Introduction to Future-Ready Branding

Welcome to this enlightening episode of Jonny Ross Fractional CMO, where we dive deep with Mitch Duckler, author and branding expert, into what it takes to build a brand that not only survives but thrives in the future. Discover cutting-edge insights straight from the minds of the world's top CMOs.

What is a Future-Ready Brand?

Learn from Mitch about the essential characteristics that define a future-ready brand. We discuss the importance of integrating purpose with business goals and how this synergy can drive a brand forward amidst rapid technological and societal changes.

Emerging Technologies in Branding

Mitch shares his expert insights on how emerging technologies like artificial intelligence, the Metaverse, and augmented reality are transforming the branding landscape. Understand how these technologies can personalize customer experiences and redefine engagement.

Purpose-Driven Branding: Beyond the Buzzword

Hear Mitch debunk the myths of purpose-washing and explain how genuine purpose-driven branding can be implemented effectively. Learn how to align your brand authentically with societal values without falling into the trap of superficial branding tactics.

CMO Insights: Navigating Brand Challenges

Mitch discusses his interactions with 43 CMOs from global giants like McDonald's, PepsiCo, and BMW. Uncover common themes and innovative strategies these leading marketers are employing to tackle today's branding challenges.

AI and Marketing: Risks and Rewards

Explore the dual-edged sword of AI in marketing as Mitch elaborates on both the opportunities and the pitfalls. From enhancing customer segmentation to the risks of data privacy, get a balanced view on how AI is reshaping marketing departments across industries.

Gen Z and the New Market Dynamics

Understand the impact of Gen Z on current marketing strategies. Mitch explains the 'me vs. we' dynamic of Gen Z and how brands can effectively engage with this influential demographic without compromising their core values.

Conclusion and Call to Action

We wrap up with key takeaways from Mitch Duckler on making your brand resilient and adaptable for the future. Mitch also shares where listeners can find more about his work and his latest book, 'The Future-Ready Brand.'

Where to Find Mitch Duckler

Connect with Mitch through his official site at https://fullsurge.com, follow him on LinkedIn, or check out his TEDx talk "Discover Your Differentiator". For deeper insights, pick up a copy of 'The Future-Ready Brand' available at major book retailers.

Engage with Us

Loved this episode? Have thoughts or questions about future-ready branding? Join the conversation on our social media channels or leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. We love hearing from you!

Subscribe and Stay Updated

Don’t miss out on our upcoming episodes with more thought leaders like Mitch Duckler. Subscribe to Jonny Ross Fractional CMO on Apple Podcasts and stay at the forefront of marketing and branding innovations.

Topics:

00:12 - 10:07

Future Ready Brand

Purpose in Branding

CMOs Insights

Emerging Technologies

AI in Marketing

Privacy Concerns

Compliance and Legal

10:08 - 20:06

data privacy and regulation

generative AI

content marketing

creativity

emotion

human touch

branding

societal implications

purpose

Gen Z

technology

emerging technologies

marketing

authenticity

transparency

connection

experience

sub brands

portfolio

profit

triple bottom line

people

planet

sustainability

green movement

20:06 - 29:59

Purpose-driven marketing

Hyper-personalization

Online and offline integration

Experiential marketing

Extended reality technologies

Content generation and marketing

29:59 - 39:54

AI-generated content

ChatGPT

systemic biases

data integrity

hallucinations

short form content

long form content

social media

human talent

creativity

emotions

experimenting with emerging technologies

surrendering control to consumers

influencer marketing

brand protection

future ready brand book

contact information

39:54 - 40:36

pre-order

fantastic information

Mitch

Jonny Ross Fractional CMO

watching

listening

Hello and welcome to Jonny Ross

Fractional CMO. We are live on YouTube

and we are live on LinkedIn. Welcome to

Jonny Ross Fractional CMO, your compass

in the ever evolving landscape of

marketing and branding. In today's

special episode, we're thrilled to have

Mitch Duckler, the visionary behind the

Future Ready brand, who will be sharing

cutting edge insights straight from the

minds of some of the world's top CMOs.

Get ready to dive into the strategies

that are defining the next era of

branding and discover how your brand can

not only adapt, but thrive in the face of

change. Let's embark on this journey

together with Marty Excellence, with

Mitch Duckler. How are you Mitch?

I'm doing well, Jonny, how are you?

