In the wilds of western Alberta, Canada, Ken Walker lives, hunts, creates, and sings Roy Orbison tracks. He’s a world champion taxidermist who specializes in recreations of extinct animals. He’s brought back stunning versions of the Sabretooth Tiger and the Irish Elk and his work is featured in the Smithsonian Institution. He’s also a Squatcher and in 2015, he began a quest to create a perfect version of the Bigfoot from the infamous 1967 Patterson-Gimlin film , a not-so-little lady he calls “Patty”.

Kansas City filmmaker Dan Wayne was taking on taxidermy as a hobby when he encountered Ken on an internet forum. He found Ken’s work fascinating and was amazed by the amount of access that this first-in-class taxidermist was giving him online to help developing his own skills. And when he discovered that Ken was working on a Sasquatch, he thought it would make a great documentary.

And he was right. The ensuing documentary, which played at Slamdance Film Festival in 2020 is 

Big Fur, a compelling story about a man’s quest to recreate a creature that many have claim to have seen but only really has been captured on shaky 1967 filmstock. Ken said that he wanted Bigfoot experiencers to see his mount (what taxidermists call their creations) and say “That’s exactly what I saw.”

Ken Walker with “Patty”

I have been a Bigfoot skeptic for awhile now because I just have too many unanswered questions, but talking to Ken and Dan about their documentary and Ken’s theories on the creature have once again opened me up to the possibility. Skeptics, believers, and people just interested in Bigfoot and taxidermy will find a lot to enjoy in this wide-ranging and entertaining discussion, including:

• Ken’s own Bigfoot experience that led him to believe in Sasquatch
• How he ended up with several bags of what he thinks is Sasquatch feces in his freezer
• How you can tell a Hollywood-style fake Bigfoot costume from a real one (hint: it’s all in the forehead)
• The careful measuring of ratio and dimensions that Ken used to determine the height and size of his creation
• The electromagnetic energy of Bigfoot
• Hunting Bigfoot with special Faraday Cage camo suits
• What kind of weird tree structures that Sasquatch are making out in the Alberta woods

Welcome to See You on the Other Mike, where the world of

the mysterious collides with the world of entertainment.

A discussion of art, music, movies, spirituality,

the weird and self discovery. And

now, your hosts, musicians and entertainers

who have their own weakness for the weird, Mike and

Wendy from the band Sunspot. See you on the other

side podcast episode 290. And

today, Wendy and I are talking about the brand new movie,

Big Fur, which is the story of taxidermist,

Ken Walker, and how he made a

super cool fake Bigfoot. And so

today, we're joined by the director of Bigfoot,

Dan Wayne, as well as the taxidermist with

the most himself, Ken Walker. Welcome.

Hey. Thank you. Hello. So,

Mike, I have to say that, you and I both have something in common

that we are Wisconsin born and raised people Yes. Both

from non hunter families. So, watching

this was really, really fascinating to me because I'm completely ignorant when

it comes to the world of taxidermy, unlike many people around us here in

Wisconsin. So learning about, Ken and his his world championship

taxidermy skills was something really, really unique to me.

How about you? That was all completely new to me. And I'm I'm

somebody that, you know, I I've fired guns before and

stuff, but never actually at something, only at targets. So I you know,

the the world of taxidermy, I thought, was completely fascinating as to how they

made all the stuff and really what what went into the creation of

especially a like, what we think of him as nonfictional Bigfoot,

kind of character, but trying to create something that you only

saw in a movie, I thought was really interesting.

Right. And and there was one synchronicity I kinda wanted to get out of the

way right away in our discussion. So part

of the movie takes place in Springfield,

Illinois at, was it

the 2013, taxidermy world

taxidermy, like, taxidermy offs? I think it was the 2000 I

think And the 2 Yeah. I think that's right. We were

there's 2 different world taxidermy championship

scenes, and one was in 2013 in Illinois, and the other

one, incidentally, is at Springfield, Missouri

in 2015. And just what I thought was

funny about it is that as I'm watching the movie, I see

Springfield, Illinois, at a hotel that we've stayed at, like the

Crowne Plaza in Springfield, Illinois. And when we when we used to

play in Springfield, frequently, we would often

play with a band that was called Big Fur.

Really? No worries. Seriously. Yeah. That that is

crazy. Well, it's funny because when I first, you know, came up

with the name of the movie, it was Mike, okay, it's time to secure the

website, and I go to getbigfir.com and some

band has the name. I was like, god, I can't I

can't say actually, I don't know if they're any good or not, but,

yeah. I was really surprised that there was a band named Big Fur, and so

I ended up with bigfirmovie.com, which, of course, where you can

go to keep up on on things. Yeah. That's funny that that

you know those guys. Yeah. That's cool.

Yeah. So that was a really weird connection. Because when I heard the name of

the movie, immediately, I thought about that band. Because over the years, we've done so

many shows with them. And I I always thought it was a unique name. So

Yeah. Anyway Yeah. I wonder if they're still together. I don't

actually, they they're I don't think that they were gonna have a reunion show. We

got an email from one of the guys last year. They were gonna have some

reunion shows, and they were wondering if they wanted we wanted to come down to

Springfield, and they wanted to come back up to Madison, Wisconsin to play. So,

2019 was when the big for a movie was released. Maybe they wanted to capitalize

on all your publicity. Perfect. But you There you go.

But, you know, what I do wanna say, though, is you did do a really

cool publicity stunt for the movie, and, I wanna

get to that in a second. But I wanna say first, like, Dan and

Ken as and, you know, Dan as a filmmaker, Ken as a

taxidermist, how do filmmakers and taxidermists end up

getting to know each other? Mike, that you know, like, what was Yeah. I

mean, how did you guys what was your meet cute? Well, you know, I

I had this interest in taxidermy, and and I started

trying to learn how to do it. And, pretty quickly

during my early research found out that there was this

world tax journey championship. And I found out about this through a a forum

that all the taxidermists are on where they share tips with each other and

with beginners, and and Ken is on that forum, and all the best taxidermists in

the world pretty much are on that forum. And I found out about the

World Tax Derby Championships, and they usually have them somewhere in the

Midwest because everybody drives and they bring trailers and it's just easier if it's a

central location. Sure. And, if this incidentally,

that week, it was in St. Charles, Missouri, which is only, you know, 3

hours from where I live. And and I went, you know, just for the

day. And it was pretty mind blowing to see the work that

was there. And that really kind of opened my eyes, you know, to

to taxidermy as an art form. And it wasn't long after that that I

started thinking about doing a documentary, and I got more interested in the

characters that were doing it than actually learning how to do it. Although I do

kind of practice it as an amateur too too. And, and so,

you know, I knew about Tim. You know, he he's

really kind of specialized in the taxidermy world because he does

these recreations, which is, you know, endangered or extinct

animals made out of other animal hides. So that's really unique. You know?

Most taxidermists just do fish or just do birds, and they just do animals.

