Average new car prices hit $50,000 for the first time in December. What is driving up prices? Is technology to blame?

Our guest this week is David Fradin, author and technology professional. Trained at HP, he has been involved in numerous exciting projects, including the Apple /// (Apple 3). David gives us a unique look and perspective at Spice Catalyst (spicecatalyst.com).

William Sikkens, Bill Snodgrass, Gretchen Winkler

Welcome to

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User Friendly 2.0 with host Bill Sikkens,

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technology architect.

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And this is User Friendly 2.0.

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Welcome to this week's show.

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Joining me Gretchen and Bill. Welcome.

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Hello there. You.

8

So I'm feeling irrational today.

9

And we'll talk about that in the news.

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We have more than normal for

you know, all the comments.

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I'm going to get back on that

because I just stuck my foot in my mouth.

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But, hey,

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hey, you do that all the time.

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You're used to it.

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I get nothing,

nothing out of the woods there.

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Not to change the topic or anything,

but let's jump into the news.

17

All right.

18

Well, apparently today is irrational.

19

Yeah.

20

So today is National Pie Day,

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March 14th or 3.14.

22

And, for anybody that doesn't know,

this is a mathematical thing that has

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to do with circles, circle diameters

and so on.

24

Something

that we've probably all seen in school,

25

but a lot of us kind of went, what?

26

This doesn't make any sense.

And there you are.

27

So the geeks in the world can read

pi out to certain lines.

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3.414157, blah, blah, blah. And,

29

this is

something that has actually been used

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in mathematics for a very long time

for computing everything from the like.

31

I say, the diameter of a circle

to the diameter of a planet and beyond.

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So the number is considered

to be irrational

33

because of the fact that 3.14, etc., etc.

34

just keeps going and going and going. Yep.

35

Wasn't there something about how far

36

you really needed to go?

37

Yeah.

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I mean, you know, but the thing of it is,

is if we want to dive into those details,

39

engineers and scientists kind of argue

40

about this all the time and, okay,

41

so we'd be stirring

the pot, you'd be stirring the pot.

42

Because the thing of it is, is

there is a point.

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Okay.

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And the 10,000ft view explanation on that,

there is a point where if we go out

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any further, it's

not really going to matter,

46

because it's not going to change anything,

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except that keeps changing as we start

measuring smaller and smaller things.

48

And when you start getting into things

like quantum physics

49

and those type of computations,

which quantum foam is very small,

50

all of a sudden

going out further does make a difference.

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Yeah,

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OpenAI anthropic feud could help Google.

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Yeah.

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So, you know, I'm

all about helping Google, right?

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So basically what's going on here is,

56

this is as it says,

a feud between these two AI organizations.

57

Although to my understanding, the actual

AIS are getting along just fine.

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So that's, you know, check their

social media and see if there's gossip.

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But at the end of the day,

when you have two companies going at it,

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and this is related to a number of things,

primarily the,

61

dropping of the government contracts,

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for use in war.

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And that's a whole nother story,

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which is out there

that we've talked about in the past.

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If you want to read more about it,

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check out a show

from a couple of weeks ago.

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But what happens is now

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we have a third party that's going, hey,

we're going to get along with everybody.

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And that's essentially

what's going on here.

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So like everything else with AI right now,

this is all stuff that's in flux

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and changing very quickly.

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And what is planned to happen today

may not be the case tomorrow.

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So it'll be interesting

to see where this goes.

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But yeah, it's, looking like this

could be a winner for Google.

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At the end of the day.

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All right.

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A 1,300 pound NASA satellite

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set to crash down to Earth today

after 14 years in space.

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Now, is it

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possible for me to have any influence

on where this crash is now?

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Because I couldn't think of it anyway.

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And neither here nor there.

83

So, yes.

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The Van

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and there's a B as well

that goes along with this,

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that had originally been projected

to come in back into,

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ground in the 2030s,

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the second one still being in that range

for the first one, because of the solar

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flares, a number of other things

that are going on has sped up its return.

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And demise.

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So it's expected to burn up as it reenters

the atmosphere.

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For the most part,

some components may survive reentry,

93

and you got to think about

what your luck is this week.

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There's a 1 in 4200 chance

that you might get hit by something.

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NASA,

however, said that that number is low.

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Okay.

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I have places where

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smartglasses like

meta Ray-Ban should never, ever be worn.

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Yeah, and this falls under kind of just,

you know,

100

being ethical and, considerate of people.

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This is the same kind of issue

that came up when smartphones came out,

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when you had cameras and things

where you wouldn't have otherwise.

103

A similar idea of a concern.

104

And what they're referring to here

is some of the new smart glasses.

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Although the meta glasses have been around

for a while, but some of the newer smart

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glasses

that that have the ability to record,

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video of motion video, as well as small

frame cameras or, pictures

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and that being said, there are some places

where it would be inappropriate

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to use these,

like the locker room at a gym.

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And I think some of this is very common

sense.

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Yeah.

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But, you know,

they put these things out there for that.

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Standardized testing is another one.

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They don't really want you taking pictures

of the test and post online.

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So everybody else can have it.

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What about if you're a Borg

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and can receive stuff, you know,

like data or something in the same way?

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Is that bad?

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Well, you're already strange

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then they can't handle it,

so don't even worry about it.

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Okay, so they won't won't be

another rabbit hole to go down someday.

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Probably. Yeah.

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Another one is hospitals.

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Now, this one actually is something

that I would think is also important

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to think about,

because patient privacy is important.

