Dating should be so simple. There's almost nothing more natural than one human connecting with another. For all of human history our species's survival has depended on it.

Yet, when technology seems to have solved the problem, it's created different problems. In this episode we talk about people's experiences in dating and what they dislike.

Welcome to honest talk about heartbreak, dating and relationships, relationships. The podcast helping you navigate your path to happy ever after with your host, Rob McPhillips.

So tonight, we're talking about everything you hate about dating in the break room, she'd been discussing the juiciest dating nightmares and stories and confessions. And I'm here pen poised, ready to move down and sell them to anywhere on the Internet that will publish them for anyone who's now just before you do anything to see everything in the main room here is recorded. And so you can listen. We only share the audio recording, but the breakout room discussion is private.

It was brought to my attention last week that we can often get excited and talk with each other, which I know I'm as guilty as anyone. If we can try and put our hands and speak in an orderly fashion as much as we can. I think that there's a lot of these many times have been going on for years. So a lot of us got very comfortable with each other. And we kind of jump in when we get excited about ideas without and sometimes to someone that hasn't been as often, it can look a bit rude, but it's not intentionally.

Yeah, if we start by hearing some nightmares or interesting stories, who's got the gist of what you've listened to a few people now say, who's got the you can use Anonymous and you can say it was from a friend we all know is you. So now no one's going to share anyone. Got anyone anything interesting?

Well, I can say, as you said about interesting, it's not necessarily a story, but I think that Books-A-Million dating is when you show interest and it's not exactly reciprocated. So when the other person likes to get people to get to know people and so do that, and then often they'll respond, it's almost like a monologue and nothing can reach them. And then the audience on the end of their message already wants a really excellent question. So I think it's kind of annoying when people like interest that you give them like like the attention, which is cool, and they just forget to reciprocate almost.

And it's like, well, you know, look, I really think that's all I'm wondering. Is that a male female thing?

I do get it. Yeah, I don't know. Possibly I think some women as well. I think I think it can happen with women as well, actually. But I can definitely speak to you so small with men myself. So considerably.

Yeah. No, I can I can definitely relate that you show interest in someone and they tell you about themselves. And personally, I take that as a sign of someone's interest in a lot of women complain about men talking about themselves a lot.

And I guess that's kind of the point, though, isn't that I mean, you are opening up and showing who you are.

Yeah. But without any interest in the other person is is the complaint that usually comes out. OK, thank you for that, Sandra.

There is the talking about yourself in an interesting way. And then there is the talking about yourself in a both totally. And it doesn't and that kind of a talk that is boastful, repetitive, constant, and thus does not give you any space to even ask a question about what it is that they are telling you. And needless to say, there is absolutely no interest in you in any way, in any shape or form. And that may not be just for that occasion.

But every time you see that person, it is an ongoing just me, me, me, me, me, me and all of the things that I have and what I do and who I know and how important I am, etc., is that usually as I am trying to impress you with how what I have done, I think it is. And also there are some men who just love to gossip. They know everybody about town and they know everybody's business and they know who is going out with who and who is whatever and who did whatever.

And I don't know if you have ever met any of those, but I've known a couple of those. And it is a nightmare. It is tiresome, you know, and they never say anything about themselves. That's the thing. They it's a deflection. I think it is. I don't know if it's an insecurity. So they deflect by telling you about all of these the people who are the what I call the people about town. So all of the beautiful people, they know them.

The in crowd, they know them, they know who knows whatever and who is sleeping with who and who broke up with who and who, blah, blah, blah. So they know all of that and but never reveal anything about themselves.

Yes. It's sort of a similar thing as information is information is power. And I know this. So therefore I am powerful. Anyone else generally it's very difficult dealing with somebody that is very powerful. When I say talking all the time, whether it's a friendship or a date, you have to really push yourself forward to even get a word in edgewise. So they've got no listening skills.

Yeah. So those are kind of some brackets of the same different aspects of the same thing. So so it can be gossip. It can be healthy. Right. Come on man. We, we've got to we've got to balance out the gender.

Wait, what exactly are you asking. What's what what is the worst thing about online dating. Also the worst day experiences.

I'm just looking for gossip.

I'll have my first ever grown up to date was when I was 17. And her name is Mo Maureen and she's very lovely. I think she's seventeen as well. And we were all grown up sitting having a glass of wine. Seventeen year old, illegal and such a really good laugh, getting along on what she hopes and dreams, which I was surprised like. But anyway, so she says, what do you want to come back for a cup of coffee.

So I will do so. I think we have this bottle of wine but might have a small bottle of champagne as well. And we kind of started kissing and I thought, well, look here until she projectile vomited into my face because she drunk too much. So that was my very, very first ever date and it just went to absolute shit. So, yeah, that's um.

Yeah, right. Can anyone talk? Cause I think for me it's interesting that. When we say about communication and I think we saw agenda songs in that's my point is that I think you get people who are open and honest and communicative, whether they're men or whether they're female. So I'm sure a lot of guys would like to sort of put it out there. They're always great minds. I've done this. I've done that and all the rest. And classically and again, not always, but a woman might put it out there about how caring and nurturing male because they're stereotypical roles, you know.

But I think the thing is this is really whether or not you're meeting somebody and being honest, that's that's the big thing. And I did try online dating once, and I found that to be a complete waste of time because both men and women never say who they are and what they want. So for me, for example, if you're after a long term relationship, you can see somebody that doesn't want to be messed up. So it's OK to speak to her and then you find, actually, no, that's not what they want.

They want something quick and easy. But one woman actually told me that the problem is this. As a woman, I can't I don't feel I can put what I really want online because other women will cheat me. Yeah. And so it's I think men and women both sets set difficulties around what they want. And it is just to be just open. This is the way forward. Yeah. And also, if you go on a date, some people talk constantly about their job and how much they use.

It does for me, that's a complete turnoff altogether because, you know, again, it's a process thing sometimes. And I like to listen to what people enjoy. What sort of things do you enjoy? What what things do you like? Not your friends or if that will be what actually on a Sunday afternoon when you're bored, what you do, what what makes you happy? Muscles. But I guess it depends where an individual is in a particular time as to how they want to be open and whether they meet someone and they feel while I can I can feel open with this person because that body language thing is such a massive a massive thing going on in the subconscious.

So, you know, somebody can move or put a gesture in. You can close down intensity without realizing it. So this is being inhibited, but that leaves you vulnerable. But that's the only way to do it, really, you know, and then you just have to hope the other person's the same.

I, I don't know. I am not looking for it. My soul mate, which I have seen on several gentlemens profiles, looking for my soul mate, looking for the one looking for a long term, the the permanent solution, romantic relationship. How do I know what I want with you? I don't have a clue. I am not going to make that commitment upfront. As a matter of fact, when I see them, I run. I just.

I don't want. I don't want I don't I don't want that at all. And I would just rather you want to meet people, because that's what I'm saying. And we take it from there. But if that is your aim up front, then it means you're going to probably be coming at me and wanting to consume me and take charge of me and and, you know, stick to me like a leech. No way.

