Brendan Weitz, Co-founder of Journey, joins host Upendra Varma to deep dive into how his company is revolutionizing the B2B sales and marketing realm with an innovative storytelling format. Brendan walks us through how Journey emerged from a prototype to a game-changing tool, aiming to make B2B transactions as seamless as B2C purchases on platforms like Amazon.
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You can also watch this episode on youtube here.
we, we get about 50 percent of our signups come from a viral loop.
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:So people share a journey that
people that they, uh, that are
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:receiving the journey sign up for it.
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:And then we work our sales
pipeline is based on what
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:people are doing in the product.
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:Upendra Varma: Hello everyone.
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:Welcome to the B2B SaaS podcast.
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:I'm your host Upendra Verma and
today we have Brendan Bytes with us.
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:Brendan here is the co founder
of a company called Journey.
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:Hey, Brendan, welcome to the show.
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:Brendan Weitz: Hi, thanks
for, uh, thanks for having me.
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:Upendra Varma: Hey Brendan.
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:So let's, let's try to understand
what Journey as a company does, right?
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:And why customers pay you money.
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:Uh, I mean, journey is a new storytelling
format for sales and marketing teams.
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:We basically felt like three years
ago or two and a half years ago.
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:B2B transactions should be as easy
as buying something on amazon.
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:com in the B2C world.
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:So we're trying to bridge that gap now.
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:large B to B transactions.
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:So we create this storytelling format
for salespeople, encompassing video
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:documents, text, um, all in one place
to create an amazing buying experience.
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:Upendra Varma: And, uh, so just talk
a bit more about the product, right?
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:So is it just, uh, like currently,
are you trying to replace PowerPoints?
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:Is that what you're trying to do?
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:Or is it much more than a
simple presentation format?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah.
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:I mean, I think it's, uh, you know, we,
we integrate with PowerPoint, but we,
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:we feel like the, The 16 by 9 rectangle
that we've all been used to for the
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:last 40 years, uh, doesn't really give,
um, much justice to the storyteller,
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:the person behind the content.
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:So we feel like Journey
is a bit more interactive.
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:It's mobile first and, uh, It helps
people to gain context, especially
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:in a asynchronous remote world where
not everything is happening live.
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:I think PowerPoints are
better for live presentations.
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:We play more in the backstage, like
after the call, before the call, you
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:know, internal meetings that you're not
a part of, uh, is what we facilitate.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:So I'm just trying to understand, it
looks like this is a different way of,
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:you know, presenting your ideas or, you
know, getting your things out there.
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:Right.
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:So how have you sort of chosen this
positioning of, you know, you deciding to
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:just sell it to sales and marketing teams?
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:Like, what's the backstory there?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah.
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:Great question.
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:I feel like a lot of,
uh, a lot of companies.
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:The founders kind of start
with what they know best.
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:I mean, we come from my, my co
founders, uh, we, we kind of span the
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:gamut of sales, marketing, and BD.
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:So that's just honestly where our network
started or our network lives and where
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:we had access to customers the most, the
quickest, and we understood the best.
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:So, um, you bring up a good point.
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:We see a lot of other use cases
outside of sales and marketing, but
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:from a go to market perspective,
To not completely go insane.
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:We try to focus on, um,
sales and marketing.
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:And, um, but as you can probably
tell, you know, anyone can sign up
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:for journey and use it for anything.
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:Uh, and we feel like everyone is a
storyteller in their own, in their
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:own regard, regardless of what
you're selling your company yourself.
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:Um, so lots of use cases,
but that's our focus.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:So Brandon, let's, let's try to
understand your customer base as of today.
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:Right.
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:So how many customers do you have?
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:How many paying customers do you
have on your platform as of today?
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:Right.
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:It's around 200 paying companies.
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:And those are.
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:I would call them, um, early
like series a series B startups.
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:And then you have, uh, about 25
percent more growth companies like
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:Reddit and Sightly more series
D series E pre IPO companies.
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:Um, and, uh, it's mainly our buyer is
the, you know, the VP of sales or the CRO.
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:But we really tailored to the end user.
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:The end user is really the
individual salesperson or the
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:individual account manager.
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:Um, so that's, um, that's
our paying user base.
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:And then we have a freemium model.
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:So there's tens of thousands of
users every month that, um, that,
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:uh, use our, our free product.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:Right.
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:So, and, and how big of a
deals are we talking about?
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:I know there's going to
be a big spread, right?
