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Adam Tarnow - Leadership Training and Consulting
Episode 11 • 8th June 2022 • Empowering Entrepreneurs • Glenn Harper
00:00:00 00:48:49

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Adam Tarnow is our guest. He is the founder of Adam Tarnow & Company, a leadership development firm located in Dallas, TX. They develop customized training to equip professionals with the soft skills they need to become excellent leaders.

What does Adam do for his clients?

Curation is a word that I'm starting to really grow comfortable with. When I first thought about what I wanted to do as a consulting firm focused on leadership development, I was thinking that I would develop my own custom content or come up with my own custom content, and I do that. But then I realized there's really nothing new under the sun, right? A lot of what I do is I'm standing on the shoulders of other great authors or thinkers and the ideas that they've shared with the world. And I'm just kind of organizing all of that. So I really do think curation is a very accurate way to describe what I do. And when I present this content to my clients, the only customized piece that I get to add to it or where I get to put my fingerprint on it, is really deciding how to organize the content.

So Adam went to school, became a CPA, then you got out of that and you became a minister. How did you fall into leadership development?

The only metaphor I can find out there that seems to really describe it well, is it my career has turned into a Seinfeld episode, where you just had all of these plot lines that seem to make no sense. And then at the very end, it's like, oh, that, okay, now that all make sense how that came together.
So being a CPA has taught me is how to think. It taught me about corporate America, it taught me about large organizations, certainly taught me how to be organized and thoughtful. What ministry taught me was people just we're all the same. We all have the same issues. We have the same thoughts, feelings, emotions. It taught me how people think and react. It taught me a lot.

When you are growing as fast as Adam's business is, there's time to say yes to all opportunities, but then there's the time when you have to make the hard choices to say no.

In 2021, the training started to pick back up and I was able to now start to say no to some of those other things that I said yes to. But I was so grateful for the learnings that happened in there. I mean, obviously, as an entrepreneur, I need to know how to market. So I was really grateful that I said yes to some of that. Podcasting is a big part of my business model as well as for my own personal brand. So I was grateful to say yes to those things because I learned a ton as I went through that. So so yeah, I mean, saying yes is very, very helpful oftentimes. But then there comes a time where you do have to focus.


Do you think when you go into these companies and you provide the training, though, is there some sense of team in that regard?

I do feel like I'm a part of their team now and they do view me as that trusted advisor. There is a high because when they do well, I feel like, okay, I got to contribute to that and that was a lot of fun.


What does Adam consider his superpower to be?

I think I just I'm a teacher. I mean, I think that really is it. I just love to teach. I love to learn. I love to systematize that information and I love to share it with others. I can remember all the way back to eighth grade in my math class and the teacher letting me get up there and teach that exercise and that lesson, like going over it with the class. And I loved it.


What advice would you give to people that have that "skill of leadership," but haven't been able to capitalize on it or have the awareness of that skill?

My teacher side of me is going to have a bias towards just go study it. And so that to me is always such a great way to do it. This is really no excuse to not be a continuous learner anymore. I mean, between master classes and YouTube and LinkedIn classes and training that your company provides and books that are out there, as well as audiobooks and podcasts. I think for some, it just starts with curiosity and just wanting to learn and finding some voices that really do that you really do resonate with.


And what is his endgame?

My owner's intent is very focused right now on what I would say is building a platform. And for the first time in my life, I think I understand why I want to build a platform.


Adam is referencing:

On a mission to curate the most helpful leadership content my clients have ever encountered.

Adam's Website

Running a business doesn’t have to run your life.

Without a business partner who holds you accountable, it’s easy to be so busy ‘doing’ business that you don’t have the right strategy to grow your business.

Stop letting your business run you. At Harper & Co CPA Plus, we know that you want to be empowered to build the lifestyle you envision. In order to do that you need a clear path to follow for success

Our clients enjoy a proactive partnership with us. Schedule a consultation with us today.

Download our free guide - Entrepreneurial Success Formula: How to Avoid Managing Your Business From Your Bank Account.

Copyright 2024 Glenn Harper

Transcripts

Glenn Harper:

:

Welcome, everybody.

Glenn Harper:

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Another edition of Harper and Company Empower

Glenn Harper:

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Entrepreneurs, The Harper Company.

Glenn Harper:

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This is Glenn Harper,

Julie Smith:

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and Julie Smith,

Glenn Harper:

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And we got a special guest today.

Glenn Harper:

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Calling in all the way from Dallas, Texas, Adam Tarnow,

Glenn Harper:

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fellow entrepreneur who is the owner of Adam Tarnow and

Glenn Harper:

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Company, a leadership training company in Texas.

Glenn Harper:

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In his spare time, he's active in his church.

Glenn Harper:

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And while he's helping everybody be their best, even though

Glenn Harper:

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he has the stature of enough NFL lineman, he enjoys golf as

Glenn Harper:

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he loves to torture himself in five hour blocks at a time

Glenn Harper:

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and chasing the ball, which is always exciting.

Glenn Harper:

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Thanks for being with us today.

Glenn Harper:

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It's kind of funny.

Glenn Harper:

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We have an affinity that, again, there's not a lot of bean

Glenn Harper:

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counters out there and every time we get one on the show, I

Glenn Harper:

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get all excited because, you know, we have this little, you

Glenn Harper:

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know, pocket protectors, green visors and such.

Glenn Harper:

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And, you know, we're always, you know, typical accountants,

Glenn Harper:

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very exciting, dynamic, motivated.

Glenn Harper:

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We're breaking the mold of that, I think.

Glenn Harper:

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Would you agree with that?

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah. Yeah. We're actually talking to each other.

Adam Tarnow:

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That is definitely breaking the mold by having a

Adam Tarnow:

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conversation because we want to, not because we have to.

Julie Smith:

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And not with a ten key.

Julie Smith:

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Right. You're not talking in ten key language.

Adam Tarnow:

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There's no spreadsheets. We're not going to talk about

Adam Tarnow:

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numbers today. We're going to talk about our life.

Adam Tarnow:

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That's that's very abnormal for us.

Glenn Harper:

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I'm telling you, a group of accounts together is is like a

Glenn Harper:

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fifth grade dance. Nobody's talking to anybody.

Glenn Harper:

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It's really bizarre.

Adam Tarnow:

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I like that. I like.

Glenn Harper:

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That.

Adam Tarnow:

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So I appreciate the NFL linemen line.

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, I've been called a lot of things in my life.

Adam Tarnow:

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I've never been accused of being a big, burly man like

Adam Tarnow:

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that.

Glenn Harper:

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I checked out all your action photos and I'm like, Oh, this

Glenn Harper:

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guy is definitely linemen material.

Julie Smith:

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Glenn was just intimidated by your stature, actually.

Adam Tarnow:

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Well, that's funny.

Glenn Harper:

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I've got a couple rapid fire questions.

Glenn Harper:

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I'd like to throw out some guests just to make sure we're

Glenn Harper:

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on the same page on some things.

Glenn Harper:

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And so is it true that you started out as a as a CPA

Glenn Harper:

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because you just knew that was the greatest thing to do?

Glenn Harper:

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But while you're in involved with the Enron audit, you

Glenn Harper:

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decided that you had to change to become a minister because

Glenn Harper:

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you knew it was such a bad thing you were looking at.

Glenn Harper:

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Is that how that turned out?

Adam Tarnow:

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I thought I'd buried that story pretty deep on the Internet,

Adam Tarnow:

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so I'm sorry that you had to find that out.

Adam Tarnow:

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No. Best class I took in high school was an accounting

Adam Tarnow:

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class or my favorite.

Adam Tarnow:

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My dad was an accountant, my grandfather was an accountant,

Adam Tarnow:

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and my birthday is April 16th.

Glenn Harper:

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That's impressive that you've got that trifecta.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah, it was in the stars.

Adam Tarnow:

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I had to. I had to go there.

Adam Tarnow:

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I was one of my only friends that I knew in college that

Adam Tarnow:

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never changed their major.

Adam Tarnow:

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I showed up. Day one said, I'm going to be an accounting

Adam Tarnow:

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major, and I never wavered from it at all.

Adam Tarnow:

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So very, very steady with all that.

Glenn Harper:

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Yeah, that's funny. I just thought I wanted to be one when I

Glenn Harper:

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was. I think it would have been seventh grade.

Glenn Harper:

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I didn't even know what an accountant did.

Glenn Harper:

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And I'm like, I just worked for this guy as his landscaper.

Glenn Harper:

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And I'm like, What do you do for a living?

Glenn Harper:

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He's like, Oh, I'm an accountant. I'm like, Well, I want to

Glenn Harper:

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be that when I grow up. I don't even know.

Glenn Harper:

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I don't think I think I got out of college when I figured

Glenn Harper:

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out what an account really did, which is odd, and I

Glenn Harper:

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apparently should have studied more.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah, I was one year into my job.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah.

