Menopause doesn’t just change your hormones. It can change how you think about money, security, independence, and what it would actually take to feel safe in your own life.

Because for many women, money is never just money.

It’s safety.

Freedom.

Choice.

Identity.

Power.

Fear.

And for some… proof that you’ll be okay if life changes overnight.

In this deeply honest Menopause Love Lounge conversation, the ladies unpack the emotional relationship women have with money in midlife—from divorce, breadwinning, and financial dependence to scarcity mindset, inherited money trauma, fear of wanting more, and the complicated reality of rebuilding financial confidence later in life.

This isn’t just a conversation about budgets or retirement planning.

It’s about the beliefs women carry in their bodies about worth, survival, abundance, and whether financial safety is something we create… or something we spend our lives chasing.

Inside this episode:

• Why menopause can trigger a midlife financial wake-up call
• Divorce, financial dependence, and learning to stand on your own
• Scarcity mindset, inherited money stories, and generational fear
• The emotional weight of being the breadwinner
• Why so many women feel guilt, shame, or anxiety around wealth and success
• Financial independence, remarriage, and protecting what you’ve built
• Money mindset, manifestation, practical action, and what actually creates financial confidence

🕰️ TIMESTAMPS

00:00 Why Financial Freedom Matters for Women Over 40

02:30 Karen's Divorce Wake Up Call and Taking Control of Her Money

05:40 Dawn's Story: Working Since Age 11 and Overcoming Scarcity

10:55 The Jet Conversation: Manifestation, Money Mindset & Big Dreams

15:05 Why Women Feel Guilty About Wanting Wealth

18:15 Money Trauma, Divorce & Learning Financial Independence

24:00 Are Your Money Beliefs Holding You Back?

34:10 The Hidden Fear Behind Women's Relationship With Money

44:20 Financial Statistics Every Woman Should Know

51:45 Power Move or Financial Trap? Midlife Money Edition

If you’ve ever wondered whether you’d be okay on your own… or struggled to feel financially safe even when the numbers say you should… this conversation will hit home.

Send this to a woman who needs a reminder that financial confidence is not just about money—it’s about reclaiming choice.

🎧 Listen Here

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Stay connected with the Menopause Love Lounge:

▶ YouTube: @MenopauseLoveLounge

◎ Instagram: @menopauselovelounge

♪ TikTok: @menopauselovelounge

🌐 Website: https://menopause-love-lounge.captivate.fm

✉️ Email: [email protected]

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Hello ladies, ladies, ladies. We're talking money, money, today. Do want to sing us something Ozzy before we get started?

Just money, money, money, money. Money.

Ooh, you even hit the note on that. Thank you.

My head

Hehehehehe

We've got backup

In stereo!

We got the

singers.

Menopause Love Lounge choir today, everyone.

Ha

Did

ha ha ha!

not see that coming, did not see that coming. For those of you out there, have you ever looked at your life in midlife and realized if everything changed tomorrow, would you truly have the financial freedom to stand on your own? That is a huge question, it's a huge question. So for so many women, midlife sparks a powerful wake up call. Financial independence is not just about money though, it's about freedom, it's about security, confidence, and the ability to choose your next chapter on your own terms.

I'm sorry.

Whether it's navigating divorce, which Dawn can fill us all in on that stuff, or rebuilding after setbacks, or simply wanting more control over your future, financial confidence can become one of the most life-changing transformations in midlife. So today, we are diving into how women build real financial power in midlife, and why taking control of your money can ultimately change everything.

So of course we're gonna hear our personal reflections from all the wonderful ladies in the lounge. We're gonna reflect on how their relationship with money has evolved in midlife and maybe even the moment that financial independence started to feel essential rather than optional. We're gonna get our stats in there and then we're gonna finish out with our game of, we're gonna call it power move or financial trap.

Wow.

Yeah, so this is a good

Yeah

one. So you guys, you gotta stick around for the Legs Wide Open segment. It is always so, so much fun. All right, so let's just jump right in. Ladies, I'd love to go around and hear from each of you. What has your personal relationship with financial independence looked like and how has that shifted in midlife? Karen, you just look lovely right now in your red, so I'm gonna ask you.

good one.

you

⁓ Thank you. Thank

I love that transition. That was amazing.

Which is funny because red is really not one of my colors. I very rarely wear red, but yeah, you like it? Thank you. Thank you. Ooh. I am ready for summer. I'm ready for summer. Okay. So finances. So I was lucky enough to, ⁓

but it is. It's, yeah, it's the sexy hot look on you with the curly wavy beachy hair. I am, or it could be the after sex hair. I'm not even sure.

It is. It is.

This looks amazing

on you.

Yeah.

grow up with a father who was in finance who taught me from a young age kind of the value of saving and you know I learned some good financial lessons and then I was married to a man who was also you know very savvy with money and so that was great especially since in my divorce you know it was amicable it was equitable I did not have ⁓ a big you know battle and and you know a messy divorce when it came to finances.

But the downside of all that is that I deferred to other people for most of my life when it came to financial decisions. I just felt like I had people around me who were more knowledgeable than I was, or so I thought. And so I really didn't take responsibility for my own finances fully until my divorce. And then while it was wonderful to have

Mm.

that sense of, you know, full financial responsibility. I also felt the full financial responsibility and the, you know, the intensity of being, you know, suddenly solely responsible for money and money decisions and budgeting and all of that. So, I don't claim to be an expert in finances at all, but I have learned a ton, you know, in the seven, eight years that I've been divorced.

Yeah ⁓

And I definitely have my eyes open in a way that I really didn't before. I think I just got very, very lucky, because that could have gone sideways really fast ⁓ if I was in a different situation. So I empathize with a lot of women who are in a similar situation and who don't have an amicable divorce, because it's a very vulnerable position to be in.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Absolutely. And before we move to the next person, how many, I know that a couple of you, well, Lori's not on with us today, but she's married, Dawn's married, and then the others, well, we've all been married. Let's just go with that route. How many of us actually combined finances? Did anybody do that? Or did you all keep your own? Yeah. And it doesn't seem like that's done as often these days. Like my son just got married recently and they're like, no, we keep everything pretty much separate.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yep. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

that's

Like he'll pay for dinner

interesting.

one night, she'll pay for dinner the next night depending on what they want. Yeah, they're pretty separate about that, which I find that interesting.

Mm.

Yeah, it's definitely a generational thing because when I was married, you know, we're talking back in 1993, that just wasn't a thing. I mean, I see like Andrea, my own son, you know, he and his girlfriend have a similar arrangement with finances. They live together, but finances are separate. you know, it's just interesting that the younger generation is approaching finances very differently in relationships.

Yeah.

Mm-mm.

separate.

