This week on Dive Bar Music Club, we dive into the eclectic songs we've been listening to lately, and how we find new music. We're kicking it off with Kim Ware's recent tour and the joy of discovering music that truly resonates with us. Chad Cochran pulls back the curtain on album cover art and reminds us of his mental health series, I Didn't Want to Tell You, at Woodyfest and Nelsonville Music Festival. Charles Hale brings his distinct perspective as a record store owner to new music from old bands, and as we explore the fine line between artistic expression and marketability in album art. So grab your favorite drink, settle in, and let’s explore what we've been spinning on our playlists!

Pin Our Tastemaker Playlists

• Apple Music
• Tidal

Musicians & Bands Mentioned

• 6 String Drag (Rob Keller, Kenny Roby)
• Aldous Harding
• Mike D (Beastie Boys)
• Clydie King
• Jesca Hoop
• Lily Miller
• Mod Lang
• Rolling Stones
• Tiwayo
• (Above on this episode's playlists)
• Adrianne Lenker (Big Thief)
• Ben Nichols
• Big Star
• Big Thief
• Black Keys
• Black Pumas
• Braid
• Bob Dylan
• The Cars
• Damien Jurado
• De La Soul
• Detroit Cobras
• Fiona Apple
• J Phono 1
• Jerry Kee
• John Harrison
• Kathleen Edwards
• Iron & Wine
• Journey
• Leith Ross
• Leon Bridges
• Lynyrd Skynyrd
• Merry Clayton
• Metz
• Night Ranger
• Paul McCartney
• Phil Spector
• Pink Floyd
• Rainer Maria
• Ray Charles
• Sad Planets
• Sam Beam
• Scott Miller
• Steely Dan
• Superchunk
• Tom Waits
• V-Roys
• Weird Nightmare
• Woody Guthrie
• XTC
• Y'All'Re
• Yum Yum Tree

Events, Festivals, Media & Organizations

• Nelsonville Music Festival
• New Orleans Jazz Fest
• Record Store Day
• Saturday Night Live
• Theme Stock
• Woody Guthrie Folk Festival

Venues, Labels, Stores & Publications

• 40 Watt Club
• Blue Note Records
• Driver 8 Records (Sign up for the vinyl record club here.)
• Nine Bullets music blog
• Sub Pop

Places Mentioned

• Athens, GA
• Atlanta, GA
• Austin, TX
• Chapel Hill, NC
• Charlotte, NC
• Clemson, SC
• Columbus, OH
• Detroit, MI
• Fort Collins, CO
• New Orleans, LA
• Okemah, OK
• Paris, France
• Wilmington, NC

The Regulars in this Episode

• Chad Cochran
• Charles Hale
• Sloane Spencer
• Kim Ware

Chapters

• 00:00 - Introduction to the Dive Bar Music Club
• 04:19 - Exploring New Tunes and Tour Tales
• 10:48 - Navigating New Music Discovery
• 17:40 - Discovering New Music
• 23:46 - Exploring New Musical Influences
• 32:24 - Exploring New Music Discoveries
• 36:28 - The Discovery of Clyde King
• 42:54 - Album Art and Creative Processes
• 46:45 - The Art of Album Covers

Recommended If You Like

Dive Bar Music Club, music podcast, 90s alt rock, emerging songwriters, indie music recommendations, music discovery, live music performances, record store culture, music industry insights, singer-songwriter tours, album artwork design, music playlists, music trends, underground music scene, folk music, alternative music, music collaborations, music interviews, music nerds, new music releases, artist interviews, Dive Bar Music Club podcast, music discovery podcast, indie music recommendations, new music podcast, alternative music podcast, underground music scene, record store owner recommendations, finding new music, music nerd podcast, album cover art discussion, vinyl records, record collecting, independent musicians, singer songwriter podcast, touring musician stories, music festival photography, Nelsonville Music Festival, Woody Guthrie Folk Festival, record of the month club, Dryland Records, music algorithms, Spotify alternatives, Tidal music recommendations, NTS Radio, XMU radio, music curation, indie folk music, indie rock music, power pop revival, soul music recommendations, modern soul artists, French soul music, Tiwayo, Damien Jurado, Lily Miller, Jesca Hoop, Aldous Harding, Mod Lang, Six String Drag, Clydie King, Rolling Stones new music, Mike D solo project, Beastie Boys legacy, Ryan Adams problematic, Superchunk, Reiner Maria, Braid, Big Star influence, The Cars influence, The Kinks influence, XTC discussion, Fiona Apple comparisons, Leon Bridges fans, Black Pumas producer, Tom Waits connections, Iron and Wine collaboration, music blog culture, Nine Bullets music blog, Chapel Hill music scene, Athens Georgia music scene, Carolina music scene, Detroit rock bands, independent record labels, Sub Pop Records, album artwork design, vinyl culture, crate digging, hidden music gems, overlooked musicians, session singers, Clydie King background vocals, Bob Dylan collaborators, Phil Spector era musicians, Sweet Home Alabama background vocals, Exile on Main St discussion, music recommendation roundtable, best new indie music, music podcast for record collectors, discovering underground artists, favorite albums of the month, music fandom and nostalgia, classic rock debate, Pink Floyd discussion, Paul McCartney discussion, Saturday Night Live music guests, New Orleans Jazz Fest discussion, music discovery in the streaming era

Welcome to the Dive Bar Music Club podcast, where the guest hosts drop in and out, but the opinions are always passionate and the playlists loud.

It's like cheers if everyone at the bar had a strong take on 90s alt rock or a suspicious number of burned CDs.

