Shownotes
In this episode of the Future Proof HR podcast, Thomas Kunjappu sits down with Angelika Ivanov-Jackson, founder of IGR, a globally focused HR and recruitment agency, to explore what it really means to build HR infrastructure across borders and why the HR professionals who will thrive in the age of AI are the ones brave enough to own their value.
With over a decade of experience spanning the US, EMEA, APAC, MENA, and CIS regions across industries from real estate to finance, e-commerce, AI, and ad tech, Angelika has built HR functions from the ground up more times than most professionals build them once. She brings a rare combination of global compliance expertise, generalist scrappiness, and a deeply human perspective on what it means to lead people across cultures, languages, and time zones.
Together, they dig into what really changes and what stays exactly the same when you take HR global, why the first hire in any new market should almost always be an HR professional, and how organizations that treat HR as a true strategic partner consistently outgrow the ones that don't. Angelika also shares her candid take on AI in HR, why she's never believed technology will replace the function, and how HR leaders can position themselves as the ones driving AI adoption across their entire organization rather than being disrupted by it.
She also delivers one of the most energizing calls to action for early-career HR professionals you'll hear — a reminder that the work of repositioning HR from an administrative function to a true business partner has already been done, and now it's time for the next generation to be brave enough to walk through that door.
Topics Discussed:
- How Gen Z is reshaping expectations in the workplace and what older generations can learn from them
- What's universal about HR across every country and what's not
- Why labor law and local compliance are the real variables when going global
- The case for making HR your first hire when entering a new market
- How the HR function has evolved from "hire, fire, and plan the Christmas party" to a strategic business partner
- Why organizations with healthy HR teams grow faster and make fewer costly mistakes
- AI in HR: who has the advantage and how to make sure it's you
- How to set up HR infrastructure from scratch at an early-stage or pre-opening company
- Hiring strategy for new markets: why you start from the top of each department down
- When to ask for your first HR hire and what the pre-opening stage actually demands
- Advice for new HR professionals: be brave, know your value, and bring options A, B, and C
If you're an HR leader navigating global expansion, building a people function from nothing, or trying to figure out how to stay relevant and future-proof in an AI-driven world, this episode is a grounded, globally informed, and deeply human look at what it takes to lead HR without borders.
Additional Resources:
Transcripts
I hear that one day HR departments will
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be replaced by technology.
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I don't think that will ever happen.
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And I have, been certain from
the very beginning when even
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ideas like that came to place.
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HR is just such a strategic advisor
that it will never be fully replaced.
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Thomas Kunjappu: They keep
telling us that it's all over.
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For HR, the age of AI is upon
us, and that means HR should
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be prepared to be decimated.
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We reject that message.
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The future of HR won't be handed to us.
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Instead, it'll be defined by those
ready to experiment, adopt, and adapt.
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Future Proof HR invites these builders to
share what they're trying, how it's going,
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what they've learned, and what's next.
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We are committed to arming HR
with the AI insights to not
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just survive, but to thrive.
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Hello and welcome to Future-Proof HR,
where we explore how forward-thinking
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HR leaders are preparing for disruption
and redefining what it means to
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lead people in a changing world.
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I'm your host, Thomas
Kunjappu, CEO of Cleary.
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Today's guest is Angelika Ivanov-Jackson,
the founder at IGR, a globally
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focused HR and recruitment agency.
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With over a decade of experience in global
HR specifically, Angelika has built people
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strategies and HR infrastructures across
the US, EMEA, APAC, MENA and CIS region,
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spanning industries from real estate to
finance, to e-commerce, AI, and ad tech.
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She's known for designing HR
functions from scratch, launching
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new markets, and partnering with
executives to scale high performing
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teams while preserving cultural DNA.
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Angelika, welcome to the podcast.
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Angelika: it's a pleasure to be here.
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Thomas Kunjappu: Let's start maybe talking
a little bit about the generations.
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Because you've built HR teams in different
organizations and from the recruiting
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engine to the other core HR practices.
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But tell me about how you feel being
in the generation that you're in.
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What is unique especially from an HR
perspective that you bring to the table?
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Angelika: That's a very
interesting question for a start.
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Every generation is different
and I was very fortunate to be
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able to support all of them.
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I started working very early.
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I'm a millennial by myself, and my
career started in the corporate world on
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the first year of my university times.
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I definitely learned a good base of how
to even have an ethic at in the workplace.
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And I think that older
generation than mine really were
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bringing this in a huge level.
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The generations which are now on
the market, which are joining to
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the market are definitely different.
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Like every generation is different.
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And every generation definitely needs
a different touch from the HR side.
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And we as HRs, we always to
adjust to whatever comes.
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This is exactly how I would
describe every day in hr.
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Every day is different.
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And the same like with every
generation and every human being.
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We have under our protection in
the company as HR professionals.
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So I would describe it like that.