Glenn Harper:

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That's just horrible.

Adam Tarnow:

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So that auditing class people actually do this, that's like

Adam Tarnow:

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a real thing.

Glenn Harper:

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And they like it. It's odd, but, you know, everybody needs

Glenn Harper:

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everybody, right? Yeah.

Glenn Harper:

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Did you you know, you were did you ever get a chance to or

Glenn Harper:

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the privilege to rub Howard's rock at the Clemson's Tiger

Glenn Harper:

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Stadium?

Adam Tarnow:

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I have yes. I do allow all freshmen to do that.

Adam Tarnow:

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So if our listeners don't know, I went to Clemson

Adam Tarnow:

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University and they have this rock that a legendary

Adam Tarnow:

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football coach got from Death Valley.

Adam Tarnow:

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Is that in Arizona? I think California.

Adam Tarnow:

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California on the West Coast.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah. And so he brought this rock back and it became this

Adam Tarnow:

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moment. Like, if you're not going to go down there and go

Adam Tarnow:

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all in today, then don't touch this rock.

Adam Tarnow:

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So when you touch the rock, it's signifying to the team and

Adam Tarnow:

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to the fans.

Adam Tarnow:

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I'm going to give it my all today.

Adam Tarnow:

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It's under lock like a bulletproof glass now, really,

Adam Tarnow:

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because of the in-state rivalry with South Carolina,

Adam Tarnow:

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there's been attempts to steal it and to vandalize it.

Adam Tarnow:

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And so no joke. If you go drive through there right now,

Adam Tarnow:

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drive through campus and you will see it is under

Adam Tarnow:

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bulletproof glass.

Adam Tarnow:

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They remove that glass right before the game so the players

Adam Tarnow:

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can touch it right before they go down the field and then

Adam Tarnow:

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boom, it goes right back on.

Adam Tarnow:

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So it's one of the most protected things in the state of

Adam Tarnow:

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South Carolina right now.

Glenn Harper:

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That's crazy. They took away all the fun of the college

Glenn Harper:

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rivalries and go and steal and all their mascots and stuff.

Glenn Harper:

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They denied that.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yes.

Glenn Harper:

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Well, yes. Is it are you sad that you're at Clemson when the

Glenn Harper:

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football team was in any good and now all of a sudden it's

Glenn Harper:

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the best? I mean, crazy would do what they would do.

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah. I like to feel like I contributed, right.

Adam Tarnow:

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Like this is they were standing on our shoulders, but I was

Adam Tarnow:

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there for a lot of bad football, a lot of bad football.

Adam Tarnow:

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So it just is sweeter.

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, I was just literally talking about this with my

Adam Tarnow:

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family the other day about how I think we our local high

Adam Tarnow:

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school basketball team here in Richardson, Texas.

Adam Tarnow:

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Was had a really great season, but they lost,

Adam Tarnow:

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unfortunately, in the playoffs.

Adam Tarnow:

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And we were driving home and I was we were all kind of sad.

Adam Tarnow:

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But I looked at the boys and I was like, guys, you know,

Adam Tarnow:

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with all sports, though, in the end, I've gotten to see

Adam Tarnow:

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Clemson win two national championships in my lifetime and I

Adam Tarnow:

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just never thought I'd be able to see that.

Adam Tarnow:

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So really all the other sports teams can lose from here on

Adam Tarnow:

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out.

Glenn Harper:

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I feel like life's complete.

Glenn Harper:

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Yeah, it.

Adam Tarnow:

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Was successful because I just never thought, I mean, let

Adam Tarnow:

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alone watch them play in a national championship, I never

Adam Tarnow:

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thought I'd see them win. And it was great.

Adam Tarnow:

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I was. I'm grateful for.

Glenn Harper:

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It. Yeah. What he's done for.

Adam Tarnow:

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Work.

Glenn Harper:

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Over there. Yeah, he was done for that program.

Glenn Harper:

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An amazing just developing young men.

Glenn Harper:

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It's it's a it's a really cool thing.

Glenn Harper:

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Do you have, you know, as a golfer, do you play a lot?

Glenn Harper:

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A little bit. I mean, what's your dream course to play?

Adam Tarnow:

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That's a really good question.

Adam Tarnow:

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I play not as much as I want to obviously work.

Adam Tarnow:

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There's I need to put some food on the table for the family

Adam Tarnow:

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so I can't play as much as I want to.

Adam Tarnow:

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I probably right now in the wintertime here, maybe just get

Adam Tarnow:

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out once a month.

Adam Tarnow:

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I practice a lot. I've got a little set up in my backyard,

Adam Tarnow:

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a net and a mat. And so I'll go hit, you know, four or five

Adam Tarnow:

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days a week back there a few times.

Adam Tarnow:

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But dream course right now, I think I would have to say

Adam Tarnow:

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probably Pebble Beach, right?

Adam Tarnow:

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I've never been out there. Something out in California I

Adam Tarnow:

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think would be a lot of fun.

Glenn Harper:

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Definitely on the list to do so.

Julie Smith:

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Adam What you don't know is Glen's also an avid golfer and

Julie Smith:

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chases all these dream golf courses as well.

Julie Smith:

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So he's probably just fishing for for the next one that you

Julie Smith:

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have on your list.

Glenn Harper:

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Looking for the next hookup.

Glenn Harper:

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You know.

Adam Tarnow:

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What's your most memorable course that you've played?

Glenn Harper:

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I just got back from a trip to some abandoned dunes, which

Glenn Harper:

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is fantastic.

Glenn Harper:

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Just surreal.

Glenn Harper:

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You're right on the coast. It was it was so much fun and

Glenn Harper:

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just built for golfers, so many courses.

Glenn Harper:

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It's a great experience, kind of like Scotland but in the

Glenn Harper:

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US of a and you know this summer I've got a trip to

Glenn Harper:

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Whistling Straits and Hills and I think it's the Sand Ridge

Glenn Harper:

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or Sand Castle.

Glenn Harper:

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It's the same owner group abandoned dunes in Wisconsin.

Glenn Harper:

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So looking forward to that.

Glenn Harper:

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That should be fun.

Adam Tarnow:

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That's fun. Yeah. It's a great another great way to see the

Adam Tarnow:

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country, right. To go visit some of these other courses.

Adam Tarnow:

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And I think when I first talked to you all, just about

Adam Tarnow:

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seeing the country, my family and I've got two boys, a

Adam Tarnow:

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seventh grader and fifth grader and my wife.

Adam Tarnow:

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And we're trying to see all the ballparks and the baseball

Adam Tarnow:

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ballparks. And I think I chatted with you all when we were

Adam Tarnow:

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visiting on our last trip last summer when I first met you,

Adam Tarnow:

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too, talking about what you all are doing now with the

Adam Tarnow:

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podcasting. And we were up there and I think we were in

Adam Tarnow:

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between Cincinnati and Cleveland.

Adam Tarnow:

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When we chat, I think we drove right on by where you all

Adam Tarnow:

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were. So that's another great way to see the country.

Adam Tarnow:

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If you don't play golf, just go see them.

Adam Tarnow:

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Go see the.

Glenn Harper:

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Ballparks. There's some good, good stuff in both those two

Glenn Harper:

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cities you just mentioned.

Glenn Harper:

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Yeah. So I got one final, like a softball question for you.

Glenn Harper:

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So, you know, I would expect that you're in Texas, you'd

Glenn Harper:

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have a little more pronounced accent because that's how you

Glenn Harper:

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roll down there. But is it true that you ride bulls on the

Glenn Harper:

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weekend for rodeos?

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, not just for rodeos.

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, that is the preferred mode of transportation.

Adam Tarnow:

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I know. So, yeah, they hang out in my backyard, I bring

Adam Tarnow:

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them out on the weekend.

Adam Tarnow:

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People will get theirs all painted up.

Glenn Harper:

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And the big deal.

Adam Tarnow:

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It's a whole.

Glenn Harper:

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Deal. Someday I like to ride one because it just looks like

Glenn Harper:

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a lot of fun. But, boy, that's a brutal.

Glenn Harper:

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Well, why don't you?

Glenn Harper:

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You know, Adam, would you mind sharing a little bit of what

Glenn Harper:

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does your business do?

Glenn Harper:

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What is the services that you provide?

Glenn Harper:

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Just give a little a little spiel on that, please.

Glenn Harper:

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Yeah.

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, it's really I would say this this is like some

Adam Tarnow:

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recent stuff that I've been writing.

Adam Tarnow:

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So I've been in business for 18 months now, which is part

Adam Tarnow:

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of the journey, actually a little longer than that, getting

Adam Tarnow:

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close to two years. But right now what I would say is the

Adam Tarnow:

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mission is to do this is to curate the most helpful

Adam Tarnow:

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leadership content my clients have ever encountered.

