What do you get if you combine data science, coaching and a team?
A happy team coached by Giannis Chatzidis.
Giannis is a Data Scientist. Team Leader. And a Coach.
He found purpose and joy in merging tech and coaching to help people reach their full potential.
He shares his journey and process in our conversation.
All started when I was like a leader in my team.
Giannis:I've been leading the last five or six years.
Giannis:Multicultural teams, if that makes sense in general, because the companies that
Giannis:I work on is usually in the Netherlands, located, and through this leadership
Giannis:journey and my one to ones with my team members I found them so viable, not
Giannis:only for me, but especially for them.
Giannis:I got a lot of energy out of them, meaning that the days that I had
Giannis:one to ones with my teams was like probably the best days of the week.
Giannis:This is how I was super eager to enhance the outcome of the one to ones and
Giannis:everything around it, the questions to make it more interactive, et cetera.
Giannis:And this is how I met coaching, so I was starting searching about ways to
Giannis:optimize those sessions, et cetera.
Giannis:And 18 months ago, I started my coaching school.
Giannis:So now I'm a certified team coach specializing in teams
Giannis:and leadership mostly.
Giannis:I'm still a lead data scientist and the combination of two is like
Giannis:inside my coaching sessions, I use a lot of AI and tech tools.
Giannis:To make the whole session more interactive, more fun less boring.
Giannis:Let's say, this is the power of Coach Tech, I call it.
Giannis:And this is how, I use it inside
Rob:my sessions.
Giannis:The hot
Rob:trend.
Rob:Yeah, I bet it is.
Giannis:I'm still working as a lead data scientist.
Giannis:It's part time and I'm transitioning to a full time team coach
Rob:so as a data scientist, I'm guessing that you look for patterns and
Rob:you try to connect the dots on data.
Rob:And then you've translated that into doing that with people.
Giannis:Numbers and data always tell the truth.
Giannis:Data scientist is mostly about, creating AI applications, products, et cetera,
Giannis:around around data just to support people.
Giannis:And this is how it goes with the coaching part.
Giannis:You just collect the data inside the session, like some prompts
Giannis:or let's say the main pain point that the coachee or the team has.
Giannis:I'm trying to translate those data into an image.
Giannis:Or into an application or, to reflect their words themselves, like an image
Giannis:or like a poem generated by AI or, something that, they will see their
Giannis:problem and they will face it immediately.
Giannis:Because sometimes we have a challenge, but we cannot visualize it.
Giannis:We cannot, let's say, dreaming of this challenge, but if we see an
Giannis:image and we see ourselves inside an image or inside a written poem or
Giannis:something usually it's more easy to do some reflections and to come to
Rob:an action.
Rob:So what you're really trying to do is speak to someone in the language
Rob:that they're going to receive best.
Rob:So whether that's an image or whether that's a poem or, whatever this is really
Rob:interesting because something I've been thinking about recently is, the difference
Rob:between maths and English and where I've noticed a lot of people struggle.
Rob:Like my daughters really struggle with maths and I think where people
Rob:struggle with maths is because they don't realize it's a different language.
Rob:In English you'd say something in it and it will be rich language and it'll
Rob:be a story because it's got a hero.
Rob:It's got a context and it's very concrete so someone can get to grips with it.
Rob:But in maths an equation is.
Rob:The purest is only the truth and only the universal and
Rob:everything else is taken out.
Rob:And so it describes the same thing, but it's applicable in every context because
Rob:as soon as it's not applicable in the context, the equation is no longer true.
Rob:That's interesting.
Rob:And then some people are artistic, some people are creative and
Rob:you have to meet people with.
Rob:Whatever speaks to them.
Rob:Yeah, so that makes sense.
Giannis:It's mostly to speak the coachee's language.
Giannis:Probably, a simple prompt by a coachee is I really want to stress less.
Giannis:Okay, what makes you stressed?
Giannis:What's make it so important for you or something and based on the answers They
Giannis:can create an image, let's say, Rob, who is, let's say, really stressed and how
Giannis:Rob imagines his situation when he's not stressed, And you reflect in two images,
Giannis:for example, Rob is stressed, Rob is not stressed And reflect those images to
Giannis:the coachee and ask a lot of questions.
Giannis:Or how do you think, what do you see inside these images?
Giannis:How would you like to see yourself when you're not stressed or something?
Giannis:Those really simple questions where the coachee, okay sees two images, he's
Giannis:really impressed and dive deeper inside the first image was super stressed.
Giannis:But he would like to go to the second phase, which like take some
Giannis:actions and not get stressed anymore or something, or get less stressed.
Giannis:This is how it goes in terms of where you are and where you would like to go.
Giannis:So it's two stages where, it's in coaching, it's still
Giannis:important to to measure the outcome that you want to achieve.
