DJ Sir Daniel and Jay Ray trace MTV Unplugged from its late-1989 launch through its rise in popularity as the Milli Vanilli lip-syncing scandal put a spotlight on which artists could actually perform live. The conversation centers on how the acoustic format pressured artists to demonstrate vocal and instrumental skill in real time, with particular attention to Uptown Records' 1993 label-wide taping featuring Heavy D & the Boyz, Jodeci, and Mary J. Blige. The hosts connect that moment to the broader shift away from the drum machine and keyboard production that defined New Jack Swing, and examine how Unplugged performances by Mariah Carey, LL Cool J, Maxwell, Lauryn Hill, and Jay-Z shaped audience perception of these artists' range.

The Breakdown

• How the Milli Vanilli scandal fueled Unplugged's popularity, even though the series had already launched months earlier
• Uptown Records' 1993 label showcase and its role in repositioning Mary J. Blige and Jodeci beyond New Jack Swing's studio-built sound
• Yo! MTV Raps Unplugged and what LL Cool J, A Tribe Called Quest, and MC Lyte's performances revealed about hip-hop's live capability
• Maxwell's 1997 Unplugged and Lauryn Hill's 2001 special, and how each artist used the format at very different points in their careers

Uptown Records, Andre Harrell, Sean "Puffy" Combs, Heavy D & the Boyz, Jodeci, Mary J. Blige, Maxwell, Lauryn Hill, and Jay-Z all factor into a discussion that positions Unplugged as a turning point for how New Jack Swing-era artists were evaluated on musicianship rather than production polish.

Chapter Markers

00:00 Intro Theme

00:16 Welcome to Queue Points

00:57 MTV's Evolution and the Birth of Unplugged

04:42 Quick Transition

04:43 The Unplugged Concept and Mariah Carey

08:06 Nirvana and Yo! MTV Raps Unplugged

15:15 Insert Transition

15:22 Uptown Records MTV Unplugged

22:36 Quick Transition

22:37 Maxwell's Unplugged

26:21 Insert Transition

26:28 Lauryn Hill's Unplugged

32:38 Dream Unplugged Performances That Never Were

38:54 Jay-Z Unplugged

41:01 Outro and Sign Off

42:27 Outro Theme

Support Queue Points

Become An Insider: https://link.queuepoints.com/membership

#NewJackSwing #MTVUnplugged #BlackMusicHistory #UptownRecords #90sRnB

Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast.

I am DJ Sir Daniel

And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my governments

as Johnnie Ray Kornegay III.

And Sir Daniel, we are going into the way back machine, into a time in music

history, uh, where we got to watch some of the most popular contemporary

artists strip down what they were doing on record and give us these,

uh, acoustic style performances.

And it was a whole moment in time

It definitely was.

At this point, MTV, we've moved into the late '80s, early '90s.

Um, I think for historical context, at this point, MTV is the video,

um, platform that all the record labels are sending their artists

to because at this point, MTV has diversified a lot of their programming.

Um, it's not just music videos.

They have live shows.

They have different types of programming to make, to keep you tuned into

MTV 24 hours a day, which is what they wanted 'cause it's on cable.

And, um, also, as I stated, it's the early, it's the late '90s going…

It's the late '80s going into the early '90s, and at this point, I

think, Jay Ray, we've, the pivotal moment that we can think about is

the Milli Vanilli situation where

exactly it.

That's why we needed

they caught,

they were caught lip syncing or accused of lip syncing, and it just became a moment

of exposure where a lot of artists were like, "Oh, well, that's not us. We can

really do the thing. We play instruments, or we can really sing." And so MTV, um,

created a program called MTV Unplugged.

Mm-hmm.

and as Jay Ray said, this was a moment for artists to come and

really show off their chops, whether it's playing acoustic instruments,

nothing but a guitar, a drum, maybe some keys, and that's it, and the vocals.

Yeah

Well, also MTV is evolving, um, racially as well because at this

point, remember in the early days, MTV didn't have any Black, wasn't

featuring any Black artists until Michael Jackson kicked in the doors.

