Rachel Kerr Schneider dives deep into the heart of grief and resilience in this episode, sharing her powerful journey through loss after her husband, John, was diagnosed with ALS. Her book, "The Widow Chose Red," isn't just a memoir; it's a vibrant celebration of life, love, and the messy, beautiful struggle of navigating faith in the face of unimaginable sorrow. We chat about how John's illness transformed not only their lives but also the lives of their two boys, and how Rachel found a way to honor both his memory and her own journey through the storm. Spoiler alert: it’s as real as it gets, filled with raw honesty and a sprinkle of humor because, let’s face it, sometimes laughter is the best medicine. So grab your favorite drink, kick back, and get ready for a conversation that just might change your perspective on love, loss, and the sheer audacity of hope.

Rachel Kerr Schneider joins us today to dive into the heavy waters of grief and faith. You know, the kind of grief that smacks you in the face when you least expect it, like a rogue wave at the beach. Rachel's journey started when her husband was diagnosed with ALS, a disease that’s basically the worst kind of thief—stealing away the life you thought you had. We chat about her book, 'The Widow Chose Red,' which isn’t just a catchy title; it’s a powerful testament to resilience and embracing life even when the chips are down. It’s like, how do you stay vibrant and passionate when your world is crumbling? Rachel brings her A-game here, sharing that despite the devastation, she found a way to honor her husband’s life and legacy.

As we dig deeper, we explore some real talk about faith, loss, and what it means to navigate the choppy waters of caregiving. Rachel’s insights are sharp, filled with sarcasm and honesty that make you nod along, sometimes even chuckle, amid the sadness. She points out that we all have our struggles, and no one gets a pass from pain. It’s like, life doesn’t come with a manual, and the ‘why me?’ moments are universal. But the real kicker? Rachel emphasizes that grief doesn’t have to be a solo journey. She encourages listeners to lean into their faith, community, and even the Holy Spirit as they navigate their own grief.

In a world that often tells us to put on a brave face and move on, Rachel’s message is refreshing. She’s not here to sugarcoat anything; she’s all about keeping it real. We’re reminded that it’s okay to feel lost and exhausted, and that seeking help isn’t a sign of weakness—it’s a lifeline. If you’ve ever felt like you’re drowning in your own life, this episode is a must-listen. Grab a comfy seat, maybe a snack, and get ready to be inspired. Rachel’s story is a reminder that even through the darkest times, there’s still a spark of hope waiting to shine through.

Takeaways:

• Rachel Kerr Schneider's journey through grief and faith reveals the raw reality of loss and hope.
• ALS is brutal and still misunderstood, yet its impact touches countless lives in unseen ways.
• The importance of community support during illness highlights how interconnected our lives truly are.
• Choosing to celebrate life rather than mourn death can transform our perspective on loss.
• Rachel's book serves as a reminder that sharing our stories can help others navigate their grief journeys.
• Embracing God's purpose can lead to unexpected paths, showing that life continues even in tragedy.

Links referenced in this episode:

• spiritedprosperity.com

Welcome back.

My name is Ashley, and this is the Black Sheep Christian Podcast.

Today I have the pleasure to be with Rachel Kerr Schneider.

Welcome.

Well, thank you, Ashley.

It is a joy to be with you today.

I am blessed that you reached out because your story.

There's.

My story isn't like yours, but the struggle is real as far as what everyday people go through, which is grief.

You are the author of the Widow Chose Red, which is a beautiful and powerful title.

And I would like to begin by just because I got some good questions.

So.

So let's begin to let our viewers know what it is that we're here to talk about, which is your journey with Jesus, your husband John and his battle with ALS.

That's absolutely right.

My husband was diagnosed 17 years ago with amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, otherwise known as ALS or Lou Gehrig's disease.

He died three years after that diagnosis, which is not unusual.

ALS is still considered a very rare disease.

Only about 30,000 people currently are living with it here in the United States.

Between 5 and 6,000 will be diagnosed with it in a given year, and it is unfortunately still a death sentence.

They give you between two to five years to live.

There is still no known cause, and there is still no known cure.

Wow.

Wow.

Thanks for those statistics.

It is a known disease due to, you know, some causes that I've, that I've seen and been a part of, but I, I didn't know the numbers.

It's, it's, it's sad and scary at the same time.

Very much.

Very much so.

And when you think about how many people are dealing with Alzheimer's, that's about 7 million.

So when you look at the size of the communities.

Right.

And the attention that, that certain diseases get, ALS is one of those that keeps kind of falling through the cracks because the community is, is so small, and it's exhausting, it's brutal, it's debilitating.

And, you know, a lot of people out there don't.

Still don't know what it is.

Even though the Ice Bucket Challenge is over 10 years old and raised over $200 million, there's still so much that we don't know.

But they do believe, Ashley, that the neurodegenerative diseases, such as pollution, Parkinson's, Huntington's, Alzheimer's, dementia, and ALS and Ms. Are somewhat connected.

And of course, there are no cures, really, for any of those diseases.

So the hope is, is that if they can unlock the mystery of one of them, then they might be well on their way to curing all of them.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah, all of those that you mentioned, because I know my grandmother has Alzheimer's, and.