I mean, I do think. But I had the situation. I was seventeen and I was in that seat in the one it's the technology that is the pieces. And one of my classmates will start chatting. And I was I don't like chatting with the ladies. Unfortunately, they wasn't the lady. It was he had a nice job and you stood up OK, and he was somewhere somehow just say one word. What I thought is the lady say and I find that actually was cute.

So I did it just for the next 20 years, online dating anymore. So, yeah, you never know who's behind the screen.

There wasn't a picture.

Well, even if it's a picture, you know, you don't know what kind of picture is that? That's another one. These days, you'll find ladies who like hope if you will donate. You do this, you can keep me on everything. And I was like, that's not with me. Or just say you are foolish or something like that. And I was like, does it look like any man sounds like these because she was so confident to do that, you know, and you've still been married all these years.

Very special. Not sure if it was Veronica or Selena.

How can I give you your first alphabet's?

Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of people have said this thing about expectations. So normally when people ask me, I just say I'd just like to meet someone and then and see how it goes. I mean, I don't know whether it will end up or was. It would just be. But for now and I think then it gets misconstrued as somebody who I am, somebody who just wants to find some benefit. But actually, that's not what I meant.

And I think I think there is a way. I mean, I am slightly a contradiction. So in the sense that there is the side of me that you want someone to be in a relationship with. And but then on the other side, I like my independence and I like to be able to do things that I enjoy doing even if the other person doesn't want to do them. And I and I have like cultural complications in the sense that, you know, tackling my family would always be a challenge.

So it would have to be somebody that's a very strong having. Sometimes, you know, you can't always please everyone. But one of the things I would just like for people to be open and honest and I'd be happy if somebody would just be open and honest and be a good communicator. I mean, I'm not asking for a house and a car, and I'm just asking for those three basic things. And I am and I'm not sure why I think things are hard to find.

I would say that you probably do want to ask for a house call because otherwise you'll be on the bus. And if you want to have private time together, you'll be it's not just me. So I would definitely go for a house, the car for me.

Those are not important because I have a house that is just like, you know, I don't know if anybody else has done this, but I kind of when I was a young child, I made this thing because I grew up in a male household. So there was no female influence. So I wanted to things the person that I would end up with in the future. And there was no monetary things on that because I always was raised to kind of work hard and I would change all those sorts of things.

And it's really surprising. How is the monetary thing that would be easy to find about that? Really hard to find.

So when one aspect of dating in my mind is like sweet and joyful and is just meeting people together and dating in the world of dating for me is like more intimate. So it's nice. You know, for me, I like intimacy, actually. I like intimacy in all relationships, which means like authentic, truthful, whatever the person is, whatever I am is that connection. So I like that. So even dating is really nice. And but when I when I look at the other side of dating, the way it did things to me is like selling.

You're just selling is like my age is this is is a contract, is everything so. And and and when I look into the because I don't have the opportunity to meet people naturally. So if I really want to to date, I would look for online things or certain ways of of of of allowing this to come to me. So dating is a lot with apps and stuff, which I did join one recently. And and then when when when, when, when I get the text, even the feeling is like it's like that.

It's like you can feel the word even if it's a high end and it's like, it's like there's an expectancy. I don't know what it is, is pulling my my my projection. Maybe because, because what I have had meeting like this is that at the beginning, even if a relationship is very beautiful, but then the man really completely changes. And I've had the most horrific relationships coming from there. So this is a little bit in my mind now.

I've changed. So I'm looking at my boundaries and stuff. I'm just doing that. But still, you know, the notion of dating is like it's like they are talking in a way because. One, it's is the expectation of the other is not to I mean, one of them said, oh, I'm looking for friendship. When I did respond, he said, well, actually, you know, what kind of you know, the intonation wise, I'm actually looking for sex and I'm married.

And I said, well, why didn't you put that down? You know, why did you not say that openly, that you're looking for sex on the site, whether in, say, friendship. So it's like this is very underneath it is they not truthful and and like that. It's very off-putting. So I'm hoping for the in the universe, just blaming someone, but we're talking about dating. We're talking about how it is and this is how it is, I think.

Thank you. Yeah. I think like as Selena said before, I think it feels a little bit like you're filling a role. Like if someone is like someone's got this. Marriage opportunity or partner opportunity, and they're just interviewing people to try to fill that role. So when you said. When you said you like someone sent a text and you have that reaction, what is that reaction?

Well, the reaction is. It's like I know what he's after and you see, I'm open to sex, but I don't like it when it's expected of me, you know, I want to win. And I get the sense is that a lot of the men that were like connecting is like even the way they look, you know, some of them are like like Hawaii, you know, the Buddha and all that stuff. And and. Or when they send the photos later on, they sound like we know the talks on the.

And what does that mean? You know, so I don't feel right because they're expecting six. And sex is fine as long as you get the feeling of the person, you know, the connection and that comes naturally, but the dating for me is what it is, you know, like like you mentioned so many times and all your talks, we are a bit like animals. And and then the male seems to be more pulman in that respect.

And I'm not talking badly about men on this side. I'm not. But, you know, that's what I'm getting from the through the app. And actually, I don't get this when I meet people naturally. Actually, I don't I don't get that when I meet somebody naturally at a party or or somewhere. It's all beautiful, to be honest. I don't meet them. That's the only problem, you know.

Thank you. And how does that website come with a recommendation?

No, I think this Web Veronique's should send to patrons so weird that they would say, oh, hello, I'm married, I'd like sex and the really so but yeah. So I felt an enormous amount of frustration and I kind of set myself a target that I I'd like to meet somebody naturally and in person if possible, or not under the context of dating apps, because there's so much that comes with it. So the first thing is it's an absolute stranger.

And I was having a conversation in the breakout room. So it's kind of like a throwaway culture. So we don't treat people with the same level of decorum and respect. We're not interconnected. We don't have to face them through family or friends or anything so that the humanitarian aspect gets torn down. The other thing is I do have a guilty pleasure, which I've shared before. I watched your TV series called 90 Day Films, so which is two strangers.

You've got 90 days to get married. If they don't get married in that time, they don't get a that I know don't ask. But the point is, is that you get to see how that plays out with people who don't really know each other. So it really frustrates me. And there is a whole dance, the whole game of when will they text and when should I text them? Do they really like it? And it's I don't know.

For me, it's not necessarily positive. I did meet a long term relationship on a dating app and it was terrible. I didn't know what I was walking into with a psychotic mother who had five layers of plastic on the sofa and there was a blanket on top and she had a go at me for sitting on that seat, even if it was like several layers of mom was just gone. She never told me that, but there was lots of stuff that wasn't communicated and I have no idea what I was walking in.

So I'm going to stop rambling now. I feel an immense amount of frustration with online dating, but it's really interesting to hear the females there and how it's sexualized. That kind of demeans men. And I think it is all about just taking cheap shots. And I think that's also the problem because it's there's a level of anonymity that it's like playing roulette. In a sense, we all know sometimes the numbers come in jackpot. Other times it's crap.