Giannis:This is how it goes.
Giannis:You are, let's say in five and you would like to go in eight.
Giannis:Okay.
Giannis:What's the difference between five and eight?
Giannis:What actions, let's say can fulfilled this gap.
Rob:When you initially took started doing one to ones, did you have the
Rob:same enthusiasm for them or is it, was it a process that you had to learn?
Rob:I was super enthusiastic.
Rob:Right from the start?
Rob:Yeah,
Giannis:I was from the start.
Giannis:Yeah, because it was like a time not for me and someone else.
Giannis:It was a time for my team members to speak out.
Giannis:And this is super important for someone working, let's say, in 9 5.
Giannis:To have, let's say, a stage and a microphone where the stage belongs
Giannis:to them and they have the opportunity to speak out, to say things about
Giannis:professionally, but also personally.
Giannis:This connection between a leader and a member is for me, super special
Giannis:because at the end of the day, it's a human connection, right?
Giannis:Leadership is a human connection.
Giannis:So building this human connection and, have a thriving human
Giannis:connection with your team members.
Giannis:For me, it's super important because this is how you are able
Giannis:to get the best out of every
Rob:member.
Rob:And that was all remote, because you said the rest of your
Rob:team are in the Netherlands.
Giannis:We're around the world, actually.
Giannis:It's some Netherlands, in Greece Africa, UK.
Giannis:Yeah, around the world.
Rob:So that was naturally something that you enjoyed and then that
Rob:became your favorite part of the day.
Rob:How did you then go from that into coaching?
Giannis:I was searching for ways to optimize these sessions.
Giannis:Initially I was watching a lot of YouTube videos about other coaches or how to
Giannis:enhance your 1:1 with your team members.
Giannis:How to create a safe environment with your team members through your one on
Giannis:ones, what the best questions, et cetera.
Giannis:I realized that this is my inner piece of puzzle that was always missing.
Giannis:I always wanted to support and help people.
Giannis:To get the best out of them, and yeah, I was searching about, how go, let's say in
Giannis:mentorship, in coaching, in consulting, in advising or something like that.
Giannis:And finally I realized after analyzing all of this super detailed aspects
Giannis:because the difference between, coaching, consulting, and mentorship is
Giannis:small details, but big the same time.
Giannis:I realized that coaching is the one that fits to my personality, to my
Giannis:way of supporting the other people.
Giannis:And this is how I went to coaching school.
Rob:When you saw that, that it fit with your personality, I'm guessing that
Rob:there were examples of that when you were younger in life, where that kind
Rob:of coaching mentality, that bringing out the best in others was did you
Rob:have younger brothers and sisters?
Rob:Was there examples of where you were put in that
Giannis:role?
Giannis:Yeah great question, when I was 17, I wanted to be a
Giannis:dentist or a doctor in general.
Giannis:So behind of this was like my willingness to support people and
Giannis:to have a special impact to people.
Giannis:I failed twice and finally studied AI, computer science, et
Giannis:cetera, with a master's degree.
Giannis:With the vision to combine health with data again.
Giannis:So health was like super important for me.
Giannis:And after that inside my one to ones I started I started getting
Giannis:a lot of attention to the mental health of employees and this is
Giannis:how this eagerness, did spark.
Giannis:And always, I'm a guy that I hate advices.
Giannis:I don't really like to give.
Giannis:Advices unless it's super important for the receiver.
Giannis:So you come to me and say, okay, give me an advice, heads up or something.
Giannis:So if it's not your final goal I'm not giving advices.
Giannis:I'm just asking questions to help you to find your own solution, your
Giannis:best action for you, let's say, and not the best action for me.
Giannis:Because the best action for me is not always the best action for someone
Rob:else.
Rob:What did you learn most from the coaching process?
Giannis:Yeah, a lot.
Giannis:First is to cultivate a safe and trust environment where everyone is able to
Giannis:share without feeling any judgment or feeling, let's say that everything is
Giannis:going to get in public or something or any gossip, intuitions, et cetera.
Giannis:So to build a safe and trust environment, this also applies in leadership as well.
Giannis:And the second is show empathy and compassion because there
Giannis:are two different things.
Giannis:And yeah, I think you should show empathy as a coach, as well as a leader.
Giannis:And it's really important to put yourself in other shoes, but not being Giannis.
Giannis:Being Rob, so I cannot wear your shoes like being Giannis because I'm going
Giannis:to give you advice like Giannis, right?
Giannis:But I have to wear your shoes and have your own way of thinking,
Giannis:your own way of acting, reacting.
Giannis:Your data of your environment.
Giannis:This is how I can understand how you feel and how you want to act you know.
Giannis:And the third one is The Q& A part.
Giannis:I really feel the Q& A the question answer part.
Giannis:A really typical question is like, where would you do if you were me?