Around our table, you'll find an emerging touring songwriter, a former cult band favorite whose work since then is even more interesting, a portrait photographer with a not so secret metal penchant, a record store owner who learned about Swifties the hard way, a retired folk singer who regrets nothing, and a zine maker with more cool music projects than we can count.

We're all just here to share what we're currently obsessed with and maybe convince someone that, yes, that weird Icelandic synth folk band is worth a listen.

Okay, that last one's probably me.

Sloan Spencer.

It's Dive Bar Music Club.

Low key, high taste happy hour for music nerds.

Well, hey, y', all, I'm Sloane Spencer.

Thanks for joining us here at Dive Bar Music Club, the low key, high taste happy hour for music nerds.

Joined today by the regulars Kim Ware, Chad Cochran and Charles Hale.

And we've got an interesting mix of tunes to talk about today.

But before we jump into that, we've also all been kind of busy.

You know, spring summer is sort of the busy time of year for those of us in music.

And Kim, I just have had a hard time even keeping up on your social media.

Tell us what's been going on with tour recently.

Cool, thanks.

Yeah, I've had a hard time keeping up with myself also over the past, gosh, I guess like couple months.

Well, I had the busiest April and just did so much music stuff, but it was like super rewarding.

And at the end of April, I went on a tour just, it was just five shows.

My friend J Phone 01, John Harrison, he lives in, in Chapel Hill and we just played a handful of shows around north and South Carolina and it was wonderful.

We've done probably about four or five times over the years and we both agreed that this was like the best one, which was really awesome because, you know, I wasn't sure.

I don't think I've really done a proper tour since before COVID So I wasn't, I wasn't really sure how, you know, what to expect.

But we, I guess because we've both been, you know, releasing more stuff since then and everything, it just seemed like we got, we got like better shows and better venues with better crowds and it was great.

So, yeah, it's been awesome.

And so you were getting to do your work this time because you're also a drummer for another band?

Yes, this was my solo stuff, my singer songwriter stuff.

And Yaller is the band I play drums in.

And we have.

We recorded an EP with Jerry Key in March, I think.

Oh, fun.

But haven't really had a show since then, but we have a show at the end of May, and then from then on through the summer, we're playing almost every weekend, so we're about to be really busy.

That's great.

Yeah.

Curious question for you about your solo work.

What is.

Because you said some of the songs have been out, you know, existed on the planet for a while, but you haven't toured a ton with those particular songs.

How are they changing for you?

Well, most of my releases are full band releases.

And like, this was a solo tour, so it already, you know, is.

Is very different.

But it's.

It's back to how I wrote the songs, you know?

Cause, like, I write most of my songs just on acoustic guitar, so I guess it's.

It's.

It's different, but it's not at the same time.

And the songs, I mean, they.

They kind of.

Sometimes they evolve, you know, over the years also.

And I like to think that I get better at performing, but I don't know.

Well, that's.

I'm glad that we're getting to hear about.

Looking forward to hearing more about your upcoming shows.

Yeah, Cool stuff.

So when we first all got on a call before I hit record today, I was sending Charles into Cranky Music Guys and World.

And I was like, ooh, there's a couple songs on here I really like from y'.

All.

And there's some that I just hadn't really crossed my mind.

We got a mix, and I'm not even really sure where to start.

So I'm going to start, I think, with you, Chad.

How did you choose the songs you chose this time around?

And I know that a couple of folks have feelings about them.

Great.

That's a great intro.

That really gives me a lot of confidence to talk about this.

So I know that you and I do this very similarly.

I literally take.

Whenever the email comes out that you say, hey, what are you listening to?

I go right into my itunes and look and see what are like the last three bands or three songs that I've been checking out.

And at the time, I have been revisiting listening to Six String Drag for some reason.

I have a feeling that you'll probably have some feedback on that because that.

Seems like, am I the reason you know them?

Here's what's really weird.

This.

Maybe I don't even know how to say this, but it's because of Ryan Adams.

Because there was, like, a time when he was, like, pre him being a horrible person, or at least it being public.

We just didn't know he.

Yeah, he.

At one point, I don't know if it was like, when he was doing that Jesse record or when it was, but I remember reading an article and somebody said, what's one of the best bands out of the Carolinas?

And he goes, it's six string drag.

And I'm like, who is that?

And I have always been one of those people that is continually hunting for something new to listen to.

And so that's all it took.

And I was like, I'll go buy that record.

I'm like, I'll go buy that record today.

And so that's a band that probably has been, like, in my queue for the last 20 years, I would say.

I don't think we've ever talked about them together.

I don't think we ever have.

I know them, too.

Oh, interesting.

Yeah.

And so that's how they popped up.

And then my other two picks just happened to be new music releases.

I didn't even know the Rolling Stones were putting out a new record.

Neither did I.

And so I was like, oh.

And I listened to, like, the first 30 seconds and I was like, this is pretty.

This is pretty good.

Like, I've not really listened to any new Rolling Stone records more than, like, a cursory listened enough to say, I don't think this is for me, but that one song that I picked, and of course I don't have it in front of me is pretty good.

Like, had a nice blues, you know, like kind of a rock riff.

And I was like, okay, this is.

This is pretty good.

And then I skipped to Mike D, formerly Beastie Boys, put out a new record.

And I listened to it, and I probably will never listen to it again.

I was.

I was intrigued.

I was like, I've always wondered, like, the last two guys, I'm like, you know, wonder what they've been up to.

I'm like, I wonder what they're like, what kind of music they would make if they made music.

And I listened to it and I was like, well, I.

Maybe I wished too hard.

Yeah, definitely not my thing.

So I'll make my comments and then y' all can chime in.