But I think that I think that's really interesting. I think that's one of the dynamics that's really people are repelled by dating is something called Dunbar's numbers, which is basically how many relationships we are. Biologically able to handle so I think Dunbar's numbers are like we can have five intimate, really close relationships like family, 15 friendships and a hundred and fifty casual as the one hundred and fifty people we know to be in a kind of a relationship. And when you look at environmental psychology, we know that somewhere like London is more aggressive, more hostile, because the amount of space that each person has is much less than somewhere like where I am.

It's relatively rural where you can have a lot of space. And so people are less pressured, less so. Like, if you if you go on the tube in London, nobody talks to each other because it is overwhelming to talk to that many amount of people, whereas it kind of seems to be like a north south thing. My daughter's in Sheffield University and she said life is so much friendlier in the north because everyone talks to you, whereas in the south everyone's a little bit more reserved.

And yes, so so I think if we look traditionally your dating pool, unless you're particularly wealthy and it would be an arranged marriage with someone from another county, which of the similar standing it would be? Someone from the village and. Everyone will know how you treated them, where is online dating is anonymous. You're probably never going to see much of the people in message. And if it doesn't go well, we can just go see them. And so there's no there's no real investment and that how you behave doesn't necessarily get back to your network.

So, yeah, I think that's one of the problems underpinning it is I think, where our society gets too complicated. We're not biologically equipped to deal with it, and that's where the behavior that we have in dating comes from because it's from a more complex society. Vernick.

What do you mean by not biologically equipped? What did you mean by that?

So biologically, we're built to be cavemen. Because in terms of evolution, for a species to evolve, it takes maybe like a hundred thousand years to evolve and we've only had civilization for what we call civilized in the last ten thousand years. So we're still equipped for our stress levels. We biologically respond to stress in the way that we would if we were in danger of needing to kill an animal. And so what Dunbar's numbers talk about is really the way that we instinctively built to be in a society is with a maximum knowing the maximum number of people of one hundred and fifty, which up until the industrial revolution, really of about two hundred, two hundred fifty years, we never had cities to cities that are a new phenomenon.

And then when you take online dating, which is last year, 90s, so we looked at maybe the third fourth decade of the Internet, and that's entirely new for all of us. I mean, how many I think most of us maybe want to see who grew up before the Internet. So. OK, everyone, I was sure there's a couple that might be younger, but when I think I. I had children the first time I went on the Internet, so I was like 20.

Like, I can remember the dial up modem. So. Yeah, that's entirely artificial to us. So so there's what I mean is this conflict between the technology and. The way we instinctively hide, so where there's a conflict between the society we live in and why we instinctively behave, that's where there's going to be a problem.

Karl, I just wanted to expand on this because I am part of something that was leading edge at the time, but it's a little bit nerdy, maybe a little bit geeky, but sort of live online chat. And what I found was there was all these people and communities, but most of it was people bickering. Nobody. You think we have a global communications that people say, oh, I've got a ladder, I've got this money or I'm really good with electrics and people would come together.

Now, it was used well to share information. So when things would break in the news, it would pass quickly and which is good from online because things get taken down. So that was incredibly useful. But for the most part, yeah. People just couldn't find a way to get along, and because it's not physical, you're purely relating to intellect and I think it got worse. Over the years, people have said more and more of it, whether that's to do with greater access.

I think in the early days, you had to be quite the leap to get online computers that expensive, you know, over a grand night for ninety six, ninety seven. You have to have a bit of money, then you have to pay the telephone bills. So it was a smaller community. It's very different than where is now kind of anybody can get on and that's changed. So I don't know what that says to you, how you can comment on that.

But I find it interesting that we had the ability for the first time in history to connect and share and instead we just find a book.

That's a perfect analogy because online dating is the perfect you have more single people, easier access to more single people than ever before. And yet because of the behavior, most people are turning off it. So there's something that you said that I'd like to challenge, and that is when you look at most people, most families don't get them. I don't mean like they don't ever get along, but there's bickering between siblings. There's jealousy, there's people falling out.

So is it just that the Internet is skipping some aspects and going straight to the bickering? So so like I'm thinking, when you first know people in person, you're kind of there's a bit more politeness that you get along when you get your family, you kind of get more to the differences without the politeness. Is the Internet just skipping that politeness?

I'm sure. Yeah, I guess. But it's a double edged sword because the beauty of it is you're not restricted by filters. Like if we're in a room and there's a guy who's six foot four, he has a very strong presence of mind and time to show up. So it's unfiltered and unrestricted. You are connected directly to somebody's mind and heart, which we've never had the opportunity to do. But on the other side of it, because we don't have those boundaries, people could be as low as botulin.

So and we know this from Twitter and you know what I mean. And a lot of it will go on to say, I'm not defending any of that behavior in any way, but I will say that it's unexamined, unconscious drives that make people do this very often unless they have staunch political beliefs. It's very didn't even know really why they're doing it, where the anger comes. And that, I think, is what we need to work on.

That's yeah, that that reminds me of a comment. It was a few years back there was a, I think a heavyweight champion boxer, and someone had been slagging him off on Twitter about what he was going to do to him and that he to step, if you can imagine, which I thought was quite funny. So, yes, there's that impact of in person, we might not say. Because of it's difficult to say, whereas it's easier to say it like on switch or something, but is the.

If someone still thinks it, but they don't say it, the problem still there really isn't, it's just masked in politeness. So maybe the Internet is speeding up the differences so that they get what they call. Just an idea. Sandra, I can see you, but there's was first and then it's Selena and then she's onto.

So, yeah, it's quite a lot through behind, but remember, before you actually even wanted something, even knowledge, you had to go and do something about. So see the money, go buy the magazine. Take it home sometimes to my Heidi, that magazine from the whole family, we know which magazine will be talking about and you actually went and connected the people after. But now these days, people just can switch it on any time when they got the cravings and they feel like the other person.

It's like like that should be a slug. So they're not really building that connection to us to that, you know, it's OK to having that cravings. But how you I think that after that's the key and that's not the mask that's about you want to be human being treated. So you should act this way. Do not act as a dickhead if you don't. I said to somebody, please, you like to that simple. I always see I for somebody what?

I would love to have it, Tussler. If not, that's the point. Think about how many times we bought those magazines and decided and was good. Sometimes we shape it. The friends. And you actually was building connection with the friends. But no. Now, these days, you might be online, get somebody who got devilled, maybe not even information might be something bullshit to a bond or something like that.

Yeah, that's that's interesting as well in that. So one of the things that struck me, I remember nothing about loneliness, is if you look at research on loneliness, the group you would expect to be most lonely for most people is old people because they're isolated. I don't see many people, but actually the group that was there, I think this was prearrangement, the group that is most likely is teenagers. And it's because the perception of what they expect to be is what I expect everyone else is doing is so is to be so much busier that they feel they're missing out.