And Ken's known for these things Mike his Irish elk and his giant panda

and his shaver toothed tiger. And so, you know, he was kind of on my

radar and really was the first person I approached. And, we just

kinda hit it off on the first, you know, phone call we had. And when

he told me he was gonna make a Bigfoot, I knew that that was the

movie right there. Perfect.

Well, you know, I think, Dan, number 1, you're lucky because most

of us, when we when we aspire to try to do something or learn a

new skill, we have to learn like, let's say I wanted to, you know, learn

a different instrument. I gotta learn from the local guy at the music shop or

I gotta watch YouTube and see some dude give a lesson.

Meanwhile, you get to immediately contact the best people in the

world, to work on the skill, and that I mean, that's something

remarkable, as it was. And so, you know, Ken,

what made you interested in the first place in trying to recreate?

Because that's a very specialized thing, you know, to recreate,

animals either extinct or animals that, you know,

that we don't have corpses of, to examine.

That seems like a harder thing to try to sell to a bar

up north or something like that when you're trying to, you know, sell taxidermy

pieces. Like, what attracted you to these

extraordinarily, difficult works? Well,

it it it kind of was a natural evolution with, with some

investigations I was doing just through the, the hunting community.

It it turns out I actually saw a Sasquatch about 30 years ago.

And the the funny thing about belief is that there's a good

good saying and that is that you will see it when you believe it. And

this thing ran across the road in the middle of nowhere, in the middle of

the woods. I was out driving down the road. We were hunting bears out in

a place called Blue Ridge, near the Swan Hills of Western Alberta.

And back then, there was no logging in there. There was just one road, the

Simpson Timber Road. And this guy ran across the road about

400 yards ahead and I thought it was a bear at first. And then I

realized, no, it's a man. And then he ran up a hill. And I mean,

like 30 miles an hour without slowing down and I've never seen even a bear

can't do that. And I thought, who is this guy? And we went

up there and, my friend who was with me said, was that a sasquatch? And

I said, there's no such thing. I said, it had to be a man because,

you know, back then, you know, I was younger so I knew everything.

And the thing ran straight into it ran straight into the woods without

slowing down. I said, well, there has to be a cut line there, a seismic

line because nobody can run into this thick Alberta bush

that fast. And there wasn't. And I was and you know, the thing never

sat right with me for the longest time. I've since found

out that was south of a place called Kidney Mike, and they still see them

there all the Mike. And I did find, subsequently find the tree structures out there,

which is my way of confirming they're there. You know,

so and then I started talking to people years later,

that 2 people had told me that, you know, they encountered sasquatches and I knew

these people. I knew for a fact they weren't lying to me. And I went,

man, if these things are out there, I'm gonna look for them. And, so I

started my investigations and it was mind blowing what

I was able to uncover, just through the hunting community,

to the point of getting DNA tested, you know. So it was,

it was very, very interesting. And so it's just a natural

evolution Wendy saw the the first time I saw the Patterson footage actually

slowed down and, you know, and zoomed in and stabilized.

It took me just a few seconds to realize because I have a trained eye

for this thing, you know. I build I build scientific models for the Smithsonian

from photographs. So I looked at it and I realized right away

that all of the ratios, the limb ratios, the parameters,

the width, and everything of that creature I was looking at

were outside of human parameters, and this thing was in fact

real. Because, you know, I mean, I studied special

effects when I was a kid. 1967 was the lizard man in

Star Trek, you know. Yes. Oh yeah, the Gorn. That's

exactly right. And so so when you look at when you look at the the

time and stretch fur, of course, wasn't, invented until 19

eighties. I mean, it it just took me a few seconds to realize. And I

mean, now that they've got it in 4 k, it's just incredible

Wendy when, when Patty turns sideways to look and

and she's actually watching Bob Gimlin pull his 30 out 6 out of his

Well, let's go back let's go back real quick right there because I wanna I

wanna go over that story there. Just because you're saying, like, we're throwing out Patty

and Gimlin and Yeah. And for us Yeah. Okay. You know, for us, we're all

like, oh, yeah. Obviously. But Okay. Okay. For anybody,

who everybody out there who's probably listening to this podcast has seen

this footage. It is Mhmm. The 19

what was it 1967? 67. Yeah. 67. The Patterson

Gimlin footage is from it's from Northern California, if I'm not

mistaken. Left And Yep. It's I mean, everybody's seen it's the

famous footage of a female Sasquatch, Bigfoot,

like, walking across a field full of, like,

a tree like, fallen trees kinda thing. And,

it's very famous. And if anybody has seen the Bigfoot cutouts,

like, that you can when you're driving down the road and people put Bigfoot cutouts,

like, on the side of the road in places and, restaurants or something like

that to catch your attention, that specific, like,

Bigfoot movement where it's got, like, one arm forward and one arm back,

that's taken from the Patterson Gimlin

film from 1967, and that

is the basis of what we're just talking about right there when we're talking

about we're talking about 1967, we're talking about special effects available

to NBC for making Star Trek

versus 2 cowboys, taking

footage, you know, in the backwoods. And so that I kind of want to

kind of want to explain that and that's some of the inspiration

for how you were building this creation. Yes. Well the

thing is and I don't build anything unless I have proper reference

because I just don't want to, you know. I don't want to make something unless

I can make it accurate from a scientific point of view.

And, of course, people are gonna want to argue with me on that statement. But

the thing is Wendy saw the when I saw the footage, I realized that I

had all of the information that I needed to build the

template. And and, you know, for limb ratio, Mike,

where pivot points are in the knee to the to the ankle, the length of

the foot. And in one of the the really good

stills from the from the film, you can actually see because

the the when a sasquatch steps forward, its shin is parallel to the ground. You

can see the bottom of her foot. You can see all 5 toes. You can

see the pad. Now I know that that's just under 15 inches long because they

casted the tracks that day. So I actually took a little measuring

tool, and that's how I measured all my parameters width,

and I made my own chart of measurements with using the the foot

length being just under 15 inches Because I didn't trust

anybody's measuring chart, I had to make my own. And it just turned

out that a gentleman by the name of John Green

from British Columbia had made a

measurement chart from the site of the Patterson footage. And

my chart, they they measured trees and rocks and

things. I just measured the foot. My my template was identical,

exactly, down to the inch. Wow. So, so I just I

realized theirs was accurate and that mine was accurate. So it was basically, for

Mike, it was corroborating, you know. I knew I wasn't going out

there, you know, and a lot of people wanted to be bigger. Well, it's just

under 7 feet tall. But I actually know people who've encountered female

sasquatches and they told me that's how big they are, you know.

So it's, so anyways, I I had

I had perfect reference in my humble opinion.

Well, you know, when you talk about your own Sasquatch story,

what I'm interested there is when you say running up the hill at 30 miles

an hour, did it seem like a big dude? You know what I mean?

