When uncertainty looms and decision-making becomes daunting, the question isn't just about navigating through the chaos—it's also about why businesses hesitate to seek help. Maartje delves into the common barriers that prevent organizations from engaging with consultants. She addresses concerns about compatibility, the fear of endless contracts, and the cost implications that often deter businesses from obtaining the guidance they need. By emphasizing the value of tailored, short-term engagements, Maartje clarifies how strategic consultation can efficiently pinpoint issues and set the stage for long-term success, encouraging leaders to overcome their apprehensions and embrace expert support to secure their business's future.

About the Host:

Your host, Maartje van Krieken, brings a wealth of experience from the front lines of business turmoil. With a background in crisis management, managing transformation and complex collaboration, she has successfully guided numerous organizations through their most challenging times. Her unique perspective and practical approach make her the go to First Responder in the arena of business turmoil and crisis.

Podcast Homepage: https://www.thebusinessemergencyroom.com/

https://www.thechaosgamesconsulting.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/maartje/

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Maartje van Krieken: Hey, thanks for tuning back in. Glad you're here. Today, in this episode, we're going to talk about my business and how I work one last time, specifically about the reasons people tend to not choose and engage external help, or some of the other hurdles you might see in your path. So I was planning to bring up the the main comments I hear often from people when you know, figuring out if they want to work with a consultant or not and address those. So the first one to start with is that I think it's very important that you have a click with the person that you work with. You don't have to be the same. You don't have to like the same things. But if you're going to bring somebody into your house and into your business and into your team, then you need to be able and willing to take some comments from the person that you're hiring, right? So if my communication style or other things, my mannerisms or other things I do, you know, don't work for you, then I might not be the person for you. And that's okay. That's a that's what this beautiful life is made up of all these different people, and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

So question number one is, when you engage somebody, does it work? Does it click? Can I actually work with that person? That's usually the easier question, easiest question to answer, right then I often hear comments around money and unlimited scopes, particularly in management consulting and consultants sticking around forever. Well, I think the nature of the business and my work is a little different, because I specifically operate in this space, in that first space, where things are clearly not right, but it's also not entirely clear what needs to happen, what kind of help is needed. And as I explained to you in episode number two, I typically work with very short initial contracts, doing diagnostics and triage, and if nothing else, we we can part ways after that, and you have at least diagnostics, at least some idea on where you're at and where I see, that you know things should maybe be addressed. And you've made some some insights, and had a fresh pair of eyes. Look at your situation, and if that's the point where you choose to leave it, I don't think you've lost anything second. We also talked about a phase two. I typically stay around then to also help source further further support. So I think it's actually important to, if it's not your your forte or something that you're used to, to have some help draft contracts and scopes that you're going to outsource, or even put some structure on the scopes that are special project or improvement scopes that you're going to run internally to make sure that you're pragmatic and realistic, and also that you if you outsource the scope, that you put it with the right type of companies and people, and that you negotiate the right stop gaps around the contractual arrangements, right so that you are set up in a way that it's clear what's going to get delivered, that what is agreed as a rate or a price for a scope like that, or for that caliber of people, actually makes sense that you're not hiring somebody with way more paying, overpaying For capability you don't quite need or paying and then not getting quite the capability you need, and hence not actually solving your problem.

So that's the type of work I do a lot for my clients. I have a very diverse and broad network, and I I don't bluff. That's the one my one cardinal rule. Anybody who's ever worked for me will tell you that that's something I always say, said to my teams, if you want to have a go at trying something or doing something, go ahead. But bluffing is inexcusable. If you know that something is really way out of your depth in terms of expertise or skills, then you need to put up your hand, and we need to place it with the person who is actually the specialist in that because, or better place at least, to do the work than than you, because otherwise it could be dangerous, and you're also wasting everybody's time, right, doing a stretch aside. Assignment and bluffing are really two very different things, and I think we all know what they are. So if I work with you and I realize that I don't have all the capacities or the skills or the answers to help you out, I will also tell you that and refer you to the appropriate people the other way around, if, if we're working well together and out of comfort, you're like but can you you not do it? And I believe you could get a much cheaper resource to do the work for you just as well, I will tell you. And yes, unfortunately, I have way too many peers who stick around longer than they maybe should, you know, who might maybe want a break from doing business development and stick around on a contract maybe longer than is necessary. I know I'm not one of those. I had a client where the interim CEO actually came from one of the biggest consulting houses in the world. And when I told him that I was going to go right, that my work was done, he said, Oh, great. So you have something else lined up. What are you going to do? And actually, it was right before Christmas. We just moved and I had, didn't have something else lined up, so I told him. I said, Oh, I don't know. In the new year, we'll see and and he looked at me a little puzzled. He says, So why? Why are you going? Then I said, my job's done, right? We're finished. There was a an interim manager put in place on the organization where the work was being done. We'd, you know, we banked the biggest fires. There was a reasonable level of calm restored, and there was capability and capacity internally to push through the scopes and projects that needed doing. And yeah, there was bits and pieces of work that I could continue to hang on to and be involved in, but that's not how I operate, and that's not what I wanted to do. And so I said, there's too many at some point. It's also too many cooks in the kitchen, or chefs in the kitchen, time to go. And he laughed really hard, and he said to me that I was the one only in first ever consultant he met who left by their own accord. So yeah, I know for a fact that's me. I also know for a fact that I'm not the only one, and I hope that you all mainly meet and get to work with consultants who stick around as long as it makes sense and is needed.