So therefore, than most learning. And when you think of Facebook and Instagram, what they're doing is kind of glamorizing how great a new shape is, how great their life is as opposed to yours. There's also something else that triggered off from that in that because books and magazines and everything else was harder to get. Now it's kind of like people, but I know people reading more. People are consuming more, but it's lower quality because there's so much and it's harder to do so.

It's easier to find information, but it's harder to find quality information because there's so much that you have to filter through. And a lot of there's a lot of misinformation, particularly when you look at things like Trump and the vaccine and all of this stuff that becomes so much you don't know which to believe. OK, so we've got Selina, Sandra, Verrone, Selina.

And I was just going to say to everyone, especially afterwards, I think the word always comes up for you. But I think even when I still have my bank with my brothers, they usually we don't do anything by text or nine. But we pick one of the biggest conversations I've had. I've been online in Texas and never being face to face the woman about and barely any communication. And that's online and it's vice versa with my bosses. That's where the tension takes a line every face to face with the way we talk.

So I just I think the time went on. I thought it was my parents relationship. And one of the reasons is because the lack of communication, he couldn't communicate and she couldn't communicate to him at home. And when she found him and that was the end for her, instead of actually looking at what the real underlying issue issues were. So I I think the biggest thing I think is the best thing for the Internet generation of just a lack of communication that we have to fight, I think, bank and online friends via text or whatever.

I mean, I don't know. That's just been my experience since I went to the site. And if someone is heavily invested in Florida, checking the phone time and and sent, you know, texting and prior to the day that you go on the day when that total silence, I think that just said the all the main that that person just because you doesn't struggle with thoughts and feelings that you can write down the actions.

Um, yeah. I'm just to pick up on that. Do you think that is more that they socially anxious and uncomfortable speaking in person, which they might because someone can communicate well by text because it's like less pressure. So they have something to say. But if they can't say and sometimes it's because it's too intense for them and maybe later they can possibly.

But I think if you really want to get to know each other, I'm going to do it in person with language I. It can just be done on the balance between using text and emails and online and actually talking together. I think there needs to be a balance between the two too much one too much of the other. I think that for some time, some people question the performance.

Yeah, what I was trying to get at was it might be anxiety like the nervous first couple of nights, but it might be that they open up from like some people get really nervous, they're anxious. Then I would they have it say it's just in person is too intense and maybe later I will.

If it is actually someone else, I can say, look, I'm a bit nervous. I mean when I mean when I was younger, when I didn't know the whole dating rules and stuff, I would if I was nervous, I, I would say that I was nervous. I think it's OK to say that I'd rather someone say that than not, because you're starting to make assumptions as to what they're thinking. And I think that's why sometimes.

Yeah, that's true. Right. Sandra.

I was going to mention consequences and the role of consequences in interpersonal, not relationships, but if you're in if you're speaking to someone physically and you have other people around you, if you're rude, there are consequences that are immediate. And it's much more difficult for you to extricate yourself from those situations. So you adopt mannerisms and behavioral patterns that allow you to survive and to engage in those in those circumstances, whereas online that is no longer a restriction on your behavior.

And if you if people come at you, you can just press the button and everybody disappears. And I think being free from the immediate reaction of people to any untoward behavior on your part has made people more. Less, less afraid to show certain unpleasant sides to themselves, they're they're emboldened, I think, because there's nobody to tell them it's inappropriate. And even if that is the case, it may be a stranger that they'll never see again. And they'll probably tell you off as well.

So I think. That has created a kind of coarseness that you don't get when it was just face to face, my face to face, yeah, it's kind of like the Internet works and interests and try to fight like tribal interests as you congregate with people who are like minded. And if you look at Facebook groups, one of the things is everyone's like different. Facebook groups have different. Cultures and they have different values, and so they're all there, that there's a certain point of view and anyone has a different point of view, it kind of gets hounded out of that group or or they become ostracized.

And people is like, what's the next thing about the Internet and social dilemma? Tristram Christian. And he talks about how. We get to see what reinforces what we already believe and in the same way, because we everyone else is thinking the same. Like, for example, if you had someone like Ragnhild Ferry, which is a real toxic vitamines group, and they will tell each other that is right. Whereas normally they would be like one percent or two percent maybe of the population.

But when there's thousands of them in the group, they feel, yeah, yeah, I'm right, because, like he signed it, he signed a lease on it, which to some extent you always had like less than a pub would have a similar point of view. And so then they would. But on the Internet, most of your information is quite informationally tribal, and so that shapes your point of view and so that you think you're justified and you don't get motivated as much by the differences of different people.

So, yeah, actually, that's something.

Well, I mean, I'm just looking at his school, for instance, and I see the value of looking at people's faces, listening to their opinions, how they express, you know, this this is so valuable when you want to meet someone. And and and I think this is what's missing the platform where you have lots of different people. You could say that they are looking for someone and just have, like, beautiful topics like this one. I mean, this is very close to two human needs.

So have such topics. And then you can you can see who you like to see and you build friendships. I mean, the first thing is building friendships. When you were talking about this arranged marriage, I mean, I love these stories because first of all, there's a lot of wisdom and there's a lot of support. I'm not talking about the whole ones, but generally, you know, in India, because I watch quite a few of those scenes, because I'm attracted to these cultures and and and it's a support of the family.

I mean, I know why my relationship never, ever worked is because my mother was a monster, you know? And I'm saying that with love, because I realize now why she was so that I become who I am. But nonetheless, it affected my relationship, because if we don't have the babyhood of love to see what the plans are, we don't act like this. But this family, they seem to be more attuned to this kind of wisdom and the competence we consider the young ones because their parents are at work.

So we've got a very good model to look at. And most of it is it's about learning to be with another person. So so when somebody is is chosen for you, because there's a lot of factors surrounding that. You know, when you watch those films, I must say it's quite exciting. And then once you have got someone, then you get on with them. How beautiful is that? I also have that. So I like that idea.

And I think it's platforms like this rather than all individuals trying to sell themselves. Because you can't you can't really you can't really show yourself. You can sell yourself for five minutes. But it's not always you know, you need more than that. You need more than the face. You need more than the text. You need even more than. And then just to talk, you need to look you see somebody whose eyes, you know, you see how they express is very, very different.

And that's what's missing in our society, where we all want to be independent. We all want to be choosing each other because, you know, it's nice to do that as well and also feel connected to the universe. You can ask the universe, but a lot of them are not connected, like I'm not always connected. So therefore, it's my job to do this and to do that is very difficult. But I think, you know, this this this these lovely platforms, are they serving?

Nothing.

Thank you. I just noticed in the chat, I don't know if you want to expand on that cylinder there about I'm really interested in what you said about the language we're using seems so challenging. And that is more to.

And I mean, I know that next week you're going to look at the flip side of this, but it's just I like to think that no matter what, I do think that we do hope that just listening to everyone, I think everyone just feels that all the language that we're using is there's no hope in the language. So I suppose, you know, we we want something, but then we kind of analyze things in such a lovely way. But they must have been some aspects of the relationship that was good.