Mm.

Yeah, absolutely.

Well, I'm wondering if they're seeing what the generation before them, how we handled money and then perhaps that that's some I'm curious what that's about. But yeah, interesting.

about.

Yeah.

Yeah, Dawn, what do you got for us?

Well, I would say, I don't want to say the opposite, but a very different lived experience. I think I spent a lot of my life complaining about how little there was when I was young, like really young and, um, Really started working when I was 11 for my dad, but like 11. Yeah. It was like no sleepovers on Friday nights. You got to be up at work Saturday morning, 11 and, um, have had.

Wow, doing what?

Wow.

between one and three jobs ever since and felt the full weight of that financial responsibility always. I would attribute a lot of that to probably some of the disease I've had to clear out of my, you know, just the chronic stress that I felt over the years. You know, had a scholarship to college, thank God, but still had to support myself in terms of room and board and all of that and worked and by 20.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

I had shingles, which just says something about where my nervous system was already. Yeah. And I still managed to graduate from college early because there's this part of me that always has felt like if I just go faster, I'll get there sooner and then I can rest. That's a load of horse shit, but that's what the voices in my mind said. You had no resting, right? Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Hmm.

Mm.

Yeah, no resting. Just the next thing, you know.

Yeah.

But how long

did it take you to get to that conclusion that it wasn't, that it was bullshit, that it wasn't the thing to do? ⁓ good. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Makes sense. Fair.

Yesterday? Yesterday?

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

Maybe this morning?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm gonna

say, yeah, I'm gonna say there was no sort of all at once awareness, ⁓ but probably an unfoldment over the last 10 years, ⁓ maybe even less. And so I've always been keen about money. And I also have been properly delulu about money as well. But like, in mostly good ways, meaning I would just say, well, I'll just earn more.

I'll just earn more. I'll just make, I'll just do it. Yes. And I always have, I always have, but the monster that was chasing me where I was that no matter how much I made, it never felt like enough. And I have seen that with my clients over the years, right? I have worked with some very blessed people who no matter how many zeros they have, still feel like there isn't enough, which is why we know that beyond a certain amount, right? Where you literally have enough, it becomes about something else.

Yeah, that's a good mentality though that there's more to get always.

Yeah

And so I've done a lot of work over that last probably 10 years or less to really unwind all that money noise. For those of us who are afraid that there's never gonna be enough, there tends to be a lot of inappropriate spending for fear that it'll never come around again or an inappropriate, ⁓ like trying to keep everything in perfect condition, because I might not have another one, which leads you to not enjoy it or to be.

Mm-hmm.

obsessive about, you know, like all of this, like not just embodied and enjoying and living and trusting, right? So I would say over the last four years, there's been like some major shifts where I started to really let go and just trust like, I'm always going to have the perfect amount of clients. I'm always going to have the perfect clients. I am going to attract the perfect team members. And in the last two years, my team has grown and I've handed so much off to them.

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

And I'm going to say like in the last two weeks, so this is like a very, very, very current update. In the last two weeks, I have finally felt the impact of something I've heard very wealthy people say to me over the years, which is hire people who are smarter than you to get where you want to go. But when you hire people who are smarter than you, which I have done, then you have to grapple with feeling like they don't need you.

⁓

Hmm

Mm-hmm.

Hmm.

Yes.

That is something.

And so it

is really something. And so I've built this phenomenal team and I have to trust that even if something happens or it reshapes itself over the years, that the next, this or something better, the next perfect thing is gonna roll in. And so I have seen so many money things shift and I believe so strongly that we are mostly vibrational creatures and the attitudes we have about money are vibrational and it did 110%.

Yes.

impacts how you experience the flow of money. So I love to do things like, have I ever told you all I sing, I sing little songs all the time. So I have one about aging in reverse and I have one every time I swipe a card, it goes out and it comes in and it goes out and it comes in and I'll just, I'll be anywhere in public and I'll sing my little song in front of people. And I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. It goes out. Yeah.

Hmm.

Let's...

You

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

That is the song. Is that the song out and in?

You

Yeah.

my God,

I sing that during sex, Dawn. That's amazing.

I was just going to

Different

say this

episode.

could go in a very different direction.

And

Yes.

it

did. And it did. Well said. Well said. ⁓

⁓

And I can let it go.

So, and then, I add, can I do, have more time, can I have more time?

Of

course, go.

Okay, this is a vulnerable thing I'm saying, okay? Okay, and I'm sort of forcing myself to say it out loud on this podcast on purpose, okay? So this is from a permanent jewelry party I went to. If you're not on YouTube, I'm holding up a necklace, a little charm necklace I'm wearing from permanent jewelry party I attended very recently, shout out to those ⁓ that were there. And we had to little charms, right? And it was whatever was in the little things. And so I have a-

golden spiral here, it's like a nautilus, but I believe it's a Fibonacci, the secret geometry of life, so it's like, know, anyways. And there's a lot of little other natural things on here that were drawn to me, but this is a jet. And I've had to grapple with over the years, like, I know, I have had this huge desire for a jet for as many years as I can remember, and it's ludicrous, it's ridiculous. I am a child of very little means who has, you know,

Mm-hmm.

Interrupting you here. There's some stories here a child of you know, and you know, how dare I think about a jet like

Hehehehe

Yeah, I mean, yeah, no, no, but like literal, I know that's

what I'm working through. I'm easy does it. Like, literally as a child. You know what I mean? And I've worked out of that and worked out of that. But I have come and I've grappled with like jets aren't even good for the environment. This is dumb. And then I've gone through seasons where it's like

Hahaha!

Who wants a jet unless I can take all of you with me? Like, that's it. just, that's it, right? I just want to go places and with the people who, you know, I want to be on the jet with. so, um, and then I've also really struggled with recent struggles, like wrestled with, I don't mean struggle, like wrestled with, right? Is there a reason God puts shit on our hearts? Because

Okay, so go for the jet.

Hehehehehe

Go for the jet.

Mmm.

this thing I'm undertaking with homeopathy and this brand I'm building Destined Homeopathics and all of that, right? Is it like this thing is put on my heart because it forces me to keep going when I when it gets hard, like really hard to do new and different and things that are really, really big stretch goals. So I sit with all of these things from time to time. And I think it's even particularly embarrassing to say that I have like a financial goal like that. ⁓ Because, I think

But it's not embarrassing.

But those are the stories,

right? I I just keep hearing vibrations, like being in vibration and calling it in. I'm totally right there, yes. And then we have these stories of, I better be careful with my money. Will I have enough of my money? I can spend it, but now I have to work harder for my money. It's like, we have to just keep unpacking these beliefs around money, clear it away. Yeah, I love this, I love this.

I know, there's noise!