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And if you're taking photographs

inside a hospital

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or an urgent care or something,

that's that's not cool.

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Yeah.

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A women's dressing room, like in a store,

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you know, men's dressing rooms, any place

that's like the locker room.

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Room.

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Yeah.

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You know, just like places

you would, you know, look at it this way.

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If you have your, smartphone,

you wouldn't use your camera

135

in the smartphone in any of these places.

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But the difference here being

is that with the glasses,

137

people aren't as likely to notice

you using it.

138

But it's still the same basic thing.

139

What about the casinos?

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The casinos?

141

You know,

142

when when we first started the show,

one of the very first things I talked

143

about was Google Glass.

144

And at that time, Google

Glass was the very

145

first system like this

and had these capabilities.

146

And the casinos at that time were,

for lack of a better term, freaking out.

147

But also in those days

you had rules that you also couldn't use

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your mobile phone on most casino floors.

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Now fast forward to 2026.

150

A lot of that is lightened up,

but I have a funny

151

feeling that the security is trained

to watch for these things.

152

And if you do use it in a way

that you would be cheating

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just like anything else,

I would consider that an advisable

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and you know it's

what they might do about it.

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We'll watch some of the movies about,

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you know, Las Vegas

when it was run by the mob.

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And just consider that and ask yourself,

is it good that I use it here

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or if that might be the outcome?

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Yeah.

160

In all seriousness, it is a thing.

161

And on that line too is courts,

courtrooms.

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A lot of courts don't allow

recording devices in the courtroom.

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And here's a situation that if you do

get caught with something like that

164

and you're not supposed to have it,

you will probably get in trouble.

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And the other one that I thought

was kind of interesting, that came on

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this list of recommended places to avoid

this is cruise ships.

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Really. And yeah.

168

And you know, you think about that. Okay.

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Well, what is this?

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Well, again, it's a privacy thing.

171

People that are on the cruise

probably don't want the world

172

to know that they're there.

173

Now, if you are on a cruise ship

taking selfies or recording and streaming

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from your cell phone again,

that's pretty obvious.

175

If you turn on the

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camera on in your glasses again,

they might not know about it.

177

So I think the biggest thing here

is just again, it's etiquette.

178

In a lot of cases,

179

but in other places, like a courtroom

and stuff, it's potentially a criminal act

180

if you do things

you should never cheat and casino.

181

So obviously, if you use this

or any other device to cheat in a casino,

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that would be bad

and bad things would happen, right?

183

So it's the same type of thing there.

184

So it's just, you know, be thinking about

this kind of thing when you are dealing,

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you're out there dealing with these things

and more as this stuff

186

becomes more ubiquitous.

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So we're going to see this

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kind of technology

around more of these and more of an issue.

189

The other thing too, is to check out.

190

And again, I'm not an attorney, but just,

191

you know,

192

from the way that I read these things

here, like here in the state of Oregon,

193

there are rules where you cannot secretly

record people in public.

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That's another area that,

195

you would want to be aware of and don't

want to get yourself into trouble.

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Now, I've had glasses like this for a long

time.

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Mine are a little bit different

that I kind of programed on myself

198

and use them for other things,

but they are based on the metal glasses.

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I've had them for about four years now,

and some of the stuff

200

I do, especially on YouTube and things,

I will use it.

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The live stream is very handy

when you're walking around someplace

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you're supposed to.

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Instead of having to hold a camera

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on a mountain, all that kind of stuff,

you can just stream what you're saying.

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So there's a lot of advantages to this

and a lot of good uses for that.

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But again, like any new technology,

it's possible to use it the wrong way.

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And there are people that will use it

the wrong way.

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And as time goes by,

they will get a little more solidified.

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But again,

210

if you are in a place where you shouldn't

use the camera in your smartphone,

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it's probably obvious to not use

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another form of a camera, especially one

that people don't see in your glasses.

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All right.

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Faith war videos are a concern.

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Yeah.

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And this is this is interesting.

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So with what's going on in Iran,

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bringing this to the forefront of this,

of course, not being anything

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new, we've been having a problem with this

with Ukraine for a while,

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but they're saying that the Ukraine war

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is the first major AI information war.

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And this is one of the first wars

where generative

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AI and deepfakes are a central part

of the battlefield.

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And you're seeing it

not just with missiles and drones

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and so on, but also on social media

timelines and governments,

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activists, users and so on want to shape

the narrative using manipulated video.

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And it's very hard now to know what's real

and what isn't.

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So we are seeing AI generated

war footage flooding social media.

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So platforms like Facebook or TikTok

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and so on have been inundated with fake

AI generated

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this, videos of missile

strikes and destruction and so on.

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And some of the clips are really altered

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or show things

that never actually happened.

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Yeah.

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And I watched some of the comparisons

and it was like, whoa.

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But the ones that seem

really dramatic and over the top,

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more than

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likely that's a load of horse manure.

239

Yeah, yeah.

240

Well, like,

241

there was one photo that was released

that showed or purported to show a U.S.

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base before and after

that had been completely destroyed.

243

And you look at this and, you know, a

big part of the reason why they do

244

this is exaggerating success

and demoralizing your foe.

245

So getting these things out there

also pushing opinion for or against,

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you know, give a narrative for the war.

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You look at the pictures

and the one of everything being destroyed

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looks very real.

249

But if you look at them side by side,

you'll notice the cars in the parking lot

250

are the same cars in the same spots

between the two

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and some other things like that.