Otherwise you wouldn't know about it. Sometimes I think it's important to learn from the good as well as the things that didn't go so right. And I suppose that's what I was trying to trying to say about not saying everything is bad. But what if actually people ask what is it that we're looking for ourselves that we not getting from the other person?

Can I pick on that? Because it really is just something I think which is really dicing is really one person connecting to another person is the most natural thing in the world. Yeah, there's something about the way that we look at relationships, the way that it's is set up, which makes it really difficult because it shouldn't be difficult. And I suppose what I'm trying to bring out in that is that. All of humanity, I don't know how how long humans have been dying, millions of years, billions, I can't remember, but we have managed to reproduce for definitely millions of years.

So it's quite natural. And yet there's something in the story of. Dating, that's made it more complex and that's something that we're putting in and so that's really what I want to get through this week and next. OK, so I think it was Yanase and then Carl.

If I know Listin or that story is actually to get me, one thinks. Do be released and why release them to Williston's to understand what we do this time, just to reply? Because the communication and the connection actually start the new search to understand, and that's where they start calculation for the people. Then you start understanding from there that's coming, not just simply reply. And that's what the Internet taking away from you, that it's no such communication in the Internet.

There is some kind of sharing information, nothing else. There is no meaning behind. You can't understand from where that's coming. And another thing what made me somebody I see something. Sometimes we just so much stimulus we got in the life, we just basically shut down. And we can't focus on anything anymore. We have to stop to do that. We have to stop thinking about one thinks of the woman and just move by step by step. But what we do instead, we start running straight away.

We start searching so much information. Rather than understanding first Foster, actually, is that really me, is that really I can relate to that? Is that really how I can connect with that? Because we are basically just be afraid to be bored and to be fairly calm and going in the same direction as so much as. Intimacy is the key term, and that's what we desire on some level, but she's right and so much is we don't get that from, you know, dates and going out and distractions and getting it kind of comes from sort of the softness and the stillness and I guess you could call it being bought.

That's a good point. But I do something really intimate with a friend, and that was we would sit in silence and hold eye contact. It's one of the most intimate things you could probably do. There's nowhere to run, nowhere to hide. We are literally just faced with the presence of somebody and vice versa. And that kind of gave me such a level of intensity and connection. And it's given me the contrast to see what we're calling connection is often very much like me desire me rather than sharing what's internal or being quiet enough and still enough to notice each other on a real level.

Otherwise, it's just a cycle of thoughts about going backwards and forwards and evaluation and plus and minus. Win or lose of love war rather than just that sort of open mindedness you might have when you hold the baby while it's not screaming. So I think this is a really good point, but it's very hard to talk about. So that's what I'm going to show.

Robert, you'll miss it.

Yeah, not not having fun. Again, this is a great shot reading. I'm up for this fall in line to always try and look at things from another perspective, because I have I'm going to say. But I become quite conscious of my age now, you know, is that sort of thing is happening and I'm looking at the younger generation. I'm trying to think, what are the positive things that the younger generation of put them in terms of aspect of being human?

Things like this. And I just wanted to say that I just put it out. There will just be the devil's advocate. Maybe our generation got it wrong and maybe actually getting to know each other through nonsense. We'll get us to a better place as a species, I don't know, you know, because I always try to think of this is how I see life and this is how how I validate things in my life. But the world is changing so much.

So I'm for the younger generation. That's that's how they're going to that's how they're going to come through. And they have to enjoy that generation and things like artificial intelligence coming in now. And you've got different countries that have got sort of three to one ratio of women and men. You know, society is going to change in a way that we wouldn't recognize it, say, in 10 years time, I'm sure. And probably it has already, you know.

And so for me, I've become quite conscious that this is a conversation. It's likely to happen with people over a certain age bracket in general. And hence, when I look at everybody go a little bit older. Yeah. You know. And I sometimes think maybe the way that the youngsters are doing it on the Internet is just the zeitgeist, and maybe that's something that's necessary in order for something to flourish, something to grow. Maybe people maybe the younger generation will get on board and carry on the way it is.

Or maybe at some point there'll be a turning point and they'll say, no, actually, it'll just send them to a better place again and leapfrog. Because if I think back to when I was a child, I know that, you know, when I looked at my mom and my dad and people of those generations, it was impossible to get any emotion from them. They wouldn't pass any emotional conversation down to you. I didn't know anything about them.

I've had to find out more by trying to do your ancestry and trying to get a couple who were there because they never used to talk about their feelings. And now I know we say things are changing, so that's great because we're part of that change and we've got the next generation taking it to the subsidy level. So maybe they'll talk too much about nonsense and not understand it, but maybe at some point that will all work out and as a species will be better for it.

I don't know if it's a necessary evil having the Internet or not, but I love technology. But I've I've kind of gone against that. I'm not so switched on to it anymore now. But then I'm I am accepting that maybe that's an aspect for me as a challenge because of because of my age and my heritage, you know, just one thing. So.

Yeah, I always believe I always believed fundamentally the future is going to be better than the past, and I think sometimes you can look at things being worse. You can see them be worse, but it's because they're worst you working out issues that will propel you to be much better in the future. I think there's so much demand that this generation, in terms of gender, in terms of sexuality, in terms of race. And I think I think this whole.

Like this is in conflict zones, everything going on at the moment, which I think is is going to resolve it eventually, just as a quick POW who OK, quick poll, first of all, who would get rid of the Internet and the technology related to it. So hands up, if you would. Because that's two hands up. He said no one or is that common to talk like he would like to be all right, just throwing it out there as a wild thing.

He would like to be born in a different time by any time in history. Robert, what time?

You know, it's funny as it sounds, I'd like to be born in the future. I'd like to be born in 10 or 15 years time, because I for the reasons you mentioned, I think a lot of all of these issues that have built up through through prejudice, for race and for humans seeing each other is different. I think we'll be faced as a species with will be calamities. And I'm hoping that that's going to rally the spirit around and we'll just forget all these silly differences and things will get better.

Will I look at if you look at the 50s and the 60s were really a time when lots got resolved, African-American civil rights, they were lucky in terms of research. There's so much research into obedience and changing from dictatorial issues like the height of the Cold War, which worked out. That's how capitalist communist thing do we centrally control everyone or do we allow individualism? And that was really initiated from the Second World War. And so it was the aftermath.

Sometimes we need great. Great conflict in order to recognize just the the everyday things, I think that whatever we can see in an extreme so like everyone looks at Hitler or. Someone else hit the road, some like someone that everyone agrees that's evil, but we all do the same thing. But a different. Intensity, so I think we can look at each one else, and I've always known from the most extreme by by looking at extreme people and thinking, okay, where do I do this or where do people do this to a lesser degree?