I'm sorry.

Yeah, it is.

And then I used to also volunteer at a facility of.

It was a retirement facility, so.

And then the second year, because I was there the first year, and they didn't have.

In the second year, they ended up creating a wing of those with Alzheimer's.

And I remember being.

Because I was, like, 16, 17, and like, I. I'm barely knowing anything about life, let alone seeing this.

This disease, being a volunteer, you know, to helping out with the nurses.

And I just remember, even at that age, of how.

How much of a prison it is, you know, for them.

You.

You just see it in their eyes.

Like.

Like, the eyes is a window to the soul, and so they can't express anything to you, but you can just see how closed off they are and how it feels.

You're absolutely right.

And.

And here's the thing about als, is the body self paralyzes.

So what happens is the motor neurons that carry the messages from the brain to the muscles, they die.

So.

But unlike dementia, the brain stays completely intact.

So imagine that you have to scratch an itch on your nose.

You can't raise your arm to do that.

You want to turn over in bed at night, you can't move, but your body is saying, I really want to do this.

So it is.

I totally hear what you're saying, because you're in one, you become a prisoner of your mind.

In the other, you become a prisoner of your body.

They're both.

They're both horrible, brutal diseases, and it's so hard to watch somebody you love succumb to these.

And.

And that's why I wrote the book, because all of us are going to experience something beyond our imagination in our lifetime.

Who are we to think that we're going to get out of this life without some kind of struggle?

And I really just wanted to remind people, especially those of us who do have faith, that we were never promised that this was going to be an easy time.

And it's okay to be scared, it's okay to question.

It's okay to be exhausted, because all of us who are believers have been gifted with that superpower, that supernatural superpower inside each one of us, which is the Holy Spirit, which a lot of times we forget that we have that access, and.

And he can intervene on our behalf when we're just exhausted and.

And just too confused to know what the next step should be.

I think that's a good word to confuse, because I get confused easily.

God is funny because at times he.

He doesn't do much.

He doesn't.

Not, not to say that he doesn't do much, but in the context of communicating to us, you know, there's a few words and you'd be like, okay, so what do you mean by that again?

Do you mean left?

Is it a sharp left?

Is it a gentle left?

Like.

Like, what am I supposed to be doing here?

Exactly?

And then did I hear that right?

Was that you or was that me?

Was that me just thinking it's you?

And I often said, you know, I need to get hit over the head with two by four because I don't want to miss.

I don't want to miss anything that God has planned for us.

And I don't believe that he made my husband ill.

I don't believe that that's what he wants for us.

But what we do know and what we do remember is that Job, in the Bible, God let the.

God let the devil do whatever he wanted to him except kill him.

He would not give him permission to do that.

But he took away Job's health and his sons and daughters and his wealth, his cattle, his land, and his, like, really, aren't you God of yours yet?

And Job was like, no, no, I'm not he.

And it didn't mean Job was having a good time with any of this at all.

And, and what I do believe, too, Ashley, is our suffering is never wasted.

You know, we think about what Jesus did, think about the suffering he withstood on our behalf.

Who are we to think that we were going to just sail through this world with.

Without any pain, without any suffering, especially knowing what he did for us.

So.

And our story will be helpful when we share it.

You know, I heard a pastor say the other day, our faith is meant to be personal, but not necessarily private.

So that's a really.

It really resonated with me again about the fact that, yes, my relationship with Jesus is personal, but I don't need to keep that private.

I need to let people know what he has done for me and what he continues to do for me, which is.

Which is one of the other reasons that I.

That I wrote this book.

Wow, that was good.

Digesting.

There was.

There's a couple of things that you said.

That's okay.

Digesting is good.

Processing.

I got it.

I. Yeah, I have to do that a lot myself.

Trust me.

Trust me.

I usually, yes, I am writing notes.

I am writing notes all the time about Things that I hear because I don't take the credit for any of it.

It was the pastor yesterday and, and I heard that and I was like that, that I need to remember.

You need to let your pastor know that that was great.

I will do that.

I will do that.

Absolutely.

Because when you say I was like, whoa, and, and, and, and I do this a lot and I, I need to accept it as a superpower because there are just things in life that God gives us that, that is a feast that shouldn't, it shouldn't be fast food.

It, it should be like as if it was slow cooked.

It should be enjoyed.

And I'm trying to think of the word.

It shouldn't be eaten fast.

It should be enjoyable.

It should be savored.

Thank you.

Thank you.

We should take time to savor it.

So thank you for that.

Thank you for.

And you bring up another great point, Ashley, which is of course we were talking about Romans.

I think it's chapter 12, verses 1 through 8 and about spiritual gifting.

And obviously this is one of your spiritual gifts.

And, and we each have been given them.

Sometimes it takes us a little longer to figure out what they are or how to use them.

But one is not better than the other.

And I know for me it's exhortation, it's encouragement.

That is, that is just one of the things that God has called me to do.

And, and that's why, and that's why we're here talking today, because I think that's one of your, that's one of your gifts too, is to offer encouragement as well.

