What if spirituality wasn't about separation from the world—but about building a deeper relationship with it?
In this episode of Spirit Sherpa, Kelle Sparta and Jules welcome Charlemagne Tremon for a fascinating exploration of Shinto, Japan's indigenous spiritual tradition. Together they discuss the core principles of Shinto, the concept of kami, the sacred relationship between humanity and nature, and the importance of harmony, reciprocity, and reverence in daily life.
You'll discover how Shinto differs from many Western religious traditions, why nature itself is considered sacred, and how developing a relationship with the living world around you can deepen your spiritual practice. The conversation also explores animism, spiritual ecology, honoring place, maintaining balance, and finding inner harmony in an increasingly chaotic world.
Whether you're interested in world spirituality, nature-based traditions, shamanism, animism, or simply living a more connected life, this episode offers powerful insights into one of the world's most beautiful spiritual paths.
Kelle Sparta
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Hey, y'all. I'm Jules. Welcome back to another episode of Spirit Sherpa, the show that helps and encourages you on your journey to unlock your magic mojo. With me, as always, is the spirit doctor, Kelle Sparta. How are you doing, Kelle? Are you feeling better? Not much.
I'm, I'm, I'm unmedicated, so that's progress. But yeah, still, still working my way out of this cold. It, it's really got its hold on me. So that's all right. We will power through. Yes. Well, to take your mind off your, off the symptoms and all the snot and all the drippies and everything, we have a wonderful guest with us today.
Charlemagne, save my butt, baby. I can't talk. Charlemagne is here. I will happily talk about this topic, and I hope that the, the, the good health visits you soon. I have, I have been working on it. Yeah, I'm sorry you're actually not feeling well. Um, and, and Jewel, just before we get into this topic, I need to say Jewel sent both my husband and I some Reiki a couple of days ago, and she said, "Oh, I'm feeling like you have it here, and he has it there, and da, da, da, da," and I'm like, "Yep, that's exactly true."
That was exactly what was true. Yay. And she had it right on the head. So ... Well done, madam. Yay. Thank you. Thank you. Awesome. I was so excited. I was like, "Well," and here's him, "Hmm, you know what? We're going for it. This is what I feel." And do you know how intimidating this is telling this to my shaman? Do you realize how intimidating this is?
Mm-hmm. And yet how affirming, right? That's awesome. Yeah. I'm like, "Should I? Should I not?" It
I'm like, "Yes." Risk gives you opportunity for reward. That's it. Whoo. Well, honey, that goes back to Inner Peace 101 and exercising my courage muscle 'cause that, that took some courage to roll that with you. So thank you. Thank you. Yes, I was excited. Yes. She gets a two thumbs up. So okay. So what are ... Uh, oh, oh, one more thing.
I, uh, we have some listeners that ... We're, we're charting in Nigeria now. Oh, wow. That's so cool. And Czechoslovakia. Wow. So if you guys listening to- Hello, Nigeria ... Hello, Nigeria and Czechoslovakia. How are you? Greetings. So happy to have you- Greetings across the globe ... in the family. Yes. So we're super excited.
So with that said, let's move our way into our topic for this week, which we're talking about the religion or, or the practice of Shinto. Well, so let's just start with that. It is considered a religion. It is considered one of the major religions of Japan, where it origin- originated. It's considered actually an indigenous religion.
So not like Buddhism, which was brought in, although Buddhism is another major religion in Japan. Um, Shinto is very beautiful. Uh, there are many, uh, many, uh, things about it that people who may be on a more earth-based or spiritual path, including shamanism or paganism, may recognize some similarities in the basic tenets of Shinto.
Um, and one of the most recognizable ones will be the honoring and respect and love of nature, um, which we can see throughout it, which drives quite a lot of Shinto. Um, actually, so let's start with that. If I can tell you what the f- the four basic tenets of Shinto, they are, as I was saying- So I, I'm, I'm hearing people go, "Ooh, like The Four Agreements?"
