In this episode, we explore the unique culture at Phoenix Children’s, a leading pediatric health system, where employees are driven by a sense of purpose and mission to provide the best pediatric healthcare in the Southwest.

Kety Duron, Chief Human Resources Officer, has over 30 years of experience in healthcare and she is passionate about nurturing the compassionate and collaborative culture at Phoenix Children’s.

She shares practical strategies for preventing burnout and reducing turnover, training and supporting leaders to embody expertise and empathy, and the importance of teaching and modeling “inclusive behaviors.”

She also emphasizes the need to reach back to high school and middle school to inspire and develop tomorrow’s talent today.

Throughout the conversation, Kety emphasizes the power of human connection and the importance of caring for the caregivers in pediatric healthcare.

You can read the full transcript of this conversation on our website.

Learn more about avad3 in Episode 5: “Building a People-Centered Production Company”

Featured In This Episode

Kety Duron is Chief Human Resources Officer at Phoenix Children’s. She oversees talent acquisition and management, workforce engagement, leadership development and organizational transformation as Phoenix Children’s continues to expand its sites of service and workforce statewide. An accomplished healthcare leader, Kety most recently held the same role for City of Hope, a not-for-profit comprehensive clinical research cancer center, hospital and graduate school. She oversaw HR strategy for more than 7,000 employees and launched numerous impactful programs and initiatives designed to maximize recruitment, retention and engagement. Prior to City of Hope, Duron was Vice President of Human Resources at Stanford Health Care and held various leadership roles in Human Resources at UCLA Health for over 25 years.

Cameron Magee is the owner of avad3 Event Production, a full-service provider of audio, video, lighting, staging, set design, and streaming services for in-person, virtual, or hybrid events. Cameron founded the company in 2011 in his college dorm room. He now leads a team of over 50 hard-working professionals that design and deliver flawless event production for clients nationwide. Cameron believes that character is as important as competence. He’s committed to building a people-centered production company that brings listening, empathy, and integrity to every client engagement, along with world-class technical expertise and seamless execution.

Jessica Kloosterman is Sales Director at avad3 Event Production. She is an ambassador for avad3’s culture of excellence and service, connecting clients with avad3’s production team and helping bring their vision to life. Prior to joining avad3, she worked in sports coaching and operations.

Adrian McIntyre, PhD is a cultural anthropologist, media personality, and internationally recognized authority on communication and human connection. He delivers engaging keynote speeches and experiential culture-shift programs that train executives, managers, and teams to communicate more effectively and connect on a deeper level by asking better questions and telling better stories.

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From avad3 Event Production, this is Culture Amplified. Compassion, collaboration, and human connection. Nowhere are these values more vital than in pediatric healthcare. Phoenix Children’s strives to be the leading pediatric health system in the Southwest, and also the best place to work in the Valley of the Sun.

In this episode ... How should we care for the caregivers? What are some practical ways to prevent burnout and reduce turnover? How can you train and support leaders so they embody both expertise and empathy? What are “inclusive behaviors” and why are they so important for leaders to learn and model for others? And why should future-focused people leaders be reaching back to high school or even middle school to help inspire and develop tomorrow’s talent today? All this and more, coming up.

Welcome to Culture Amplified. I’m Adrian McIntyre. We’re joined for this conversation by Cameron McGee, owner of avad3 Event Production. Welcome, Cameron.

Glad to be here.

Jessica Klosterman is Director of Sales for avad3. Hi, Jessica.

Hello.

And our distinguished guest for this episode is Kety Duron, Chief Human Resources Officer for Phoenix Children’s. Kety, welcome.

Thank you.

I’m so excited that you’re here because I, as someone who lives here in the Valley in Arizona, have heard rumors that the culture at Phoenix Children’s is unique, is special, that there’s a secret sauce, that you’re doing things differently. If you were to describe that difference to somebody who was not familiar with Phoenix Children’s, what would you say is different about the culture, about the people?

