In this episode, Lesa Koski speaks with Catherine Collins, also known as Kat, a financial writer and blogger who shares her authentic story of navigating finances without a formal business background. Kat discusses her journey from graduate school to becoming a self-employed financial expert, emphasizing the importance of financial literacy, especially for women. The conversation covers various topics including the challenges and benefits of being a stay-at-home mom versus a working mom, the importance of financial independence in marriage, and practical tips for teaching children about money. Kat shares her experience of balancing work and motherhood, and highlights the necessity for women to understand their financial standing to prepare for unforeseen circumstances. The host and Kat also touch on the evolving dynamics of parental roles in financial management and end with a brief mention of future discussions on financial well-being for older women.

00:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome

00:57 Catherine's Financial Journey

02:59 Empowering Women in Finance

04:56 Stay-at-Home Moms vs. Working Moms

09:54 Financial Independence for Stay-at-Home Moms

13:14 Teaching Kids Financial Responsibility

20:13 Conclusion and Future Topics

By way of background, Catherine Collins is a nationally recognized entrepreneur and author of the book “Mom's Got Money: A millennial mom's guide to managing money like a boss”. Over the past decade, her writing and expertise have been featured in dozens of media outlets, including Good Morning America, Yahoo Finance, Forbes, U.S. News and World Report, Real Simple, The Huffington Post, Kiplinger, Investopedia, Business Insider, and many more. 

Websites:   Five Year You and Micro Morning Magic - Free Download

Linkedin:    https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherine-collins-8b983049/

Find Lesa at Saddleuplive.com

https://linktr.ee/LesaKoski

and @saddleuplive

Welcome listeners.

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I'm very excited.

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I have a new friend, Catherine Collins.

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I call her Kat.

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She was on doing divorces.

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different.

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So if you have any issues financially

and are thinking about divorce, go back

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and listen to doing divorce different,

but we're happy to have you at saddle

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up live to learn about finances and cat

is going to share her authentic story.

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What led her to help?

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She helps a lot of women.

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I think who've maybe feel like

they don't know about finances.

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So we're going to delve into that and

we're going talk about stay at home moms.

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versus working.

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And this is a good one that I

think I really need it for my kids.

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They seem to be doing okay.

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How do you get your kids on

the right financial path?

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So Kat, thank you for joining us.

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Thanks for having

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Catherine Collins: me.

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Thank you so much.

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I'm really excited to be here.

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These are some of my very favorite topics.

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And, um, yeah, so very quick backstory.

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Um, I am a full time financial writer.

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Um, I've been fully self

employed for about 10 years now.

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And so I do financial writing.

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I own personal finance websites with

a business partner and my partner and

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I have a podcast called five year you.

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Um, but I don't have a finance background.

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I don't have a business degree.

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I came at it a weird way.

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I started a budget blog when I was

in graduate school for history.

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And I was just writing about how

broke I was and how I was trying to

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live on a 14, 000 a year stipend.

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And, you know, it was a challenging time.

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It's a very like academically

intense environment.

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And my blog was sort of my outlet

to creatively write and, um, share

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my thrift finds and, Over time to

supplement my income, I started to

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apply to freelance writing jobs online.

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Again, this, so this was in 2010.

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So very like dinosaur blogging days.

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Um, I got paid 8 a post to start, but

like the more experience I got, I,

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um, you know, traded out an 8 post

for a 20 one and a 24 50, um, to where

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I am today, which fully supports.

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Me as my job.

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Um, so I always love sharing that

with people because there's so many

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finance experts out there and there's

so many amazing experts out there

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with letters behind their name and

business school and all of that stuff.

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But I like to come on

authentically and say like, look,

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I didn't go to school for this.

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But these are things I learned

from experience from a lot

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of research and writing.

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Um, just because I started writing

about budgeting, all the jobs I

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got ended up being about budgeting.

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Then they were about mortgages

and they were about investing.

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And then there was brand deals that

wanted someone who was like a regular

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mom, a regular person to talk about money.

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And then, um, I got a book deal and

wrote a book called mom's got money, uh,

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which is a personal finance book for mom.