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep.

unpacking. Yep. And so that's why I'm claiming it right here, right? I put the jet on the necklace and now I'm telling the

Yeah.

Yeah.

whole internet.

that a jet is in your future.

But Dawn, but hold on. Is it really

I'm getting a chat. ⁓

Yeah. Yeah.

So, and I'll tell

you...

about the jet?

Yeah.

No, right. I think it's about these goals that I have and it's about the places I want to go and the experiences I want to have and the freedom and the relationships and all of that. Right. Absolutely. But I'm a non-specific I'm a non-specific manifesto in human design. like, is it really about the jet? No, because it's non-specific. Right. But just fun story about manifestation. I've been saying this jet thing for years, literally. And we, you know, y'all know how I love my Disney cruises. Like a year ago, nine months ago, we were on a Disney cruise and we had a pin trading board outside of our door.

represents.

Yeah.

you

Mm-hmm.

and we woke up one morning, a pin trading board. know, Disney pin traders, have you ever met a Disney? Okay. So, all right, it's a whole Disney culture pin. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's a whole subculture unto itself, right? But so we had this pin trading board outside of the room and wouldn't you know, we woke up one morning and someone had left a Minnie Mouse jet pin on our board. There's a whole set of Disney jet pins. I had no idea. Now I have three.

What?

No.

⁓ a pin and you trade them. yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, got it.

Stop. Stop.

I love.

I love that stuff.

Yeah.

She showed up. Yeah. was like, clearly the universe is telling me.

Wow. She took us. Don

took us on a jet plane.

Yeah. Yeah,

that's right.

I love that. I love when stuff like that happens. It just like reinforces that you're on the right path to me. That's what it says.

Yeah. And you

know what? I'm going to remind us all, a man would have no trouble saying, I want a jet. None. This is a very female issue of being reluctant to claim what we want, feeling, you know, guilt or shame over what we want money-wise. You know, it's so interesting to me how gender plays into that.

None. None. None.

Hahaha.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Well, female and healer, female healer, like forget about it. I'm not supposed to want material possessions. I'm supposed to be, yeah.

Yeah.

anything.

the environment. Let's not we take in so many pieces, you we that's the beauty of women. It's like we're so expansive. And we take in all these different aspects, men, boom, I want this, you know, so that I'm glad you said that Karen, because it's so true. It's a very different energy of claiming.

Yeah. ⁓

true.

Well,

and we also grapple with this idea that we deserve freedom, right? Like that, like does that belong? Because I would imagine that the jet, and that's why I was asking you, it was really about the jet. I mean, there's a sense of freedom and also the sense of power that we get when we claim something as big as that, right? But really, we as especially women, we are chasing or looking or wanting or desiring, is a better word for us.

Yeah. Yeah.

desiring more of the feeling of it rather than the thing of it, right? Because I think where you actually said it was, I could get one if I could take you all. And I think that's something that I kind of, that's something about me where my generosity comes in. When I have money, when I'm in abundance, for me, I spend it on everyone, including myself, but I include everyone else in there. And it brings me so much joy to share the wealth, right? So it's...

Mm-hmm.

REX

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

it's it and I feel the freedom in that and that feels really good to me right because I always know it comes back you know and but I didn't know that when I was younger I did not know that I mean I come from a lineage of family members right we're Jewish or Eastern European where back in the day it was really hard to earn money like money was scarcity right there's a lot of lack and scarcity and that got passed down generationally and then I chose I guess appropriately.

Yeah.

always right.

I know. I chose a family that, ⁓ you know, my mom, my grandparents were Holocaust survivors. And so again, money, lights, my grandfather would walk around turning off lights. do that now too. ⁓ Turning off lights, right? Like they were very careful about how they spend their money and what money they had. they, you know, they utilized it and they maximize it to the best of their ability. you know, growing up in a house where my mom had to deal or, you know, had a parents that

didn't really give her freedom. And when she became a mom, was something sparked in her and her relationship with me was such that she used money to, you know, lack was used against me, right? So there was a lot of manipulation around money. You can't have that. And then she would give it to my sister and my sister would get the brand new pair of pants or the brand new pair of shoes or the roller skates is what I remember.

Mm-hmm.

You

my sister got that where I didn't and it was used to show me that I'm a bad person and that's sort of what I learned. And then when I moved out, the family that I moved in with at age 16, ⁓ my dad, they came to me and asked me, ⁓ I remember this because I think this is where my relationship with money shifted because money is a relationship. ⁓ So my relationship to money was always tied to

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

manipulation or it will be taken away from me or it's used against me. I always had some distance from it. Like I understood it was there, but I didn't want to believe that it wasn't available, but I also didn't want to believe that the opposite of that. So for me, because it was used against me, I sort of disassociated. And then I had to also feed myself. had to put myself through college. had to, you know,

pay. I always also had jobs. To this day, I have more than one job. And so it's in me. But what I learned and I also went through, so when I was married, my then husband took care of all the bills. So when we got divorced, I was like, I have to learn how to pay bills and I have to learn how to budget and I have to learn all these things. And it was overwhelming. And it just felt so because I was the spender and he was the one that would, you know, would

More than one job!

Mm-hmm.

pay the bills for us and do all that, but I still had a job, right? I still brought money in, but I would spend not even looking at how much we had. ⁓ And so when I became single, I then had to figure out very quickly, how do I manage it? And how do I have a different relationship with it? And I read a book called Happy Pocket Full of Money. Did I get that right? Happy Pocket? Yeah, I don't know if anyone has read it. It's a little out there.

⁓ love that book. Great book.

Mmm.

But it's really where it cemented for me how much money is energy. It's an exchange of energy and that's all it is because we've given it so much power for so long that, and again, that power was used against me. So my association and my relationship to it has always been not favorable. so I always believe that money has always shown up. Money has always come. I don't live in the lack, but I do.

Yes, that's it.

Yeah.

spend a lot of it, right? So I go through spurts where I'll spend a lot of it and then I'll stop and then I'll spend a lot of it and I notice that it's usually around, it was when I was getting my period, it was usually around my period, right? Like that's, would spend more, I would be Amazon's biggest shopper.

you

But yeah, so it's, and then I have a hard time. I noticed that I was also, my relationship to it was that I was having a hard time asking for more money, valuing myself and my time and my efforts. always thought I had to, and I'm sure you could relate to it, at some points of your life where you almost had to quantify why you are asking for that money that you earned or that matches your value. I've had to grapple. So there's different elements. There's so many,

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

layers to it ⁓ on so many levels. again, I will come back to what Dawn said. It's energetics. Like it's when you understand energetics and you understand how manifest, you understand its frequency. So when I am in receiving mode, money has the idea of money, right? ⁓ That energy can come in. And when it comes in, so long that I don't either hoard it or I don't spend it,

that it just feels like, again, it's like the song that Don you sing, right? Money comes in, money goes out. Amanda Francis, I don't know if you follow her. mean, she speaks a lot into the spirituality in money. And that always made sense to me too. Like just being grateful for when the money comes in, knowing, right? It's not just knowing here. It's the knowing in the body. It's not only the money.