Giannis:Every time that we are in, let's say, in a friend zone or something,
Giannis:or in a friendship relationship or in a love relationship or something.
Giannis:The first question that we ask, okay, I have this issue, where
Giannis:would you do if you were me?
Giannis:And people usually because they are busy or they want fast advice
Giannis:and ready advice or something, they want to hear what we do.
Giannis:The only thing that I learned is like asking questions.
Giannis:and deep questions and dig deeper inside, the main challenge that the other person
Giannis:has is the way to move forward is the way to take some action and not just tell
Giannis:something and that's the end of the story.
Giannis:No, this is not the end of the story because the story has a lot
Giannis:of aspects, you have to dig deeper.
Giannis:The deeper you go, the better, in order to find how the other person feels,
Giannis:acts understands a lot of situation around in the environment, et cetera.
Giannis:Yeah, I think those are the three things that I learned.
Giannis:Of course, there are much more, but I think those are the.
Rob:The best.
Rob:I heard once if someone's coming to you about something that you
Rob:know a lot more about than them.
Rob:When they ask a question, you should always challenge the context,
Rob:rather than answer the question.
Rob:If someone's new to a topic, they don't generally know enough
Rob:to ask the right question.
Rob:Often the question someone asks shows the level of knowledge that they have
Rob:and it's usually the wrong question.
Rob:If someone's new to a topic, they'll ask a beginner's question.
Rob:Whereas someone who's say an expert, they'll look at the same question and
Rob:say you're asking the wrong question.
Rob:We can often get in the trap of answering people's questions when often what
Rob:we really need to do is challenge the context in which the question was asked.
Giannis:Also, I think it's super important.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:How do you set to challenge the other person?
Giannis:Okay.
Giannis:I have a vision about, becoming a top team coach, let's say, for example,
Giannis:okay, but let's challenge this my vision and my mission, what makes you
Giannis:super driven of being a team coach?
Giannis:What, how is it going to happen if you don't become a team coach?
Giannis:It's a lot of, there are a lot of challenging questions and aspects.
Giannis:Through a vision, a mission or an action or something.
Giannis:And the super important thing as well is to not listen to what is being said,
Giannis:but listening to what is not being said.
Giannis:The underwaters, it's something like you feel that, Giannis
Giannis:has a procrastination feeling.
Giannis:Okay, just breaking the surface, what does procrastination mean to you?
Giannis:Let's say, what's how does it affect your daily life?
Giannis:It's what is not being said most of the times more important than what's said.
Giannis:And same in leadership.
Giannis:And a team was not where nobody speaks out.
Giannis:It's not a high performing team.
Giannis:It's the other way
Rob:around.
Rob:Very true.
Rob:So that makes me question what has been the biggest impact for you?
Rob:In your journey on you personally,
Giannis:The biggest impact in my journey as a leader or in my journey as a coach.
Giannis:In both.
Giannis:In both.
Giannis:Okay.
Giannis:In my journey as a leader the biggest impact to myself.
Giannis:Yeah, tough question, I think.
Giannis:The way that I see my team members growing, this is what makes me
Giannis:super happy and super motivated.
Giannis:And not only inside the company, but outside the company, their personal lives,
Giannis:where, when I see them, changing habits.
Giannis:Changing their characters, their way of communicating, acting, et cetera.
Giannis:This is something, makes me super proud of them.
Giannis:At the end of the day, this is what they want, because every time that
Giannis:they hire someone I don't really care if they're super tech skilled
Giannis:or they know how to write perfect code or something, or my goal is not.
Giannis:After the six months period, let's say it was a probation period to
Giannis:be, let's say, better in coding or in AI, but to be better persons,
Giannis:specifically us as individuals.
Giannis:When I get messages from my old team members, I go to this new
Giannis:job or, I go this interview and I'm super happy and everything
Giannis:started from you, blah, blah, blah.
Giannis:I'm super grateful for, and I'm super proud of them, and yeah, I
Giannis:think this is the the impact that I always wanted to help the people.
Giannis:And when I have it, I'm, yeah, this is it.
Giannis:I'm super fulfilled, and from the coaching part, I think more or less.
Giannis:It's the same, when I see transformation to someone, so for example, I had
Giannis:recently a team coaching session here in Greece and after 90 minutes, the
Giannis:whole team finalized to an action to have a meeting once a month altogether
Giannis:without the leader and we'll discuss their problems, their challenges, their
Giannis:priorities, their vision, everything.
Giannis:When they found this action, which was like it sounds super easy, right?
Giannis:But for them, it wasn't because we've been there, let's say for 90 minutes
Giannis:and talking, discussing trying to optimizing the approach, et cetera.
Giannis:And when they found it, I saw nine faces, super smiley.
Giannis:And that was the moment that I said, yeah, you did some, something right.