Like like, big guys that would be as big as a

sasquatch running 30 miles an hour, that limits you

to, what, Walter Payton, Reggie White? Like, how

many guys big guys can run that fast up a hill? This one

that I saw was not that big, and and,

as a matter of fact, there's another piece of footage that's quite, well

known out there, and it's called the Memorial Day footage. And it's

where some people, on Memorial Day out for a picnic, they

they filmed a sasquatch or or proposed purported

to be a sasquatch running across a a hillside. That

is exactly what I saw and very similar in

size, you know, in that now the thing was quite

far, and it was also, it

broke cover and it was acting almost scared, like really scared, Mike, almost

like, you know, nobody poaches in the spring. Is this a poacher? Why is he

so scared? Why is he dressed in black from head to toe?

But I almost think that it was probably

a, a subadult that hadn't

got across the road before our truck was in sight. And the

other one A 2 laser. Across. Yeah. And basically, I and

because and it broke cover to catch up to the other one out of

fear. This was just the kind of thing going through my

head, you know, because it had no reason to break cover other than to just

stand there and wait until we passed, which is what a big one will do.

You know, so that was

the one thing about it, like it wasn't like I was really close and this

was one of those, you know, 10 foot tall ones with a 19 inches

track. It was it it seemed to be almost within

human parameters in size, but it was still a long distance.

And, it's very hard to judge size at distances, but whatever it was

moved like lightning. It moved fast. That's very cool. Well, in addition to your

own experience, it occurred to me while I was watching the the film

that, you know, you probably have more interaction with hunters

than anyone. And so I

was curious, you know, how frequently do people, like, fess up to you about the

and especially after your Bigfoot project. It's because Bigfoot isn't the kind of thing that

everybody just openly talks about. But do you

think that, creating that replica of Bigfoot might have

made people more willing to discuss their own experiences with you about it? Well,

almost nobody's willing to discuss it, but I was able to target the individuals

who had seen one when it was in my shop. And most of the people

they walk in, you know, they're looking at the polar bears, they're looking at the

grizzlies, and the, you know, the wonderful bighorn sheep and all that stuff, and then

they see the sasquatch standing there, and they'll look at me and they'll go, No

way, no, you know, where did you get that one? And they'll make a joke

or they'll say, Hey, get my wife out of the truck, she's going to come

in here, there's a sass watch in here, you know. And that's how most

people are. You get I get the odd person who stands there and looks

at it in silence, and without making

any emotions or anything, they turn around and they walk

away, and they're acting as if they didn't see it. And when

somebody does that, I Mike I say I just say, I got you. I got

you. You've seen 1. And they'll say, what? What? And I'll say, you've seen

1. And I'll say, If it makes you feel any better, I've seen 1 too.

And so then what I do is I talk to them, and I say, I

know you've seen 1. You just I said, Look, it's just you and me standing

here. And then some of the stories that I get are

absolutely amazing. And I can always tell, if

somebody almost they walk away from it

looking with a look on their face like they wish they hadn't even seen it

in my shop. And those so I used to gauge people with

that model, and I got I got a number of good accounts from

people in that same scenario. Well, that's really cool because

most of the time people who experience that don't get a second look, you know.

So it's the type of thing where it's in their memory, but they don't get

to and especially up close. And the detail on your model was

incredible. So I can imagine that would be a quite an experience for

those that have seen it from afar. Yeah. Mike best witness,

and this is a guy who doesn't he's not just seen them, he, like, he

really knows these animals. The guy's amazing. If he would ever

talk about it, we had learned so much just from him. He looked at the

model and he said, It's bang on. He said, Except for, he

had an up close encounter with a group of Sasquatch

and there was a female and he said that she had more of a pointed

head and more of a pointed chin. But then he also told me that

their faces differ as much as people's do, that they're they

are like that, that some look, you know, they all look different.

But, like, they're within the parameters of being a Sasquatch. But

he said the model was bang on. And then

there's a few things about it, like if you watch the movie, when we set

the thing up, you'll notice that the nose is quite low on it.

I actually had the nose where a human nose sits. And I went

something didn't look right, so when I went back and looked at

the Patterson photos again, I realized that the nose

sits up very, very close to the eyes, and, there's a lot

more distance between the the nose and the mouth than on a human. And

and there's a lot less distance between the nose and the eyes, the line across

the eyes. And, so I watch for that whenever I you know, there

there's a lot of photographs on the net that people, you know, grainy or whatever.

I can usually tell if they're accurate by the nose position

because that's a that's kind of a different thing. It's a different

observation, you know. It's it's it's almost like when we find

tracks out in the woods. A sasquatch has an indentation on the outside of

the foot, where a human track has the indentation on the inside of of

the foot where the arch is. But on your sasquatch track, the foot is

flat and there's an in slight indentation on the outside of the foot, almost

always. Well, one of the things that I really liked about the movie was

when you came out and said you're, like, well, my goal here is

for somebody to see, you know, see my

model and say, that's it. That's what I

saw. Yep. And I thought that was really that was a really powerful thing to

say because you're trying to put a, you know,

you're trying to give validation to people who a lot of

others will laugh at or will mock. Yep. And,

you know, it's it's even though we think, like, well, it's for a competition or

it's for arts for arts Mike, it there's also there's a therapeutic

quality to it that I thought was powerful in that aspect.

Yeah. Exactly. I've had a number a number of

people in front of it. And some, I've had

people react emotionally, to

it. You know, it's they've I've had a number

of people now validate it. And and I try to explain to

people that this is not an embellishment. It is simply the interpretation

of what is in the Patterson footage. Well, you know, speaking of the Patterson

footage, you guys do show the, you know, the Patterson Gimlin

film in the movie. And, Dan, I was wondering, that's not in

the public domain or whatever too. Like, was that half the

budget, or how do you get a copy? Like, how do you get access to

that footage? Well, that's

debatable. And and, you know It's fair use,

baby. I don't know how to get into I don't know how to get into

issues of fair use, but, you know, I only used as much as I had

to to explain what was going on and and, honestly, you

know, the the the ownership of that copyright

has been debated, and and I'm not sure exactly,

if it's in the public domain or or if if the

Pattersons actually own the the copyright. I I did a lot of

research and wasn't able to get anywhere with it and and,

yeah, I don't wanna get myself in trouble. Fair enough. Well, I think there's

there's one frame. I think I think it's, like, frame 354, and it's

actually in the public domain, and that's that's the the image that you

always see, you know. Right. But the movie

has been analyzed to gas, you know. So many people have

have, you know, have analyzed, you know I

mean, just it's crazy the the amount of attention that movie has

gotten that it's considered among bigfitters to be, you know, the

the holy grail of Bigfoot evidence. And,

you know, there are people that claim that they were the guy in the suit,

but there's more than one person that that has claimed that. And and

nobody has actually ever debunked it even though a lot of people

claim that it's been debunked, but nobody really has been able to do that.

