroes.

If this is your first time listening to this podcast, we welcome you. If you're a returning listener. Thanks for coming back. Please be sure to tell others about our podcast and leave us a review.

If you're enjoying what you're hearing at every WWIA event, there's a certified WWIA Guide present.

WWIA Guides are an essential part of accomplishing our mission as they've been recommended by their fellow Purple Heart peers and are certified through our WWIA Guide School.

WWIA Guide School is the world's first multidisciplinary adaptive sporting guide program and prepares our guides to lead and serve their fellow Purple Heart recipients and assist the event hosts on each WWIA mission we conduct across North America.

On today's episode of the WWIA Podcast, WWIA founder and CEO John McDaniel is honored to welcome Purple Heart Hero and WWIA Guide Gabe Fieros to the program. Gabe, along with his wife and son reside in Long Pond, Pennsylvania.

Gabe joined the army after high school and was deployed to Iraq three times during his service. After being medically retired from the Army G Gabe worked in Anchorage, Alaska as a contractor for the Army.

He later relocated to Northeast Pennsylvania and took a federal position with Toby Hana Army Depot where he continues his career. Gabe initially heard about WWIA from one of the guys in his unit and soon after attended his first duck hunting event in southwestern Ohio.

He found it both relaxing and cathartic to be around like minded people who understood his experiences and found that the camaraderie and experience was just what he needed. Gabe now proudly leads WWIA Events as a guide and enjoys giving back to his fellow combat Wounded Warriors.

We hope you enjoy getting to know Gabe and hearing more about his story. Let's join the conversation with John and Gabe now.

Hi, I'm John McDaniel, founder and CEO of the Wounded warriors in Action foundation and this is our podcast Honor, Connect and Heal. So today I have with me a gentleman who I've known for 14 years and he is an army guy that I met on an event.

He's become a guide for the foundation and he's just a great American. I've got very fond memories spending time with this person. We share a lot in common and I thought I'd ask him on the program.

Gabe Fieros, welcome to the program.

Thanks John, thanks for having me today.

Absolutely. So I'm looking at Gabe and, because you guys can't see, but we see each other by the modern miracles of technology through our podcast thing here.

But Gabe's got a big old honking Jeremiah Johnson beard going there. He's wearing his WWI ball cap, and he's actually at Toby Hanna. He's in Toby Hanna, Pennsylvania, at the Army Deep Depot there.

Taking a little break from work to chat with us. But you hail from Pennsylvania. That's where you live, Gabe.

That's currently where I live. I was born and raised in Ringo, Illinois, which is north Illinois, about 90 minutes north of Chicago, about 20 minutes from Wisconsin border.

Wow, I didn't know that. Yeah, yeah, I didn't know. Well, we share that, too. I wasn't born and raised in Illinois, but my parents moved.

I was born in East Lansing, Michigan, and then we moved to the suburbs of Chicago, so. Palatine, Illinois. I grew up there for many years until about the sixth or seventh grade, we moved to Oshkosh, Wisconsin.

So, yeah, we share that in common as well. Cool. All right, so let's just talk about your service real quick. You were in the Army. So tell it.

Tell us a little bit about your, you know, you joined the Army, you know, and. And take us up to the point where you go to combat, and then we'll take a quick tactical pause because I do want to chat about your Purple Heart.

So tell us your Army story, Gabe. I'd love to hear it.

I did not know that.

Yeah, so I did that. You know, I went to South Carolina, Jackson, or Jackson for AIT shortly, first station was Korea.

After that initial one year deployment, you know, I headed down to Fort Stewart, Georgia, where I was in 169 Armor or 369 Armor. Sorry.

Okay.

And I spent a couple years there, and long story short is I was there. I was the Colonel's driver. I was kind of not behaving too well.

Wait a minute. Stop, stop. I gotta say something. I gotta say something, man. We're both smiling at each other like a, like a fox eating yellow jackets.

I stole that from Jake Whipkey, by the way. But anyway, so you know, the fact that you. Well, first off, you're mechanically inclined. I didn't really know that. But now that I know,

I may ask you a lot of questions about that. But, so that's really cool. But you were also the, you were, you were the. Would you say the CO's driver?

Yeah, it was a battalion commander.

So here's the thing, man. You don't get picked to be. And then he said you were in trouble a lot. Well, here's the thing. You know this as well as I do.

You don't get picked to be the Battalion Commander's driver unless you're squared away. Right. That is a fact. You know, they don't just pick some dirt bag to go drive the Battalion Commander, the Lieutenant Colonel around.

So you had something on the ball, but then you said... said you were getting in trouble.