David Bowie, um, talked to, um, like really sh- um, showed them up and, and,

and embarrassed them on television.

Like, "Why don't you have Black artists on

Right

this channel?" And so MTV has evolved.

We've got Yo!

MTV Raps.

We've got, um, some, uh, R&B programming, um, that comes into play here and there.

But we've got, um- More artists from the Black community, from

the Black music community showing up on MTV on a regular basis.

Hip-hop as a culture, uh, uh, the, is in like full upward trajectory at

this point, and so it's, so MTV has no choice but to include programming and

tailor programming around Black artists.

Yeah

And one, and one of the complaints, like we could go back to

the whole Milli Vanilli thing, and one of the complaints was that, you know,

rappers don't really play instruments, and rappers aren't really musicians.

Yep

So a lot of… So hip-hop heard that challenge and said, "Hold

my beer. We're going to come and do not just MTV Unplugged, we're

going to do Yo! MTV Unplugged."

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yo!

MTV, uh, Raps Unplugged.

mm-hmm

Jay Ray, before we, before I let you go, I wanna say, I wanna

give, um, s- um, props to Ted Demme,

Mm-hmm

Fab 5 Freddy, Todd One, Dr. Dre and Ed Lover because they,

uh, behind the scenes, you know, some of them were front-facing, but

behind the scenes they really had to fight for this representation.

So I really wanna give them props, and Ted Demme was, fought for it as well.

He, and he was the white guy that helped push it through.

So shout out to those and, and rest in peace to Ted Demme.

Unplugged a very interesting and unique concept for the moment.

Um, if we think about the 1980s the early 1990s, everything for

the most part had moved electronic in some way, shape, or form.

Very keyboard-heavy, drum machines, um, not a, a, a, a lot of, um, actual

instruments, uh, in the tr- in the acoustic traditional sense, right?

Right

Unplugged gave, uh, artists the ability to do was to reimagine, these

songs in front of this smaller audience.

It was a much more intimate crowd.

Um, but it also gave them an opportunity, quite frankly, to your

point, to show off their chops.

Like, can you, can you rock this kinda crowd?

And to that point- Um, I, there are so many Unplugged performances that I

absolutely love, but when I think of Black MTV Unplugged performances that

really, like, made an impact on me and I was like, "Oh, snap," um, Mariah Carey

and Trey Lorenz doing I'll Be There

Oh yeah

a moment in time.

Now, we should also contextualize this moment for Mariah Carey.

This is really key.

Mariah Carey is, has become a superstar by the time she does Unplugged, right?

Her first album goes crazy.

She's now a year later releasing her second album.

is in a crystal case, like in terms of how she's being treated, right?

Mm-hmm

And people have questions about can she really do that?

Like, is that a thing?

That thing that she's doing on the records, can she really do that thing?

The Whistle Notes

The whistle notes and, like, all of that, because Mariah

records, she- Mariah's a studio rat.

Those records are heavily produced.

She loves being in the studio.

But can she reproduce it?

what we learned in the Unplugged performance was she absolutely could.

And

rest

could she reproduce it, she showed us who her influences were,

like, through these performances.

Like, you clearly got to see, like, Mariah in this way.

So even just, uh, her and Trey doing I'll Be There, which was a super

interesting choice, unique, but Mariah bodied, and Trey Lorenz bodied, too,

and it was, like, not even a thing.

Mariah was like, "No, do that."

Juzwiak

"I need you to do your thing." And it became just, like,

such an important hallmark performance of what Unplugged could be.

It, it showed Black artists like, oh, if you go here and show what you can

do, it'll give you something else.

And Mariah got a whole other hit out of this with I'll Be There, but

it was from the Unplugged release

She sure did.

I think, um, I, I wanna say, so there's two things that I wanna harken to as far

as like, uh, what really stands out to me as far as MTV Unplugged performances.

Um, the very first MTV Unplugged performance that really made me

sit up and take notice was Nirvana.