Thank you.

I'm going to get into this book because, and, and I'm going to read a paragraph of what you wrote.

And then I have some questions.

There was this, there's a couple of paragraphs that I'm going to refer to, but these two really spoke to me.

And so here we go.

This one first paragraph that spoke to me was the problem is we put God in a box.

Stepping outside the religious or denominational box will allow us to see what God really has to offer.

I realized there was so much more to having a relationship with Jesus than head knowledge and going through the motions of what religion expects.

I wanted to know more about who he is.

Head knowledge is what spoke to me in this paragraph.

What head knowledge did you have that needed to be let go of?

That's a great, that's a great question.

I, I think I needed to let go of a concept that, you know, I, the God is all powerful.

He is Sovereign.

And you know, there's God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.

It's a mystery.

I don't think that I'm going to figure it out on this side.

So I needed to just try to, to let go of trying to figure it out and just embrace it.

Embrace God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit for who and what they are and what they've done and what they continue to do.

And I also, in that regard, I grew up in a very faith based family.

My dad was Southern Baptist, my mom was Lutheran.

So I call myself somewhat of a schizophrenic believer because I was getting hellfire and damnation on one side and I was getting grace and real wine with communion on the other.

So that those, those totally didn't, didn't sink for me.

And, and yet I knew all the stories of the Bible.

I knew a lot of, you know, Esther and as we talked about Job and Samuel and Joshua and David, Moses and Abraham and all those people.

And yet I think somewhere in there I thought, well, you know, God did stuff for them.

He's not really going to do anything for me.

He's not going to do anything that big.

Right?

I mean, seriously.

And so I had to really kind of go, wait a second, Rachel.

Jesus became as real to me as you are sitting here having this conversation.

And I still wish sometimes I could hear him as clearly as you and I are talking.

But what I do know is he chooses to communicate, communicate with me a little differently.

Sometimes it's through my study, sometimes it's through other people in a conversation, sometimes it's through prayer.

So he just, he, he, you know, I do hear from him though.

But as you said earlier, sometimes we get the information or the confirmation or the revelation or the inspiration in a way that, that we weren't asking for or in a way that we weren't searching for.

And therein that just lies the discernment process of really just saying, okay, all right, Lord, I only want to do what you want me to do.

I just want to check in and make sure this is exactly where you want me, how you want me, when you want me, all of that stuff.

And it's a process, you know, we have to submit to that over and over and over again because each time that we do, he will reveal what we, what he wants for us in this particular time in our life.

It's not like we just say, okay, I'm submitted, and that's it.

Because we live in this world of Ours, we have to do it over and over and over again.

So I think that was probably something that.

That I had to let go of.

Was.

Was not.

Not the why is this happening to me?

Or how am I going to get through this?

But just Lord, lead me, teach me, guide me, direct me.

I don't need to worry about the rest of it.

Just.

And be here with me through every step.

That's beautiful.

Yeah, I. I feel like this was speaking to me before I get to the next question, because my.

My partner passed away before our daughter was born, so it was like this.

Big.

Break, which is why your story just speaks, you know, to me so well when it comes to losing someone so, so out of the plan, you know, because your story seems like you two were just in step together, you know, once you had your.

Once you got the groove of things, you two were.

Which can take a while, right?

Yes, Right, right, right.

You had the plan together.

You.

You.

You saw what was to be.

You know, you were working towards that step of what was to be of what you were planning on.

And then God just like, no, and it just breaks, you know, and when I think about the head.

Knowledge, you know, as a Christ that had knowledge, you know, this is how things are supposed to go.

This is how it's supposed to be, you know, A, B, C, D, 1, 2, 3.

And then God's just like, no, we're gonna break that, you know, and you'd be like, well, interesting.

You know, those concepts are different to you all of a sudden.

Yes.

So.

Yeah, very, very much so.

And we wonder why.

Why does he.

Why do we have to go through this?

You know, why.

You know, why do we have to go through this?

And.

And, you know, they're just some of these questions we're never going to get the answers to on this side.

And.

And yet I. I know, you know, I'm like, okay, I'll ask.

I'll ask him about that when I see him.

And then I'm thinking, you know what, Rachel?

When you see him, you're not even gonna.

All of that's just not even gonna matter anymore, you know?

And I'm like, okay.

I mean, but it's still.

And.

And we don't know.

That's the thing too, Ashley.

And I'm sorry for your.

I'm sorry for your loss.

And, and it.

You raised.

You raised this little person on your.

On your own.

I mean, that's a.

That right there is such a huge, huge, daunting responsibility.

And, you know, we're just.

We Just one of the reasons also why I wanted to get this down on paper was because my boys were 10 and 14.

They had had some time with their f. But not, not like I, not like me.

I had 24 years with him.

Right.

So I wanted them to be able to, to have something tangible that they could go back to and read the stories that, not just about his illness because their father lived a, had a great, had a great life.

We had, we had a lot of fun.

You know, we, we, we just, we did a lot of things and he was very successful and I know that in his heart all he wanted be there for those boys.

That was the thing I think that broke him so much was knowing he would not see these boys grow into the wonderful men that they are today.