Giannis:I don't know if I did everything right, but you did something right.
Giannis:And that was the aha moment, let's say from the session that not only made
Giannis:them happy and smiley, but made me super smiley inside my heart, soul,
Rob:et cetera.
Rob:So there's clearly that's to do with your purpose.
Rob:So what is that tapping into in you?
Rob:That's the thing that brings you purpose.
Rob:That's makes you feel fulfilled.
Rob:What you do for them is you make them happy.
Rob:And what is that activating something in you?
Rob:Are you aware of what that is?
Giannis:Yeah, at the end of the day, every team and every leader wants to
Giannis:be more productive, more high performer to bring more results, et cetera.
Giannis:And also this is my goal.
Giannis:In every session, so to yeah, to have, to be a better version
Giannis:of themselves in general.
Rob:So I have this theory that everything we do comes down to about,
Rob:probably about eight to 10 currencies.
Rob:It's recognition, it's care it's love, it's respect.
Rob:So I'm guessing for you it's feeling valued.
Giannis:Feeling valued.
Giannis:Do you mean to me or to
Rob:others?
Rob:I think it's about value as in you providing value and feeling that
Rob:you're being a personal value.
Giannis:It's mostly about unlocking what is really hidden in your personality
Giannis:and helping you to see what's unfolded.
Rob:So it's a chef who has a certain set of ingredients.
Rob:They can bring a recipe that makes a higher or less lower value meal.
Rob:My interpretation is that you like being valuable as in producing
Rob:value and unlocking value in people.
Giannis:I think it is.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:It sounds simple.
Giannis:It sounds simple.
Rob:I think people are simple.
Rob:I think there's only a few motivations people have.
Rob:But we cloud it . We often feel that we shouldn't have that.
Rob:And we feel that we have to present some noble intention.
Rob:If you talk to people about why they do what they do,
Rob:they'll talk to you with logic.
Rob:And when they talk with logic, it's not really what they're talking about.
Rob:They're talking about the rationale that they've given that they feel is
Rob:acceptable, but it doesn't, it's not really what excites them inside them.
Giannis:For me, leadership is, should be emotional.
Giannis:It should be driven by emotions.
Giannis:Of course, there are a lot of times when you have to balance both.
Giannis:Rational decisions, emotional decisions, etc.
Giannis:But yeah, for me, leadership, because it's like a human to human
Giannis:relationship, it should start by, understanding the other person's
Giannis:emotions and how the other person feels.
Giannis:In general, and the same applies in everything, in every lesson, it's okay,
Giannis:and I totally agree with what you said, it's like people, the first thought
Giannis:is like the rational one about what, it's acceptable by the society usually.
Giannis:And what is like matching with the society believes actually.
Giannis:And after that, you know what, when they start triggering themselves,
Giannis:they will find something else that probably they're against this opinion.
Giannis:Or they have, another opinion about that.
Giannis:And this is what coaching actually does, bring to the surface, your own beliefs.
Giannis:opinions, et cetera, and try to demolish them, split them in multiple factors and
Giannis:understand, what, who am I actually, who am I at the end of the day as a person,
Giannis:as a leader and where do I want to go.
Giannis:That's my purpose in this life, let's say, in this position or something,
Giannis:I think this is the most important.
Giannis:And I think that my favorite question is just super similar.
Giannis:It's what do you want to do?
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:Two X or something, what they want to become, what I had to do.
Giannis:I want to be or something, it's like mostly four similar words
Giannis:and you have An initial idea and the purpose in your life and
Rob:in your journey,
Rob:it's where all journey start.
Rob:Isn't it?
Rob:What do I want?
Rob:Where am I?
Rob:What do I want?
Rob:How do I get there?
Rob:And it really is that simple.
Rob:The problem I think is a lot of people aren't clear on what they
Rob:want and what they want is going to change as they go along the journey.
Rob:Because when you start, you want this thing and you haven't really
Rob:understood why you want it, but one of those like eight to 10 deep
Rob:currencies, is why you want it.
Rob:And then as you get closer, what you want changes because it wasn't
Rob:really the thing that was just a symbol for what you really wanted.
Giannis:I agree.
Giannis:I agree, but this is a transformation and this is a part of the journey, right?
Giannis:I'm a huge believer that, it would be super viable.
Giannis:For the society, for for the world around, if we were able to change, a profession
Giannis:or a work, let's say every five years.
Giannis:For example, I was a leader.
Giannis:I am a leader.
Giannis:I want to, I really want to become a team coach, a leadership coach.
Giannis:And probably through this journey, I will find something else.
Giannis:And in five years from now, probably I would want to become something different.