Nirvana's, um, d- doing their, um, "Smells Like Teen Spirit,"

Mm-hmm.

from that al- from those albums, and I think,

If their

I

had come out, yeah,

think the second album had come out then.

Mm-hmm.

so hearing them do that, and what MTV was great for doing was

not only were they playing the actual music videos, but what they would do is

they would edit those, um, live, those Unplugged performances and put them in

rotation on, on their programming, and you could see, you could watch those,

um, live performances over and over again as they came up in programming.

So, you know, Black people, uh, we live for Nirv- Nirvana.

We love us a Teen Spirit, and so I absolutely loved that performance.

But when M- Yo!

MTV Raps Unplugged came along, that was an event, Jay Ray.

It was

That was an event.

Um, we, you had LL Cool J, A Tribe Called Quest, De La Soul,

Mm-hmm

the lone female rapper of the group, MC Lyte.

Yep

the only one, and she did "Cappuccino," and I think they,

everybody did probably about one song.

I think LL Cool J may have been the one that was able to go on a little longer.

But LL Cool J's performance really stands out in my mind because at

that moment I realized that he was, he was more than just a rapper.

Mm-hmm

I think he became, he became fully realized because we had never seen

him in that element, and I think nobody ever r- nobody really expected these

MCs, these rappers who were used to just having a microphone and a DJ or a DAT to

rap to could, one, keep up with a band

Yeah.

Can

And

stay there for a minute?

Oh, keep going,

absolutely.

get back to that

Certainly, to one, keep up with a band and be in pocket with a band

Yeah

um, and also, um, not rely heavily on being overproduced.

Like,

Yeah

I have-- I can project.

I can, I can rap and make you feel it right here in the front row, and you in

the nosebleeds, you're gonna feel it too.

Yeah

everybody on that lineup, but with in particular LL Cool J really

stands out in those performances and really, I think took, made people sit

up and notice about hip-hop even more and really took a rapper seriously.

And I think after that, and we're gonna talk about bands here, you saw a lot more

rappers taking bands on the road with them after, after MTV, YonTV, um, Unplugged

Yep, that's exactly where I wanna spend some time.

I think this is such an important moment to kind of spend some time in this

history, 'cause you're absolutely right.

so interesting about rap music is a culture, uh, as a, as a, as a

format, rapping was such a live experience, like when it first begins.

It's a live experience.

It is this, this, this MC and this DJ kind of interacting with this

crowd that's in front of them, right?

And, and just kind of like coming off the dome and doing all this stuff.

Um, when rap transitions to a recorded art form, there's no model for doing what

they were doing on stage in a studio yet.

Like, that's not a thing.

You- a DJ then wasn't able to go in and do what they were doing on stage in a studio.

It just wasn't the time for that yet.

what rap was when it became a recorded art form was they would

have bands that would be replaying these breaks in the studio, right?

Because that's how you had to do it then.

They were using the traditional production model of how records were

produced in that moment in time, and creating rap records on top of them.

So these are, these are bands in the studio playing

with rappers rapping, right?

the time we get the drum machine- Rap is, uh, its own thing, right?

So we no longer need the band in the studio.

Studios are more sophisticated.

We're able to kind of do the things that we're able to do,

uh, on stage in the studio now.

We can sample the way that we can sample.

We got this MPC.

We're able to do everything that we can do.

We don't need a band per se, right?

So that's where we are when this happens, right?

So we hadn't seen, this is pre-Digable Planets.

This is pre The Roots.

This is after Stetsasonic, but Stetsasonic was just like

a rare experience in hip-hop.

You know what I mean?

Where you have this hip-hop band.

So could that be something that's commercially viable?

And to your point, Sir Daniel, the Yo!

MTV Raps Unplugged proved that one, rappers could rock with a band.

One, the band could figure, like, could be in that pocket, 'cause the important

thing about hip-hop is the pocket.

Like, that drummer has to be able to do that thing repetitively so

that rapper can do what they do.

But they can interplay, and so this proved that that was possible.

loved Lyte's performance in this MTV Unplugged.

First of all, Cappuccino was just made for this environment.

Um, shout out to MC Lyte and her storytelling.