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:So typically, for example, if you
pick your series, there'll be a
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:customer, right, that you have.
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:Right.
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:So how big of a deal are we talking about?
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:Is it a thousand dollar deal?
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:Is it a thousand dollar deal?
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:I I'm asking you because I just want to
understand your go to market motion later.
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:Right.
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:Brendan Weitz: Totally.
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:Yeah.
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:So, uh, our team deals
range from six to 10 K.
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:So for those series a B companies,
that's kind of the, the,
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:um, the median, I would say.
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:Upendra Varma: That makes a lot of sense.
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:Uh, all right.
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:So are you comfortable sharing
your revenue overall as a company?
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:Brendan Weitz: Uh, I would say our
next milestone is a million in ARR.
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:Upendra Varma: Okay.
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:That's, that's a wonderful data point.
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:And how, how are you looking at like,
when do you plan on achieving that?
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:Like, how does the numbers look like?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah.
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:I mean, hopefully in the next,
you know, six to nine months.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:That makes a lot of sense.
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:And all right.
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:So let's, let's talk about
your go to market motion here.
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:Right?
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:So I'm assuming you've
got 10, 000 deals, right?
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:So just, just help us understand, right.
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:Typically where you finding all of
these deals or leads from a top up
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:funnel perspective, and then we can
talk about the conversion as well.
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:I mean, we, uh, candidly, the
founders of Journey, we don't
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:come from, uh, enterprise sales
background or direct sales background.
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:We, uh, we've always worked at
and built self serve software
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:companies, um, in different spaces,
but, uh, our entire motion is, um,
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:I don't want to use too much of a
buzzword, but product led growth.
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:Um, we, we get about 50 percent of
our signups come from a viral loop.
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:So people share a journey that
people that they, uh, that are
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:receiving the journey sign up for it.
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:And then we work our sales
pipeline is based on what
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:people are doing in the product.
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:So.
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:We are looking at, uh, signals from
what people, um, when they're coming in,
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:creating a journey, inviting team members.
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:And then we have a lot of enrichment
on, uh, what companies they work
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:for, if they're a good fit for
us to then reach out and engage.
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:Um, we don't, we don't have any sales
or marketing headcount at the company,
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:so it's just the founders doing it.
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:And then, um, uh, I mean, we have
done things like product launches
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:and things to drive, um, top of
funnel, which have done very well.
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:Um, we've tested out some very
lightweight, um, email sponsorships.
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:Um, and then, uh, yeah, I would say the
majority though comes from the product.
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:Um, I wouldn't say we're, we're
viral like Loom or Calendly,
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:but, uh, that's our goal.
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:Upendra Varma: but do you have something
like what Loom or Calendly have
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:powered by Loom, powered by Calendly?
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:Do you have something
like powered by Journey?
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:And is that what's responsible for
most of these top of funnel groups?
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:Brendan Weitz: Exactly.
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:Uh, it's, it's really tough to track,
like not the majority of people don't
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:click on that button, but, uh, when we
do like follow up surveys and things, you
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:can tell that they've seen a journey and
that's why they're, they're signing up.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:And then what typically, and what
happens after somebody signs up,
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:starts using your product, right?
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:So how do you convert
them to a paying user?
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:And I know you've got
hundreds of customers, right?
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:So what's, how have you
managed to close them so far?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:I mean, typically it's, uh, once we,
we, we use the, the framework that slack
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:used back in the day, like once you get
three people in an, in an organization,
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:uh, that's, we consider that a team.
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:And if they fit our ICP like a.
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:Company that our sales team that
is like most of our customers are
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:selling non transactional deals,
like, um, meaning that there's
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:a lot of stakeholders involved.
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:There's a lot of content
going back and forth.
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:So if we deem that it's a good fit for us,
once we see three people in an account.
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:We serve them hopefully helpful content
that gets them to creating their
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:first journey, sharing their first
journey, inviting more team members.
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:And then we engage with more training,
uh, and onboarding content live.
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:Upendra Varma: So just give
me one data point, right?
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:So for example, for a 10, 000 deal
that you might have closed recently.
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:Right?
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:So, so how, how much time did it
actually take you to close that deal?
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:Was it, are we talking weeks, months?
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:And how much effort did you put
in actually to close that deal?
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:Brendan Weitz: Uh, I, I
wish it was faster, but it's
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:probably two months right now.
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:Like is the, is the deal cycle.