Adrian, I would tell you, I grew up in healthcare. I started in adult care in Southern California. I spent more than 30 years, and I moved to specialty care at City of Hope, where I discovered how special it is. It’s very different when you’re in specialty care, in cancer care. And now I’m at a children’s hospital, Phoenix Children’s. For me, the culture is that of compassion, of collaboration, that of, I think, passion. People love what they do. People are there for a purpose, a mission. And I always tell people when I interview them, you can’t walk the hallways of Phoenix Children’s and not fall in love with the place. And it’s the families, it’s the children you see. And the patients are actually, when you get the look from the patient, you know that you’re there for them. So it’s an incredible experience.

It strikes me as such a potent and compelling slice of the human experience. I mean, nobody is there because they want to be. Your patients and their families are often dealing with some of the most challenging things that they’ve faced. Your staff, your providers at every level are there because they’re up for that challenge and they want to meet it with grace, with excellence, etc. But this is not always the norm. The healthcare industry in general is one where some environments struggle with culture, with those intangible qualities that you’ve just described. I’m curious, what sorts of practices, what sorts of actual things do you and your folks do that makes that difference real, not just something you talk about?

So, again, pediatric care, children’s hospitals, are different because people are there for that purpose, for that mission, for that vision. And it’s no different at Phoenix Children’s. As a matter of fact, I think we’re unique in the sense that for me, when I joined Phoenix Children’s, I felt that we needed to support our leaders. We needed to support our employees in every step of the way. And we started—just like everyone, not just healthcare—we’ve all experienced high turnover in the last four years, post-pandemic. During the pandemic, we’ve seen our talent world change dramatically. So now we came back and we’re all looking at what can we do differently? People are here because they want to be here. How do we make the experience a great experience?

We’re constantly measuring our turnover, our engagement, our patient experience. And those are things that you can look at if you’re actually trying to select, where am I going to take my child? What hospital? So we want to make sure that we’re not only ranked high, but they are real, because you’re going to feel that experience when you’re in the hospital. So starting with our pre-boarding, the first thing we need to do. And Phoenix Children’s has been growing by leaps and bounds in the last five years, I would say. If you’re an original Phoenician, Phoenix Children’s has grown by 50% in the last five years to retain that culture. Every time a new person comes in, they bring their culture with them, right? So we want to make sure that we teach them the Phoenix Children’s way. And that’s about our mission, our vision, our values, our ways of working. And we’re starting from the beginning, attracting and selecting the right talent. And how do we pre-board them? How do we onboard them?

One of the biggest turnover trends you see in the industry today, and I think everywhere in the talent world is first year turnover is very high. So that was something we focused on. And then as we move forward, we want to focus on developing people, on making sure people feel like there is a career path for them as they join us, and that we provide programs. We have our wellness programs were ranked some number one, actually in 20 22 by Phoenix Business Journal. They continue to be a scored really high because we bring services to our employees right onsite. We know you’re working from Monday through Friday. Sometimes odd shifts, right? Night shift, evening shift. Let’s bring the services to you. So we have Eyes On Site to check your eyes. We have SkinIO, which is skin screening, right? So things like that, we’re making it easier for you as an employee. If you were a new hire, you would hear me in orientation: “Don’t miss our cafeteria. I think we have an amazing cafeteria.” So I think when you walk, again, our campus, first of all, it’s an incredible campus. It’s a beautiful campus. But we also provide all of these services along with those intangibles, right? Career development. We have a rewards and recognition program for our employees. And we’re just beginning our spring training for leaders.

That’s something that’s also now one of the trends in human resources. How do we train leaders? We’ve left our leaders without any support in the last four years. We onboarded them and we let them do what they needed to do, but we haven’t supported them in the way that they knew. They can have the tools. They can have a toolbox from an HR perspective.

I mean, this is such a common story in so many places because the focus is often on hiring. And of course, that’s critical, right? But then what happens next? Not just the onboarding, but the care for the team, the care for the staff, the care for the physicians, the care for the leaders. And I don’t think it’s commonly realized, aside from some stereotypical sorts of ideas or portrayals, just how serious the issue of caring for the caregivers really is. You know, I used to work in international humanitarian relief where the environments were difficult, often dangerous, working in a war zone, for example. We can pay lip service to things like putting our own mask on first, but how you do that and still keep functioning when you need to get the most from your people, but you can’t ask so much. And we have in the past demanded, I think, almost unreasonable, inhuman performance from physicians, from nurses, from other core players on a healthcare team. So how do you turn that in the direction of what you’re talking about, where well-being is at the center, where people find joy and respect as the norm in their workplace?