Like, probably just need to do a show

What's a cafe on the West Side?

Midtown." You know

"So I stepped in and I ordered a cup." So it's just such great storytelling.

But, um, A Tribe Called Quest, right, who are a new band, right?

They're a new group at the time when MTV Unplugged happens.

Um, they are still a four-pack at this f- at this point.

And doing, uh, Can I Kick It Live, you know?

And of course, sampling, you know, the, the band is playing Walk on the Wild Side,

Mm-hmm

their own.

And I think to your point, Sir Daniel, this was the moment when folks figured out

like, oh, hip-hop is more than just people

Fix that

and a DJ.

Like, you can have a band, and this is pre bands including DJs.

Now it's regular to have a DJ

Have both.

Yep

what I'm saying?

The DJ is just kind of part of the band like everybody else.

But before this happened, that was completely rare, and it's such an

important moment in hip-hop history.

And you're right, like, LL showed that he was a superstar in that performance

He absolutely did.

And so when you fast-forward to, that was 1991,

when we fast-forward to 1993 in this moment, wow.

Uptown Records, it has such a stronghold and has really, um, re-

recreate, not recreated, but has, um, reimagined what R&B is and really what

could, it could be for the future.

Mm-hmm.

Because they've … At that moment, Uptown Records launched

the careers of some people that really changed the face of R&B and what R&B

sounded like and what R&B looked like.

And so when we talk about the Uptown MTV Unplugged, you're talking

about a marriage made in heaven.

Yeah

Because if you look at the M- the Uptown roster by 1993, you've

got powerhouses like Heavy D & the Boyz,

Mm-hmm

Jodeci, the legend herself, Mary J.

Blige,

Father MC, we

who

forget Father MC

cannot forget Father MC.

And, uh, but this is a very important moment for Mary J. Blige as well.

Mm-hmm

like the rappers having to prove that they were more than just

people who, who said words on the mic, Mary J. Blige had under- was under

a lot of scrutiny as well for her song stylings and her vocal ability.

You

love that.

know I love, I love s- calling somebody a song stylist.

And she … And so this was a very important moment for her as well because

by 1993 Mary has … So What's the 411 is, is a classic record at this point.

She's in our hearts.

She's our girl, you know, um, squarely in the Black community, a generation.

She is, she's clearly our representative.

And so in this moment Mary J. Blige I think is at the forefront to me, and I

think that this was a very pivotal moment for her to prove her vocal prowess, her

stage presence, all the things that people were picking apart about her as an artist.

And so, but we, I mean, we get some serious performances with Yo MTV,

not yo, but M- Uptown MTV Unplugged.

I mean crazy.

Heavy D…

Yeah

I'm gonna let you talk because I could just, you know me, I could just

yap on ad nauseam about this whole thing

no, no, no.

I think i- I want to underscore, um, how important it is, going back to that

idea of music had become so electronic.

Yes

swing at its core,

Mm-hmm.

keyboards, drum machines, da, da, da, da, doo.

Right?

this is Uptown's foundation, right?

Um, so this is an opportunity for Andre Harrell and a then

young Sean "Puffy" Combs

Mm-hmm

to take their artists show the world, 'cause really what

this is is a showcase for the world that this is sellable to white

audiences, that white audiences would be interested in seeing this.

So they had to package these artists up.

That's why there's such an interesting variety.

So we mentioned all of these, like, different types of artists,

so but it's all Uptown, right?

So they're showing, "Oh, we got something for everybody.

You not into Christopher Williams?

That's okay, we got a Heavy D. You not into that?

Oh, we got a Jodeci.

Oh, we got a Mary.

Oh, we got a da, da, da." Right?

all of these artists did, think, show up in their, their tr- their fullness,

and one of the most important classics that we do get out of this Jodeci.

So Jodeci takes Stevie Wonder's Lately, which is a beautiful song

Gorgeous

right?

re-imagines it in their own style, being true to what Stevie created,

but it is, like, for the artist now.

And that song becomes such an important staple on R&B radio.