Yeah. So, you know, so I was a mechanic, and they. And they assign you, you know, a platoon. Right. So I was assigned to the Scalpoon.

So trouble ensues, you know, in the barracks, and one day I'm in the motor pool working on something and tuning. Sergeant comes up and says, hey, the Sergeant Major wants to see you for an interview. And I'm like, interview for what? And I walk.

And, you know, they schedule it, and I walk in the office, and Sergeant Major throws a map on the table and says, plot these grids. And so I go through the whole interview, and he's like, all right, great. I'll let you know. So I go back down the motor pool, I think.

I don't think it was even halfway through the day. Yep, you're going up to be the Colonel's driver. So that started that. So I went up to there. A lot of guys were like, oh, look at him.

He gets to go up there.

That's right.

Be in the head shed. Right. Not doing anything.

That's quite a privilege, actually. I think.

Yeah. Yeah. So we deployed to Kosovo. I was a driver.

I didn't know you were there. I was. I did one there, too. Cool.

Yeah, we were up there for a year, up Tampona Steel. Long story short is we're in country, and he says, hey, Gabe. He says, hey, Specialist Fierros, I think you're in the wrong MOS.

And I'm like, sir, what do you mean? Something's just not rubbing me right about you being a mechanic. He's like, you need to be an infantryman.

There you go.

And I was like, what, sir? I'm like, you're out of your mind. Like, no way.

So good judge of character, I might add.

Yeah. Yeah.

So about two, we come back off of deployment from Kosovo, and I hit that reenlistment window, and they sent me the reenlistment nco, and he's like, hey, you get a bonus if you go to infantry. And I was already an E4P, so I went to PLDC, which I don't know what they call it now.

Yeah, I know what that is.

Yeah. So head down there, reenlist, go to infantry school. I had to go back to Benning for seven weeks.

Benning School for Boys!

Yeah, Benning School for Boys. Right. So you can just imagine E4P showing up to Benning. You have unit patches, you already have awards on your uniform. And.

Right.

You know, you forget about all this stuff that happens at basic training. And I can remember the first time the Drill Sergeant's meeting us, and I'm like, hey, Sergeant.

And he's like, you know, the death stare, and he goes, what the beep? You know. You know, not very kind words after that. But so. Because.

Why? Because you just said, hey, Sergeant.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, you know. You know, they work hard for that, that badge, so.

Right.

We understood. And we.

It should have been Drill Sergeant.

Correct.

And it should have been Good morning. It should have been Good morning, Drill Sergeant or Good afternoon, Drill Sergeant.

Yeah.

Right.

Yep.

Okay, cool. Well, interesting, you know, interesting. And then so you. That's what you did. You changed Moses and you became an infantryman. Is that where.

Is that when you landed in Alaska to the 501st?

No, so. Actually, I went to Fort Bragg. First.

82Nd Airborne.

Yeah.

They sent you. Wow. That's unusual. They sent you.

Yeah, my bonus was for Infantry. Airborne. Fort Bragg.

Oh, so you knew you were going to the 87 and falling out of perfectly good planes.

That's correct.

Did you already have your Airborne wings at the time?

No, I went right after I completed infantry school.

Oh, all right. So I gotta ask you, man. Was. Now, now, the story goes on. Right. But was your boss right?

He was right.

He was right. See? Yeah, they can tell. I can tell, too, man. It's like. I can tell, like, inside of every.

You say inside of every good Marine is an army guy waiting to get out. My Marine buddies are gonna love that. But anyway, I digress. You know, it's like inside of every good mechanic is an infantryman dying to get up.

Right. That's the thing.

Yeah, absolutely.

You know, but you can tell when somebody's got that. You know, that. That. I don't know. Je ne sais quoi, as the French might say. Hard, hard to put your finger on it, but, you know, an Infantryman, if he has the metal to be an Infantryman, you're like, yeah, I don't know what you're doing, you know, as a wrench. You need to be, you need to be an Infantry.

You know, I could just, I can just see it because he, because he liked you, you know, and you're, you were a good soldier. I guarantee that's what it was. You might be real humble about it, but I can guarantee that's what it was because. Yeah.

So anyway, was he an Infantry guy?

No, he was an Armor guy.

Holy cow. And he said, you should be an infantryman. That's, that's quite, that is quite a compliment. Okay, very good. So you go to the 82nd. What happens next?

So I walk into my first unit, which was 3rd Battalion, 325, which is no longer there, but I was in Charlie Company and first week they're out in the field. I get there, they're like, hey, by the way, Sergeant Fierros, pack your stuff up. We're doing trench clearing for the week.

So I walk in, I think it was like a Thursday and they were coming back Sunday. So quick introduction to trench clearing. And shortly after that, you know, the wind up prior to Iraq started.