One of the things I’m thinking of, Adrian, and maybe that’s my own, where I am, the space I’m in, next week is Health Care Human Resources Week. And our theme is the irreplaceable human connection. And actually, I think it hits home because it underlines how much we need to retain that human connection and constantly amplify it. So in everything we do, I think it’s the empathy we show. In everything we do, we connect with our leaders. As we connect with our, when we invite our leaders through our spring training, the things we’re going to talk about this year are very specific to change management. How are we going to… Phoenix Children’s is about to expand. Two new buildings are coming up. Two new hospitals. So in the face of that change, what do you need as one of our leaders? And how are you going to support your own employees? Some of the things we talk about, again, is trainings on onboarding for success, which I’ve already talked about. We’ll talk about our compensation philosophy. People that are employees these days are asking about, right? They want to know, so what’s the philosophy? How do you do this? We hear those questions.

And for me, it’s being transparent, having the conversation, listening to our employees. And our employee engagement survey last year showed us some of these things that we need to keep focusing on. And that’s why we bring them back in our training. We’re going to be closing those sessions. We will begin with our CEO, but we’ll close them with, “What are you doing for yourself as a leader? How are you stepping back, taking care of yourselves?” Because if we don’t model the way, which is we need to take that time off sometimes so that others can see us. I think what we do, what we don’t do well is we as leaders never take the time off. So our own staff feel like they can never do that, right? So it’s how do we model the way and lead from the heart? So I think that for me is really, really important. And that’s something we bring to the organization.

I’m just struck by the challenge of this because the realities of the work itself have never been more demanding. The time available to spend with patients, the way in which electronic medical records require a different form of information gathering than was sort of traditional in, you know, some imaginary 19th century past, right? Where you could spend 35 minutes taking case histories and things. The empathy in action when time is short, resources are not unlimited, and yet you’re trying to make sure that that irreplaceable human connection is at the center of it. How do you actually do that? How do you help your team members to do that?

I will say our team members are there because of the passion they have for what they do. So I do think it’s not allowing people to fall into that trap of constantly thinking about that, you know, burnout of constantly by offering the different services, by offering that support. So I really do think the reality is the work is there. The reality is we will never turn away from the work. Our patients need us, the families. And I think in pediatric care, you’re not just caring about the patient, you’re caring about the family. That’s our first value. We talk about how family-centered care is so, so important. And then we talk about innovation. We talk about accountability, about our teamwork. But I would tell you, people are there because they have passion for what they do, and they’re there for the right reasons. And for me, it’s how do we always make that connection to know that they have the support they need from us.

Jessica, you are a parent of a child who has needed specialty care. You’ve spent a lot of time in the pediatric environments that we’re talking about. How does this conversation land for you? What thoughts, what questions? You have a personal experience here. I think we would be remiss not to ask you about that.

Yeah, it evokes a lot of emotion for me, both on a personal level and on a professional level, because I got connected to avad3 because of the passion that the people had for the execution of their job. So the passion that people have in health care, the passion that our team has to serve our clients for events, and they’re different, but the passion, the fire and the passion behind it is really similar. And yes, I spent, my youngest, we spent three weeks in a children’s unit and after he was born and have spent multiple doctor’s appointments, we were at a children’s hospital earlier this week. It’s obvious when the entity invests in the culture and invests in the intentionality of valuing their people, giving them the tools that they need to equip them to level up, giving them the tools that they need to lean into when they’re burnout, giving them the attention, the connection that you talked about when they need it. We all need that human connection. We’ve talked a lot about community on this whole series. And we desire that at the core of who we are, we want to feel valued and we want to connect with one another.