But yeah, I'm also care about making sure that you get the third party support that operates like that, and that we also set up your deals and your contracts and your scopes in a manner that you have the levers to determine whether it's time to let go and it's done, or whether somebody needs to stick around a little longer. I talked also a little bit already in the second episode that you know, for solopreneurs or business owners starting out and still growing, they could use the caliber of support that I provide, or from some of my peers, because that's what their business needs. But at the same time, it's at a price point that you maybe can't quite afford yet with the way your business operates or where it is in its life cycle, and yeah, I discussed with you that in those situations, I would work with you initially, one on one to do the diagnostics and the triage, but we could convert to some ad hoc Office Hours set up so that you can reach out for implementation support as and when needed at a more affordable price point, right? And yes, in in some of these cases, I might also refer you to somebody else if you need somebody really full time in there to help out. But in those situations, typically what you're looking for is not the consulting side of things, but really more the interim management side of things, yeah, and then you're paying for a resource, right? So then you should be able to afford the salary. But yeah, interim management can also come at a at a different price point, so if that's what you need, then we can find the right resource to fill those gaps and find a solution that works. We talked also already a little bit, but I want to elaborate a bit more about it.

On scope. I think it's important to agree with a third party or with the help you hire, what is in and what's not in. But of course, I advertise myself. Say. Think I come in at a point that you don't quite know yet what needs to happen. That's the whole point of bringing me in. There's still things we should agree on, right? There is we could have no go areas in terms of topics, we can agree a few hard and fast rules around communication. How you want to introduce me to your organization? Maybe you want to ring fence certain parts or departments. Maybe there are some other sensitive issues that are also at play in the organization that I then maybe need to know about. But once you've informed me about them, that sits somewhere else or that's left to others, whatever it is, I do think it's important to be transparent and be clear. Be clear. Also, how, if you're my main focal point, be clear how you want to be kept in the loop. If there are specific things that you need to be able to stay on top of things, or that are truly your way of working, then let's, let's have that conversation, right? Because it's important that we collaborate in a way that you can hear and absorb and that I can also hear and absorb what you're telling me and that. Yeah, so if we do that in the formats, in the style that is preferential to you, then that should help, typically. So be open and be transparent. I'll be open and transparent. I'm Dutch. I don't really know any other way people say the Dutch are also blunt. I don't really know if it's blunt. I think culturally, it's more about saying, saying what it is, right? And, yeah, I think in the situations that I would operate with you, that's what these situations need there. We don't have to make a bigger drama out of things, but there is no sense in making things sound better than they are. I do believe, though, that there is a way to look at situations more positively or constructively, and that that I'm a big proponent of, because I do believe when we're in an emergency or chaos situation or in turmoil and emotions are running high, energy is really low, and so I do, I can, at times, be a little forceful in the way things, the way we talk about things, meaning that sometimes you need to talk about the scars a little bit, but then we also need to start moving on to the things that we can actually change and influence. And looking back too much, it's not always helpful.