Giannis:And as you said, this is the start of the journey during this journey, probably
Giannis:you will find something else, something more fascinating that, brings you
Giannis:closer to your full potential, because I don't think that when I will be,
Giannis:let's say 80 or 75 or something really older, I will be to my full potential.
Giannis:I feel it's impossible, but every day or every year I want to be closer to it.
Giannis:And this is how it goes to everyone.
Giannis:It's not to find it, let's say in the next month or after two
Giannis:sessions or after three sessions.
Giannis:It's about get closer
Rob:to it.
Rob:Being quite a bit older than you I'm about 30 years in now.
Rob:1993 I opened up a gym, so I trained in fitness.
Rob:I then trained as a nutritionist.
Rob:So I think it was about 1994 when I probably started
Rob:training as a nutritionist.
Rob:So I had fitness and I had nutrition and I barely used my nutrition qualification
Rob:because I thought, what was the point?
Rob:You write people diet plans and exercise plans and they do it for a
Rob:little while and then they never stick.
Rob:I went more into why don't people stick?
Rob:So then I trained in therapy and I ended up instead of selling gym
Rob:memberships, doing therapy, but to try and get to, cause I had a similar
Rob:kind of purpose and wanting to see people be the most that they could be,
Rob:I'm wanting to see people be happy.
Rob:I did.
Rob:Therapy, went into stress, motivation.
Rob:Then I went back to uni studied psychology.
Rob:And everyone in psychology was looking at mental health or criminology or alcoholism
Rob:or addiction or something like that.
Rob:And I was like, Freud said something that if all we do is look at problems, all
Rob:we do is make people moderately unhappy.
Rob:And I thought we want to look at.
Rob:We need to have somewhere to lead people.
Rob:I learned that happiness and I was quite lucky that it was when Marty Seligman was
Rob:first coming out with authentic happiness.
Rob:It was around the time when Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi.
Rob:I can't pronounce his name, but when he came out with a concept of flow, and
Rob:because before then all they'd been was like a study in the fifties, I can't
Rob:even remember his name of optimal living.
Rob:So there was very little information.
Rob:That's when I got into coaching back in the early days.
Rob:I don't know if you know of Thomas Leonard.
Rob:I learned from him after he'd left the ICF, he wasn't happy with what it became
Rob:and then he was set up his own thing.
Rob:I saw what him and I was like, you're a genius, but I'm not that's not my style.
Rob:It doesn't fit with my.
Rob:I never identified in that same way as a coach.
Rob:I just saw it as a useful tool to have.
Rob:But I never felt like I embodied it.
Rob:I never felt it was.
Rob:I always felt like I wanted to know something and be able
Rob:to pass on that knowledge.
Rob:And coaching is a way that is able able to meet people where they are,
Rob:but it's not it's part of, like it's, I just took it as a tool.
Rob:Then I realized the real problem that people had was relationships, which then
Rob:led me to conflict, which then I went into mediation and realized it was teams.
Rob:I would say.
Rob:There's always been a constant throughout what I've done and I think there's a
Rob:constant in yours, in that it was one to ones and then it became coaching.
Rob:I think there's a theme that runs through our life and I think our
Rob:theme is probably set by what we feel is important, maybe in childhood.
Rob:That's some significant experience.
Rob:And from then we're.
Rob:We look at different contexts, different ways of delivering it.
Rob:But I think that there's a constant in us.
Rob:Say for you, that constant seems to be about maximizing potential or
Rob:yeah, unlocking potential or helping people because even if you look
Rob:at health, health is about helping people be at their best, isn't it?
Rob:I went fitness, nutrition, that's how you help people be at their best,
Rob:whereas you can't because they don't stick to it, so what's the point?
Rob:So I went into the mind more, which fitted more for me.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:That's an incredible journey.
Giannis:And, I just have to say that I really admire and appreciate people like you
Giannis:when, and I think this is your example is a great example about, starting
Giannis:from something I thought it was viable.
Giannis:And it's viable still because I think nutrition is like a part of
Giannis:our being and our well being, etc.
Giannis:But after that you just dig deeper and deeper until you found, what you are
Giannis:passionate about at the moment, because probably in five years or in 10 years
Giannis:from now, you will find something else.
Giannis:Probably you will go to neuropsychology or I don't know what comes later.
Rob:It's also I think I have a deep sensitivity to failure.
Rob:And there's something like when you're in a kind of a relationship therapist, coach,
Rob:mediator, whatever there's, you have to you have to be able to detach yourself
Rob:from someone else's results because otherwise you're trying to influence them.
Rob:So you have to not care.
Rob:You care while letting them hold direction.
Rob:And I think I, I just found to work in nutrition, I would find that soul
Rob:destroying where basically maybe if you're lucky one in 10 follows
Rob:what you do, because especially I tend to go into things and I'm
Rob:want to really understand it.
Rob:And I'm like, okay, this is the absolute best.