And I think they say, yeah, definitely Stalin and. Yes, so I think we can look at this. I think there's a common thread of humanity and whatever anyone. Does whatever anyone else does. We do to a lesser extent, but the contrast where the contrast is greater, we can see it more easily and then we can see in ourselves. OK. Trying to think of what started out, but, yeah, OK, we're onto call.

I was just going to feed back and Robert was talking about that future generations and I have literally been on the fence about this. And so much as we've got this power from technology. But will it be used for self-absorption and narcissism or will it be used for learning better? One thing I think is good is back in the days when Pop was community, you always had a Billy Bullshit's or in the pub, whereas now you can look up and say, that's all right.

What are you talking about? I think that's great. So there's a level of honesty that perhaps will develop because people know you can't just talk shit and say, oh, I'm Elton John's cousin or something like that. So that will help. This is another 50 50 thing, but there will be more self-aware people putting themselves out there on social media. No, not everybody. Some people just blindly post pictures of them with drinks in their hand like that and and cocaine all over their nose, whatever.

But that will be a level I hope it does. Boardroom's paranoia of self-awareness. I'm quite hopeful for the young people in the future that I never had this sort of stuff. If I had questions, I just went with what my mom told me. And quite frankly, my mom is a fucking idiot. So I'm glad that we've got the Internet to be able to just ask anything we don't know and simplify things and improve our lives. And if we want to make changes, it's quite simple.

So that's kind of my two cents.

So I except that you need to have the tools to discern what's proper information and what's not, you can be totally you can be totally misguided. You have to still learn to ask why, how, what, etc., you can't take everything from the Internet and think that it's gospel. There's still people out there trying to mislead China and trying to do things that are not for the right reasons. So if you don't have the power of discernment, then you're still going to be let down to God.

But. So you still have to have cognitive skills that are well honed. To deal with the plethora of information that bombards you from all quarters, yeah, flat earth is right here. There is that to so yes. So it's good in one sense and it's good that information can be readily available. You can find information on any topic, but it's how you search. First of all, it's the questions that you ask. What do you want answered and how do you sift through all of that to come up with with with proper answers that guide you properly and not take you further down the rabbit hole?

Now is the time to speak again. Yeah, I mean. When the sun is that I'm just reminded of you, like you see these jokes of light that I have the Darwin Awards and you have some of the like this the level of stupidity that comes out of. You know, of people believe in how people act and. Because when you give someone a microphone, you can broadcast your what is it Oscar Wilde said when you say silent, no one knows how intelligent you are when you speak.

They know how stupid you are, similar to. Such a great source of humor and. OK, so. I don't think we've covered quite a bit, so there was something I think we said that triggered an idea for me. It talks about being open, honest, like wanting from someone open openness, honesty and something else and straight off the verrone talks about honest, open, authentic, truthful. OK, so. What might be worth if we switch off two minutes, so switch off your camera and just think.

What three qualities would be most important for you? In. Looking for a partner in online dating. So everyone's going now. Yes, I can't say, but does everyone does everyone get the question? Guriev Hanzo.

Yes, what policies would you most see?

Yeah, OK, so we can go two minutes, right? So you can only choose three colliss. Which freed cheese, right, so. OK, so we'll go quickly into breakout rooms to talk about what are your three qualities? Three minutes and then we'll switch. Welcome back. So it might be interesting if people want to share in the chat, what were the top three qualities? In the meantime, does anyone want to share? Or anything that struck them in discussion.

I just got a text message from Robert. It says, Those entities, so I, I tell you, that was the third member of the. Oh, you're talking to me.

Yeah, I wasn't sure if it was me or not.

Oh, yeah, roboroach. Well, nobody has to speak, and so, well, I just I was very broad, I said body, mind and soul. And I feel that if one of those three key pieces isn't quite in balance, it doesn't seem to work somehow. There's three key elements. I know it's very broad, but it does kind of look at what's missing. What I was using in my group, I just said what I like so many people using target integrity of.

I like to use the word of craziness is the easy path to pass. What is she able to express that satisfied and to be good for it, for the word. Don't be afraid. Do with me. And honesty and loyalty, those are very important to get there, to feel forever and be the person.

Forever young. That's nice. Honesty seems to be like honesty seems to stand out to me.

I choose the authenticity, which means both of them are authentic with each other and they open minded in the sense that each one think of their own ideas, but they also look at from the other side and trustworthiness, which is honesty.

OK, Tom. OK, now. This is a quick we've been moaning all night, the quake, the number one frustration you have with dating.

Not least on. Transgenders.

My own projections.

Misunderstanding, misunderstanding.

You see the lack of reciprocation for that person not knowing themselves and whether they want something, but no expectation or pressure in Sacramento is that when people ask me questions about, you know, have you ever been with a woman or have you ever you know, sometimes I think I may be asking the question, do you want to know the answer? And and then when you do honest, is that a shock? And so I just think it's just the judgment that comes from people.

I always think you should if you're going to ask questions, then you need to expect the answer. And so I.

Whereas kind of asking the question for. Does that checklist still no.

Yes, because I'm a big one about I'm not somebody who likes to put against them all my life. So really, for me, just about being attracted to in that moment in time. But when people say when they want to put you in the box, I sometimes think that there's something about them, not about me. But then then they judge the answer that I get. So I just think it's. Yeah, that can be.

Fear of being imprisoned and not free, your fear of being imprisoned, your fear or there is no mine, mine is all. It's my.

What do you want? My own, OK.

I don't like the topic of materialism comes up, you know, earnings, how much do you weigh in graduate school to car for the source material?

I have a difficulty with that because because I live Gruene, I do want to know if somebody has got a call because it is a pain in the ass running people about to and from Forgione. So I do understand it's not really as practical as I need to know later on.

There's a difference between do you have a car and what kind of car do you have, what model do you have, you know, so and so on. So there's a big difference. And how much do you earn? Being interrogated is just the pits. Well, you are. And I think most of you know that I will speak my mind and I say I won't hide information, but necessarily. But let it come out so it's not an interrogation, you know, and especially if they're asking and you ask a question and they're evading, they're not answering, but they are coming at you.

They want to know everything about you, but they're giving nothing away. But then I kind of hot-Blooded, you know, to say to them, if this is over and done. Forget it. I can't be bothered with this rubbish. But nonetheless, I think the amount of information that we give is out to people is something that we should be comfortable with. And if somebody makes us feel uncomfortable, then we should not feel that we have to suffer it and give it because we are expected to, you know, and that that makes me feel uncomfortable.

And I will confess. I will lash out. I'm gone.

So perhaps we'll be going to explain this, what is it we don't have websites are honest people, dot com or integrity. Individuals know why. Why are we not looking at the values of internal capacity? And instead, it's I don't know.

Yeah, of it wasn't a question that in the chat maybe.

Yeah.

And I think that that's quite perceptive, is that. If you to go mass market and you're going to sell something. You're going to sell on, you're going to get the hottest guy, hottest girl, and like if you look at Clairol, L'Oreal or something, they don't say you're going to have an authentic connection. You're going to have you're going to have the dream. You're going to have bewitched. And I think when you look at dating sites, because it's a consumer product, you're going to you're going to see what's going to work is going to hit the masses.

