Alissa Crabtree from Crabtree Coaching Collaborative joins us on Annotated ELA. Alissa is an instructional coach who helps teachers and instructional leaders reach their full potential and conquer their goals.

She specializes in helping coaches build relationships and provide feedback that sticks. Alissa focuses on building relationships and being a thought partner because teachers are the hero of the journey, and coaches are sidekicks. 

1. How having a coach can propel instruction and increase success within the classroom.
2. A partnership approach that creates teacher autonomy and reflection is important.  
3. Creating a culture of feedback that sticks and increases teacher engagement.

Alissa shares all her secrets to building trust and gaining traction with teachers by laying the foundation for a strong partnership and being the coach every teacher wants to work with!

Join The Crabtree Coaching Collaborative Course:

Launch Your Instructional Coaching Journey - bit.ly/LaunchIC23

Get all the goods on The Crabtree Coaching Collaborative Website: crabtreecoachingcollaborative.org

Follow Alissa:

Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/crabtreecoaching/

Twitter - https://twitter.com/alissa_crabtree

IG - https://www.instagram.com/crabtree_coaching_collab/

Linkedin - https://www.linkedin.com/in/alissa-crabtree/

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48YcuhlK46M

Show notes: www.annotatedela.com/podcast/episode14

Follow along on Instagram @annotatedela

Melissa Burch 0:00

Hey friends welcome to Annotated ELA. Alissa Crabtree, from Crabtree Coaching Collaborative is joining us. I hope you are as excited as I am to have her. Alissa is an educator and instructional leader. She is the founder and CEO of Crabtree Coaching Collaborative where she partners with districts and campuses to strengthen tier one instruction. With over 16 years of experience, she has helped hundreds of teachers and instructional leaders reach their full potential and conquer their goals. Yay, Alissa. Welcome. I'm so excited to have you.

Alissa Crabtree 0:34

Oh, thank you for having me Melissa. I am super pumped to be here.

Melissa Burch 0:38

Would you like to share some more about what you do? And all the ways you help people and how you got into coaching?

Alissa Crabtree 0:44

So you know, I am owner and founder of Crabtree Coaching Collaborative. And just like you said, in the intro, I partner with campuses, school districts, where I support tier one instruction and I work with instructional leaders to help them identify their goals and to create a realistic actionable plan that will not overwhelm teachers and really help them succeed in their growth goals. I got into coaching, it was my fourth year teaching, and an opportunity came up to become an instructional coach, where I would be coaching half the day and teaching the other half of the day. And I did that for four years. And man, let me tell you, that was a whirlwind. It was often difficult because I was a coach for sixth, seventh, and eighth grade ELA, and also teaching. It was just trying to find that balance of doing it well, and then also teaching well, and then I ended up moving to the Houston area, Houston, Texas is where I am, and became a full-time coach. I've been a campus coach and a district coach. And I really found that with instructional coaching, I was able to make more of an impact than any other thing that I did. And I wanted to do it full-time and on my terms, where I could truly support teachers, so I decided to do this full-time. And that's what I get to do, work with teachers, work with administrators to strengthen instruction in the classroom and alleviate so many headaches, so many headaches that teachers have to deal with.

Melissa Burch 2:28

Yeah, I think that all teachers can appreciate that and especially avoiding the overwhelm of already having so much to do. Knowing that your coach is not coming in there trying to put more on your plate, but helping you alleviate that. I think that's great.

Alissa Crabtree 2:41

One thing I tell leaders all the time, we are slapping so many band-aids on so many issues in education, where if we just got to the root cause, man, we could take off so much on teachers plates, and and let's do that, that's like my charge. Let's make it easier.

Melissa Burch 3:02

I think we all love that. So we kind of already started talking about it. But how do you think that instructional coaching can propel instruction for the teachers and make life easier?