Rob:Nutrition is so complex and it's so demanding of people because
Rob:the food supply that they have by default isn't very healthy.
Rob:So you have to spend money on nutrition.
Rob:You have to spend money on more food so that everything weighted against you.
Rob:And.
Rob:I don't think I could turn up every day to work and feel this doesn't work.
Rob:Not like I, yeah, I can have pride in I've got an understanding and I can give you
Rob:the best advice, but if no one takes it.
Rob:It doesn't feel like you're making any value.
Rob:I suppose it depends on how resilient you are, because some people really
Rob:have a belief and they'll pursue that nutrition, even when people
Rob:aren't getting results, not because of the fault of the nutritionist, but
Rob:because they just don't stick to it.
Rob:I suppose I'm detached from people like you can do what you want to do.
Rob:I need to have enough ratio that enough people succeed.
Rob:So I've always looked at it's like pushing the problem away.
Rob:The problems there.
Rob:How do I make the problem more and more minor by solving more and more problems?
Rob:So I don't know how you've handled that in your.
Rob:Journey, like how do you deal with maybe the term is not coachable
Rob:or people who don't want to take advice or don't want to do what it
Rob:takes to change their situation.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:I think the word is coachable.
Giannis:I'm not going to help or support someone who is not coachable, meaning that
Giannis:if you don't want to change or if you don't want to take your leap of faith.
Giannis:To take the next step or to start something.
Giannis:I'm not the best guy for you.
Giannis:I really want to work on with visionaries, bold people, change makers, people who
Giannis:are, let's say, super eager to take the next step, to get the next step.
Giannis:I usually say it's like detach from the results and attach to the process.
Rob:Detach from the results, but attach to the process.
Rob:Yeah.
Rob:Yeah.
Giannis:This is how I always say to my clients and to the teams.
Giannis:It's not about, being 10 percent more productive on your daily base.
Giannis:It's take the necessary steps and actions.
Giannis:To become 10 percent more productive and the productivity will come somehow.
Giannis:With some magic way, so it's not about, what you want to achieve, but it's
Giannis:about how you're going to achieve it.
Giannis:And yeah, I think from my side, it's.
Giannis:It's almost the same.
Giannis:So I really believe in people's potential.
Giannis:I really believe in your potential, but firstly, you have
Giannis:to believe in your potential.
Giannis:I'm not going to tell you how to believe in your potential.
Giannis:If you want to start believing your potential, yes.
Giannis:Come to me because you have a vision, to start believing in yourself.
Giannis:Start leading yourself better.
Giannis:This is how it goes.
Giannis:Because you want something.
Giannis:But if you don't want anything
Giannis:You are not the best guy for me Or I'm not the best guy for you, try to find
Giannis:someone else Who is eager to give you some advice Or probably, fit your,
Giannis:in your personality or doesn't fit in your personality, but please don't come
Giannis:crying back to me and saying, okay, I gave X amount of dollars and money.
Giannis:This advice doesn't fit my personality.
Giannis:And what should they do now?
Giannis:I don't know.
Giannis:I'm not, an advisor or a guy who's going to tell you what to do.
Giannis:I'm a guy who's going to help you to tell yourself what to
Rob:do.
Rob:In my experience with in relationships, for example there was a great need and
Rob:a great market for people who had come out of a narcissistic relationship.
Rob:And, but the difficulty is they are so traumatized.
Rob:That it takes a really sensitive approach because they have a lack of belief and
Rob:they're not in a place to be challenged.
Rob:And there's a lot of people that need someone else to believe in them before
Rob:they, they believe in themselves.
Rob:A lot of people that have come from maybe an environment where
Rob:no one's believed in them.
Rob:Where, what you're looking for and your style is for the high flyer, the
Rob:visionary, someone who wants to change something who's already had some success.
Rob:So how would you define your ideal client and what are they
Rob:grappling with at the moment?
Giannis:As I said before, visionary, change maker, bold people leaders,
Giannis:founders who really who are the team.
Giannis:People centric mostly, and they really believe that people can make
Giannis:a difference inside their company.
Giannis:And this is how they're going to be more profitable and they're going to
Giannis:have more clients and more clients results at the end of the day.
Giannis:Because what every company wants is like to me to be more profitable, to
Giannis:have a bigger bank account to be, let's say, cash flow positive, et cetera.
Giannis:But you really have to believe in your most viable asset, which is your
Giannis:people and together with your clients.
Giannis:Because if you ask me, I would say both are super important for the
Giannis:thriving company clients and team.
Giannis:You should focus on both in order to have a thriving company and to
Giannis:find the right balance between them.
Giannis:But yeah, I totally agree with your previous statement about some,
Giannis:in some cases we have some people who, nobody believed in them and
Giannis:they want some support on that.