But it is a it's a fascinating thing and it's certainly a part of pop

culture now, you know, and and it does get used, you know, in

in a lot of different forms. So, you

know, the only time I show it is when we're actually discussing,

the validity of it, and and I actually animated a different part,

you know, instead of showing it in in a different section. So I was trying

to trying to be careful and make it actual fair use. No. I I really

I just was interested in that because I was I was always wondering, like, because

you always see it in different documentaries. You'll see it

online in a million places. And I'm like, what's the intellectual

property behind the Patterson film? Yeah. That's that's a whole other

movie, I think. Right. Now another thing you were working on, or

another thing that, about the film is the the publicity stunt with the

Empire State Building. And so I read that the press

release from, you know, the website about that. And and, Dan, I wanted to

talk a little bit about the the fur on the Empire

State Building. What was that all about?

Well, you know, there's, there's a group of,

there's a filmmaker. I'm gonna mess up his name if I say it.

It's Louis Castellos or

something like that. Anyway, he he made a movie called Racing Extinction, and

he's done a lot of movies. Most recently, he did one called Game Changer that's

been real popular. He's a he's a he's a

very accomplished and award winning, you know, documentary filmmaker.

And, he did a movie called Racing Extinction,

and as part of their publicity, they were projecting

images of endangered species

onto, like, public landmarks and and buildings. They did it on the

Vatican, and they did it on the Empire State Building. So, you know, it was

just kind of a an April fools joke. We said we are trying to cover

the Empire State Building and for to raise awareness

about Sasquatch and the, you know,

diminishing habitat.

What okay. So I was just I was just wondering because I read the press

release and maybe I might have probably said April 1, 2019. And

Mike a dumbass, I was like, oh, that must be it. My gosh. You fell

for it. Yeah. Because I was looking at it, and I was like, wow. How

did how did I not hear about this publicity stunt?

Because the idea was and there's a little picture of it too. We'll link to

it in the show notes at othersidepodcast.com/290.

We'll link to it. But, it's, you know, it's the Empire State

Building with a bunch of fur over it and then this idea that security guards

or whatever had to go clean it up, and it was all made from, like,

recycled plastic bottles to keep with the environmental

theme. Yes. So so I was hoodwinked

on that. Fair enough. Fair enough. Ken, one thing

I wanted to ask about too, when you were in the

creation of this is probably the most famous recreation

of Bigfoot, at least the most detailed

that I can think of, is Harry from Harry and the Hendersons.

Is that, you know, is is that it's that special effects

creation for the movie. And Yeah. Did you compare and

contrast at all? Or Wendy were working on it, were you like, well, this they've

got this part right. They got this part wrong. Or, I was just wondering

because I think besides your recreation of,

the Patterson Gimlin, Bigfoot, that seems to

be the most detailed, you know,

costume made of the creature. Yes. I agree.

Now the the biggest problem with any kind of a costume

that you that you get, for a sasquatch, that where you're going

to put a human into, is if you look at all of the skulls of

all the other great apes and all of the other hominids, for that matter, from

Neanderthal to Homo erectiheidelbergensis

or, or any of them, the only one that has a tall forehead is

Homo sapiens. And the Sasquatch, if you Mike,

is, its forehead goes back from the

brow ridge, the head moves backwards. So that if you were to actually

take a a an accurate sasquatch

mask and pull it down, your head would stop the

the mask from from lowering low enough to get your eyes through it.

So whenever they use, any whenever they use anything that they have

to put a human head into, the

the the forehead goes straight up like a human and then up to a

point. And a real Sasquatch,

doesn't have that. And this is very apparent in another

piece of film footage. If you if you

go on to YouTube, you can see it's called the Peguis Road

Sasquatch. And what it is is it's a a couple of native guys were

hunting in the winter and a and a huge Mike a big Sasquatch walked

across the road. They pulled the camera out and, of course, they had gone behind

the berm and they got a just a small clip of it walking into the

trees. But at one point, it looks up and you can see the brow

ridge and you can see the head go straight back from the brow ridge. And

Patty does that too. So the the Harry and the Anderson,

they had to alter the forehead in order to get a human actor's

head inside of it or, you know so that that's the first

thing that stands out. And I've seen a lot of of, what I call

fake footage. And as soon as I see that

forehead going straight up, I know it's homozygous. That's something to look out for when

we're seeing all those That's an awesome that one. And, also, the guy

that played Harry and the Henderson, Kevin Peter Hall, he

also played the predator in the the predator films,

and he was the basketball player that could shrink to a tiny

size, in the TV show Misfits of Science, which

we've talked about Misfits of Science on this show at least 4 or 5

times so far, because they had a lot of

very cool paranormal ideas in that TV show that only lasted for 7

episodes. You know, Ken, before you mentioned,

the whole DNA aspect of Bigfoot, and

I you know, I'm interested in how you ended up

getting what you think is a

sack of Bigfoot crap. Like, that I thought

that was awesome. I'm like, what? I'm like, that's the, that was

one of the most exciting parts of the movie for me because Yeah. You're, like,

you're, like, laughing. You're holding up this bag. You know? And even,

you know, even your, your your Mike mentions it.

She's like, look. He's bringing the crap home. And I'm like, yes.

I'm like, I want a sack of pizza crap in my freezer. You know what?

How much money you got? Well, that's Nice.

Right. Well, you know What How much do you think? There's a great story behind

that. We're doing this podcast. And, this trapper friend of mine,

that, you know, he was literally to the point he didn't wanna go out there

anymore. I mean, because he says he was on his trap line for 6 years

and then suddenly they just decided that they accept him. And they would

walk out in front of him and and he said they and this guy is

tough. He's not scared enough and they're nobody, he said, but the things petrify him.

But if you're following accounts Mike all the squatchers know that if

you're anywhere in vicinity of these animals, it's, you will

experience an unreasonable amount of fear. And I still think

it's electromagnetic energy. And we actually did an experiment

with Dan's dog where I actually called 1 in in the nighttime and

his dog turned inside out. Well, everybody knows dogs and wolves communicate

with electromagnetic energy. That's what they do.

So anyways, this he said that this something was robbing his traps,

his Martin set. So he had the beaver cubes with this

stuff called Martin magic, which is, skunk oil and fish

oil mixed with, yeah, mixed together and then put, you know,

made rancid and then put That's good stuff. Alright. Hold

on. We're gonna have to we're gonna have to take a rewind in the we're

gonna have to rewind in the lingo here. He's got his bigger beaver cubes with

some skunk oil and fish oil. Okay. Now we're remember, we're not

we're not hunting. We're talking about we're talking about the west we're talking about the

western and Alberta. Right? So what's the population

of this area? Like, how big are the places we're talking about, and how many

humans live there? You know, very well, almost no humans live there.

There's a there is the odd native encampment out there, there's one that's

close by. But this is public land, it's not land that people live

on, but but they have it divided up in what they call registered trap

lines. Now some of this area is inaccessible because of river

canyons and mountains. As a matter of fact, this

whole area up until the trapper went in there was completely

inaccessible, which is why they've been in there.