Speaker 2 3:13

My favorite analogy, now, not everyone gets my reference. But I'm always like, I'm your Richard Simmons. So I am your annoying little workout partner that comes in like, "Hey, how you doing?" And it really is just a partnership approach. And when coaches take it has that partnership approach, one thing that they're able to do is look on the outside and be kind of that fly on the wall, where as teachers, we're making 500 decisions in one class period, we don't have time to kind of notice all the things. That's where I come in. My job is to notice, and especially notice the goal that you've told me you want me to notice. In doing that I can provide feedback, I can provide strategies, but in no way am I the superior; which I think sometimes an instructional leader can come across as in 'I know best,' 'I'm the decision maker.' And I think that's where a lot of coaches get it wrong. I think that the really important thing that instructional coaches have to remember is that we are the guides to teachers and their success. We're not the hero, we're the Yoda of the journey. We are not the hero of their story. And so having that opportunity to be on the outside and help them identify areas for growth is so important. But here's the kicker, and this is one thing that I always always stress to instructional coaches, is it is a collaborative partnership approach where the teacher is providing you permission of where to give them feedback. This is my goal. This is where I want to grow. This is what I want you to look for. And when you do that, it really is creating that safe place that will provide momentum and perpetuate success for them and for their students in our goals.

Melissa Burch 5:18

I think that's so important that teachers feel like they have a voice in all of that, it definitely has to be a partnership. How do you think that coaches can really create that culture of feedback that sticks and that open sharing so that teachers feel safe to have them come in and be open about what their real goals are?

Alissa Crabtree 5:37

It goes back to what I mentioned earlier about the teacher is the one who establishes their goal. What I like to do is sit down with teachers and talk about their pain points. "What is driving you up the wall?" And if this weren't happening, what would it look like? By having those reflective conversations; I always use "Tell me more, tell me more," What would the students be doing differently? What would the teacher be doing differently? We can really get to the root of the issue and establish a goal that will make their life easier. So it's not me coming in and saying you need to fix this, you need to fix this, coaches don't ever do that. Don't do that. What you want to do is establish that goal. And then whenever they give me their goal, and they've provided me permission to come in and give them feedback, I only focus on the facts. When I go into their classroom, I'm not giving some fluffy language or my opinion on anything, I am collecting data. And what I mean by that is, maybe the teacher asks a higher level thinking question, and only two students respond. That right there is data that I'm going to collect if their goal is around student participation or if they're just so frustrated with kids constantly getting up out of their seat, or blurting out answers, I would collect data on how many times one of those instances occurred. And what was a cue? What was a prompt that made them do that? That's the kind of data that I'm going to collect. And I'm going to lay that out for the teacher. And then I'm going to ask reflective questions. Sometimes I see teachers get really annoyed with instructional leaders when they say, "Well, when I was in the classroom," "When I did this, when I was in this school district." Ain't nobody care. It's kind of like, we want to know about solutions now. And so I'm going to ask teachers reflective questions to get them to essentially kind of come up with their own solution. I'm a thinking partner, that's what coaches do. I'm your Richard Simmons that's going to hold you accountable for those things. And then I'm going to provide action steps that are easy. We've discussed, I've asked you these reflective questions, and then I'm going to show you some options of action steps that we could take that you could do today. And I'm not just going to throw spaghetti on the wall and hope that it sticks. It could be something that I'm gonna say, let me come back later. And I'm going to come back with this solution. But it will be something that I will help and coach them to do it independently when I am not there and provide resources for them to do it. And then we create a plan for follow up. The kicker is permission from the teacher, you're positioning them as the expert. And when I come up with those action steps, I'm also giving them choice. You said you wanted this here's some options. Let me show you how this could look, which one suits you best? We know that not everyone's teaching style is the same. I am loud and proud and all over the place. I am a okay with chaos in my classroom, but I know a lot of teachers who are not. I sometimes will provide a way out there strategy and then a little safer, more conservative strategy. But I think that's where feedback really sticks, is when you partner them as the expert.

Melissa Burch 9:16

So real talk for a minute. How long did it take for you to make sure that you weren't doing the "Well when I was.." because even as teachers we do that - when we change schools or change grades, "Well, I did it this way." And that can be a hard habit to break. So how long did it take, and how did you get yourself out of that?