Giannis:To be honest, I don't know if these people want coaching or therapy.
Giannis:Yeah, I think this is a great dilemma.
Giannis:this is also a situation because.
Giannis:If nobody believed in you in the past, and you have this this habit and this limiting
Giannis:belief that I'm suck and I cannot find my inner fulfillment, et cetera, because
Giannis:I'm, I'd say I'm a failure or something.
Giannis:And this is something that I heard a lot and in life coaching mostly.
Giannis:I think for these people, in my opinion, it's like a combination of therapy
Giannis:coaching is the best because therapy, that better for me, I'm not a therapist
Giannis:or a psychologist or something, usually addresses the past and the present
Giannis:while coaching goes present and future.
Giannis:I think a combination of both for these people is.
Giannis:is the best.
Giannis:Of course, as coaches, we are going to give, let's say, a hand to these
Giannis:people, okay, to rise them up.
Giannis:But as a coach, it's like we're not here to study their past.
Giannis:We're here to design their future.
Rob:When you look at therapy you can look at all the different
Rob:schools of therapy and they're pretty much have a similar, Success rate.
Rob:What makes the success isn't the school of therapy.
Rob:It's the warmth of the therapist is how trusting the bond this how safe
Rob:the space the therapist can make and I suppose that's the same in coaching.
Rob:In order to change because it's so inherently stressful and because
Rob:it's so cognitively demanding and emotionally demanding.
Rob:We need that space is like a refuge.
Rob:If we go out and we take risks, we need somewhere safe, which is part of the value
Rob:of a relationship is that a relationship is means that you have someone that
Rob:has your back no matter what, like a romantic relationship, you have someone
Rob:that's got your back no matter what.
Rob:So you can go out and take risks in the world because you've
Rob:got someone to cover for you.
Rob:And I think that's what coaching does.
Rob:And I think that's what therapy does.
Rob:I think therapy has its place, but I also think it overspreads.
Rob:I think a lot of people will go to a lot of therapists who are schooled in a
Rob:certain thought of therapy and they'll frame everything in that thought,
Rob:whether it's, it happened from your childhood or it happened because of these
Rob:different parts or it happened because of, whatever kind of therapy, and often
Rob:all they're doing is giving a story.
Rob:And people can either become trapped in the story or they can go round and round.
Rob:So they spend years telling different stories and seeing different therapies
Rob:and getting different stories, but never actually changing what happens.
Rob:I think you have to look at all of these things as tools.
Rob:And I think we look at the big currency is we want.
Rob:Like you and I want to help people make, we want to be of value to people.
Rob:We want to see people thrive and optimize.
Rob:And I, so I think the key is you have to look at what's their framework?
Rob:What's their mentality of how are they thinking?
Rob:What's the barrier?
Rob:What's the block and what's the best way of getting over that?
Rob:And for some people that will be therapy.
Rob:For some people that will be coaching, for some people that will be mentoring
Rob:mediation or facilitation or whatever.
Rob:I think all of them are tools.
Rob:Depending on the personality, depending on the situation they can all be used.
Rob:But the main thing is they have to empower someone.
Rob:They have to make someone.
Rob:Take responsibility and help someone see how they can do
Rob:better, be better, feel better.
Rob:Yeah,
Giannis:exactly.
Giannis:Exactly.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:It is the final goal for everyone, right?
Giannis:Because everyone is like a different beast.
Giannis:And from what we said before, and I think for everyone, everyone has the
Giannis:same goal to, to see people change something, to see people grow, see people,
Giannis:have more value and empower people.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:I think it's mostly to find what, who beast fits better to your personality
Giannis:and to what you want to be and carry on.
Giannis:I have a motto saying every coach should have another coach, a therapist.
Giannis:And the supervision, and I have a therapist, I have a life
Giannis:coach, it's because I am a coach.
Giannis:I can manage my own priorities, challenges, issues, it's, yeah, it's
Giannis:not possible because Sometimes I did that from, I did that to the results
Giannis:and this is a trap, so it's impossible to, to every time to say to do what
Giannis:you say and to do what you believe.
Giannis:I totally believe I have to go detach from the results, but there are
Giannis:also some times where I chase the next dopamine hit, it's it's all of
Giannis:this like a huge journey about work.
Giannis:It's about getting closer to your full potential and if you have people around
Giannis:you, helping you get closer to that, I think you are on the right, right path.
Rob:We all have blind spots.
Rob:People are a closed system and sometimes we need new information
Rob:into that system to open it up.
Rob:One of the things I always think of when there's always like new fads and
Rob:this is the greatest thing and whatever, and I always think 2000 years ago you
Rob:look at you like Jesus, the Buddha, Lao Tzu, people like that they went
Rob:through the same things that everyone who's striving in personal development
Rob:or spirituality or whichever field.
