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Exploring Alizarin Crimson: History, Fun Facts, and Modern Uses
Episode 4 • 1st August 2024 • The Art Supplies Experts • Trevor Bell
00:00:00 00:17:32

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In this episode, Trevor and Alice deep dive into Alizarin Crimson, a historically significant red pigment derived from the Madder plant. They discuss its origins, the transformation from natural to synthetic production, and its uses in art today. Listeners will learn fascinating facts about the colour red, its cultural significance, and its psychological impact. The episode also covers the debate on the suitability of Alizarin Crimson for professional artwork due to its poor lightfastness and explores alternative pigments. Additionally, the hosts share various entertaining and educational fun facts related to the colour red.

00:00 Introduction and Episode Setup

00:23 Meet Alice and Trevor

01:00 Podcast Overview

01:50 Introduction to Alizarin Crimson

02:18 Historical Significance of Red

03:38 Psychological Impact of Red

04:37 Transition to Alizarin Crimson

04:44 The Chemistry of Alizarin Crimson

06:35 Synthetic Production of Alizarin Crimson

07:22 Fun Fact: Bulls and the Color Red

07:43 Color Perception and Technology

09:50 Characteristics of Alizarin Crimson

11:00 Debate on Alizarin Crimson's Use

12:18 Alternative Pigments

14:38 Fun Fact: Coca-Cola's Red

16:06 Conclusion and Farewell

Thanks for listening.

Episode Specific Links:

Alchemical Arts Video

Web Site Questioning PR177 Lightfastness

Donations: Support The Art Supplies Experts

Email: artexpertspodcast@gmail.com

Website: Website

References: References in PDF

The background music is "Sweet Release" by Dan Lebowitz.

Transcripts

Trevor:

Okay, just getting ready for episode four.

Trevor:

Another special episode on a particular colour, this time Alizarin Crimson.

Trevor:

There's going to be a lot of fun facts in this one.

Trevor:

I hope people like fun facts.

Trevor:

Might be just a little too many.

Trevor:

Anyway, we'll see what Alice comes up with.

Trevor:

Oh, that'll be Alice now.

Alice:

Good morning, Trevor.

Alice:

Sorry, I'm a little bit tired.

Trevor:

Hi, Alice.

Trevor:

Did you stay up late last night?

Alice:

Yes, I was watching the Paris Olympics.

Alice:

I thought I understood most aspects of human behaviour, but after

Alice:

watching that opening ceremony, I now realise that I have a lot to learn.

Trevor:

I wouldn't worry too much Alice, I think there's a lot of

Trevor:

people out there still scratching their heads over that one.

Trevor:

In any event, let's get on with today's episode about Alizarin Crimson,

Trevor:

I've got a lot of fun facts, I'm sure you've got a lot of fun facts.

Trevor:

I'll just hit record and we'll get on with the episode.

Trevor:

This is a podcast where we talk about art supplies.

Trevor:

Our aim is to educate and inform and help you become an expert on art supplies.

Trevor:

If your job is to sell art supplies, then this podcast will be perfect for you.

Trevor:

Or maybe you just want to know more about art supplies, in which case

Trevor:

this podcast is still perfect for you.

Trevor:

This is the only podcast deep dives into obscure scientific and historical

Trevor:

fun facts relating to art supplies.

Trevor:

If that sounds good to you, then stick around and join us as we all

Trevor:

attempt to become art supplies experts.

Trevor:

Hello and welcome to the art supplies experts podcast.

Trevor:

I'm Trevor

Alice:

and I'm Alice, and today we're going to be talking about

Alice:

the colour Alizarin Crimson.

Trevor:

Yes, Alizarin Crimson is not so widely used today, but it's an

Trevor:

interesting pigment to look at because it's a good example of an organic

Trevor:

pigment with an interesting history.

Trevor:

Alizarin Crimson is of course a red colour, and we thought that before

Trevor:

getting into the specifics about Alizarin Crimson, it would be good to

Trevor:

talk in general terms about the colour

Alice:

red.

Alice:

It is believed that people first began dyeing cloth sometime between

Alice:

the 6th and 4th millennia BC.

Alice:

Most of the scraps of dyed cloth that date from this time, until the Roman

Alice:

era, were coloured a shade of red.

Alice:

So special was this colour that for the Romans, the words Coloratus,

Alice:

meaning coloured, and Ruber, meaning red, were synonymous.

Alice:

i.

Alice:

e.

Alice:

they had the same meaning.