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Thomas Kunjappu: We're of the, same
generation, but at this point we're not
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the youngest generation in the workplace,
and there's been a few years now of.
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Gen Z getting in post-college and
into all types of functions and
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even getting towards mid-career.
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What would you say is from an HR
perspective, what have you noticed?
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Is different for the in supporting
Gen Z versus millennials,
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Angelika: Yeah.
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I love Gen Z for so many reasons.
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They're so driven.
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They want to feel an impact.
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They like whatever project they do,
they want to feel that they really
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improve the place where they are at.
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And that's something what founders
CEOs many times don't understand.
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It is just for this young
professionals, they just whatever
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they do is, even if this is internship
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Thomas Kunjappu: right?
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Angelika: they just wanna feel that
they do, they're making impacting the
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workplace that they are force which is
change and and that the, work matter.
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And also I think that they really
they were the force which teach
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us older generations that about,
respect of everybody's work.
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I feel like that was somewhere in the
background, but always in the background
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in the healthy organizations, of course,
that there is in respect to your,
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work, to your position and you name it.
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But I feel like this generation really
brought a huge light into this, that
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every, person in the company matter
that as that accompanies as a whole
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and ev like I said earlier, that every
person is making an impact and every
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person deserves to be seen for exactly
what they bringing to the table.
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Thomas Kunjappu: Another slice of
just I guess humanity that I feel
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like you have a really unique insight
into is a global perspective, right?
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You've come in from Europe into the us
but you've, led organizations in pretty
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much every kind of continent, right?
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Where you've worked with folks there.
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What have been some of your, observations
when you're talking about global hr,
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what are some of the the challenges
that, organizations have that are
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maybe the same across the world
and or, and, but especially what
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are some unique differences, right?
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That challenges that HR professionals
have when they're in different geos.
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I.
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Angelika: I love this question
because I remember when I first time
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got into the global opportunity and
I was very fortunate to like get
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opportunity like that very early on
the very early stage in my career.
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And I remember how nervous I was
because I'm like, I have not even
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been in this country, like how I
can even run a HR process there.
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But to tell you the truth, this, this
whole stress was for nothing because
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I know after decade, I know now that
we as people, we are truly the same.
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In everywhere.
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We have the same issues.
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We want the same things.
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Of course we speak different languages.
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We have different culture backgrounds.
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And what's definitely a main difference
of course in the HR " situationship"
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is the law, the labor law.
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That's definitely something you
have to follow as an HR to make
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sure that your organization is fully
compliant with the market you are in.
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But, but as for people itself,
it just we are all the same.
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We have all the same problems and
happy moments in the workplaces.
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We truly, which we truly
want the same things.
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And it doesn't matter, is it in Dubai?
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Is it in the us?
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Is it in Poland?
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Is it in any other place?
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The value stays the
same small differences.
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Like I said, cultural every country is
different and every country is unique,
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but but those are really small, the main
factor stays the same whatever you go.
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Of course the processes
itself are different.
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You will run interview very
differently in Europe and in the US.
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Even like the application process
some countries, you are sending
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your resume with the picture
in US, it's not what you do.
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And the questions you are allowed
or not allowed to ask during the
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interview process they will also rise.
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Of course entering a new country,
you have to understand this, market.
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And you have to understand what is
allowed and what is not, what is well
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seen, what is absolutely not something
you should do or ask or proceed with.
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But but in general I would say the
stress of entering a new markets, it's
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not shouldn't be big because if there is
like any HR which will be listening this
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podcast and they are opportunity like that
comes to them they shouldn't be afraid.
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This is something that you can
really learn fast and keep up
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faster than you think actually.
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Thomas Kunjappu: So there's, if
anyone is looking at expanding
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into new market, that'll.
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Often happens, right?
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Especially with the age of the
internet and customer expansion
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happening globally faster.
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People are going from an employment
perspective into new markets faster.
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The challenge on the HR side is often
like, how do I set up this new office or
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entity or higher up the core group there?
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And it's a, to your point, it's
a big moment of pause, right?
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For folks in, in hr it's do I, need
to find someone locally who can
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execute all these things because
everything there is gonna be different.
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Are you saying that actually.
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maybe if it's, a, it takes some
effort, but it's it's something
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that you you could evolve.
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If you understand a, certain number of
factors in depth in one market, you can
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learn and evolve in that way versus hiring
someone local or getting local help.
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Would you say that's the
case or kind of depends?
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Angelika: You can do both ways.
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Why I love HR from the beginning
and I think it's important
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for me to start from there.
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It's because, HR professionals,
HR departments, we are really
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like ninjas in the organizations.
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We adapt quickly, like
I said on the beginning.
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You need to adapt quickly
for whatever situation.
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And nothing really starts without HR.
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Because HR brings people, HR brings
law and order into the organization
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and make sure that everything
is like how it's supposed to be.
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Of course entering new market, you're
doing extensive research and this is
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something what you can do, by yourself.
