How did a Jewish boy from New York become so enamored with pork belly?

Well, you probably know some of the answers. But Bruce is here (without Mark, who still has a broken leg) to tell you about his crush on pork belly, the most luxurious of all pork cuts.

He's also got a one-minute cooking tip as well as something that's making him happy in food this week.

Here are the segments for this episode of COOKING WITH BRUCE & MARK:

[00:25] Our one-minute cooking tip: Keep a toothbrush in the kitchen for cleaning things (but not your mouth!).

[01:39] Bruce's wild relationship with pork belly!

[16:08] What’s making Bruce happy in food this week? Braised Brisket!

Hey, I'm Bruce Weinstein, and this is

the podcast Cooking with Bruce and Mark.

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And Mark is still recovering, so this week

it's just the podcast Cooking with Bruce.

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I've got a one minute cooking tip.

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I'm going to talk about my

relationship with pork belly.

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Yep.

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And I'm going to tell you what's

making me happy in food this week.

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So let's get started.

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Our one minute cooking tip.

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Keep a toothbrush in the kitchen.

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Yep, and not for brushing your

teeth at the kitchen sink.

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That's actually a little disgusting,

But it's a great cleaning tool for tight

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spaces like waffle irons or between the

grids on a grill pan It's also great for

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scrubbing stubborn dirt off of potatoes

and other sturdy vegetables like winter

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squash and the outside of melons So just

like you change a toothbrush in your

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mouth every few months Yes, you should be

changing your toothbrush every few months.

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Do the same thing with the

toothbrush in the kitchen.

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before I get to the next segment

of this podcast, I want to thank

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you for listening to Cooking with

Bruce and Mark and for supporting

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this podcast by giving us a review.

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Please go to wherever it is that

you get your podcasts and leave

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us a review, give us a rating.

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Maybe I can even ask for five stars.

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Why not?

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Mark does all the time.

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And that's what really

helps us with the analytics.

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We are not funded in any other way.

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So we do appreciate you giving us

those reviews and do appreciate

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your time that it takes to do that.

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And also love that you're here listening

and with us on this cooking journey.

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Okay, my relationship with pork belly.

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As a New York Jewish kid, you'd think

that I'd have little relationship

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with pork belly, but You'd be wrong.

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Well, sort of.

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My relationship was with bacon.

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And it's really funny because when I talk

to other people about their relationship

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with bacon, especially Jewish kids, Jewish

people, they never ate bacon as a kid.

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What I hear was that bacon

was like the forbidden thing.

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They might even eat bologna and ham

at lunch, but they never ate bacon.

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My house, we ate bacon.

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We never ate ham.

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In fact, Growing up, ham was the

most Christian of all your meats.

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In fact, I didn't even know that, like,

smoked ham existed until I was a teenager.

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We went to some cousin's

house on Long Island.

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This is my mother's family.

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And they had served a

smoked spiral cut ham.

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And my mother and her mother were both

Outraged that this cousin would do it.

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And once I tasted it, I didn't

speak to them both for a week

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because I was so angry that they'd

kept that from me for so long, but

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bacon was a big thing in our house.

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Look, it was even a big thing

in that grandmother's house

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who was upset with the ham.

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And she only bought kosher meat.

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She had meat dishes and dairy dishes.

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But I guess, you know, her idea of

kosher was a separate pan for the bacon

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because my grandfather insisted on bacon.

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He was not kosher at all.

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He did not come from a religious

family the way she did.

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So she had bacon for him, but it was

in a separate pan and that's bacon

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and it's smoked and it's succulent.

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And for a lot of people

who don't even realize it.

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Bacon is pork belly, right?

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It's just the pork belly that

has been smoked, and then

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usually you buy it sliced.

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You can buy chunks of bacon,

but usually you buy it sliced.

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Now, plain pork belly is

like a whole other animal.

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The unsmoked kind of pork belly.

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And it's used in cuisines

all over the world.

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It's used in Germany, it's used in France,

the French eat it as charcuterie, it gets

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boiled in pâte au feu, it gets roasted.

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but you probably are going to see

it more in Asian culture and even

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though as a family when I was a kid we

went to Chinatown a lot for dinners.

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We went all the time and my

parents loved Cantonese food.

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It was a battle we had all the time

because I wanted to go into a Sichuan

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restaurant and a Hunan restaurant

and I wanted desperately to try hot

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chilis and hot foods that I read about,

but they wanted to have chow mein.

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They wanted to have

shrimp in lobster sauce.

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Again, you see, we weren't

kosher, but we didn't eat ham.

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Really weird.

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And we didn't eat pork belly,

except for the bacon kind.

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But shrimp in lobster sauce is a

thing because there's no lobster.

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It's basically shrimp in the kind

of sauce you would serve with

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lobster if you were serving lobster.

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And that is totally an Americanized

Chinese dish if I ever heard one.

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So we went there and I never got

to eat pork belly and I didn't

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discover that pork belly was a thing

until I went for my first Chinese

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cooking lesson at about age 18.

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I took these classes at the new school

which is still around, new school

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in New York, and the guy teaching

it was, get this, Norman Weinstein.