And so in a specialty service like a children’s hospital, I love what you said about we don’t just serve the patient, we’re serving the family. And I felt that. I have lived that. And I will be in that probably for a long part of my life. And I’m appreciative of when teams invest in their people because then it’s such a snowball. It is such an exponential impact on who you’re touching. You think you’re just touching the family, but you’re not. You’re touching their other family members and their friends because they get to go and talk about their experience. And that’s all part of the connection. It’s the same thing with events. We get to be in front of people and our people care so much about what they do. They’re so passionate about serving one another. It’s just that snowball. And it’s so fun to see people in a profession that love what they do, but ultimately that their team is taking care of them. They’re providing that connection for one another. That’s, it’s just, it’s unique and it’s really fun to hear.

Kety, one of the things we’ve asked leaders over the course of this series is to share with us some of the moments over the course of their career that helped shape the way they lead now. Because none of us started out thinking about these issues in quite the same way as we do today. Some of the things that have shaped our point of view were positive experiences. We’ve heard about key mentors or key moments when things, kind of light bulbs went off or people had insights that changed the way they now lead their teams. We’ve also heard about moments of conflict or struggle where they realize, I never want to end up in a situation like that again. I’m going to make sure we do things differently in the future. Can you think of any of those kind of turning points in your own career? Is there anything you could share with us that has helped to shape the way you now lead?

Sure. I’m going to go all the way back to when I started my career. I joined UCLA Health, which back in the day was UCLA Hospital, much smaller than what it is today, just as a part-time position, thinking that I was going back to school. I was a physics major from the University of Athens in Greece. And within the first two months, the CHRO came to me and said to me, schedule a meeting. Let’s talk a little bit about you, about your career. And I thought, I must be in trouble. This must be, you know, I’m in HR and now the boss is calling me in. So when I met with the CHRO, the first thing I talked about was I’m studying for my, to get ready for my GRE because I’m going to go back for my Master’s and I will return back to Greece to teach.

And Marilyn, at that point, that’s her name, said to me, “You know what? I think you’re very much a people person. What if we did turn that into an MBA and you stay with us and you grow with us?” I have to tell you, that lifted a weight off my shoulders because it was really hard to go get that GRE. And it changed my career forever. So right out of college, someone talked to me about my career. And I believe in mentorship very much as we bring in new employees in human resources. I always say, “Tell me about you. What do you want to be one day? And it’s okay if you want to be in my role, right?” So we talk about that and people will laugh and we will talk about, well, how are we going to get there? So I think the power of mentorship is so, so important. And that’s one of the things I missed when I wasn’t on site. I think it’s important for us to connect with people. You talk about events. That’s creating space for those individual connections is so important. And for leaders, I think, to make the time to speak with their employees and talk about, so where are you going next? And I always tell people, it’s fine because you can learn and promote from here. But that’s kind of how I started my own career and stayed in health care ever since. Started in health care.

Yeah, I love the uncommon juxtapositions and things like a physics degree that leads to a people leadership role is to me, it just speaks to what’s amazing about humanity in general.

Cameron, you started your company because you wanted a place to work. As you’ve said in other episodes, there wasn’t anything like this. You wanted to do production. Over the years this has evolved into something that, I don’t know if you would say it this way, but as I’ve gotten to know you over the course of this series I would say. You are an ambassador for culture. You’re not just doing the technical things, although you do that and you do it well. You’re serving big clients on their biggest day of the year.

But what has emerged and why this series was something you decided you wanted to do is that you got to help them drive the impact that their leadership wanted. You got to create an experience, as Kety said, that actual human component, the connection, and you get to do it in the room and you do it with lighting and sound and video and all the wonderful technical things. But as you’ve heard folks from all these different organizations speaking about their commitments, is this changing the way you think about events? I know you came into this with a very solid grounding in it, and you’ve certainly served the kind of clients who demand that from you. Are you learning or thinking differently now that we’ve done these conversations?