You can still hear Jodeci's version of Lately on R&B radio

today because it's so impactful.

And we should also mention, Sir Daniel, one, this is the first

label-centric MTV Unplugged.

It might be only.

I don't know

No

ever did anything quite like this again.

we got a full release of this on Uptown as well, so you can still go

back and listen to these performances.

They repackaged them and released them as, as full releases.

And even Lately, Jodeci's Lately, I do think they re-recorded it, so I

think there's a, the live version, but then I think there's an in studio

A studio version

But I think it's just really important to underscore that

when this happened This wasn't a, a sure bet, you know what I'm saying?

Like, they, Andre and Puff had to really work to make sure that this thing was

packaged the way it needed to be packaged, and it went off the way it went off in

order to work, and it's become one of the most important MTV Unpluggeds, period

I think so.

And, uh, there's something I wanna go back to really quickly, of a

very important point that you made.

This s- particularly this, um, Uptown, um, Unplugged, um, uh, combination was

very important because we weren't getting a lot of live… Radio wasn't playing

a lot of live recordings at the time.

Mm-mm.

And so because of this, um, this collabo between

MTV and Uptown, we got live recordings in radio rotation again.

Yep

You know, and there's only a few artists that when you

think about it, that radio would play live versions of their tunes

or their labels made live versions available to radio for radio to play.

So I think that that's something to, to, to, to magnify really

quickly just to say, you know what?

This was, this was also important to Black radio.

And so that because when you think about it as a listener, if I'm

hearing, you know, Jodeci live and, a- and they're singing "Lately,"

I'm more apt to say, "You know what?

When Jodeci comes to my town, my corner of the planet, I'm gonna

go see them because according to this, they do the real thing live.

And so I'm gonna, I know I'm gonna go and get a great show."

So I think that's super important to radio.

Unplugged becomes kind of a mainstay in the MTV ecosystem for

several years, and to that point of, like, live infiltrating radio, uh,

three years later, be four years later, this might've been '97, um, a brand

new artist who had released their debut album, uh, Maxwell's Urban Hang

Suite, Maxwell got his own Unplugged.

And I think what was so unique about this is Maxwell was still really new as

Yes

He had definitely penetrated Black radio.

Like, Maxwell was, was winning.

Uh, by the time Ascension came out, which was song number two,

Maxwell was, like, in there.

We was in there with him.

But we got something super special with his Unplugged when he did

his version of This Woman's Work.

Once again, they had the live version, which I think is the,

the, the, um, definitive version of

Mm-hmm

but they also have an in-studio version of it as well.

But what's so unique about this is, of course, he's taking this, this,

um, pop song that's a remake, um,

Somebody want me?

sung by a woman, singing it in his falsetto

Baby, he was up there

up there.

I wonder, I've never seen, uh, Maxwell live.

Let us know in the comments when you listen to this if Maxwell does this

woman's work, and where is that key?

Let us because in 1996 and 1997, he was way up there doing this.

But radio picked up thing, and we still hear that once

again on, uh, R&B radio today.

Quiet Storm, you're gonna get This Woman's Work by Maxwell

Uh, it just dawned on me.

This is something s- very special about Maxwell's Unplugged to me.

Maxwell's Unplugged was recorded at Brooklyn Academy of Music,

Shout out

which is directly across the street next door to 38 Lafayette,

which is Hanson Place Seventh-day Adventist School, which is where a

young DJ Sir Daniel attended school from the age of two years old up until 13.

Wow

Brooklyn Academy of Music was so important to us, Jay Ray.

I think I may have mentioned it.

They would invite us students to come ac- walk across the street and, um, and

see performances, and that was such a… tho- those are such impactful moments

to me in particular, um, to see live music being performed, to see dance, um,

to, to see choreography, to see acting.

I mean, thank God for Brooklyn Academy of Music, and it's still there.

Thank God for- Mm-hmm … opening their doors to us and allowing, you

know, these young, these young Black kids, impressionable Black kids to

just hold hands, 'cause you know at that age we had to hold hands.