252

So it's clearly been,

253

you know, modified or fabricated even.

254

But again, at the end of the day,

most people don't do that.

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You're going through your feed

256

and see this stuff and it's like,

wow, that's you know, that's amazing.

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And that's where they want to go through.

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And the other one that I thought

was kind of interesting with this is video

259

game footage is being manipulated

and stuff.

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So your Call of Duty

is suddenly showing up on,

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you know, Facebook of

this is what happened wherever.

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And, I've been seeing a rash of videos

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where there's avalanches

and people are running

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and I'm looking at these going, okay, I,

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I think these are probably fake.

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Yeah.

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I've seen some things with pets

that I also suspect are very fake.

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So I, you know, when you watch these

things, take it with a grain of salt.

269

Now, I saw a rock video of Rammstein

being performed by cats.

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They were doing a very good job.

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There's no way that was AI generated.

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Oh, I think that was real.

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I see land in Florida for you. Yeah.

274

There you go. Yeah.

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You know,

276

one of the ones that, stands out from

this is something that recently happened

277

is a video of a naval battle

from a game called War Thunder.

278

Had something like 7 million views

before it was finally debunked.

279

And what's happening with that is,

in addition to it making a splash and,

280

you know, being clickbait

and things politicians and major accounts

281

are sharing these videos before realizing

they're fake.

282

So it gets even more, you know?

283

Yeah, yeah.

284

So and one of the other things,

old war footage

285

being recycled or changed a little bit,

but the thing of videos is where this gets

286

to be a little bit dangerous

or a lot dangerous

287

from the standpoint of state actors

that are actively pushing propaganda

288

and have the ability to sit down

and do the manipulation of these things to

289

a point where it becomes almost impossible

to tell that they're fake in some cases.

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You know,

291

and, right now they're seeing things

where Iran linked accounts are spreading,

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AI videos exaggerating damage to enemies,

and then Russian aligned networks

293

impersonating these official sources

or picking them up to amplify.

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And this is a coordinated thing

that's actually happening,

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actually going on now, disinformation

isn't anything new,

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but in this case, it's easier to do

and it's being coordinated.

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And again, this type of thing,

it can spread panic,

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influence opinion, manipulate markets

and so on, and trigger

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reactions in a way

that you just didn't see before, you know?

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So what to look for in this?

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If you see a video, if something looks off

like Strange shadows,

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or if it's a video and something appears

and disappears, or there's something

303

unrealistic like explosions

and that type of a thing, that's one way.

304

And the other thing

is to check the source.

305

If you're looking on Facebook or whatever

and see this great video and it's

306

from an anonymous account or a new account

that was just formed, maybe take a look.

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But this is gonna irritate some people.

308

But Xbox membership prices are increasing.

309

Really?

310

People aren't gonna love this.

311

You know,

312

I think we actually need

to do a deep dive on this

313

because this is something that,

in a lot of the comments

314

we get, is one of the most

frustrating things that are out

315

there are subscription costs,

which we've talked about,

316

but I'm gonna just

throw some numbers at you with this.

317

Xbox is leading

in the most expensive subscriptions.

318

So if you look at Xbox,

PlayStation, Nintendo,

319

since they are kind of the big three,

320

the comparison is interesting.

321

So just for these numbers, with numbers

that we're gonna throw out at you, we're

322

assuming a five year ownership, which is

the average lifespan of a console.

323

You buy it and use it

for about that period of time.

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You buy the console.

325

Once, you're buying the version

that uses physical media

326

and you have the highest subscription

327

tier available, there's different tiers

and they do different things.

328

And again, these amounts,

that's all it includes.

329

No extra controllers, hardware game

purchases, that kind of a thing.

330

So Xbox Series one X,

331

your five year

total cost of ownership is about $1,700.

332

That's,

333

PlayStation five.

334

It's about 1300, so it is less.

335

And, both of those consoles

are $500 or 499 suggesting.

336

No, no, no, no,

you can't do for 99 anymore

337

because the penny is going to be gone.

338

So they got 39, 99, but it's 99.

339

We still have dollar bills

I think, who knows in this world.

340

But it's going to

you can't have that $0.99 thing anymore.

341

No more $0.99.

342

But here's the thing for 99 is great price

for any of these answers.

343

But if it was $500 too

expensive, wouldn't do it.

344

Let's do it.

345

They're going to have to change

their marketing plan. Yep.

346

And there you are. So but yeah.

347

So, Nintendo,

which comes in a distant third, at least

348

for right now with the switch, total

cost of ownership, consoles, roughly 300

349

and the five year total would be at 515

because their annual cost is $50 a year.

350

But don't feel bad for Nintendo.

351

It looks like there's going to be another

tier coming out for the switch two.

352

That will put them more in line

353

with the other two, so they're not going

to miss out. So don't feel bad about that.

354

I'm not feeling bad.

355

All right.

356

Technology

originally developed for space missions.

357

Now part of everyday life.

358

Yeah.

359

This is on NASA's website

where this comes from.

360

And it goes through and talks

about some of these things.

361

And, you know, we've talked about

there's two things in the world primarily

362

that push the advancement of technology.

363

And it's war in space.

364

So developing for the military

or developing for space stuff

365

like NASA,

this is where this stuff comes from.

366

And the article primarily talks

about some different things,

367

but it's primarily

talking about camera on a chip technology

368

that was used for space missions.

369

Now the idea of this is that lighter,

less components, less that go wrong,

370

especially when it's going to be flown

is a good thing.