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was the late 70s and only then

could someone named Norman Weinstein

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be the Chinese cooking expert.

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That is not going to happen today.

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No relation, Weinstein, but no relation.

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And I have to say, I didn't love it.

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The first time he brought in

this giant slab of pork belly,

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all I saw was all of that fat.

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Now, of course, bacon has the

same amount of fat as pork belly,

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but when you cook the slices of

bacon, the fat renders out, right?

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And it shrinks down and you

have the crunchy, crunchy bits

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that are left where the fat was.

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And this Pork belly that wasn't

smoked was just way too fatty for me.

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And I had this thing about fat in my

late teens all the way up to my 40s.

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I didn't eat fat.

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It upset my stomach.

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I didn't like it.

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I just had this aversion

to big chunks of fat.

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I wouldn't eat chuck roast.

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When Mark moved in, And he was a

great cook, and he found out that I

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was making wolf bourguignon with top

round, not even bottom round, but

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top round, because I didn't like fat.

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He nearly lost his mind.

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And then, he discovered the

joys of Chinese delivery.

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And, my God, you have to really

live in New York to understand

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the joys of Chinese food delivery.

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But, I never Let him

get anything deep fried.

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He always said, oh, let's try orange

beef for General Tsav's chicken.

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I was like, that is nothing but

deep fried gristle and fat chunks.

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We're getting white meat chicken.

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I would yell at them on the phone that I

wanted a stir fried and not deep fried.

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And the poor thing, poor Mark, he

never got any of that until much later.

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But now.

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Pork belly has become one of my go

to meats for all sorts of dishes.

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Yes, I have overcome my aversion to fat.

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I love fried chicken.

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I love pork fat.

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I like chuck.

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I like everything that's gelatinous

and rich and fatty and oily and yum.

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So, pork belly has become one of my

go to meats for all sorts of dishes.

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A lot of Asian dishes, of course,

but also dishes that don't

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require soy sauce or fish sauce.

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Like, for one thing I love to

roast pork belly and serve it

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with a French lentil salad.

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For this, I actually prefer

pork belly without the skin.

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So if you're buying pork belly and it has

the skin, you can ask them to cut it off.

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Or you could just slice it off at home.

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Just try not to get too much fat

off as you slice the skin off.

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A lot of salt, a lot of pepper.

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I put it on a rack on a roasting pan.

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350 degrees on convection if you have it.

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A one pound piece or one and a half

pound piece is going to take about 45

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minutes to get crispy on the top and

brown and the fat is rendering out.

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Inside is juicy and I serve

it with a French lentil salad.

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And what I mean by that are

those little green lentil dupuis.

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I boil those, I strain them,

and then to make a dressing.

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And this is the best part because

it's a double pork belly dish.

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To dress the lentils, I'm gonna chop

up some bacon, yeah, some smoked pork

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belly, render that out, then with all

of that fat in the pan, and the crispy

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bacon pieces, I'm gonna throw in a little

bit of shallots, and some diced carrot,

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and some diced celery, and saute that

in that bacon fat till they just start

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to soften, throw in some Dijon mustard,

a little Worcestershire, then deglaze

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that pan with some white wine vinegar,

Dump all of that into the lentils.

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And that is your French lentil salad.

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Serve it with a pork belly and do not

see a cardiologist for at least a month.

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But there is something.

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You can get in every French bistro that

has pork belly in it, the smoked kind.

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Salad au lardon.

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Well, what is lardon in French?

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Bacon.

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And to make a salad au lardon, you take

the bacon chunks and you toss them,

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in this case, with frisee lettuce,

and you make a dressing with all the

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bacon fat that was in the pan and

you grate some parmesan over the top

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and it is an amazing dish especially

when you top it with a poached egg.

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So those are the non Asian ways

that I like to make pork belly.

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Let's talk about some of

my favorite Asian dishes.

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You could braise pork belly with soy

sauce and rice wine and spices and that's

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usually called red cooking pork belly.

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You could also do twice cooked pork where

you boil the pork belly and then you

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slice it up and then you stir fry it.

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with leeks and with fermented chili

sauce, and crispy skin pork belly.

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This is kind of an Asian version of

that roasted plain pork belly that

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I did with the French lentil salad.

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So for crispy skin pork belly,

you want to take your one and a

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half to two pound piece of pork

belly and leave the skin on it.

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Then rub salt.

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all over it and set it in the

refrigerator uncovered overnight.

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That salt is going to draw so much

moisture out of the skin and out

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of the pork that it's going to help

it get crispier , the next day you

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wipe all the salt and moisture off

of that, turn it upside down, score

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it in an X pattern through the meat,

but not down all the way to the skin.

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Rub some five spice powder into that.

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Okay, turn it back.

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You've got to take a lot of

toothpicks or the sharp points of a

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carving fork, and you want to skin.

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You want to stab it and stab it and

stab it like a hundred holes at least.

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You want to allow places for the

fat to come up, for it to render

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out, for that to get super crispy.

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So the skin's been salted, the skin

has been wiped, the skin has been

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poked, and now the skin is going to

get rubbed with a little vinegar.