Alissa Crabtree 9:38

You know, it took me a while when I was half teacher half coach, I would do it more I think because I'm like well I did this yesterday like I was living it I was in that moment. But even then, even with me being in the arena with the teachers, I would still get the eye roll. When I became a district coach, I had five campuses, the opportunity for me to really foster a true relationship with teachers was not there, because I'm only on their campus once a week, maybe once every other week. I really noticed that people weren't buying what I was selling; when I was just like, well, I did this. What they bought into is when I actually got my rear end up and modeled it for them with students. That is where the magic happened. I talk to instructional leaders all the time, whether you're an instructional coach or an administrator, lip service isn't enough. If you really want someone to buy into what you're selling, you got to show them and you have to show; not just tell. A lot of coaches will just tell, hey, do this, do this, here's a checklist. Those things are beautiful, but I also want you to show me with students or without students, I don't care. Like I've had teachers that are just like, hey, in this one-on-one meeting, will you just stand up and show me what you mean? Absolutely. It took me time to reflect, to notice trends of when teachers were actually implementing things that I suggested, and not just nodding their head and saying, Okay, that was the big difference. If you're going to tell me you did something back in the school district, show me and show me with kids.

Did you find that it took some time and some building of trust, though, for them to feel comfortable to be like, well, here, can you come in and show me or take over my class for the day? Because I know we can feel pretty protective, and you know, territorial of our classrooms and our students and like, well, I don't want anyone to not think I'm doing it right. Because where's that going? So how do you build that trust with them? Especially if you're not with them all the time?

Oy, girl, I'm so glad you asked me this question because this is the meat and potatoes of coaching. I don't care if you're using Jim Knight, Diane Sweeney, Elena Aguilar, it does not matter what method you prescribe to, if you don't have that relationship with the teacher, it's going to fall flat on its face. So you have to build trust. And I always talk about trust in three C's, and that is collaboration, competence, and communication. When you foster those three things, that's when the magic happens. But you have to get to know your people, and principals, I'm going to say this, if you're listening, the same way that I tell coaches, you have to meet with your teachers one-on-one to get to know them and their goals. Principals, you need to do the same thing, because when you do that you are showing that you are invested in their well-being. I am willing to take time to meet with you, I'm not going to waste your time, I'm actually - I always say 10 minutes, give them 10 minutes, talk to them as humans, not just oh, I'm only going to talk to you as a full staff. As a coach, when you put in those little deposits of relationships, they're going to trust you more and more. When you make them a collaborator in their own success, you give them choice - trust. When you demonstrate your competence, I'm not talking about just talking, you got to demonstrate it and give them stuff. Let me show you this great stuff that I have. And I'm also going to strengthen your competence. And then I'm going to clearly communicate things to you. One of the biggest things that my suggestion for all instructional coaches, and it's the one that I get the biggest pushback on, share your schedule. Share your schedule, how many instructional coaches get frustrated, because someone might say, "Well, they're a coach, they don't do anything, or what do they do? They're sitting in their office all day. They're just chatting away." No, no. Every Friday, I would send my schedule for the next week. And it would be every class period and before school, nine periods a day and after school, this is where you will find me. Did it change? 100%, it always changes because we're in education; life happens. They would always say, "Oh, Alissa is the busiest coach on our campus." And I'm like, no, no, I just share my schedule. The other coaches are doing the same thing. That communication is also going to add camaraderie. Like you're just as busy as me, you're in the thick of it with me. These are also some things that I discussed in my course that you know, I dive into them a little deeper to show instructional coaches how you can use the three C's to really gain momentum.

My gosh, I think that's revolutionary sharing your schedule. Oh my goodness, and why do you think that's the thing you get the most pushback on?

Because the number one thing that is stated is, but Alissa, it's going to change. And I'm like, yeah, it's going to change. But everyone's is going to change. I think there is, and Melissa, you and I have talked about this before. There's the perfectionism, this idea of perfectionism. And I think sometimes coaches really take that on, because they're like, I'm the coach, I should have everything perfect. I think teachers need to see that your day is messy, too. And you might have this schedule. And you might say, you're going to be in this teacher's classroom. But guess what, if I get pulled, because of something big, I'm just going to shoot that teacher an email. Sending my schedule, one holds me accountable. It gives me permission to say no, to things like lunch duty, an unnecessary meeting, and it allows teachers to see my work. I've even had teachers go, "Hey, I noticed you're going into so and so's class will you come into mine too? Because I'm doing the same thing. And I want feedback." This is going to help you drum up instructional coaching business, and trust.