Wow, that's beautiful.

And, and heartbreaking because 10 and 14 is.

Losing a parent at any age is heartbreaking.

But 10 to 14 is such a critical age for boys and girls because at 14 you are beginning to learn about life like, like, like Mickey Mouse clubhouse, you know, See ya.

You know, you're, you're, oh yeah.

You'Re headed into high school, you're headed.

Full blown adolescence.

You've got the ones raging and, and that's the point too, that boys will want to break away and identify with their dad.

That's what, and that's what they're built to do, right?

I'm not built to be, I'm not built to be a dad, right?

Surprise.

I wasn't built to be a dad.

I don't care what, I don't care what the world wants to say.

I wasn't built to be a dad.

And, and I wasn't gonna, I wasn't gonna fill that.

I wasn't going to fill that hole in their heart.

Yes, ever.

You know, and so to your point, and that's the topic, actually that's the subject of the second book, which is going to be about the boys, the Bible and the battles.

Because, because my older son went down the road of addiction and I didn't know anything about drugs, you know, my parents, but the fear of the Almighty in me, as far as drugs were concerned, I never touched him, wasn't curious about him, none of it.

I was scared to death of them.

So it really took me a while to figure out that this was what was going on with my son.

Because like you said, between adolescence, we've left the Mickey Mouse club where we're now with, you know, some, some people that are doing some things, involved with some things and you know, My son was so.

The grief was so overwhelming that he was just looking for a way to numb it.

And.

And so that's where we ended up.

My youngest got addicted to sports.

If it had a ball in it, he was playing it.

So that opens a whole new door.

As a single parent, you.

You understand the responsibility.

And then.

And then when you're.

You're trying to guide them through this.

This adventure called life, and realizing, too, that, you know, we have.

We have a very small window at 18.

They are.

They are.

They can do what they want, how they want, when they want.

And so I had to.

I had to make some decisions about rehab and some other things very quickly while I still had.

While.

While I still had the jurisdiction and the authority to do that.

Yeah.

Wow, that's powerful.

I know with my daughter, like what you said, I'm not built to be a dad.

And, And I, I. I understand why culture did this to us, but at the same time, I was.

I was taking dust off and I accidentally muted myself.

I understand why culture did this to us in order to empower us, but I feel like we need to have a new conversation for women as single moms, that we can't be dads, you know, woman be like, I'm the mother and the father.

And I completely get that.

I completely understand that.

But I knew early on I was not equipped for that.

And I'm proud of myself for not.

For not going down that road, because with my daughter's father being out unexpectedly out of the picture, I ended up putting my dad in that role as a father.

Because there are some things that.

This is why as women, we need to have a conversation.

There's just some things that we just can't show.

A father, can't show a daughter how they should be respected as a girl into a woman there for boys, there is a language that as women, we just can't.

We were.

We.

We just can't communicate.

I do remember that there's an African tribe that takes their boys, not takes their boys.

That's a strong word.

There's an African tribe that at a certain age, they are separated from the mother.

And that is because there are certain things that as women, there are things that we just can't teach.

You know, we can teach love what a certain way, but there's another.

There's another viewpoint to love that men can only.

That men can only know.

You are.

You are absolutely right.

And you did.

In.

In my humble opinion, yes.

Giving her other strong male figures in her life was exactly the right thing to do.

And I, you know, I, I even sent my oldest over to Australia, which is where my dad lives, and one of my.

And both of my brothers were living at the time.

I sent him over for a summer so he could.

So he could be exposed to.

To them.

And, and I wasn't there.

And, and you were right.

We bear the responsibility of a single parent.

We spare the responsibility, but there's no way.

And, and kudos to you for figuring that out because I think, you know, a lot of women do think that they've got to be able to.

To do it all.

And, and we weren't.

We weren't designed that way.

We're not built that way.

And, and it's so important.

And, and my boys, I think, have always understood I'm a very strong person, but I have never tried to step in.

And I've never, you know, I've never said, you know, I have to be your dad, too.

No, I let them.

They started to make.

They started to have to make, you know, choices about, you know, things that they were going to have to do and live with the consequences.

Fair or much earlier, maybe much earlier, Ashley, than some of their counterparts because.

Because they didn't have a dad there to.

To rein them in on some certain things, you know, so, yeah, that's a, That's.

It's interesting because I've never really had this conversation with, with anyone yet, but.

But it's a huge.

It's.

It is something that in our, in our society, I think you're right, we've been done a disservice thinking that, you know, we can, we can be both.

Right.

Right.

And now move on to another question.

But I had this thought, and I think as, as.

As women, and this is something that we're wrestling.

You know, we were like, we can't do it all.

Now we're having this conversations like, we can't do it all.

We can't go to work and take care of the household and take care of the kids.

You know, there's.

There's a lot of people who are.

A lot of women who are struggling.

And I think that's probably why, you know, with the relationships, because I think the conversation should be now, not about.

It should be men, men, men.

Because, you know, as women, we're cool.

We're awesome.

But I, I think men are lost because we women have taken.