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And there is, in today world, there
is like just so many materials out
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there that you can, do the research by
yourself, but what is definitely more
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helpful is to start, and I ha have many
times worked in solutions like that with
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organization that you actually, your first
placement in the new location is an hr.
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And it's HR who is very generalist
who understand all perspectives
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of what it's needed to bring into
the new the new location, right?
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And from my observation clients
who started that way really grew
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faster, better, and they made
much more less financial loss.
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They just did it better that way.
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When the first person really
was an HR professional.
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And then you're starting from the
CEO and general manager, it's always
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if organization already has like
other location, it's better to send
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somebody from the location to be a
temporary general manager and start
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this with an HR because the person
from the other location will bring
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the culture and the general setup.
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But the local HR will make sure that the
location has all the compliance in place
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that everything is taken care of from the
perspective from the wages per perspective
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and that you do not make mistakes with
hiring from the from the first place.
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And of course, the local HR
works already with your other HR
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professionals from the from the other
locations, but you do not have to
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necessarily send them to the location.
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They can be remote.
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And so you have a person in
place already who, who understand
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the market better than anybody.
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Thomas Kunjappu: That's a thoughtful
advice, and it depends on the actual
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expansion plan for the, local region.
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But having the first hire be in HR
kind of sets the tone and sets you
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up for success is what I'm hearing.
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So if that's one way to expand globally,
let's just talk more broadly about
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the HR function in general, right?
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Yeah, so what do you think if you're
looking through your career to today,
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do you think the, what is asked of
the HR function has changed at all?
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Angelika: Yeah, it changed
massively, I would say.
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I remember on the beginning of
my career, definitely HR was.
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Pretty much seen as somebody we
hire, we fire, and occasionally
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we organize a Christmas party.
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Pretty much it was just
seen like that Today.
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In today world hr is a is a
heart of the organization and
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not everywhere, obviously.
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Not, everywhere it's happening, but
the understanding of HR function
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and what healthy HR department looks
like is definitely much more broad.
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And and again, founders company
leaders who understands that
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HR is your business partner and
really a heart of of your company.
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From my observation and even from
the statistics, and not only mine
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there is a lot of publications out
there who proves that point too.
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Just organizations like that grows
much faster and without many mistakes
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which can be avoided because only
HR has as a department make sure
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that step forward is really looked
through, through, and taken care of.
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So they're much more than
just hiring, firing, end.
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Organizing parties they HR takes care
of, like we spoke extensively about
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your compliance of the organization
law and Order in place, but also hiring
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a right talents, which will not only
match the culture you already, they also
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creating, because HR creates culture
and make sure that this culture stays.
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So they hire talents which not only bring
the skillset, they also match the culture
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and flow of, organization, which is today.
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And if you know you want to part ways
with somebody, they making sure that
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you will do it correctly, that you will
not end up with some unnecessary and
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maybe ugly lawsuit in the background
because nobody really needs it.
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And of course they also create
opportunities for people to grow
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internally and be promoted and
stay in the organization for years
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because that's everybody's goal.
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Like you want.
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Everybody who you hire stay as long
as only possible because it's always
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more profitable for organization
to have it that way, right?
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But, but it's like just so much more.
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And there's just so much more to,
even say even HR is responsible
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for even salaries for every,
two weeks every month, payments.
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It's like agreements everything.
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So it is just you cannot really
do it that well without treating
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HR as your true business partner.
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And just let them give them the place
at the table, what they truly deserve
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and and always hear their perspective.
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And from my experience,
definitely founders not always.
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Of what HR says, but
we will say it anyway.
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The decision is always yours, but
we are here to tell you scenario
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A, scenario B and scenario C.
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And in the end we will proceed
with whatever route you want us to
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follow, and we will make sure that
you are well protected as our client.
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But we're expecting the worst,
hoping for the best, but proceeding
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with whatever is in place.
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That's how I would describe it.
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Thomas Kunjappu: So Angelika , that's an
interesting transition you've described
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about how the relationship for HR and
the C-suite or founders has evolved.
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But then if you project that forward now
where we're in an age of ai business and
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strategic background that we're operating
in is continuously more murky laws.
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It can also like shift but post COVID,
we're dealing with a whole new surface
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area with like remote work and things
keep continuing to shift and the
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maybe there's some expectation with.
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AI for a lot of things, not just in HR,
but across GNA to be more, more efficient.
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But how do you think about where HR is
headed and how we can stay future proof.
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Angelika: Definitely the world
is changing all the time and with
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AI right now in place that's.
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That's a change for every department.
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It's it's not just hr.
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If it comes to hr, like from, whatever
I started working in that field,
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I hear that one day HR departments
will be replaced by by technology.
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I don't think that will ever happen.
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And I have, been certain from
the very beginning when even
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ideas like that came to place.
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Hr, HR is we, like we talked.
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It's just such a strategic advisor
that it will never be fully replaced.
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But what's changed?
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Definitely ai.