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So just so your listeners know if they're

listening to this and they're like, money.

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It's like, I get it.

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This is not going to be

like bro finance talk.

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This is me coming to other women and

saying, look, the language of money

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has been made intentionally difficult

to leave us out of the conversation.

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And all women listening to this are smart

enough and capable enough to absolutely

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learn everything there is to know about

personal finance and sort of take their

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financial futures into their own hands.

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Lesa Koski: Okay, Kat.

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I love that.

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And I love that about you.

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And I've told you that before.

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My favorite things that you're,

you're kind of a regular gal.

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I am like all of us, like all of us.

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And so what that's telling the listeners

is they too can become an expert.

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You're an expert.

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You get paid.

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for writing about finances and

you learned it on your own.

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It is possible.

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And I don't, what is that?

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Like, why are women sometimes,

you know, adverse to finances?

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I'm not sure what that is, but you

said, um, sometimes they make it

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more difficult than Then it is.

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And truly, when you think about

it, it's not that difficult.

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And that is what I've

learned with my work.

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Finally, now that I'm a

grandma, I understand that

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this really isn't that hard.

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This is what you have and

this is what you can spend.

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So finally I get it.

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Catherine Collins: Yeah, for sure.

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I mean, there, I mean, we could

have a whole nother episode.

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I mean, there's an entire.

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You know cultural narrative that we've

all been brought up with and the change

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is slow um, but we are still like

unearthing the narrative that You know

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men and husbands are the ones that earn

money and manage the money and that women

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um, you know their job even if they work

is You know to maintain the kids and

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handle the mental load of all that I

think there's been so many conversations

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like changing that and updating that

Um, But we're still going against a

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lot of societal pressures and norms and

advertising that tells us otherwise.

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Yeah,

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Lesa Koski: I totally agree.

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And I'm glad that you brought

that up, which kind of could

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bring us into the topic of stay

at home moms versus working moms.

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Let's talk about that a little bit.

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Give us your perspective.

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And I want to say I'm an attorney.

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I was a stay at home mom for many years.

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Um, there were really

hard things about it.

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Yeah.

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Um, and there I would never change it.

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Catherine Collins: Yeah.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah.

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Catherine Collins: I think, um,

I have an interesting perspective

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on this because I have been a work

from home mom the entire time.

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So I had twins in 2014 and that's

the same year I became self employed.

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I was working towards that because I, I

knew that it would be challenging and it

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would be fine to hard to daycare spots.

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I had been, I was teaching and

doing museum work, but I had this

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whole freelance writing thing

on the side that was growing.

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And as I watched my numbers, I remember

it was the July before I had them

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that my writing income surpassed my

day job income for the first time.

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And I remember thinking if I can keep

this up, then by the time they come, I

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might be able to stay at home with them.

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So I kind of did the balance thing of

it's very, you know, this is not like, I'm

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not like the Instagram with the million

dollar business with the baby on the hip.

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This is just very normal.

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Put the twins down for a nap, write

an article while they nap, leave

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the dishes, house is a disaster.

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This is very much like put the twins

down for bed, write another article.

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But because of that, um, I got the

perspective of what it's like to

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be a stay at home mom and all the

challenges that come with it and

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all the benefits of seeing their

first steps and things like that.

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I got the benefit of.

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earning enough finally to hire

a mother's helper than hire a

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babysitter for 20 hours a week.

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So I had a little bit of balance and

then I get to send them off to school

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and then, you know, have, you know, 8 a.

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m to three to work and then

pick them up every day and

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bring them to their activities.

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That's what I was working towards.

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And so I do have the perspectives

of, Of sort of both, like, uh,

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uh, I still, still have sort of

like a foot in both worlds now.

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Yeah.

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Lesa Koski: I love that.

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And I did that as well.

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And I'm going to tell you, you're, you

sound like you're doing it beautifully.

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I kind of felt like I was, I'm

just going to swear a little,

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which I don't usually do.

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I was half ass at everything.

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It does feel like that.

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Yeah, it was a half ass mom.

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And then I was, uh, you know,

you're just, it did feel like a lot.