Knowing in the body.

Right, embodying that knowing that it's always available, it's always there, and ⁓ its job is to circulate. Its job is not to stay silent.

Right, right.

And when we aren't attracting it or we're not receiving it, it's because we're out of energetic alignment in some way, right? We're not, yeah, like, and yeah. And so I think it's becoming much more in vogue for women to approach some of these topics and claim some of these things, which is amazing. ⁓ And one of the breakthroughs that I'm sure many of you will relate to is this concept that I can't be broke enough to help poor people.

to sit.

Yep.

Yes. The stagnation.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

be wealthy and I can't be sick enough to help sick people get well, right? Like the world benefits from abundant women sharing their resources with people. Yeah, and I do think that's given us a certain permission to be in hot pursuit.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. It's like

Yeah.

that expression, you when the current rises, all boats rise, right? Like it's that same idea. ⁓ Yeah, it is interesting.

Mmm.

Yeah, yes. Yeah.

And also just really quickly to speak to what Junie was saying about language and how we speak around it. That's one thing that, you know, if I hear my clients say or my kids or anyone around me and they say, ⁓ I'm broke, I always will encourage, you know, if you come at it from I'm broke, you're going to be broke, it's going to be your reality. But if you come at it from I am not, ⁓ I'm not ready to invest in that right now.

sounds a little bit more elevated and sounds a little bit more as though you're coming from a place of right elevation and a place of not lack the abundance. It's a choice. It's path. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Of choice. Yeah, yeah, choice. I think choice

Speak as if you have it.

is really, know, the disempowering part of finances is when we feel like we don't have choice, when we feel like we don't have power over it. You know, the minute that we can say, you know, I just choose not to spend my money on that right now. You know, if you frame it as if it's a conscious choice,

Correct.

It's so much more empowering than saying, I can't afford that, you know?

Right.

Yeah, wow, great, great stuff.

Yeah. And then your reality mirrors that.

I can't tell you.

Yeah.

Yeah, I can't tell you how many remedies I've taken also that have almost immediately shifted certain money blocks for me, which has been remarkable. And the remedies are energetic medicine. you think some of those? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I have stories where like one day it was like this and the next day it was like that. And it's like, whoa, two remedies in particular. And they are both lineage inheritance remedies, right? ⁓

take some of those, don't you? Yeah, and this is money remedy.

I was just gonna say get ready, everyone's gonna be knocking on your door,

That's it.

Mm-hmm.

Interesting.

both of them things that we would see like in cultures that had to leave their homelands and that kind of thing. Yeah, really, really interesting.

Hmm

We forget that piece, right? We forget that we come from a lineage. come from, you know, it gets passed down. It's a belief system. That's all it is. And if we could see it as such and we could change that belief system, then our energetics changes and we embody something different and then we attract something different, right? But if we, it's just really about noticing the patterns, right? Like if you're continually, if you're seeing a pattern of I'm making money and then all of a sudden I'm completely broke, right?

There's something that's not allowing the money to circulate the way it's meant to circulate.

circulate.

But I'm gonna also challenge a little bit of that because I believe in energy. I believe in the energetics of money. But I do think that we're in a culture where everybody just wants to put up a vision board and just assume that everything will be taken care of. There is a very practical action piece of this, right? Like I think energetics are great, but I think they have, your actions have to be

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Yeah.

aligned with your energy and vice versa. And I think that when it comes to finances, especially for women in our age bracket, we need that kind of alignment. We need to get our energy right, but we also need to be taking actions that are aligned with what we want.

But what you're

referencing is spiritual bypassing, is putting up a vision board and not doing the actual work to become in alignment with the board. We can't say energetics are great, but we're ladies of a certain age and we need to be practical. That's not it. It's, you know, when people spiritually bypass and they don't do the work to really drop into their bodies and feel like, what do I actually feel about money in my body when I really focus my attention on it? What is present?

Yes.

Right.

Correct.

That's right.

Haha

That's the embodiment.

But you can do that work and still be making poor choices. I mean, you can be in the process of doing that work. But again, there's this very practical element of that flow of money in and money out. You've got to be aware of that flow. You've got to be working with that flow. I don't believe that it's energetics alone. I think we work in a physical world. We live in a physical world.

I don't get

So there is an energetic component, but I would argue that there is also a component of, know, sometimes we do have to rein in spending. Sometimes we do have to work on investing, making choices about where we're gonna put our money. Like I have a little bit of an issue with just the energetics alone and not acknowledging the actions that have to really support those energetics.

But where is it coming from though?

I want to just jump in and say, you know, it's, it's, I'm totally right there with you. And how I look at it is the actions a lot of times come from the beliefs that are underneath it. So, you know, we could like, it's, we're talking about money, but this goes to everything. It's like, like if we own to the cows come home and go, yes, I'm, I'm beautiful. I'm abundant. I, I have every old blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, But we don't take action. You know, nothing's going to happen.

Right. It can't be one or the other.

That's right.

everything.

Yeah.

That's right.

Yep, that's right.

then what is it that keeps us from taking action or what is it that has us like white knuckling going, I've got to work so hard, I've got to take so many actions and everything in between. So to me to get, and this is how I see it, we need to clean up all the BS between our ears, the belief systems between our ears so that we can feel aligned. And that's where I have had to really like drill down. Because when I left my husband, I knew nothing about finances.

He did everything that had to do with money. And I'm thinking, I've got this little nest egg. I'll be fine. I'll get a job. I was so not prepared. I didn't know what things cost. And I didn't know what my beliefs were around money. And so for the last 15, 16, 16 years since our divorce, I had to really hone in on why am I struggling so much with money? Why is it not coming with more ease? Why am I working and being so hard on myself?

Mm-hmm.

knowing that it's alignment, knowing that it's energy and abundance, where am I getting in the way of this? And so it comes back, a lot of us talked about our childhood and Ozzy, I can't believe the similarities that you and I have always, it's always amazing to me. I was told to be really careful with money. It wasn't used against me, but it definitely was, you be careful so you have just enough to do what you want, but don't spend too much. So when I left my husband,

Mm-hmm.