So the biggest ones is match plenty of fish. Tynda. Which is. Probably the most superficial ones as well, just because that's where that's what's so. Yeah, I think so. And I think the promise is easy, easy, easy dating. Get your dreams. As we were talking about a younger generation than by which I assume we're talking about millennials. And I'm reminded every time I hear that, I'm reminded of Simon cynic's rant about the millennial generation.

Anyone seen it? If not, look it up, it is a video we just went on around and said, but the whole millennial generation is a failed parenting and it's like the expectation of impact without effort and without time and patience. And they've grown up in a time of expecting instant gratification. And it's instant gratification. That sounds. Everyone really wants to beat down. We're talking now and we will honest and deep, intimate relationship. But we're talking from a rational, intellectual perspective.

And when it gets to the hormonal primal element, we go for the hot one. And I think that's what sells. So, yeah, I think. I think it will always be. When when you're selling to the masses, it's always going to be the lowest common denominator is going to win, like if you look at relationship or dating advice, it's always the. It's like send this text, do they say this thing because people want a magic bullet?

Selena.

Can I just say, I mean, just pretty much every side, whatever one thing you have to decide to do some day, but I think one thing that I've come across a big tell tale signs that in my culture we have marriages that even arranged marriages now is that this new generation has become throwaway in my time, divorce or not, being married was a real stigma. And you want to know why you never went to family gatherings, never at public.

But this generation, they are marrying and marrying people and that is within arranged marriages. This is cultural, everything, instant patient. And I want that qualification. Now, once I have it, I know I can get it elsewhere. So why would I want to be with one person? I think this is something that that is what's developing. And I'm not too sure why that is developing, but I think that that comes across.

I'm not sure that's entirely, because I think a lot of the marriages that were long lasting traditionally were bad marriages. People were trapped in them. I think there's a level of discernment. I think the real issue is that we don't know how when we disconnect, we don't know how to realign, how to get that connection back. And I think that is the missing element. That there is. I think most couples that break up. Would given the right, given the ability to to heal their differences and reconnect would be better staying together.

However, without knowing that. That would just be frustrating for people. So I think this is expectations. But it's also. I think people are less willing to tolerate, which isn't a bad thing, but I think equally I get your point and I think people should be able to work out their differences. I think it's a knowledge gap. That's the real issue of not being able to resolve them.

Sandra, I think we're also more interested in our evolution, our development of self and within our relationship. If who you are finding yourself to be at the point B. after marriage is no longer compatible with the relationship, then that is when you find that more people may be brave enough to say it's no longer works for me. I want out. And also I've I've been reading I've seen a couple of articles where people talk about marriage is dying a natural death.

In other words, people come to the conclusion that there's nothing more. That the marriage can give to both of them. That is of value. That it's not evolving anymore, it's not doing anything for them, there is nothing on which they can build further. And so it's better if they allow them the marriage to to to end and possibly start afresh, a new maybe with, you know, find another partner or not have another partner, because maybe they're at the stage where they want to be focused on themselves.

And I think we see this thing of stigma is something that is not holding as much power as it is over people anymore. And as a result of that, people are now becoming braver. And also having the economic stability that allows you to split is also driving some of that. But I think and also, let's face it, we are living longer. And so, you know, a typical marriage would probably have lasted 40 years or 30 years or so.

And people are heading to 50 years. And there's this whole discussion now about why is it that people in their 60s, there's this phenomenon of people in their 60s divorcing. And in many instances, you also find out that if you have a typical husband, a female point of view, where her husband has spent probably 60 hours a week at work. And he then retires and comes home, who is the stranger invading your space? Who is he?

And you don't want to share this space with him because he's approaching your routine and he wants you to come and do things with him at his beck and call when you have had your life structured in such a way to fill all those gaps when he was not around. So I think that as we as we evolve and as we go through our reasons for either wanting to end our marriage or to not be in a marriage or to find a new relationship with polyamory seems to be, I think now seems to be coming up now where people seem to find it all.

We need to add a third party to this thing because the two of us are just not enough. That's not for me, but it's there. So, yeah, I think change is part of the equation.

Yeah, I think I think you've pulled out some of the real the real issue is everything's really changed. The environment in which we have relationships has changed completely, which as in the relationship is longer. It's fine for the first time, really last 50 years has been the first time when we've been financially stable enough to be able to support the two households. That's the part of. People used to die earlier and say that you didn't have the refinement, whereas now you've got and I think dental floss is a jigsaw thing, brings up the whole idea of how many people are living relationships, that they're kind of escaping from each other.

And I think the pandemic has shown that. I had someone tell me an 81 percent increase in people seeking advice for divorce and separation and things like natural things to slow down. But the other the other part, which kind of Robert touched on and I just want to double click on that in. The relationships is that I think what happens when you have so much technology is that you speed up the velocity of life to the amount of interactions, the amount of stuff that happened in your life.

Cars probably sped up to three times, so where when we before we had the Internet, stuff happens much less like maybe there's a couple of highlights in a week, whereas now and you'll be bombarded with stuff because there's so much news, you're being bombarded with stuff because technology means that you're having particularly like even using Zoom as opposed to physical meetings means that you have more meetings. So there's more velocity, more ideas, more talking to people. And that whole that dynamic means we have a need for greater stimulus of attention, which is really what the social dilemmas talking about is that the Internet distorts our attention by being overstimulated.

So there is that there is the ability to deal with stress. But there's the fact that a 40 year relationship in today's climate is probably more like 60 or 60 year relationship because so much more is happening. And when you look back, I often talked about that. I think the relationship is set when you make just plays out. And if you the speed of the velocity of what's going on in your life determines how quickly that's going to play out in a relationship to determine the velocity of your life, meaning how much stuff is happening in that time because the time is still the same.

But if we're now so much more stuff, that's more stress, that's more challenge, that's more for the relationship to deal with. And that's when stuff the problems, the conflicts in relationship get come out quicker and more frequently. So actually, that's a real change in relationships. I think it was Rolnik first and then Nicole.

And yes, I mean, for me, it feels very much like all those last conversations is about as evolving and as a result of this, we need to find ourselves. So we're going to have lots and lots of different experiences, relationships with everybody. And just to to to check what would we resonate with what we're still going with. And then and then when we're ready, we let go. And even when Robert was talking about the future, I mean, or when when I speak to my children on the phone, they're flowing with life so beautifully.

And sometimes I'm with them not very often. And I see how they interact with others. I mean, I wish I was like that so freely and so spontaneously. And they really are living life more than me in my head about how they're doing. You know, they're just living life. And it's so beautiful. And I think I think I think the whole world is and I mean, at every stage I see the beauty of every stages of of life from the last age is this age and all.

But but I can see it. I can hear it as well, but I can see it with them. And that's in.