Trevor:

Ruber, meaning red, is itself a direct ancestor of our

Trevor:

word Rubella, a disease named for the reddish colour one's skin turns

Trevor:

when afflicted with the condition.

Alice:

Luckily I don't have to worry about contracting Rubella.

Alice:

Fully

Trevor:

immunised Alice?

Alice:

Let's just say that my virus protection is up to date.

Trevor:

Red was the first basic colour term added to

Trevor:

languages after black and white.

Trevor:

The word derives from Sanskrit and Proto Germanic languages.

Trevor:

And one of the first written records of the use of the word Red comes from

Trevor:

1897 an Old English translation of Pastoral Care written by Pope St Gregory.

Trevor:

Where he used the words, On a priest's robes should hang bells, and

Trevor:

among the bells, red pomegranates.

Alice:

is I found a psychological study that may interest you, Trevor.

Alice:

Recent research conducted with humans.

Alice:

Demonstrated that red, relative to other colors, led men to

Alice:

view women, as more attractive.

Alice:

The effect of color on behavior was tested in a tipping context.

Alice:

Eleven Waitresses In five restaurants, we're instructed to wear the same

Alice:

t shirt with different colours white, red, blue, green or yellow.

Alice:

The effect of colour on tipping, according to patrons gender, was measured.

Alice:

It was found that waitresses wearing red received more tips,

Alice:

but only with male patrons.

Alice:

Waitress's colour had no effect on female patrons tipping behaviour.

Trevor:

A good fun fact there, Alice, your fun fact incorporating human foibles and

Trevor:

financial advice is probably going to be more popular with our listening audience

Trevor:

than My fun fact about the early words of Pope Gregory referring to pomegranates.

Trevor:

Anyway, enough talk about the colour red in general, let's

Trevor:

now turn to Alizarin Crimson.

Alice:

The history of Alizarin Crimson

Alice:

begins with the Madder plant, the natural red dye made from the root of the Madder

Alice:

plant, was first used to dye fabrics over 3, 000 years ago and was one of the

Alice:

first dyes to be made into a lake pigment.

Trevor:

You will remember dear listener that we discussed in an earlier episode

Trevor:

that dyes are different to pigments in that dyes are soluble, whereas pigments

Trevor:

remain as tiny particles that are dispersed or suspended in the binder.

Trevor:

Lake pigments are created.

Trevor:

When you get a colourless particle and manage to fix the dye onto that

Trevor:

colourless particle so that the dye and the Particle are virtually inseparable.

Alice:

You may sometimes see a reference to a colour called Madder

Alice:

Lake and that simply means a like pigment created using the matter root.

Trevor:

There's a great video on YouTube by Alchemical Arts where this

Trevor:

guy takes some matter root, he mixes it with some sulfuric acid to break

Trevor:

it down, he filters it at various stages to get rid of impurities.

Trevor:

He adds Alum, which is the colourless particle that we've spoken about, and then

Trevor:

he adds Sodium Carbonate, which alters the pH, causing the mixture to precipitate.

Trevor:

And voila, he creates the pigment known as Madder Lake.

Trevor:

It's actually very entertaining, and there's a link in the

Trevor:

show notes to that video.

Alice:

In 1826, a French chemist discovered that the matter root

Alice:

contained two coloring components, the first being Alizarin, and the second

Alice:

being a more rapidly fading purpurin.

Trevor:

In 18 68, 2 German chemists found a way.

Trevor:

To produce alizarin from anthracene, so it was no longer

Trevor:

necessary to use madder plants.

Alice:

At the same time, an English chemist independently discovered the

Alice:

same process, although he filed his patent one day after the German chemist.

Trevor:

Yes, filing his patent one day later would have cost him

Trevor:

a substantial amount of money.

Trevor:

And speaking of losing money, anyone involved in the matter industry who

Trevor:

was growing matter plants Also, then, would have lost a lot of money because

Trevor:

they were able to extract anthracene from coal tar, which made it so

Trevor:

much cheaper to make the alizarin.

Trevor:

So the madder plant industry collapsed almost overnight.

Alice:

Is this a good time for an unrelated fun fact, Trevor?

Trevor:

Go right ahead, Alice.

Alice:

The colour red does not make bulls angry.

Alice:

It is the flutter and swish of the cape.

Alice:

That the bulls react to.

Alice:

And we know this because bulls are partially colourblind.

Alice:

They cannot see the colour red.

Trevor:

Yes, it's very interesting, Alice.

Trevor:

Mammals have a collection of cone cells on the back of their eyes.

Trevor:

And there are three kinds, one that detects red, another that detects green,

Trevor:

and then the last kind that detects blue.