So lots of jumps, lots of tactical stuff, lots of trains up, JRTC, NTC.

Did you fit in? Was it hard for you to fit in because, you know, the 82nd, there's a lot of nepotism.

I never served in the 82nd, so I don't, I mean, I bet a lot of my friends did, but I know that there's a fair amount of nepotism that goes into, you know, like there's a lot of guys that grew up in the 82nd. Well, you didn't grow up in the 82nd. No, you, you know, you, you got transported.

Transported to, you know, to, to there through, you know, divine intervention. But did you, did you find it difficult to integrate into the 82nd after you went through this training and got reblued as an infantry guy?

Was that a difficult transition or not?

It was at first it was. As an E5, you're always unsure. Right. I'm a brand new E5 Infantry.

Right.

You're gonna stick me with, in a leadership position.

You're gonna be a Fire Team Leader. Right?

Right. So that whole transition was, was difficult. Right. I'm learning the language of Infantry.

Yes.

And you're eating.

And the culture. And the culture. Right. Language, culture, it's a whole thing.

Yep.

So I would say in my Squad Leader at the time, I said, hey, Sergeant AB was his name and like, hey look, I came from mechanic background Like, I'm an NCO, brand new, have no Infantry and experience. He's like, don't worry about it. He throws me a stack of manuals and says, start looking, start reading, start gaining information.

There was never a question from any of my guys whether or not I could lead. It was just learning information fast enough to put it in practice.

Right, Right.

So, wow.

You know, and that's great. And now. So let me ask you this, but did you grow up hunting and fishing?

I grew up fishing. Not so much hunting.

Really? Okay, interesting, because what I find is in. And always found, you know, as a career Infantry dude, you know, I always found that the, the soldiers that, that I had that were, you know, sportsmen, outdoor sportsmen, hunting, fishing, kind of guys, you know, took to that line of work, you know, quite well. You know, I mean, you're always in the outdoors. You know, you're. You're doing. You're doing something, you know, in the field.

And a lot of guys that like to, you know, the outdoors gravitate towards the infantry or the army in general, but more so the infantry and those units that spent a lot of time in the field. I was just, just curious. Okay, so, all right, we're at the 82nd Airborne, and then take us. Take us to. You go from there to Alaska.

Is that what happened? Or did you go from there? Did you get hurt when you were with the 82nd?

So, yeah.

So first.

So we deployed for the invasion, Iraq with the 82nd. So sometime in that deployment, probably somewhere about halfway through, we were doing some riot control on one of the main supply highways.

And, you know, we're waiting for the MPs to come. We just come off patrol from being in the Green Zone and said, hey, by the way, there's people blocking the highway for supplies. Let's go.

Try to push them out. So they send the whole company out. Things ensue, helicopters start dusting the people, try to move them off the road.

During that whole process, something came in the air and there was a big boom. And. And I remember falling to the ground and being like, okay. I don't. You know, I don't feel anything wrong.

So I try to stand up, and I just fall to the ground. And I'm like, huh? What happened? I don't see anything. You know, I'm not bleeding right away. And some. I'm like, can't stand up.

I look down at my right leg, and there's a hole in it. And so it's not a very big hole. You probably stick your Pinky finger in it.

What time. What year is this? What this is.

This is tail end of O3. So we're going into.

Things are getting cranked up.

Yeah. Things are getting cranked up.

Yeah. By 05, it's a shit show.

Yeah.

But. But, oh, three things are the drum beats happening, right?

Yeah.

Okay, so. So go on. I'm sorry, I interrupted you.

No, no, you're so. You know, they realize I'm hit. So we get in the back of, you know, the Humvee.

This is a gunshot wound. Is this shrapnel? What is this? No, it's.

It's shrapnel. So a couple other guys got hurt. This is all going on. They throw us in a Humvee.

And, you know, infantry guys, when you're in a bad situation and you're all stuck in the back of this truck, you start picking on each other, right? So we're in the back of this truck, and I got a bandage over mine, and I look over and one of the guys.

My guys got Kerlux or gauze in between his butt cheeks. And so we're. We're laughing. It's not a funny situation.

Like, I laugh now, but, you know, all seriousness, we're trying to lower the mood, the adrenaline, right? So we're cracking jokes.

And, you know, if you see that and you're in the back of a truck, a bare, naked, you know, infantryman with Kerlux in between them. So.

Tragedy plus time equals funny. That's the equation.

Yeah. Yeah. So we get done with that.

They send us out to cache in Baghdad, slap a bandage, take some X rays, and they say, well, we can't take the shrapnel out, but we're not going to evacuate because it's not that bad. We don't think it's that bad.