Yeah, really good indeed, thank you. Very

excited to talk about the future ready

brand. And in fact, I wanted to totally

dive in because 1 of the things that you

explore in your book is the critical role

of purpose in branding. But I'm very

aware that as more brands claim to be

purpose driven, there's this growing

skepticism around purpose washing and how

companies genuinely integrate purpose

into their brand without falling into the

trap of appearing insincere or just

jumping on the bandwagon. Where is that?

No, that's a great 0.1 of the things I

talk about in the book, in that chapter

on purpose, is to separate a few

different concepts, right? There's at the

first level, and this is all good by the

way, I'm not trying to be critical or

judgmental, but at the most basic level,

there's CSR, right? A corporate social

responsibility platform or campaign that

I'd say most companies of any size adhere

to. And that's all well and good. The

next level up, I would say, would be

purpose-driven companies. So these are

companies that not just have a CSR, but

they live by this ethos. Whatever that

purpose is, whether it's a cause or a

competency or what have you, it's in

their DNA, right? They, everything that

they do, decisions are being made

consistent with that purpose. Candidates

are hired based on their embracing of

that purpose, etc. And then I think a

level above that is not only are you

purpose driven, but you define your

brand, your corporate brand by that

purpose. And that's probably the highest

level of all, but especially in the

latter, right? When you have a company

that is purpose driven and your brand is

defined by that purpose, it is so

critical that it be genuine, right? And

that you activate and you bring that

brand to life in ways that are very

consistent with your purpose or it will

be disingenuous, right? It'll be

perceived as purpose washing.

Yeah. Yeah. And That's the issue, isn't

it? And we're going to get onto Gen Z,

which I guess is where the biggest

skepticism will come from. But let's just

talk about the book itself. So you

interviewed, was it 40, 48 CMOs around

the world? 43. And I mean, from the likes

of McDonald's, PepsiCo, Wells Fargo, BMW,

Salesforce, new balance, young brands. I

mean, some, some world-class CMOs. I

mean, you know, that, that, that in

itself must've been quite an exercise. It

took you about a year, is that right?

Yeah, yeah. It's as you might imagine, I

mean, some of these folks I've known, but

most I didn't, right? So as you can

imagine, just even identifying them and

getting on their radar and getting them

to commit and then schedule and follow

through was quite a task.

What were some of the common threads that

you saw across some of these very large

corporations from their CMOs?

What was really interesting to me,

Johnny, was in particular, as we got into

the middle section of the book, it's

around emerging technology. So what we're

talking about is artificial intelligence,

predictive analytics, extended realities,

so virtual reality, augmented reality,

metaverse, et cetera. And then Web3,

blockchain, and so forth. I mean, These

are all, these are the emerging

technologies that are kind of on their

minds. And I was really interested to

hear or to find that they're all kind of

in a similar, most of them are in a

similar place and that they feel that

they need to be experimenting with these

technologies. And they don't have the

luxury of sitting back waiting to see how

the technology evolves, which platforms

are the winners and which are not. And

they're all kind of taking measured steps

towards experimenting and learning about

it. AI is certainly further along than

some of the other technologies I

mentioned, right? They're actually knee

deep in that now. But they're really

embracing it and testing and learning and

just kind of kicking the tires if you

will. And I think that that's really very

smart. Another thing I think that came

out of this, especially the AI portion of

technology is the belief that this has

the ability to elevate the stature of

marketing within the company, within the

C-suite in particular. So by that I mean

if you use AI right, right, And you don't

necessarily need to be a data scientist,

but you need to understand the

capabilities of AI. You need to

understand what the CIO can do for you,

that he or she may be your best friend as

much as the head of sales, right? That if

you embrace that, you really can start to

own the growth agenda for your company to

a much higher level than you may have

been previously because of all of the

power that the technology brings.

So, but then at the same time, I'm

guessing that some of them could be

wasting an absolute fortune on

experimenting with AI, but I assume

that's just part of the cause and that's

taken into account for whatever loss they

may have, as long as they get some big

wins, it balances.