I had this little nest egg and I just was like, okay, I'm gonna hold on to it with dear life, but I'll still have some fun, but I'll be really careful. And so that was where it started. And then I had to start to be more literate with how to do money well, the actions, like you said, I'm not just gonna own and go, believe it's all gonna be great. I had to really look at why am I being so overly careful with I don't wanna spend too much and my God, I see what happens with people in the future if they don't look to the future.

Mm-hmm

Right.

And suddenly it was causing me so much stress. And here's something else as you guys are talking, I remembered another belief I had to work on. This is really like vulnerable, another vulnerable shareholder. I remember, and there's still even a little bit, so I'm like, I gotta work on this, that when I would go on vacations or do whatever adventure that I wanted to do, because I'm always doing something fun, there was a part of me, definitely way more in the past, but a part of me that felt uncomfortable posting it on Facebook.

Hmm.

Ha!

.

because I was afraid, here we go, message, belief, my God, what are people gonna think, that people are gonna go, ⁓ look at how much money she must have. And she must be really asked, like she's greedy or she must have so much that she can do all these things. I was so out there thinking what other people would think about me choosing to do whatever I was doing. So.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Relatable. Yeah.

unpacking the stories I have had, you know, I've listened to the books and I just did a course just a few months ago, because I it's still I'm still trying to get to that still point that that vibrational level. It was called unfucking your relationship with money. And it was everything about beliefs around money when money is just a thing. It's a tool. And it's it everything we put on it, anything we feel about it.

Yeah.

Mmm.

Yes.

has nothing to do with money. It has to do with us. And so I continue to pull back the layers and find my way with it. I, again, know, yes, and it's like, yes, energy. It's there's so much abundance. We could have whatever we want. I know all that. And I believe all that.

Exactly.

Mm-hmm.

And

I also know I'm human and I have picked up some stories and beliefs and my God, the world is coming to an end and what's happening with the budget. And I get pulled in, you know, that human thing of will I be okay? And to just stay fresh with all of that. So I'm still figuring it out. I still have some things. So Dawn, throw that into my mixture of ⁓ remedies. ⁓

and

Yeah.

Mm-hmm

Yeah.

So that in your mixture, you got it. You got it. And going back to something,

There's definitely a lot of unraveling.

you

yeah, what Karen said earlier about the gender difference about how we judge ourselves. When any of us were married, would we have thought twice about posting a picture about an exotic trip because our husbands were the quote unquote, like, no, it's this like women and greed or what that's like, yeah.

Yeah.

⁓ the good question. Yeah.

Right, right, right.

Good point.

Very good point.

Well, we didn't really

post back then, did we?

Yeah.

Mmm.

Who am I to have abundance? Who am I to be that person? Who am I to be this coach that's doing all this work with women and asking for these fees? How dare I? Well, how dare I not? And I did this other course once and somebody said, okay, what are all the beliefs? We just spilled them out. What are all the beliefs about money? And then the mentor that I had said, what do you think about Oprah? And everyone was like,

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah.

she's helped so many women rise up. She's helped so many of us wake up to what's possible and believing in us, all this stuff. And it's like, well, how much is Oprah worth? Which is a lot of money as we know. And it's like, well, do we look at her, go, how dare she? How could she be so this, that, and whatever? No. So of course, the joke is you could go as far as you want, you know?

Right.

But we've also watched her be very generous on public television. And the world hasn't necessarily watched Ozzy spend all of her money. You know what she said? She spends it on herself, but she spends it on everybody. You know what I mean? So I do think it's about unhooking. Because half the people are going to have a negative opinion, and half the people are going to have a positive opinion, according to Life on a Bell Curve,

does have a jet.

Mm-hmm

Yes,

yes, that's true.

Good point.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

And you know what's so interesting? Like I'm listening to our conversation, right? And one after another, we all speak and underneath everything that we are working through related to money, it's just fear. It's just more and more fear. Fear of what other people think, fear of not having enough, fear of displaying too much. Like if you really think about it, we are so...

It is.

Yeah,

yeah, well said.

Mm-hmm.

consumed with our own fears as women, that it seeps into every area of our life, our health, our relationships, our finances. There is like this, just this terrible, unfortunate undercurrent of fear that I just hear in everything that we're saying.

Hmm

And it's not just women, because I work with a lot of men and their attachment to their fear is mostly the failure part, right? Like if I don't make enough and whatever's in my bank account determines the value of me, right? Like their worthiness. And so there's a lot of fear for men too, especially today when there's just this interesting shift of women becoming more independent and more ⁓

Hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

where they're not needed as much. And so I see the fear across the board.

Yeah, I'm glad you said that because I just don't, I guess I just don't have these conversations as much with men. You know, I hear it more in women, I guess, because I'm just having the conversations with women. But it is it is interesting. I'd be curious. ⁓ As the mother of a son and a daughter, you know, it's interesting to me kind of how ⁓ how men think about money and what their fears are and you know, how different or similar they might be to the way women do.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Well, for a long time, there was a lot of pressure on them to provide, right? That's part of like their job is to provide, protect and procreate. If they cannot provide, who are they, right? So it's so attached to their identity, more so than women, although I see that there's been a little bit of a shift more now for women. ⁓ So it is interesting. I think they don't talk about it as much. I think we do.

I think it's a lot.

Yeah.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Yep, exactly.

Mm-hmm.

Hmm.

Yeah.

One of my favorite new podcasts is called Breadwinners. Shout out.

Mm.

It's not menopause level.

Bleep!

Of course, that goes without saying. ⁓ But Breadwinners is

a podcast about women breadwinning and the implications downstream. like, you know, now one in four, one of five men are stay at home dads. and yeah, like them, like navigating identity. It's it's I being someone who's been a breadwinner many, many times. And and I think we're going to talk about this in the statistics, like most women at some point are the sole financial

Mmm.

Yes.

Yes.

responsible caretaker or whatever. So yeah, it's definitely a beautiful valuable conversation about women stepping into their financial power.

Your turn, Andrea.

Hmm.

Yeah, yeah. Wow. This is a great conversation.

Yeah.

I know this is I mean, you guys have touched on so many things and you know, I would just touch from the space of that I have had an unhealthy relationship with money for as long as I can remember. And I think it started we were very well off when I was young. So we had an abundance of everything. And then my dad did some crazy embezzlement thing that got us all.

in a pickle and we lost everything. And so, and I was in high school at that time and that was a drastic change. It was an overnight of he got busted doing something and all of a sudden our entire lives changed. Yeah. So, I mean, we had to, that's when I moved from Canada. We had to pick up and move to Florida because we had.

Wow.

no money for our house there and everything. So it was like, that was a very huge transition for us. And so I was very ⁓ astute to all of that. Like I was always really watching that and we were always being told to watch everything we spend it. And, you know, it was very, very difficult. And then when I got married and I was married for 20 years, but during that time, my ex-husband didn't work for a lot of it. And, you know, he spent time at home with the kids when I would, you know, I first had Grant, he was at home with them for a while.