Wow. There you go. Well, there you go. Well, God bless you. You know. You know, I say, I say it can always be worse, right? I mean, that's.

That's the thing is, like, you know, you essentially return to duty. Didn't get you back from theater, which is.

Which is great, all things considered, because that thing could, you know, hit you in the temple and then you wouldn't be here.

Right.

You know, so anyway, well, wow. I appreciate you sharing that. That story with us. So you go from the 82nd. Eventually that deployment ends.

That's where I was at, Rich.

Yep.

And you got orders. Did you want to go there, or did they just send you there?

There's a story behind that, too, but it was unplanned. I was supposed to go to recruiting duty, and at the time, I had torn my labrum and my shoulder doing combatives at the 82nd.

Okay.

And what do you call them? Your Service Manager or your.

Your Branch dude?

Yeah, your Branch guy. He's like, well, if you can't go to recruiting school, we're gonna send you up to Alaska to help step up.

New brigade up there, which was a 425th at the time, because now they are the 11th Airborne Corps.

Yeah, I missed all that. I don't. When I was there, it was a division. It was a 5th Infantry Division. And you had a brigade north of the range?

I don't want to say it was a brigade. It was a brigade north of the range and then a kind of a brigade south of the range, centered around the first of the 501st Airborne, as I recall.

Yeah. So anyway. All right, so. And how long did you serve there?

We were out of Iskandaria in Iraq this time and happened to be in the S3 shop working Ravens, the small UAVs, but also working in the detainee center. And they said, hey, Sergeant Fierros, we gotta send some detainees down to camp Proper. And I back.

Are you an E6?

At this point, I'm still in E5 at this point.

Oh, my gosh. Okay, so you're still in E5. Must be a senior E5 at that. You must be getting ready to make. You must be getting ready to make staff sergeant this time.

Okay, so. All right, so go on, tell us. Tell us what happened.

So, you know, we load the prisoner into the helicopter, we take off, we land a couple small fobs, pick up some guys about the third landing, we come back up, and I think we're in the air for maybe five minutes, and all of a sudden, something shoots down the center of the plane. Things I can remember was it felt like a baseball bat hit me in the face. And so I didn't...

I don't remember passing out, but I remember things slowing down in slow motion and looking around in the Blackhawk, and I'm like, well, there's smoke, but there's no fire. I put my hands up to my face because my face hurt really bad. Looked down at my gloves, and there was nothing on my gloves.

So I did it again, and it was just streaming from injury. So basically what happened was shrapnel came through the bottom of the plane, entered my left eye socket or my retina, nasal passages, and face, so.

Wow. Where did it enter? Where did the shrapnel enter?

So it came through my nasal passages and through my face and my eye orbit.

Can you. Did they. I didn't know. I didn't know that. That. I did not know. Did. Can you. Do you have any issues seeing?

I have one blind spot. My vision gets. You know, my vision's getting progressively worse every year, so.

Is it in one eye or both?

One eye, mostly.

Okay. Wow. I didn't know that you had two Purple Hearts. I guess I did know that. I just got forgotten. I apologize. It's been a while, man.

So two Purple Hearts. God bless you, man. You're lucky to be alive. That one. That. That. That one. Holy smokes. So did you guys do an emergency crash landing? What happened?

So, yeah, so no, at this time, you know, the cab filled with, or the, you know, cockpits filled with smoke.

And all of a sudden, you know, we're looking around me and the other guys, and we see fire coming out from behind our heads. So we're screaming for fire extinguishers. And finally the pilot set it down.

And this field, like, luckily, it had just been plowed, so it was a harder landing.

We pile out, we pull everyone we need to pull out, and I can remember, we pull everyone out everyone's got their weapons and we have these HVTs with us. And, you know, a million things are running through your head at that time.

Because at the time, high value targets, right? I mean, these are. You have.

You've detained a couple of high value targets and you're taking them, you're transporting them back for interrogation or safeguard or whatever the case might be. And this is when you get hit.

Yeah. Okay, so, you know, helicopters on fire. We're in this field setting up security.

And at that time, that's when all that crazy beheading and capturing was going on. So we can hear gun trucks that we know are not ours getting closer and closer.

And I can remember we're sitting on a berm and we all have M4s and we're like, where's the 249 that's on the helicopter? You know, where's the gun helicopter? So we're looking around and I can remember another E6 that was on the flight yells, go get that machine gun.

And so the guy runs back and gets machine gun.

What seemed like 20 minutes went by, and finally the second helicopter in our group there shows back up, lands, and we all pile in this helicopter, and you can tell it's severely overloaded. They had probably another eight or nine packs in their flight. Plus us is a Blackhawk. It's a Blackhawk. Yeah.