Adam Tarnow:

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Curation is a word that I'm starting to really grow

Adam Tarnow:

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comfortable with. When I first thought about what I wanted

Adam Tarnow:

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to do as a consulting firm focused on leadership

Adam Tarnow:

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development, I was thinking that I would develop my own

Adam Tarnow:

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custom content or come up with my own custom content, and I

Adam Tarnow:

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do that. But then I realized there's really nothing new

Adam Tarnow:

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under the sun, right? A lot of what I do is I'm standing on

Adam Tarnow:

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the shoulders of other great authors or thinkers and the

Adam Tarnow:

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ideas that they've shared with the world.

Adam Tarnow:

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And I'm just kind of organizing all of that.

Adam Tarnow:

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So I really do think curation is a is a very accurate way

Adam Tarnow:

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to describe what I do.

Adam Tarnow:

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And when I present this this content to my clients, the,

Adam Tarnow:

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the only customized piece that I get to to add to it or

Adam Tarnow:

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where I get to put my fingerprint on it, is really deciding

Adam Tarnow:

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how to organize the content.

Adam Tarnow:

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So if I've got a client who wants to say they've got some

Adam Tarnow:

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managers that need to get better at communicating or get

Adam Tarnow:

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better at coaching, I get to decide what pieces to put

Adam Tarnow:

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together and how do I want to organize that?

Adam Tarnow:

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What is the basic theme?

Adam Tarnow:

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So that's where I get to customize some things.

Adam Tarnow:

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I get to add my own stories, metaphors, metaphors,

Adam Tarnow:

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illustrations, videos.

Adam Tarnow:

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I just get to share my own experience with that content.

Adam Tarnow:

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So I get to add all of that and then I get to decide what

Adam Tarnow:

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to emphasize, right? I can add my own perspectives and my

Adam Tarnow:

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own opinions and some of my own story in there.

Adam Tarnow:

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So. So that's a lot of what I do a lot of.

Adam Tarnow:

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Mid-market sized clients, I would say, are really the sweet

Adam Tarnow:

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spot for me right now.

Adam Tarnow:

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If you've got anywhere between 25 and maybe 2000 employees

Adam Tarnow:

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where you have multiple level levels of leadership within

Adam Tarnow:

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the organization, so you've got some.

Adam Tarnow:

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If we think about the old just CPA firm type, where we've

Adam Tarnow:

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got some seniors, some managers, senior managers partner.

Adam Tarnow:

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So if you have some sort of of leadership structure within

Adam Tarnow:

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the organization, that probably is is a client where I'm

Adam Tarnow:

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going to be able to really serve well.

Adam Tarnow:

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And and then maybe probably an organization also that

Adam Tarnow:

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doesn't necessarily have an in-house training department.

Adam Tarnow:

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There's a lot of my clients right now that there's maybe

Adam Tarnow:

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one HR representative who is responsible for bringing in

Adam Tarnow:

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training, but they don't have their own in-house training

Adam Tarnow:

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department. So that's that's where the client base is kind

Adam Tarnow:

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of starting to shake out right now, as is are those types

Adam Tarnow:

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of clients and all sorts of industries.

Adam Tarnow:

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I mean, I've got everything from the largest franchisee of

Adam Tarnow:

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a particular fast food brand to to somebody in the

Adam Tarnow:

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biomedical industry.

Adam Tarnow:

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And so it's like everything in between there.

Adam Tarnow:

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Obviously I connect well with CPA firms as that being part

Adam Tarnow:

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of my background as well.

Adam Tarnow:

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So professional service providers.

Adam Tarnow:

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But, but that's what we're doing.

Adam Tarnow:

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I'm on the mission to try to curate helpful leadership

Adam Tarnow:

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content.

Julie Smith:

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So Adam, answer me this because I'm not quite following.

Julie Smith:

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So you went to school, you became a CPA, then you got out

Julie Smith:

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of that and you became a minister.

Julie Smith:

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How did you fall into fall into this?

Adam Tarnow:

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Yeah, I like to if I think about my career, the only

Adam Tarnow:

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metaphor I can find out there that seems to really describe

Adam Tarnow:

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it well, is it my my career has turned into a Seinfeld

Adam Tarnow:

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episode where you just had all of these plot lines that

Adam Tarnow:

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seem to make no sense.

Adam Tarnow:

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And then at the very end, it's like, oh, that okay, now

Adam Tarnow:

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that all make sense how that came together.

Adam Tarnow:

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So yeah, ten years as a CPA, ten years on staff at a

Adam Tarnow:

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church, a little bit of grad school in between there and a

Adam Tarnow:

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couple of other part time jobs in between there.

Adam Tarnow:

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But so what CPA has taught me is how to think.

Adam Tarnow:

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It taught me about corporate America, it taught me about

Adam Tarnow:

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large organizations, certainly taught me how to be

Adam Tarnow:

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organized and thoughtful.

Adam Tarnow:

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What what ministry taught me was people just we're all the

Adam Tarnow:

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same. We all have the same issues.

Adam Tarnow:

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We have the same thoughts, feelings, emotions.

Adam Tarnow:

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It taught me how people think and react.

Adam Tarnow:

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It taught me a lot.

Adam Tarnow:

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And being a part of a large organization there too, I also

Adam Tarnow:

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learned about organizational life and what we were trying

Adam Tarnow:

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to do in the nonprofit world was we were trying to lead,

Adam Tarnow:

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right? We were trying to lead people.

Adam Tarnow:

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And so I learned a ton about leadership there as well.

Adam Tarnow:

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And so to me, like that, that corporate America thing and

Adam Tarnow:

:

then all this stuff that I understand about people, it all

Adam Tarnow:

:

came together with this consulting firm that I started, so

Adam Tarnow:

:

I can look back on it and go, Yeah, those were definitely

Adam Tarnow:

:

some right and left hand turns along the journey that were

Adam Tarnow:

:

maybe a little bit of a head scratcher.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But to me it all kind of makes sense right now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

It all came together because that's a lot of what I'm doing

Adam Tarnow:

:

right now, working with organizations and also trying to

Adam Tarnow:

:

help them with their people.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so those two things come together in a way that I

Adam Tarnow:

:

probably when I was graduating from college, I could have

Adam Tarnow:

:

never written this out. I mean, this was I didn't know this

Adam Tarnow:

:

was where the journey was going to go, but it's I'm

Adam Tarnow:

:

grateful for it.

Glenn Harper:

:

So you don't you didn't just wake up.

Glenn Harper:

:

You just kind of woke up one day and said, Hey, I'm going

Glenn Harper:

:

to be an entrepreneur and start my own business.

Glenn Harper:

:

Or is that something that was, you know, percolating way

Glenn Harper:

:

back when?

Glenn Harper:

:

You're just just a lead growing up?

Glenn Harper:

:

When did that happen?

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, I would have never I would have never been accused of

Adam Tarnow:

:

being an entrepreneur growing up.

Glenn Harper:

:

That's crazy.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah. And it was I really think if there's some ways, like

Adam Tarnow:

:

when I got out of college, I was living in Atlanta working

Adam Tarnow:

:

with PricewaterhouseCoopers and and candidly, I was a part

Adam Tarnow:

:

of a church there in town that was big.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they were they were one of the first organizations that

Adam Tarnow:

:

introduced me to the concept of leadership.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they were reading Built to Last and Jim Collins and

Adam Tarnow:

:

John Maxwell's 21 irrefutable laws of leadership.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that I just became fascinated by that as a subject.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'd never thought about that before.

Adam Tarnow:

:

As a subject. I always just thought about Leader was a

Adam Tarnow:

:

boss, that's all that I didn't understand that leadership

Adam Tarnow:

:

is more nuanced. It's about caring about people and trying

Adam Tarnow:

:

to influence people. And that's a skill.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I never thought it was a skill.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I thought it was just something it was a reward for.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Hey, when you're good at what you do and you get to be a

Adam Tarnow:

:

boss, it's a reward. I never thought about it as a skill.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I'm really grateful that church and what they started to

Adam Tarnow:

:

teach me. So I just went on this like personally, it became

Adam Tarnow:

:

a hobby where I just started reading on this subject and

Adam Tarnow:

:

going to conferences and now eventually starting to listen

Adam Tarnow:

:

to podcasts, talk about leadership.