I think that's so powerful. I'm glad you shared that. I think for me, as a teacher, I appreciate when my instructional coaches do that. And when I see them at my school, when they aren't doing anything that I just see them walking around. And they're there to help because they have covered duties for us on more than one occasion. And when I'm pulled for something that I don't want to be in, they have free time and can take that over. I know that's powerful for me, too, because they know my time is important.

Absolutely. It's a partnership. We're in this together. And I think sometimes educators are pitted against one another. But we all have the same goal. And we are in this together. So let's work together so that our jobs are easier; if we're working against each other it's just gonna create chaos.

Yeah, I can definitely appreciate that. So you mentioned that you have a course what is that called? And what are you doing in it? And who is it for?

Yeah, so I have a course open right now. It's called Launch your Instructional Coaching Journey. It is for any instructional coach, whether you are a newbie or you are a veteran coach, you'll receive tools and resources to really start the year off strong, to foster those relationships to dig into those three C's that I had mentioned earlier, and really make sure that no matter what coaching method you prescribe to or your district prescribes to, it will be successful, because you have fostered those relationships with teachers. And again, you know, if we just dive straight into business, it's going to fall flat on its face. Because as a coach, if I'm gonna go back to Richard Simmons, or I have a personal trainer, I have to be vulnerable with that personal trainer. One, they're going to weigh me, oh my gosh, I'm going to hate it, I'm going to cringe. They're going to ask me about my diet. I'm gonna have to confess all the horrible things that I ate, and then they're going to make me do burpees. And even though I know that they're good for me, I hate burpees. But I have to be vulnerable with that person, which means I have to trust them. As educators, we have multiple degrees. We've done this for a really long time. We know what we're talking about. A lot of us are people pleasers and perfectionist, it's very vulnerable, to have a coach. You're going to come in and see my imperfections, you're going to tell me something I can do better. Like I always equate teaching to an art. It is an art, we are artists. And when someone comes in and tries to help you strengthen your art, it can be vulnerable. So my coaching course actually coaches instructional leaders on how to build trust and build those relationships. You can find it on my website at Crabtree Coaching Collaborative.org Or in the show notes to see if you're interested and if you want to join. It's a great opportunity.

Absolutely. I think from the teacher perspective, so many of us can relate to. And I wish my instructional coach could hear this. So teachers make sure you're sharing that out there too. But I know how thankful a teacher can be when they have a coach that is really just there to help them maybe get over that perfectionism too. Because I mean, yes, you're right. We were talking about it before we pressed record today, that teacher cycle of perfectionism, so having a coach that you feel safe with is just really key. I think

It's the make or break. I have heard stories of teachers slamming doors in their coach's face and saying, "You're not welcome in my room," like literally doing that. And I'm very fortunate I've never had that happen before. But I know others have, and it is a lack of trust, or maybe it's something a little softer. And it's, "Hey, I'm going to listen to you, and I'm going to be kind. But when I go back to my classroom, I'm not going to implement anything that you suggested." It's not that they are anti the coach, it's not necessarily that they think that they can do it better; there's just not that trust. It's hard, education is hard. So when your day is like crazy, and things are going off, it's easy to go back into old habits. And sometimes, working on those new strategies can be hard. It takes some brainpower, you have to have someone that you trust to hold you accountable, and also celebrate your successes, no matter how small, but the relationship piece as a coach is vital.

Okay, so I have one final question, because I can only speak for myself as a teacher. But I think that as teachers, we make the worst students. And I know that when I have had a new instructional coach come in, I have kind of been skeptical, maybe extra hard on them almost waiting for them to fail. Not that I want them to it's just that, oh, what are you going to come in and do? How are you going to come in and approach me? What's this going to look like? I don't know if I'm ready for this? So what is your biggest piece of advice if they are a new coach, or even if they're a veteran coach, but they just have teachers that are definitely being difficult students? How can they navigate that?