Yeah.

So we fly to the cache in Baghdad. I'm swollen up. I can't see out of one eye. And I get to the cache there. They're like, you have shrapnel in your face. You have a torn retina.

We're going to evacuate you to Launch tool. So go to launch tool. They figure out I have a traumatic brain injury along the way, along with the eyebright. So they sent me to Walter Reed.

So I end up at Walter Reed for seven months. And while I'm there, yeah, so while I'm there, you know, they run the TBI test.

And I remember staring at the money and staring at him and staring at the money, staring at him. And it wasn't clicking.

Wow.

It wasn't clicking. You know, it's 25 cents, right? So it wasn't clicking at all.

But long run, you know, they put me all through the therapy, cognitive, behavioral, some gait I was having problems with balance. They fixed my retina. But so seven months and then I went back to the WTU there at Fort Richardson, Alaska.

At this point, you're probably like, okay, so I've been wounded twice. They said I should be an after trimming, and I did. And then I got hit twice. Maybe it's time for me to look for a new career field.

Absolutely not. Absolutely not.

No, not at all. Huh. So tell us what happens. Man, I love it.

So, you know, after seven months there, send me back to Alaska, WTU and I have to hang out there. I can't go back to the.

That's the Warrior Transition Unit. That's where they send the, the guys that are, you know, that are trying to either get out or get back in or, you know, it's. They're,

They're wounded or injured, you know, this kind of thing. They're kind of. It's like it being in limbo a little bit.

Yeah. So you're in limbo, right? And I'm there and unit comes back, Commander comes in, checks on you and says, you know, hey, what's going on?

How are things going? And, you know, I'm still going through therapy. I'm getting, you know, botox for migraines. I'm still doing cognitive therapy.

You know, you're in Alaska, you got to travel, right? So, you know, you go to Homer and you go to Seward and drive around from the family.

So after that, I get a job as Fleet service at the Anchorage Airport, you know, working cleaning aircraft for a year. And I get a phone call one day while I'm out fishing for red salmon. And it's TACOM, which is Tank Armament Command up in Warren, Michigan.

And they're like, hey, do you want to interview for a job with. Working with left behind equipment for the units there in Alaska? And I say, sure, I'll interview. So interview goes on.

I'm like, oh, I did horrible in the interview, right? And a couple weeks later, I get a call back. At the time, the Supervisor's like, hey, we're gonna offer you the position.

Wow. Yeah.

So when you get med boarded, basically, the army's saying to you, hey, listen, we're gonna put you through a medical board, and we're gonna find. We're gonna determine. The medical board's gonna determine whether or not you're fit or capable of continuing your service.

And if you are, you get to go back to the service if you want, I guess.

And if your enlistment's not up, but the other option is you are found unfit or not capable of performing your duties as assigned, or in some cases, you know, no duties whatsoever because of the nature of your injuries or wounds, and then. And then they separate you from the service. Isn't that how that works?

Yeah. So when I went through my med board, I applied for COAD, which is continuation on active duty.

So you submit your pack up up to big army, and they make a decision on whether or not, you know, we can reclass you or we can send you somewhere. During that process, it kind of slows down. It goes up to this whole big Army. And I was getting itchy.

I was a little bit worried about what was going on because I didn't heard anything. And I'm calling the contact number for this program, and the med board's like, you need to make a decision. Right. Need to figure out what's going on.

So I'm like, well, just med board, Right. Because at this time, I'm. I'm on a lot of medications. I'm. I, at the time, I probably wasn't thinking right. You know.

Right.

I kind of lost that whole, I'm going to fight for this because I really want to do this. And I said, you know what? Just. I'm gonna cut strings right here. So they med board me. I'm 70% temporary retired from the Army.

So they retired me out of Fort Richardson. And I, you know, a couple years there at Fort Rich as, you know, civilian, and then as a contractor for the Army.

Wow. So I meet you. I think we met, like I said earlier, we met in Ohio, and then we hunted ducks together.

And I thought to myself, you know, I was just going to be honest. Yeah, I like this guy. He's kind of quiet. He's very observant. Yeah. He's got a great personality, easy to be around.

And I just absolutely enjoyed meeting you and spending time with you in Ohio. And then I think I either asked you or. Because at the time that.

That time frame, 12 years ago or whatever it was, I think I was the guy doing the assignments. You Know, I mean, yeah, I was the guy calling people up, going, hey, man, you want to go on another event? Certain thing. And. And. And so I think I.