Right? I'm... That's what I'm hearing. Um, I can feel that. It's, you know, there, there are certainly agreements that you make. There's certain things that you do, so let's discuss. The first is the love and respect of nature. Um, the second is the, uh, honoring of family and tradition The third is what's called matsuri, which are the, um, worship of the, an honor given to the kami, the spirits, the gods, the deities of the religion, as well as the festivals.
And the fourth is what is sometimes translated loosely, it's not a perfect translation, as purity, which includes physical cleanliness and inner harmony. So those are the four major tenets of Shinto. Which is not the same as Don Miguel Ruiz's four agreements. Uh, no, not at all. It's, that's why I said to you, they're four things, but they are different types of things.
You know me, I just had to throw something in there, so, 'cause we always look at how things are interrelated here. That's our, that's our deal. So i- if you think about it, these really fit a lot with Japanese culture. Yes. This is a very old religion, so much of Japanese culture was built upon it. There's a, a beautiful Yeah, this is, this is the sort of thing that we talk about, is that you have to understand the culture in which a belief structure is created, um, or upon which a, a belief structure is created or, or the, where the culture came from the belief, either way, in order to truly understand the belief structure, right?
And so, um, y- to, to imagine that you can understand with Western eyes an Eastern tradition is a bit folly. I would say that while it takes a sensitivity, let's put it that way. It, to try to imprint, or l- like going back one f- one step before the, even the imprinting, which naturally happens. Before one even approaches this, it's really important to let, uh, let go of our preconceived notions about it.
Um, again, Japan didn't open to the West until much, much, much, much, much later, truly, and so there was a lot of mystery around Japan. And there was, you know, uh, isolationism, you know. In, in some regards, that was a very good thing for them. A lot of things really fell apart and went, um, south, I think. A lot of people who are more traditional would see it that way in Japan.
And then there's others who are like, "Well, the expansion of the West and the exchange of ideas was good." So, you know, it's like anything where you can see the positives, the pros and cons, right? You can see that. However, what didn't ch- change particularly much is the basics of Shinto. Um, and the way that it practice, it's practiced rather, has evolved over time, and in some ways it's- Remarkable easily entered into, remarkably easy to enter into because there are shrines all over the country, shrines to the different kami, and the kami, like I said to you before, are sort of this animistic idea of they're gods, they're spirits.
Also a phenomenon, right? You th- the gods of phenomenon, the gods of storms, the gods of different characteristics even, and energies that exist. So- Like architecture ... kami is a, a s- yeah, a small word that is got extremely broad meaning. You know, it's not separate from nature. They're parts of nature. Um, they possess many characteristics, many.
Um, and interconnecting energy of the universe is itself thought of as a kami, and they're, uh, really everywhere. Everywhere. And so it's- Instead of using- ... everything- ... different words for these things like in other belief structures, they basically lump them all into a single category of kami. Yeah, and we, we could, you can see it's a simplification on a certain r- in a certain way.
Um, but yes, when they speak of the various forces, the sacred forces that are venerated in the r- in the religion, it's the kami, and there are many types. Many, many. And, and kami being K-A-M-I? Yes, K-A-M-I. Yeah, not separate from nature but are of nature, I think is kind of really important. So instead of how we have in the West usually the idea of a, a higher power, a, a certain o- oversight goddess or god that we go to, in Shinto it's everything around us we go to, everything around us.
So the thing that's becoming ... Here's a great example. A thing that's happening more and more here in America are land honoring, right? That's what's happening. We're doing much more land honoring. This would be absolutely you would be doing this in the Shinto religion. You would be honoring the land. You'd be honoring every being on that land, whether it's a tree or blades of grass.
They all have that sort of animistic spirit. Well, and the interesting thing about assigning them all the same name is that it makes it impossible to make them hierarchical. On a certain level, yes. And then there's of course one thing that, uh, it's funny, like with everything there's an exception. So their sun goddess, Amaterasu Ōmikami, the over kami, the chief deity of Shinto, which I like to point out is a goddess.
