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Using Enneagram Personality Types to Uncover Your Strengths with Nicole Saunders
Episode 708th December 2021 • This Shit Works • Julie Brown
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We’ve all heard of the Meyers Briggs personality test, you’ve probably taken that test a few times over the course of your career - but have you ever taken an Enneagram test to find out your personality number. The Enneagram shows a range of healthy to unhealthy behaviors that each of the 9 personality types might demonstrate unconsciously. The enneagram number offers a foundation to have a discussion about who we are, why we do the things we do, why we react to things a certain way. Listen in to my discussion with Enneagram coach Nicole Saunders as she breaks down the 9 personality types and how we can use the power of the numbers in our relationships and our careers.

Drink of the Week: No. 8 Cocktail

https://www.seriouseats.com/no-8-cocktail-whitehall-kings-ginger-mezcal-paloma-recipe

This episode is sponsored by Nickerson, a full-service branding, marketing, and PR and communications agency with team members in Boston, LA, Miami, and NYC. https://nickersoncos.com/

Julie Brown:

Website- ​https://juliebrownbd.com/

Instagram- ​https://www.instagram.com/juliebrown_bd/

LinkedIn- ​https://www.linkedin.com/in/julie-brown-b6942817/

Youtube- ​https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIwWVdayM2mYXzR9JNLJ55Q

Facebook- ​https://www.facebook.com/juliebrownbd/

Nicole Saunders

https://saunderssays.com/

Transcripts

Julie:

We've all heard of the Myers-Briggs personality test.

Julie:

You've probably taken that test a few times over the course of

Julie:

your schooling and your career.

Julie:

But have you ever taken an Enneagram test to find out your personality?

Julie:

Number.

Julie:

Welcome to episode 70 of this shit works.

Julie:

I am your host, Julie Brown.

Julie:

And today I am joined by Nicole Saunders to discuss using any grams for business.

Julie:

And self-awareness.

Julie:

This episode is sponsored by Nickerson.

Julie:

A full service, branding, marketing PR and communications agency.

Julie:

With team members in Boston.

Julie:

LA.

Julie:

Miami and New York city.

Julie:

Visit them.

Julie:

At Nickerson C O S.

Julie:

Dot com.

Julie:

I won't lie.

Julie:

Before researching this podcast, I knew nothing about Enneagrams and now.

Julie:

After doing the research on this podcast, I know.

Julie:

Next to nothing about any grams, except that there are nine personality types.

Julie:

In preparation for my conversation with Nicole, I purchased an online

Julie:

Enneagram test, which consisted of 144 pairs of statements.

Julie:

For each pair of statements, you pick the one that most reflects your personality.

Julie:

Some were super easy to answer.

Julie:

I was like, yep.

Julie:

That's me a hundred percent.

Julie:

But some other ones I felt could go either way.

Julie:

And I struggled to pick the one that described me the most.

Julie:

And that was a little frustrating.

Julie:

After I answered the 144 questions.

Julie:

My test results were emailed to me in an eight page document.

Julie:

Which left me with more questions.

Julie:

Then I started with it's like, when you, get your yearly blood work done and

Julie:

the lab sends you back a print out and you look at it and you're like, well,

Julie:

I guess my hemoglobin numbers are good.

Julie:

And Michael Lester all is within acceptable parameters.

Julie:

My iron's looking pretty healthy as well.

Julie:

The numbers are there, but they don't really mean anything

Julie:

to you or at least to me.

Julie:

That is what getting my Enneagram type indicator back was like for me.

Julie:

Apparently within these results lies, powerful information.

Julie:

Corporations small businesses and non-profits around the world are

Julie:

using the Enneagram as a breakthrough approach for leadership development

Julie:

team, building communication skills and emotional intelligence.

Julie:

The ne Ram shows a range of healthy to unhealthy behaviors that each personality

Julie:

type might demonstrate unconsciously.

Julie:

This podcast is all about networking.

Julie:

And knowing your Enneagram can help improve your people

Julie:

skills among other things.

Julie:

This is why I needed to talk to a professional about this.

Julie:

Someone who could break this all down for us.

Julie:

And turn Nicole Saunders, who is a business coach who helps people grow

Julie:

their businesses by tapping into their Enneagram personality type.

Julie:

And it's strengths.

Julie:

. Nicole, welcome to the.

Nicole:

Oh, my God.

Nicole:

That was the best.

Nicole:

I'm like over here, cracking up.

Nicole:

I'm like, I've never heard anybody introduce the.

Nicole:

Enneagram in this way, nor compare it to blood work.

Nicole:

I'm like dying.

Nicole:

This is So far.

Nicole:

And I'm like, no, I had your results in advance.

Nicole:

And I'm like, you know, you're reading that.

Nicole:

I'm like, yup, definitely an eight.

Nicole:

Like I'm also an eight.