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Now you have to put the pork belly on a

piece of foil and fold the foil up just

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so it covers the sides of the pork belly

but leaves the top totally uncovered.

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Now put that piece of foil with

the pork belly in it on a tray.

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Put that in the oven at about 325 degrees.

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Oh, for about an hour.

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hour and then crank the oven up at

that point to 450 and you are going

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to watch that skin bubble up and

get crispy and turn into something

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that looks almost deep fried.

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that takes maybe 10

minutes at the high heat.

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So you really want to be careful

and watch it and make sure it

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doesn't burn but it does bubble up.

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Okay, I talked about

red cooking pork belly.

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So I have to tell you how I do it.

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Cut the pork belly into 1 to 1

12 inch cubes with the skin on.

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Bring a large pot of water to a boil.

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Throw in those cubes of pork

belly and you're going to let them

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boil for about 5 to 7 minutes.

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Skim off any scum that comes to the top

of that pot and then drain the pork belly

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and put them on a tray and let them cool.

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Very common when you're braising meat

in Chinese cooking you will boil it

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first to get some impurities out before

you actually start the real cooking.

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Now we're going to take about

four tablespoons of sugar.

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If you have access to rock

sugar, Asian yellow or white

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rock sugar, you can use that.

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I dissolve that in about four

tablespoons of water in a skillet,

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and I'm going to caramelize that.

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I do it in a nonstick skillet.

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It makes it a little easier.

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And you're literally just going to

boil that until the sugar turns golden

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brown, smells like burnt caramel.

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Now, when it gets to that

point, you throw the cooled.

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Pork belly cubes into that pan

with the caramel and toss it

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around and take it off the heat.

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Now transfer that pork belly

tossed in caramel into either a

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dutch oven or if you have a clay

pot, that's the best thing to use.

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Throw them in a clay pot.

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You're going to put in a couple of star

anise, a cinnamon stick, few tablespoons

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of chopped up ginger, three or four

garlic cloves, oh, and four or five

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scallions cut into one or two inch pieces.

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Pour over that about a quarter

cup of Chinese cooking wine,

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about a quarter cup of soy sauce,

and then the rest with water.

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Bring that to a simmer and let that

simmer for about an hour and 20 minutes

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or until the pork belly is pretty tender.

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Skim the fat.

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Raise the heat, boil that down so the

sauce is a little bit thicker, and

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that is amazing red cooking pork belly.

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You know, a friend emailed me the other

day and said Mark had mentioned in

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his book discussion group that she's

part of, that I had made him pork

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belly for dinner and she wanted to

know more about where to find it and

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what to look for when she's buying it.

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So here's what I told her.

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I have three pork belly

outlets in my life.

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One is Costco.

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Yep.

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At least the Costco by me always

has pork belly and it's kind of

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interesting the way they sell it.

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Each package is about four to five pounds

of pork belly, which has been cut into

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two inch wide, but long strips, each

strip being about a pound and a half.

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That's really good for roasting.

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It's really good for some of these dishes,

but it doesn't have the skin on it.

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So if the skin is important

to you, then that's probably

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not the best place to get it.

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You can go to an Asian market.

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The one I go to always has two pound

pieces of pork belly with the skin on it.

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They're the perfect size for

almost everything I need to do.

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The third outlet I have is a local farm.

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Shout out once again to Howling Flats

Farm in North Canaan, Connecticut.

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The pork belly there is amazing.

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The meat is organic.

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The only problem was the last time

I called and asked for pork belly.

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All they had were the giant

10 pound sides of pork belly.

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So I had to buy the whole thing,

thawed it, cut it into pieces,

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shrink wrapped it, and refroze it.

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And yes, you can thaw meat and

refreeze it, but there is a rule to it.

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If you've thawed it in the

fridge, it's okay to refreeze it.

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If you have thawed the meat

on the counter or anywhere.

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That is higher than 40 degrees . It

is not safe to refreeze it.

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And it is never safe to refreeze

ground meat of any kind.

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So, that's my take on pork belly.

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It is one of my favorite things.

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I hope you A lot of our books

have pork belly recipes.

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Check them out.

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And if you're making something amazing

with pork belly, go to our Facebook group,

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Cooking with Bruce and Mark, and share it.

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Show a picture.

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Tell us what you made.

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I want to know about your

relationship with pork belly.

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Okay.

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What's making me happy in food this week?

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Brisket, a classic Jewish food.

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I went to Costco and I got

this giant 20 pound brisket.

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This is the biggest thing I've ever seen.

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And I cut it into four five pound

roasts and I braised one last night

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with red wine and and carrots and sweet

onions and mushrooms and fresh herbs.

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I put a little tomato paste

and Worcestershire in it.

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It was absolutely amazing.

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Mark asked for mashed potatoes with

it, which he got because with his

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broken leg, he gets what he wants.

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And brisket was making me

happy in food this week.

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That's it for today's episode.

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We talked about brisket.

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We talked about pork belly and we talked

about toothbrushes kept in your kitchen.

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Thanks for joining me.

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Please share your thoughts about

food at our website, bruceandmark.

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com or on our Facebook group

page, cooking with Bruce and Mark

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and don't forget to subscribe.

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