Find a partner and hold hands and walk across the street and,

um, and to, to go and check out this, um, these performances.

But yeah, I, you know, finding out that Maxwell's Unplugged was performed at

Brooklyn Academy of Music really, you know, gave me a little, you know, a

little oomph, a little BK pride, which is something that continued later on.

I guess we gotta talk about Lauryn Hill's Unplugged.

do.

we have to?

Yeah, okay, we do

Well, well, okay.

We do from the perspective of

It happened.

it happened.

Honestly, I, I have never heard that thing in full.

Um,

It's a heavy lift

it's a heavy lift, but I, I, I do wanna, I do want to mention for those

that weren't there, when this release happened, this was before we knew what

it entailed because I don't think many people had seen the actual performance.

But I remember the double disc release being, this was a

big deal in the record store.

You know what I'm saying?

Oh, yes

Because it's Lauryn Hill.

Lauryn Hill spent 1998 and 1999 conquering the world, and had disappeared after that.

So we were expecting different than what we got.

And what I think is worth mentioning is that Unplugged was willing to take risks,

Mm-hmm

Lauryn's Unplugged was absolutely a risk.

Um, it didn't pan out commercially, but it did give us a glimpse into

what an unraveling of stardom at that time kind of looked like.

This was not something we had seen in hip-hop before.

I think this is, this was the first time where we were like, "Yo,

happened to Lauryn?" And we got a whole record that chronicled it.

I think that that's, um

That sentiment right there.

Yo, what hap- that could be a T-shirt.

Yo, what happened to Lauryn?

Literally was echoed from, from hood to hood across America because we were all

looking like… I think people had just been so wrapped up in the whole, um, Doo

Wop That Thing of it all, and the joy and the happiness of Zion and, and all

that upliftment and, you know, she had…

Wait, where's her locks?

Where's the, you know, she's not, she's not done up.

Well, yeah, of course she had a baby.

Okay, we can understand that.

Is she pregnant again or… You

Right

there's all of this stuff, all this real-life stuff

that's happening to this woman.

And, you know, in true human fashion, as consumers, we're selfish.

We want Doo Wop That Thing.

We

like what is

we want that thing that you… What is this?

Uh, this is not bringing me joy.

This is not happiness.

And it, it reflected definitely, I remember I was, 'cause this was in 2001,

so I was definitely working at HMV, and I remember those boxes and boxes

of that CD just kept sitting there.

People, it was just not something that people were, um, drawn to and

wanted to relive over and over again.

I remember I got a copy, took it home, and I mean, I was just, I was

exhausted after listening to it.

It was just… And then, oh, and this is something that we

had not experienced either.

She was breaking down and crying

Yeah

in the middle of the performance.

I don't think we've ever experienced that.

Our generation

No

has ever experienced seeing an artist, um, have a real-life

emotional breakdown on television or, and have it recorded so that we

could re- hear it over and over again.

And I think that, that part of made it unlistenable to a lot of people as well

Y- you know, it's so interesting, sir, that I hadn't

thought of that in that way.

But,

I do think it is an interesting artistic choice, and I'm sure Lauryn

had, had a piece of this, there were a lot of false starts on this as well.

Like, she would start … 'Cause Lauryn, she wasn't a proficient, uh, guitar

player, uh, at the time, and so there was just a lot of false starts, so the

song would almost be whatever, whatever.

most musicians would be like, "All of that gotta go. cut that whole beginning

part out. I need this part, whatever, fade here," you know what I'm saying?

'Cause I start crying, and I don't want that in the thing.

W- that's in the double disc.

It's a double disc.

It's a double disc

double disc, that mean, disc could hold up to,

like, 70 minutes of music.

This is a double

Ooh.

And you know, you bring up something very important.

There's a lot of money at stake here too, because this is, the

label has, um, is putting up money, musicians have to be paid.

MTV is putting up its cameras, its lights, its Times S- they've got Times

Square, so the venue Times Square has to be, you know, taken care of in some

form of f- financial form as well.

And so she can't.