Nicole:

So I'm like, I'm just like, this is too funny, too funny.

Julie:

So I'm literally walking into unchartered territory here, and so

Julie:

I'm assuming that for a number of the people who are listening to this

Julie:

podcast, they're all like any of who can you just sort of, what is this

Julie:

Enneagram personality type thing?

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So at the end of the day, it's basically a way to understand the why.

Nicole:

Behind the things that you do.

Nicole:

So why do you act this way?

Nicole:

Why do you come across this way?

Nicole:

Why do people think, for us eight, why do people think we're intimidating and bossy?

Nicole:

Well, and I, we just are that way naturally.

Nicole:

So.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So it's a good way to understand yourself.

Nicole:

And also others.

Nicole:

It's a really good tool for building empathy.

Nicole:

And, there are so many pieces of the Enneagram.

Nicole:

It is so deep.

Nicole:

I'll, I'll try not to go too in depth with it.

Nicole:

We'll try to keep it more basic level,

Julie:

So there's there's nine types is this is like a basic question.

Julie:

Cause I don't know because I got mine back.

Julie:

So for the listeners, I'm an eight, we'll get into that later.

Julie:

The eight is called the challenger and I immediately, it was like for

Julie:

one fucking time in my life, could I just please be like the good person,

Julie:

the person who understands like.

Julie:

And so immediately I was like, oh, eight is probably the worst number.

Julie:

It is one type better than the others.

Nicole:

N no, no, they're all equal playing field.

Nicole:

Right.

Nicole:

So, and, and the funny thing is, I think.

Nicole:

And I talk about this quite a bit is in entrepreneurship.

Nicole:

I think people are like, oh, I need to be a three because that's the best

Nicole:

type, but that's not necessarily true.

Nicole:

I think a lot of people think one threes are best, but two that,

Nicole:

because I'm an entrepreneur and I'm driven and I'll work really hard.

Nicole:

And I'm a workaholic because I like, I.

Nicole:

That I'm a three, but that's not always the case.

Nicole:

We could have similar behaviors.

Nicole:

I'm like eights and threes could have similar behaviors as to why

Nicole:

we're really driven and wildly take fast action and want to work hard.

Nicole:

But.

Nicole:

Eight.

Nicole:

So want to work hard because we don't want to be controlled.

Nicole:

So we all have these drivers behind these core fears, core desires behind the why.

Nicole:

so with eights it's we don't want to be controlled.

Nicole:

We want to be in charge of our own destiny, Tom, whatever.

Nicole:

And So there is no better or worse type.

Nicole:

There's not one that, oh, that's the best type.

Nicole:

We all want to be like this or one that's like it is, I do not want to

Nicole:

be like that type now, personally.

Nicole:

And I probably shouldn't say this, but there are.

Nicole:

Is that when I first heard about them, I was like, oh my God, that is not me.

Nicole:

I would not want to be that like,

Julie:

let's do let's break down the types.

Julie:

So there's nine.

Julie:

So let's start with all right.

Julie:

So type one is called the reformer.

Julie:

What is the reformer?

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So each type has different names and depending on which I'm, which

Nicole:

school of thought you're looking at, they may have different ones.

Nicole:

So.

Nicole:

I may call it a different name.

Nicole:

So the one could be the perfectionist or the reformer.

Nicole:

, and so those are their core desire is they want to be good.

Nicole:

They don't want to be wrong or evil, so they are chasing things to be good.

Nicole:

Things can be black or white for them.

Nicole:

Like there's not, it's hard for them to learn this middle ground thing.

Nicole:

So, and, and I will say, let me preface this too, with I'm

Nicole:

giving you general information.

Nicole:

Now, there are some people that may be really healthy.

Nicole:

I don't do that.

Nicole:

Or people that are like, oh my gosh.

Nicole:

I'm so like, that's me.

Nicole:

It's just because they don't understand, like, you just don't have that.

Nicole:

Self-awareness, haven't went through a growth process yet.

Nicole:

So these are generalized things.

Nicole:

Yeah, yeah,

Julie:

Okay.

Julie:

So we've the reform one, the reformer now on, on the test that I took, I'll

Julie:

give the names at the test that I, took, and then you can say if there's

Julie:

a different imprint to, is the helper.

Nicole:

Yep.

Nicole:

So two is the helper or also known as the giver and they want to be loved and

Nicole:

accepted and they fear being unwanted.

Nicole:

So a lot of times they're doing things because they want love in return.

Nicole:

So I'm going to do this for you.

Nicole:

So you'll love me.

Julie:

Okay.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So, yeah, Right.

Nicole:

Like an a is probably like, oh, that is not me.

Nicole:

I do not do things because I want people to love me.

Nicole:

I don't care if you like me or not.

Julie:

Right.

Julie:

Yes.

Julie:

Yeah.

Julie:

The three is now this was what I was upset about.