So the Mike D song, when I listened, I was like, oh, he Made his Flea record.

Oh, my goodness.

The recent Flea jazz.

So, I mean, yes, that was my response to that.

And then I know Charles has strong feelings about this Stones tune, so I.

Feel like I'm getting set up here, but I set myself.

You are, but I'll join in.

Yeah, Chad, First I'll say I'm really glad that you suggested this song, because that's what I needed to go listen.

And I actually knew that the Stones had a new record coming and sort of dread that, because what it's going to do is bring cranky old white guys into my record store and sort of ask me opinions about the new Rolling Stones.

Or have I listened to the new Rolling Stones and now I can say I heard a song and it sounds like the Rolling Stones.

It does.

It is very clearly a Rolling Stone song.

No doubt about it.

And just as a side note, if we get to all three of my songs, watch me talk about the Rolling Stones again.

But it is just.

I told Sloane when we got on the call, I'm feeling like a cranky old white guy.

And part of that is because I'm dreading other cranky old white guys who still think the Rolling Stones are the greatest thing that ever happened.

And how could no one not love the Rolling Stones?

And it's just exhausting.

And it's baby boomers who will not exit the stage.

And we can just top that off with Paul McCartney being the final musical guest of Saturday Night Live for the season.

Can't we do better than that, people?

I love that there are no sacred cows here.

You know, I actually.

I get worked up about the old guys that come in the record store and.

And talk about there's no good music being made anymore.

That drives me crazy.

Yeah, it's like, I don't say this because it's a 500 square foot store.

I'm the only employee there, and I'm trying to make a living out of this, but it's really like, hey, guy, you're the problem.

You know, if you don't think there's any good music, it's because you suck.

And.

And I told you, Sloan, you got me revved up.

I thought the Rolling Stone song was way more rocking than I was expecting.

And it's going to be great when they.

When they headline the New Orleans Jazz Fest that has very little jazz in, like, two years.

And all the baby boomers die from a heart attack because it's hot in New Orleans.

Wow,.

Charles, I have been waiting for this side of you to come out.

Well, I. I will say, and I think I've presented in previous episodes that, like, I think people should listen to what they enjoy and enjoy what they enjoy.

No problem with that.

I think Chad knows.

I'm not talking about Chad.

The people that can't get past the early days of rock and roll.

And I just have.

I have no tolerance for it.

Clearly no tolerance for it.

Charles, I'll jump in here because it's a really interesting conversation to talk about.

How do people in my generation and those older find new music?

Oh, yeah.

I think I spoke about this on maybe a previous episode where I'm a photographer, but on TikTok, I don't talk about photography.

I only talk about music.

And the amount of people who.

Where you're talking about Paul McCartney and the Rolling Stones, and a lot of their answers are like Journey and Night Ranger, where they just not found any other bands because I truly don't know if they know how to find them anymore.

I grew up in a very rural town.

The closest town we had to us was Columbus, Ohio.

And the station that had the best coverage that you could get, far away from Columbus, Ohio, of course, was the classic rock station.

And so I'm just convinced that you have 85 songs that are just completely recycled over and over and over and over, and people never get any exposure to new music.

I agree with you 100%.

And I went through that struggle of how do you find new music?

16, 17, 18 Years ago, I was sort of late to the blog world because that was a big, big thing.

And then eventually I started writing for the blog Nine Bullets.

And since that time, that's sort of how I learned how to find new music on the Internet.

And as a side note, I wrote a review of the previous six string drag record on nine bullets 16 years ago.

Oh, that's cool.

But, yeah, so I just feel like the resources are out there for people, and I understand that it's not as easy as it used to be.

And then I'm also fine if people want to listen to the same 15 bands that they've been listening to all their life.

I've got no problem with that.

Where I turn into the grumpy guy is when they come into my work and tell me that those 15 bands are the only 15 bands that really matter.

I totally hear that.

And there was research years ago that said that whatever you listen to in your 15 is what's ingrained in your brain for the rest of your life.

And I was like, hell, no, it's not but also, yes, it is for me as well.

But also I have a super broad playlist of constantly rolling in my head.

But Kim, it's not like you're like decades younger than we are, but your music discovery is very different and you have really vibrant music discovery and I would love for you to share.

For folks who haven't heard other episodes where we've talked about this, I would love for you to share a little bit how you're finding new music, because it really works.

So.

Yeah, I mean, I listen to streaming music a lot.

It's convenient.

Right.

I work in Charlotte and that's about a 45 minute to an hour commute for me.

So that's a lot of time, you know, in the car to just listen to whatever.

And I probably got rid of Spotify a while back, but I listened to Tidal a good bit.

And I've mentioned the Tidal algorithm before.

That's how I learn about a lot of new stuff.

And I think that's, I think that's where I found each of the three tunes for, for this episode was from the Tidal algorithm.

And oh, I guess that I have, I also have like XM radio in my car and the, I guess xmu, that station plays a lot of new indie music.

So I like to listen to that.

And yeah, I mean the digital algorithms basically is where I find most stuff, like be it title of YouTube, whatever that.

That tends to be where I find most new stuff.

I also got an NTS radio subscription.

What is that?

Several months ago.

Shoot.

If you wouldn't have asked me, I probably could have told you what it stands for.

But it's, it's Internet radio.

They have a really great app and they have.

Oh, Rachel Colst also uses this.

Yes, yes, yes.

Okay.

Yeah, so that's a good place for me.

I wouldn't say that that's where I find like new releases, but things that I probably would not hear anywhere else.

So I have a variety of places and friends, you know, friends will ask me.

I have a specific question, your algorithm.