Have taken on too much and we shouldn't have.

I, I agree.

I totally.

I totally agree.

And I think, you know, that was one of the things too, that I watched with my husband as he was, as he was ill.

He wanted to just be, he wanted these boys to just think of him, you know, lovingly, which of course they do.

But it started to affect his ability to discipline and his ability to call them out on things.

He started to let some things slide that otherwise I knew that he never would have.

And you know, I kind of had to step in unfortunately, and say, okay, let's.

Let me remind you, you and I agreed that if he didn't make the grades, he wasn't going to, he wasn't going to be able to play on the team, you know.

Oh, but Rachel, I'm like, no, we, we set a boundary and we have to.

And, and that is the one thing, Ashley, if my boys will tell you anything about me, I say what I mean and I mean what I say.

Yeah.

And, and, and you know, and I get that for my upbringing.

My parents were, I was, it was, I was always understood.

You do this, this could happen.

You are going to face some consequences for your actions.

Let's hope that you make good choices so that you don't have to face bad consequences, but you make bad choices.

And they'll probably be some things that will happen that won't be, that won't be terrific either, you know.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow.

Thanks for sharing that, that, that, that portion because I'm sure that in itself was an interesting, an interesting.

I'm trying to, I want, I don't want to use the word consequence or battle, but something that probably just was unexpected because you two are on two different journeys in itself.

Like he's probably thinking about the love that he has and what is left to show that love while you are still, you know, you're still going to be left here.

So it's for you, it's what is beyond.

In a different way.

You are, you are so right.

You're absolutely right.

And that was one of the reasons too that, you know, I stepped out to and, and sought a faith based counselor because I'm like, I'm still going to be here, but I've never helped anyone die.

I've never, I've never done that.

And how do I do this?

How do I help him finish well and how do I keep myself together and strong knowing that I'm going to be left, that's the sad fact.

I'm going to be left here with two young boys and, you know, I can't let them get away with all kinds of things now because that's only going to get worse.

And it was interesting because when I went into, to see Nancy and I said, you know, I don't, I don't understand this.

I have faith.

I, I, I believe.

I know that God's in charge.

I, you know, but I, this is still, I'm exhausted.

I'm cranky, I'm irritable.

What's wrong with me?

Don't.

Shouldn't my faith be enough to make all this, like, not be here?

And she looked at me and she said, rachel, she said, Jesus was a guy.

He was human, and he had 12 guys helping him, and you're not Jesus, so you might need some help.

And I, I looked at her and I thought, you're right.

And Jesus didn't really need the help.

He chose to have those guys around him.

And I thought, okay, that it makes it okay.

I can still, it's okay for me to say, I need the help.

I, I need some help.

I need help today.

Could you, could you help me with this?

It wasn't.

And it really kind of flipped the switch on me being able to ask for it and receive it and also understand, too, Ashley, because we know those disciples, some of the times they weren't helpful at all.

Right.

They, I'm sure Jesus looked at them, rolled his eyes, and said, really, you guys, seriously, this is what we're talking about.

This is what you're dealing.

Really.

We know that.

Right?

We've got that.

We know that.

And so, and so that's kind of, I think it helped me put things in perspective to, too, about, about help, because people will respond differently.

And, and a lot of times what you think, what, what they think is help may not be help, but you know what?

You still receive it, you still thank them for it.

And, and we know in, in some little way, we just acknowledge that act of, that act of kindness because we know what the intention was behind it.

Yeah.

Which is love.

Oh, you know, that is a great.

I never really thought about that.

You know, him and his 12 disciples helping that, that, that's a great analogy.

Thank you.

Because when you think about, I mean, is Jesus like, right.

What does he need?

Right.

He is the Son of God.

Like, what do you need?

God.

Yeah, exactly.

Exactly.

And yet, you know, I mean, to think that he would come to this earth as baby and grow up and go through all that and then be this grown man going around with these 12 guys who.

It is, you're right.

You kind of go, why?

But there was a reason.

There was an absolute reason.

And once they got and Once they were filled with that Holy Spirit, they were unstoppable.

They were absolutely unstoppable.

Which is the one thing that I want to remind.

Remind us all of is that.

That.

That.

That Holy Spirit, which is why it still remains a mystery.

But you know what?

The more that we embrace it and.

And acknowledge it and welcome it and stir it up in our spirit, we just.

We too can deal with those things that come into our life that.

That are meant to.

To harm us and to hurt us and to destroy us.

They will not.

They.

They will.

They will not over.

They will not overtake us.

They just won't.

Yeah.

Wow.

I'm going to read a next paragraph.

Sure.

I'm going to skip over this question, which was, what motions of religions?

Okay.

I.

Did I write it that way?

Ashley, I'm not sure that I remember.

I should have thought that in.

I'm in trouble.

This conversation is really good because I'm.

I'm gonna skip over a question because we kind of talked about it.

What motions of religion that gave you a new perspective?

But, but.

But we.

We already touched on that.

Okay, this conversation is really good.

So there's this other paragraph, and I had to sit in this, which is why I'm skipping over, because I had to sit in this, and I feel like I'm.