But then, know, Grant went to preschool or wherever he went and my ex was still home, you know, not really doing anything. And I think at that point it was for him, the fear, the fear of now I've been out of the workforce for how many years, staying home with a child. You know, I'm a man, I'm older, all of these things that it was his fear, you know, to go back. ⁓ But that just put more stress on me. Yeah, so.

pressure on you.

I was constantly the breadwinner in the family, always. And it was paycheck to paycheck. And I found myself just getting angry and resentful. We'd go out to eat and he would order a beer, like $5 beer. And I'm like giving him the look of death. Like, what are you doing? And I just, it felt terrible. would tell the kids like, okay, this is what you can get. Grant at 12, 13, 14 years, you're eating off the kids menu. I became very controlling about it.

And we've had those conversations with the kids because it did transfer into them a little bit. And I remember Grant being like, you know, saying he would go to order something and then he'd think, ⁓ would my mom get really mad at me if I ordered all this food, you know? And so I feel for them because I have really put that on them as well. It was very, it wasn't like a, it wasn't like a good thing. It wasn't like, you can save money if you get this. It was like, ⁓ you're gonna do this because we're gonna save money.

stress. ⁓

Mm.

Yeah,

so that's where frugal Fanny was born. I became, you know, frugal about everything and you know, just going from there. I still am. I've gotten so much better since I was, you know, I was in a corporate job that I was making a lot of money and that I came out of that. Like now it's been two and a half years. I've been on this different path of this creative side with my podcast and the children's book I wrote and know, voiceovers and all that stuff. And it's

It's more of like, am I gonna get this job? Is that money gonna come in for that? I'm again living paycheck to paycheck with no paycheck, wait a second. But it comes from somewhere. And I just said this the other day. I'm like, I don't know what it is. I mean, I am a hard working girl. I do not have a regular job. This is...

yet yet

gig to gig.

what I do, what I love to absolutely do. And I know that it's going to turn into something where my money flow is going to come in more than I can even imagine. But right now, I'm up at 8 a.m. I'm sitting at my desk. Sometimes I am there seven, eight o'clock at night and I'm like, what am I even doing? But I'm trying so hard to make everything happen on different avenues. I'm believing in myself. Thank you, thank you, Dawn, because I know.

You're believing in yourself. You're believing in your journey. That's Priceless.

Priceless.

I know

I have it in me. I know I have the work ethic. have the drive. I have everything in me. And all of a sudden, you know, something will come through and I'll go, oh, I just got this, you know, UGC thing that I'm gonna do and make this kind of my, it just kind of comes from nowhere. I don't know how I've been paying the bills for the last two years without going into my savings. I mean, that's pretty amazing. So, I mean, I did win on some game shows for a while. So that did help that love. I know, but again, I could look at that.

It's pretty amazing.

That's amazing.

And that's another way of money

coming in, different ways coming in.

Yeah.

Absolutely, and I

Yes.

can say that, that I'm on one and I win a car and then I go in another one and I win $10,000 and then I'm like, wait a second, I go another one and I win, I'm so worried about them delivering all this furniture to my one bedroom apartment and then I get a call saying that they don't have that model and they're just gonna cash me out and I'm like, my God, and they're like, that never happens. I'm like, but it does to me, it does to me.

It does to me!

So, you know, just all of those things, it is so much about just putting it out there in the abundance, speaking as if you already have it. I think I even said to you once, Ozzy, I was like, I need to make money. And you were like, you don't need to. You just need to think that you have it. And you said something like that. that, you know, changed that for me. Like, yeah, you're right.

Yeah. Yeah.

can

say in nonlinear time, I already have it. It's already mine. In nonlinear time. Yeah.

Yeah, it's so great

Sorry, yeah. ⁓

to

think that way because you can get stuck in that negative mindset. So yeah, wow.

Yeah, and money

was coming to you because you were a vessel of the, you you're in the action of, you're in the doing. And I wonder what life would look like for you if you were more in the, it's not passive, it's more grounded in and embodied with the knowing that I wonder how much more can be available for you.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

could come

in. It's just life is weird the way we think about things. You know, it's so weird. I've been sitting in stew and going, should I go back to this mortgage thing? And I see these absolute perfect jobs coming over of exactly what I did before. And then I'm just like, why would I abandon myself and what I'm doing right now? What I truly believe I was meant to do for a paycheck. I have learned to live within my means at this point. And I am not

Life is so weird. So weird.

Yeah.

needing anything. Would I love a jet? Yeah. Would I love like, you know, to go on, we'll just go together. I mean, it's great. Yeah. So I don't know. It's just, we don't. We don't. It's a, it's, it's a mentality thing. And I love that I'm getting them for it. ⁓ now you're talking. Now we're talking. Now we're talking. ⁓

We'll just go together!

That's right.

We're all going to go together. That's so beautiful.

We don't need more than one. We don't want to go separately.

Alright.

Hmm.

We could wrap it in MLL branding.

⁓ And then it's a write-off. ⁓

I'll be on Canva tonight

making that. ⁓

That's right.

Yes.

Yes, and we can

Get wrapped.

put

it all up on our vision boards.

That's right.

Yes, I love that. love that. All right,

let's move on real quick. I know we kind of took a lot of time on that. I'm so glad we did because we all had so much to really say. It's a great topic and really in depth. So Karen, just throw like a couple of small ones at us that you got a couple of steps.

Juicy, ⁓

big topic. Big. Yeah.

Yeah, there's a lot.

Yeah,

there's a couple of ones and actually we touched on a lot of it, but one thing that I find interesting is that women still, even now, earn approximately 82 cents for every dollar earned by a man. So when we do talk about fear and frustration and disappointment around money, I think over time women have been sort of conditioned to feel that lack.

Wow.

and to feel the inequity. So that's maybe a piece of it. But as Dawn pointed out earlier, nearly 80 % of women at some point are going to be solely responsible for their finances. And this is for a few different reasons. mean, first of all, women live on average five years longer than men, right? So there's just simple life expectancy. There's also the divorce rate, which as we know is...

Mm-mm.

Mm-hmm.

I think at this point a little more than 50%. So divorce, especially in midlife is another reason. And then just the rising percentage of women who are choosing to remain single. So, you we are no longer living in a world where women can bury their heads in the sand or defer to other people because it is pretty likely that at some point or another, we are all going to be solely responsible for finances. that might be, Andrea,

the reason that we see this trend among younger people. Maybe they have sort of recognized the fact that it's just better for them in the long run to have these skills and to have that freedom.

Yeah.