So there's a this saying, don't look where you fell, but where you tripped, right? So let's, let's focus on some of the lead up specifically, if we think that there is causes there and that need fixing to move forward, but let's also agree that there is water under the bridge right, and figure out a way how to agree and really leave leave that behind us. So yeah, I won't paint you rosy pictures. I might steer somewhat forcefully, sometimes in the way of communicating and the way we discuss things and try to figure out what we believe is, is our common truth right, AND, and OR where, where the the disagreements or the the misalignments are therein in support of moving forward and not Moving back. Very much, I do agree and provide clear deliverables. You will know, if you go into a protector arrangements with me, what it is that you should have at the end of it. I think that is, you know, normal, normal operations. I do have a an accreditation in HR. So I know enough about HR to be aware of issues around privacy and personal management and other HR aspects that are critical in these situations. I'm also an accredited coach, so there's techniques, like from coaching that come into into the work. And I do think it can be helpful when you engage a consultant to check for some of these accreditations, because one coach or one consultant is not the other. So depending on what your. Situation needs. Accreditations are a good way sometimes, to assess the the level of experience or the value of the experience that people bring to the table. And people should always be happy to share what they have or don't have, because if they're not the right person for the situation, that's not good for for anybody there. Last, but not least, I'm a, I'm a one woman show. So, yeah, sometimes I hear people say, well, but then I would work with you. If I go to a big consulting house, then I get the whole apparatus. Yeah, if you go with a big consulting house, you get the whole apparatus. But chances that as a smaller business, you get the A team are, if you're not the big the big multinationals with the big corporate contracts in the repeat business, you typically don't get the A team. They also need to train their graduates and their younger staff. So you pay for that right? You either pay for that by them putting more hours onto your scope, or by by them giving your scope to somebody for whom it's it's their first or their their stretch assignment. And I am a referrer. I'm a network builder. I love people. I love hanging out with people. I love the type of work I do. So my my personal time. I also talk shop lots, because my peers are my friends, and so I have a high caliber network, and I'm also one of these people who's good at finding out. So yes, I'm a one woman. Show that I already told you that if I'm not the right person for you, I wouldn't take on the work, and I can help you find the the right people for you, or bring in the resources for the the missing the missing pieces in terms of expertise or specialty support that we might need. And if you have somebody, it doesn't have to be my person, but we can, we can close those gaps, and I can make my own arrangements with some of these people to also just get access to that kind of expertise for a few hours here or there. That is totally possible, and that's totally how it works in this network, in these networks, and then, last but not least, once we're done, yes, I make I choose sometimes to exit, as you've heard, when I think I'm done, my main client within the organization was also totally okay with that, right? This was not me saying, Hey, I'm bowing out now. I delivered what I said I would deliver. And, yeah, the team said, I think we can do this.

So I do typically stay in touch with with people and with organizations, with some more than others. Sometimes there's follow up. Sometimes there isn't, whatever the situation needs, I am totally okay if somewhere down the line you've got questions and you're just calling me to say, hey, we're re looking at this project, change your scope, and now we're looking back at what you told us, or what you talked about with us, and can you can you talk us through it one more time? Or, Hey, do you know somebody for this or that, because you know what we're after and that kind of stuff. Once you're in my network, you're in my network, and yeah, I love hearing from you. I love help celebrate the successes with the people I worked with. And so if you want to stay in touch, we stay in touch. That's not your thing. Also totally fine. So yeah, I think I addressed some of the main things that I sometimes hear from people when they're considering if they want to work with a consultant. So I think in this case, with short term contracts and very specific scopes, money is not really the excuse schedules and deadlines and deliverables need to be agreed. You need you and I, and not just with me, but with any consulting or support contract you have. You need to have clear scopes and have clear arrangements for all sites to to end and to start these things, so that you can pull the trigger on those things when you want to or need to. And yeah, you need to have somewhat of a click and believe that somebody is the right person. And if you can't put it into words, but it doesn't feel right, then that's also totally fine, right? Move on to something else. And last but not least, the main thing from my side that I always hope with my clients is, and which, hence, I talk quite a lot about in some of my social media posts, etc, is that what I see is that many of my clients ultimately say that they wish. That they did something sooner. Asking for help is so hard, and we all have our egos, and we don't like acknowledging that we have ego. So maybe it's pride, maybe it also is our fear of failure, and it's the the little voices in the back of our heads. We think we can do it, we think we can manage. We think we should be able to manage. Yes, we're all capable. And I believe that each and every one of you is, you know, more than qualified for your job. And there is so much you can do. Every you can do anything.

The challenge is you cannot do everything, and you cannot sometimes control how things come at you, right? It's like the weather or a storm. Sometimes you're just a little bit unlucky. That's that this thing slows down, that one speeds up, and then there's an unexpected external factor that piles on top of it, and suddenly everything is out of whack, or everything is out of sync. Sometimes you don't realize that you know till it's kind of late that you're not in a good space. That's normal, right? But I do hope that when you realize you are not in a good space, that you stick up your hand and say, Hey, I could, I could use that external infusion of energy and insight, because once you know and you wait, you're just wasting time and money, and effectively, you're better off spending then that money with somebody like me to get out of the hole quicker and be back to being successful and productive then waiting, because waiting and doing nothing gets you nowhere, right? You that's not going to get you out of the hole. So, yeah, I hope. And I've made it my mission to try and remind people to stick up their hand a little sooner and say, Hey, actually, I could use a little help. And if we learn to do it sooner, then we're out quicker. We feel better sooner, and the team will feel better sooner. And also, if we start to recognize the signs a little sooner and figure out to deploy help more systemically a little quicker, then our business becomes more resilient, right? And we start seeing the symptoms quicker we can and then we get on this path where we can address some of these symptoms earlier ourselves. And ends maybe get to the point that you need less and less help, especially if your business is growing or changing drastically. It's normal that the skill set or the capacity you have at times it's just out of sync with what goes on. It's not you, it's not anyone. It's just the growing and changing pains that happen, right? So alright, that's it for today. Thank you for tuning in and talk to you next week with a good scar story. Thank you.