Shownotes
Do you want to start making money from your podcast? Well, we talked to a Hall of Fame Podcaster who is the perfect person to show you how.
Dave Jackson from The School Of Podcasting has written a new book entitled “Profit From Your Podcast,” which talks about your next steps after launch, and is the perfect tactical gameplan for you to be able to be profitable with your podcast.
Dave is also an amazing Coach and shares some fantastic stories of past failures from podcasters that you can avoid!
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Full Episode Transcript:
Dave Jackson - Profit From Your Podcast
Do you want to start making money from your podcast? Will we talk to a hall of fame podcast or who is the perfect person to show you how Dave Jackson from the school of podcasting has written a new book, entitled profit from your podcast, which talks about your next steps after launch. Dave is also an amazing coach and share some fantastic stories of past failures from podcasters that you can avoid.
Let's get to it.
Dave, how are you, sir? Oh, I'm glad to be here. This is a, this is going to be fun, man. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. I think a lot of people, no, that you are, one of, one of the legends in the podcasting industry and you started in, I want to say it was a 2005, 2005. Yeah. Back when It was painful.
There was no iTunes yet. There was no Apple and you go to somebody and go, Hey, do you want to start a podcast? And they go, do I need an iPod for that? And you're like, no, it was just the first few years was just painful. I think all of the problems that I've heard from recent podcasters, and it's always can you start one for free?
What's the best microphone. Those are always like the questions. And so I can imagine over the years you've heard. All and seeing all of the mistakes that a lot of podcasters have made. And I think one of them is worrying too much about all of the gear and all of the tech and all of the muck before they actually worry about what they're going to talk about.
Yeah. I've actually, I had a guy hire me as a client. And he had put out thousands of dollars had this really nice video layout and nice DSLR camera and lighting and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, he had all this, just everything was just top-notch and I'm like, great it go tell me about your podcast.
And he goes, that's the part I need help with. And I was like, Oh, okay let's, let's back up a little bit. We got the cart a little bit, just a little bit before the horse there. So yeah, but you don't have to spend thousands of dollars. I usually tell people about the price of an X-Box. We'll get you up and going, Dave.
I love your story. You definitely are. I would call you a self-made man. When I read about how you started, basically, like you said, with the government cheese and worked your way up to where you are today, it just. That's what sometimes, like to say, it's that way now is one of the great things about America, but I got an, I got to ask you about this crystal ball, right?
Because in the book at the end of the preface, and I told Chris, this was just like you must've known something. He goes, one last thing as I write this it's February 20, 20, things may change by the time you read this. Please keep that in mind. I was like, how did he know? Yeah. I just off the crystal ball every now and then ask it for a couple of lottery picks and then Do you know, magic eight ball.
Will there be a pandemic in 2020 chances are yes. Okay. There we go. It's just wow. So right there, even before getting into chapter one, you already had me like, Oh, this guy, he's got some great nuggets in this book and I'm excited about it. So tell us a little bit about what it was like.
Is this your. First book that you've really written. It's the first time I've worked with a publisher. My very first book, my very first podcast was for musicians. And it was called, get your band out of the basement and keep them out of the asylum. And so that was my first one and I put it on Amazon, the whole nine yards.
And then I want to say about seven years ago, the book was called more podcast money and it was it was like the precursor to profit from your podcast. In fact, I'd actually started to. Rewrite that, because that version of the book doesn't even mention Patrion, there was no crowdfunding back then when I wrote the book.
And so I started, I was like, I need to rewrite this. And it was just so funny. And at that point I got an email from a publisher that said, Hey, You seem to know what you're talking about when it comes to podcasting, would you be interested in writing a book about profiting from your podcast? And I was like as a matter of fact, I'm working on that right now.
So that was a, it's been a little different as a podcaster, as an entrepreneur, you're used to just let's hit the ground running and go. And this is different working with a publisher. There are pros and cons to each, but I'm just used to, Hey, this is what I want to do. Let's do it. And they're like it has to go through this checkpoint and that, then this person's going to give it to Harold.
Who's going to give it to Susan. And I'm like, really, like when I originally turned in the the, like the final draft of it and they're like, okay, great. They go. And this was back in September of 2019. And I said, so is there any chance this is going to be ready by Christmas? And they're like no, this will be ready in July.
And I was like, wait, how does it take nine months to make a baby and 10 months to make a book? So it's, but on the other hand, they've, it looks really nice and it, it's a different experience and pay wise. It's different. When you self publish, you put out all the money up front, you buy the, in my first book I had two editors and I hired a guy to.
