From the outside, she's on top of it. Then something small happens — a cold, a bad night, one extra thing — and the whole thing collapses. And she decides the collapse is the problem. She needs to be better. More disciplined. Try harder.

But the collapse isn't the problem. The collapse is information. The problem is that she's been running her whole life on a system that was never built for her brain — and every time it falls over, she reads it as proof that she's the thing that's broken. Rachel Few is back, and this one is about the loop underneath all of it: if I could just try harder. Why effort was rewarded your whole life, why it stopped working the moment you had kids, and what it actually takes to stop surviving and start thriving — not the influencer version with the one massage and the full cup, the real one.

CHAPTERS

00:00 — The collapse isn't the problem. The collapse is information.

02:07 — Why 'just try harder' worked for years — until it didn't

03:12 — Jane's two years out of school, and the effort trap hiding inside a success story

04:36 — Add kids, and the sprint you can't run as a marathon

05:42 — Fight or flight: why you can't get the drone view of your own life

06:41 — Why every mum deserves a coach, and nobody questions it for a marathon

06:56 — The homework trap — leaving every appointment with more to do

09:02 — Why women keep landing back on 'I'm the problem'

10:25 — Effort that's purposeful vs effort that's just doing, doing, doing

11:26 — 'I've done years of therapy but I still can't get the shopping done'

13:22 — When to go back and unpack, and when to stay in the here and now

15:27 — The Friday meltdown that actually started on Monday

16:48 — The map: why women stop feeling like they're winging it

17:45 — The wine-and-big-plans trap, and Jane's real conversation with her husband

20:15 — The rugby coaching question — is it the thing you want, or one of four?

23:38 — Doing the mapping for our kids but never for ourselves

26:35 — Her one takeaway: cancel half a day

RESOURCES & REFERENCES

For more on Rachel Few — https://rachelfew.com/

Free Resources

ADHD Physical Health & Emotional Wellbeing Kit — for the burnout and the body-keeps-score part — https://adhdmums.com.au/product/adhd-physical-health-emotional-wellbeing-kit/

Paid Resources

ADHD Reset Workbook — Values, Energy & Planning — the closest thing to the 'what fills my cup, what goes, where are my spoons' mapping Rachel walks through — https://adhdmums.com.au/product/adhd-reset-workbook-values-energy-planning-for-adhd-mums/

ADHD Mums Shop — https://adhdmums.com.au/shop/

Related Episodes

Overstimulated Before 7am — And No One Sees the Work — with Rachel Few — her first episode, one of the most-consumed on the show — https://adhdmums.com.au/adhd-podcast-episodes/rachel-few/

What Is Underneath the Mask? Uncovering Who You Are After Diagnosis — S2 EP17, with Tanya Hicks — https://adhdmums.com.au/podcast_episode/episode-17-underneath-the-mask-uncovering-who-you-are-after-diagnosis/

Burnout, Pain & Weird Symptoms? The ADHD Link No One Told Us About — S2 EP62, Jane solo — https://adhdmums.com.au/podcast_episode/episode-62-burnout-pain-weird-symptoms-the-adhd-link-no-one-told-us-about/

Preventing Burnout: The Power of Setting Boundaries — S2 EP37, with Kara Lynch — https://adhdmums.com.au/podcast_episode/episode-37-adhd-autism-or-both-karas-story-of-burnout-and-sensory-overload/

About the Guest

Rachel Few runs Neurodivergent Counselling and Mentoring on the Sunshine Coast — telehealth, available Australia-wide. As a social worker, former school counsellor, and neurodivergent mother herself, her approach is holistic and body-centred: working with the nervous system as much as the brain.

Website: https://rachelfew.com — free 15-minute connection calls available via her site.

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[00:00:16] Jane: In a neurodivergent mum's life, often things look okay from the outside. She's on top of it, but then something happens. Maybe it's a cold, a bad night, or one extra thing, and then suddenly the whole thing collapses.

[00:00:57] Jane: Welcome to you, Rachel.

[00:01:00] Jane: if you haven't listened to Rachel's last episode on identity, it is one of the most downloaded and highly consumed, which means that it is one of the episodes that if you started listening to it, you were the most likely to get to the end. If you haven't checked out that episode, I really highly recommend that you do

[00:01:43] Jane: So Rachel, I think a great place to start because you're practically on the ground with women all the time, do you see this over and over again? The same push, the same routine, the same effort, then they're collapsing. I feel like in the Facebook group I see it all the time, [00:02:00] women saying, "Well, maybe I'm the problem.