I. I'm gonna.

About to cry because the emotion's about to come over, come over me again.

I went to the study to look for dad, who was talking.

I asked, dad, what are you doing?

He said, well, you know, God brought Lazarus back from the dead.

Jesus raised people from the dead all the time.

He can do it.

I love my dad for this.

I love his faith.

It wasn't that I didn't believe it could happen, but I had reconciled myself a long time before that.

If God was going to heal someone with als, it might as well be John.

But it didn't happen.

I let him stay in there and wear himself out until he realized John wasn't going to return.

I. I don't know why I feel like I want to cry.

I'm sorry.

I know why you want to cry because I want to cry, too, because I.

You were just talking to me off air about your grandfather, and you know, your grandfather and my father are about the same.

Are about the same age, and they come from.

They come from a place where their belief system is.

It.

It is.

It is just DNA wired in them.

Yes.

And.

And you and I are like, I want that.

I. I want that.

I want to be so.

I Want to be so committed that I could actually stand in a room.

Yes.

And, and, and pray over someone and actually believe.

Right.

God would bring them back.

Yes.

He's done it before.

And that is what make.

That is.

I mean, for me, that's the emotion.

And I, I think you might be wired.

We might be wired a little bit the same way there.

But it.

I will tell you that to me speaks volumes about my, my father and his faith walk.

And, and even today, living in Australia, he's teaching.

He's teaching and preaching in a little Polish church.

These people don't even understand English, but he is still bringing the word to them every single way that he can.

And, And I was just so taken by his belief.

And, And I did.

I let him.

I let him stay in there until he.

He finally realized that, yeah, John.

John had gone to such a better place there.

He just wasn't.

He just wasn't coming.

He wasn't coming back to us.

But thank you for reminding me of that because it was a.

It was a moment.

It was.

It was quite a moment.

It.

It is quite a moment.

There's so few words because I'm.

I am just thinking of.

I'm just imagining of the scene.

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, imagining that you are no longer in that room, but you know, what's happening in that room.

I'm thinking about dad and how he is just nearly begging to God for him to come back.

And then lastly, I'm imagining John because studies show and science is trying to catch up to God, that when somebody leaves, studies are beginning to say, you know what?

Even though they're clinically dead, you know, the spirit is still there.

And, And I can only imagine John's spirit seeing your father pray that the way he's praying.

I don't know how his spirit is moving.

I don't know if he's able to, you know, listen, because I think hearing is the last thing that goes.

Like, like.

I'm just.

You're right, it is.

I'm just trying to be like, what is John feeling in that last moment of him being loved?

The.

That, that.

The way your dad is expressing himself in that moment.

I don't know.

That, that.

That paragraph just, just was powerful for me.

Oh, I. I'm.

Thank you for reminding me.

For reminding me of it.

Because it.

My father had started.

John didn't have a lot of that head knowledge that you and I discussed earlier.

John always felt like maybe he was not good enough.

Right.

He didn't know Enough.

And a lot of people sometimes do think that in our world and what we do know is that once we have relationship, we want to know more, right?

We want to know more about who it is we're having relationship with.

But my dad started reading the gospels to, to John and they were in Romans.

When John died, they had gone through the four gospels and, and they were in Romans.

And so my dad.

That's one of the sweetest memories I have is my dad sitting in the room with John.

And in John, he couldn't.

He.

His.

His speech was, Was pretty much diminished.

And.

But he, he would, he would, he would motion, he'd start rocking like, like go back again.

Go, Go back again.

I don't understand that.

Could you go back again?

And my dad, I mean, those are just some of this, some of the sweetest moments because, you know, they came over and they moved in with us.

They lived with us for, for six or seven months before John died.

And, and my dad was able to, you know, I still was running a house and taking care of these kids and who's putting dinner on the table or how, you know, who's getting the stuff for the feeding tube and getting John's, all of that, you know, but my dad was just really able to just go in there and put all the things aside and just, just, you know, just, just, just share the word with him.

Wow.

I didn't even think about that, about John's relationship with the Lord.

That's powerful.

Yeah, it was.

It, like I said, he.

He always thought that I was like a smarty pants because I knew, you know, I knew all these stories and I knew all these people and, and I didn't, you know, we don't mean.

I never meant to make myself seem smarter or better.

It was just the way I was.

I was brought up.

So it really.

His.

I think that my dad spending that time and, and really just talking him through a lot of that was very helpful and was of a great, A great comfort for my husband.

Wow, that's.

That's beautiful.

That.

I think that is a. I'm trying to find the word.

It's not powerful, but for people, for those who are preparing to leave this earth, I think that is a strong task to, to be able to take on, if somebody's able to take that on.

Yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

You know, because.

Because it's, it's not a small thing.

I mean, we know too, you know, even in this day, sharing your faith, we.

I ask for holy boldness every day.

You know, I Don't want to hit anybody over the head with it.

But I also want to be able to share it in a way that, that they can receive that.

And you know, a lot of times it can be, it can be very different based on the situation.

But to your point, yeah.

If you know that you are exiting this world, there's a piece of me that would be like, okay, I want to, I want to get a clearer picture.