I would say what I’ve seen in events has changed as I’ve matured as an individual. You know, when I was 17 or 18, 19, whenever I started the company in my dorm room, I saw events as a way that I got to geek out. I saw events as a way that I got to do a craft that I love. I want to run the sound. I want to set up the projector. I know that’s silly that that’s my passion, but I just love audiovisual. But as I’ve matured, I’ve started to see events for, I think, the way that a lot of us see them is they’re very special. They’re a very unique moment. Even this room we’re sitting in with just less than 10 people right now, just this small room, this is an event. This is an event on our calendar today, and it’s categorized simply as humans connecting. And I also mirror what you said about, you know, during the pandemic, we had to take a break from that. The pandemic was hard on everybody. It was hard on businesses. It was hard on us. We didn’t do any events for months. Of course, we couldn’t. But I think what I learned from events in the pandemic was these are essential. They’re essential because we’re human beings, and human beings have to connect. And so we’ve gotten to hear from so many different companies that are so large. It’s such an honor to be in the room with you and the other guests we’ve had. But I think we all understand the importance of events and how they’re really allowing us to be human. And you just can’t, you can’t do this on an email chain. You can’t do this on a Zoom call. It takes getting in the room.

Kety, this prompts me to think about something you might have some insight into, which is the larger the organization, the more important the small moments, the small interactions, the moments that matter, right? The one-on-one conversation, some of which you’ve spoken to, but the interactions people have with their team, with their manager, with their department head, with leadership. That’s the fabric of culture. It’s conversations, it’s interactions, it’s that kind of thing. What are some of those moments? What are some of the opportunities in the actual everyday life of a complex healthcare system where people get to create that meaning together, get to have those experiences together?

Well, it’s that being on site for me today in a health system, I think it’s being right there with the employees, it’s doing the rounds, because we do a lot of that. Today, our chief nursing executive was doing rounds to all of the nursing floors with some of the goodies, going around and talking to people. It’s that opportunity to speak to employees at different levels, even if they don’t have a relationship with you and asking them about their day, what’s going on, what can we do differently? I think that I’ve learned so much from doing rounds and asking people, “I’m from HR, what can we do differently?” And you hear a lot, a host of new things. And you think, I asked for that. So that’s kind of, but I think it’s from the just individual connections to I do believe in the big events, to coming together, to the roundtables where in between sessions, you get to chit chat with others. And you, while you get business done, you talk about your family. You talk about, again, what do you plan to do, you know, for the future? What is your son doing? What is your daughter? So I think those connections bring you closer to people, and that’s where that trust is developed, that, I think, connection where you can collaborate, you can reach out to people. Some of the best connections I’ve made were through leadership cohorts, right? I knew to reach out to people I wouldn’t have met unless if I went through a program with them.

So I think it’s the getting out to get some lunch, going to the cafeteria and talking to people, because I am definitely the person that would wave, that would talk to people to, you know, having the big sessions. We brought our new hire orientations back on site when I arrived back to Phoenix Children’s. And for me, it’s such an amazing connection, just coming in, talking to people, asking them where did they come from? How was the weather before, you know, in Chicago when they got on the plane and, you know, telling them about the great weather now and how summer is going to be a little bit warmer. But I think people will say in the hallway, “you did my orientation. Hi.” So I think it’s being intentional. That was the word you used that I love. You have to be intentional in connecting with people. I think the pandemic was really hard on our, I want to say our Millennials and Gen Z-ers because they hadn’t had that experience. So bringing them back today is just so impactful.

One of the things Adrian was saying, you know, we sponsor this because we want to get to hear from others who are such a different scale, so large and so inspiring. But it’s because we’ve scaled a lot and had to grow a lot coming out of the pandemic. One of the things that I was excited to hear from you all specifically on this episode was, and you said it earlier, your people are driven by passion and purpose. And so what I want to, it’s a tough question, but I want us to discuss it in here. How do you care for people when they truly are passionate and have a lot of purpose in their work? How do you act as a caretaker for people who want to be at work? They want to be serving because our industry, just like yours, they’re so different. Children’s health care and audiovisual for events, but the technicians at the shows, they want to be at the shows. When we’re on a three, four-day conference that had a two- or three-day setup and a two- or three-day strike plus travel, they love it. That’s exactly where they want to be. But I’m tasked with caring for them and caring for their families and caring for their life outside of work. How do you do that at a children’s hospital when the physicians, everyone, we always think of the physicians, but everyone. They want to be there. They want to serve, but our lives are so much bigger than work. So how do you care for people when they’re trying to maybe work more or they’re trying to be there? How do you do that? Because you want their work to be sustainable?