Julie:

I looked at the names before I, before I did, and I was like, I'm

Julie:

definitely going to be a three because the three, and you mentioned it.

Julie:

Everybody wants to be a three.

Julie:

The three is called the achiever.

Nicole:

Yeah, and they can also be known as the performer.

Nicole:

So the achiever.

Nicole:

what happens is they want to be valued and essentially loved

Nicole:

because of what they accomplish.

Nicole:

So again, they may be doing what we're doing.

Nicole:

You know, they may be an entrepreneur, but they're doing it because

Nicole:

they want people to see their achievements, their accomplishments,

Nicole:

and that's how they gain love.

Nicole:

So they fear being worthless and I am.

Nicole:

This also comes from your childhood.

Nicole:

So a lot of this was how you were raised, your parents or guardians

Nicole:

or whoever your caretaker was and it developed your defense mechanisms.

Nicole:

So that way, this is what happens now as an adult, you can see this playing out.

Julie:

sure.

Julie:

A number for the individualist.

Julie:

That's what it is on my.

Nicole:

Yup.

Nicole:

Yup.

Nicole:

And they can be called individualist or the romantic.

Nicole:

And so they want to have this unique significance.

Nicole:

They want to create this identity and they fear not being significant.

Nicole:

So, and I, for the longest time I thought I was a four, but when I

Nicole:

looked at the childhood grow stuff, I realized I was an eight and I'll

Nicole:

look back and I'm like, Oh, my gosh.

Nicole:

I'm totally an a, I can't believe I didn't see these signs before,

Nicole:

but, um, fours just have this core, like, what am I missing?

Nicole:

What does everybody else have that I don't have?

Nicole:

So they constantly think they're missing something.

Julie:

Oh, okay.

Julie:

Uh, moving on to number five, the investigator.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So the investigator or the observer is type five and they want to be competent.

Nicole:

So, and fives can sometimes miss type threes as well, but that what

Nicole:

they're doing is learning this stuff.

Nicole:

So they know things and they don't appear as useless or Dom

Nicole:

or whatever term you want to use.

Nicole:

I'm so they are constantly trying.

Nicole:

Resources, especially knowledge.

Nicole:

Um, yeah.

Nicole:

So that's the observer or the investigator.

Julie:

Okay.

Julie:

Number six, the loyal.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So this type, um, the loyalist or the loyal.

Nicole:

skeptic, sometimes I think of them as the devil's advocate, just

Nicole:

because they ask so many questions.

Nicole:

If you're asking a lot of questions and you're like trying to make sure

Nicole:

that everything's really secure and safe, um, you might be a type six.

Nicole:

So their desire is to have that security and that support system.

Nicole:

Um, and they fear being out, being without guidance or stubborn.

Julie:

Okay.

Julie:

Oh, interesting.

Julie:

Yes.

Julie:

Okay.

Julie:

We're going to get that to that in a second.

Julie:

Type seven.

Julie:

The enthusiast.

Nicole:

Yeah, and they can also be known as the Epicure and this type.

Nicole:

I think of, they are very playful and spontaneous.

Nicole:

Their core desire is satisfaction or pleasure.

Nicole:

So they don't want to be deprived or.

Nicole:

The mundane is kind of something they don't want to deal with.

Nicole:

So they are constantly seeking pleasure and stimulation from their experiences.

Julie:

That's very interesting then type eight.

Julie:

We've talked about a little bit that challenger.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

And they can also be known as the protector.

Nicole:

and I think there's one system that even calls type eight,

Nicole:

the boss, which is very funny.

Nicole:

Um, so our core desire is to have control of our own lives and our

Nicole:

fear is being controlled and that can manifest in different ways for me.

Nicole:

It's a lot about my schedule and my time, or other people, it may be money.

Nicole:

It may be something else.

Nicole:

Yeah, it can be different things.

Nicole:

So we just want to make sure that we are protected from

Nicole:

vulnerabilities and weaknesses.

Julie:

So this might shock you, but the ninth one is the

Julie:

one I ranked the lowest on

Julie:

nine is called the peacemaker.

Nicole:

Yup.

Nicole:

Yup.

Nicole:

And they can also be known as the mediator.

Nicole:

So nines have this desire to have this piece, this piece of mind, they do

Nicole:

not like conflict where eights some.

Nicole:

And this is where I thought I wasn't innate because.

Nicole:

Love conflict, but I can deal with it very quickly.

Nicole:

Eights also have a denial piece, which is another reason why I

Nicole:

didn't think of a sudden eight.

Nicole:

I was in denial about it, but anyways, with nines, Um,

Nicole:

they have this separation or loss.

Nicole:

So they think if they're in conflict with somebody that they're

Nicole:

going to be separated from them, or they won't, they'll lose them

Nicole:

as a friend or partner, whoever.

Nicole:

So they're constantly seeking harmony and peace.