I want to know more.

Where am I of where I'm headed to, especially if I haven't, if I haven't paid a lot of attention to that.

And, and we know, look there, I'm not here, I'm not here to do anything but encourage people to grow in their relationship with Jesus.

And as I said earlier, it can be through study, it can be through worship, it can be through conversation and communication.

We have so much available to us.

We have this, this digital world that we live in and you can go back and look up sermons and you can listen and you can do all kinds of things that just didn't exist, you know, 15 years ago.

So ignorance is not an excuse anymore, Ashley.

You know what I mean?

You know what I mean?

Doesn't have to be.

Doesn't have to be.

And you know that's part of our commission, right, Is to go out and, and, and teach and preach and spread the world, the word all over to the four corners of the, of the world.

So, yeah, we have gone to some places, haven't we?

Yes.

So your book, the Widow Chose Red is a beautiful and powerful title.

And.

It is very fitting.

And what I, if I can find my words, what I find fascinating is I'm slowly.

Funerals is something that I'm slowly, I wouldn't say getting into, but learning more.

And I remember a co worker of mine, she went through a really rough patch.

And I say rough because she was losing a family member every year.

And this was her, this was her sister that recently unexpectedly passed away.

And it was rough because mom just recently died and she took care of her mom.

So the sister took care of the mom.

Mom passed away.

And then she soon passed after mom passed.

So that, that was rough.

And I remember my co worker did because the pastor had to be out of town.

And so she ended up doing the eulogy.

And it was, it wasn't a eulogy.

It was really a celebration of life.

It was like as if you went.

It was just another church day on how she spoke and just really fired the congregation to continue on.

And what I'm trying To get back to is your title of your book, the Widow Chose Rhett and how it is you continuing to move on.

A Celebration of Life.

This isn't the end.

This is only a chapter to something more.

Absolutely.

Very well said, Ashley.

And you're right.

Celebration of life is a relatively new term, right?

Probably.

I say new meaning within the last 15 years.

Funerals are a somber, morose, very depressing, you know, kind of occasion.

And that's what most of us, if any of us, you know, can remember.

That's how it used to be.

But, you know, the emphasis with a celebration of Life is just that John died in a very brutal way from an illness that was just terrible.

But let's not focus on that, because you know what?

He lived a terrific life.

And look at who he touched and the legacy that he left in his two boys who they did speak.

They.

They recited a poem called the Dash.

There are QR codes in the book that will link you.

Because I did actually have the foresight to videotape the service because I knew I wouldn't remember it right.

You know, and I wanted my boys to be able to hear stories about their father from people besides me, you know, and we did have a lot because the boys were so young.

I mean, Jake's football team, they all came in their jerseys.

You know, John, lacrosse team, they all came in their pen.

And, you know, we had a lot of kids there, so it was an opportunity.

And I think more people are seeing it, too, Ashley, as an opportunity to.

To share what faith, what.

What faith means, what.

It looks like that, as you said, this is just.

Yes, we are going to miss him here, but he has gone on to glory.

And Gustav, what.

That's what he wants for each one of you, too.

So, I mean, it was.

And my dad, who we've talked about a little bit already, he always.

His biggest, biggest goal dream was to stand behind the pulpit at the church and deliver a message.

And John afforded him that opportunity.

And he rehearsed and he practiced.

I told him, I go, dad, even the squirrels, they're tired of listening to this now, you know, but he.

It was one of the greatest.

It was.

It was probably one of the greatest gifts that John was able to give back to my father was to.

Was to have him as part of that.

Of that service.

So.

So, yes, I wore red because red is the color of love.

It is the color of passion.

It is also the color of fire, which you mentioned.

And fire and flame represents the holy Spirit in the celebration of Pentecost.

And I really wanted to.

To make sure that.

That John was just really, truly his life was celebrated.

His death, yes, came early and was something we would have.

We would have rather not.

We would have rather not experienced the way in which we did.

But nonetheless, the way he lived and the way he did die were caused to pause and take note of a life well lived and an ending that finished well.

Wow.

Thanks for sharing that.

Thanks for sharing that.

Oh, my goodness.

Time has really left.

Watch me.

I'm looking, I'm like, oh, my gosh, it's almost an hour.

It's ready.

It's running away from us.

Yes, it is.

I could see it.

There you go.

I mean, God has given this gift.

I want.

Before I ask my last question for you, I just want to thank you for your time and your wisdom.

Your stories of discernment have really touch me in ways that I am going to digest continuously in the next few days.

And so I am honored and blessed.

And the fact that you had this hard moment, I mean, three years is a long time.

I mean, kid can't even graduate high school in three years in the United States.

Every parent wants their kid to be done because high school is such a long time.

Yes.

Yes, it is.

You were right about that.

Yes, it is.

And there are some.

There are some days that feel like years.

Right.

And some years that feel like decades.

Like, is this, Are we done yet?

You know, what these teenagers go through.

But for you to go through three years of honoring your vows of sickness and health, we didn't even touch on that.

I mean, oh, my gosh.

For you to be able to do your best to keep your boys together, for you to be able to let alone keep yourself together.