Adam Tarnow:

:

It just became a thing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And it was it was this theme that ran through my entire

Adam Tarnow:

:

career, whether I was in a CPA firm or I was at the church,

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was always thinking about leadership and observing

Adam Tarnow:

:

leadership and trying to figure out what are ways that we

Adam Tarnow:

:

can become better leaders.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And and so when I went on staff at the church, I mean, just

Adam Tarnow:

:

real vulnerably, it was a big pay cut, honestly.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I was a I was a manager in an audit firm.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was making good money and and then I was making a lot

Adam Tarnow:

:

less. And so I maintained some connection to the CPA

Adam Tarnow:

:

community here in Dallas through training and speaking.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so it was it was it was just it was supplemental income

Adam Tarnow:

:

for me and my family at the time.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And it was something that I loved.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I was and I was starting to develop a little bit of an

Adam Tarnow:

:

aptitude for it and some skills and was starting to get

Adam Tarnow:

:

asked to speak at conferences.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then that led to an accounting firm here in town more

Adam Tarnow:

:

formally engaging me to train their their managers and

Adam Tarnow:

:

their seniors.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And after about ten years on staff, I really don't know

Adam Tarnow:

:

what really probably after about seven years on staff, I

Adam Tarnow:

:

really started to realize that my heart was changing and I

Adam Tarnow:

:

was laying awake at night thinking more about, I bet I

Adam Tarnow:

:

could grow this consulting thing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm really enjoying it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And, and so it took me probably three years.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I had the conviction long before I had the courage, which I

Adam Tarnow:

:

think a lot of entrepreneurs can identify with that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Some people you just know that you need to do this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But that's that's one thing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Then getting the courage to take a step out and at that

Adam Tarnow:

:

time having a family and older kids financially, it's

Adam Tarnow:

:

always a risk to go and do that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I remember having a lunch with somebody telling them that I

Adam Tarnow:

:

was thinking about doing this, and the first question they

Adam Tarnow:

:

asked me is, Do you have six months of income saved up?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I was like, Nope. They were like, Well, I really would

Adam Tarnow:

:

caution you against doing this then and now they had their

Adam Tarnow:

:

own story on on why that was their advice to me.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I appreciate what they were saying.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they were just that was the courage piece, right?

Adam Tarnow:

:

I just needed to get the courage to go and do this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then probably around 20, late 2019, I had made the

Adam Tarnow:

:

decision that I need to do this early 2020.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I actually told the the organization, the church that I was

Adam Tarnow:

:

working with, I told them in mid-February of 2020 that I

Adam Tarnow:

:

was going to leave at the end of May.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they were like, Well, what are you going to do?

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was like, Well, I'm going to go start this consulting

Adam Tarnow:

:

firm. I'm and I'm going to really focus on that more full

Adam Tarnow:

:

time and go seek more clients where I can do more live

Adam Tarnow:

:

training and work with leaders.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that's what I've been doing kind of on the side, as you

Adam Tarnow:

:

all know. And I'm going to go give that a shot and you're

Adam Tarnow:

:

like, great. And you know, we don't want to see excuse me,

Adam Tarnow:

:

we don't want to see you go, but but we can't knock you if

Adam Tarnow:

:

we're going to try this. This makes a lot of sense.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then the world, the world changed.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so that, you know, that really was a test of that

Adam Tarnow:

:

courage in March and April and May of 2020 on whether or

Adam Tarnow:

:

not I was going to do this.

Glenn Harper:

:

When you were with the church and doing your thing and you

Glenn Harper:

:

would do these gigs on the side, is that something you were

Glenn Harper:

:

just volunteering to do or are you getting paid for that or

Glenn Harper:

:

you're getting paid to the church?

Glenn Harper:

:

How did that work? Just out of curiosity.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was getting paid. And I think now what I realize is there

Adam Tarnow:

:

was a reason I was pretty busy because my rates, I was the

Adam Tarnow:

:

cheapest guy down.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so like, how much is it?

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm like, oh, this, you know, coming from the nonprofit

Adam Tarnow:

:

world, I was almost embarrassed to ask for what I was

Adam Tarnow:

:

asking for. Like, Oh, are they going to think I'm being

Adam Tarnow:

:

greedy and selfish? And, and I've fortunately changed my

Adam Tarnow:

:

prices a little bit now that it's a full time thing and

Adam Tarnow:

:

understand the value that it does provide for some

Adam Tarnow:

:

organizations.

Glenn Harper:

:

Yeah. We always get a kick out of entrepreneurs, like when

Glenn Harper:

:

do you make that jump?

Glenn Harper:

:

Or and literally it's it's a cannon ball from the top of

Glenn Harper:

:

the building into it.

Glenn Harper:

:

Yeah. You were able to.

Glenn Harper:

:

I think what some entrepreneurs get a chance to do is kind

Glenn Harper:

:

of slowly test the waters.

Glenn Harper:

:

And because you don't really know, you're just like, well,

Glenn Harper:

:

I like doing that. And then you're doing it and you're

Glenn Harper:

:

you're successful at it and you're like, you get a little

Glenn Harper:

:

more confidence, a little more swag.

Glenn Harper:

:

And then you're like, Hey, you know what?

Glenn Harper:

:

Maybe I could be this guy.

Glenn Harper:

:

I want to be that guy.

Glenn Harper:

:

But then, like you said, you probably knew that many years

Glenn Harper:

:

before you actually said, I'm going to go do this.

Glenn Harper:

:

And again, those we always talk about, it's not really

Glenn Harper:

:

regrets, but just if you could go back and change something

Glenn Harper:

:

in your in your journey, do you think that it would have

Glenn Harper:

:

been monumental change or just a nominal change if you'd

Glenn Harper:

:

have said, hey, instead of waiting that five, six years, if

Glenn Harper:

:

you'd had done this at year five, would that have

Glenn Harper:

:

accelerated where you're at today or were you just not

Glenn Harper:

:

quite ready yet?

Adam Tarnow:

:

That's a really thoughtful question, Glenn.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I like that you ask that because it's something I've

Adam Tarnow:

:

been thinking about. And I'm candidly, I'm reading Daniel

Adam Tarnow:

:

Pink's new book on Regret right now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so it's really interesting as he is breaking that down

Adam Tarnow:

:

and talking about what regret is and how often we you know,

Adam Tarnow:

:

the way he describes it is we go back in time, we make a

Adam Tarnow:

:

different decision, then we come back to the future, so to

Adam Tarnow:

:

speak. And that's why we feel regret.

Adam Tarnow:

:

It's really interesting how he is talking about that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I think the only regret that I really have, Glenn, if I

Adam Tarnow:

:

could go back and do it again, is maybe I would have had

Adam Tarnow:

:

the courage to have left and maybe 2018 or or maybe end of

Adam Tarnow:

:

2017. So I think it would have just been a few years that I

Adam Tarnow:

:

wish I would have started a tad bit sooner, but I don't

Adam Tarnow:

:

think I'd go back to college and choose to major in English

Adam Tarnow:

:

and then just start writing and developing content right

Adam Tarnow:

:

away. I think that's where, again, I'll go back to that

Adam Tarnow:

:

Seinfeld episode. Like those plotlines were necessary in

Adam Tarnow:

:

creating who I am and then the value that I believe I can

Adam Tarnow:

:

add to organizations today and to leaders today.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I needed that that ten years in accounting, I needed that

Adam Tarnow:

:

ten years on staff at Watermark or five or six years there

Adam Tarnow:

:

on staff I think would have been really helpful.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So that's the only change I think I would go back and make.

Glenn Harper:

:

You certainly couldn't. I mean, accountants can't write, so

Glenn Harper:

:

that would have not worked anyway.

Glenn Harper:

:

So you had to stay with the numbers because if you had to

Glenn Harper:

:

do handwriting, it'd have been over.

Glenn Harper:

:

No, no way.

Julie Smith:

:

Yes. So, Adam, you talked a little bit about the the person

Julie Smith:

:

that you met and they had asked, you know, do you have six

Julie Smith:

:

months of savings?

Julie Smith:

:

And it kind of played a role into that decision.

Julie Smith:

:

But is there anyone else that really stands out to you that

Julie Smith:

:

was a mentor that kind of helped guide you to get the

Julie Smith:

:

courage to make that jump and maybe you still have that

Julie Smith:

:

relationship today.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, thank you. That's another great question.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yes. A guy named Randy Marshall and a guy named Jeff

Adam Tarnow:

:

Strasser, those were two very instrumental friends that

Adam Tarnow:

:

were looking me in the eye, hand on the shoulder.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I believe you can do this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I don't think this is crazy.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Right. So we know you.

Adam Tarnow:

:

We've watched you for years.

Adam Tarnow:

:

We've seen you. I mean, Jeff Stresa in particular was the

Adam Tarnow:

:

chief the chief learning officer for a large wealth

Adam Tarnow:

:

management firm here in town.

Adam Tarnow:

:

At the time, he had hired me to come in and do some work

Adam Tarnow:

:

with his firm.

Adam Tarnow:

:

He also knew me from church and had seen me in that

Adam Tarnow:

:

context. So he had seen me in both contexts and had a lot

Adam Tarnow:

:

of experience here in DFW in that kind of consulting,

Adam Tarnow:

:

leadership, training space and was just going, You're not

Adam Tarnow:

:

crazy. And so I think you can do this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I think you've got a product, I think you've got some

Adam Tarnow:

:

skills. I think you've got a willpower that you'll be able

Adam Tarnow:

:

to to do this and get some stuff done.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So those were very, very helpful along the way.