[00:02:07] rachel: That's a great question because it's really common for women to come to me at that real breaking point.

[00:02:24] rachel: if it came down to effort, it would all be totally fine because these women are putting in an incredible amount of effort, and they deserve for things to be going well. it should feel really good if you're putting in all this effort. But the thing is, I guess, over time for a lot of women, they come to this realization that they are an ADHD-er late in life, and they've tried this certain process for their whole life where they just put in more and more effort, and in fact, that's rewarded.

[00:03:12] rachel: funny you should say that because I have always, my whole life, been successful because of effort. I had two years off school. When I say two years off school, I was in school cant for two years in high school. And then eventually my parents changed schools, which was not done back then, and went on to be in the paper for getting one of the highest scores in the state ever.

[00:03:50] Jane: And everything I've ever done that I've been successful at, I've always felt like if I could put enough effort in, I could make it work. So it's interesting that you say that because [00:04:00] maybe that's where some of that burnout comes from. I hadn't actually considered that.

[00:04:08] rachel: I mean, it's not entirely sustainable, but it seems a little more manageable before you have kids. But you add kids into the mix and keep trying to just effort your way through everything, and at some point the wheels generally start to fall off, and it often does look like a burnout. it usually comes to that point where you just can't sustain that level of effort and energy that's required, and I think that kind of like you could do that for a sprint, but you can't really do that for a marathon.

[00:05:04] Jane: Maybe I need to do more work with them by myself at home. Maybe I need to source the right tutor. So I feel like for myself and some of the people that I talk to on the podcast, they'll say their strategy is that effort.

[00:05:18] rachel: Yeah, and it's just doing, doing, doing. Like, it's just more and more action, and I guess that's when people finally, you know, arrive with me, it's sort of a counterintuitive thing for them to pause- and reflect Because when you're in that sort of fight or flight mode that so many moms live in, and spend a lot of time in, it's not the kind of place where you stand back and get like a drone view of your life.

[00:05:44] Jane: I found one of my children to be a little bit more challenging to connect with over time, and I found him to be quite disruptive, for example. And I've always felt like if I spent more time with him one-to-one, if I connected with him more deeply...

[00:06:14] Jane: And then you're in this cycle "Now I'm gonna research it. Now I'm gonna find a new thing that I have to do," and it does seem never-ending.

[00:06:41] rachel: It's like taking stabs in the dark and hoping, you know, like, something's gonna land. Because when you're exhausted- Mm ... that's what you're doing. You're just like, "I just need to survive this, and how am I gonna do that?"

[00:06:56] Jane: if you're doing a lot of therapies, for example, it's like the conversation at the [00:07:00] end is often some homework or some strategies or, "This is what we tried," or, "Could you try this?" Or, "I saw this." And when you're going around and all of those externals are giving you more information about things that you could be doing, whether it's teachers or OTs or whatever it is, or grandparents, family, that at the end of it, it feels like it really comes back to, well, what are you doing about it as a mom?

[00:07:29] rachel: Yeah, and it's overwhelming. Like, to leave every therapy appointment and every conversation with more homework, like, no wonder it feels really overwhelming to have all of that on your plate. But then also, you know, it's another conversation that I have so often is, which of this is actually working?

[00:08:23] Jane: it's so much easier in this scenario to take a step back, as you and I are sitting on the couch, fairly emotionally regulated, and be like, "Okay, well, really the system needs to take some responsibility. It's not ADHD mum's responsibility, and we really need to reflect on it's not us.

[00:09:02] rachel: Well, I think the messaging, you know, that a lot of women have received, especially pre-diagnosis, is if you just tried harder, if you just could do it differently, if you could just... If you could just, like whatever that is, right? And so that becomes the inner dialogue of, "If I could just, if I just,"

[00:09:25] rachel: Yeah.

[00:09:30] rachel: Yeah.

[00:09:31] rachel: Mm. Yeah, and it's a focus on, moms because really at the end of the day, in a majority of cases, it's the moms who are sort of picking up all of these pieces who are carrying this load.