And I think it's really interesting that. Definitely, I know my generation Y, my experience was it was kind of like unconscious rules of the game of life were to gather as much stuff as you could. And now I'm looking and like clutter is a big problem because we've had so much stuff that we don't really care about. And then just following up on that and Nicole's comments, I think it's also. If you look at when I was growing up, like 10, 15 years ago, people would laugh at meditation and mindfulness.

I never had mentioned and people are filling their lives with stuff to do it, just like their parents are so busy because they're sending kids to this class, this class, this class, because we're still working on the paradigm that if you feel more into it, we life is better and. We're now getting to the stage where we've got too much stuff and we have to do extra stuff like mindfulness meditation to cope with the business of our lives. Nicole, did you have something to add?

And I want to thank you.

OK, that's usually my trick. OK, right, so anyone else have a moan, gripe, comment on modern dating before we all. Despair and come back next week for a more positive.

I have, as you know, joined two sites and I was still trying to make up my mind which one I should actually subscribe to. So here goes did match and what's the other one by ship? OK, fight on, match all of these all these hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of old or whatever and hundred and how many of whatever it is to. Like you and what I feel is there is a little bit of a marketing thing that's underpinning all of this to get you to subscribe and pay.

So these numbers, one must not think that it's flattery that people really like you. All of these people really like you. Numbers are there to get you to feel that there are people who actually do like you. So you need to pay some money to see who these people are. So I think it's and it's not cynicism, but it's reality because that's what marketers do. They make you want something that you would never thought that you wanted and that you can do without it.

So here it is. This is the marketing. So what you're reading from what you're seeing is not necessarily actually what is that's that's what I'm getting from it. Right. Because clearly, there is a portion of people I need to let her see that she has a chance of finding somebody here because these numbers are really climbing. So she must pay the subscription. And when she does, then she'll come on board and she'll be hooked. And and so that's another fish that we have caught.

Right. Whereas there's nothing. Yeah. You're supposed to do the personality tests and all the rest of it and all of the criteria should have to filter out people that you don't want. But they are still there. They're all there. Because those are the people who have to make up the numbers. So you still have to go in and filter out all of these people that you thought that you were filtering out back answering these questions. I just nodded her head.

She's she's agreeing with me, so it's a front to capture and and put you in, but it doesn't really make it that much easier for you, I find. Even though there are these filters that I suppose because if I look at my thing and I tell you, oh, it says you've had nine hundred and this is what I saw this morning, you have got nine hundred and ninety three looks views. Oh my God. OK, fine.

OK, I know of that. I've got one hundred and sixty something like. So I should be flattered. Shouldn't a nation hold up my credit card and immediately pay because God loves me, ya know, when I go, when I look, because you can see. Like maybe thirty five percent of them don't meet one or two of the criteria that I established that I you know, that's supposed to filter them out. So out of that, maybe it's only two or three or four, maybe 10 that I could probably say hello to.

I want to say hello to. So that's my gripe since we're are in this evening and that's my bread. Yeah.

Thank you, Gary Vaynerchuk. The market is ruined everything. And it's really based on the idea of like the tragedy of the Commons, because that's when there's a resource that's available, then people are always going to milk Dreux. So, yeah, OK, Veronica.

I mean, I would say because it's a visual thing, I mean, that's what I do. But I mean, that's how I feel is the photographs are quite, quite important because it's a visual thing. So if you if you if you're not too good looking, for instance, you know, like you're I mean, when I don't show my face on the first one and after that you can hardly see me. And what I wear is just really, really plain.

And it's like it's like the visual is, you know, like. I'm not one type or I'm not this type. So maybe that's a little bit and then afterwards you can see people want to get to know you. Maybe, you know, I mean, that's that's my thought about the vision thing.

I think the fact is being online. Slanted towards being more visual. Whereas in person, you pick up people's mannerisms and stuff like that, but, yeah, that's why the artificiality of online makes it more superficial.

We're on a actually I've done it not necessarily my best self, my best pictures out there, because it's a matter of well, no, because this is who I am. I'm not always at my best. So take it, believe it and get to know manses.

But some take that to the extreme. And really put things that there is absolutely new hope in hell that I'm telling you. There's no way it's going to happen. You feel like, oh, somebody wrote an article and saying the things that you should do if you want to fish was one of the things that she said to those men with the fish pictures, please put away the fish. And then the other one was the dark glasses. People need to see your eyes.

And I mean, I agree with her because I just pass you over if is especially the reflective ones. What's the point? Yeah, those those two things in particular she mentioned. So there must be something in it and the men don't seem to learn. Don't, don't, don't do it. And just and the selfies in the mirror with the belly hanging out and, you know, the hairs on the shoulder and shoulders and the.

He needs to make a YouTube video and report, not exactly.

But the thing is, you know, it's not if you if you had on a shirt, you know, you had all of those things because come on, let's face it, we all have things that we don't want people to see. But just just cover it up. I could probably like you, but just seeing that is enough to just I just like their work. Whereas if you had on a shirt, I probably the same number myself. To me, it's like an interview you put your best foot forward for an interview, and I'm not saying that you must be glamorous and, you know, come like Kim Kardashian or who is I can't even think of a flamboyant man, but you know what I mean.

That's not the point. But it needs to be scrubbed and cleaned and cleaned up and, you know. Bessel. Because if you look messy, I'm going to say, oh, well, he's probably not going to be very attentive to me. He's not going to be particularly careful. He just looks sloppy, untidy, don't care. And maybe that's how he is. And that's that goes against the grain is me.

Troy Bowen says that would be easier when you are in complete control, the likes of Bumble and getting killed, 27, 28, 29 year old little boys trying to come. No, I don't know.

Are you a good man?

So I thought you said, Mommy, what is wrong with you? We are crazy.

What's this?

You're embarrassing me.

No way.

I only ask that you be clean. No fish, no glasses. Let me see your eyes. No stray hairs. Just just just put on a shirt that's up. And no, no beard that is out here and don't dare I mean, I'm not kissing here. No, it's not happening.

Can't be honest from what you've just said, that sounds exactly like Robert Mansfield. Look, he's got a show on it. No, he does have a beard. He's good.

I noticed you take your camera off, OK, shaving. Yes. I'm just thinking you're whittling down those nine hundred's.

And probably down to about 50 now, don't you think it's not worth it? That's the bottom line. I think it's just I don't know, I'd rather meet people in somewhere and just talk to them and see if we find somebody that you you click with that. That, to me, is just, you know, see if they have pheromones, get excited and you find them attractive and stuff, you know. And if the smile reaches the eyes and those kinds of things, that's what gets to me, you know, just smile genuine, the person is actually looking at you and they're pleasant and they smell like they they've had a shower before they came out.

You know, those things.

OK. All right, well, thank you, everyone. So now we mind this time next week to look at what would be better. So we've looked at what's the current state, what are the problems, the current state, so next week. We'll have a discussion about how could it be better? How could we make dating work? OK, well, thank you, everyone, and have a good week and see you next week.

Thank you. Thank you.