Design my my cover, this, they pay you upfront and they do all that fun-filled stuff. And then you get royalties later. Question Mark, hopefully, that's how that's going to work. So there are pros and cons to each in your book. You're basically seeing the things that everybody needs to a prophet in your podcast.
And what I loved about it was. The last thing you talk about are the tools are the specific tools. And again, it goes back to listen, if you're a podcast or stop worrying about the Shure, SM seven B Mike and getting this huge expensive thing. Worry first about what you're doing on your podcast.
And I think that message is great to hear from someone like yourself has been doing it, for 15 plus years in the podcasting space. So I was that intentional on your part to leave that last or it was just because. Again, I knew that things were going to change. Cause I was like, this is the technology part, right?
Let's save this to the very end. And that way, if something changes, it'll be there. And I've also got a spot in the book for people that buy the book that they can go and I'll have a thing online where, cause it's going to change. It's just, that's the nature of technology. So then in the future, if you want an updated list of that'll be an option as well for those thoughts.
So when you do update for. Tools that you think would be valuable for someone who's bought your book today. And it's three years from now, you'll have an updated sort of tools list. He's got a link, but we're not going to share because you got to buy the book. I just said it right. Don't give it away to everyone.
The the fun thing is I have an episode of the school of podcasting and it's 27 steps to start a podcast. And it's actually one of the few episodes I really want to go back. And rerecord because I'm talking about buying a mixer and buying this microphone. And it's that is not what I would recommend today because things have just, they've made it easier.
And I was thinking about that the other day, because somebody said don't, I need a mixer. And I'm like, who's telling you to get a mixer. And I'm like you are in this episode over here. And I was like, Oh, I might want to redo that. So I wanted to do two things there. Number one is. To sign up and get this extra information.
You're going to have to give me your email. And that doesn't mean I'm going to spam you to death, but it means I am going to have further contact with you. Hopefully in the future and we can start that relationship. So that's one. And then number two, you get the updated stuff. As it as life happens and technology changes, you get to keep up to date with the latest stuff, as someone who does has given you my email, I will say that you, I do not get spammed, but I do love the email that I get from you.
It's the halftime. Email. Yeah. What I can remember. It's one of those things right now, I'm in the middle of moving. I don't know if you guys have moved lately. It's so much fun to pick up everything you want and move, but it's just simply, here's a cause people say you have so many podcasts.
How do I keep up with them? And I'm like here sign up for my newsletter. And it's just, here's what I did, who is her interviewed. And then sometimes something will catch my eye and I'm like that's kinda cool. And I'll just, it's just links. It's Hey, here's a quick and I call it the halftime report cause it's Wednesday.
And I figured between Monday and Sunday, Wednesday's in the middle and it's just a way to keep up to date with what's going on until The next school of podcasting comes out. Amazon actually did a launch podcasts recently, so I thought it would be great while we have Mr. Dave Jackson on the show.
Dave, I don't know if you've had a chance to to play around with with podcast in the Amazon music app and lo and behold, look at this, They just top of the charts here on the Amazon school of podcasting. Any thoughts on Amazon launching podcasts in general?
For one, I love it. Just, it's another phone book for lack of a better phrase. It's something that gives you think about it. The phone books make makes it easy to find whatever it is you're looking for. So to me, it's another really big phone book. Which is great. I love the fact that the formatting of it, if you compare it to something like Spotify and some other apps that, they aren't really fully embracing podcasting maybe and all the links work and things like that.
So I'm thrilled. I was like, all right well done. And they didn't do in the past. Other companies would make a copy. Of your file, which created this weird, you had your normal stats and then you'd have like your Amazon stats. They're not doing that. So they've learned, I think, from other people's mistakes, which is a great strategy, no matter what you're doing.
And I'm excited. I know Rob ball choose the vice-president of Libsyn. On the last episode of the feed said after I think it was a week or a day or something like that, it was already getting more attention than some apps that have been around for years. So it's one of those things where. Things jump in and out of podcasting and you never sure exactly what the impact is going to be in.
Rob said, we probably won't know until the end of November exactly how many people are using this, but I'm just hoping that they just help promote podcasting. And that one person's apart what you know, that they might actually click on that and find that to your point. I think I'm happy that this is just casting a wider net.
There's a ton of people that don't know what a podcast is and it being available on a massive platform like Amazon, it just can't help, but be good. And if that creates more fans, more listeners of not just our content, but podcasts in general, maybe they gravitate to another app. That's got. More stuff going on, where you can save playlists and share more easily and have all of that other stuff, but it's a gateway.
And I think when Spotify launched, it was the same thing. It is a podcast app. It was a music app and there, there was, but just think of the impact for podcasts in general, to be able to just cast that wider net. Yeah. And the I just refer to her as the woman in the tube.