[00:09:54] Jane: No, it isn't. So if we move forward with so many women talking [00:10:00] about how they wanna thrive, they don't wanna just survive anymore, we don't wanna talk about, how to get diagnosed.

[00:10:25] Jane:

[00:10:45] rachel: Because to make change, obviously, it takes time to implement that. But what I notice is then it's like long-term change because it's true nervous system understanding, mapping, regulation, having your own [00:11:00] resources, always having the visuals because otherwise it's just out of sight, out of mind, So it's getting into the really practical stuff, and I find a lot of women say, it's good they want to do the therapy work, but sometimes they get to a point where they're like, I've done years of that. I've done years of therapy, but I still don't have a solution to how I'm gonna get the shopping done and what I'm gonna do when my kid melts down about the wrong spaghetti."

[00:11:48] rachel: And that's what I think where it's kind of at is, as I was saying to women, we can drop into the deeper stuff whenever we need to and it's important, but we don't need to spend the whole time there

[00:12:06] Jane: And then it's a good point because you've made a shift and maybe you're speaking to a neurodivergent specialist or practitioner that's really attuned, but that it can also be this like, "I can't talk about this anymore, but yet I really need it." I think you've made a great point that it's not always about going back into the past if it's not helpful.

[00:12:35] rachel: Well, I think that there's lots of practical day-to-day things where when you get those things, it's kind of, again, it's a bit chicken or the egg.

[00:13:03] rachel: But also, if you understand someone's nervous system and you're helping them to regulate, then you're doing it from, that safe place when you start to look at these things, because there's no point in having somebody come in and they're in fight or flight and then they say something about their childhood and you go, "Oh, like, let's jump into that."

[00:13:40] Jane: So once a woman sees the loop, she realizes what it's costing her, this loop of if I could just, if I tried harder, burn out, whatever you wanna call it, and she's in a position for the first time to possibly make a change or even just be aware that she's about to do the same thing over and over and over [00:14:00] again,

[00:14:15] rachel: And it's just not sustainable anymore. And then that question comes in, "Okay, what am I gonna do?" And so when they arrive, then, you know, with me, it's around pause. As much as I know that's a really hard thing to do that's where we're at, is to do the pause, and then I explain, "Okay, this is what I'm thinking is going to help us get your map out of here," because that's what they need.

[00:15:05] rachel: creating deeper awareness and understanding. Then we start to be able to put that across our kids. Ah, where are they at? What do they need to go back around? What resources do we have? Again, what are our just simple reminders. It's not complicated, it's just do I have a visual that if I've gone offline, I can remember what it is that I do that helps.

[00:15:46] rachel: And just has nothing left. So we'd created the family schedule with all of the things in mind, the sensory, the social needs, the everything. But then there was this blowup happening on Friday. So we [00:16:00] went through the schedule with a fine-tooth comb and a real PDA lens as well, and it's like back at Monday there was bits and pieces Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, but really, like Monday was affecting Friday.

[00:16:29] Jane: Wow.

[00:16:48] rachel: Yeah. I think that's probably one of the most common things is that once the women have this map, they just don't feel like they're having to wing it anymore. And I [00:17:00] think the winging it thing comes from in most women's cases, living a lot of their life as neurotypical, but not.

[00:17:34] rachel: So we have to get quite strict on what we do and don't allow into the week for each person to go well

[00:17:58] Jane: He said, "Oh, well, [00:18:00] why don't we try and get someone over to look after the kids? We can actually go out for dinner and have a chat about it." And then I just started laughing. I said, "No, no, no, no, no.

[00:18:21] Jane: Then we end up being in this exhausting burnout thing where we don't actually ever plan anything. And then I said to him, "This year has been one of the most exhausting I've ever had, and I don't think we should just wing it and go, 'If you wanna do it, you can. If I wanna do it, you can.' And then we're both just spread so thin."

[00:18:48] rachel: Yeah, you're right. Like, what we have to look at is do we have the spoons? But not do we have the spoons, like, right now, but if we actually overhauled our life, what would be the priorities?

[00:19:25] rachel: So there is a reality to it. But even within that, y-you would be amazed how much you can work out when you do these equations. And like I'm terrible at maths. This is not about, fine mathematical equations. This is about the equation of your life and what battery, what spoons, what is going where.