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AI is bringing huge help to HR
professionals and we are already using it.
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It's not a question even do
you want to use AI or not?
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It is just who will start using
it faster than has an advantage.
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And you can be still scared about it.
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You can like, obviously, but but you're
missing out because this if I am looking
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back and thinking even like how long
many tasks were taking me and how much
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faster and how much more productive I
am on my daily, duties with ai help.
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It's just, it's not even comparable.
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It's, just it's, a lightspeed I
would say so, yeah definitely.
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The word changed.
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The word is constantly changing.
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Like our conversation probably will
not be relevant in two years from now.
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And there will be like just more which
comes to the, to this everyday table.
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But but as for now definitely
organizations which already understood
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what extra tools, what's what extra
softwares, what extra whatev, whatever
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it is, you name it based on AI or
with ai and they can adapt this.
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They can have HR who are leading.
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and prepare trainings for each
department in the company and bring
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00:20:42,333 --> 00:20:49,723
them these tools and so they can have
this advantage so they can be faster
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than anybody else, than competitors.
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Then you will win a lot.
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Not only as individual, in the workplace,
but as a organization as a whole.
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Speaker 4: This has been a
fantastic conversation so far.
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If you haven't already done so,
make sure to join our community.
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00:21:09,263 --> 00:21:11,933
We are building a network of the
most forward-thinking, HR and
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00:21:11,933 --> 00:21:15,113
people, operational professionals
who are defining the future.
291
00:21:15,593 --> 00:21:18,203
I will personally be sharing
news and ideas around how we
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00:21:18,203 --> 00:21:20,213
can all thrive in the age of AI.
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00:21:20,573 --> 00:21:23,558
You can find it at go cleary.com/cleary
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00:21:23,988 --> 00:21:24,598
community.
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00:21:25,223 --> 00:21:26,063
Now back to the show.
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Thomas Kunjappu: So you've been
in that role many times of being
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that first HR person to come into
an organization, basically set up
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everything from scratch, right?
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So there's a team in place, there's
maybe some funding or revenue obviously,
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and then you want to grow a little bit.
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Recruiting usually tends to
be top of mind, and now you're
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getting into compliance.
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And there's a series of tasks
that tend to come in that first
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setting the table as a function.
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At this point, if you're doing that
from scratch for a new organization
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What is different?
307
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What is your mindset?
308
00:22:01,180 --> 00:22:04,240
Who are you hiring or
what tools are you using?
309
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:08,840
What's, how do you actually go
about setting that up for an
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00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:11,090
organization at that early stage?
311
00:22:11,835 --> 00:22:12,555
Angelika: Great question.
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00:22:13,065 --> 00:22:17,935
Yeah, it was each time basically I would
say that I specialize in the openings
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from the scratch or completely reshaping
the organization which already exist.
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But but yeah when you start definitely
you're starting from understanding
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the the le the legal aspect of like
we discussed already, like the legal
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aspect is very important and you analyze
the wages to be competitive on the
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market and benefits whatever you can
do to make your organization attractive
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because you, entering this market
and you want to make sure that you
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do not miss all this little, details.
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00:22:56,735 --> 00:23:02,835
But if it comes to the hiring I
usually advise to start from the
321
00:23:03,135 --> 00:23:10,785
top positions of the departments
and let them to drive how they want
322
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to structure each of the department
because they will lead this department
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and they will lead this individual.
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00:23:20,055 --> 00:23:26,725
So everything has to match not only a
skillset and the description we had in
325
00:23:26,725 --> 00:23:34,030
other relocation in mind, but also those
soft aspects and culture effects as well.
326
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And somebody who just see the vision.
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00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:42,110
Because every organization, even if
it's global when they entering a new
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location, they are startup there.
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And you have to treat it as as such
nothing, is in place yet, and you
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00:23:50,350 --> 00:23:53,650
need some time to to build it, right?
331
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So you need also people who understand
that, they're, for example, joining
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even a global organization, but
333
00:24:02,625 --> 00:24:05,765
this location, it's just about to start.
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So this location is a startup,
but with the corporate and very
335
00:24:11,675 --> 00:24:15,725
well structured background like
in some other countries, right?
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00:24:16,715 --> 00:24:20,105
If, we have a situation like that,
because I also work with startups who
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didn't have any other locations and
they, that was just starts in general.
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00:24:27,915 --> 00:24:32,115
That's a startup like in, in full
understanding of this meaning.
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00:24:32,505 --> 00:24:41,705
But so what, tools like we discuss,
you can right now do a lot of things by
340
00:24:41,705 --> 00:24:47,945
yourself, but you can also start work
with some agencies already in place
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in terms of finance or legal aspects.
342
00:24:53,445 --> 00:24:58,575
But if we are choosing working
with hr, because it's see,
343
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every organization is different.
344
00:24:59,955 --> 00:25:02,445
And of course, like every
field will be different.