So we don't set off people's little hockey puck on your desk, but from my understand, it's going to be easier. To call up a podcast via your voice. Now that they have that set in both in the past, they were using tune-in as their default. So I'm sure tune in is just thrilled that Amazon has got into the podcasting space because they've now, as you might imagine, that's now the default for if you're going to use your voice to call a podcast that there'll be using that.
So it's awesome. I'm glad to see them. Yeah. I wonder if you've already spoken to the woman with the letter, the name that starts with a and the POC on your desk. If you've already sinked that with another player. If they'll supersede that and redirect you to, or will they just like out of consumer experience and user experience, maybe they just let that go and all new devices will have that, inherently in them.
Yeah. I think if you haven't said anything in the app, in the woman's app, that starts with a I think if you haven't done anything, then it's the default. But if you go in and say, My default in a video, streaming is Netflix and my podcast is blah, blah, blah, whatever. Then I think they'll leave it alone.
Yeah. I don't have one of those devices around me and you guys have headphones on, so it's an Alexa device where on Amazon. I have to say it. We can't tiptoe around it. And not to mention Chris, I think. One of the things. And I think that's where I sometimes look at Amazon is that sleeping giant is they have so much data, so much information, and they really in some aspects have been first when it comes to voice, whether it's flash briefings or all this other things.
So this, I thought, I think, is a logical step for them. And I do believe it's not all podcasts, but some podcasts are actually even being pushed into the audible platform. So I wanted to talk about something that Dave brought up in a. I want to say it was in chapter two where we're content is King. And I love how he describes it because Chris, how many times do we talk about people are, they're worried about countdown timers and their video, and they're spending all this money, and this really resonated with me, it's content that moves you.
It taps into your emotion. It entertains you. It makes you laugh. It makes you cry. It makes you think it makes you groan. It educates or entertains you. If your contents not doing that, nobody's going to listen. Nobody's going to watch. And I think people forget that they get so caught up in, Oh, I want to get my stuff out there and just people are going to come buy from me.
No, they're not. And. And Dave also talks about the relationship building piece and building community. And I think that is so important. And, I've been reading about some of these examples of people that he talks about. And as I was like, wow, I never thought of it. My, my step son is actually becoming a crime scene investigator.
And I was reading about this coroner that Dave talks about how this guy has developed this. He, like he said, he's probably making more per month than we can even think about right now, just from starting a podcast and a website in a niche. He shrines with quiche type of thing.
So I thought that was pretty cool. And then the next chapter he talks about presentation is queen. And of course I'm disliked. Wow. So Dave, you're a genius in my book anyway. I appreciate that. Yeah. You're talking about Darren Dake, who does the corner talk and this was the guy that started off, a lot of people, if we take the Joe Rogan's of the world and the Dax Shepard, and think these guys have been entertainment for years, Darren Dake was a coroner in the middle of Missouri.
So no huge social following, things like that. He just wanted to talk to other corners. And so he started her corner talk and started to do that. And then somebody said, this guy seems to know what he's talking about. Maybe we should have him come talk at our, some sort of assembly or whatever.
And then somebody saw him talk and said, Hey, can you come talk to my thing? And it just, it didn't happen overnight there. I just heard this new phrase. I don't know. I guess it's been around for a while. You don't eat the fruit the day you plant the seed. And I was like, I love that. So this took a while to build up, but eventually he found this weird loophole where some States don't, you love the government.
Some States make you get certified every year. To keep your corner status, but they don't offer the training. I was like, that is brilliant. So this is a case where Darren hopped in he's up to his neck and his niche, and he finds out that there's a need, Hey, these people need certified. There's no place to go.
So he built one and he actually started, I believe in his bedroom. And then he moved to the basement of a church and now he actually has his own kind of building. And just in time for you guessed it Corona virus, he started doing training online and now as it is just making. A lot of cash doing it.
He was one of the guys on my, can we put what you make? And he goes no, that's good. He goes, it's a, it goes, but he let me know. It's a lot. And I was like, that's it. I amen. My friend. I'm so glad. And that's one of the things I wanted to do. Was, I didn't want it to be the Dave Jackson show. Here's what I've done.
And here's, it's no. And it was more, I didn't start off to do this, but people are like, it's like little baby white papers of here's what this guy did. Here's what it worked. Here's what didn't work. I know, I talk a lot about Jonathan Oaks who has a trivia podcast when it comes to Patrion.
Cause he's just crushing it over there. So I just interviewed a lot of different people. And that's where I lucked out. I just reached out to the school of podcasting audience and I said, Hey, if you are making