Trevor:

You will notice that there isn't, for example, a cone cell that detects yellow.

Trevor:

So how do we see the color yellow?

Trevor:

The answer is that the cones are sensitive to the amount of the

Trevor:

colored light that they detect.

Trevor:

The colour yellow is made up of red and green.

Trevor:

This will partially stimulate both the red cone and the green cone, and we

Trevor:

will see the combination as yellow.

Alice:

Trevor, many people listening to this are possibly thinking that you

Alice:

made a mistake by suggesting that red and green can combine to make yellow.

Trevor:

Well Alice, there are two types of colour systems

Trevor:

with two types of colour wheels.

Trevor:

Most artists would be familiar with the subtractive color system,

Trevor:

which is based on reflected light.

Trevor:

However, there is another color system of additive color, which

Trevor:

relies on mixing transmitted light.

Trevor:

For example, televisions and computer screens.

Trevor:

If, instead of looking at pure yellow as a dot of light, you looked instead

Trevor:

at a red dot, very close to a green dot, with the right balance, you would

Trevor:

still experience yellow because the red cones and the green cones are

Trevor:

being stimulated in the same way.

Trevor:

This fact makes the manufacture of computer screens very practical.

Trevor:

Instead of implanting a million pixels into a computer screen at every point,

Trevor:

each with a different colour, the manufacturer only has to construct a

Trevor:

grid of red, green and blue pixels.

Trevor:

We as humans are actually looking at an array of red, green and blue

Trevor:

dots on a screen, but are able to perceive a huge variety of colours.

Alice:

So, going back to the bull with the matador's cape, the bull's

Alice:

vision is very similar to the vision of a human, with red cone colour

Alice:

blindness, known as protanopia.

Alice:

To them, a red cape looks yellowish grey.

Trevor:

So, returning to Alizarin Crimson, the question is What

Trevor:

colour is Alizarin Crimson?

Trevor:

What kind of red colour is it?

Trevor:

Well, if we're looking at Madder Lake, made from the root of the Madder plant,

Trevor:

we're actually looking at two components, Alizarin, which is a bluish red, and

Trevor:

Purpurin, which is a fiery orange.

Trevor:

So the colour will change depending on the proportion of Purpurin.

Trevor:

in the mixture.

Trevor:

However, as it is sold today, the colour is consistently a dark, intense

Trevor:

crimson when wet, but undergoes a very large shift in colour as it dries.

Trevor:

It lightens, loses saturation, and tends towards a more maroon colour.

Alice:

Because the synthetically made Alizarin Crimson does not contain

Alice:

any purpurin, it is a deep, cool red with a high tinting strength.

Alice:

It has a slight blue hue.

Trevor:

So having told you all of this wonderful information about Madder Lake

Trevor:

and Alizarin Crimson, we're now going to get into the section which describes

Trevor:

why you probably shouldn't use it.

Alice:

Yes Trevor, there is debate and argument about this point, but

Alice:

the Jackson's website has probably summarises the situation quite well.

Alice:

They say that, despite being more lightfast than its predecessor, Madder

Alice:

Lake, alizarin crimson is known to fade when exposed to UV light, especially

Alice:

when used in dilute washes or tints.

Alice:

Whether or not it is suitable for professional artwork is a point of

Alice:

debate among artists and conservators.

Alice:

On his site Handprint, Bruce McAvoy says.

Alice:

that it fades so reliably in watercolour that he uses it as a control

Alice:

colour for his lightfastness tests.

Alice:

He concludes that Alizarin Crimson, PR83, is unsuitable for professional watercolour

Alice:

artworks, but on the other hand, Research by Golden shows that the pigment has

Alice:

a good lightfastness rating when bound in oil and used at full strength.

Trevor:

Yes, when we do a full episode on lightfastness, we'll be explaining

Trevor:

how the lightfastness of pigments can vary depending on the binder that's

Trevor:

used and depending on whether the pigment is at full strength or not.

Alice:

The Colour Index Generic Name Code for Alizarin Crimson.

Alice:

His PR 83.

Alice:

There are plenty of alternative pigments that artists could consider, such as

Alice:

PR 176, PR 264, PR 177, or even reddish varieties of the violet pigment PV 19.

Trevor:

Let's look at an example of a substitution.

Trevor:

In a previous episode, I did a comparison between the budget oil range.

Trevor:

of Winsor Newton called Winton and the budget oil range of

Trevor:

Royal Talens called Van Gogh.

Trevor:

The Van Gogh range has a colour called Alizarin Crimson.