371

And back in the day, 1980s,

when this all started,

372

the size of a sensor on a camera was,

373

well, quite large,

especially by today's standards.

374

And I can remember the old VHS camcorders,

which was, you know,

375

like walking around with something

almost as heavy as the jetpack

376

might be exaggerating your touch there,

but it felt like it at times.

377

You know, and they've created technology

based on this that,

378

I believe CCD, which is how we see this is

379

what is a charge coupled device,

I think is what that acronym stands for.

380

And this is the type of technology

that has been used in our compact cameras,

381

which we're seeing billions of them around

now, because pretty much any camera

382

you have, that's

383

whether it's in your phone

or a security camera or the, metal glasses

384

that we were just talking about or

whatever uses a form of this technology.

385

And as time goes

by, these sensors get smaller and sharper,

386

so they can pick up higher resolution,

387

you know, all of that kind of stuff. And,

388

you know, we'll continue

to see that going on going forward.

389

But again,

390

this technology would not exist,

at least not in the way that it does right

391

now, had it not been developed

for the use on NASA

392

for being able to make things

that they were sending up lighter

393

and smaller and more dependable,

and in all honesty, they are dependable.

394

You can drop your cell phone and,

395

other

396

cameras

and, you know, if you do it too hard

397

or abuse it or something

that might damage it, that's possible.

398

But in most cases

it probably will survive.

399

And I can tell you what, if you took

400

Yeah, it'd be toast.

401

It would be toast.

402

I mean, you know,

403

just besides all the mechanical components

for the VCR components, the lens on

404

that thing is glass and has different

layers and all kinds of other things.

405

It can break, come apart

and come loose and,

406

well, there's layers and all of that

within modern camera technology.

407

It's done in such a way that it is very,

very resilient

408

to all of the things

that we might throw at it, you know?

409

And it's just one of those things

that, it's interesting

410

to see where all of this goes.

And there's a lot of other stuff too.

411

But this being the one

that this mainly touched upon.

412

So anyway.

413

All right.

414

So Tech Wednesday this week

talking about cars.

415

And we're going to be giving you

some details on this in the next segment.

416

But just to give an overview

of all of this kind of stuff, the new car

417

industry is in a bit of a budget

to slightly call it a reset right now.

418

And the reason of this is the price.

419

In December, the average transaction

price for a new car hit $50,000.

420

And what that means is,

421

is that half of all the new cars sold,

or more than that

422

and a half or less, that's a lot of money.

423

It has come all the way back

down to 49,000 something. Now.

424

So, you know, now it's okay.

425

I, you know, it's that whole 99 thing

Gretchen you were talking about.

426

But the thing of it

is, is at the end of the day,

427

people are not wanting to pay

this much money for a car.

428

And, you know, some of the numbers

that come out of this, too,

429

because I remember the last car

I had that I had payments on was a BMW.

430

So a fairly higher end car,

and I think my payment on

431

it was 320 a month, which at that time,

432

which was about 15 years ago

now, was considered,

433

quite high, you know,

at least I considered to be quite high.

434

And now you look at these things

and the average car payment

435

for a new car

that people are paying is around $750

436

a month, with 1 in 5 being over a grand

a month for their car.

437

That's crazy.

438

And this is just a car payment,

not the insurance, registration,

439

maintenance, all the other stuff

that would go along with it.

440

And that's an increase

441

So you know,

you're looking at this through.

442

And then the other thing

that's happening with the car loans to

443

to make

this feel like it's more affordable is,

444

a five year loan.

445

Back when I did, my last financing on a

car was considered a big deal.

446

We're seeing, in some cases,

ten year loans.

447

Now to get the payments now.

448

Now, of course,

what you pay an interest on

449

something like that is 2 to 3 times

the amount.

450

Yeah.

451

But the monthly payment is a little bit

less because of the duration of the,

452

loan.

453

And to me, this is something where they're

shooting themselves in the foot.

454

Because number one,

455

if you have a loan that long,

the person buying the car

456

is not going to be back in the market

457

to buy another car for a long time,

or they'll have negative equity.

458

So, you know, it's short term thing,

but for the longer term

459

it isn't going to be something they're

it's also closing the door on the new car

460

owners

the the young younger people, you know.

461

Yeah. Exactly, exactly.

462

And the other thing of it

is, is how many cars last ten years.

463

Some do.

464

But that's not necessarily the norm. No.

465

In fact in my car from the norm.

466

So people are going in to use cars now,

which is driving up

467

the prices of used cars.

468

And during the pandemic

we started to see this.

469

But it is unusual

470

because like my car, every year

it gets older seems to go up in value.

471

My Nissan that I have now,

472

which was not the norm

at any time that I'm aware of in the past.

473

So when we get back from the break,

we're going to be diving into

474

what's causing this a little bit, and then

we are going to have a special guest on

475

who is an author.

476

But he is one of the people

477

that was involved in, among other things,

the Apple three computer

478

from a few years ago.

479

This is user friendly. 2.0.

480

We'll be back after the break.

481

You see him? He's from the future.

482

He's got a really big computer

483

and he uses it, uses it every day

484

and he uses it in every way.

485

What do you mean? Sure.

486

You know, I'm not sure because he means

487

welcome back.

488

This is User Friendly 2.0.

489

Check out our website at UserFriendly.show

one place you send us your questions,

490

your comments, your ideas

and check out our past episodes

491

and everything else

that is User Friendly. 2.0.