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:I think everyone is, uh, the,
the, the way the market is and
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:the way the world is today.
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:Everything takes longer, smaller
deals have more people involved.
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:And I think the beauty for us is
that people can get started for free.
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:They can, it's like no risk to them.
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:Um, if we want to speed up deals, what we
do is we actually can go in and help them.
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:Create the journeys and customize for
them and run like a very focused pilot.
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:Um, but we live and die by the product.
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:If, if our customers can't come in and
do things self service, then we need to
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:iterate more and make the product easier.
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:Upendra Varma: And it's primarily
you founders trying to close
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:these deals today, right?
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:Or do you have any
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:Brendan Weitz: Yep.
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:Well,
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:Upendra Varma: team?
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:Brendan Weitz: we have one
customer success slash.
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:Sales slash rev ops person, but it's,
it's basically me and one other person.
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:So, so yeah, just, uh, I just want to,
want you to sort of go back, right.
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:When it all started, right.
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:So, and I want to understand
that zero to one journey, right.
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:I know you talked a bit about,
you know, how you had this viral
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:growth and all of it, right.
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:But that's, that must have been,
you know, your recent story, right.
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:So how did it all begin in the beginning?
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:Right.
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:So how did you get that, those first
set of customers, what was that journey?
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:Like, how does that zero to one
journey look like in your case?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:So we, um, we, we were accepted into
Y Combinator and winter of 20, uh, 21.
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:So that's January, 2021.
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:And, um, our, we had no product, no
customers at that point, but we had
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:this idea and a prototype that we showed
to, like I said earlier, Our network
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:was primarily in sales and marketing.
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:So we just went out to our network,
um, warm to the best 50 or a hundred
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:salespeople, marketing people that
we knew, and I begged them to try the
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:product or use the product and iterate.
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:Upendra Varma: and what's
your background here?
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:So how did you build
that network over years?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, so I've been working
in startups for the last 15 years.
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:I'm from New York.
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:So I started in around 2008,
worked at startups here.
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:I worked at Facebook fairly early
on before the IPO in sales there.
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:And then I, I led business development,
corporate development at a company
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:called AdRoll and then Quora.
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:So I had worked at, you know, early stage
companies like Series A, Series B, and
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:then later stage companies like Series
D, um, all in sales, BD, uh, functions.
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:So that's kind of where my, my network
lies and my, my co founders, um, also
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:have, have worked at startups for.
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:first for their whole career.
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:So we grew our network through
our previous companies mainly.
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:Um, so I think, I think all
the ex Facebook ad role Quora
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:people for, um, helping us grow.
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:Upendra Varma: Yeah.
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:Right.
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:So, so a couple of questions here, right
in, within this context here, right?
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:So I'm assuming when you start, when
you go to a VP of sales and, you know,
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:sort of pitch your product, right?
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:So is that something that is, is it
really that pressing a problem for
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:them that you're really solving?
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:Right.
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:I mean, I could, if I'm VP sales,
right, I've got a bunch of tools, right?
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:So I mean, I could invest
in some other place, right?
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:So why would I sort of
prioritize your product?
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:So what, what's that pitch that
you're sort of using to sell this
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:and, you know, create that urgency
and importance for your product?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:I think the, you know, the The,
um, the last 10 years really were
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:focused on sales enablement, like
training sales reps, coaching them.
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:There hasn't ever been
a focus on the buyer.
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:Like how does the buyer want to
buy, um, meeting the buyer where
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:they are and, you know, just.
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:The way sales has, has
evolved is really changing.
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:It's more virtual, it's less in person,
it's more asynchronous and people
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:like the buyers are getting younger.
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:Like they're like me, there may be
millennials now in buying roles where
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:they don't like to always hop on a call.
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:Um, so I think it's changing.
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:It's changing slowly though, but our
pitched essentially is, um, that you can.
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:You can test out Journey fairly
quickly to see if it's impacting
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:things that you care about.
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:Like VPs of sales, they pretty
much care about three metrics.
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:It's their win rate, their deal
velocity, um, and then their,
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:their net dollar retention.
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:So we really help with the first two.
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:Um, and we could help with the third,
but, but we've tried to focus on just one
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:of those and testing out, you know, uh,
if it could help improve those metrics.
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:And then you're also a bit doing a bit
of consolidation with journey because
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:we have a bunch of tools in one place.
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:Upendra Varma: Right.
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:So what's, what's the vision here, right?