Yeah, I think so. And 1 of the things,

some of the CMOs actually even use this

verbiage, they said it's crawl, walk,

run. So the crawling is, let's say we're

talking about AI, so we'll stay on that

for a moment. That might just be, you're

experimenting with generative AI. So it

could be as simple as using chat GPT or

an equivalent. But as you start to get

comfortable with that, as you begin to

realize its impact, its potential, as

well as what it does well and what it

doesn't, then you might wanna start

thinking about customizing these things,

right? So it's not just the off the

shelf, but it's customized chat GPT. And

then for certain things, especially like

mission critical functions within your

company, you might want to bring it in

house, right? And actually start building

your own AI, in this case, generative AI

infrastructure, right? Your own GPT, if

you will, so that you have it in house

and as proprietary and so forth. You

don't necessarily need to go to that

final, nor would you want to go to that

final step, you know, right out of the

gate, right? You kind of work your way up

to it gradually.

Did they show any concern around privacy

and how much they would be sharing with

the likes of cheap ET. I mean, you're

talking about some of the world's biggest

brands.

Yes. And absolutely. And they are

certainly the most, in most cases, the

most risk averse. Right. So, and here

they were a little bit all over the

board. I've talked to some of the CMOs

who are in very, and some of it just is

because they're in regulated industries

and they have to be, but others are just

in very risk averse cultures. And there

is a lot of concern over a few things. I

mean, certainly privacy is 1 of them, but

also just even data integrity. Is the

data that they're getting, is it

reliable? Are there biases, systemic

biases in the data that is being

generated by ownership rights, right? Who

owns the intellectual property that's

actually being created by it? Are you

violating copyrights? So yeah, there's,

there's a whole host of legal concerns

that, that are on their minds and risk

that they need to be willing to

undertake.

And did you get any feeling that

compliance and legal were suppressing

some of what marketing could do or Is

that just that there's ways of dealing

with that?

So again, yeah, I think yes, there's

concern, but also the realization that

you can't just reject it outright and

say, you know what, it's not for me, or

I'm going to wait 10 years until all the

kinks are out. They're kind of proceeding

cautiously, right? And almost to a T,

it's interesting when I talk about the

topics with the CMOs, like here, there's

9 topics, right? A chapter on each in the

book. Which ones would you like to talk

about? Most of them said, oh, you know,

we're not really doing much with AI. And

yet, when I started, you know, probing,

I'm like, you're doing a lot more than

you realize a lot more than most, right?

So, yeah, they kind of get it that you

need to proceed, but proceed cautiously.

I would say, yeah, that data privacy and

regulation, I think is 1 of the big

concerns. Another, I think, is a concern,

especially in the area of generative AI

and content marketing is around just

losing kind of creativity and losing the

emotion, right? And the human touch,

especially as it relates to content. And

those are all just some of the concerns

and the watch outs that are on their

minds, but certainly none of that is

stopping them from using the technology

and experimenting with it in a big

way. So you typically work with large

organizations, you know, it might be the

senior directors or VPs of marketing or

brand or etc. 1 of the things that I'm

wondering and having written the book,

what do they, What do you use to define

exactly what a future ready brand means?

Well, I think it's really, it kind of

goes across all 3 sections of the book. I

think that there are societal

implications for brands, right? So we

talked earlier about purpose, right? And

the role that purpose plays, whether it's

just as simple as having a CSR platform

or actually defining your brand by a

purpose, I think it is something you need

to think about because it is increasingly

important to consumers. It's nothing new,

right? Purpose has been around for a long

time, purpose branding, But I would argue

that it's only increasing in importance

because of the generations that are

really now dominating the marketplace,

right, millennials and Gen Z. So I think

that's really important to kind of figure

out where you are, like if you, to what

extent you are purpose driven, to what

extent should your brand or is your brand

defined by that purpose and so forth. The

other thing I think again, being future

ready in that societal bucket is Gen Z,

right? And they are kind of, they are the

dominant, going to be the dominant

generation from a commercial and

marketplace perspective for a number of

years. So really understanding the nature

of them, what drives them, what motivates

them. A little bit I talk about in the

book is this notion that they are a

little bit schizophrenic in that there's

really 2 segments of Gen Z. There's the

me and the we, right? The me is very much

defined by individuality and

self-expression. The we, which I think is

what most people associate with Gen Z, is

very socially conscious. They're very

aware of causes such as ESG and DE&I. So

I think, you know, just understanding

that and how you need to be able to

relate to them and to market to them is

really critical and part of what's making

your brand future ready. And then the

other side is the technology, right? And

just realizing that these emerging

technologies, which AI I would argue is

beyond emerging, right? It's almost here,

right? But even if you look at extended

reality and Web3 and blockchain and NFTs

and so forth, These are as disruptive now

as the internet was 20, 25 years ago. And

it really is, we are starting to see some

fairly seismic shifts in marketing and in

brand building and the relationships that

marketers have with consumers much like

we did in the dawn of the digital age.