And I've been attributing this to Tidal because I'm an Apple music user.

But Tidal seems to really serve you up stuff that you.

That fits what you're looking for.

Like if you had to list off just like your core, like five core bands.

Like just five.

Like if you're just wanting music that's going to be peaceful for you driving and you know, you just want to hit these five bands, what would you hit?

Oh yeah, so like old standbys that Like, I can just put them on pretty much at any time and enjoy.

Sure.

Well, let's see.

Kathleen Edwards is one of my favorite songwriters.

I listen to her a lot.

So, yeah, I would say she's a good fallback.

If I want something that's more rockin, I really like Super Chunk a lot, so that's been one of my favorite bands since like the 90s.

So I would say, you know, if I'm in the mood for that.

I don't know if you're familiar with either of them, but I like that genre a lot.

But so, I mean, those are.

That's kind of like my three different.

You know, I have pretty diverse taste, I think.

And yeah, I would probably go.

Depending on my mood, I'd probably go in one of those three directions.

I'm trying to, like, understand why the algorithm seems to be serving you up things, new music that also is appealing to you in a more effective way than, for example, what I would pick.

And I think it's probably because your core music is newer and so it's part of that ecosystem.

I don't know that.

But, like, I'm just.

I'm literally thinking this out loud as we're all sitting here chatting.

But speaking of which, and we'll come back to some of the songs that both Chad and Charles have talked about.

Tell us a little bit about some of the tunes you picked this time around.

You picked a couple, as always, that I'm not familiar with.

And one that I'm like, oh, this is like, really cool to talk about.

Cool.

Yeah.

So I guess I'd probably start with the Damien Jurado.

And I think it's Lily Miller.

I was unfamiliar with her, very familiar with him.

I like, I like his stuff.

And when I was driving to Wilmington, North Carolina during tour, I was just looking for something new.

And title algorithm.

This was like the first.

I think it was the first new release listed and recognizing, you know, Damien Girardo.

I was like, oh, what's this?

And put it on.

And man, I was obsessed with it.

Like, instantly.

I was like, this record is so beautiful.

And it's.

It's interesting because it's like he'll.

He'll do one of his songs, which a lot of it's got probably 20 some songs or more on it, and a lot of his songs where, like, he's singing lead and I assume, you know, he wrote it Are really, really short, almost like little song snippets.

And hers are just really, like, more fleshed out and just absolutely beautiful.

I was blown away by her writing and her voice and everything.

So I highly recommend that one if you like, like, slow, sad, folk, acoustic stuff like, I do.

Side note on that one.

Do the rest of y' all kind of hear Pink Floyd on those first guitar notes on that song?

I don't know if you had a chance to listen.

I also don't like Pink Floyd.

No, I hate Pink Floyd.

Oh, we need to have a whole episode about that.

Oh, wow.

I was not familiar with Lily Miller, and I thought this song was fantastic.

It was, like, sparse and dark and, like, I loved her vocals.

I just thought it was a really good song.

I was not familiar, and I will definitely.

I have a note on my sheet to go check more of her stuff out.

Yeah, that record is.

It's amazing.

I mean, I was like.

It really affected me.

And, like, I was.

I must have listened to it probably three times through, like, in a row.

I just couldn't.

I didn't want to listen to anything else.

I was just like, this is just so beautiful.

So, yeah.

So before I get us off on a too much of a tangent, I want to redeem myself vaguely on the Pink Floyd thing.

I do.

I do hate Pink Floyd, but I also love the Wall, and I have the double album, and I have probably seen the movie 300 times, so those songs are the exception.

And so what I hear in those first, like, five or six guitar notes is very similar to one of the songs off of the Wall.

So if you go and listen, you'll hear it, too.

Anyway, thank you, Kim.

I would never have found this artist just completely outside of my wheelhouse.

You've got some other great ones this time as well, as you always do.

Yeah, well, the others.

So Jessica Hoop, she, I think probably came up in my algorithm also, and I think I saw her open for someone, and I cannot remember who.

It was so long ago back in Atlanta, probably a good, like, 15 years ago or so.

And.

And I liked her then.

I remember kind of exploring her stuff then, you know, to see what all she had out and everything, but have not seen her name or heard her in a good while.

And so when she popped up, I was like, oh, I remember liking her.

And, yeah, her album is.

It's really, really cool.

It's so interesting.

And I don't have the name of the song that I selected for this week right in front of me.

I think it's Citizen Something, but it has a really cool video also.

What I really, really loved about this particular song, though, is the drums on it.

It's.

It sounds like.

It sounds like a sort of like a marching band drum arrangement.

And I was so drawn to that because one of the many musical things I did back in April, I played drums and something called Theme Stock, which is a collective of.

We have, like, a group on Facebook called Theme Music.

And you basically.

Basically every.

The short of it is everybody performs a song based on a common theme, and we do it throughout the year on Facebook, and then we get together once a year in person to do a live show.

And I played drums on a handful of songs at Theme Stock, and one of them was a song called the Everyday Story of Small Town by xtc.

And it's.

It's the most challenging thing I've ever learned on drums, ever.

It was like a marching band play drum section played on the drum kit.

And that song of Jessica's reminded me of that so much that I was like, well, I learned that XTC song.

I want to learn this one, too.

Because now I'm just really.

I'm like that.

What an interesting.

It's just a really interesting drum part.

But, yeah, Jessica Hoop is.

She's.

She's really good.

I mean, it reminds me.

Some of her stuff, like, reminds me of Bjork a little bit.

And it's.

It's cool stuff.

And as does the other artist, Aldous Harding, Some of her stuff reminds me of Bjork probably even more.