Yeah, throwing personal prenup. Mm-hmm. Yeah,

yeah.

think that's the big struggle we're in as a society in general though is the I versus the we and I do think it has to, there's a reckoning coming about that, right? Because we can't be rigidly independent and have it work either. So I would guess that that generation, yeah, is compensating in a way that's gonna burn them in the ass as well.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. We're not designed that way.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yes, and I'm going to blame

Yeah,

technology and I'm going to blame social media for that because it's definitely making us more apart than together.

it could be.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. fear. It does, comes back to fear.

But it's fear, then it comes back to fear, right?

That's how they, by the

way, and it's a tactic, right? That's how they sell you on the things that are going to make them money, right? It's the whole other episode.

That's it.

Right.

Yeah, fair play.

Right. That's right. That's a whole.

But especially

within relationships, you know, because there is that fear of, I have to protect myself. have, you know, even though I'm in this loving relationship, there is an element of self-protection. And I don't think it's only the young people because, I mean, I'll use myself as an example, vulnerable share, since everyone's doing it, I might as well. You know, I'm potentially looking at moving in with my boyfriend, getting married again, you know, all the things.

Yeah.

I have a lot of reluctance and a lot of concern around joining finances, you know, and I, there is a part of me that feels like I have built up a certain nest egg, a certain net worth, assets, whatever you want to call it. And I mean, I'm not a multimillionaire, but you you say to yourself, I've worked my whole life. I would love for my children to have this. And I don't know that I want to

But you are.

Yeah.

run the risk of perhaps, hopefully not, but perhaps another failed marriage and losing something that I've worked so hard all my life for. You know, there's a lot of complicated emotions that are tied up in money. as much as we can say it's rooted in fear, I can't necessarily judge it because I feel some of that myself and I contend with some of that myself and I think it's reasonable.

losing it.

there is.

Yeah.

You know, it's a very loaded topic.

Well, it's reasonable. Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, it's reasonable because you've had an experience with it where it felt a certain something, But, you know, I have a couple that I work with and they both came to the relationship with a lot of money. And so they were sort of struggling with that. Do we merge? Do we not merge? And again, I'm always teaching the both hand. What if there was an account where you do have a together account and then you could have your own separate account, right?

You can make it work so that it can benefit the we as well as the I, because without the I feeling good and being good, the we cannot function.

Yeah.

Yes, I believe that.

Yeah, yeah.

Ozzy with

I'd love

to offer

the live hot seat coaching today.

I'm

Yeah.

⁓

No, it's true, though. I believe that. I think that's very true. think, you know, that's why I say it's a loaded topic. It's not it's not so easy to say, ⁓ we just blend everything. We just join all our money. You know, it is easy when you're 20 and you have nothing and you're building it together. But, you know, that gets complicated. So it's there's a lot as as we've seen with this episode, there's just a lot tied to money. Right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

to think with

age, there often is more fear, right? Because there's this perceived less time. it's so when you think about how fast it can come in, right? Like all of a sudden, you're on a game show and it comes. One of the one of the little fun things I do on the side in my Venmo app, right? Who doesn't have Venmo? I'll take a couple bucks out of my Venmo, and I'll throw it in and buy some Bitcoin and I have made

Right.

huh. Yeah.

a few thousand dollars doing that just with change. Like I don't mean 20 cents, right? But 20 bucks here, 50 bucks there. And over the last couple of years, I've made thousands of dollars in my little Vinmo app buying Bitcoin. But you gotta like do, you know, you gotta go do the things. Be open.

some money.

Mmm. Yes, yes.

Yes, I love that. I love that, Donna. And I think, yeah.

Yeah.

Well, and

you're circulating the energy of money and therefore that's why it's working for you. It's growing. But when it sits stagnant somewhere and it's not doing what it's supposed to be doing, which is moving, it's not going to grow. So, good on you.

Yeah? Yeah? Yeah? Yeah?

Yeah.

Mm-hmm

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know, I wanna just pop in here and

just say something about fear. It's like, fear is not bad. It's only when it's running us and getting in the way. I know we get into this fear versus love, but at the end of the day, fear informs us. Fear gives us an opportunity to go, what's going on here? And take a step back and make good choices. I think we need to befriend our fear more so that it can actually help us move forward in a conscious way instead of it just taking us out and having us react. So I just wanna support the fear thing.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Great point, Juni.

Great.

Bam, Toonie!

Yeah, great point.

Yeah. Yes. Gosh, this is all such great. We do. I know. This is all so good. And I think we can really ⁓ benefit from doing another conversation on this again and maybe having like a money expert or somebody that can kind of give advice to those that are going through divorce because as we've spoken before about those going through menopause that are going through divorce because of the menopause, that we want them to be prepared.

Boom. we have a game, don't we?

⁓

Let's play a game!

Yes.

Yeah.

And not, that is I think the biggest fear like Karen, you were talking about of getting remarried or leaving. Yes. And it is, it's frustrating. but we got to figure out ways to deal with it. And so I love that we're going to kind of bring some light to that of things we can do to get ourselves in a better spot. Great. Game time, game time. Let's do it. All right.

Mm-hmm.

prepared, not scared.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Game time.

Game

Game

time.

time!

We're going to play midlife money moves. Okay. I'm going to read some real financial habits, beliefs and situations that women are facing midlife. And we're going to decide, is it a power move with our green thumbs up panel or is it a financial trap with our red thumbs down? Okay, ladies. So raise your paddles. We're going to defend your choice and let's see whether we agree or not. Power move, financial trap. Number one.

Yeah!

Mmm.

Relying on your partner to manage all the finances while you stay completely uninvolved. Relying. Yes, all financial trap. You need to know what is going on with your money. Even if someone else is paying the bills, writing the check or doing it in your account, make sure you know what's going on. All right.

have to wait for that one. Relying right there, relying. have to, you can stop right there.

Yeah.

We're super clear.

Relying?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Number two, believing that it's too late to build real wealth after 40 or 50. Yeah, boo. That's another trap. Right? Like, it's never too late. Never too late to start. You can start just putting a little away, just like Don said, and build a Bitcoin portion. Number three, staying in a financially secure job that completely drains you because starting over feels too risky.

It's never too late.

me

Yeah. Educate. Yep. Yep. Educate. Learn.

There's no such thing as too late for anything. Never too late for anything.

Yeah

I'm sorry.

Is that a power move or a financial trap? Yeah, Karen, you're kind of in between.

Do we have any power moves here?

I'm of two minds.

Karen's on the struggle bus with it right now. But you're not staying

You know, look.

forever. have a you there's a there's a light at the end of your tunnel.