Nicole:

And I think with you looking at your results and knowing that seven.

Nicole:

I think a second

Julie:

Yeah.

Julie:

So for the, for the listeners, apparently there's you, the three, top

Julie:

three scores are very important in.

Julie:

In our personalities.

Julie:

Uh, my top one was an eight, which is the challenger is second, was the loyalist and

Julie:

the third, which was number six type sex.

Julie:

And the third highest was a type seven.

Julie:

Um, which is the enthusiast.

Julie:

I will say.

Julie:

the loyalist and enthusiastic, they were one point away from each other.

Nicole:

Mm.

Julie:

they could flip flop on, on that.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So I would say, just looking at that your wing would be a seven, so you'd be an

Nicole:

eight wing seven where I'm an eight wing nine because I'm, I'm more introverted.

Nicole:

I don't, I'm not like spontaneous, I can be, but I have to

Nicole:

be in the mood to do that.

Julie:

Please explain wing.

Julie:

Cause I don't know what that means.

Nicole:

Yup.

Nicole:

So the wings, um, and sometimes people get confused.

Nicole:

So if you were looking at this and you're like, well, six is my

Nicole:

high school, second high score.

Nicole:

So it must be an eight wing six.

Nicole:

Well, that's not correct.

Nicole:

So wings are the numbers on either side.

Nicole:

So with us, you can either be an eight wing seven or an eight

Nicole:

wing nine and so on, so forth.

Nicole:

So a three, their wing is either going to be a two or a four.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So everybody has the one core type and this is why it can be so confusing.

Nicole:

You have your core type, then you have a wing on either side.

Nicole:

So that's two other numbers you have in relationship to, and then

Nicole:

you also have connection points to two other numbers where you

Nicole:

can connect and health and growth.

Nicole:

So really you have a connection with five numbers.

Nicole:

So it's so easy that people get mistyped, like.

Nicole:

If you've been mistyped or you're like, I'm still confused.

Nicole:

Like you don't have to rush into deciding what number you are.

Nicole:

Nobody's out here being like pick a number.

Nicole:

So,

Julie:

So this is, what's so interesting about this conversation because, um,

Julie:

again, I didn't, I took the test.

Julie:

I didn't know what it means, but I know you listened to the numerology,

Nicole:

um,

Julie:

interview that I did with Joe solely where my life path

Julie:

number is a seven, but I was born.

Julie:

On the eighth.

Julie:

And so she keeps saying that I gravitate towards being an eight, but I should try

Julie:

to reform myself a little to be a seven, which is interesting that I'm an eight,

Julie:

but the wing next to it is the seven.

Julie:

It's just very strange, you

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

There, I mean, there's, I believe there's and I I'm a little Lou, I

Nicole:

believe there's like synchronicities and there's numbers in our life for

Nicole:

a reason and things we keep seeing.

Nicole:

So Yeah.

Nicole:

that's, that's really cool that you're, you're like connecting these patterns to

Julie:

Right.

Julie:

I mean, that's the thing about patterns.

Julie:

You can't connect them unless you look for them.

Julie:

, and I think you might, I did the intuition one with ONJ like that was that's.

Julie:

The thing about being more intuitive is looking for these not waiting for

Julie:

them to smack you in the freaking face.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

And that's another reason I kinda thought I was a four, cause

Nicole:

I'm like, I'm very intuitive.

Nicole:

And I thought, oh, it's my intuition comes from my heart.

Nicole:

No, the eight is part of the gut center.

Nicole:

That's your intuition, that's your somatic.

Nicole:

That's coming from the body.

Nicole:

And So I, had to really kind of realize that too.

Julie:

So I, the Enneagram is, is a diagram in when it's done.

Julie:

It's a diagram, it's a circle and the numbers around that circle and

Julie:

they make points and everything.

Julie:

And I'm going to suggest that the listeners buy this $12 tests.

Julie:

So you can see what I'm talking about.

Julie:

W w what I, I sent you my results, the eight pages of like here,

Julie:

you know, um, they did do that diagram for me in the diagram.

Julie:

They connected, the eight to two other numbers, which was

Julie:

growth or growth was a two.

Julie:

And stress was a five.

Julie:

What is that mean?

Nicole:

So what happens is eight.

Nicole:

When we are really healthy, we, we can access to.

Nicole:

So, and, and, uh, I do this program and somebody asked me because twos,

Nicole:

when they're in stress, they go to.

Nicole:

And they're like, oh, that makes me feel bad.

Nicole:

I was like, no, don't feel bad.

Nicole:

We're just accessing the best or the worst parts of those other numbers.

Nicole:

So with two we're accessing those really, empathetic pieces.

Nicole:

We can really connect with people, which is interesting because

Nicole:

this podcast is about networking.

Nicole:

Twos are amazing networkers because they like to get to know people.

Nicole:

And so.