Rob:It's basically the same thing and they didn't necessarily have therapists or
Rob:coaches or something, but they had someone who was there was always their wise elder.
Rob:There was always someone who'd been through it, the
Rob:mentor those kinds of things.
Rob:So I think I attach less significance to the actual label and more to
Rob:the relationship and the key.
Rob:And I think it is.
Rob:In the end, all it is we all need to see beyond we need a fresh set of eyes.
Rob:There's certain things that we can't look at ourself.
Rob:And so I think that's what people like you and I can do is give people a different
Rob:some different either idea or insight or fresh pair of eyes on their situation.
Giannis:Yeah, exactly.
Giannis:And if we look back at the history, we'll see a lot of fortune tellers, probably
Giannis:it was in the mythology, we see Calchas Mopsus, a lot of fortune tellers in the
Giannis:Greek mythology and you know what they did is like they they were looking at
Giannis:the future, this is their charisma, let's say they're unique talent or something.
Giannis:And people back then, they really needed these people.
Giannis:They really had someone to tell them, probably in our imagination
Giannis:is old man with, a white beard or something, and super wise and
Giannis:from experiences, life, et cetera.
Giannis:But everyone wanted someone like him, to support them, to tell some different
Giannis:opinion, a different perspective.
Giannis:To challenge them sometimes, to advise them, it's also fine, if
Giannis:that fits to you and yeah, this is what all of us together do nowadays.
Giannis:We don't have fortune tellers, we don't have Old man with white beard
Giannis:or something, but we have coaches, we have therapists, mentors, consultants,
Giannis:facilitators, whatever they are, and yeah, find what fits to your personality
Giannis:and pick one, start with someone.
Giannis:I think this is how it goes.
Giannis:This is how you get closer to what you want.
Giannis:It's not embarrassing to ask for help.
Giannis:For me, it's like a superpower because personally, I didn't
Giannis:ask for help as a leader.
Giannis:It was a period that I was like, super bad as a leader.
Giannis:And I really I understand it.
Giannis:I understood it after some period and because I couldn't ask for help
Giannis:and it's super bad, not only for me, but for the rest of the team, because
Giannis:everyone is was living in the dark.
Giannis:And I took the decisions.
Giannis:I wanted to control everything.
Giannis:I was like a control freak or something.
Giannis:It's bring everything to the surface.
Giannis:It's this is how it goes.
Giannis:Like you said, I think in one of your posts, like we are like a computer
Giannis:with a lot of history, with a lot of folders that we haven't met yet.
Giannis:We haven't unfolded yet.
Giannis:And it's time to double click, this is it, double click in those folders
Giannis:and see what it is, what is inside.
Giannis:Yeah.
Giannis:It's, it sounds simple.
Giannis:It seems simple, the first step is to start.
Rob:Momentum has great power in it.
Rob:Then just one more question before I let you go.
Rob:You talked about like the old man with the white hair and all of this kind of thing.
Rob:If you look at all the examples from culture, from films, from TV
Rob:shows and things, who would be the character that you see yourself
Rob:like or would like to be like?
Rob:Like to be his old man.
Rob:In your role as a coach and as a leader.
Rob:Developing others.
Rob:Is there a role model you want to be?
Rob:A Yoda or do you wanna be a Gandalf or a Dumbledore or those kind of roles?
Rob:Yeah,
Giannis:yeah.
Giannis:I understand your other question.
Giannis:I always want to be, let's say, really invisible in the room.
Giannis:This is my approach in coaching.
Giannis:So I'm not a centric person.
Giannis:The coach here, the team is the center of the session.
Giannis:I don't want to talk a lot.
Giannis:So it's like silence for me is power.
Giannis:And do you remember the old man from Pocahontas film?
Rob:I've never seen that, but Yeah,
Giannis:I think this is it.
Giannis:It's like an old man sitting at his chair and listening deeply with
Giannis:Empathy and compassion and talks or ask questions whenever it's asked
Rob:for that.
Rob:Okay.
Rob:Yes, that's that's why I saw with you have a noble strength and an ability
Rob:a patience to wait for the result.
Rob:I can see that.
Rob:Okay.
Rob:And if someone wanted to reach out and see if coaching with you would work for
Rob:them where should they get in touch?
Rob:What should they do?
Giannis:LinkedIn is the best way.
Giannis:It's Giannis Chatzidis and you can DM me ask your question, yeah, whatever,
Giannis:my DM is always open, feel free, don't hesitate, it's not embarrassing.
Giannis:It's fine.
Giannis:So yeah, on
Rob:LinkedIn is the best way.
Rob:Thank you.
Rob:Giannis is been fascinating to hear your journey to here.
Rob:What makes you and I'm going to have to go and look at Pocahontas now.
Giannis:Yeah, it was my pleasure.