I have a lot of thoughts about that.

It’s a big question.

Yeah, I was first thinking about you, right? How do you do that? And I think it’s by being flexible, by allowing them to do what they need to do when they need that flexibility, right? It’s, we were talking, my son just sprained his ankle, right? It’s like, how do you make sure that he is taken care of while he’s doing his work, right? So I think it’s ... stay connected with people. I think knowing about their families, you don’t want to be nosy, but you want to be there when they’re going to need you. And not everyone will share, right? We have the people that don’t necessarily talk about themselves, but they’re the people that will share. And then I think people, when they’re down on themselves or when they’re in need, they will respond to a friendly voice, to someone who’s willing to listen, and someone who does it with empathy and compassion. I had a meeting this morning with one of our leaders, and we talked about that. You have the different types of employees, and I always say, that’s human behavior. Everybody comes in with their own ways of talking, right? So there’ll be the introverts, the extroverts, the people that will talk a lot, but we need them all because they make, that’s what makes our culture. So how do you continue to have that dialogue, even bringing people out? It’s important to me that we do that. And that’s the only way, but I think flexibility, empowering people to do what they do well and giving them that, I think empowering is really important so that they feel like they own something. But those are the things that come to mind. Yeah.

Yeah. I love that. Cameron has a saying, I think you said this on like my first or second day when I started, anything is permissible as long as expectations are set.

Yes.

And it allows appropriate boundaries for expectations. And then to know, like, these are my parameters, but then there’s lots of mobility in between on how we execute on that and lots of freedom. And we trust the people that we hire to do their job with meeting expectations. And I also, I really like what you said about the intentionality piece of it and making sure that like you’re going out of your way to make that connection. And by leading by example. We’ve got fantastic leadership at avad3. And you mentioned something about making sure we take the time off and we take care of ourselves. And we show that to our employees by doing the same thing. And Cameron says, how do I take care of my people who want to be on site 10 days a week and work, you know, 14 hour shifts? And he would do the same thing. But he has learned over the course of his career to set those appropriate boundaries, set those expectations and have that mobility in between to execute. And I think he does a great job of leading by example. So I love to hear that. That’s something that you guys are working on, too. That’s cool.

Yeah, that’s great. I think that trust, you also brought up trust, trusting people and then trusting people when they are late and they were late for a reason, right? I think is that when someone walked in late or whatever, I trust that there must have been a good reason for that, right? As long as they are not doing it every time, right? So I think that’s part of empowering them to own their own time, their own calendar. So, I think that’s really, really important.

You’ve mentioned several different types of diversity. And of course, there are so many now, right? It’s not just the physical and obvious visible differences. It’s the cognitive diversity, different ways of thinking and acting, into neurodivergence, different ways of actually being in the world and perceiving the world. There are so many different ways in which organizations are now trying to do the right thing about the way the world always was, but the workplace didn’t reflect that. We’re now trying to navigate through difficult and challenging issues outside our walls because of course the people who come to work every day come from those environments. And whether it’s talked about or not talked about, who’s at work is a product of the family situation, the neighborhood situation, the group dynamics, the national origins, the religious difference, all the things.

It’s very easy to be trite about diversity, equity, inclusion, belonging, and all the words that we like to say, but these are big, big issues that really matter. How do you think about that now? Or what’s emerging as some of the ways in which you’re embracing the diversity, which is a reality, and trying to get to the equity and inclusion, which takes action.

I think part of it is training our leaders on how do they recognize those things and how do they invite in diverse opinions. I think part of what we talk about when we talk about teamwork is that everybody’s opinion matters. And we know that people at different levels will bring a different perspective. They say a leader’s Achilles heel is actually their implicit biases. And I learned through the years that we all come with those. So I think it’s really, really important. One of the things we will be rolling out is how do you lead? What are inclusive behaviors? And I think it’s calling people out, inviting people, meaning inviting people to share their thoughts, their ideas. as it’s when you’re sitting in a meeting and someone is so quiet. Tell me what you’re thinking. I think they can add so much to the conversation, but also bring that engagement at the next level by inviting them in. So we do, this is something that we’re planning to teach as well very soon, to our leaders is kind of what are those inclusive behaviors. From the beginning, from the interview, all the way through that threat, that workforce journey. So, I think that’s been really important for us at Phoenix Children’s.