It's a sun goddess, Amaterasu. So many people sort of have this interesting preconception about Japan being this, you know, they see the samurai and this very male dominant culture they believe. But in truth, there's a lot more balance Uh, there's a lot of very feminine interweaving, the yin and the yang, which is not a-- I shouldn't use that 'cause that's really not true to Japan, that, that, they wouldn't even really say it that way.
But we would see that, um, the, the flow of the masculine and the feminine, of the active and res- and receptive qualities are very much in flow and very much everywhere, and can shift, which is interesting, too. Well, and it's, it's interesting in the fact that the, the sun is a goddess in this tradition as opposed to in most of the other traditions it's a god.
Um, and it makes sense that the sun would be the overarching goddess or deity because without the sun, everything else dies. So, you know, that makes sense, too, from that perspective. So it's, it's-- I'm wrapping my head around it as we're talking about it because this is something I don't know anything about.
So I am, I am being the student in this scenario, so here we go. It, it is actually something that it's funny, I think many people in the West, particularly many Americans in the last several decades, we can laugh about this, but had no idea. It's the influx of Japanese culture in terms of art, and it's pop culture as well.
So if you look at anime, anime has brought a ton of stories, traditional stories, as well as new stories regarding the kami and the m- mythology of Japan, which I think is very, very beautiful and true to form, 'cause there's this idea that the kami are ever-changing themselves, that they are a presence.
There's a, uh, a, a anime on Netflix right now called Avatar that is particularly good for expressing the elements and things like that. So if you haven't watched that, that, that is particularly good for that. Uh, but it's interesting 'cause it's also chakra related, so that's not exactly Japanese. True, it's not.
And I would say that that's not necessarily, uh, connected to Shinto or the kami themselves, that that's d- distinct to that anime series. But what's interesting is that the, the goddess being the sun in Japan, and Japan being i- you know, the flag of Japan is the rising sun. Exactly. Yeah. The main force is the sun, and so we, we, again, back to that idea of Amaterasu as the major chief deity of Shinto.
Um, but some interesting things you might find, uh, that I find interesting about the kami in terms of their defining characteristics, um, there's an idea that kami are of two minds that, and you can engage them. So they're benevolent and loving and can be very nurturing if, especially if you go pay homage to them or you have a dialogue, a relationship with them.
But if you fall out of favor then you may want to appease them to regain their favor 'cause they can also be very wrathful and very destructive. That's kind of similar to the Orishas. Yes, exactly. So there's, there is that type of similarity about them. So, um, there's that. Um, generally it's thought that they are not specifically, the entities themselves are not specifically visible to humans, but that they inhabit specific places, and like I was saying earlier, are natural phenomenon as well.
You can ask the kami for blessing, they can be interacted with, but they don't necessarily appear to people in the way that we see them in a lot of anime. So I'm here to kind of, kind of, uh, help clarify some things that may be misconceptions based on pop culture. Um, but I love the idea that they're shown that way because it, it gives a, an idea of how they might be engaged with, and I think there's a tradition of people having them come in dreams and take form in their dreams, so that feels more in alignment with what we see in some of the anime.
So now I've heard the term deva, right? Um, the deva, which is the spirit of something. Is that, uh, related to or similar to the kami or...? I would say it's somewhat similar. Like when you're looking at Hindu traditions and we talk about the deva, the deva of a place, the deva of a plant, et cetera, the spirit of it.
So yes, in some ways, uh, you could say that there is a correlation, let's put it that way. There is a correlation between those things. But the other thing about them is that the kami, it's kind of interesting, um, you know, that I was saying earlier, there's lots of shrines all over Japan to the various kami, and people sometimes set those things up at home, a home altar for the kami.
They want to really get into relationship with them. There's public shrines and, um, shrines in nature too. Some of the most beautiful are these tiny little... You could walk by and miss them if you weren't paying attention. So the idea that, again, is very much like many pagan traditions, that nature is our church, right, nature is our sanctuary, is very true in Shinto.
And so you will find these places where the various kami have, uh, shrines installed where people go. And the idea too is that, um, the kami themselves are thought of as always in, on the move. They're not stuck in one place. So often you think people go, they feel like they have to be, in some traditions, in a particular type of building, in a particular, with a particular type of leader to talk to God, which is very much opposite of Shinto and the kami That when you're visiting their place of worship, it's like you're going to their, like almost like a telephone, right?