You know, this opportunity in Washington came by, and I think I called you up, and. And I just. I was like, if I'm going to have to go on this event, this is how I was thinking, you know, how it all started.

And Jake, of course, you know, was part of the first wave of guys who I identified as being dudes I liked, you know, that I knew would perform well in this space. And that was the foundation for the guide school that we ultimately started that you went through and have graduated from. And so it was.

For me, it was like easy math. Like, I'm not gonna pick somebody.

I don't like to go on an event with me, you know, for four or five days, sleep in a bunk, you know, in close proximity. And, you know, all of this, I'm like, I'm an army guy, you know, I'm gonna pick the dudes I like, you know, I think are cool dudes, you know.

And so we went up to Washington together, and I remember we stayed in a Quonset hut or some of some sort. Remember that?

Yeah, I do. That was a small cabin just off the. Was it Skajit River?

That's right. Skagit. Yeah. Somebody. Maybe they say Skijack.

I don't know.

I don't either. But anyway, we were salmon fishing and. And this thing was like a little chalet. It was, you know, you had to go outside to change your mind.

It's pretty tight quarters in there. But it was cool. It was like public. I don't know what the heck. It was like public campgrounds or something.

It was like a state park, I think.

State park. There you go. Yeah, that's right.

Karina would know that.

Karina would definitely know. That's a fact. And so anyway, we. We. That's when we got to know each other.

And I think that's when I asked you, you know, if you were interested in, you know, getting more involved or something like that. But I just remember you saying to me, you know, John, whatever you need, you know, And I just thought, wow, that's just the right answer right there.

That. That's a guy, you know, this is the right person for this job. So you ultimately go through our guide school, and I think you were the first.

Were you part of the first guide school? Were you the first guide school? Yeah. Okay. I think we're on seven now, and we do it every other year, so if you know, we're on seventh iteration.

We do it every other year. And you were the very first class, your class one of whatever that was and whatever year that was.

And yeah, I remember Pat Corcoran came, we were doing the knots and the rope corral. I know, I remember that. That gave you. I remember looking at your. I remember certain things very well.

And I remember looking at your face, you know, was. You were, you were, you know, the, the knot, the knots, I remember kind of gave you a touch...a bit of a fit.

But that had to be because your, your brain injury, right. It's like the money too. You're an infantry guy. You're an 82nd, you're in the 501st. You know, knots dead... deadpan out, straight up, man.

And, and, and here there was a couple of knots or not. And that, that knot test is no joke, is run by a, you know, it was at the time run by a Ranger from 6th Ranger Training Battalion.

So he was a, he was a knot guy, and he was like cutting no slack jack.

No, no, there was no slack.

There's no slack jack, man. Time limits. Yeah, that's right. And he stress test them afterwards, right? He's saying expect them and trust stress test them.

And if you don't get your knots right here, no go Ranger, you're going back.

You know, So I remember we were testing and Pat Corchoran, you know, grabs my. Goes last knot, right? So we're last knot of the test. He's like, this seat. So I'm like, oh yeah, I got this.

Yeah, right?

Yeah, I didn't have it. Yep. One wrong turn on the seat and he's like, you're a no go. And I remember just sheer panic. I'm sitting, I'm like, shoot.

I'm like, John sent us to this because he believes we're going to make it through the first time. And here I go and I miss it. Cause it's Swiss seat. And I remember packing. Listen, calm down, take your time.

We'll retest you on your knot and you know, you know, simple mistakes. Right. You know, but it was. So knots were difficult at that time, right. Remembering all those different knots and.

Yeah, you know, I tell you what, man, I'm just so proud of you and all, all guys like you that, that, you know, we created a school, the Guide School. Not. It's not an easy school. You know, we, you know, you go through the WWIA Guide School. You know, I don't want to say it's. It's somewhere.

It's some it's not like a gut check like Ranger School. We don't do that. But, you know, we have to. You take tests, you know, you get. You'd get trained on a certain material.

You take a test, your hands on, you know, knots is one of them, you know, and it's one of those things, you know, we learn a lot about people, you know, when you put them under a little bit of stress. Now, we're not trying to put you in any more stress. You don't need any more stress in your life.

That's not what it's designed to do, but, you know, it is a gradable thing and, you know, it's challenging, right? And that's what we want to do. We want to challenge guys, you know, a little bit there and.

And put them back in the kind of challenging environment that you found, you know, without, you know, anybody shooting at you again, you know, you know, that you found and fell in love with in. In the Army. You were challenged in the Army, and, you know, it's not a cakewalk, and. And nobody wants anything just given to them, right?

So that's why we. But anyway, so you've been serving our Heroes now for 14 years, you know, and you're a trained and Certified Guide. I have to ask you, man, tell us.