Adam Tarnow:

:

There's obviously a lot of friends that are putting you on

Adam Tarnow:

:

the back, and for me, that was the way I was trying to make

Adam Tarnow:

:

the decision is what the people who know me well, what are

Adam Tarnow:

:

they saying? Because if if there is a lot of caution and I

Adam Tarnow:

:

want to listen to that, I want to listen to the counsel of

Adam Tarnow:

:

others. And and so, yeah, Jeff and Randy were very

Adam Tarnow:

:

instrumental as I was making that decision.

Glenn Harper:

:

Yeah. Because it's, it's weird.

Glenn Harper:

:

The entrepreneur, it's not we believe in what we do

Glenn Harper:

:

wholeheartedly of whatever that skill or task that we're

Glenn Harper:

:

doing. We just, we just know we can do it.

Glenn Harper:

:

But to actually run a business around it is a very

Glenn Harper:

:

intimidating thing for for most people.

Glenn Harper:

:

And if you don't have that mentor or somebody who really I

Glenn Harper:

:

don't want to say respects a big thing, but they've got to

Glenn Harper:

:

respect and believe in you so you can actually look

Glenn Harper:

:

yourself in the mirror and go, Man, I can believe.

Glenn Harper:

:

Gosh darn it, I'm Stuart Smalley.

Glenn Harper:

:

I can do this right.

Glenn Harper:

:

And when that happens again, it's just unfortunate.

Glenn Harper:

:

A lot of entrepreneurs don't seek those mentors because

Glenn Harper:

:

they're so busy doing their tasks that they don't think

Glenn Harper:

:

about that. But if you could just if you would just go out

Glenn Harper:

:

and explore and look at things and meet people and get in

Glenn Harper:

:

those groups, you might be surprised if you're listening as

Glenn Harper:

:

an entrepreneur that you might get to your journey, not

Glenn Harper:

:

your destination, but you'll get on that train a little bit

Glenn Harper:

:

quicker. If you can find that one person or a couple of

Glenn Harper:

:

people that really believe in you and just, you know, make

Glenn Harper:

:

you kind of challenge yourself, right?

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, that's kind of what happened with you.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah. Yeah. And I always wanted to to also make sure that my

Adam Tarnow:

:

life didn't become one of those opening episodes of

Adam Tarnow:

:

American Idol. You know, where the singer is terrible.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they're looking at the judges are looking at them and

Adam Tarnow:

:

going, Who told you you could sing?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And they're like, Well, my mom and my sister, they all tell

Adam Tarnow:

:

me I'm great. And and so that's where for me, an abundance

Adam Tarnow:

:

of counselors on this was very, very helpful to make sure I

Adam Tarnow:

:

was not just picking and choosing people who were going to

Adam Tarnow:

:

tell me, Oh, you'll be great at this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then my life was going to was going to turn into a

Adam Tarnow:

:

different TV show and I didn't want that to happen.

Glenn Harper:

:

Yeah, you can't be George Costanza because you get nothing

Glenn Harper:

:

done. But having a great show about nothing is always good.

Glenn Harper:

:

You know, when you're out there and you're trying to do

Glenn Harper:

:

your thing as an entrepreneur, the ability to you feel like

Glenn Harper:

:

you have to just stay on point all the time and just focus

Glenn Harper:

:

on one thing and try to get that done.

Glenn Harper:

:

But there's really that other side where it's that quest

Glenn Harper:

:

for knowledge, it's quest for relationships.

Glenn Harper:

:

But people are always scared to ask and or they're scared

Glenn Harper:

:

to say yes and said, You want to do this?

Glenn Harper:

:

You should always say yes, right?

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, not all the time, but most of the time, if you

Glenn Harper:

:

would just double up the amount of times you say no and say

Glenn Harper:

:

yes, I can't imagine how many entrepreneurs out there would

Glenn Harper:

:

be achieve their success that they want so much quicker.

Glenn Harper:

:

And I think that's just a tragedy that people just don't

Glenn Harper:

:

talk about.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, yeah, you're exactly right.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, so even if I go back to my story and start my

Adam Tarnow:

:

business in June of 2020 and my business model was or the

Adam Tarnow:

:

business plan was live training, there was no live

Adam Tarnow:

:

training. It was happening in June.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So now I'm trying to say yes to different things.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I know one of your past guests, Janelle, who is a story

Adam Tarnow:

:

brand certified guide. I went through and did that and was

Adam Tarnow:

:

saying yes to helping some some of my friends with their

Adam Tarnow:

:

marketing. And and it was a way to use some of my curation

Adam Tarnow:

:

skills on, on writing and clarity and things like that said

Adam Tarnow:

:

yes to helping some clients with podcasting, you know, that

Adam Tarnow:

:

led to some business there.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so that was really helpful to say yes to a lot of

Adam Tarnow:

:

things in the beginning because in the beginning I couldn't

Adam Tarnow:

:

really execute Plan A yet.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was everybody was still learning the virtual training

Adam Tarnow:

:

space. And so I was certainly trying to say yes to some

Adam Tarnow:

:

virtual trainings, but it was still everybody is trying to

Adam Tarnow:

:

figure that out. So saying yes helped me put food on the

Adam Tarnow:

:

table for about the first 6 to 8 months of my business.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Then in 2021, the training started to pick back up and I was

Adam Tarnow:

:

able to now start to say no to some of those other things

Adam Tarnow:

:

that I said yes to.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But I was so grateful for the learnings that happened in

Adam Tarnow:

:

there. I mean, obviously as an entrepreneur, I need to know

Adam Tarnow:

:

how to market. So I was really grateful that I said yes to

Adam Tarnow:

:

some of that. Podcasting is a big part of my business model

Adam Tarnow:

:

as well for my own personal brand.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then it's a way to to help some other clients as well.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I was grateful to say yes to those things because I

Adam Tarnow:

:

learned a ton as I went through that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So so yeah, I mean, saying yes is very, very helpful

Adam Tarnow:

:

oftentimes. But then there comes a time where you do have

Adam Tarnow:

:

to focus. Right, right.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And and so I feel like I'm just getting now 18, 20 months

Adam Tarnow:

:

in where I have the luxury of saying no or it's more

Adam Tarnow:

:

strategic for me to say no to a few things, to really hone

Adam Tarnow:

:

in on the products that are profitable for me and where I

Adam Tarnow:

:

think I'm adding the most value and really where where I

Adam Tarnow:

:

want to take the business going forward.

Glenn Harper:

:

Yeah, I think that the beginning entrepreneur then you go

Glenn Harper:

:

through the, you know, figuring out what the heck you want

Glenn Harper:

:

to do and how you want to do it.

Glenn Harper:

:

And then you're trying to just gather that information and

Glenn Harper:

:

ultimately you find out what you're going to do and then

Glenn Harper:

:

you've got to narrow it back a little bit.

Glenn Harper:

:

But that beginning stage, that's where that's the most

Glenn Harper:

:

important time to reach out and get that information.

Glenn Harper:

:

And I think what you said was, you know, we'll go back 100

Glenn Harper:

:

years from now and look back at what happened and, you

Glenn Harper:

:

know, 2020 and 2021.

Glenn Harper:

:

And it's it can't be any more glaring than you start off.

Glenn Harper:

:

I'm going to do this and instantly that it doesn't exist.

Glenn Harper:

:

There's no in person.

Glenn Harper:

:

And you had to do this pivot and go, right, turn, Clyde,

Glenn Harper:

:

and we're over here doing the virtual thing.

Glenn Harper:

:

And you had to figure it out because as an entrepreneur,

Glenn Harper:

:

you can't go back now.

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, you committed I mean, you can't just stop because

Glenn Harper:

:

you believe in yourself so much.

Glenn Harper:

:

You figured it out.

Glenn Harper:

:

And entrepreneurs, you know, you just don't get frustrated

Glenn Harper:

:

and and go, Oh, no, what happened to me?

Glenn Harper:

:

It's got to be like, hey, there's another opportunity.

Glenn Harper:

:

I got to go through that door now.

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, that's the a big takeaway, I hope, from this

Glenn Harper:

:

podcast that people will see that you are going to get

Glenn Harper:

:

roadblocks, you're going to get pummeled, but you just got

Glenn Harper:

:

to figure out a way to get around that roadblock.