When we think about what sometimes is called talent pipeline issues—which is where folks are coming from and how you attract them etc.—there’s also such a diversity of background competencies in these core areas that you’re pointing to. So many people were never taught or shown empathy. People’s family environments, some of them were very connected and engaged and modeled what it means to listen intently. And others had a very different and perhaps even horrifying experience at home. So you have folks coming in with a variety of training, a variety of expertise, some of which at the highest level possible, right? In specializations, in areas of health and healthcare that are just so incredibly difficult to master. This is also difficult to master, the so-called soft skills, which it’s the wrong word. We should stop calling it that. Maybe we have stopped calling it that. These core skills, these fundamental human abilities, listening, empathy, et cetera. Is there a curriculum for that? How do you provide the gap fill for the people who don’t have it? Get us into the world of the learning and development.

Sure, sure. And I think there is a session specific to how do you lead with empathy? What are those actual characteristics of a training like that? So we do teach that. We’re actually bringing it back as well here at Phoenix Children’s. It’s about listening again. It’s about, you know, how do you listen? How do you respond to an employee? And how do you invite them in? How do you bring out the best in them? So part of it is, I think Jessica brought it up before, is set the expectations. People come in and they don’t know what it is that you want them to do. So as a leader, I think we’re failing if we don’t set the expectations from the get-go, reinforce that expectation throughout their journey. We talk about continuous conversations. It’s not just your annual performance evaluation, right? is that continuous conversation. And I do know that our new generations want to hear about that. Please correct me. Please set me on the right path. But also I think as leaders, we need to remove the obstacles. I think our people are looking at us as, what are you going to do for me? Because I’m trying, and every step of the way, everywhere I look, there is just another obstacle. So we owe it to our employees, to our people, actually to our talent, to remove obstacles and allow them to do their best work. But by setting that expectation and being intentional.

I was going to touch on one more thing, Adrian, because you started talking about we have so many people coming from diverse backgrounds. The one thing we’re also focusing on to develop that talent pipeline is, I think we need to educate our high schoolers. We need to educate our college students. Do you know that if you actually come for a career as a surgical tech in health care, we can help you. We can pay for part of your education. And this is, by the way, the salary you’re going to make right out of school, right out of 12 months in college, right? It’s not even more than that. So, I think something we’re really focusing on as we develop the talent pipeline is to educate our youth. Because I think we’ve, again, the last four years, there’s been a gap. And we need to bring them on board. And part of it is we own.

Yeah, there’s a conversation in sort of the intersection between academia—including K-12 and then university and college—and then workforce development. There’s an idea called linked learning, which is about reaching back much further than before. You’ll appreciate this, actually. A few years ago, I was in Los Angeles. I was attending a session of the American Association of Colleges & Universities, and it was up specifically about this context. So there were folks from the LA Chamber of Commerce and a number of large companies in the area, and then there was a lot of folks from Centers for Teaching and Learning at colleges and universities.

And I’ll never forget, the chairman of the LA Chamber of Commerce got up and he said, “Listen, I’m happy to be here. Thanks for inviting me. You also invited me last year and the year before, and I’m grateful. I appreciate it. And I have to tell you that my message hasn’t changed. What we need from you actually hasn’t changed. We need you to find ways to include empathy, creativity, compassion, et cetera, in the curriculum. Of course, our companies, our members need hard skills. Of course, they need technical competence. Of course, they need all of these things. But we’re going to keep telling you until you figure it out that we also need this other stuff. And we need you to be telling their high schools what you expect from them as they deliver students to your doors for community college or four-year university degree. And we need the high schools to be telling their elementary schools what we need from them. We need to change the whole thing. And I’ll just keep coming back and saying this until you finally figure it out.” He wasn’t being rude, but he was being very direct. I’ve said this before, and I’ll keep saying it. So I agree with you that this idea that we must somehow reach back to a much earlier point in time. I’m not exactly sure how we do it, but I like the challenge.