Nicole:

That's where we go.

Nicole:

When, when we're experiencing growth, we pull out those really good qualities.

Nicole:

And then when we're in stress, we're going to access our type five.

Nicole:

So let's say for example, and maybe you did this, maybe you didn't, I

Nicole:

don't know, but let's say you were like, oh, I'm interviewing Nicole.

Nicole:

I don't know a damn thing about any agreement.

Nicole:

Oh my gosh.

Nicole:

Internet search.

Nicole:

I got to sluice.

Nicole:

I got to look at everything.

Nicole:

I got to take the test.

Nicole:

I got to figure all this out.

Julie:

Exactly.

Nicole:

That's an eight going to five and stress because fives are, let me

Nicole:

collect all the knowledge and all the

Julie:

Um,

Nicole:

So that's what eight Stu when we're in stress and each type has numbers

Nicole:

that they go to in stress and growth.

Nicole:

So with us, we're an eight, we can either be a wing nine or a wing seven, and then

Nicole:

we go to two and then we can go to five.

Nicole:

So those are our five numbers that we have access.

Julie:

Where does the, where does like the six come in?

Julie:

The fact that that was in my top three.

Julie:

Is that just something I access in my personality?

Nicole:

Not necessarily, it could be that the way you took the

Nicole:

test, depending on your mood of the day can impact your results.

Julie:

Okay.

Nicole:

It could be that you just ask a lot of questions.

Nicole:

And so that's something you naturally do.

Nicole:

And I think it's funny too, because those are both in the head center, which is the.

Nicole:

Uh, the normal, the mental intelligence piece.

Nicole:

So you may have really good access to that mental intelligence, but also five, six,

Nicole:

and seven being in that head center triad.

Nicole:

They also have a lot of access to the core emotion of fear where 8, 9,

Nicole:

9 1, we, our core emotion is anger.

Nicole:

So, and I think that's where we become really intimidated

Nicole:

because it's like, it's anger.

Nicole:

I just got to move it through my body.

Nicole:

But other people are like, oh, anger, that's bad.

Nicole:

Like.

Nicole:

I don't even use the word anger.

Nicole:

I like to use the word frustrated, like, cause they think anger makes

Nicole:

them look like a bad person and we're just like, it's just energy.

Nicole:

We got to move it.

Julie:

Right.

Julie:

One thing you said when you talked about the six, which is my second

Julie:

highest number, you said that the need for stability, that is 100% me.

Julie:

The way that I grew up, the, you know, just being poor.

Julie:

My, you know, my mom's car, being repossessed out of the driveway

Julie:

and me watching them tow it away.

Julie:

Like I, I live in this.

Julie:

It doesn't matter how much money I ever have.

Julie:

I will live with the fear.

Julie:

That my things will be taken away from me.

Julie:

Like I remember thinking like in the great recession saying to my husband,

Julie:

like what if we lose one of our homes?

Julie:

That was my immediate thought was what if we lose one of our homes?

Julie:

Like that was never going to be a reality, but I

Nicole:

is, which is so funny.

Nicole:

Cause I want to pause for a second cause it's like, okay.

Nicole:

Homes with an S right?

Nicole:

What if we lose one of our homes, Right.

Nicole:

know, just to think about that from a place of privilege for a second, it's

Nicole:

like, I don't want to be vulnerable.

Nicole:

I might lose one of my homes,

Julie:

Exactly.

Julie:

Yeah.

Julie:

And so that was my first, my first thought wasn't like,

Julie:

oh, maybe we have to cut back.

Julie:

Maybe you have it.

Julie:

My first thought was, we're going to lose a house.

Julie:

I immediately, my mind need for stability.

Julie:

Financial stability is so baked into me.

Julie:

Not only did I have this situation with, with my mom, but I was essentially

Julie:

raised by my grandmother who is 97, who grew up in the depression, who

Julie:

you had a freezer in the basement for when we didn't have food.

Julie:

When the depression came again, like this was my mentality as a

Julie:

child, was that at any moment, things will be taken away from us.

Nicole:

Yeah, and I think.

Nicole:

If, if you don't have and save and, and have these things that leaves

Nicole:

you vulnerable and will you cry.

Julie:

Right.

Nicole:

So I think that it makes sense that you're an eight

Nicole:

with that C w my a is more of a.

Nicole:

My dad was, , emotionally and verbally abusive.

Nicole:

So I would stand up to my dad and be like, you can't do that.

Nicole:

As an eight year old kid, like, whoa.

Nicole:

You know, and, and I didn't even think about that until I looked back and I

Nicole:

was like, oh yeah, definitely an eight.

Julie:

There are so many things that in the light of reflection, years later

Julie:

are so glaringly obvious, but you can't when you're in them, recognize them.

Julie:

So tell me how you work with people to make them recognize.

Julie:

Their personality types.