You mentioned societal there and I'm

guessing that the biggest influence in

from what you're saying in society is Jen

said then, and you talked about the we

and the me, the 2 different sides. How do

organizations market to both different

sides at the same time? How do they

navigate that? Because to some extent,

whilst there's lots of similarities, they

do have very different desires and wants.

So I don't know if there's any examples

you might have or thoughts on how they

deal with it?

Yeah, I think there are certainly some

differences, right? And where there are

differences, I think again, me, we, I

mean, those could arguably be polar

opposites, but there are also some

commonalities and things that they have

that they share, right? And I think 1,

and it goes back to this, the issue we

just talked about, around purpose, which

is this, regardless of whether they're

kind of a me or a we, they have a desire

for authenticity and transparency,

whether they're me or we. So, and you're

seeing that play out in the way brands

are marketing today, right? This shift

from influencers to creators, from

content provided by marketers to user

generated content, homespun content, if

you will, and things that aren't

necessarily polished and perfect, but

they're just real and authentic. And I

think that that is something that

regardless of who you are within Gen Z

and whether you skew more towards this we

snapshot or me snapshot, that is

something that I think is that they

share. Another is this desire for

connection and experience. I think Gen Z,

regardless of whether you're in that me

or we camp, they really do seek out

experiences. So, kind of mixing up the

commerce a little bit, you know, pop-up

stores, things like that, just making the

experience, whether it's retail or other,

more immersive, I think is something that

definitely appeals to this generation,

much more so, I think, even than other

generations before them.

Is it enough of a reason for producing

more sub brands within a portfolio or is

that or is the whole me we that that's

not that's not a good enough reason to

have a separate brand?

The sense I got is no, they're not

necessarily separate brands. I think it's

just, and again, because there are a lot

of commonalities, it's, it's, it's not

like these are 2 grammatically different

generations, right? It's just, I think

it's really more around the, how you

bring the brand to life, how you express

it, how you activate it that might be a

little bit different. It's not that you

need like a me brand and a wee brand,

right? They're not that dramatically

different. So yeah, that's a

generalization, but that's kind of the

sense I got from talking to the CMOs

about Gen Z, as well as just my

experience working with clients on it.

We talked about purpose earlier on, but 1

of the things that is important for most

organizations is profit. And so I'm just

wondering how brands can effectively

balance this with the drive for profit.

Yeah. So 1 of the things again, in the

purpose of chapter I talk about is the

triple bottom line, which you may have

heard of, right? So it's profit people

and planet. And they're all important,

right? It used to just be about profit,

right? And it's, you know, hey, you're in

business for 1 reason, and that's to

increase shareholder value, right? To

make money. While that certainly is not

going away, right? That is a real goal,

objective mission, whatever you want to

call it, and will be forever, it's no

longer sufficient, right? There's other

things that matter. And that's where kind

of the people and the planet come in, the

other 2 Ps of that triple bottom line.

And the really good news though, is that

a lot of the longitudinal research that

was done, this isn't my research, right?

This research I leveraged though as part

of the chapter in the book, is that

companies that have a focus on purpose,

whether it's a cause or competency or

what have you, or regardless of what that

purpose is, right, but they tend to do

better financially, right? Their income,

right, their profitability over the long

haul is actually larger than those

companies that are not considered to be

purpose-driven. So it doesn't have to be

1 or the other. In fact, it's not like,

hey, are we in business to make money?

Are we in business to promote our

purpose? It's both and when you do 1 the

other follows. And again that's what

research was showing too, right? And so

that's good news. Another similar point

is, which I find kind of interesting is,

you know, when I started out in the world

of brand, this is back in the early

1990s, some of these issues, like

sustainability, and, and, and, you know,

green, right, the green movement, Those

were things that were starting to get on

people's radar, right? And they were

saying it's important, but when you did

market research, people would say it's

important, but they would never pay 1

penny more for it. Right? Now that's not

the case. Now what we're starting to see

is that consumers, and again, whether

it's green or another purpose, consumers

are willing to pay in some cases up to

20, 25% more for an equivalent product if

they embrace the purpose that that

company stands for. So again, that kind

of goes hand in hand with this notion

that the 2 aren't necessarily separate.