492

So we've got two things

we're going to be diving into.

493

We're going to continue talking

about car tech here in just a minute.

494

And we also have an amazing guest

this week.

495

His name is David Braden.

496

Classically trained

HP product manager recruited by Apple.

497

Brought the first hard

drive to market for hard disk drive.

498

I mean, you know, that kind of

was a milestone five megabyte,

499

for the Apple three.

500

And I believe the app Lisa as well.

501

And, I don't know, Gretchen,

you had interest

502

and wanted to get a hard drive, and

I remember it was some exorbitant cost.

503

$500 for one megabyte. Yeah, yeah.

504

You know, it's, not even the size

of a floppy disk, but, hey, if.

505

Yeah,

506

you know, got to start somewhere,

and these things are really cool.

507

So he's going to be talking to us, a bit

about all of that.

508

And he's an author

and just a very interesting interview.

509

So we'll have that coming up for you

in just a minute.

510

But before we get to that car prices,

we were just talking in the, back

511

half of the previous segment

about how the average transaction

512

price for a car in the United States,

new car hit $50,000 in December,

513

backed off a little bit,

but is still quite high.

514

1 in 5 people to buy a new car

have a payment of $1,000 or more a month.

515

And what is driving up these prices?

516

Well, in addition to all the normal stuff

with inflation, that type of thing,

517

a lot of comments have been made

about the on board technology.

518

And is this something

that we are having to pay extra for,

519

and is it something that's worth it?

520

And is it

one of the major contributors to this?

521

Well, what do you think?

522

Possibly,

523

yeah, I was looking into it too, you know

what are we going to have

524

some sensational thing

that it's a big part of it.

525

And, that was the case.

526

There's two schools of thought on this,

and definitely new technological systems.

527

You're paying for engineering

and additional equipment

528

and that type of a thing.

529

So that would certainly add to the price,

especially on things like battery

530

electric vehicles.

531

Development costs are really on top of it.

532

But those systems are completely new.

533

So the tech in there

534

definitely is something that could

contribute to these type of things.

535

So, what's in there?

536

All modern cars, driver

assistance systems, these require

537

all kinds of sensors and different things

to be able to function.

538

These are things like if you go outside

of your lane, it tells you about it.

539

If you start to nod off,

it tells you about that type of a line.

540

Large inform tainment displays.

541

So the big screen in the middle of the car

and this is gone two directions.

542

I know in a lot of cases this was heading

to where that was your entire interface.

543

And people don't like that

for the most part.

544

Yeah.

545

And you know, so you have no real gauges,

you have no buttons.

546

So what happens is

I want to turn on my windshield wiper.

547

So I've got to go through

menus on a touch screen,

548

which seems like

not only would that be annoying,

549

but could be somewhat unsafe or your a

recipe for an accident that was, you know.

550

Yeah.

551

Radar and lidar systems.

552

These are things for auto drive.

553

Which still hasn't been perfected.

554

But self-driving cars

or what they call self-driving cars.

555

But you also see this in other things too.

556

Like, I know my Nissan has adaptive

cruise control, which uses

557

a form of this kind of technology

to be able to work.

558

And, you're making a face at me right?

559

Oh, just nothing.

560

Anyway, not the cruise control. Basically.

561

It's a nice feature is you set your cruise

control to 55 miles an hour,

562

and the guy in front of you slows down.

563

So I magically slow you down

and then speed you back up.

564

That's what that's for.

565

And, you know, but that requires different

sensors and things to be able to work.

566

Some of the other things the onboard

computers, mission systems now, what

567

this can save money on is things like,

over the years, software updates.

568

At least that's what they say.

569

My problem with it

is, is, I have a 82 Toyota pickup truck.

570

I have never needed an over-the-air

software update for it, and it's

571

on my car either. Yeah, exactly.

572

You know, and, but

573

neither have I.

574

Yeah.

575

I was just going to say, you

576

know, the 66 Volkswagen

we have doesn't need that either.

577

So I think that could be arguable either

578

way, it does take some of the stuff

like that's kind of irrelevant.

579

It's not necessary. Yeah.

580

And now now automation in factories

which is based on technology

581

not directly what you have in your car

that can lower prices

582

at least over the longer term.

583

Or I don't know if this is that new

because, you know, Henry

584

Ford kind of came up with this idea

a little while ago, too, with the model T,

585

but the idea of it is, is that, you know,

you can be able to push that along.

586

So what does this mean?

587

Here is our automakers pricing the middle

class out of the new car market.

588

You know, it's a it's a valid question

when it comes down

589

to these types of things.

590

And also do

we need some of this technology.

591

And you look at it,

you know, some things okay.

592

If it makes car safer, I'm all for it.

593

And I think it's worth paying for that

within reason.

594

But some of the other things

are the quote unquote features.

595

I'm doing the air quotes here

that you may not consider to be important.

596

At least I don't.

597

And some of them are.

598

Now, Nissan is one of the bigger,

offenders of this.

599

And we're going to deep dive into this

a little later in the year.

600

But at least the accusation is,

is that some of these onboard systems

601

that you're paying for when you buy

the car, you as a, for example, attach

602

your phone to the Bluetooth when it comes

on, you know, do I have access

603

to download contacts and, text messages?

604

On the plus side of that is it's great

because it'll read your text message

605

to you and you can respond

and all that kind of stuff.