She's really, really weird.

And my husband likes her a lot.

And so basically my history with her was just when he would be listening to her sometimes I would.

I would hear it and be like, oh, yeah, that's that Aldous Harding.

And, yeah, her new album is really weird.

And I think the song that I picked, San Francisco, I thought that was so interesting because it.

It's like two songs in one kind of.

And I like when songs do that at the end.

It's like, oh, I thought the song was over, but now it's doing this.

That's kind of cool.

So, yeah, just, you know, I've obviously been listening to a lot of, like, indie folky ladies here, here lately because that's.

That's.

I'm glad you are.

That's my jam.

But, yeah, I mean, I figured, you know, I usually.

I.

When I bring that sort of thing to this, it is something a little different than the.

What the others bring to it.

So, yeah, I really.

Both of these Last two songs in particular, the Jessica Hoop and the Aldous Harding have.

They're both sneaky in very different ways.

Yeah.

And I mean that in a good way.

So, like, the Jessica Hoop one.

At first, I was just kind of.

You know, her voice can just.

You can just kind of lol along with the voice.

And then, like, the second or third time I listened, I was like, oh, I need to pay attention to what she's saying.

This is actually really interesting.

And so the more I listened, the more I really, really liked that one.

And I was like, I need to know more about her.

And she was like, Tom Waits nanny.

That's right.

Thanks for mentioning that.

Yes.

Spoiler alert.

Because I. I was going to say just look up her Wikipedia.

She is so interesting.

Yeah, she's got a really cool backstory, for sure.

It's interesting.

The.

The notes that I have for Jessica Hoop, I wrote down that at first it sounded like a De La Soul song.

Yeah.

And then she started singing, and I was like, wait, this could, like the background music.

Like, if it would have been like a, you know, a modern rap artist rapping over top of that.

That track, I would have been like, oh, yeah, that's completely believable.

And then when she started singing, I was like, oh, this takes it in an entirely different direction.

This is not what I was expecting, but I really dug it.

Good pick.

I like it a lot.

I also noticed the percussive elements on the Jessica Hoop, and I'm almost positive she did an album or an EP a number of years ago with Iron and Wine.

Oh, who?

I also feel like to use Yalls words is, like, very percussive, but in a sneaky way.

So I thought it was really interesting.

With the Aldous Harding record, I listened to the.

The San Francisco song, and then I went to the album and listened to a handful of songs on there.

And I thought also there were some interesting percussive elements on that album that in some ways reminded me of Fiona Apple.

Oh, yeah.

Yes.

I know Fiona Apple is a piano player, but I think of her more as, like, a percussionist.

So both of those were really interesting songs, sort of from the percussion side.

Yeah, I. I love that.

I'm sure that's why I was drawn to it also, you know, in addition to Girl with the guitar.

So.

Yeah, those elements are kind of like the things that you do because your work is on both sides of those spectrums as well.

Spectrums, sure.

That's a word.

Yeah.

No, and, you know, I should have mentioned, speaking of both Sides, because I'm doing a show in June where I'm going to be the first time I've ever done this.

I'm going to be opening, playing just my, you know, singer songwriter stuff, and then y' all are gonna play later in the night.

And it's.

I'm calling it like my Gemini party because my birthday's in June and it's like the two sides of me.

So I think.

Yeah, I mean, I think now that you say that, Sloane like sort of indie folky music that's like quirky and weird and has like this unexpected something in it, I think I'm really, really drawn to that.

Yeah, we could almost loop those in with the Leith Ross tune from a while back, which came from Caitlyn.

But just in terms of the stylistically, it's unexpected with still that pretty vocal.

And then you're like, oh, wait, love it.

Ah, this is fun.

So we sort of skipped around and we haven't had a chance to have Charles share some of what he's been listening to.

And Charles, I really, really, really, really like the stuff you brought this time.

Not that I don't other times, but you hit a chord for me big time.

So tell us about some of the tunes you chose.

Do you want me to start with.

Whichever one you like best?

Well, I'm not doing that.

All right, then the one that you've listened to the most most has nothing to do with how much you like something.

So I'll start with Tawayo.

I'm just guessing that's the way you pronounce his name.

He's a French born soul singer and it's an album that I discovered on Instagram.

I follow a lot of record collectors on Instagram and I just saw someone post this album cover and it was pretty striking.

And at the time, I was looking for a record for my store's Record of the Month club.

Oh, right.

And so I was needing ideas for that.

I'm not terribly tapped into new music and.

And so I was using Instagram sort of for that reason.

So I went and clicked on that album and immediately I was drawn to it.

It seemed the song I picked or any song on that record is fun and soulful and a little bit gritty.

It reminds me of a grittier like Leon Bridges kind of thing.

And so after listening to it a handful of times, I got feedback from a couple of people.

I picked that record for our Record of the Month club, which has just started.

This was our, our first pick and it's the first time as a store owner that I've really tried to be like a quote taste maker of saying, hey, here's this thing that I've.

I found that I think people will like.

And since we had 17 people sign up for the club before I.

That's great.

Yeah, I'm thrilled with it.

But it was all before I announced what the record was.

So they had.

They had paid me for the record before they knew what it was, which is pretty nerve wracking.

But the feedback has been really good from people.

I'm still enjoying the record.

I played in the store a bunch because we bought a bunch of copies more than the number of people in the record club.

So it's.

It just feels like the kind of thing that if you play it for people, they will respond favorably to it.

So this is maybe his second full length album but the first one that's been released in the U. S. Where is he from?

He's.

He's from France.

Okay.

Oh yeah, you said that.