I remember I talked to a pastor and I said, I don't know how you guys do it.

I can't be a pastor.

I can barely take care of myself.

So you are taking care of your husband, you are taking care of your boys and yourself.

And so I, I just want to be able to give you your flowers on the journey that you have been through and to be able to go through that pain again.

And writing this book for others to be able to pull themselves out of or just to see a light.

Because three years of a disease that you know from the very beginning is no cure is.

Yeah, I just want to give you your flowers.

So, Ashley, I appreciate that.

And, and you know, there are a lot of people out there that are caregiving.

It is, it is a thankless job.

There are days when you just you just don't know how you're going to do it.

And yet it is the highest form of stress service that any one of us can provide to somebody that we love and care about.

And I just want to, you know, encourage you, wherever you might be in that, in that journey, to just know that what you're doing does make a difference and it does count.

And there are a lot more resources out there than were available 15, 17 years ago.

So, you know, do your research, you know, ask for help.

Find it.

There are churches that can provide so much, so much more in the way of support, too.

And you're not alone.

You may feel like you are, and a lot of us do sometimes, because you look around and you're like, nobody else is having to deal with this.

It may look like that, but please know that that's not always.

That's not always the case.

But I have.

I have so enjoyed this time with you.

You have.

You have helped me remember some things that, that I had kind of tucked away.

And, and thank you.

Thank you for that.

And, you know, if people want to connect with me personally, they can go to the website.

I do have an online community@spirited prosperity.com.

i'd love to.

There's a.

There's a.

They're their blogs, their posts, their videos.

Follow me on social.

Whether it's Facebook or Insta or LinkedIn or YouTube, I'm always posting about, you know, things that have helped me through this journey, that are helping me still.

And knowing that, you know, this.

This season, it may feel like it's going to last forever, but.

But it won't, you know, and.

And God, there's a purpose.

There's a purpose in.

In our pain.

And I know that it's really hard sometimes to.

I mean, it's like, geez, Rachel, really.

Yeah, I know.

I've said it to myself a few times, too.

Trust me.

Trust me, you know, I know.

And I still just really just want to offer encouragement and support and prayer, even for.

For anyone who.

Who might need it.

Yeah.

That's beautiful.

My last question.

Thank you.

Is talking about God's purpose.

And.

We.

We didn't touch on this at all, but do you think.

Do you feel your purpose changed?

So with you and John being together from his diagnosis till now, do you think that God's purpose or your understanding of God's purpose for you changed?

It's a great.

It's a great question.

And here's what I.

Here's what I do know.

Interestingly enough, all I ever wanted to do was be in broadcasting.

I really thought I wanted to grow up and be a journalist and be behind the microphone and report stories and be, you know, be out there like Barbara Walters.

Right.

Yeah.

And that didn't happen.

You know, I got married at 24.

I followed my husband.

I was a trailing spouse.

I followed his career.

I did that lovingly.

And I. I knew the day I married him, made the decision to marry him, that my career would not be.

It would not be primary.

And.

And so.

And interestingly enough, when.

When John was diagnosed, I had just stepped out and started doing some television in the Minnesota market.

And I think he was just absolutely terrified that I was going to pursue that and that I wouldn't be able to put him and the boys first.

And I said no.

I stepped away from everything that I thought was important and that I thought I was supposed to do.

And here I am 14 years later talking to you.

And media has changed micro.

You know, people with microphones are all over the place.

We.

We are so.

We live in a place where we can tell our stories with so much more ease.

And.

And I would have never thought that.

And even, you know, even when John died, I thought, okay, this is now.

I'm going to build my platform.

Platform.

I'm going to do this.

I'm going to speak, I'm going to write.

I'm going to do all that God was like, you know what, Rachel?

You have two little boys.

They've just lost their father.

This is still not your time.

I'll let you know.

There's more to your story.

And that is.

And I think that's.

If I can leave the message, too, to anyone out there.

There's more to your story.

Please don't think that you're done.

Please don't think that you're done.

There is more that he has in store for you.

More.

More that he wants to write into your life, into your heart, into your soul, so that you, too, will be able to share and support and encourage someone else in ways that you may not even know or imagine.

But he's going to use it.

He's going to use your life and your story for even more than you could imagine.

There's no better way for me to end that.

Those are words of wisdom that are very powerful.

Okay?

And I think this is where I say, ashley, Godspeed.

And I look forward to our next conversation because I think we should have another one.

I completely agree.

Yeah.

I think that we.

I think there's so much more that we could delve into.

So please know, you know, if anybody.

If anybody doesn't show up.

Spontaneity.

I'm really good with girl.

Write me, text me, shout out, and I'll be here.

Okay.

All right.

I'm gonna write that down.

Oh, my goodness.

Please do.

So.

Closing out because we.

I.

Honestly.

Joking aside, I'm gonna write a note because I feel that we have so much more to talk about than.

Than beyond this.

So those who are watching today, thank you.

Yeah.

We will be right back when God tells us we can come back again.

But I do want you all to remember that God is love, and God wants you to show his love to the world.

So until next time, later.