606

But apparently what's happening

607

is some of the manufacturers

are downloading this data, analyzing

608

all of your private text messages

and contacts, and figuring out stuff

609

they can sell you,

610

or selling that information

to third parties or something, you know,

611

and again, that's an allegation

and one that does seem to be playing out

612

from the research I'm doing.

613

But I not only don't want to pay extra

for that, I don't want that period.

614

Yeah, I don't either.

615

I don't play with my phone

or talk to people outside of the car

616

while I'm driving. I'm focused on driving.

617

And I think that's, you're very rare

618

in that now

because, you know, people, don't tend to,

619

have that the primary goal anymore.

620

Yeah.

621

And a lot of ways, you know,

travelers comes on and talks to us

622

when we get into Safety Month

in October about these things.

623

But every year this is an ongoing problem.

624

So we're going to deep dive later.

625

Go to user friendly Dot show.

626

Let us know what you'd like

to learn about this.

627

As I do my research on it

and we get ready to do that segment.

628

All right, speaking of which,

let's talk to our guests

629

and talk about computers

and things related to that.

630

Here we go.

631

Joining us now guest David Braden.

632

Welcome to User Friendly.

633

Glad to be with you.

634

So I could sit here and read this bio

of all of the amazing things

635

you've accomplished.

636

But instead of doing that, I'm

going to just make you do it.

637

Tell us a little bit about yourself.

638

I was born and raised in Detroit,

639

home of Motown,

640

and then,

went to the University of Michigan

641

and then in Ann Arbor,

started the flying club there,

642

started a nationwide student organization

in support of a supersonic transport,

643

and later in interned in support of,

science and technology,

644

where I graduated with a degree

in interdisciplinary engineering.

645

I moved by association

called Fast to Washington, DC,

646

lobbied Congress for a space

shuttle, was successful

647

in that lobbying Congress

for Project independence.

648

I was not successful in that

getting us to,

649

move quicker to wind and solar

and geothermal and hydro and so forth.

650

And then I was recruited by,

651

a group that started at Minnesota.

652

I called the Environmental Ballots

Association

653

and pioneered the field

of environmental mediation and helped

654

site, do facilities throughout the state

and resolve major environmental disputes.

655

And then Hewlett Packard recruited me

to go, to Hewlett Packard in Palo Alto

656

to handle their community relations

for new, facilities.

657

And then,

658

I was able to move over

into product management at HP and got

659

recruited by Apple to bring the first hard

disk drive to market,

660

which was an enormous in size

and was five megabytes.

661

It was just really cheap, was only $3,500.

662

And nobody could understand,

663

understand why they would ever use

five megabytes of space.

664

And they noticed that I knew how to manage

having managed

665

those organizations

I mentioned previously, I ran,

666

I'll squeeze gubernatorial campaign

in Minnesota, one that,

667

John Connelly asked me to run

his presidential campaign in Minnesota.

668

And we got four times more delegates

that he did in New Hampshire.

669

We got four of Minnesota.

670

He got one to New Hampshire,

until he, dropped out of the race.

671

And then,

672

so I was

673

asked to do Apple to become the business,

674

or the Apple three Group product manager.

675

And, Steve Jobs

676

convince the executive committee

that occupied a place of the market,

677

the Apple three of the business computer

where he wanted his debt

678

to be introduced

or shipped Macintosh to be.

679

So they canceled the product line

after I was out of the job

680

for about three weeks.

681

And, John Sculley asked me

what we should do about it.

682

And, so I made him a proposal

to set us up as a

683

the independent operating entity,

an independent business unit.

684

He agreed with that.

685

They asked me to be the business

unit manager.

686

I asked if I could be the general manager.

687

He said no, we want you to be the bum

or business unit manager.

688

And we went out, sold,

689

25,000 apple trees

690

for an average

selling price of about $7,000 each

691

was able to make enough profits to help

pay for the development of the Macintosh.

692

And I phased the product line out

without any of the customers

693

getting pissed at Apple

or leaving out some place else.

694

So, that's my story,

and I'm sticking to it.

695

I love it, I'm good.

696

It's and it's a real quick aside,

I like retro computers.

697

I actually do have an Apple three,

698

and it's a one that not a lot of people

these days have heard of.

699

And I do have, I think it's called

the Mega File Hard Drive or something

700

like that.

701

And it's this huge box and yeah,

I think it is five.

702

I might have the ten megabyte version,

but yeah, I remember,

703

looking up how much that

originally cost, going, oh boy.

704

On the on the profile profile profile.

705

That's right.

706

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

707

Mega file profile,

I think Mega files. Atari.

708

Yes. Anyway, they're not being here.

709

They're they're it's

just an interesting thing,

710

but you're an author of several

quite successful books.

711

And let's talk about that a little bit.

712

Yeah.

713

I began to put down on paper,

my experiences of what it takes to build

714

what Steve Jobs

would call insanely great products.

715

So my first book is, building

insanely great products,

716

and it covers the five keys

to product success

717

that Wiley, the book publisher,

asked me to write a textbook.

718

So they published the little pamphlets,

all these 798 pages long called,

719

successful Product

Design and Management Toolkit.

720

Both of these books are available on,

721

on Amazon,

722

as and

they're also available as audio books.

723

And then I have another one

called Organizing and Managing Insanely

724

Great Products, which is for, CXO,

725

level people to know how to structure,

organize a, product management function,

726

or I prefer to call it a product

success function.

727

Within the organization

728

that a few years ago, because of the mind

set me a bunch of letters

729

my dad wrote home during World

War two, and his name was Hymie.

730

Like the robot and, get smart.