That's very cool.

Yeah.

Born in Paris.

The album was produced by one of the guys from the Black Pumas and it was recorded.

Oh yeah.

In Austin, Texas.

So he clearly has come over to the US to make a record.

But yeah, so I've been.

I've been enjoying that record.

Can folks still get in on your record club or is it too late?

No, there's never too late.

Salon if people want to, you know, spend money with the dry rate records is the name of the store.

They can go to the website and sign up for it.

It's technically not a record of the month club.

It's a record every other month, which just makes it sort of easier for me so I don't have to keep finding new things that I think a broad spectrum of people will like and it keeps the cost reasonable for people.

If you're not in Fort Collins, Colorado and we ship the records to you, it's 200 bucks, which essentially breaks down to like 28 bucks per record plus shipping.

So very cool.

I want to ask you another question that.

Because like, thinking about music that will be broadly liked or broadly appreciated is very different than choosing something for yourself.

A hundred percent.

And normally I'm listening to things that I like.

There's a responsibility, owning the store to stock things that I think people will want to buy, but that doesn't mean I have to listen to them.

So this is one that I kind of feel like with the record club.

It's not designed to appeal to the.

The really serious, nerdy Locked in music fan.

Because they're gonna know what they like and what they don't like already.

But there's a lot of people that are not like the four of us, and they don't spend a ton of time looking for new things to listen to.

And they want someone to say, hey, here's this new cool thing that I think you'll like.

So that's sort of the way I'm approaching it.

We'll see if I ever pick something that I don't like.

But.

But you've.

You've got some other cool songs this time around as well.

Yeah.

So talking about not really being the.

The die hard new music person right now, I happened into another new band.

They're called Mod Lang.

They're based in Detroit.

I found them from a guy's YouTube channel that I like.

He's a.

A young Canadian guy that's big in the.

Into punk and primarily into punk, but as a record collector.

So he makes these really great YouTube videos where he goes to people's homes and checks out their record collections.

But then he was sharing some of his new finds.

And he's also a power pop fan.

And he.

He mentioned this band called Mod Lang.

And he didn't have to tell me where the name came from.

I knew where the name came from, and that made me want to check it out.

Ma is the name of a big song, and so I started listening to it, and I really love it.

It's.

It's what I would call fun rock music.

It's not as dirty as I normally prefer, but it just seemed good and fun and they weren't taking themselves too seriously.

They were aware that they named themselves after a big star song and just sort of leaned into that, which I kind of think is great, because the whole world doesn't know who Big Star is.

And so more about their Big Star influence in the second half of the record.

They have a song called TV Star, and they follow it up with a song called Big House.

And I'm certain that's intentional, especially because in the song Big House, they actually say, I'm going to be a big star.

So I'm sure they're in their 20s, so they're telling us where they're coming from.

But it just.

It felt like the Cars or the Kinks or Big Star to me.

Charles, out of the ones that you picked, I was going to say, I really.

I really like the other.

I was going to say Charles, of the three that you picked, I really liked the other two.

They Were like kind of like old school.

Like everything felt like a little old school all three of these.

But Mod Lang totally caught me off guard.

They were.

I mean I have in all caps.

Love this.

They.

I know you said you like dirtier.

It would be somehow if like the Detroit Cobras were a pop band.

Like it's, it's, it's like I absolutely loved it and can't wait to, you know, check out that record.

I was, I was blown away by this one.

Yeah.

I had never heard of them and I absolutely love the entire record.

I'm so glad you brought it up.

And the only drawback to their name is it is impossible to Google because it brings up everything else, not them.

If you google Mod Lang Band at least like three times, which is what I've done, then they will come up first.

I'm going to have to train my Google.

How to train your Google.

And so I found this maybe two weeks ago and I immediately tried to order copies for the store but they are very small.

Their record label does not have distribution through my distributor.

So I've contacted the label itself.

Hopefully I'm getting copies soon because it's the kind of thing that I think I could put on in the store for the right people and people will dig it.

So yeah, I would say this would be an easy sell for the right person.

Yeah, yeah, for the.

Right.

For sure.

For sure.

That was fun.

Good.

I'm not just cranky old guy.

Well and because like I also don't like a lot of like pretty stuff, but pretty, I mean non dirty and I like gritty.

I like dirty, you know.

But this is like 100% loved it.

People who.

Rock musicians who are not afraid to be rock musicians.

If you watch a video of them, I mean they're a throwback to the 70s in their look as as well, which I think is great.

And then my third pick was sort of more my normal wheelhouse.

I bought a collection of records.

There was one that I had never seen before and it looked interesting so I put it on the turntable and then I decided, well, this is not for sale.

The woman's name is Clyde King.

She only released two albums in her lifetime under her name in the 70s.

But a simple Google search just showed me that she's one of these people in music that I love that has done a thousand different things, but it's not a household name.

And so just sort of the basics is she fell into Phil Spector's orbit early on in her professional career.

So she started Doing a lot of background singing, but she's done an amazing amount of background vocal work for people like Ray Charles, Bob Dylan.

She did a ton of stuff with in the 80s.

Apparently they have some.

Clyde King and Bob Dylan have recorded duets that have never been released.

She's a background vocalist on Lynyrd Skynyrd, Sweet Home Alabama, and she's background vocal a number of songs on the Rolling Stones, Exile on Main street, including Tumbling Dice.

So.

And she's on three Steely Dan records.

So I feel like in that world, Mary Clayton is a much more known name, but she sang with Mary on a bunch of this stuff.

So the album I, I found is called Direct Me.

The song I picked is just one of several songs on that album that I could have picked.