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And it is a lot.

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So give yourself some grace.

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And Kat, what I have to say is what

I'm seeing now with my adult children.

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One of my daughters is almost

done with her residency,

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which we're so excited about.

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And she's got a three year old and

her husband, she's a rock star.

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And so is her husband.

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Because he has taken on a lot.

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All of it.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And so, and then I watch my daughter

in law who's a nurse, it works a little

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bit more part time and my son who

works full time, they're more partners.

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They are partners and I

am seeing a shift in this.

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In fact, I just did a podcast

with somebody about this,

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which is amazing and I love it.

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So mamas, if you're staying home all

day with your kids, you still, you don't

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have to work until you fall into bed,

you can still count on your husband.

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Uh, to be there supporting you because

if you were bringing in, you know,

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daycare kids, that would be a job.

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And I think we miss that.

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I think we miss that.

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So I'm really, that is what like the world

can look kind of, you know, I look at

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that and how, um, my kiddos and my husband

has always been a pretty good partner.

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Um, I see it even more so happening.

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And.

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That's what I want to see in finances too.

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I think yes, is awesome.

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Um, for couples, if they can do it

together, you know, do their finance.

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But one thing I just have

to bring this up too.

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And it really hit me when I was.

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A new lawyer.

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And I worked a little bit.

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We have a big span of years between

my son and our baby who we adopted.

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So I'm like half grandma, half father.

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Yeah.

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I know it's awesome.

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But we had a big span and I remember, so

I was working a little bit and I was going

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for my continuing legal education courses.

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And I went and I listened to a well

known family law attorney and she

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said, Don't ever be a stay at home mom.

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I don't recommend it because

then you're screwed in divorce.

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Well, I still did it.

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I still did it and I'm glad that I did.

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But sadly Cat, that is what we're hearing.

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That's what the message is.

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It's like you, it's a

little bit scary for women.

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Can you talk about that at all?

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And.

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And what do you, you know, if

you are that stay at home mom and

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suddenly your husband decides he

doesn't want to be married anymore?

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Catherine Collins: Yep.

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I, I mean, I think

that's a great question.

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I went through a divorce two and a half

years ago and, um, I would have been

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absolutely terrified had I not had a

business and streams of income on my own.

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Um, but that's not to say that being a

stay at home mom is wrong in any way.

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And I would, I see what that

family lawyer was saying.

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And so I would say that with an

asterisk, with a caveat, I think it's

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possible to be a stay at home mom.

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So long as you and your spouse

sit down regularly and talk

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about money, but not just that.

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that you have money in your own name.

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If your spouse works and you don't,

some employers offer a spousal

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IRA where you can have your own

retirement account in your own name.

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Um, it's not enough now today to be a stay

at home mom and to do everything like if.

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Our previous generations did because

now the divorce is possible, but also

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emergencies, the unthinkable is possible.

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And so I always tell people like, if

you're in a secure and happy marriage

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and you're listening to me and

thinking that will never happen to me.

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Um, I thought the same thing, but even

if you're very secure, your spouse

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could still get hit by a bus tomorrow.

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And so it is vital.

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And if you don't want to do

it for yourself, then for your

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children, it is vital for you

to know every asset you have.

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It is vital for you to know how

much money is in your bank account,

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what your spending is like.

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That doesn't even mean you

have to have joint accounts.

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You can have separate accounts,

but it is not enough to be

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a stay at home mom anymore.

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You have to have the knowledge and the

financial literacy to be able to move

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forward in case the unthinkable happens.

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Because the worst time to learn

about money is in the worst moments

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of your life right now is the time.

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And I do think there's a lot of

men, like you said, there's been a

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lot of discuss about mental load.

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There's a lot of amazing

men who do partake and who

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do take care of their kids.

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And so there are a lot of men

who are open to the discussion.

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Things are changing now.

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And, uh, there are a lot of men

open to that discussion and it's

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about the partnership and awareness.

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And I do think, so I think

it's possible, but with a much

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stronger partnership financially.

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Absolutely.

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Lesa Koski: Okay.

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I love that cat.

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I love that.