You can be profitable and purpose driven.

Yeah, I

think that's a very, very fair point

indeed. And there has absolutely been a

swing from consumers to start paying for

this without question.

It's easy to say it's important. It's

another to say I'll pay more for it.

Yeah, yeah, totally. If you're listening

or watching right now, this is the Johnny

Ross Fractional CMO. We are live on

Instagram for the first time as well,

which is great. So if you're joining us

there, welcome. You may be listening to

the podcast afterwards. You're just as

welcome as well. We're with Mitch

Duckler, the author of The Future Ready

Brand. We're exploring what brands need

to do to be future ready, especially from

the insights of all the CMOs that you've

spoken to from these worldwide large

organizations, famous names that we've

all heard of. What I'm wondering is, as

you've spoken to the CMOs and you've got

clearly technology, as you've said, is a

very large part of this. I'm interested

in how it's currently impacting marketing

in general and what you're seeing.

Yeah, so what I would say, especially

artificial intelligence, maybe to a

lesser extent, some of the other emerging

technologies are driving more

hyper-personalization. So I think that's

when you think about AI's capabilities

and its ability to classify much more

finely and predict much more accurately,

It's bringing about this dream of Peppers

and Rogers back in the early 90s, the

one-to-one future, which at that point

was a pipe dream. It's that you could

actually start crafting your brand and

your marketing and your offer to each

individual customer. But that's in a

sense what AI is allowing you to do. It's

no longer you have a segmentation schema

of 6 or 5 or 6 segments, right? And you

pick 1 or 2. I mean, you start to talk

about a thousand different segments or

clusters. And because AI is able to parse

data out and classify much more finely

and predict much more accurately, It's

really dramatically different, right? It

is almost making this notion of

one-to-one marketing more of a reality

than just a pipe dream.

And how's that integrated into the,

you've got your online and offline

worlds. I'm assuming that online, that's

a lot easier to do than offline. Are you

seeing anything happening to bring those

2 closer?

Yes. So 1 of the CMOs I spoke with, the

CMO from Sephora was a great example

where he, they kind of merged online and

offline. So you think about Sephora,

they're, cosmetic, right? And they're,

they have retail. I'm not sure how many

5,000 stores I want.

Whatever they are doing, they are doing

it very well because all I have, all I

have is my 10 year old daughter

constantly telling me how I need to take

it to a Sephora shop. So, yeah. And, and

you know, she's on Snapchat, she's on

TikTok. And you know, of course we

monitor and of course we only allow

certain times a day and all of that

stuff, but my God, they are doing their

job well because that is all I ever hear.

And unfortunately, I'm going to have to

give in at some point.

Yeah, it's, it is, it's a great brand.

It's a, it's a brand I have a lot of

respect for and I'm sure he'll love. If I

get back to him and tell him about your

daughter, he'll, he'll be, he'll be

thrilled to hear that. But if you think

about that business, what they're able to

do in store is, understand, a sales agent

can be working with a customer and asking

a lot of questions, what they're like,

where are they from, their lifestyle,

what sort of climate, right, are they

exposed to, what are their activities,

what kind of skin tone do they have, do

they have oily or dry skin, their

complexion, you know, are they interested

in SPF or not, all these different, and

then actually in front of the consumer,

just putting this into AI and say, okay,

out of these thousands of products, here

are 3 or 4 we'd recommend. And like, you

know, in a nanosecond, right? And it's

not only fast, but it's probably a lot

more accurate and predictive because it

is so analytical and data driven. And

then, oh, by the way, they're talking

about how they can use augmented reality.

You know, if you don't want to try the

product on, well, we can show you what it

looks like through AR, right? And, and,

you know, your face, your exact

reflection and what it will look like

with this particular cosmetic. I mean, So

yeah, it is blending both online and

offline.

Which, which is, you know, so important

to engage Gen Z without question. Yeah.

And that's another, yeah, going back to

the earlier point about How immersive and

how experiential is that interaction?

Much more so than it has been in the

past.

You talked about experimental marketing

there. How important is that as part of

the mix?

Experiential is definitely becoming more

important. I think a lot of it is because

for a couple of reasons. It's like I

said, the some of it is just being driven

by demand and preferences and trends,

right? And that's what consumers want.