We were talking in the pre, in the pre show. You and I were just chatting a little bit.

You said you thought maybe ask you how many events you think you'd been on in, you know, in your 14 years with the Foundation or whatever it's been. And you said, well, I mean, guess probably 20. So, you know, you've got...you formed...so in 20, if there's.

If there's an average of four dudes on every event that you don't know on average, sometimes more, sometimes less. But, you know, let's just say it's four on average. And, you know, you, you know, or five, you know, you're getting.

You've been on events and led over 100 combat-wounded Purple Heart recipients in the field environment as WWIA Guide. So in that process, you form some opinions. You've got a perspective that few people do.

You're continuing to serve in a very unique capacity, helping these veterans, you know, with their challenges. You know, you are the Guide, our guide...

Our guides, plural, the Foundation's Guides are the critical link between the Heroes we serve, the hosts that put on these events, and the Foundation. You're at the center of all of that, and it's the most critical position that we have.

It really Is, I mean, I'll someday in a few years, be gone, and this thing's going to carry on. And the weight of the Guides, the importance of the guides is just going to continue to strengthen because you really are that critical link, right?

And so I gotta hear from you...tell us about, you know, your experience with the Foundation as a Guide, you know, what's it mean to you and what kind of observations do you have about this work.

So as a Guide, you know, first of all, attending the event as a Hero, right? You never know what to expect. And when I had my first event from Foundation, right, which was a duck hunt, never duck hunted in my life.

I was always, you know, fishing, you know, panfish, bluegill, bass. That first duck hunt, and I was like, wow, this is awesome. I remember laying in that blind and you said you had a pitcher, right?

And I remember that morning, and it was two minutes before shoot, and all those ducks got off that gravel pit.

And they were right in our face. In our face. Hundreds of ducks, Hundreds of ducks in our face. And we didn't get to shoot them, did we?

Yeah. So you know, that hunt two minutes before shooting light. Yeah.

No, I'm telling you what, I never forget that either. I mean, it was two minutes because usually you'll hear the guide because there's... there's game wardens out there and they're listening there.

Then they got their, watch out. You pop off two minutes before shooting light and kill a bunch of ducks. Guess who's going to pay you a visit. That's right.

Yep. Absolutely.

So anyway, go on. I didn't mean to interrupt you, but I remember. Remember that.

So, you know, I went on that hunt and I was thinking, man, this is a great program. You know, you guys took care of us. We didn't have to worry about anything. Everything we were, you know, was smooth, right?

And I thought, oh, this is great. You know, that ended, went back home and I go, oh, man, I gotta, you know, tell some other people about this. I had such a great experience.

And, you know, time went on and I was like, ah, you know, I would every once in a while at the time, Facebook was just starting...you'd see a couple things here or there. And I remember he called me for the Washington State. And you say, hey, you know, I can't find anyone.

Would you be willing to go? So this is my first week at Toby Hanna. And my Supervisor goes, what are you doing?

I'm like, I'm part of a, you know, veterans group that takes Purple Heart recipients on these hunts and fishing events and he's like, he's like, just go. He's like, have out. So like, I remember, I think it was like two or three days before the event.

I can't remember what happened to spur such a quick thing. But as a Guide, the way you organize it, you make it so seamless for the Guides and the Hosts. You know, the OPORDER, Right?

Is a big part of everything we do. Tells you where to be, when to be there, how to get there, what to bring, what not to bring. Right. You know, it means a lot.

It means, you know, I was struggling in a place where I didn't, I didn't know who to talk to. Right. You kind of shut down, you get out and you lose that sense of camaraderie and you're like, what am I going to do? What am I doing with myself?

Nobody understands really what's going on. Yeah. And that's what the Foundation did for me.

You know, I was able to be there with like minded people that understood what we, you know, things that happen over there and the things that you go through, you know, we're not all the same story, but similar incidents. Right. So for me it, you know, it gave me a sense of purpose, you know, that sense of being back in a small unit.

And I think, you know, what we're doing currently with these smaller groups and keeping it that way is the best thing you can do for the Foundation. It really works.

And you can really see these guys bonding in just three or four days and usually by the end of the first night they're pretty much, you know, already bonding as already snapped in, aren't they? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Well, I gotta, I appreciate that your opinion means a lot to me. You know, and we've tinkered with the form formula for, you know, we did at least when we were starting out and you know, in the first few years.

But today it's pretty much a standard, you know, deal, you know, and I think, and I have always thought that the small group of, you know, not to exceed say, you know, six to eight, you know, and preferably, you know, right around six, because that's, that is a very manageable span of control for one guide, you know, one Guide and five heroes. One Guide and four heroes. You know, that's the size of a Fire Team.