It's, it's where they can hear you the best, let's say it that way. It's almost like a broadcasting station, right? You visit them there, um, but they don't necessarily stay there forever. There's stories about the kami moving on. So especially if a shrine isn't getting enough offerings or enough people coming, the kami might go, "Okay, this, it's time to move on, time to move along."
Um, yeah, so there's that. If, uh, someone is to, uh, come into relationship with a kami, what would be the type of thing that one would do? Often, um, shrines get established and maintained by people coming to them and literally speaking to the kami like you would to, um, a respected elder. So you would go and often bring food offerings, sometimes incense offerings.
In Japan they have a tremendous incense tradition, and that's a whole topic for another time if, if you're interested. But they, they offer incense and prayers and sometimes songs. Sometimes there are prayer ties that are left in the places because sometimes there are trees associated with the, the shrine of the kami.
Sometimes coins are left, money is left, and usually that's so that the priestly caste who are taking care of a shrine can up- do the upkeep on it, as well as maintain their lives to a, you know, a humble degree. So there are many ways. And having a regular practice, just like we talk about having a regular practice when we're engaging with any s- spiritual element or entity.
You would want to not just come to them to ask for things, but to come and praise, especially in nature. Perhaps if there's a shrine and there's... it needs cleaning up, maybe there's been a lot of trees have fallen, it's winter and a lot of trees have fallen or a lot of leaves have fallen in the autumn, you rake it, you honor them, you say, "Thank you for this beautiful place."
So it's, again, a very, both formal and informal. It becomes very personal for many people. So this is gonna seem random, but it's not. Um, so there's this guy on TikTok who is in the UK who is, uh, cleaning up his surrounding areas. He's pulling all the garbage out of all of the natural places, and he's taking months sometimes to clean up a particular area and, uh, 'cause he's doing it all by himself.
And to me, that feels like it would be a dedication to a kami of an area. Um, would that be an accurate depiction? Yes, I think that's an excellent way to establish a relationship and to maintain it. Absolutely. Um, I think about the kami of my eucalyptus grove, right? There's definitely... There's the kami of the trees themselves.
There's the overarching kami of the grove, which encompasses all of the beings that live there, right? So it's a, it's a complex concept, and it's, it's also a simple concept. Um, you know, there's an interesting idea that, um, you've raised a good point, that the people have an obligation to keep the kami happy, right?
But the kami also perform certain functions, too, uh, of, of keeping the place that they inhabit lively. And so it is a symbiotic relationship, which is very different than going to a West- or Western spiritual places, Judeo-Christian, where it's like, no, the idea is like we need to appease God, and if we're not doing the right thing, God isn't happy, and so therefore no one gets whatever it is that they want.
So it's very, very different, where you're talking really about a symbiosis, and it's, it feels very different in my experience. Yeah. So that would, that would really reflect- A lot of what I have been doing here in Panama since I moved here, in the idea of coming into relationship with the volcano Barú and my surroundings, and to really just being quiet and being still and feeling into the landscape and feeling into the environment and becoming
Recognizing that it's not going to conform to me, I have to conform to it, right? I have to come into relationship with it. And, and it's not about making it into what I want it to be, it's about me finding my place in the harmony of it. Exactly. Yes. But there is, there, there is a very beautiful, uh, idea about, like I said before, harmony.
Being in inner harmony is one of the tenets of Shinto. And so absolutely that we are trying to find this beautiful connectivity and relationship with all of our surroundings. And like I said, it's, it's not just nature, it's other kinds of places. Like, there's the idea that there's a kami of cities, but each city has a
Right? And I'm sure you've gone traveling and you know that. I'd certainly feel that. Like, the kami of the city I'm in versus the kami of other cities that I have lived in. Like, that energy and how I relate to it and how it relates to me. Yeah. Well, and you know, people talk about New York, New York City, as being, you know, New York and Paris and, you know, I mean, there, there are just cities where they've, where the kami of the city is already recognized.