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00:25:02,445 --> 00:25:08,205
Like real estate will be completely
having different drive than e-commerce.
346
00:25:08,205 --> 00:25:11,955
Like you will need different
people from the start because you
347
00:25:11,955 --> 00:25:14,725
have to also understand maybe.
348
00:25:14,930 --> 00:25:21,080
In other location, you have people who
you can grow and give them a new market
349
00:25:21,650 --> 00:25:26,090
for example, and new responsibilities
what they already have for the
350
00:25:26,090 --> 00:25:28,070
existing place where they are at.
351
00:25:28,070 --> 00:25:33,830
But they can maybe take a new,
location and it'll make sense, right?
352
00:25:34,130 --> 00:25:39,860
So you have to analyze all those
aspects like giving professionals
353
00:25:39,860 --> 00:25:42,770
in your organization opportunities
is always a good thing.
354
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:47,810
And that's something always
supposed to appear in HR mind
355
00:25:47,810 --> 00:25:53,650
that Hey this, these people would
probably like to have a global role.
356
00:25:53,650 --> 00:25:58,090
They probably would enjoy having
business trips to that location.
357
00:25:58,090 --> 00:26:01,920
So you have to think about it too,
and see what kind of opportunities
358
00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:03,600
you can give internally.
359
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:09,280
Of course the tools, the
softwares the everyday softwares,
360
00:26:09,335 --> 00:26:10,685
what you will be working on.
361
00:26:10,685 --> 00:26:14,525
And maybe this is the opportunity
to see what's new in the market.
362
00:26:14,525 --> 00:26:18,125
Like right now, like every day I
feel like something new is coming
363
00:26:18,125 --> 00:26:25,300
up from the task trackers, to
softwares to searching engines.
364
00:26:26,050 --> 00:26:26,590
You name it.
365
00:26:26,590 --> 00:26:34,210
It's just I feel like with AI already
in place, there is just so many ideas
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00:26:34,210 --> 00:26:41,330
already which are being, brought to light
and it's, I think that we are in times
367
00:26:41,330 --> 00:26:46,550
when you really have your, have to have
your eye open and follow those trends
368
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:53,630
you can sign up yourself to like many
groups, even on LinkedIn and just keep
369
00:26:53,630 --> 00:27:00,840
your eye open for whatever market is
offering you and which will match also
370
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:05,680
your organization and your goals and
the vision you already have in place.
371
00:27:06,380 --> 00:27:11,630
Some, softwares will not match
exactly organization which have one
372
00:27:11,630 --> 00:27:17,950
location in place and but others
will match some sort of global setup.
373
00:27:17,950 --> 00:27:23,950
So it's, you have to always
custom for where you are.
374
00:27:24,330 --> 00:27:29,350
Now and like what kind of company
you are and like, what's your
375
00:27:29,350 --> 00:27:30,520
goals, what's your vision like?
376
00:27:30,570 --> 00:27:36,900
That's hr work over there to really
sit down with founders with C-suite
377
00:27:37,290 --> 00:27:44,350
professionals and just understand their
vision and then propose right solutions.
378
00:27:45,050 --> 00:27:51,225
Thomas Kunjappu: So if you had to
pinpoint when would be the point where
379
00:27:51,225 --> 00:27:57,525
you actually make the case to hire
someone to help you within HR and why?
380
00:27:58,070 --> 00:28:00,170
Angelika: I would start from
the beginning, like before
381
00:28:00,170 --> 00:28:01,610
even you even have a location.
382
00:28:01,610 --> 00:28:03,345
I was in the situations like that, that
383
00:28:04,050 --> 00:28:04,560
Thomas Kunjappu: But hold on.
384
00:28:04,810 --> 00:28:06,550
Isn't that why they
hired you as the first?
385
00:28:07,270 --> 00:28:07,330
Yeah.
386
00:28:07,570 --> 00:28:07,600
Okay.
387
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,040
So you're coming in and doing something.
388
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,970
So I would imagine on day one, you're
not coming in with budget, right?
389
00:28:12,970 --> 00:28:15,130
That's the, scrappy
mindset I would imagine.
390
00:28:15,310 --> 00:28:19,030
There's gotta be, at some point
you are there's a trigger to
391
00:28:19,090 --> 00:28:21,070
hire someone to help you, right?
392
00:28:21,790 --> 00:28:22,285
What would that be?
393
00:28:22,985 --> 00:28:26,465
Angelika: Okay, so I have a right
understanding you want me to speak from
394
00:28:26,465 --> 00:28:33,485
the perspective of me as a global already
HR leader who helps my client to open
395
00:28:33,485 --> 00:28:40,455
new location and I am driving process
to hire somebody who will help me open
396
00:28:40,510 --> 00:28:42,645
Thomas Kunjappu: I'm talking about
the former, which is much more common.
397
00:28:42,915 --> 00:28:45,905
The idea that you're just
starting up and you're the first
398
00:28:45,905 --> 00:28:48,215
HR hire at this company, right?