You know, they have this habit of getting as far away from people as they

can. So, you know, so when he ran a string

of Martin traps through there, he figured, wow, this has never been trapped here. So,

you know, he'll get a good quote of of Martin of Mike Martins, which is

a fur bearing animal that they make sable coats out of. And so are these

traps Mike leg traps? Are they cages? Or Mike what kind of traps? They're they're

actually called a connoisseur trap. They're they've outlawed a lot of the leg

traps. These are a trap that's like a square and

it it basically is designed to to kill the animal

instantly. And, so what,

what he you put him in a box and you put the bait in the

back and then the marten climbs up the tree and then you catch it and

you find the marten hanging from the trap. It's, you know, dispatched

humanely. And then you reset the trap, rebate it,

and then keep going. But he found all his traps hanging out of these

boxes. They were still set, and the bait was gone, and

each one had 3 rocks sitting on top of the

box. And he couldn't figure out he couldn't figure out who was

jacking with them. And, so

anyways, to make a long story short, he found this bed under a

tree, which which squatchers will know is is called a nest.

And, he said it was Mike a 10 foot round nest, and

it looked like whatever was in there had been living in there for, you

know, weeks or even months because he said there was and this was in

the winter, so everything was frozen. So there there was, he said

piles of, feces all the way around this thing.

And, you know, he drew us a map, he said he wouldn't take us, he

drew us a map, told us which set it was at, we went in there,

we got out the snow shovels and we dug this nest up. And there

was, I mean, a lot of, this scat. And it

looks like human scat or bear scat, but there's

just more of it in a pile, Mike, there's a lot. It's like a triple

flusher. And so So

it was like a treasure map, but the the treasure was Yes.

Scat. Yeah. Right. Yeah. That's right. We I think I still have the map, you

know. But, we we filled up 5 bags,

with gloves on. We actually filmed the whole thing. We filmed the whole procedure.

And, and then, of course, I gave it to I do work for people in

the government, so I know them personally. So I, you know, I convinced the guy

to test it because that's how they were counting grizzly bears, was through

extracting DNA from scat. So I knew that they had the the

preparation and they had the experience to do this. And,

I didn't know you found that, Ken. You should have given me that footage. Where

is that? It's, you know what? I I found the little,

the little cassette. It's sitting on the shelf with all the DVDs right now.

Oh. How'd I miss that? How'd I miss that one? Well, that's the

special features. I didn't it was I had put it aside to keep it

safe, and then I forgot about it when you collected all the other ones.

So so anyway, they tested it. And, you know, they were not gonna tell me

the results, but of course, I knew somebody personally who

was very high up, and he said that it was inconclusive. And I I

thought that meant they didn't find DNA. And he said, No,

we don't know what it is. It doesn't match anything in GenBank. And so

he told me, he said, This is kind of the result you wanted. That's

awesome. And but you know what I don't get? You don't get to be mad,

is every time these guys get out in public, they're like, we had people bring

us, hair samples reported to be sasquatch, and we proved

they were buffalo, or we proved they were horse, or we proved they were human.

But nobody wants to talk about my sample. Mhmm.

You know? Mike, I I I don't look at what's there. I

also look at what's not there. Right. And I kind of I kind

of got the gist after all of this that I wished I hadn't taken the

samples to them, because I think they know what they are. Oh,

man. You know, and and the thing is, in the movie, you'll

talk about a couple of different things. First of all, you,

you know, you you link it to, Gigantopithecus.

Well, we talk about we touched on that subject. Yes. You I mean, as far

as, like, the link as far as when you talk about hominids that could be

as big as what people talk as a sasquatch is. Yes.

And so that that's a good I I was like, oh, I like it when

it brings things back into the realm of the solid

cryptozoology of Gigantopithecus and that's like the Lauren

Coleman model Yep. Versus, like, the Nick Redfern

Bigfoot from another dimension model. And so I kinda

wanted to ask real quick. From the people you've talked to, do

they think of Bigfoot? Because you talk about the fear. Yeah. You know, the the

fear people see and the and the high strangeness that happens often around

Bigfoot sightings. With a lot of the peep what the people that have talked to

you, do you feel the stories have a

supernatural element or an undiscovered crypto element? I think that

they definitely have the, I I there is I mean, there's merit

to it because I've experienced it myself. But everything has,

one way or another, everything has an explanation.

Whether the explanation is is within our comprehension is,

you know and I've heard a lot of people say that they believe

that the the fear is induced by infrasound.

And I've said, okay, well, let's step back for a minute and and you

ask yourself, which animals actually use, you know, infrasound?

Infrasound is more of something that that works underwater, you know?

And all animals to some extent use

electromagnetic energy. As a matter of fact, I hunt

with a suit called a HECS suit. Now it's

h h e c s, human energy concealment

system. And what this this hunting clothes has is

with carbon filaments, an actual Faraday cage.

And I could tell you stories of animals walking right up to

me in the wild that don't know what I am. Even my dog doesn't know

me. When I walk out the door, the dog barks at me, me, because I

all all of a sudden, I have eliminated my electromagnetic

signature, and they've they've tested these suits. You can go on to their website,

the HECS website, And they will show you

people walk up to a wild turkey and

literally almost close enough to grab. I mean, I've walked up to a lot of

wild turkey. It might oh, you mean the animal?

Sorry. Yeah. Well, but you see, so

now now and the the the the conversation that I like

to have and and the analogy I like to use is this. When you

talk about, rudimentary, vocalization in in

mammals, You have your dogs, you know, your dog growls, it,

it it howls, it barks, it yips, it whines, you

know, and these are all communication signals that we understand quite well.

But when you talk about the human brain and what it can do with sound,

all of a sudden we can describe events that happened a 1000000000 years ago.

We can, sing an opera. We can,

talk about math equations to the point where people can actually see what we're

talking about. So we have developed we have gone so

far and developed this sound into something so

complicated that almost every other animal in the animal

kingdom has no no comprehension of what we can do

with sound. Now step back and and and ask

yourself, what if there was an animal that could do this with the

basic, electromagnetic energy? What if there's some an

animal that could could manipulate it

into such a way that they could broadcast it, they could interpret

it. And it's not so far fetched when you think that an eel about a

foot long can create enough electricity to kill a

horse and its rider, if it if it steps on it, you know, an electric

eel. And, and and also I've talked with a lot of people who've

actually seen the red eye shine on sasquatches

without the without the, the presence of any

other light that could refract. And and,

you know, I've I've talked to a number of witnesses about that. Sometimes you'll see

their eyes almost, like, come on like too light. Well, is that like is that

like the monkeys? I mean, there's certain animals Mike lemurs and stuff like that.

Maybe lemurs, but I'm thinking about certain primates that have that kind of reflective thing

in their eyes that, I can't think about. We learned about it in primate

psychology a 1000 years ago. But, that, you know, when seen under

certain light, they seem the eyes seem to glow. Yeah. Well, that's right. Because,

because of the, oh, I don't know what that I forgot what they call it.