You hit the nail on the head. That's something I do talk about in the course, teachers are kind of, they're rough students. And it's just because they're, they're artists, too. And so it can be difficult. But my number one, and we talk about this in the course, is those one-on-one meetings at the beginning of the school year are priceless. Not only I mean, you know, you don't want it to just be all business, but get to know the person sitting in front of you. And my favorite question at the beginning is "Who is Melissa?" And then they just kind of look at me, and I'm like, okay, and they start listing things. And I'm like, "Who's Melissa, tell me more, tell me more, tell me more, "they ended up going into all of the things that they value. And when you understand what they value, you can tailor your coaching towards their needs. Just like with any student, we differentiate our instruction, we differentiate our approach. And you also need to find what motivates them. It's different for everyone. But if I could just give one piece of advice for any coach, please take the time at the beginning of the school year and schedule a one-on-one meeting with every one you coach. And I always say 10 minutes, because teachers are busy. I just want 10 minutes of your time, I'm gonna set my timer, when the 10 minutes goes goes off, if you want to continue talking, let's continue talking. If you don't, I will value your time. And we will pause and do this at a later date or you know, wrap up later. And I will tell you eight times out of ten the teacher wants to continue talking because we like to talk about ourselves. And so you get to know a lot about them. And then you can follow up with casual conversations in the hallway or "Hey, I was thinking about you said you really wanted to work on this." "I found some stuff." And just making those initial deposits of, of caring, of a relationship is what my advice would be.

Yeah, I mean, sitting in my teacher chair, I think if we can all remember, as teachers that we want to do the same thing with our students, it's the same for adults. We just want to know that you truly care about us and what our needs are. That you're not just, like you said, throwing spaghetti at the wall with your own agenda of what I should be doing or what any teacher should be doing.

I mean, you think about it anytime that a leader has provided you feedback. When did you receive it? So if you've never been in my classroom, you've only been in there twice. You've never had a one-on-one conversation with me. I don't care what you got to say. Like that.

If it's good feedback, you're like, how do you know?

I have had that before. I've had like glowing feedback on my stuff. And I'm like, I don't know what I did. And so I think that is just really important. At the beginning of the year. Be visible. Administrators, again, if you're listening, same message, be visible. One-on-one meetings show that you care.

All I can say is thank you! Hallelujah to all of that because as a teacher, I think that was some frustration this year for us. So, yes, just be visible; just like we are with our students. I think that's so true. So, I did ask you to give that one piece of advice. However, what are some key takeaways that you'd like to leave our listeners with?

You know, don't be afraid to have a coach. I think that is, as a teacher listening to this. I think everyone deserves a coach and there's not it's not a bad thing to have a coach, it's actually a really good thing, if you were fortunate enough to have one. And I also want people to take away just the idea of as a coach, position yourself as a partner; as someone who is a galvanizer or I'm going to cheer you on, I'm going to help you relieve all of your pain points, but you still are the ultimate decision maker because this is your journey. It's not my journey. This is your journey. And the final thing is just really invest in relationships. It is going to be worth the time to plant those seeds instead of just jumping straight into business right off the bat and be visible.

I agree. Thank you so much for being here today. Would you like to share all the places that we can find all of your amazingness

Follow me on Instagram at crabtree_coaching_collab. I also have a YouTube channel where you can find it at Crabtree Coaching Collaborative. My website, crabtreecoachingcollaborative.org And my course Launch Your Instructional Coaching Journey can be found - it's a Bitly with a back slash launchIC23. So yes, there's where you can find me.

I follow her on Instagram as a teacher and she is hilarious. And I think that she even has golden nuggets for teachers because I do think if we are blessed enough to have a coach, we should be open to them. I know that I appreciate mine very much now that I've opened up so I completely agree with Alissa. Thank you again for being here and teacher friends. Listen, we've got coaches we love, some we may not love, but share this with your coaches so that they can hear exactly what you want. And until next time friends the magic is in the process.