Glenn Harper:

:

And I think you did it pretty well.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I hope so. Yeah.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, one way to judge it would be, you know, my family

Adam Tarnow:

:

and I, we haven't missed a meal and we've been able to put

Adam Tarnow:

:

gas on the car when we need it, you know, and all that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You haven't missed a mortgage payment, all that kind of

Adam Tarnow:

:

stuff. So so from that perspective, yeah, it's turned out

Adam Tarnow:

:

to be okay. I mean, and again, going back to the courage

Adam Tarnow:

:

piece that in 2018, that's really most of 2019, that's what

Adam Tarnow:

:

I was afraid of. Like, well, will we be able to can I

Adam Tarnow:

:

provide for. Or my family.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so from that perspective, it's great to see that that

Adam Tarnow:

:

worked out, you know, and now we can start to dream about

Adam Tarnow:

:

where growth takes us and where it goes from here.

Glenn Harper:

:

But right there is the is the coolest thing ever is that

Glenn Harper:

:

until you commit, you can't you're never going to make it

Glenn Harper:

:

work. And when you have to put food on the table, there is

Glenn Harper:

:

no other option and there is no failure.

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, we can't say failure in these podcasts, but there

Glenn Harper:

:

there is no going back.

Glenn Harper:

:

So but you can't commit until your back's against the wall

Glenn Harper:

:

and you're looking at your family go, well, you know, this

Glenn Harper:

:

has to work. I have to make this work versus well, I'll

Glenn Harper:

:

kind of sort of and I'll get to it next week.

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, what a great way to get you get you motivated when

Glenn Harper:

:

you don't have any choices.

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, that's a big deal.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah. For 20, 20 some odd years of my career, I had my boss

Adam Tarnow:

:

is telling me to think like an owner.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Think like an owner. Think like an owner.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I understood the the intent there behind that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But it was always difficult to act like an owner sometimes

Adam Tarnow:

:

because I wasn't I mean, it was like this is an acting

Adam Tarnow:

:

exercise. I get what you're trying to tell me to do.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You want me to take responsibility?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that was a great a great thing for me to continue to do

Adam Tarnow:

:

as a as a young leader.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But this is the first time I've owned something.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so, yes, there is a when you're walking across that

Adam Tarnow:

:

tightrope and there's no net, you're a little more focused

Adam Tarnow:

:

and there's a little more motivation.

Glenn Harper:

:

It's the best, though, isn't it?

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, it's an incredible euphoria because you're just

Glenn Harper:

:

it's all you. It's you versus the world.

Glenn Harper:

:

But it it isn't like an adversarial thing.

Glenn Harper:

:

It's more like, hey, I can do this.

Glenn Harper:

:

I can compete at this level, I can do this.

Glenn Harper:

:

And it's a really whole different thing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Julie Smith:

:

So I have one another question for you.

Julie Smith:

:

And I think you kind of are at an advantage because you're

Julie Smith:

:

in the corporate world and then you were really a big part

Julie Smith:

:

of your team at the church.

Julie Smith:

:

But from a leadership perspective and your role in what

Julie Smith:

:

you're doing today, what does team mean to you and what how

Julie Smith:

:

is that influenced where you are and what you're doing?

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, yeah. That is maybe one of the things I miss the most

Adam Tarnow:

:

is that that really that feeling of being on a team because

Adam Tarnow:

:

my team right now is me and, and then my wife who is a non

Adam Tarnow:

:

paid employee at times.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Right. She comes and helps out but it's like, well, the

Adam Tarnow:

:

money's all going in the same place.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So there's no need to know, need to formalize that by

Adam Tarnow:

:

giving you a salary.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so, yeah, for me what I have to do with team is really

Adam Tarnow:

:

that, that I don't want to say joint venture, but those

Adam Tarnow:

:

professional relationships where we know there's going to

Adam Tarnow:

:

be mutual benefit.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so some podcast with some friends who also have their

Adam Tarnow:

:

own personal brand, but we're coming together to to do

Adam Tarnow:

:

this. So my buddy Clay Scroggins and I, we've got a podcast

Adam Tarnow:

:

called How to Lead. He's in Atlanta.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I've known him for 20 years.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm here in Dallas.

Adam Tarnow:

:

He has a very similar career journey to me.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And and it's trying to do very similar things.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so we have done a joint venture on that podcast to try

Adam Tarnow:

:

to come together. It helps both of our personal brands,

Adam Tarnow:

:

helps us test out some ideas that we're trying to share

Adam Tarnow:

:

with our clients.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And then that has naturally led into some other products

Adam Tarnow:

:

that we're trying to do together around, like specifically

Adam Tarnow:

:

around employee engagement.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Right now, we've got this thing called the team engagement

Adam Tarnow:

:

sprint and we're just trying to help organizations and

Adam Tarnow:

:

teams that are struggling with retention and engagement.

Adam Tarnow:

:

We feel like the workforce is thinking differently about

Adam Tarnow:

:

work right now, and so leaders need to start thinking

Adam Tarnow:

:

differently about their their workplace and how they engage

Adam Tarnow:

:

people. And so those are some things that we're doing

Adam Tarnow:

:

together that does feel like a sense of team.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But but I think that would be one area that if you too were

Adam Tarnow:

:

my business coach, where you would continue to challenge me

Adam Tarnow:

:

to not get isolated and to continue to maintain those

Adam Tarnow:

:

professional relationships where there is vulnerability.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You're talking about the highs and the lows.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You're seeking counsel, seeking advice.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I think that's an area where I still have to continue to

Adam Tarnow:

:

push myself to do that right now.

Julie Smith:

:

Do you think when you go into these companies and you

Julie Smith:

:

provide the training, though, is there some sense of team

Julie Smith:

:

in that regard? Because essentially they're hiring you as

Julie Smith:

:

the captain of their team to lead them to the next level or

Julie Smith:

:

to take them or pivot or do something like that.

Julie Smith:

:

You have to kind of get a little bit of that team high when

Julie Smith:

:

you go in and achieve that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, that's really good. I don't know if I would have been

Adam Tarnow:

:

able to put words on that, but but you're exactly right.

Adam Tarnow:

:

That is it. I mean, especially some of these clients that

Adam Tarnow:

:

I've had for a long time, I do feel like I'm a part of

Adam Tarnow:

:

their team now and they do view me as that trusted advisor.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so, yeah, that is an aspect of it as well, that maybe I

Adam Tarnow:

:

haven't been able to put words on that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But you're exactly right, there is a high because when they

Adam Tarnow:

:

do well, I feel like, okay, I got to contribute to that and

Adam Tarnow:

:

that was a lot of fun.

Glenn Harper:

:

So what's this is?

Glenn Harper:

:

Again, only an account would understand this humor.

Glenn Harper:

:

But, you know, do you find yourself sometimes you're

Glenn Harper:

:

sitting there at this organization and you're doing what

Glenn Harper:

:

you do with them and you're looking around and go, You guys

Glenn Harper:

:

are doing this all wrong.

Glenn Harper:

:

I could reorganize this thing.

Glenn Harper:

:

I get you a new tax structure, I get a new GL, I get all

Glenn Harper:

:

kinds of things I could do for you and do some

Glenn Harper:

:

multinational corporations.

Glenn Harper:

:

Do you ever? Take that hat totally off.

Glenn Harper:

:

You just kind of bite your tongue and not say anything.

Adam Tarnow:

:

No, listen, Glenn, I was a very average accountant.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, I think I think my career is better that I'm not

Adam Tarnow:

:

doing that anymore.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so, no, I often I'll think about reorganization, but

Adam Tarnow:

:

not like, oh, if you set it up this way, it's more like if

Adam Tarnow:

:

you move to that person over there and then that one over

Adam Tarnow:

:

there, and if you all were just clear about this, I think

Adam Tarnow:

:

this team would do better. So that's where my brain goes.

Glenn Harper:

:

Oh, my God, that's funny.

Glenn Harper:

:

So is it safe to say, you know, as you went through this

Glenn Harper:

:

journey as a kid and here we are today and maybe an

Glenn Harper:

:

accountant and doing all these things, you know, have you

Glenn Harper:

:

defined that your superpower?

Glenn Harper:

:

Like, what is that thing that you're like, man, I'm I'm

Glenn Harper:

:

just the man at that. This is I just rock this space.

Glenn Harper:

:

Is it talking?

Glenn Harper:

:

Is it looking good?

Glenn Harper:

:

Is it motivating people?

Glenn Harper:

:

You know, what is that.

Julie Smith:

:

Your NFL linebacker stature, right?

Adam Tarnow:

:

No, I've never gotten so many positive comments about the

Adam Tarnow:

:

way I look and I have on this podcast.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I will come back whenever you want me to.

Adam Tarnow:

:

No, that's so funny.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Again, I was just thinking about this Monday night.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I think I was writing this down because I was in a

Adam Tarnow:

:

conversation with a leader.

Adam Tarnow:

:

No, it was Tuesday, Tuesday night, where I just asked this

Adam Tarnow:

:

leader, he's the CEO of of an organization here in town.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I just said, hey, what's your like what's like what are

Adam Tarnow:

:

you a craftsman of?

Adam Tarnow:

:

Like, what's your craftsmanship?