399
00:28:48,335 --> 00:28:49,355
And then you're trying to take it.
400
00:28:49,355 --> 00:28:54,155
to a certain place before you would
consider asking for more headcount.
401
00:28:54,455 --> 00:28:57,095
So what is the progress you
think is expected, right?
402
00:28:57,725 --> 00:29:00,675
What, is, and what are the triggers
before you would feel like it's the
403
00:29:00,675 --> 00:29:03,695
right moment to get help for you in
what you're trying to accomplish?
404
00:29:04,220 --> 00:29:04,520
Angelika: sure.
405
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:09,860
So this is some sort of you're, not
starting from total scratch because
406
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:14,630
if somebody made a, decision to open
in that location, then they already
407
00:29:14,810 --> 00:29:19,590
made some market research before
you even came to the conversation
408
00:29:19,590 --> 00:29:21,630
that, and end up being hired.
409
00:29:21,660 --> 00:29:26,130
But so I would imagine this, that this
is already okay, we want to invest
410
00:29:26,130 --> 00:29:27,570
in that market, in that location.
411
00:29:27,570 --> 00:29:29,310
We see huge opportunities here.
412
00:29:30,010 --> 00:29:31,330
And this is what we wanna do.
413
00:29:32,030 --> 00:29:34,340
Then they hire somebody like me.
414
00:29:34,340 --> 00:29:35,270
I'm already in place.
415
00:29:35,270 --> 00:29:36,230
I understand the market.
416
00:29:36,230 --> 00:29:43,140
I understand what kind of documents
you need what kind of legal aspects you
417
00:29:43,140 --> 00:29:45,270
have to follow how the wages looks like.
418
00:29:45,270 --> 00:29:47,340
So I, I'm an expert in the field.
419
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:49,140
I'm, joining and I'm.
420
00:29:49,410 --> 00:29:54,570
From the day one, giving you already
either confirmation of what you already
421
00:29:54,570 --> 00:30:01,780
found either some different insight
of maybe you mistaken in your previous
422
00:30:02,230 --> 00:30:08,660
researchers, but I Remember times when
I started in the company where there was
423
00:30:08,660 --> 00:30:11,360
not even the official location set up.
424
00:30:12,255 --> 00:30:13,940
You have only just one person.
425
00:30:13,940 --> 00:30:18,970
You are renting a space
in this networking.
426
00:30:19,390 --> 00:30:20,335
Thomas Kunjappu: A coworking space.
427
00:30:20,925 --> 00:30:21,705
Angelika: Co-working space?
428
00:30:21,705 --> 00:30:21,945
Yes.
429
00:30:21,945 --> 00:30:22,305
Thank you.
430
00:30:22,725 --> 00:30:25,845
So you're renting a desk
in the co-working space.
431
00:30:25,845 --> 00:30:31,975
You have your HR professional working
there, or you don't even have to do it
432
00:30:31,975 --> 00:30:38,035
now because since COVID times change
and you can just like have this person
433
00:30:38,035 --> 00:30:40,975
working remotely from from their home.
434
00:30:40,975 --> 00:30:42,865
And then this is how it can start.
435
00:30:42,895 --> 00:30:43,675
Definitely.
436
00:30:44,035 --> 00:30:48,535
And then you have also a person
in place who can help you.
437
00:30:49,235 --> 00:30:52,085
To, even open this location
because that's, what I have
438
00:30:52,085 --> 00:30:53,585
been doing as an HR tool.
439
00:30:53,585 --> 00:31:00,205
Like I have been helping just to even
open the location from the administrative
440
00:31:00,505 --> 00:31:06,545
side of even talking to building and
building representatives and and then
441
00:31:06,575 --> 00:31:12,510
even I, even work with the construction
companies and and manage them at the same
442
00:31:12,510 --> 00:31:17,160
time because that's the, thing, like when
you want HR in play, like your first,
443
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:22,780
if you want to start from hr, you have
to choose the one who had been wearing
444
00:31:22,780 --> 00:31:30,110
many hats and is not too good to, to do
to even go to the construction site and
445
00:31:30,110 --> 00:31:35,520
just make sure that your location has
all the right aspects of there as well.
446
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:37,680
And everybody is doing the good job.
447
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:45,220
Definitely this is not only HR
responsibilities On the beginnings
448
00:31:45,250 --> 00:31:51,160
of projects like that you really
go outside of the box many, times.
449
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,800
And I think that it's important
that whoever will be listening this
450
00:31:54,980 --> 00:32:00,290
podcast to understand that this is
how it is for the first five, seven
451
00:32:00,290 --> 00:32:01,910
months of the pre-opening stage.
452
00:32:01,970 --> 00:32:08,210
And and then once you have
everything staged, then you really
453
00:32:08,210 --> 00:32:11,880
like fully on only HR aspects.
454
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,910
But before you're just
like wearing many hats.