You know, you were a Fire Team and that's critical because you guys are used to that and so are they. That is the fun that, you know, the squad is the fundamental fighting unit. But a squad is comprised of two Fire Teams.

You know, you got a Sergeant E6 in charge of a squad, and you got two E5s or, you know, E4 promotable in charge of a team. Two teams equal a squad. It's perfect.

It, you know, it's just the right answer, you know, and so we do have events that go beyond that, but we always throw in two Guides so that it breaks up into basically two teams, you know, a squad of guys. And it's just, you're right, it's intimate. Nobody gets lost in the sauce.

There's bonding, you know, happening almost like immediately, whether, regardless of. Of the service branch that you were in. So, you know, you're right. I appreciate you sharing that with us because, you know, it's super important.

It's just this idea of, you know, belonging, you know, again, back.

Back on a team, you know, again, feeling comfortable because nobody's going to judge you feeling comfortable because you all share something in common, you know, very important in common.

And like you said, everybody's story is different, but the one story that stays, that remains constant, is that you are all awarded the purple heart for being, you know, wounded in combat. And nobody wanted to be wounded at combat. It wasn't like you went there and said, yeah, let me, let me get a Purple Heart. And not, you know, Not! Not so.

Anyway, you're a great American, buddy. I genuinely appreciate what you've done for the Foundation. You know, our friendship means the world to me. I'm really happy you're on the program.

It's great to see you again. And I know you're a family man. You've got a son that's now, what, a sophomore? Yeah, yep, sophomore in high school.

You just got a new job, you said, you know, same.

You know, you're, you're, you got to be getting close to her over 20 years as a civil servant now, right, with your Army time combined, Aren't you getting that close to that?

Yeah, yeah, I'm over the 20 year mark.

There you go, man. So life is good. You made it, you know, you made it through all of that, and you look great and everybody likes you, man.

I mean, the word on the street, everybody likes you. You know, nobody ever says anything bad about Gabe. And you are just a solid, solid citizen.

You know, thanks for what you did for this country and thanks for what you're continuing to do to support your fellow brothers and sisters who were wounded in combat. I'll give you the last whack at the pinata here, buddy. You got anything you want to tell us?

No, John, just thank you for letting me be part of this awesome team and Foundation that you have. Hopefully it continues to grow...with the success that we're having.

You know, getting these guys out in the outdoors and you know, getting these guys to, you know, first duck hunts and first pheasant hunts. You know, it's always awesome to see that.

I think my last event here in North Dakota, we had a first time pheasant hunter and I can remember the look on his face when he shot his first pheasant and knowing that it was his and you know, that's what the Foundation is about. Right.

Not only bring these guys together to bond and talk about, you know, things that have happened to them, but seeing those first time things just like you guys were there for my first duck. Right? So I want to say thank you for that.

Well, it's our pleasure.

You know, you mentioned earlier about how, you know, it's well, you know, planned the op order, you know, and you know, we've got a great team, you know, that puts this thing on. You know, I'm here in the headquarters in Apollo beach, you know, there are two employees here.

You know, David does all our social media and special projects, you know, and he's in the Carolinas and then of course Corrina, you know, out West, you know, there is doing all of the logistics planning and that includes the interactions with the Host and you Guides and the Heroes, the selection and yeah, it's, it's, it all comes together and it is a lot of work behind the scenes and we're just fortunate because we have a great team pulling this thing off and we try to make it look like when you guys show up on the event that it's, that I don't want to say it's easy, it's not easy. Your work is not easy, the work that you do. But you are the critical link.

And we just try to, you know, the folks back here at the headquarters that are helping make it all happen are trying to do it, set you guys up for as much success as possible.

So when you hit the ground, essentially the table is set, you know, and all you, you have to do is focus on, you know, being a good guide and being there for them and making, making sure everything is, you know, running, running well. And, and you do that along with the other guides exceptionally, exceptionally well.

And it's, you know, I, I feel like a very, very fortunate person to, you know, have such an amazing team. So keep up the good work, buddy. And it's our pleasure. And, and God bless you for your service and what you're continuing to do.

And I wish you and your family, you know, a wonderful holiday season as that's coming up.

Yeah, thank you, John.

And anything ever, you ever need, anything, you got my digits, man. Just ding me.

Okay.

All right, buddy. Thanks for your time.

Yeah, thanks.

Okay, bye.

Thank you for listening to the WWIA podcast.

To learn more about the Wounded warriors in Action foundation and how you can get involved, please visit our website@wwiaf.org or follow us on social media on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and LinkedIn.

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