Julie:

And then the strengths that lie within that personality type, because I

Julie:

know you work with a lot, a lot with entrepreneurs, which is, we are the thing.

Julie:

We are the business.

Julie:

We are the thing we need to know how to be the, at our best working

Julie:

with our strengths all of the time.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So depending on what type the individual is, cause it's all going to be custom.

Nicole:

So like your personality and then what are your goals?

Nicole:

What's your end thing that you want to get to?

Nicole:

So I recently worked with a three and I was like, when's the last time

Nicole:

you like, took a break or just sat around and were like, do you know

Nicole:

how to be, what does being mean?

Nicole:

And she was like, Cannot recall.

Nicole:

Like I know it was at least October last year and I was like, Okay.

Nicole:

So let's work on that, you know?

Nicole:

So how was like, could you do 60 seconds?

Nicole:

Cause I know if I was like five minutes, that was going to be too much.

Nicole:

So just figuring out that, because I approach this coaching piece that Yeah.

Nicole:

we want our.

Nicole:

To succeed.

Nicole:

But if we don't take care of ourselves and understand who we

Nicole:

are, it's not going to succeed.

Nicole:

I bring a lot that holistic approach because of my background within higher ed.

Nicole:

So for us as eight it's we make quick action.

Nicole:

We want to move.

Nicole:

We want to go, go, go.

Nicole:

, if I'm working with a six and they're like, Oh, I'm scared

Nicole:

this isn't going to work.

Nicole:

You know, there's a lot of fear that comes up.

Nicole:

A lot of self doubt.

Nicole:

Sixes Are very big into self doubt and not being assured and confident.

Nicole:

So that's what I think.

Nicole:

I just bring some of that confident energy so I can help them see.

Nicole:

Well, why aren't you taking action?

Nicole:

You've already thought through all the things.

Nicole:

So using the personality of each individual and seeing those strengths

Nicole:

with a really good at if there's areas they need to develop, or maybe there's

Nicole:

things they can outsource, like say.

Nicole:

No mundane thing.

Nicole:

So sevens, I hate bookkeeping, if sevens don't like that, I'm like outsource it.

Nicole:

If you don't like it, outsource it or sandwich it, do something you really like

Nicole:

do the thing you don't like, and then do something fun out on the other end.

Nicole:

so each personality has something they're going to be really good at and

Nicole:

something they're not going to be good.

Julie:

Are there good personality matches I'm an eight.

Julie:

Do I jive well with a certain personality number or a person that I wouldn't jive?

Julie:

Well, because I'm also, you and I are like, immediately, like, Oh, like

Julie:

w two eights, like peas and carrots right now, but are there like two

Julie:

numbers that you're like, Ooh, I should probably steer clear of this

Julie:

personality type or is that not a thing,

Nicole:

I think it can depend.

Nicole:

So, um, I'm very conscious of this sometimes.

Nicole:

So my sister and I are both eight, my sister is a different kind of ADA.

Nicole:

I think that I am so I'm like, oh, you're acting like, yeah.

Nicole:

I'm like, you're acting like Alec Baldwin.

Nicole:

Again.

Nicole:

I'm going to need you to level it down.

Nicole:

Like when she gets in her moods, like yesterday, I saw her and she was

Nicole:

telling me something about at work.

Nicole:

Something was going weird.

Nicole:

I said, yeah, I could tell.

Nicole:

Cause you texted me and you were very rude.

Nicole:

And she was just like, okay.

Nicole:

So, you know, I think sometimes eights, we can butt heads because we might think

Nicole:

the other aide is trying to control us or whatever, but we also move through

Nicole:

it really quickly because we can be blunt and honest and just move on.

Nicole:

Now.

Nicole:

I think, um, I always say this carefully because I never think people should.

Nicole:

Filter their self or water, their self down, or try to be something

Nicole:

they're not, but at the same time when you're aware of how you're coming off.

Nicole:

So , I'm very intimidating.

Nicole:

I know that I can be bossy, bitchy, whatever other words

Nicole:

you want to call me aggressive.

Nicole:

So when I'm approaching a two, I'm not going to be like,

Nicole:

just go do the fucking thing.

Nicole:

I want to be like, okay.

Nicole:

So how can we just go do this thing?

Nicole:

How can we go take the action?

Nicole:

Right.

Nicole:

So twos, Annie.

Nicole:

I know.

Nicole:

And they.

Nicole:

They're more emotional, even fours are more emotional, especially

Nicole:

all that heart center piece.

Nicole:

So the two, three, and four, but when I approached them, it's going

Nicole:

to be a little bit different.

Nicole:

It's not going to be as much fluff as with a three.

Nicole:

I would be.

Nicole:

Just go set your alarm and B we're a two.

Nicole:

I would, you know, let's be a little bit nicer.

Nicole:

Nicole.

Nicole:

Let's use some nicer language then I would approach, maybe a one or a, or a three.