Whether the person recognizes the specific energies of it or not, we speak of them with a type of respect because we know that there's a gravity to those places, that they have been revered, and that lots of things have happened there historically that have imbued them with these types of energies. So there's that, too.
Yeah. Yeah. You know, as part of, um, Shinto you would say that there's a, a great mythology tradition in Shinto. W- what's also interesting about Shinto is that there's no founding book. Like, here's the thing that's kind of interesting. Like, the, the, the ... It's, it's there's not the same kind of thing like the Bible.
There is not that. Again, it's, it's much more about a spirituality that is based in experience and following the tenets. The tenets are about as close to a Bible as we would recognize it or a holy book as you're gonna get And so it very much relies on each person finding what is essentially true and beautiful within themselves and within the world around them, and how they relate to it, which is, I think, quite beautiful.
So, you know, engaging the ideas of growth, change, development, again, inner harmony, honor, honoring the family, honoring the community, honoring nature, and that that becomes, to me, really makes a lot of sense- Well, and there's certainly- ... how to live ... less to argue about and to foist upon others. You bet. So what else do we need to know before we wrap up for the day?
If, if you had time for one more thing. Yeah, one more thing. Um, I guess this is sort of an East/West thing, and as, as well as a, you know, um, welcoming thing I think that for people of the West looking at Shinto can be very deep and beautiful as a subject, and that it, it... and as you were saying, and I think this is actually really a, an appropriate and good thing to end with.
At a time when there's so much strife and division based on so many things, including religion, to be able to move through the world and see the beauty in all, inner and outer, is a great gift. And to be able to have ways of offering both praise and reciprocity is also powerful, and a great place to in- engage spiritually.
Okay. So I think the Kelleism for that is find your harmony. Yeah, inner and outer. Find your harmony. Mm-hmm. This was, this was wonderful. I was taking notes 'cause I knew nothing about this. I didn't even know how to say the title of this thing. So I was, I'm, I'm... I very much enjoyed this. I always enjoy learning, so thank you so much for that.
egory that we started back in:And I would say also, many cities have, and we certainly do here in San Francisco, and I know there used to be one in Boston, a Japanese cultural center, and I highly recommend visiting a Japanese cultural center. If nothing else, for just stepping in there and you're in an environment that is so peaceful.
So again, the word harmonious. So harmonious, so beautiful, that you immediately take a deep breath and you relax. It's... I can't recommend it enough. Charlamagne, tell us something that you do, because I know you know, I know you do a bunch of things, and we've, we've talked about your... We talked about your astrology, and we talked about, uh, the cacao ceremony stuff.
Let's talk about your custom herbal blends today, because you do a little bit of everything, and you're like the, the, the Jane of all trades and who, who masters it all, you know? And so, um- Let's talk about the customer blends because those are really quite amazing And it's something that I really love to do.
So I work with people on designing custom blends, both herbal blends for their homes, as, you know, both as enhancing just their lifestyle as, and essential oils. So I'm an aromathist and what is also referred to as a myrrhophor, which is a mistress of the oils. So I've been studying ancient uses of oils in ancient cultures, Egypt, Greece, Rome, India, all over the place.
And I make blends for people based on both what their mental, emotional, physical, and psychic needs are. And I really specialize in making blends based on people's astrological charts and various types of transits that they may be experiencing or preparing to experience so that they have something that they can...
And I teach them anointing rituals for themselves so they have something that helps them to feel very grounded and very embodied. Embodiment practice is so important, regardless of if we're in a time of great harmony since we're on Harmony, or if we're in a time of chaos. Having ways that we can do beautiful, simple, caring for ourselves energetically, physically, emotionally can be so wonderful.
And so I love to do that with people because it becomes a real fun thing, 'cause it's so, it's so... Well, it's sensual, right? And the old brain, which is what's activated through our sense of smell, activates memory, activates dream. It's
so powerful. It's really one of my favorite things to do. Thank you for asking about it. So basically when somebody gets an oil from you, they're also getting a personalized ritual based in their own astrology to support them through whatever the next stage of their evolution is. So it's not just an oil.