Adam Tarnow:

:

So what is this identity that you go, this is who I am and

Adam Tarnow:

:

what I do. This is my vocation.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So which got me thinking about that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

How, how would I describe what what I think I'm good at?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I think I just I'm a teacher.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, I think that really is it is I just love to teach.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I love to learn.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I love to systematize that information and I love to share

Adam Tarnow:

:

it with others. I really do that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

That is something that I can remember all the way back to

Adam Tarnow:

:

eighth grade in my math class being able to.

Adam Tarnow:

:

We had a student teacher one semester and she every day we

Adam Tarnow:

:

started off with an exercise basically reviewing the lesson

Adam Tarnow:

:

that we went over the day before.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So we'd show up and there was a lesson or there was a

Adam Tarnow:

:

problem on the board. We would all do it, and then the

Adam Tarnow:

:

teacher would go through and go over that lesson with the

Adam Tarnow:

:

class. And I remember she got to the point where she was

Adam Tarnow:

:

letting me get up there and teach that exercise and that

Adam Tarnow:

:

lesson, like going over it with the class.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I loved it. I was like, okay, I'm going to do this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Hey, can I get up there and can I lead this part of the

Adam Tarnow:

:

class? And she was like, Sure.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I remember one time, so she was a student teacher, so

Adam Tarnow:

:

her professor was there observing the class and I got up

Adam Tarnow:

:

there and did that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And as an eighth grader, I didn't know who this this lady

Adam Tarnow:

:

was in the back. It didn't. I was just doing my thing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that professor came up to me at the end of class and

Adam Tarnow:

:

she kind of pulled me aside and she just said, I just want

Adam Tarnow:

:

to let you know what you did up there was fantastic.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I think you really have some teaching gifts and you

Adam Tarnow:

:

should think about that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You know, 14 year old Adam was just like, you know,

Adam Tarnow:

:

whatever. I don't know and didn't really think much about

Adam Tarnow:

:

it. But I can think back to that moment and then just all

Adam Tarnow:

:

the moments throughout my career where I felt the most

Adam Tarnow:

:

alive and it usually had something to do with teaching.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so so I would say that's probably what I feel like I'm

Adam Tarnow:

:

the best at.

Julie Smith:

:

So you said something very interesting and powerful in the

Julie Smith:

:

beginning of this interview, and I think that it really hit

Julie Smith:

:

home for me because I think that a lot of people don't see

Julie Smith:

:

it the way that you said it.

Julie Smith:

:

And you said leadership is a skill and you just described a

Julie Smith:

:

skill that you've had your entire life and essentially

Julie Smith:

:

you've been able to capitalize on it.

Julie Smith:

:

But for anyone out there who heard that and it was rattling

Julie Smith:

:

around again, that that kind of really stuck with me.

Julie Smith:

:

What advice would you give to people that have that skill,

Julie Smith:

:

that haven't been able to capitalize on it or have the

Julie Smith:

:

awareness about it instead of, like you said, most people

Julie Smith:

:

think they earn this position to have leadership and that's

Julie Smith:

:

just untrue. It's truly a skill.

Julie Smith:

:

What what advice would you give them?

Julie Smith:

:

Because I think that's.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So how to grow in the skill of leadership.

Julie Smith:

:

Yeah. And how to, how to really capitalize on that,

Julie Smith:

:

understand it, be aware of it.

Julie Smith:

:

Again, it's not, you know, it's not a position that you

Julie Smith:

:

earn. It's something that comes from within that you're

Julie Smith:

:

able to exert.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah. I mean so again, my teacher side is going to have a

Adam Tarnow:

:

bias towards just go study it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so that to me is always such a great way to do it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, we live in the golden age of learning right now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, like what we're doing right now, there's so much

Adam Tarnow:

:

free content out there that there really is no excuse to

Adam Tarnow:

:

not be a continuous learner anymore.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I mean, between master classes and YouTube and LinkedIn

Adam Tarnow:

:

classes and trainings that your company provides and books

Adam Tarnow:

:

that are out there in audio books and podcasts, it's just

Adam Tarnow:

:

so I think for some, like it just starts with curiosity and

Adam Tarnow:

:

just wanting to learn and finding some voices that really

Adam Tarnow:

:

do that you really do resonate with.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So like for example, I mentioned Daniel, Daniel Pink, like

Adam Tarnow:

:

he would be a mentor of mine that I've never met, but I

Adam Tarnow:

:

just resonate with the way he talks and the way he

Adam Tarnow:

:

communicates. It's ideas.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And he has had a profound influence on my on my leadership

Adam Tarnow:

:

skill. I take his ideas from his books.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I apply them to my life because he's so clear when he

Adam Tarnow:

:

writes. And I find that very helpful.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I think it's it's like finding some voices that you

Adam Tarnow:

:

really resonate with and just going, okay, I'm going to I'm

Adam Tarnow:

:

going to try to apply what this person says to my

Adam Tarnow:

:

leadership journey. And I think what what is so freeing

Adam Tarnow:

:

about the leadership as a skill is it's like any skill and

Adam Tarnow:

:

it's like if you don't use it, you're going to lose it and

Adam Tarnow:

:

you can get better at it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So wherever you're wherever you are right now, you can get

Adam Tarnow:

:

better. And so there's a bunch of ways that you can get

Adam Tarnow:

:

better as a leader.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But a guy named Clay Scroggins and a guy named Duke Rivard

Adam Tarnow:

:

really helped me understand.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Clay Scroggins wrote a book back in 2017 called How to Lead

Adam Tarnow:

:

When You're Not in Charge, which was such a great title of

Adam Tarnow:

:

a book, and it's so just amazing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And he just really unleashed this idea that leadership is

Adam Tarnow:

:

about influence, and you can influence anywhere in the

Adam Tarnow:

:

organization, anywhere, I'm sure for your firm right now,

Adam Tarnow:

:

you've probably got maybe the most influential person in

Adam Tarnow:

:

your firm doesn't have a leadership title, whether it be

Adam Tarnow:

:

through a positive attitude that they bring every day or a

Adam Tarnow:

:

negative attitude that they bring every day, they're

Adam Tarnow:

:

influencing people.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so so leadership is influence.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Wherever you sit in the organization, you can have some

Adam Tarnow:

:

influence. And then my buddy Duke Rivard, taught me what I

Adam Tarnow:

:

think is the best definition of leadership that I've ever

Adam Tarnow:

:

heard. That to be a leader really is just somebody who

Adam Tarnow:

:

takes initiative for the benefit of other people.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So you just take initiative for the benefit of other people

Adam Tarnow:

:

that so some of those concepts along my leadership journey

Adam Tarnow:

:

have really helped form the way I think about it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so to me it was all just being open, curious, listening

Adam Tarnow:

:

for ideas, having a desire to want to get better at that

Adam Tarnow:

:

skill. And you'll always find an opportunity to use it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I love sharing that with emerging leaders is just do

Adam Tarnow:

:

not wait to get the title.

Adam Tarnow:

:

You can start leading right now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Where can you take initiative today for the benefit of

Adam Tarnow:

:

other people? Go do that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I'm telling you, you start to do that one day after

Adam Tarnow:

:

another, day after another day soon, you're going to find

Adam Tarnow:

:

that a title matches the amount of influence that you've

Adam Tarnow:

:

got. And with the title, hopefully comes some more

Adam Tarnow:

:

financial reward and more opportunity and all that and so

Adam Tarnow:

:

on.

Glenn Harper:

:

It's eighth grade.

Glenn Harper:

:

When you talked about that, it's one of the things that I

Glenn Harper:

:

find for myself and Julie, I think probably the same same

Glenn Harper:

:

way on this. And you I'm going to try to put it all

Glenn Harper:

:

together. There's a lot of thoughts in my head on this, but

Glenn Harper:

:

ultimately you can't really learn something and know

Glenn Harper:

:

something until you take that and try to teach it to

Glenn Harper:

:

somebody else.

Glenn Harper:

:

For some reason, it just makes you have that clarity.

Glenn Harper:

:

And ultimately there you are helping somebody else.

Glenn Harper:

:

And you're doing this in eighth grade, right?

Glenn Harper:

:

And here you are, what, ten years later?

Glenn Harper:

:

15 years later, you're doing it now.

Glenn Harper:

:

But whatever that is.

Adam Tarnow:

:

For the record, that's the third positive element.

Glenn Harper:

:

We're always keeping it positive.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But my wife's going to get jealous.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I know she's going to be like, Hey, I don't know what's

Adam Tarnow:

:

going on.

Glenn Harper:

:

Who is this guy? And I think that that the teaching part is

Glenn Harper:

:

really everything in life now, because once you acquire

Glenn Harper:

:

that knowledge, why not might not teach somebody and not

Glenn Harper:

:

only resonates more with you, but you're helping somebody

Glenn Harper:

:

else. And then the other thing in eighth grade that I can

Glenn Harper:

:

probably count on my on one hand out of like 1000 schools,

Glenn Harper:

:

how many people want to get up and actually do the hardest

Glenn Harper:

:

thing ever at that age and go in front of speaking people

Glenn Harper:

:

speak in front of people like it's impossible.