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:So how are you going to grow, grow to
that 1 million ARR and like, how are you
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:going to grow to that 5 million mark?
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:Right.
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:So what's going to happen in terms
of marketing sales, all of it.
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:Right.
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:So what's the vision here?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, absolutely.
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:I think the, the, um, you know,
the idea is like we're, we
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:started in sales and marketing.
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:I think we'll continue to focus
there for, you know, until we
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:hit that milestone, uh, of ARR.
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:Um, but.
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:I mean, we're just realizing that
everyone is pretty much selling something.
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:Uh, you know, whether you're, um,
whether you're looking for a job
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:and you're trying to stand out, like
we have people that are creating
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:journeys as a new format for a resume.
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:We have like Tik TOK creators that are
creating a portfolio, uh, on journey and
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:selling, you know, sponsorships that way.
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:So we think it's much broader,
uh, to just like a new way of
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:doing business in a B2B world.
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:Um, and so I think once we get to certain
milestones, we'll start to really pour
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:the fuel on, you know, doing like actual
paid growth and doing outbound sales,
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:uh, because I think the reality is that.
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:Um, in 10 years, every sales team is
going to use something like journey.
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:You know, I hope it's, I hope the majority
of it is through something like, like
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:actually journey, but, um, I think we're
just going to see the digitization of
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:B2B sales, um, become more like what I've
said when I initially got on this pod.
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:Of like, think of how easy it
is to buy something on Amazon.
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:Um, I think you'll see now I can
buy a Tesla for a hundred thousand
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:dollars with a few taps on my phone.
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:Like, I think you're going to see
that B2B sales move in that direction.
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:And the role of a salesperson
really is going to, going to shift.
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:So that's where I think tools like
this are going to be, uh, Um, are
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:going to be a, uh, a need to have
the bigger question is more so, is
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:it going to be startups that scale
or is it going to be the behemoths
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:that just build or buy these things?
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:That's really the bigger question.
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:Upendra Varma: So, and so far
you haven't been focusing on any
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:outbound sales or any of that, right?
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:It's just, you know, a bunch of
leads coming in through your viral
311
:loop, and then you're trying to
selectively pick a bunch of them
312
:and, you know, go after them.
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:Is that how it's
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah.
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:I mean, yeah, candidly, we could
probably grow a lot faster if we did
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:outbound sales, but I think you, I
mean, it's, it's time will tell if
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:we're, we're doing the right thing.
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:Um, I think that for us.
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:We, like I said, live
and die by the product.
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:And if you're going to truly be
a product led growth company, and
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:that's your go to market motion, you
can't force it with top down sales.
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:Like you, you really should just pick one.
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:Uh,
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:Upendra Varma: you doing with
all of those, you know, uh,
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:non aligned leads, right?
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:So somebody from, let's say
a HR team trying to use your
327
:product for something, right?
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:So are you literally leaving them around
and you're just saying, okay, we don't
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:really care about you as of today.
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:Is that what you're doing?
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:Brendan Weitz: yeah.
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:It's a great question.
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:I mean, I wouldn't say like we have.
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:You know, once again, I hope it's helpful.
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:We have hopefully helpful content for
every type of persona, whether you're a
336
:salesperson, you're a marketer, you're a
customer success, you're in recruiting,
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:you're in, um, you're, you're a venture
capitalist and you're fundraising, or
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:you're a founder and you're fundraising.
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:We have helpful content about how you can
use journey for these different use cases.
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:Um, but just the, the, it's not worth
it to us from a revenue standpoint
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:to like focus on those users.
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:So we just try to convert them self serve
entirely, like you can pay monthly or
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:Upendra Varma: Yeah.
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:It makes, makes a lot of sense actually.
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:Yeah.
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:So, all right.
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:So Brendan, let's just
talk about the team here.
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:Right.
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:So how, how big is your team
and what are they doing?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah, we're a team
of nine, three co founders, three
351
:engineers, two design, one customer
success, fully remote in crazily enough,
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:like five, four or five different time
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:And have you raised any external
funding so far to build your company?
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:Brendan Weitz: Yes.
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:We raised 4 million or a little
million, uh, in:
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:Upendra Varma: Got it.
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:All right, Brendan.
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:Uh, thanks for taking
the time to talk to me.
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:Hope you scale journey to
much, much greater heights.
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:Brendan Weitz: Yeah.
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:Thank you so much.
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:Thanks for having me.