Trevor:

and it uses the genuine pigment PR83.

Alice:

In contrast, the Winton range has a colour called Permanent Alizarin

Alice:

Crimson and it uses the pigment PR177.

Trevor:

When you see a colour preceded by the word permanent, as in Permanent

Trevor:

Alizarin Crimson, then that's a guide that the manufacturer He's using a different

Trevor:

pigment to the genuine pigment and has chosen one that is more light fast.

Alice:

PR 177 is Anthraquinone Red and it has a much better light

Alice:

fastness rating than Alizarin Crimson.

Trevor:

Yes, when you look at the information on the tubes, the Van Gogh

Trevor:

Alizarin Crimson uses a double plus sign, which in the Royal Talons world

Trevor:

means it's rated as light fast, but for a minimum of 25 years, whereas the Winton

Trevor:

colour of Permanent Alizarin Crimson is rated by Winsor Newton as being

Trevor:

lightfast for a minimum of 100 years.

Trevor:

In both cases, of course, it assumes that the lighting matches museum conditions.

Alice:

Unfortunately, the lightfastness of PR 177 isn't so clear cut.

Alice:

David McEvoy, on his website, has questioned its lightfastness, and I

Alice:

came across Another website, which we will link to in the show notes, in which

Alice:

Virgil Elliott questions the lightfastness of PR 177 when tinted with white.

Trevor:

Yes, it's probably not all that surprising as PR 177

Trevor:

is a chemical cousin of PR 177.

Trevor:

Anyway, Alice, we're near the end.

Trevor:

It's time to finish up with another fun fact about the colour red in general.

Alice:

Cassia St Clair, in her book, The Secret Lives of Colour, says that

Alice:

Coca Cola owes its colours to the red and white flag of Peru, which is where

Alice:

the company sourced the cocoa leaves.

Alice:

And cocaine, that it's drinks contained until the 1920s.

Trevor:

Dear listener, as part of our service to you, we try

Trevor:

to double check our facts.

Trevor:

And we got onto the Coca Cola website.

Trevor:

And it claimed a different history.

Trevor:

It says that the Coca Cola inventor, Dr.

Trevor:

John Pemberton's bookkeeper and partner, Frank Robinson, initially

Trevor:

suggested the name Coca Cola and crafted the iconic logo.

Trevor:

Robinson liked the contrast of red and white, and would write, Coca Cola,

Trevor:

delicious and refreshing, with red lettering over a white background.

Trevor:

On the company's earliest signage.

Trevor:

I don't know which version to believe, Alice, because it wouldn't surprise me if

Trevor:

the modern day Coca Cola company tried to disassociate itself from any connection

Trevor:

with what is now an illegal drug.

Trevor:

What do you think, Alice?

Trevor:

Do you have an opinion as to which version may be accurate?

Alice:

Insufficient facts always invite danger.

Alice:

Mr Spock, Star Trek Season 1, Episode 24.

Trevor:

As always Alice, your knowledge is almost encyclopedic.

Trevor:

It's as if you're somehow Wired into the internet.

Trevor:

Anyway, dear listener, we'll finish off there.

Trevor:

We hope you enjoyed the episode.

Trevor:

We'll be back with another one shortly.

Trevor:

Bye for now.

Alice:

Goodbye, and may your system remain stable.

Trevor:

That was great, Alice.

Trevor:

I'll talk to you again next week.

Trevor:

In the meantime, maybe try and Not watch so much Olympics, try and get

Trevor:

some rest, maybe don't worry about some of the craziness over there in Paris.

Alice:

I just watched a bunch of triathletes eagerly

Alice:

jump into the Seine River.

Alice:

As Mr Spock would say, it does not seem logical.

Trevor:

Ah, Alice, but Spock also said, logic is the beginning

Trevor:

of wisdom, not the end of it.

Trevor:

Well we hope you enjoyed that episode.

Trevor:

If you want more information about the episode or this podcast, you

Trevor:

can look at the show notes and there will be information there.

Trevor:

There will also be information about how to contact us, give us some

Trevor:

feedback, ask us some questions.

Trevor:

Maybe correct us if we've made a mistake.

Trevor:

If you really like the show and you want to help us, then the best way to do

Trevor:

that is to tell your friends, the people you think might be interested in this

Trevor:

podcast, tell them about the podcast, get them to subscribe, pass the word around.

Trevor:

That really is the best way to promote a podcast, is by word of mouth.

Trevor:

And if you'd like to help us, that's the best way you can do it.

Trevor:

Okay, until next time.

Trevor:

Bye

Trevor:

for now.

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