It's inside the eye. Actually, I use Yeah. I forgot the name

too. But, but you guys know what I'm talking about, though. But it has a

refractive A lot of animals have it. But when when you

have, when you have something that, like, especially with a primate eye, like even

people, when the when when a person's eye refracts, it

refracts red because of the blood. It it it

kind of obscures things. But if if the animal could

actually could actually, produce light

through some sort of electromagnetic energy or biological energy, it would

automatically be red because of the blood that's flowing through.

So it makes sense in a way. It's a theory, it's only a

theory, but I've talked to enough people about it to say

that there is something about the red eye

shine of a sasquatch maybe being produced and not actually

refracted light. Mhmm. And it would go towards the

it would lean towards electromagnetic theory. You know,

the first time I ever got zapped, as they say it, when I was out

looking for sasquatch, it was a horrifying experience. I have never gone back

out without, a hex suit on with the Faraday cage. I don't ever wanna go

through that again. And I've just, you know, using it as

a, you know, using it as a

theoretically, it's it it'll stop that or or it'll inhibit it from happening.

But when when Dan and I were sitting there, we talked about this theory in

the middle of the night in the in the time when the trapper told me

the sasquatches gather in that area. So I gave a couple of really

quick calls, and I told Ann, I said, your dog, I

said, you know, the dog didn't even lift its head when I called.

And I said, you know, does your dog ever lose control and go

crazy and get really scared? And he said, no. And I said, well,

we can establish right now that I have no magical, mystical powers

over your dog. Well, it was within 10 minutes, that dog

was fixed on that ridge down downwind Wendy and

it was scared, like really scared.

And, so the thing came in, downwind,

went up into that ridge, and as soon as that electromagnetic energy hit us, like

probably scanning us, the dog sensed it right away and

and whatever it was left immediately and then the dog calmed down. But

that really happened and I got the witness on the phone with me that'll tell

you that happened. No. Betty's lying here. She's not

on the phone.

But but so I've so that was my testing of the theory

and I think there's something to it, you know. So a lot of what people

think is paranormal. And we had a I was guiding some

hunters once, and we had an episode where a guy went

outside the tent, and he screamed, and he passed

out. And he and he when he we woke him up, we dragged him back

in the tent, he had no memory. And I'm pretty sure there was a

Sasquatch outside the tent, you know, in in

hindsight. The guy had no memory. He went straight to sleep right afterwards.

And, then I was talking to another fellow, you

guys might have heard of him, he's a friend of mine, Adrian Erickson. And he

talked to a guy who said that he had a Sasquatch standing in

front of him, and he says they appeared to appear and disappear,

almost like they were going in and out of portals. But he said

that he was he got really disorientated and confused,

and he said what was happening was that snippets of his

memory were being erased, is how he described it

to Adrian. Adrian and when he told me that, I thought, bingo,

that has something to do with the people talking about the

sasquatches appearing and disappearing into the portal. If they have this

ability to do this through electromagnetic energy, it's Mike I said, it's

theory. But I only listen to the stories and and accounts that

people tell Mike, and I try to draw theories and conclusions from

that. You know? You can't embellish things. Well, Ken, what you're saying right

there, like, the portals thing. First of all, I love I love the electromagnetic theory.

I love that you're pushing out, trying different things, wearing the hex

suit, all that kind of stuff. Like, that kind of

research and that kind of destroy like, it's fun. It's interesting, and it's

it's pushing things forward, and I think that's important. You talk

about the tree structures in the movie. Yeah. Wendy you talk about, like, when you

see a bunch of trees put together, I mean, all Mike Blair Witch style or

whatever, but they're put together Mike almost like a like a pyramid or, you know,

when you're putting together you're putting a bunch of, Mike, you would make a tent

from, you know, a makeshift tent or something. And

there are some Native American legends in Wisconsin of

if you see trees that bend all the way over and touch the

ground, that those are the portals that the

Sasquatch comes in and out of. Okay. And I just thought that was

interesting. Can you tell me the tree structures? And I had just heard this particular

thing from a native guy that was saying, like, oh, yeah. Well, I believe

in them, but I don't I I believe they're a lot more than just,

you know, just apes undiscovered or whatever. He was Mike, I

believe that they're beings that, you know, come in and out or they're, you know,

there's beings from a different dimension or whatever. And he talks about the legends

of his people or whatever that the the trees bend over and touch the ground.

That's the portals they come in and out of. And so when you're saying that,

that Adrian was telling you about that, that that they seem to disappear and reappear,

and then you talk about the tree structures, that all kind of linked together for

me in, something that I thought was a couple of interesting connections. Well,

when you have people try to explain something away, there's

2 trains of thought. There's, like, you know, and there's still the 2

major trains of thought even to this day. You have your science

based train of thought and you have your religious

train of thought. Okay? Now, with the scientific

train of thought, you have to try to apply existing theories

and you have to try to reason through it in such a way that, you

know, that that you can come back and come up with an

equation eventually. But with the religious train of thought,

the sky's the limit, you know. And with the Native

Americans, God bless them, they the nature

is a religion to them. So they're going to they're going to try

to explain things in a way that Mike,

you know, that makes sense from what their forefathers told them,

you know. So that's one of the things that, that and so what I

try to do is, and believe it or not, I'm a person of

faith, and that comes from a near death experience. But,

but if but really, when it comes to this subject, I try

very, very hard, to differentiate the

people who are talking to me between faith and belief. They're

2 different things, you know. And

so just because I'm

looking for proof, I have to be very, very careful

with my theories. They have to be plausible, because one day I might walk

in with proof and nobody believes it's actually in my hands, I'm a

nutcase, you know. So I I tried to I tried

to I tried to, to keep some semblance of

credibility to the people who are even never going to

believe me. Well, that that seems right. And that's the the thing is

the one thing we have, I was actually talking about this to someone the other

day, is well, you know, when you're talking about the New York Times, so you're

talking about newspapers or something like that. They've been around for a 100 years.

They've earned credibility through, you know,

through daily daily papers or whatever for decades

and it's centuries now in some of these cases of newspapers.

And, but when you're talking about people who are doing their best to

convince you of something, extraordinary,

then your cred like, if if you can't be credible on little things,

how can people trust you on the big things? And and and

that's and I I think that's where it's really

important what you're saying is that you gotta maintain that believability as

much as possible and understand that, you know, these are theories or things

we believe from, you know, empirical evidence and things we've

experienced, and that's the best explanation we can give to you at the Mike,

but of a very real experience that happened. And saying

that, you can't just throw out near death experience without giving us

a little bit of follow-up. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

That's that's, it's one of my favorite stories that I tell people.

You know, and I just wanted to on the other subject really quickly, I just

wanted to say that when it comes to to what you're trying to, when you're

trying to convince people of something or trying to to get your point

across, you have to try very, very hard not to come

across as agenda driven. It's that's

extremely important because the minute somebody senses an agenda, they

will shut you down. And, so you basically what you have to

do is you have to leave the whole thing open as to, you know, okay,

this is what I know. What what's your interpretation, you know? Mike, it

doesn't have to fit my, my beliefs and because I don't wanna stand here

and say, you know, this is true and this is everything else and now we're

gonna stop all logging or drilling, you know. You have to be very careful about

what your agenda is when it comes to things like that. But it's, and

back to the near death experience, when I was 27 years old, I

broke my arm, and of course, I was wrestling with a big Down

syndrome guy and he broke my arm. And it can't be a normal

story. Right? But

anyway I got the visual now. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Like,

so anyway, they sat me up in the chair and I had a compound fracture

in my left arm. And they shouldn't have sat me up because I went into

cyanotic shock and all the blood drained out all the blood drained out

of my head. And all of a sudden,

like everybody there basically said they watched me die.