It's great 70s soul music.

It's just not something that became incredibly popular.

Really cool history.

Yeah, this, this whole thing was just speaking my language.

I, I have a Clyde King tune on an eight track compilation.

A lot of my life was spent sitting and reading the liner notes to my parents records.

My parents had an extensive record collection.

And then the rest of it was these weird like gas station compilation eight tracks which were probably like bootleg stuff.

And by bootleg I mean compilations put together illegally and then sold at truck stops.

Just tons and tons of soul music.

And that's how I knew Clyde King.

And then when I saw it reading record liner notes at home, I was like, I know that name.

Just fantastic, fantastic stuff.

I'm so glad you found this record.

I did not know that the record itself existed.

And I was, I was actually so close to switching out that song for some.

Another new band that I discovered.

So I'm glad I stuck with Clyde King.

Who are you gonna put in?

Well, I'm gonna do this show again, I think.

Okay, okay.

But you, you can listen to more than three songs a week.

I was in the same, but I'm like, tell us anyway.

I want to know who it is.

They're called Weird Nightmare and they're on Sub Pop Records.

Oh, I don't know them either.

Cool.

Well, now we all have homework.

Yeah, it's a, it's a side project for the main guy in a band called Metz M E T Z.

Which I'm not super familiar with them, but I was introduced to Weird Nightmare 2 days ago by the guy who does the radio show after me.

And so then I, I went home and ordered five copies of that for the store also.

That spoke to you, I guess.

Yes.

I love this.

I love how all these recommendations come together and I love the different methodologies we all use and the sources of how we happen upon, what it is we're listening to and all of it.

I think that's part of what makes this so interesting, is to be able to share that part of it.

Because that's really the point of this, is how everyone's like, how did you find that?

And it doesn't have to be some magical thing.

It might be like I typed in the wrong name on something and this popped up.

I love that you and Chad are so casual, like, oh, let me just see the last three things that I played.

Because I handle it completely differently.

Yeah, yeah.

I stress and worry about it and think about it and try to figure out what I might can say.

So I envy Yalls casualness.

I want to give a little.

I mean, I'm winging it at all times, so not sure that's something to emulate, but I want to give a quick little shout out about the six string drag Chad that you brought up because we were talking about how that record's what, at least 15, maybe 20 years old.

That record's been around for a really long time anyway.

The players still have continued to make lots of fresh music in a lot of different ways.

That band was primarily the duo of Rob Keller and Kenny Roby and then whoever else was in the band at any given time.

And if you lived here in the Carolinas, you probably saw them on a triple bill with the V. Roys, among others.

So overlap with Scott Miller, all that sort of stuff anyway, just to kind of give connections for folks who are like, oh, that name sounds familiar.

But Rob Keller put out a cool record this last year in Portuguese.

And I saw him perform the entire record and I was like, I don't understand this, but this is fantastic.

So it's Roberto.

I can't speak Portuguese.

Roberto something.

But if you search Rob Keller and then Roberto, it'll come up.

So just really interesting stuff.

Continuing to both create in very different ways.

Kenny's gone on to have a new duo that's also way more on the folky end of the spectrum.

But I just, I love to see folks who continue to push their own boundaries and try new things.

It's always super cool to me.

And I'm guessing that the album title comes from the Short Lived club in Athens.

Yeah, that's.

Rob grew up in Clemson and they both.

They kind of got together in Athens, but they also have a Chapel Hill era.

So lots of overlap.

That's where it all comes from lots and lots of overlap.

So I know we talked a little bit about what creatively folks have going on.

And Kim, you had your solo tour.

You've got a bunch of stuff coming up with.

Y' all are Chad, I know you mentioned a while back that you've got your two big summertime events coming up.

Would you go ahead and share those with folks who haven't heard the other episodes?

Of course.

In June, I will be at the Nelsonville Music Festival and I will be doing backstage portraits there as well as the main stage.

And in July I will be at Woody Fest, so for the Woody Guthrie Folk Festival out in Okemah, Oklahoma.

And I will be doing some photography work as well as like young songwriters, I'm going to do some videography for that component of the festival and I will also be leading a talk on Mental Health with my I Didn't Want to Tell youl series.

Yay.

I will be looking forward to that.

You do a great job of keeping people updated in your socials about that stuff.

I want to ask a quick question to both Chad and Kim in different ways about album art.

Charles, you mentioned that the Taweo.

I'm assuming we're saying that right?

I have no idea.

The album cover caught me.

And I'm one of those people who, when I'm record flipping, will totally buy an album because I like the COVID for different reasons.

Chad, you've photographed and your art sometimes is assemblages.

I don't know that there's probably a better word for it because I'm not an artist.

But you have done a number of album covers.

How what's been the creative process for that?

Has it been work that you had existing or were you trying to capture a vision of the person in charge of the project?

How did those come around for you.

Most of the time?

I mean, it's very rare.

Like sometimes people will if people hire me to do an album cover, almost always it's going to be a photo of them.

So that's how that usually comes about.

But the majority of the album covers that I've done have been work that I have put out into the world previously.

And people will say, hey, there was that one photo of that tree on the road.

And I'll be like, let me search the archives and see what I can come up with.

And that's usually what it is.

It's usually something like that.

Or I did a album a long time ago for a band called Sad Planets and it was the drummer from the Black Keys and a local singer here in Cleveland.

And it was like a weird thing I did.

Like, I loved that cover messing around.

And so I, like, did this thing where it was like a kind of a sunset over Lake Erie.

But then I took the.

I made, like, ropes hanging down from the clouds, and they were holding on to cars and kind of like dangling them over the water.