Nicole:

Knowing how you're coming across the perception of how others perceive you.

Nicole:

Because I remember the first time somebody told me I was intimidated.

Nicole:

I was like, oh, that's funny.

Nicole:

I'm not intimidating.

Nicole:

But then I realized, yeah, yeah, I'm kind of.

Julie:

I get that.

Julie:

I get that from people that I'm

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Julie:

But I also am.

Julie:

I feel like you can say anything to me.

Julie:

I'm like Teflon, Don.

Julie:

You can say anything to me.

Julie:

Let's talk about it.

Julie:

, so I feel like maybe that is intimidating, but I always feel like I, I allow

Julie:

people to say whatever they want to me.

Julie:

And I'm like, okay, let's, let's, let's figure this out, you know, but I

Nicole:

also this intensity, this energy.

Nicole:

So we can just be.

Nicole:

Intense, cause I was like, how am I intense?

Nicole:

I'm not, I don't feel like I'm that like, but somebody was

Nicole:

like, Nicole, it's your energy?

Nicole:

It's your presence.

Nicole:

It's just what you bro.

Nicole:

I was like, oh, like I didn't realize that.

Nicole:

And then I was like, okay, well this makes more sense.

Julie:

Yeah.

Julie:

So when someone works with you, do they come into working with you knowing their

Julie:

type or do you go through the process of discovering their type together?

Nicole:

So I'll ask them to take a test first and that's where we'll start.

Nicole:

So, you know, I'm like, send me your results if you want to pay for it.

Nicole:

Great.

Nicole:

If you don't just send me what you get and then.

Nicole:

If we're going through it and it's not sitting right, then we'll work through it.

Nicole:

I'm working with a team Right.

Nicole:

now for, through an agency.

Nicole:

And one of their members was debating between a two and a four.

Nicole:

So it was like, okay, we we've talked about the four before we

Nicole:

meet again, I would like for you to do some self-reflection

Nicole:

and kind of figured this out.

Nicole:

Cause I can't get inside your brain.

Nicole:

I can give you some tools and some questions and help you

Nicole:

decide, which is best fit.

Nicole:

Let's use this as a starting point.

Nicole:

So if I was coaching you on like, okay, you're an eight, let's

Nicole:

start there and go through things.

Nicole:

And I think , from us talking like an eight seems pretty accurate,

Nicole:

especially, listening through some of your older podcasts and stuff.

Julie:

If I came to you and I was like, I'm an entrepreneur, I'm an eight.

Julie:

Do I present you?

Julie:

My challenge?

Julie:

Like, this is what I'm being challenged with at work, or this

Julie:

is what I'm struggling with.

Julie:

Or like, does that come up in the, like, how does that, how do you help?

Julie:

I'm just, what is the, how do you help

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

So I asked them some questions, , what are your goals?

Nicole:

What's your biggest thing that you're struggling with right now?

Nicole:

Where do you want to be in three, six months?

Nicole:

Talk through all of that, because, we can all be struggling with different

Nicole:

things or even the same thing, but how you approach it and how you, solve

Nicole:

that problem or, or work it out in a way that's healthy is going to

Nicole:

be different based on that number.

Nicole:

A lot of times it's, I want to make more money.

Nicole:

I need to get in front of people?

Nicole:

I need to be more visible.

Nicole:

An eight it's just like, just go do it right?

Nicole:

Where, other numbers it's , okay, well six, why are you scared?

Nicole:

Five?

Nicole:

Why are you hiding?

Nicole:

Isolating?

Nicole:

Every number is going to have something.

Nicole:

And the Enneagram is, is that framework is that tool to help people understand,

Nicole:

and how they approach the business, how they do things, because some people

Nicole:

are like, oh, I'm not good at sales.

Nicole:

Okay, well maybe you're not good at asking for the sale, but is there some.

Nicole:

Because of XYZ and you're tight, that's holding you back from even

Nicole:

asking for the sale or from being visible or from whatever it is.

Julie:

So I'm to say we could have talked for five hours and I would still be.

Nicole:

Oh yeah.

Julie:

Not understanding a lot of what is in this eight page document about myself.

Julie:

So I'm going to suggest to the listeners, number one, take this test.

Julie:

It is, it is so interesting.

Julie:

Take the test, figure out your number, reach out to Nicole and say,

Julie:

what can I do with this information?

Julie:

Um, I think that would be great because I pretty much am going to, hang up with

Julie:

you and then send you an email and say, what else do I do with this information?

Julie:

Because it is, there's so much in here.

Julie:

And I just feel like the deeper weeds, like, like anything, the deeper we

Julie:

dig, the more we're going to uncover and the more useful it's going to be.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Cause then you go into subtypes and the intelligence centers.

Nicole:

There is so much within the Enneagram that you can use because yeah.