Glenn Harper:

:

But ultimately your deepest, darkest fears, scariness,

Glenn Harper:

:

whatever that is, go do that.

Glenn Harper:

:

The first thing when you get done with this podcast, go, go

Glenn Harper:

:

put a trench on your face.

Glenn Harper:

:

I don't care. Whatever that thing is, you literally, once

Glenn Harper:

:

you overcome that fear, you are a different person because

Glenn Harper:

:

you don't have those shackles on you anymore.

Glenn Harper:

:

You can be free again.

Glenn Harper:

:

So those biggest fears are things you're scared of.

Glenn Harper:

:

Just do those first, first thing in the morning and

Glenn Harper:

:

everything else is downhill.

Adam Tarnow:

:

That's right. That's right.

Adam Tarnow:

:

That's really good advice. I like that.

Glenn Harper:

:

Well, I think we got one more kind of final question that

Glenn Harper:

:

well, I guess I got two.

Glenn Harper:

:

The first one is, you know, when we see people as

Glenn Harper:

:

entrepreneurs are kind of doing two things.

Glenn Harper:

:

One, they're kind of doing business when they have the

Glenn Harper:

:

skill set and they're doing what they do and they do it

Glenn Harper:

:

very well. And you can make a great living at that.

Glenn Harper:

:

You find your balance if you do it right and there's

Glenn Harper:

:

nothing wrong with doing business.

Glenn Harper:

:

But sometimes people want to make the conversion where they

Glenn Harper:

:

say, Look, I'm tired of just doing all the work.

Glenn Harper:

:

I want to build a business.

Glenn Harper:

:

Do you see yourself?

Glenn Harper:

:

I see you kind of as doing business right now.

Glenn Harper:

:

Do you see yourself ever wanting to go build this mega

Glenn Harper:

:

business or are you pretty happy doing what you do?

Glenn Harper:

:

And you find your right balance and you're making what you

Glenn Harper:

:

want to make and do what you want to do, or you're like,

Glenn Harper:

:

you know? And Glenn, it's a funny conversation.

Glenn Harper:

:

Five years from now, I want to have 37 consultants like me

Glenn Harper:

:

doing this.

Adam Tarnow:

:

That I don't know honestly how to answer that great answer.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Right now I'm very content with what I've got.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that was one of the that was surprising on this

Adam Tarnow:

:

entrepreneurial journey.

Adam Tarnow:

:

How many leaders when I was when I were talking to them,

Adam Tarnow:

:

they were asking me, so are you going to build a business

Adam Tarnow:

:

or are you going to be a solopreneur?

Adam Tarnow:

:

Like, what's what are you going to do?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so I think right now there's a tremendous amount of

Adam Tarnow:

:

contentment as a solopreneur, personal brand doing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I have some examples in my mind which has been very

Adam Tarnow:

:

powerful for me to just think through, not where do I want

Adam Tarnow:

:

to be with some numbers or some words written down, but put

Adam Tarnow:

:

some faces out there of people who I think are doing at a

Adam Tarnow:

:

high level what I would want to do.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so there's a guy like Jon Acuff comes to mind is a guy

Adam Tarnow:

:

who I've never met but seems to be doing some very similar

Adam Tarnow:

:

things under his own personal brand, writing books and

Adam Tarnow:

:

speaking and doing trainings.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so I'm attracted to that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I think the the autonomy that he has and the upside I like

Adam Tarnow:

:

the downside is you've got to buy the business from

Adam Tarnow:

:

yourself along the way because there's no exit strategy.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I think as an accountant, I appreciate understanding

Adam Tarnow:

:

that, that right now I can't just take all the revenue and

Adam Tarnow:

:

put it in my pocket. I've got to start buying the business

Adam Tarnow:

:

from myself if I'm not going to grow it and sell it one

Adam Tarnow:

:

day.

Glenn Harper:

:

Oh, so now you're bringing all the accounting in.

Glenn Harper:

:

Now I get it. I see how you're drawing.

Glenn Harper:

:

I see what you're doing.

Adam Tarnow:

:

For that skill. That's right.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Very great.

Glenn Harper:

:

So final question is, you know, what's the end game?

Glenn Harper:

:

I mean, is everybody not everybody, but a lot of

Glenn Harper:

:

entrepreneurs think they have to chase this magical number

Glenn Harper:

:

thing, whatever that is.

Glenn Harper:

:

I don't really get that feel for me.

Glenn Harper:

:

These are chasing anything. You're just having a good time

Glenn Harper:

:

and for some reason you get paid.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Yeah, I do have some owners intent in Casey Graham's new

Adam Tarnow:

:

book, The No BS Small Business Book, a great resource that

Adam Tarnow:

:

I would recommend for for entrepreneurs.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I just read it two weeks ago.

Adam Tarnow:

:

It was very, very fast.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Read the first section there.

Adam Tarnow:

:

He talks about owners intent.

Adam Tarnow:

:

What is your intent? Like, what are you trying to do?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And your owner's intent can change as your business

Adam Tarnow:

:

changes. My owner's intent is very focused right now on

Adam Tarnow:

:

what I would say is building a platform.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And for the first time in my life, I think I understand why

Adam Tarnow:

:

I want to build a platform. It felt very icky to say that

Adam Tarnow:

:

before because it was like, I don't want to be famous,

Adam Tarnow:

:

right? I'm not trying to be famous.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm not trying to be a celebrity platform.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Felt like fame or something.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Like I was telling everybody, I just want to be rich and

Adam Tarnow:

:

famous, you know, like all the millennials want.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And so it felt like that.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But but I understand now that I want to build a platform,

Adam Tarnow:

:

because what I want to do, if I think about the spectrum of

Adam Tarnow:

:

hustle for work versus manage the demand that people are

Adam Tarnow:

:

reaching out to you for work.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm way over here on Hustle, right?

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm sending out emails.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm asking for business.

Adam Tarnow:

:

I'm trying to do things to build the platform, build the

Adam Tarnow:

:

email list, build the LinkedIn subscribers or the LinkedIn

Adam Tarnow:

:

followers and connections.

Adam Tarnow:

:

Because what I want to do is I kind of want to not mark it

Adam Tarnow:

:

right? Like that takes up so much time to mark it.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So I want to get a platform to make selling easier and to

Adam Tarnow:

:

build that tribe that knows me, trust me, and they will

Adam Tarnow:

:

continue to hire me again.

Adam Tarnow:

:

So that that's my endgame right now is just thinking

Adam Tarnow:

:

through the platform building.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And that's my owner's intent now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

And I think once I reach that goal, then I'll have to think

Adam Tarnow:

:

about the next owner's intent where where I think that's

Adam Tarnow:

:

when I would get to the language of what is the endgame,

Adam Tarnow:

:

how much longer do I want to do this for?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And probably I think right now my accounting brain, I would

Adam Tarnow:

:

just pick a number that I feel like my wife and I need in

Adam Tarnow:

:

the account and then just start working backwards and just

Adam Tarnow:

:

go, okay, what?

Adam Tarnow:

:

We've got ten years now.

Adam Tarnow:

:

How far away are we from that number?

Adam Tarnow:

:

And and I think that's I think that's how we'd solve that

Adam Tarnow:

:

problem.

Glenn Harper:

:

But that's a trick question because there's not a number.

Glenn Harper:

:

Just so you know, the accountant wants to make a number,

Glenn Harper:

:

but there's no number. There is not there.

Glenn Harper:

:

And the other funny thing you said, like, you just can't

Glenn Harper:

:

get away of being an accountant. I'm just sorry.

Glenn Harper:

:

You just can't, because here you are saying you don't like

Glenn Harper:

:

to do sales. Are you kidding me?

Glenn Harper:

:

An account that doesn't like to do sales that just doesn't

Glenn Harper:

:

exist. That's the funniest thing ever.

Adam Tarnow:

:

But I'm so rare.

Glenn Harper:

:

I know. It's so bizarre.

Glenn Harper:

:

Not stereotypical at all.

Glenn Harper:

:

Well, Adam, it's been an absolute pleasure having you on

Glenn Harper:

:

the show today. I hope all of our listeners.

Glenn Harper:

:

They glean some some points that will resonate with them

Glenn Harper:

:

and help them maybe make that next step to try to be all

Glenn Harper:

:

they can be and live the dream that's out there for all of

Glenn Harper:

:

us to do. Again, this Glen Harper.

Glenn Harper:

:

And thanks again for joining us today.

Julie Smith:

:

And Julie Smith.

Glenn Harper:

:

Take care.

Glenn Harper:

:

Adam Tarnow: Thanks, guys.

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