[00:20:09] rachel: And maybe it did. Maybe it once did serve you well, but does it now? And is it still there and does it need to go?

[00:20:25] Jane: So he's been doing rugby coaching for the last three years, which is out at night and also a lot of the day on Saturday. And I spoke to him about it last night. It's so interesting that you said that because when we were talking about it, I said to him, "It's not that you can't do the rugby coaching.

[00:20:57] Jane: Because I think you made a great [00:21:00] point If you're thinking of this is gonna take that much time, is it what you really, really want? And I hate the filling up the cup word really, 'cause I think it's been overused by influencers who already have a full fucking cup. Like, I hate seeing it. It's like I'm looking at you, I'm seeing your life, your cup seems pretty full. You've had one massage, now it's full. Like you, it's not empty, mate. That's what I wanna say. But I think you're right, like being more conscious around what it is that you really wanna do rather than treating it all the same.

[00:21:58] rachel: So it's just this [00:22:00] really- intricate way of looking at it for a start. But as I say to the women that I work with, yes, it might take us a few weeks to go through that, but then you've got that. And yes, you'll need to check in and tweak it maybe 6 to 12 months, but you'll never have to, like, completely do that again because in that process, you come to know yourself on this deeper level

[00:22:49] rachel: Like, it might be five minutes, but it's amazing what doing that through all of those little moments of the day, and this is what I'm always saying to women [00:23:00] is, like, I'm not here to tell you some ridiculous plan around you doing all of these self-care things, and some of these things that we're gonna talk about literally take a minute

[00:23:19] Jane: And I feel like the mapping that you're talking about, we often do with our children. Mm. We think about it carefully, we look at their energy, we make a conscious decision about what we're planning for them, but yet we don't do that for ourselves. And I think it's like almost like you're the mom and the person's a child, and it's like, okay, well, what taxes you?

[00:23:50] rachel: Yeah. And that's because as moms, it comes from intuition, I think, you know, to just focus on your children and to try and help them and do what's best for them.[00:24:00]

[00:24:25] rachel: And then when, you know, women start working with me and they go, " Yeah, actually, this is the first time that I feel like there's any change." Like, I've been going to those allied health appointments and whatnot, but I come away and I think, what's different in the family? What's feeling better about this?

[00:25:07] Jane: Yeah, it's always that old saying, like put on your own oxygen mask before you help others

[00:25:26] Jane: Yeah. I don't think it's natural for a lot of mums, especially the mums listening to this podcast, that are wanting to better themselves, that are wanting to be a better parent. Yeah. The women that listen are already good parents because they're putting the time in- Yeah ... and they're thinking about it, and they feel guilty, and often I think they're already great mums.

[00:25:58] rachel: Yeah, [00:26:00] absolutely. And that's what, again, a lot of women say is like, "I need this locked into my week and some accountability," like to show up and actually do that because otherwise that instinct to go and focus on the children again.

[00:26:35] Jane: If there's a mom listening and she's in and out of burnout doing the same thing over and over again, and then wondering why she keeps feeling burnt out or overwhelmed, coming back to the message that she needs to try harder, What's something that you can leave them with to really mull over or reflect on as we come to an end of the episode?

[00:27:16] rachel: And for most women, there is no space to do the pause. If that's not scheduled in, it's not gonna happen. So just cancel the half day, cancel the day, whatever you can manage, and know that this is the first step to that real change that you need for yourself and for your family. And if possible, work with somebody to do that because it's something that everybody needs support.

[00:28:01] Jane: Oh, I think that's a great point, and the podcast episodes are great.

[00:28:24] Jane: I think this has been such a great episode. If anyone would like to share how they're feeling about it or things that they are up against, I think Rachel's in the Facebook group, aren't you, Rachel?

[00:28:34] Jane: I can tag Rachel in the Facebook group. We can start a thread when the episode comes out on this topic, because it's such a big one, and it's very difficult to do it justice in just 30 minutes.

[00:28:44] Jane: And we can have a bit of a thread around identity, what is challenging, and I bet you there'll be some common elements in there .

[00:28:57] rachel: If you'd like to check out Rachel, I'll put all of her [00:29:00] information in on the show notes.

[00:29:06] rachel: Thanks, Jay. It was great.