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And I think that's where my husband

and I probably fell a little bit short

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where I took care of all the finances,

but I didn't know where everything

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was and I can't get my hands on it.

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So now we're finally on my case.

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Sweetheart, you got to get me on.

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Yeah, 401k so that I also can manage

it, not just because I'm worried.

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I mean, not because I'm worried about

divorce, it's because he's busy.

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He's got a huge job working all the time.

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He doesn't have time to go

in and figure out how to take

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money out for the kids college.

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And so, and the, the HSA and I

didn't do that and I wish I would

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have, so learn from that, but now

Kat, okay, so time's ticking along

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here and I still want to talk about.

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How to get your, get your kids on the

right financial path, because I don't

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think I was on a good financial path.

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And I know my dad did his darndest tree.

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You know, he was like,

I paid for everything.

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I worked really hard.

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Um, you know, but, and yet,

I never really understood it.

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All through college, I would

buy a bag of potatoes, eat them

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so that I could go buy a shirt.

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Actually, it's

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Catherine Collins: pretty good.

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It's better than most people

who would just buy both.

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Um, so I.

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My like biggest thing as a mom is yes,

you know, love my children, but I view

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like my job as their mom is to prepare

them to be independent human beings.

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And now, because I am a single parent

to them, um, after getting divorced,

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even more so I am like very heavy on.

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anything that creates

independence in them.

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And once I learn how to do something,

I don't do it for them again.

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Um, so I do the very controversial

thing of paying my kids for chores.

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But when my kids go out with their

friends, when they walk to town and get

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an ice cream, if they want to get a slice

of pizza, if they want to get a t shirt.

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They buy it.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah.

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Catherine Collins: Now I'll buy back

to school stuff, you know, birthday's

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Christmas, but I am not the mom that's

taking them through target and say,

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Oh my God, this shirt's so cute.

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Oh my God, I got to get this for you.

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I don't do any of that.

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And so they have the

ability to earn money.

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They earn money from doing just about

every chore there is in the house.

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And they get money from reading books.

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I'll pay them 10 for a nice

big, thick chapter book.

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And everyone's like, Oh my God,

I can't believe you do that.

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Are you kidding?

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They're reading a big, thick chapter

book and they're not on their iPads.

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But I do it.

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And I kind of like overdo it

because of the things that they're

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required to buy on their own.

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And my son, 10 years old, 18 months, he

saved, he saved for a PlayStation five.

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That's funny.

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500 video game console.

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I can't tell you how many

times I wanted to pat it.

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I wanted to like give

it to him for Christmas.

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Like there was a sad little, he's

got these giant brown eyes, this

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sad little puppy dog, like all

I want for Christmas is a PS5.

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I just want one thing on the list.

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And I'm like,

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the confidence he got from buying it

himself, which he did in March after

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Christmas, he turned 10 and so he

finally got, you know, the grandparent

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birthday money that topped it off

and it's his, he bought it and Before

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that he was buying Pokemon cards

like they were going out of style.

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Yeah.

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He had to make the choice.

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What do I want more?

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And that's sort of my

way of preparing them.

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I do this in every single way.

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Like even when we go to the airport

at 10, I just kind of stand there

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and I'm like, Where do we go?

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Where's the security line?

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What signs do you see?

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I'm like, you know, I'm like,

okay, what's our gate number?

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How do you find out?

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Okay.

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Where are we?

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You know?

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And so I, I'm just, I just kind of like

let them lead and let them, I try to

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make them as independent as possible.

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And, and I think we talk about money a

ton, like maybe we should talk about other

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things, but that's just what they get.

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Like, you know, if they're, if I

was a plumber, they would just hear

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about, you know, plumbing all day.

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So that's just what they

get with me and my job.

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Um, But I think you don't have to

take it to that extreme, but I think

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that giving your kids the tools to

make the decisions on their own is

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really important because it allows

them to make mistakes on their own.

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It allows them to buy something really

cheap at Claire's and have their neck

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necklace break and be devastated.

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And it allows you to have

conversations of like, well, we

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can bring it back to the store.

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We can get your money back or we can

say, we're not going to shop there.