This is not something that you can go back and say, "You know what, guys? I'm

off t- I was a little off tonight. Let's just all come back tomorrow night and

we'll do it again." That's not happening.

That could not happen.

it

And this is it.

And so we literally, if you, if you're interested, you can hear in

real time what happened to this woman musically, and the, and the reason

why people were kind of like…

It started this conversation around the, the validity of this

star, this, the superstar that we had created as a, as an audience.

You know what I'm saying?

It started that conversation a- and, and people still to this day

have this conversation of, "Oh, y'all give Lauryn Hill too much.

She only had that one record."

And it's like, is she really that dope?

And it started that con- th- that's the kink in her armor, and

it started, I believe, um, at the release of the, her un- MTV Unplugged

You know, um, as we wind down, one, I have a question for you that

Mm-hmm

I'm, I'm curious about, but as we wind down, I'm thinking about

this idea, like L- the Lauryn Unplugged probably the most raw really

does live up to the idea of what Unplugged was supposed to be, right?

This kind of very authentic experience of this artist interacting with their,

their work, interacting with the audience and the musicians that are with them.

And z- uh, say what you want about the Lauryn Unplugged album, which I

still have not heard and I probably will not hear in this lifetime.

I'm just not, you know… But it's very, it was authentic

to where she was at the time.

And I would be curious, um, she probably is good with it.

I don't know if anyone's ever asked her, like, to reflect on it, because

now we're at the 25th anniversary of it,

Yeah

am curious to know what she thinks.

And maybe that's a question we'll just ask on social media, like, directly,

like, "Yo, Lauryn, like, it's 25 years since Unplugged. Like, what do you think,

like, what do you, do you feel about that body of work today?" Let's, let's

As it sit, as it sits in your discography and your body of work.

Yeah

So here's my question, Sir Daniel.

Mm-hmm

Who is one, what is one or two Unpluggeds that you wish happened?

Hmm

Huh.

I think we really should have gotten, we should have gotten a MTV Unplugged

Invincible I know we got the ti- the, the, the 2001 performance and all

that, but I, I know there was a lot of stuff going on, but I really do

think maybe that that could have pushed things over, pushed the, that record,

that body of work a little further

yeah.

Me and you are in the exact same space.

If there's any, if there's the, the one Unplugged that I wish

happened, and I actually don't wish it was Invincible, but I think it

should've been released at the time.

Mm-hmm

truly do wish Michael Jackson just went on stage and did

Michael Jackson history of songs.

Like, can you imagine a stripped down Billie Jean and a stripped down

Man in the Mirror, where Michael Jackson is not being Michael Jackson?

He's j- it's just him and the band and that voice.

Baby, I don't need you to dance.

You can tiptoe around that stage a little bit, but what I really need

you to do is we just need to have a conversation because m- that voice

and those songs are so timeless.

So I'm with you.

I wish that in 2001, ahead of the release that, of Invincible, that Michael Jackson

had done an Unplugged, a true Unplugged, where it's like, "No, Michael, you're not

doing none of that. You literally going, we give you this stool, and we give you

a microphone, and this band. Work it out, child." I wish we'd gotten that.

can I have one more?

Of course, yeah, you can, 'cause I have another one too.

I wonder if we're on the same page again.

Ooh.

I, so I kinda wish we could, and we did kind of get it, but I kinda

wish that there was a overlap or a, a collaboration between Sisters in the

Name of Rap and MTV Unplugged because we saw what MC Lyte could do with a band.

Mm-hmm

At this point, Salt-N-Pepa has a all-girl band that they were

on tour with from DC, a go-go band.

I can't remember their name right now.

For, was it For Pleasure or something like that?

A Pleasure or something like that.

Anyway, so, so MC Lyte, Queen Latifah, who is also, um, touring with a band and doing

stuff with a band, I think, and they were, for all intents and purposes, like the

mainstays of female rapdom at the time.

Like the hierarchy, it was them.

They were the ones that were constantly on MTV.

Um, we'd seen them perform.

So I think, you know, and this is, and this is clearly

a, a Sir Daniel moment here.