Yeah,

I mean, you know, I'm a school teacher. I've been a teacher for 27 years. I have three years until retirement. You know, I've built a pension for 27 years. It would be financial suicide to walk away from that now, right? So even though I'm, you know, I don't think, I mean, look, I'm gonna probably, people are gonna hate on me for saying this, but.

Mm-hmm.

but drains you.

Yes.

I don't know of anyone who's teaching for 27 years who's still excited about it. Like, I like it. I don't hate it by any stretch. But, you know, if I woke up one day and somebody said, you could do anything you want, I wouldn't want to teach anymore. I mean, you know, that's just 27 years. I've done it. But the reality is, you know, I don't, I don't, ⁓ some days it does drain me.

Yeah.

but is it draining you?

That's reality. Yeah.

But is it, but Karen, is

it draining you?

issues here in you.

Ha ha!

I'd

be lying to say that some days working with teenagers, you know, eight hours a day is not draining. ⁓

And overall,

it's a power move with the light at the end of the tunnel. Yeah.

choice. It's

my choice and that's why I say I think taking responsibility and framing it as a choice is much more empowering for me. So yeah, I'm staying because it's good for me and it's my choice.

Yep. Yep. That's a great choice.

Absolutely.

Nice defense. I like that. All right. Number four, starting a side hustle or business in midlife after divorce, burnout or career shifts. Power move? Yeah. No, Junie. Oh, okay. That's right. Wrong side. That's such a great point, Don. I know. I know. She's got a theory for us.

Amazing, both end.

Yay.

Ha ha ha.

Yeah, that's it. We're doing it.

Oops, No, no, no, no, was ⁓ wrong side. Yes, yes, yes. ⁓

That's why Karen is here hanging with us.

We're all going to take $20 from our Venmo today and put it into company.

am changing hearts and minds!

That's right.

But you're so right, that's why we're even doing

this, right? We're taking opportunities and risks and trying new little things that you just never know what can come out of it, right? I mean, we're amazing, so it's gonna happen. We do know, we do know. Number five, avoiding retirement planning because life already feels overwhelming. Hmm, financial trap, yeah, come on, we gotta get that together. Get your money lined up. Be proactive.

Yeah.

We do know. We're multi-millionaires.

Yeah.

Be proactive.

Supporting adult children financially even when it delays your own freedom power move or financial trap. ⁓ that's a hard I Know it is so hard It's so hard yeah, I'm a little in between

a little nuance. Supporting fully.

⁓ I don't even know how to answer that one. Yeah.

Yeah,

define supporting and I need context, right? Like, is there an extenuating circumstance? Is it temporary? Are they taking their remedies? You know.

Yeah. Yeah, me too.

Yeah.

Well...

Yeah.

⁓ No,

Hahaha!

Yeah. Also,

are we supporting them emotionally, right, by teaching them tools like those things?

Right, is it enabling?

it's no, I'm going to say that it's a child that is still living at home and he's 28 years old and he just doesn't want to get out and he's not paying any bills and you're making his dinner and house cleaning his room, pick up his laundry because he doesn't want to get out and do that. Yes, yes. We're not talking about the ones where we're just kind of giving them a little lift and push. Yeah, they need that. They need that.

Right.

yeah, okay, fine.

Yeah, Light a flyer under his ass.

fuck that.

Yeah.

Yeah, sometimes they need a little help. Yeah.

now.

Yeah.

All right, number seven, hiring a financial advisor, money coach or wealth strategist to help rebuild. Is that a power move? Yes, yes. Find your person that can help do that for you.

Absolutely.

Sure. Learn, learn.

are so many

Knowledge.

women

lately who are teaching women money and yeah, yeah, love it.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. I know. I know. It's great. It's

Yeah. Knowledge is power.

great. Number eight, splurging on travel, self-care, or bucket list experiences instead of aggressively saving every dollar. You're splurging. Power move. Power move. You first. Yes, go.

Power move.

Now, I want to make an asterisk to that.

and ask.

I am not personally including things like, because you said travel, self-care, I don't know. I'm not including things like handbags and Botox. I actually think those types of things are selling out, are true.

self-care bucket list.

me.

luxury.

true deepest desires in exchange for some fake identity thing. don't know. Am I making sense? Like, and so who am to make that judgment? But yeah.

Hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Hmm

Yes and, yes and, there,

yes and, right? Like I think that there's some people that, I mean, it depends why you chose to invest in that, right? Like I think that it is nuanced and it is dependent on what is your belief system and if you have a belief system and you have the ability to afford, right?

yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

yeah. Yeah, no, I'm talking more about like when we sabotage ourselves by splurging. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

if you sabotage yourself. Yes. Yes.

Yeah. She's splurging on the Disney cruise. She's the Disney cruiser.

She's got another one coming. All right. Number nine, avoiding difficult money conversations with a spouse or partner because it feels uncomfortable. Yes, we're all holding up. That's a thumbs down. Now you got to talk about it. Push through the discomfort. That is huge.

That's right. Soon.

No, no, no.

We're in alignment. Yeah. Yeah. Got to talk about it.

No hiding. No hiding.

Mm-hmm.

That's huge. Okay. And the last one, negotiating your salary rates or worth later in life instead of settling. Is that a power move? Yes. Ooh.

Yes, stand up for ourselves,

what we deserve, what we want.

I'm about to do that Wednesday.

Are you?

Are ya?

So we'll have to get an update on that Ozzy. good. I think we all pretty much agreed on most of those. So, you know, I think that it's super important for us to remember that we have to sit through those discomfort conversations. We have to make efforts to make things happen if we want it to. We can't sit back and let it happen because that's not going to end well. Can we agree ladies? Well, all right, you guys, we want to hear from you. Which of these did you feel were true power moves or maybe a financial trap?

You can drop your thoughts in the comments on our YouTube video. We would love for you to check it out. There is some good stuff on the videos. We are so much more fun to watch in person, right? Yes, we are. Yes, And we're cute. So we have full videos on all our episodes on YouTube. Go check it out. Don't forget to like, follow, and subscribe. We love that and share it with somebody you know. Well, thank you and send us money.

Yeah.

We're cute.

you

and send us money.

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support

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You know, liking commenting

and subscribing is in essence, sending us money, right? Like it may not translate. That's right. And we will bring you with us.

Yes.

going

to make us some money at some point. That's right. That's right.

Tommy, you're supporting our Jet Fund.

That's right.

That's

I'm going to

right.

tag that line in the show notes, support the jet fund. That's our goal. All right. Well, that was a great conversation, ladies. Thank you so much for being vulnerable and honest and just sharing your true, real, authentic experiences with money. I hope it helps somebody out there. And if you guys have questions, you know where to find us. We'll have everything in the show notes. All right. We'll see you guys next week. Thanks for joining. Bye.

Nothing.

Bye.