731

And, so I published his letters,

which follows the history

732

from my grandmother

733

in Spain, about the same time that,

734

Chris Columbus, started sailing west,

735

and she, emigrated to France,

where she and her party were being robbed.

736

And a gallant young man by the last name,

a frightened,

737

the same as mine came to her rescue.

738

They fell in love, got married,

and then, a few generations later,

739

when, the French turned against the Jews,

740

the frightened

family left and went to Ukraine.

741

And then in, 1914, with my grandfather,

742

who was the blacksmith

for the governor of Kiev,

743

he told him, you better get out of here

because the program is coming.

744

And they had six before then.

745

Were of the Ukrainians. The,

746

the Cossacks, tried to wipe out the Jews

and the immigrants, the United States.

747

And then my dad was born in Baltimore,

joined, the, Marines.

748

Yeah. 1941.

749

They kicked him out

because he had flat feet that he was able

750

to get back in again.

751

So they stuck up in the infantry.

752

These very funny,

writer always wanted to get

753

published some letters from my Hymie,

the very funny book.

754

And it takes you through history,

including the fact that, later, frightened

755

in, in France,

was appointed a duke by King Louis

756

and, ignoring the French Revolution.

757

The word titles are not passed down.

758

I still say that by, I have a Duke.

759

I love it, I love it.

760

Well, I,

761

can certainly accept that.

762

So I know in your background

763

you talked a little bit about HP and Apple

and all that, but you've trained

764

actually hands

on, trained a lot of managers

765

over the years and and quite successfully

from my understanding.

766

Can you speak a little bit to that?

767

Yeah.

768

I have a series of courses that take you

through a product, lifecycle framework,

769

which is up on my website

at Spice catalyst.com.

770

And it starts out

with a product market strategy,

771

that marketing, social media marketing,

772

those types of topics.

773

And also have, workshops that I perform.

774

But my number one client is Cisco,

and I've prayed

775

I or my traders of trade, about half

of all the product managers at Cisco.

776

So if your Cisco stock

has gone up, that's, my,

777

responsibility.

778

If it went down, that's your fault

for buying it in the first place.

779

And, through the years,

780

I've trained about 10,000 of product

managers worldwide,

781

including a company and, Saint Petersburg,

782

Russia,

783

and, including the Botswana

784

and telecommunications company

in Botswana.

785

By the way,

Botswana is north of South Africa.

786

So I went there to figure out

how you get north of South and,

787

trade capital, world Bank and, and product

management for their digital tools.

788

And a number of other companies.

789

Now we have a lot of listeners

790

that are small business owners

and have products and ideas.

791

What's some advice you could give them

and would you would you be

792

somebody they could interact with for help

on what they're doing?

793

Sure.

794

I'd be happy to look at what they're doing

or help fill in the holes.

795

The key here is, is to follow

the five keys to product success,

796

which are in my books.

797

By the way, if you just look up my name,

David Frieden for adding,

798

on Amazon all my books, will show up.

799

And the first one

800

is the letter S and spice,

which is a strategy.

801

You have to have a product

market strategy.

802

You have to understand,

803

what it is that your product needs to do

for the customer to be,

804

happy and successful and, a product is

a service is the same as a product.

805

It's just an intangible product.

806

And these principles apply to a service

like a dentist office.

807

To a restaurant to, a gas station,

808

just as much as it applies to products.

809

And the product market strategy has to,

810

then, identify who the personas are,

811

are the people that you're then

do with the product does.

812

And it spells out to them

the value proposition,

813

the product positioning, the,

814

and, and furthermore, the competitive

research, the market research.

815

And so forth.

816

There are 32 elements of the product

market strategy.

817

Most companies

start products and or start companies

818

without thinking through those 32 things,

819

by going out and, observing what

820

their prospective customers are doing by,

821

interviewing a 40

to 80 prospective customers,

822

buy a survey and go somewhere between 800

823

and 1200 of their target customers.

824

And as a result of that, they follow what,

825

better and Zuckerburg calls ready

fired aim.

826

And oftentimes they miss the target

and they go on a business.

827

In fact, 35% of all new products

and services introduced each year

828

fail, wasting well over $1

trillion in the world's assets

829

as a result of not having that product

market strategy.

830

The the P and Spice stands for repeatable

processes.

831

The AI stands for having the information

available

832

in order to make informed decisions.

833

See is the most important

834

that I mentioned a piece of that already,

and that's understanding your customer.

835

What it is your customer wants to do,

why they want to do it,

836

when they want to do it, where they want

to do it, how they want to do it,

837

what's standing their way,

what how important is it to get it done?

838

And most importantly, how satisfied

are they with the current solution?

839

So, for example, if someone was thinking

of inventing an alternative pencil,

840

the chances of big success

were quite small

841

because the perfect pencil has been dated

and shipping for thousands of years.

842

So, understanding your customer

843

by observing,

by interviewing, by surveying.

844

And then if you're lucky

enough to have big data,

845

you can do analytics.

846

And if that big data has populated

an AI engine, you could ask the AI engine,

847

for more details.

848

And then last is your employees.

849

There are 130 skill sets

that I've identified

850

that are vital in order

to have product and service success.

851

So you should have an ongoing

training program

852

to upskill your existing employees

to assess,

853

and analyze what skills you have

or what skills your organization

854

needs to acquire, and have a plan

to bring those people on board.

855

So you mentioned this before, and it's

856

obviously a topic among technology

and has been for the last couple of years.