Well, and I think it’s reaching out to high schools and offering maybe a day at Phoenix Children’s, right? And they walk with us and we spend the day. Someone will need to be dedicated to walk with them down in the OR or in the different areas. And we do a lot with the universities, but my challenge is how do we reach out now to high schools? High schools and middle schools even. So I think there is a lot we could be doing.

A lot of our conferences that we do are for adults, certainly. There’s not many conferences for children. Usually it’s adults, but we get to do a conference next week and it’s specifically for children. They’re usually around fifth grade, 12 or so. It’s 3,000 of them in this big arena and they’re getting together to celebrate kind of the culmination of their year they’ve been working on. And we realized years ago, this is our future teammates, these students. We’re there running the sound and running the lights and stuff. But it’s kind of a, I’ll say this word because I would call myself a nerd or a geek. It’s a geeky conference. It’s a nerdy conference. These are technical boys and girls. And we realized it. And we asked, we said, “Hey, we’re nobody, we’re just the production company. But could you announce at the close of one of the general sessions that if anybody wants to see backstage, they could just meet us down front, because we would love to just do a little tour.”

And kids came out of the woodwork. And now we lead a breakout at that conference, and I’m going next week. And our company has grown so much, and we did over 200 events last year, so I personally do not get to see as many events as I would like to, as I used to. But I’m not allowed to miss that one now. And I’m flying down just to that one, just for the day, basically, because they said, “Now, you’re still going to do the breakout, right? You’re still going to do the behind-the-scenes tour? Because we’ve already got students asking about it and we’re not even there yet.” And it’s such a small investment. It’s 45 minutes of my time. It’s a short Cessna flight. I like to fly little Cessna airplanes. It’s a short Cessna flight. It’s 45 minutes, but it’s a long-term investment.

These kids are 12. But there are jobs in our industry for when you turn 18. You don’t have to be 28 with a massive degree anymore to get some of these jobs. You can be 18 and get started. And I want to inspire those children at a young age to see what we’re doing back here. They get to see policemen and astronauts. And I’ve got a four and five-year-old, and they want to be a policeman, and they have these kind of classic careers. But show them what an x-ray tech is. Show them, my wife’s an ER nurse. Like, there’s so many jobs at the hospital that don’t have to be the doctor and the BSNs, you know? And I just get inspired thinking about showing the next generation that they don’t have to wait. They can get started thinking about those other things. But we all have to think that way. And for years, I didn’t think that way. I’m not saying this to toot my own horn that I had this great idea. It was just an accident. But it makes me want to get, how many other youth conferences can we get? How many other moments can we get in front of youth to say, think about a career in production. It’s been great for me. It’s been great for our 50 people that we’ve changed their lives through what we do. But we have to realize that we need to be speaking to them very young before they decide, they’re 18 and they’ve picked their major. We need to be speaking to them extremely young.

Kety, as we wrap up this conversation, I want to give you the last word. As you look forward to the future, what are some of the things that you’re excited about that are keeping the fire and the passion and the sense of meaning and purpose in your own life alive with regard to your work at Phoenix Children’s? What would you leave us with as the inspiration that’s on the horizon?

Well, I think the growth at Phoenix Children’s for me keeps me definitely very excited, very passionate. And just the fact that when we opened our Avondale emergency department, we were able to staff it on the first day. When we did the ribbon cutting, I was sitting surrounded by all these people that talked about they were so excited about us being there. And I was thinking, and we’re fully staffed. We’re able to open today. So to me, in a market that everybody talks about, it’s so hard to recruit. There are talent shortages. It’s true there are. But there is a very good reason for people to join us at Phoenix Children’s. And for me, I want us to be the best place to work in the Valley. I love what I do. I’m excited about our future. We have a very bright future.

Kety Duron is Chief Human Resources Officer for Phoenix Children’s. Thank you so much for joining us for this conversation.

Thank you for inviting me. Thank you.

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