455
00:32:14,910 --> 00:32:17,190
It's a startup like we discussed.
456
00:32:17,670 --> 00:32:19,450
But yeah, I hope
457
00:32:19,905 --> 00:32:21,255
Thomas Kunjappu: Yeah, got it.
458
00:32:21,255 --> 00:32:24,435
So then one last question
while I have you here.
459
00:32:25,435 --> 00:32:26,815
With the shifts that.
460
00:32:26,815 --> 00:32:31,235
you expect in the HR function,
what's what's needed from it?
461
00:32:31,935 --> 00:32:36,195
If you're giving advice to someone who's
just now coming out of college or school
462
00:32:36,195 --> 00:32:40,975
and is looking at getting their first HR
role what, thoughts would you have for
463
00:32:40,975 --> 00:32:43,435
them about how they can best be prepared?
464
00:32:44,135 --> 00:32:44,945
Angelika: Oh, be brave.
465
00:32:45,425 --> 00:32:46,355
Let's start from that.
466
00:32:46,385 --> 00:32:50,615
Be brave know your value and make
yourself a place at the table
467
00:32:50,615 --> 00:32:53,435
because you fully deserve this place.
468
00:32:53,855 --> 00:32:59,375
Like I said earlier, organizations
which have a very healthy and well
469
00:32:59,375 --> 00:33:03,615
structured hr teams grows much faster.
470
00:33:04,365 --> 00:33:13,915
The founders the managers and whoever
who is in the executive position and
471
00:33:13,975 --> 00:33:21,545
management board understands that really
will get to their goals much faster.
472
00:33:21,845 --> 00:33:25,145
And that's just something
both sides has to understand.
473
00:33:25,145 --> 00:33:26,705
HRS has to be more brave.
474
00:33:26,765 --> 00:33:30,935
They have to believe of what they
bring to the table and that they
475
00:33:30,935 --> 00:33:32,795
are many times the whole table.
476
00:33:32,795 --> 00:33:37,325
And they can really support
every aspect of organization.
477
00:33:38,090 --> 00:33:43,470
And management board has to understand
that they really need that second opinion.
478
00:33:43,470 --> 00:33:46,430
And your HR will protect you.
479
00:33:46,430 --> 00:33:48,230
It's like we protect everybody.
480
00:33:48,650 --> 00:33:50,240
We, are always in the middle.
481
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:55,620
And HR is probably this one
professional, which looks super
482
00:33:55,620 --> 00:33:58,740
easy and it's such a mistake.
483
00:33:59,460 --> 00:34:04,600
It's just such a wrong statement
because our job every day is different.
484
00:34:04,810 --> 00:34:07,330
We are fighting with change every day.
485
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:12,909
We can plan the entire week and
it'll never really be like that.
486
00:34:13,690 --> 00:34:19,489
We adapt extremely quickly and we
deal with whatever comes because our.
487
00:34:20,190 --> 00:34:22,770
Product, if you want to name it that way.
488
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:28,600
Is a person, who every day wakes
up and can change mind every day,
489
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:33,580
can walk up in a different mood
day, can make a different decision.
490
00:34:33,580 --> 00:34:40,510
And we have to deal with every situation
with the high to the highest extent.
491
00:34:41,380 --> 00:34:47,530
We have to very careful of how we
speak, what we say how we even interact.
492
00:34:47,530 --> 00:34:52,659
And we always have to make sure that
we protect everybody and at the same
493
00:34:52,659 --> 00:34:56,020
time make everybody feel heard seen.
494
00:34:56,199 --> 00:35:01,290
And really we just like I don't
think that we are really ir like
495
00:35:01,290 --> 00:35:04,500
replaceable even in the, organizations.
496
00:35:04,500 --> 00:35:11,790
And I want young professionals to
really understand that we did like
497
00:35:11,850 --> 00:35:14,550
your older colleagues that already.
498
00:35:15,250 --> 00:35:21,280
amount of work to change even
this perspective of hr not
499
00:35:21,430 --> 00:35:27,200
administrative function, not your
hiring, firing event kinda lady.
500
00:35:28,015 --> 00:35:28,025
But.
501
00:35:28,725 --> 00:35:33,525
A true advisor and strategic
business partner to the organization.
502
00:35:34,065 --> 00:35:35,745
This work already have been done.
503
00:35:35,745 --> 00:35:41,295
And and I think that it'll be following
only into the better direction.
504
00:35:41,685 --> 00:35:47,205
And but it'll happen only if
professionals in that division will
505
00:35:47,265 --> 00:35:53,275
be brave because we like our education
background even before we start
506
00:35:53,425 --> 00:35:57,235
working that field is really massive.
507
00:35:57,325 --> 00:36:04,615
And you just have to, you are very
you are skilled after the studies and
508
00:36:05,245 --> 00:36:10,705
you just have to be brave to use this
knowledge and put this on the real
509
00:36:10,915 --> 00:36:16,615
situations and always share your opinion
because like we also spoke, it's not
510
00:36:16,615 --> 00:36:23,165
necessarily that the decision makers
will follow your advice but you have to.