They said I wasn't breathing, I had no pulse. There was a nurse there. But

none of those guys tried to revive me. I still question that one.

But, I was well, I was Thanks, guys. So they were all looking

at me. I turned white, my mouth turned black, and,

but meanwhile, what happened with me was all of a sudden

everything just became made out of light.

And, all of a sudden it was just light. It was,

pure light. Everything was light. And then I looked at myself and I realized I

was made of light. And then I started to fly. And

I got I was up and I was I was it was the most

amazing thing. I can't even give you words to describe this experience.

Euphoria is a muddy, dirty word. It doesn't even come close

to describing how unbelievably pleasant that

that experience was. And I got to what,

I guess the best way for me to describe it is around light.

But the thing is I'm talking about light inside of light

without polluting the other light sources. And it doesn't make sense when you talk

about it but when I remember it, it makes perfect sense. I even remember

the the feeling of knowing everything. And,

when I got up there, there was a there was somebody

I was talking to somebody and I told them to let me through and they

wouldn't let me through. They told me I wasn't supposed to go through. So I

got in an argument because I did not want to leave and I wanted

to stay there. And I remember this phrase, it's my choice

and you know it. And I said this, and then what

happened after that is a big blank. It's not in my

memory anymore, but I opened my eyes

sitting in the chair. People were crying. The ambulance

was just pulling up. And I started laughing

at everybody, and they turned around and looked at me like I just crawled out

from under a tombstone. And I said, get a camera. We gotta get

pictures of this. Somebody grabbed a camera. And they have pictures of it loading me

with a with a great big crap eating grin on my face being loaded into

the ambulance. I was my my arm never hurt again from the

time I woke up from the worst pain I ever felt to no pain. I

think I negotiated that. Wow. But the thing is, when I came, I

realized afterwards that I came out of that experience

with no fear. I did nothing scares me anymore. Nothing.

Ridicule, people who wanna make fun of me over this. I can make fun of

me better than anybody. So, there's a lot That's

amazing. Mike for a paranormal experience, but I have

since, met a lot of other people who have had exactly the same

experience. And the very interesting thing about it is when I meet somebody

who has that experience, it's almost like I know them. Mhmm. You know, I those

people I I really hit it off with. You know, it's almost like I know

them. It's really strange. It's bizarre. And, you know,

and it it kinda it it became something that in a

subtle way over the years I realized has defined me.

Oh. There's that, you know, experience I had. That's amazing. We talk

we've talked with a lot of people who've had near death experiences and

described very similar, to what you've just said. So that's that's

fascinating and how it impacted you. Yeah. Well, and I watched

a lot of videos on it and Wendy and as soon as people, you know,

were saying that, you know, we live our lives in fear. We're worried about everything.

We're afraid of everything. From Mike we get up till the time we go to

bed. And when all of that is gone, it's almost like,

things just become very clear, you know. It's an

inhibitor that has gone away. But and you're not afraid of death,

which I used to be terrified of death, and I'm just I mean, I'm not

afraid of death, to the point where I need to, you know, go to the

doctor and get my blood work done every year and I don't. I just why?

I don't you know. Wow. Alright. Yeah. So it's it's kind

of, you know, and and it's always in the back of my Mike. But Right.

I I view death completely different than a lot of people around me. That's

amazing. Yeah. It's just, you know, it's Thanks. So,

and I'm quite confident in what I experienced. Well,

I'm completely confident in it, whether people believe me or not. And I

like to tell people, you know, and I've actually comforted a lot of people

who were a, terminal or had family members that were

terminal just by telling them what I experienced. That's a wonderful gift. Well, I

guess. I guess, you know. And thanks for sharing that experience with

us. I had no idea that was gonna be part of our conversation,

but it's fascinating. But, anyway, go back to Sasquatch.

Oh, yeah. We're we're getting short on time here. But getting back to the the

nuts and bolts of your amazing model that you made of

the Sasquatch, I just had a question that I was curious about the model

itself. I was wondering, number 1, does it have a

name? Its name is Patty.

Okay. You know, we've we've referenced we've referenced Patty

throughout this this conversation. And and the reason for

that is, you know, Roger Patterson was the guy

that filmed that famous movie in 1967.

Okay. Apparently, they they referred to the figure as

Patty. Oh, that's cute. And I heard I heard that it's

because And it was a female because she's got boobs. Right. Right. And and his

wife's name was Patricia, and I think that's why, but I don't really

know, but everybody in the, yeah, in the Bigfoot community

refers to that figure as Patty, and and and this one was modeled after her.

So I think, you know, I mean, it wasn't it wasn't me that first started

calling her Patty. I think it was Ken, but they, she's always been

known as Patty. But this was the first time I thought of the actual figure

from from the Bigfoot from that movie as a woman. Like, I've always thought of

it as a dude. She kept on calling Patty. I'm like, Patty, why? And then

I'm like, wait. Bigfoot's got Snoobs.

Mike, it totally blew me away. I was like, no. I'm sorry. I was just

Mike, I never thought of Bigfoot. I never even thought of like, female male Bigfoot.

I never even thought of, like, that she might have to wear a big bra.

But does Patty so I know you guys bring Patty you brought her to the

film festival and everything. Does Patty have a home now?

Or is she slated to go somewhere? Because we've been to about

several paranormal museums that I bet would just be clamoring to

have this amazing model. Right. Fighting for it. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, Ken Ken gave her to me recently.

And and I've been traveling with her to promote the movie. And I had, you

know, extensive plans to to go to more festivals and

screenings. Sure. And, I mean, actually, it was supposed to screen

tonight, you know, in in, Boston area. So, you

know, all those things have been canceled because of the, you know,

coronavirus, you know, concerns. And so,

yeah, I don't know what's gonna happen. There's still a chance that things kind of

return back to normal, do some Mike touring with her. But But she's safely

sheltered in place with you? Yeah. She's suffering here. She's got a extra

large mask for when we go out in the public. And and,

I think she's probably immune. I think she has a natural immunity to it

because, you know, a lot of them live in caves and they eat you know,

they snack on guano regularly. Yeah. So That's a

fair point. Yeah. If you can handle that, you can well, they got big

lungs too. So respiratory thing Yeah. They can just they just cough it right

out. They actually have 30 lungs. If anybody else has got

the 10,000 memes on their Facebook feed about the Sasquatch is the

social distancing champion. Oh, yeah. That's the first

Oh, yeah. So her home is with you, Dan. She's she's,

she's just you got an extra roommate for a while. Resting up and waiting to

go out to her again. So hopefully hopefully, we'll get her out

there. And and she may end up at some point in a museum. I think

that might be a good a good home for her to, you know

Absolutely. In her old age. Yeah. Yeah. I should

probably mention too, I kept casts of of, of the mannequin and

everything after I made it, so I can make another one anytime I want.