Nicole:

Self-awareness but then it's, self-mastery, and so much that

Nicole:

you can use for professional and personal development.

Julie:

Yeah, I would suggest for people, for team, you know, for

Julie:

entrepreneurs, know your type

Nicole:

Mm.

Julie:

your strengths and your weaknesses and not type, and then encourage, if

Julie:

you are S if you are on a team that works together, encourage everybody

Julie:

to do this so that you can begin to understand the different types and it

Julie:

might change the way you work together.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah, for sure.

Julie:

Oh, Nicole, thank you.

Julie:

This was great.

Julie:

I mean, honestly, I love when I have a topic that I know nothing about,

Julie:

and then I'm like, oh, this is great.

Julie:

I've learned something, but I also want to know more.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

I love it.

Nicole:

I'm so glad I was able to introduce you to the Enneagram.

Julie:

Okay.

Julie:

Thanks so much.

Julie:

I'm going to put links to your website, your information, in the show notes.

Julie:

I'm going to suggest that everybody reached out to Nicole

Julie:

to, to start digging into this.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

Yeah.

Nicole:

And when the show goes live, when you're listening, you know, screenshot it and tag

Nicole:

me, I'd love to see that you've heard it.

Nicole:

And so I can reshare you.

Julie:

Yeah.

Julie:

Awesome.

Julie:

Thanks so much.

Nicole:

Thank you.

Julie:

So we clearly only scratched the surface of what Enneagrams

Julie:

are and how understanding what our numbers are, can help us.

Julie:

Each of the nine personality types we talked about is characterized by a set of

Julie:

dominant behaviors, motivations and fears.

Julie:

The goal of the Enneagram is to better understand your type so that you'll be

Julie:

able to make the most of your strengths.

Julie:

And address your weaknesses in order to achieve your full potential.

Julie:

Well, personalities are complex and a simple online test is not enough

Julie:

to tell you everything about your personality, your motivations,

Julie:

behaviors, strengths, or weaknesses.

Julie:

But I love that it offers a foundation to have a discussion about who we

Julie:

are, why we do the things we do.

Julie:

And why we react to things a certain way.

Julie:

I think it's fascinating.

Julie:

And after the conversation I had with Joe solely about my life path number, I'm

Julie:

so intrigued how the numbers seven and eight keep showing up in everything I do.

Julie:

I want to know more and I hope this conversation has made you curious as well.

Julie:

Do you already know your number?

Julie:

Did anything that Nicole said about your number resonate with you as it relates

Julie:

to your fears and your motivations?

Julie:

See when Nicole said the Enneagram eights go to a two in times of

Julie:

growth, that 100% tracks with me.

Julie:

That's when I'm building relationships easily.

Julie:

I'm able to express my emotions.

Julie:

I'm generous and I'm helpful.

Julie:

But during times of stress, when I go to a five, that's a hundred percent me as well.

Julie:

When I'm stressed, I'm worried that I'm not capable of doing all the things

Julie:

I want to do and become hyperactive and preoccupied with thoughts of

Julie:

what if this and what if that.

Julie:

Now.

Julie:

It's one thing to recognize that all of these things are happening,

Julie:

but it's another thing to have tools to work through them.

Julie:

That's what Nicole does.

Julie:

She helps people make sense of their motivations and fears

Julie:

based on their personality type.

Julie:

I think we could all use a better understanding of that.

Julie:

Anyway, there's no shortage of information out there on Enneagram types.

Julie:

And I encourage you to learn more about what type you are and see

Julie:

if it doesn't make you go, huh?

Julie:

When looking at their corresponding treats, fears and motivations

Julie:

associated with the number.

Julie:

And if there are any other eights out there,

Julie:

Let me know.

Julie:

So because the eight keeps showing up in my life.

Julie:

I found a cocktail called the number eight.

Julie:

And it has mezcal and ginger in it, which are two of my favorite things.

Julie:

How perfect is that?

Julie:

Here's what you're going to need a half ounce of fresh lime juice.

Julie:

One ounce, every Ruby red, grapefruit juice.

Julie:

Three fours, ounce or ginger liquor.

Julie:

I used to make Anton cause that's what I had.

Julie:

One ounce of mezcal.

Julie:

One dash of orange bitters.

Julie:

And if you want a garnish, she can have a, an orange twist or

Julie:

an orange wheel as a garnish.

Julie:

What you're going to do is you're going to add the lime juice, grapefruit juice,

Julie:

ginger liqour mess, cow and orange bitters to a cocktail shaker and filled with ice.

Julie:

Shake shake, shake, and then strain into a filled highball glass.

Julie:

Garnish was that orange twist or the orange wheel and surf.

Julie:

That's my friends.

Julie:

I hope you enjoyed this episode.

Julie:

I certainly enjoyed researching it.

Julie:

Um, and I hope you got something out of it.

Julie:

Until next week.

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