And they called me up, and they were like, that's our cover.

And I'm like, what that?

And so I would like to say that I have, you know, it's probably like somebody, when they write a song, rarely do they write a song and they're like, oh, yeah, that's a hit, or people are gonna really like that.

I don't have any level of intuition of what the public is going to like or musicians are gonna like.

I just kind of hope that as I continue to put stuff out there, it continues to connect.

Kim, have you had a role in designing what the front facing artwork looks like for any of your work?

I'm trying to think which ones.

I have not.

I think I've designed all of them or at least had a hand in the design of all of them.

Sometimes I get someone to help me with, like, the layout part of it, maybe make it better.

I don't know, just the layout and all of that.

And sometimes it drives me a little bit crazy whenever I'm doing.

Whether it's like CD or vinyl, whatever, and some of my vinyl.

I did get somebody else to do that, but it was me sending them a picture saying, like, hey, I want it.

I want this to be the COVID you know?

So, yeah, I think I pretty much designed most all of them as far as just, like, coming up with the concept and all that.

Yeah.

And does that come before or after?

Like, how does that work for you in your process?

It varies, honestly.

I mean, that's something that I. I really.

I enjoy that part, but I tend to also kind of stress out about that part at the same time, you know?

But I mean, it really varies.

Like, sometimes it will come pretty early in the process.

Sometimes it's after I have all the songs together, and then I have, you know, the title of the album, and.

And then kind of like, well, now I have to find a cover, you know, so it varies.

Sometimes it's one of the first things that I come up with.

Just gave me another opportunity to be grumpy old guy.

Oh, please do.

Albums are absolutely art, and the artwork on the album is absolutely art.

But from the business side of things, if the name of the artist is not on the top third of the album cover, it's really doing the musician a disservice because that's the part that people see, you know, no matter what the album, it artwork looks like if the name of the artist is not there or if it's at the bottom, which I see way too many times, people aren't looking at the bottom third of a record when they flip through the bins.

So anything that's striking and just the awareness that the top third is what people are going to see 90% of the time, which it just sounds so business wonky and I apologize for it, but it's the truth.

No, that makes sense, Charles.

It's funny because I like to think that I have decent eye.

I mean, I worked in, like, web design for so long.

Different animal, of course.

But, you know, I'm not just.

It's not just a complete, you know, foreign thing to me.

But some friends of mine, the Yum Yum Tree from Atlanta, they just released an album on vinyl a couple months ago.

And Andy, who is basically her band, she's one of my very best friends.

And we went back and forth for a long time with her asking me for my feedback on the COVID art.

And have you noticed, Charles?

It seems like I've seen this.

Maybe I'm just imagining it, but it seems like more and more people are just using a photograph without, like any text on it at all for the front cover.

Have you noticed?

Does it seem like there's more of that now?

This is my pet peeve.

I don't.

Yeah, really, I don't.

I don't know.

I think it's entirely possible that that's the case.

Yeah, I mean, I think Big Thief did it recently.

Like, maybe it's like indie stuff that I listen to and maybe that's why I'm noticing it more.

But anyway, I think it's funny that you made the.

The comment about the bands that put the name, you know, at the very bottom, because that was when.

When my friend Andy was trying to come up with the COVID that was one of the possible options.

And I was like, absolutely not.

Like, I'm actually a fan of, like, if it's a really good picture with no text at all on it, I think that can be kind of cool.

Because if it looks really good, then maybe People might stop and be like, oh, who is that?

But I'm like, if you're going to put it on the bottom, that seems like just a total waste, especially for vinyl.

Because, like, yeah, like you said, like, no one's going to see that if they're flipping through stuff.

I think the big Thief album cover you're thinking of is Adrian Lanker, the singer's solo album.

Okay.

Perhaps.

Yeah, yeah.

And part of it could be if artists and labels are not thinking about the physical product and they're thinking about the digital product, where the name of the artist is going to be right next to the image on any streaming service or anything like that.

And I think they counteract that by putting a hype sticker on the shrink wrap, which is fine.

But then also, once that album becomes a used record, that shrink wrap is not there.

So I know it's balancing.

It's balancing the business and the art.

And as we're saying this, I'm thinking about Chad's album cover of Ben Nichols, and I don't know if it says Ben Nichols on it or not.

It doesn't.

Charles, as soon as you said it, I felt like I was getting quizzed.

And I immediately went to, like, my portfolio page and started, like, flipping through albums.

Now the.

And I don't always design them.

Like, a lot of times they're just, you know, getting the photo from me.

Every now and then somebody will have me design it.

But Ben told me right up front that he wanted a good, strong image because he wasn't likely going to put his name on the front of it.

And you're right, I think that he did like the sticker on the shrink wrap.

Yeah.

But that was it.

And because we're talking about it, I will point out that the gold standard in this is the jazz label Blue Note.

They have a long history of very strong, striking photographs with interesting typography on the front cover.

So you could.

You can recognize a Blue Note jazz album from across the room.

Yep, Agree.

Completely agree.

Oh, man, I would love to go a little bit more on this particular rabbit hole at some other time because I have super strong feelings about image only usage digitally.

So, yeah, I will hold off on that.

This has turned out to be a whole lot of fun.

Chad Cochran, Charles Hale, Kim Ware.

I sure appreciate y' all being part of the regulars and joining us here on Dive Bar Music Club.

That's last call at Dive Bar Music Club.

If you like the hang, follow the show, leave a review and tell your algorithm.

Gosh darn it.

We're worth it.

Better yet, share your favorite episode with a friend who actually stayed for the whole set.

See y' all next time for the low key, high taste happy hour for music nerds.