Right. Right. It's not just... And, and the funny thing, and I'm glad you brought that up, 'cause it doesn't always smell awesome. It's... But you know what I think? In the way that we think of perfume, right? Perfume always smells... We... And also it's all aldehydes, and I only use, you know, essential oils and mostly organic essential oils because anything that goes on your body gets into your blood, and that's a real- that's a reality.
So I'm very careful about sourcing. But yeah, sometimes something that we need to strengthen us may not smell like flowers. It may smell like strength. How does strength smell? Well, think about things that are strong. Think about trees. It may smell very woody. It may smell very earthy, right? So these are other ways that I work with these things to help people even with something as simple as elemental imbalances.
People who feel, you know, since we're going with the earthing, for people who have a hard time focusing or feel ungrounded, I might make them an oil that's very earthy as well as one that stimulates various aspects of the brain as well as aspects of speech if people need to communicate better. So there's a whole wide range of ways to utilize oils on, in this manner, and that's part of what being a mirror for is.
It's me working with them to figure out how we can find something that will best suit what their needs are now or going forward. That could be if you're looking for a practice in your life, then simply having a variety of these oils for different purposes that have been specifically formulated for you with a ritual attached to them is a way to, you know, every morning you get up and you go, "Okay, what am I focusing on today?
What do I need support in? Here's the, the piece that I do, and here's the ritual that goes along with it, and this is my daily practice," right? That alone could be a perfectly lovely daily practice. So if you're looking for a daily practice and some support in creating it, that could be a way to do that.
Absolutely, and that's a really good way of putting it, and it's certainly a lot simpler and clearer than what I was gonna say. So thank you for that. It's, it's really, really true, 'cause I think about that, right? If you were to see... Well, you've seen it, Kelle, but Jill has never, Jill's never seen it. You know, I have dozens and dozens of bottles, hundreds of bottles.
Right? I help you pack them. There's a lot. Yeah. Okay, Jill hasn't seen it- I help her pack ... Jill hasn't seen it yet. Okay? Right. We're just gonna say Jill hasn't seen it yet. Right on. Right on. Yeah. She has an entire room- The idea- ... in these oils ... the idea. Yeah. That's called slumber party- Yeah. There's a room
and that's where Jill's sleeping In the good-smelling room. Yes. So. So yeah, this is, this is a great way to start a practice. So if that's what you're looking to put into your life, then, you know, get in touch with Charlemagne and let her craft it for you, um, because she's a badass, and we know that. So and, and it's never just one piece with her.
You're always doing multiple pieces all at once. She's, she's such a, a great seeker, which I think you guys know by now after all the episodes that she's been on talking about shit, so that she just knows. You know? Um, everything gets integrated in, in a unique way when you work with her. So, uh, you know, reach out.
She- We'll, we'll have her contact information in the show notes, and, uh, you'll be able to reach out to her and talk to her about that. And, and, uh, thanks for being on the show again, Charlemagne. It's always great to have you here. Thank you so much for having me. It's delightful to be with you both. Thank you, and thank you for that very generous shout-out.
I really appreciate it. I, I only say it 'cause it's true. Thank you. Well, guys, that's all that we have time for this week. So tune in next time when Kelle adds another chapter into your guide to minute energy ... Sorry, Chris, I just fucked that up royally. We gonna try that again, baby. No, just keep going. I'd leave that in.
Leave that in. We're just gonna keep going. Lord, okay, we're gonna leave this in, and we're just gonna show Jules' fuck-up. All right. And that's it. So that's all we got time for this week. That's it, babies. So catch us on the flip side and we gonna add another chapter into your guide into energy, magic, and the spirit world.
I'm Jules, having a wonderfully fluid day talking. And I'm here with Kelle Sparta- I'm driving down the road ... and Charlemagne Tremon. And you have been listening to Spirit Sherpa. So long, everyone. Staying in the wonderment- Bye. ... within me. Bye.