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Like it lets you have So

many conversations around it.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah.

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Okay.

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So Kat, I'm so impressed.

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And I want you to know that that's amazing

that you do that because I'm a cobbler.

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I want to make everything perfect.

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And you talked about

your son, like my son.

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Oh my gosh.

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Those little boys, they get.

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Yeah,

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Catherine Collins: it

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Lesa Koski: is hard,

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Catherine Collins: but

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Lesa Koski: it's so much so

that, but I think, and I want

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to say something interesting.

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I think there's a difference between

my adult kids and that little one,

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something changed, but I mean,

something changed, um, And how they

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respond to things or in this world.

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And I can't put a finger on what it is,

but so my adult kids, I coddled them.

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I wanted to fix everything.

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I've had conversations with them.

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Like, okay, you know what guys,

you got to feel bad sometimes.

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Sorry.

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I, you know, so we talk about it now

because I wanted to fix everything.

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Catherine Collins: But

that's so millennial parents.

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We were like, feel your feelings.

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But our parents were like, get over it.

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Well, mine was like, get over it.

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But I was like, let

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Lesa Koski: me fix

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Catherine Collins: this for you.

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So you don't feel bad.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah.

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So just, well, I mean, yeah, yeah, but

it wasn't about making them independent.

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But the good thing was, was those, those

older ones seem like in the time that

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they were raised, that they just got jobs.

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They just paid for things on

their own and they're making it.

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They're amazing.

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They're families.

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Now my younger one, I probably

should have been better, but

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I mean, she's awesome too.

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And she's been, she's

kind of an entrepreneur.

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She, instead of getting a job, like

started a, you know, a business

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of taking care of dogs for people.

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And

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Catherine Collins: awesome.

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Lesa Koski: Awesome.

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Awesome.

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But I, and she's independent, but

she kind of had to fight me on it.

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It's interesting.

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You know, like, I can go to the

airport by myself and now she goes

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to college, you know, states away.

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We have to fly to see her.

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Um, but I don't know.

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I don't know why they turned out, but

I wish I could have done a little bit

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more about what you're talking about.

399

There's probably a good balance

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Catherine Collins: in there.

401

Like I said, I probably, Probably

402

Lesa Koski: take it too far sometimes.

403

I don't think so.

404

Well, so I just think maybe

it was just all those prayers.

405

So that's another thing.

406

If you feel like you're

screwed up, just pray about it.

407

It will be taken care of.

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Exactly.

409

Yeah.

410

So I love that.

411

And I think that that is a

wonderful way to teach them.

412

And I have noticed that with my daughter,

because there was a while when she

413

would, um, just be spending all the

time, every little thing she got.

414

And then suddenly she went,

Oh, This isn't lasting.

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Do I really want 5, 000

Goodwill sweatshirts or do

416

I want to save for a Kindle?

417

And so she is figuring that out, but

I think if you can help them so that

418

they don't, you know, the earlier,

probably the better and the healthier,

419

you can talk about it so that it

doesn't have to be something anyone's

420

afraid of something that feels icky.

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It just is what it is.

422

Catherine Collins: Yeah, for sure.

423

I think just all the taboo topics

that parents, the more we can talk

424

to our kids about it, the better.

425

And it sounds like your

kids turned out amazing.

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Thank God.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah.

428

Thank God.

429

So Catherine, I, our time is up

430

Catherine Collins: and I

431

Lesa Koski: just want you to know,

I have loved chatting with you.

432

I think I might have to have you on

again, happy to, to talk about some other

433

topics and um, one that I can think of is.

434

I don't know, kind of those women

who are more like my age and

435

menopausal and how they're doing

through the money, money situation

436

and feeling good about themselves.

437

So that's for another time, but I want to

thank you from the bottom of my heart for

438

taking the time to be on both podcasts.

439

You're just a doll.

440

My pleasure.

441

Thank you so much.

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I have loved getting to know you.

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Same here.

444

Thank you so much for having me.

445

I really appreciate it.

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Catherine Collins: Thanks for being here.

447

You take good care.

448

You too.

449

Thank you.

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Bye.