And and Dan invested a lot of his life and a lot of his money

into this project, and she's the iconic original that was

made in the, in the movie. So I think he

deserves to have her. Uh-huh. And I could because I can always make another one.

And I really I really wanna make a better one, to be honest. I I

know I hate to say it, but I think I can make a lot better

one, you know. But, but now just recently, I should tell you guys

there was some some stills came from a,

a piece of, or a video of a sasquatch in

Colorado looking through somebody's window. And did you guys see those?

I don't think I've seen that yet. You know, actually, I thought that was on

Adrian Erickson's, like, Twitter or his Facebook or something like that. I

think he shared it. Well, it's that that thing's real, and it's a male.

And the the thing that really killed me about it was I took on you

can see its eyes. You can see its nose. And the nose is in the

right position, first of all. Like, you know, people don't know that. But the thing

that really got Mike was the morphological differences

between, the head and the one in that picture, which has to be a male

because the the the Wendy sill is 8 feet up, and a

female wouldn't be able to see that high. And this thing's about 9 feet tall.

So, but the morphological differences in the head

are actually the in the same parameters as they are from a

gorilla, from a female gorilla, Patty, to a male gorilla. This this

thing looking through the window with the the the type of forehead and

head it had and crowned it had. So I basically

now have what I believe is enough reference

to make a a male model now, just from those pictures. Oh,

so Patty gets a boyfriend. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yep.

You know? Anyway, the movie is really fun, and, you know,

we all had a great time watching it. And you guys obviously had a great

time making it. We didn't even we didn't even talk about

the whole, Roy Orbison impersonator thing,

but, that's a treat for you guys when you watch Bigfoot. That's where all the

royalty money went. But the but the

one thing is, so, Cam, when you're in the studio

and you're singing, you're dressed up like you're going to the office. What was the

ins my last question is what was the inspiration behind the suit? That was Dan.

Dan. Dan, you know, he says, you know, we're we're renting a suit for you.

And I'm like, really? I said, okay. Okay. Thanks for your

help. And the actual glasses that I wore in that

one scene there were actual Roy Orbison issue glasses.

And so we thought we would do a tongue in cheek sort of

thing. Of course I did the the song in dreams,

which I is my one of my favorite if not my favorite piece of the

movie. And, that came out really, really Mike. You know, of

course, I had the glasses and the suit on, and it was kind of a

heartfelt moment, so I liked it. But, but, yeah,

like, you know, I think that Dan Dan had a vision, and I I guess

he figured that, you know, rather than me in one of my GladWork shirts or

something like that that Or like a Canadian tuxedo of all denim. Oh, there

was there was a guy in the film wearing one of those. Well

yeah. I love it. No. It's great. Well, you know, I think Big First got

a powerful message, whether you know, however you feel about

taxidermy and stuff. Like, the thing is that the the combining of,

the conservationists from hunters and taxidermists and things

to the conservation of people that believe in the environment and and care

about that, there's a there's a place to connect both of them.

And, I think that the film really delivers that message powerfully.

And, so even though, like, the attraction for,

like, me and Wendy and stuff is that we see, like, oh, Bigfoot. We gotta

go check it out. There's also, I think a moral in

there for everybody about the importance about saving these wild places,

like in Alberta and stuff and places untouched by humans because

there's a lot of cool things out there left to discover. Absolutely.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm glad you got that. Yeah.

It's an entertaining movie and it and, you know, the movie very early

on as Dan puts it, you know, it's okay to laugh. You know, there's there's

some kind of tongue and cheek stuff with with, you know, animation and and, you

know, funny moments in it. And and it the movie lets you know right from

the beginning that, you know, it it it takes itself seriously,

but not too seriously. So it's it's it's good entertainment. It

doesn't it's not, you know, not so offensive. It's it's, you know,

it's not necessarily agenda driven, but the messages are in

there. Absolutely. Now, Dan, if people wanna see

Big Fur, where's the best opportunity that they can go check out the film

or, you know, a website or purchase it

or see it in upcoming where can they find upcoming showings?

Sure. Well, there were you know, we had plans for festivals for

the next 6 months, and those are probably either all

postponed or or canceled. So Uh-huh. It's probably I'm already

there. Your next chance is probably gonna be, streaming

in some way. It'll probably go to something like iTunes first. But

but if you wanna follow along, you can go to the website and install that

for updates. That's big fur movie.com.

And we won't send you a whole ton of emails. In fact, you'd be

lucky if you ever get Mike. But you can check on there

and and as soon as it's actually available online, there's a process

that that it will go through over the next few months. But by the end

of the summer, it should be available if you look for it. And then we

have a Facebook page and an Instagram. And and so, you know, you

all you can link through all those things from the, website.

Sounds good. And, Ken, if people wanna, know more about your

creations or find you online in a place where they can see,

some more of the, amazing things that you have built.

Where can they find it? Basically, I just have a Facebook page and I just

it's almost anybody can look at it. I don't have any

privacy parameters on it so much, you know. I've

right now, I'm I'm I'm in the midst of of transitioning

my business. I've more or less retired now. I'm going into

designing product for other taxidermists and and just going into other

endeavors. So I'm kind of at a weird place. I'm between

careers, you could say, almost, in some ways. So,

you know, I mean, you but if you if you Google me or you go

online, you can you can find what I'm doing. Sounds good. Well, I'm

sure with a talent like yours, it'll find a home. And,

Dan, you as well, a filmmaker with a wonderful film. And we want to, just

thank you both for joining us today on See You on the Other Side. And

wherever you guys are going next, I hope it's an awesome place. Oh,

thanks. It was yeah. Yeah. It's just been a great journey. Yeah.

Yeah. Thanks a lot, guys. It was fun. Thank you. And special thanks to

Scott Marcus of what's your ghost story dot com for introducing us to Ken

and Dan. He thought we might be interested in their story after he interviewed

them during the Slamdance Film Festival that happens during Sundance

Film Festival. And if you wanna see his interview, you can find a link to

it at othersidepodcast.com/290. For the song

this week, there were a couple of things that we just couldn't resist. Number 1,

Ken isn't just a world class taxidermist. He's

also a Roy Orbison impersonator. He sings a bunch in the film, and it's

great. Number 2, the fact that they call the sasquatch in

the Patterson Gimlin film, Patty for short. And I didn't

even know it was a female until now. Well, that kinda blew my

mind. So we couldn't resist making a rockabilly

song about our favorite new girl, and that's

Patty.

Thank you for listening to today's episode. You can find us

online at othersidepodcast.com. Until next

Mike. See you on the other side. So we know we

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I want a sack of Bigfoot crap in my freezer.