857

How has AI changed your direction

in even starting up businesses?

858

Because it seems to have left

a lot of stuff on its head,

859

and you've been working in the field

for a long time.

860

Can you tell us a little bit

about some of the differences

861

you're seeing, and a good way

862

to be able to interact with AI,

or is it something you should ignore?

863

You should not ignore

864

it because it's getting better

and better, every day.

865

And it speeds up the process

866

of putting that product

market strategy together.

867

But you have to keep in mind

that it's only,

868

regurgitating back to you,

869

what has been the, printed,

870

previously.

871

So if something is bad, printed,

that's wrong.

872

Some of the AI models will regurgitate

that back to you.

873

An example of that

where there was some kind of post

874

on X or Twitter about,

875

Elon Musk being Hitler.

876

And then if you did

877

certain kinds of queries

would come back and tell you about Hitler.

878

Also, there have been several people

879

that have committed suicide

because of their, AI, chat box.

880

Encourage them to hurry up

and kill themselves, so it can't go

881

the wrong ways.

882

I like to test AIS, by, like, for example,

putting my baby in,

883

and if it comes back, fairly accurately,

that I'll trust it.

884

I use an AI tool called perplexity,

which seems to do a very good job.

885

And the AI boat

886

in, Google has recently gotten

pretty good.

887

I tried out Microsoft's

AI a year or so ago,

888

and I put the name in a

by a former business partner of mine,

889

and they came back

and said that he went to Harvard.

890

He didn't said he graduated from it.

891

It he didn't even have a college degree.

892

Said he worked at, several companies

that he never worked at.

893

So what it had done is taken his name,

894

which is not entirely, uncommon,

895

and mashed it together

with other people's names

896

and then came up with a bio

that was inaccurate.

897

So you have to be very careful about,

another thing that I tried to do,

898

and it worked fairly well,

and I published this on the

899

on a blog of my, Spice Cannabis

dot com website.

900

I asked, perplexity.

901

What is it that people do?

902

And it came back and told me,

you know, we eat,

903

we sleep, we dress, we,

904

we, transport ourselves to work.

905

We work those kinds of things.

906

And it put all the things that people do

and some nice, neat little categories.

907

And then I which is something that,

908

would probably take weeks of effort

for an individual, to figure that out.

909

And then I asked that,

which of this, these things could I do?

910

And it came back with a very explicit

description, could do this, could do

911

that, could do this.

912

But it cannot do this

and it cannot do that.

913

So I published that,

as I mentioned, in a blog on my website.

914

So that's an example of,

rapidly speeding up the process.

915

Another

thing that if you're in the software area,

916

if you could figure out

how to use it, some,

917

AI tools could write the programs for you,

918

eliminating the need for the engineers,

the software programmers.

919

Yeah.

920

You know,

and I know from my own standpoint

921

as a programmer,

I've been using a lot more for,

922

you know, being able

to do a lot of the basic tasks.

923

And these are the way that it's growing.

924

And you know, what you can do with AI

today compared

925

to even six months ago is very,

very different.

926

And, you know, and it's one thing

and it is good to emphasize

927

that you speak of

928

AI is having hallucinations, which is one

it brings back all state are incorrect,

929

you know, information,

that kind of stuff for,

930

the legal profession,

I think has been seen.

931

Things have been entirely made up.

932

So you do still need to check

the information.

933

You know?

934

Yeah, that a lot of lawyers

have gotten the trouble

935

of using AI to write their briefs.

936

Yeah, well, it's easy to do

if you have case law.

937

That's just random, but it's good for.

938

It's not real,

but it supports your position, right?

939

Yeah.

940

Now, I

941

could see where stuff like that

942

could become very embarrassing

and problematic at the end of the day,

943

you know,

because it's not true information.

944

So yeah, you, you got to watch it.

945

But it does sound like it's,

946

you know, making changes

here. And I would think so too,

947

if business start up,

there's no reason it wouldn't be.

948

But it is something that in this day and

age, it's starting to become as important

949

to know how to interact with AI as

it was to use a computer in the 90s.

950

You know, so going

that direction can make it or break it.

951

Was there anything else

you'd like to tell us?

952

There's a newsletter whose name escapes me

right now that I get daily,

953

which updates me

on, latest developments of AI

954

and, what should, I guess

subhuman or human

955

software, rather, you should seek that out

and subscribe to it.

956

Keeps you up to date,

has the latest developments

957

okay.

958

That's great.

959

Or. Well, listen, thank you for joining us

today.

960

Give us your websites again.

961

It's, spice Catalyst.

962

What Worldcom.

963

Yeah. My name is David Freed.

964

And for aiding,

you could look me up on perplexity

965

and find out more things about me

than I ever do.

966

It's make sense.

967

Thank you for joining us today.

968

Thanks for putting up with me.

969

I don't know, you know,

we have a lot of interesting questions

970

that come in on retro technology

and stuff like that.

971

The Apple three was a unique system and,

one that many.

972

I well,

I think they're all really cool, but,

973

it's kind of fun to be able

to learn about this until next week.

974

This is User Friendly 2.0,

keeping you safe on the cutting edge.

975

User Friendly 2.0.

976

Copyright 2013 to 2026

977

by User Friendly Media Group Incorporated.

978

All rights reserved.

979

The content is the opinion

of the show's participants

980

and does not necessarily

reflect this station or platform.

981

Requests for material use, interviews,

disclosures,

982

and other correspondence may be viewed

983

and submitted at userfriendly.show.