511
00:36:23,855 --> 00:36:25,295
Bring it as an option.
512
00:36:25,325 --> 00:36:30,365
You have to say your perspective and
the best is just to have option A,
513
00:36:30,365 --> 00:36:36,515
B, C, and even if they want to follow
with D, which you didn't propose you,
514
00:36:36,515 --> 00:36:40,535
really over looked through the issue.
515
00:36:40,565 --> 00:36:43,235
And every aspect from every angle.
516
00:36:43,335 --> 00:36:47,085
Thomas Kunjappu: That's great advice and
for, the future and we'll have to leave
517
00:36:47,085 --> 00:36:50,455
it there, Angelika . Thank you for this
conversation where we talked specifically
518
00:36:50,455 --> 00:36:55,505
about how organizations can go global and
what that means from an HR perspective.
519
00:36:55,505 --> 00:36:58,535
And you've done that over and
over again on the ground level.
520
00:36:58,955 --> 00:37:02,945
And you have this carry and
call to just be brave, right?
521
00:37:02,945 --> 00:37:07,395
Whether it means in terms of how
you're working with your executive
522
00:37:07,395 --> 00:37:11,115
team around the value that you can
bring in the HR function and that can
523
00:37:11,115 --> 00:37:12,765
help future-proof yourself, right?
524
00:37:12,765 --> 00:37:14,155
And the.
525
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:19,120
The kinds of things that you need to
do in opening up a new office or geo.
526
00:37:19,510 --> 00:37:26,680
It's probably even more scrappy and
more wide from a wide angle lens
527
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:30,280
beyond even what most HR professionals
are doing on a day-to-day basis.
528
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:32,650
'cause it's not just even
full lifecycle management.
529
00:37:32,650 --> 00:37:35,020
You're probably, to some degree
getting deeper into compliance,
530
00:37:35,020 --> 00:37:38,530
deeper into finance, construction
and facilities, right?
531
00:37:38,770 --> 00:37:40,270
Than other folks do.
532
00:37:40,270 --> 00:37:48,070
But that kind of mindset can where
you just chase the the, and to
533
00:37:48,370 --> 00:37:50,560
chase that the, problems, right?
534
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,230
And you're trying to solve whatever
comes your way on behalf of the
535
00:37:53,230 --> 00:37:55,570
organization is a great mindset.
536
00:37:55,900 --> 00:37:59,260
And for everyone out there who's
listening in and looking to future
537
00:37:59,260 --> 00:38:03,670
proof your own organizations especially
in this case as you're going global,
538
00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:08,353
I hope you got some value out of this
conversation with Angelika Iwanow-Jackson
539
00:38:09,063 --> 00:38:15,302
as I did and I wanna thank you again,
Angelika , and to everyone out there.
540
00:38:15,332 --> 00:38:17,762
Good luck as you future proof HR.
541
00:38:18,437 --> 00:38:18,677
Angelika: Yeah.
542
00:38:19,487 --> 00:38:20,057
Thank you.
543
00:38:20,057 --> 00:38:20,687
Thank you Thomas.
544
00:38:20,687 --> 00:38:26,627
And I will just add whoever out there
remember that when you seek perfection,
545
00:38:26,977 --> 00:38:29,437
somebody else is already doing it.
546
00:38:29,437 --> 00:38:34,477
So the longer you wait to, take
this opportunity to make this
547
00:38:34,477 --> 00:38:41,322
step somebody else already is
doing it with the best they can.
548
00:38:41,352 --> 00:38:44,122
But you don't need perfection.
549
00:38:44,122 --> 00:38:45,232
That's what I'm trying to say.
550
00:38:45,232 --> 00:38:46,392
It's just do it.
551
00:38:47,112 --> 00:38:54,022
It's just do it because a lot of ideas
dies in the suffer and a lot of ideas
552
00:38:54,982 --> 00:39:02,762
are being buried in the under like
just somewhere in our head instead
553
00:39:02,762 --> 00:39:04,592
of being just like brought to life.
554
00:39:05,492 --> 00:39:08,912
Be brave not only to HR,
but be brave everybody.
555
00:39:09,842 --> 00:39:10,452
Thomas Kunjappu: Wonderful.
556
00:39:11,402 --> 00:39:14,462
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us
on this episode of Future Proof HR.
557
00:39:14,702 --> 00:39:17,312
If you like the discussion, make
sure you leave us a five star
558
00:39:17,312 --> 00:39:20,192
review on the platform you're
listening to or watching us on.
559
00:39:20,612 --> 00:39:23,552
Or share this with a friend or colleague
who may find value in the message.
560
00:39:23,852 --> 00:39:28,802
See you next time as we keep our pulse on
how we can all thrive in the age of AI.