I think that would have really done well and gone down in, um, history as

a great moment, um, of an unplugged version filmed by MTV, 'cause they really

could do a great job of these pioneering women that really would've lasted still

to this day, and we probably could've gotten some really great, um, live

performances to play on the radio, like we mentioned the other ones of the past.

And, uh, yeah.

So yeah, that would be my other one

I love that.

I love that.

Um, my, my other one, and this is a dream, um, one, would've been

an official The Roots, Bahamadia, and Gang Starr Unplugged.

Ooh

That would be so crazy.

Like, just think of, like, the power of, like, having that go down.

You got the jazz inflection of Gang Starr.

You have, with Bahamadia, right?

Bahamadia's kind of the center because she's bridging Gang

Starr and The Roots together.

You know what I mean?

that would've went crazy

That would've gone, gone dumb.

Yep.

Yeah,

beats, unplugged versions of Preemo beats.

That would've been something.

Crazy,

Listen, well, we can't even say MTV call us 'cause, well, there's no

We

more MTV.

unfortunately.

No more

Yeah.

Um

before we get out of here though, we gotta, we

gotta take it back to Brooklyn

Yeah.

So

the last, was this the final

It wasn't the final Unplugged.

There were, there were Unplugs after that.

Um, but it really did, um, Jay-Z as just an interesting artist

who, um… Here's the thing.

For all the things we wanna say about Jay-Z, um, and his dominance

as a pop culture figure, Jay-Z is also a squarely an artist.

Mm-hmm.

And, um, just speaking of The Roots, right, him pairing with Questlove

to pull together the band for the official Jay-Z Unplugged, is a moment in time.

So you get this overlap of Philly and Brooklyn happening, and it is one of the

best Unplugs that they ever released, 'cause, you know, it was, everybody was

firing on all cylinders for that joint

Yes.

Now, noticeably missing from this Unplugged performance, because

I think what had Jay come off of where Mary J. Blige was featured

on heavily on, like, "Living in the City," um, and some other records.

It was Ma- like… Well, Mary had also appeared on Reasonable Doubt,

uh, for some of his biggest hit, hits, "Can't Knock the Hustle."

So he, people were expecting to see Mary, but boys and girls, singing, um, lead

vocals was one Jaguar Wright, who at the time, you, we, we, she did her big one.

Like, she was the next up.

Like, we, we looking at Jag, she's that girl.

She's about to be

she sat in there.

She, she s- she stood up in Mary's boots

Mm-hmm

and sang her face off, and she put her spin on it because

you can't listen to that, uh, that Unplugged version of Jay-Z and not

think, "Damn, Jaguar Wright is really putting down some good pieces of

singing on this, um, on this project."

And so you did your big one on that one, Jaguar.

you know, my how things change.

Um,

My, how they have changed

Y'all, but, you know, thank y'all so much for hanging out with us.

Like, MTV Unplugged was such an important, um, it was, it

was, it was, uh, important TV.

it was a way that you could see some of your favorite artists in, um, a

context that they weren't normally in.

And, um, shout-out to them for, for leaning into it.

But, um, and we appreciate y'all for hanging out with us

as we, we went down memory lane.

What's one of your favorite MTV Unplugged performances?

Let us know in the dis- uh, in the comments.

And, um, so if you can hear our faces and see our voices, subscribe,

share the show with your friends, family, your colleagues, because if

you love Queue Points, chances are they will love Queue Points as well.

Visit our website at queuepoints.com.

That is the, the foundation for all things Queue Points.

You can listen to our old, our, our archive shows.

You can become a member, you, which gives you all types of perks, uh,

and really dope stuff that you get.

Um, and you can read our blog, and then make sure that you go ahead and shop

our store at store.queuepoints.com.

We appreciate y'all.

We love

y'all

We certainly do.

And like we say at the end of every episode, in this life you have a choice.

You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play.

I am DJ Sir Daniel

And my name is Jay Ray y'all

And this is Queue Points podcast, dropping the

needle on Black music history.

We will see you on the next go-round.

Peace

Peace, y'all.