But then the emerging technologies that

we haven't talked as much about, we talk

a lot about AI, but extended reality and

virtual reality, augmented reality, mixed

reality, these are things that especially

I think augmented reality are having the

ability to make experiences that might be

mundane much more immersive. So Even

though this was 1 of the interesting

dynamics that during this interview

process, the last 15 months or so, a

metaverse took a dive. There was so much

hype and so much build up around its

potential. And then it kind of took a

little bit of a nosedive in terms of,

maybe we're getting a little bit ahead of

this, the goggles aren't as great as they

need to be, the experiences and what. And

there is some wait and see about

metaverse, right? And this web 2.5,

right, where it's the metaverse, but it's

not, it's not the Oculus metaverse. But

what is real and, and present today is

those extended realities, whether it's

metaverse based or not, especially

augmented reality in retail environments,

is really changing the experience and

making it much more immersive.

So we've talked about how technologies

are impacting marketing in general and we

sort of stepped on this a tiny bit

earlier in terms of specifically content.

So let's just talk about how it's

impacting content and where that's going

really.

Yeah, it's impacting content in a lot of

ways. I think the way that's most evident

or most familiar to people is in

generation, content generation. So that's

ChatGPT and its ability and the like and

its ability to actually create a long

form, in some cases, a very long form

content with decent reliability and

quality and enlightening fast time,

right? But 1 of the things that I do

highlight in the book is that it's really

impacting content marketing from more

than just that, right? It's impacting the

way content is researched, right? So that

includes like segmenting audiences or

generating outlines, brainstorming

topics. That's kind of on the front end

of content. Then it's doing the actual

creation in some cases. So that's the

generative AI and the chat GPTs and so

forth. It's also helping to personalize

content. So think about versioning. So

how do you actually take a piece of

content and make it much more relevant

for a particular segment or audience?

Maybe it's more specific to a vertical or

an industry or to a geography, or it's

actually being translated into 7

different languages. So that's the

personalization. And then it's also

helping you to curate and optimize. So go

out and find content, especially

user-generated content that is the most

relevant for your brand. And then

optimize it, obviously make it so that it

is suitable for your brand, so it's

on-brand, etc. So it's not just, again,

chat GPT and the gen side, the generative

side of AI, I think it's getting the most

press if you will, about for AI and

content, but I really think it's

impacting much more.

And what's your perception on how much,

how much of the content we're seeing from

some of these large organizations in

terms of what's AI generated and what's

human generated? And do you believe that

there is going to be a continued move to

AI generated content?

I think it will. A lot of the issues that

I brought up earlier are real, some of

the obstacles, and that can include data

integrity, systemic biases,

hallucinations, right? In some cases, the

AI doesn't know, doesn't have an answer,

so it makes it up, right? And then you're

like, oh my gosh, and it sounds real,

right? So 1 of the things that I've, And

I think this is fairly standard, but 1 of

the things that I've heard from a lot of

the CMOs is they trust it a lot more for

short form content than they do for long

form. The longer form content is where

you start to run into trouble, the

hallucinations, et cetera, the risk of

going off brand or biases being

interjected. So if you're, I want to say

maybe 500 to 800 word pieces, they're

feeling reasonably confident as long

again. You can't just take it and run

with it, but if you use it to kind of

hypercharge what you're doing and to

maybe save an hour to do something in 1

hour versus 2 or 3 hours, that's huge. So

yeah, I think that that's the biggest

use. Social media, I think is it's, I

think I read somewhere where 70% of posts

are at least somewhat AI influenced if

not generated. So again, it's the shorter

form where I think there's more

confidence with it. Longer form, I think

there's a lot of long way to go before

people are going to start trusting it

with meaningful thought leadership,

longer form content pieces.

Yeah. Well, I mean, if I think of in the

UK, ASDA, which were part of Walmart, and

I've seen some of the sponsored Facebook

ads very recently and Instagram ads. And

having as a user of AI on a regular

basis, I'm looking at this ad and I'm

thinking, there's no question in my mind

that has been written by AI, by ChatGPT.

But then I question myself and I wonder,

have humans learned from that and are

mimicking it? Or, or, or have they just

totally gone with whatever chat GPTs come

up with? But looking at it, I'm looking

at it, thinking that that has definitely

originated from chat GPT. And, and, and

even as a, what I consider to myself to

be an expert in terms of understanding

the content, the output from ChatGPT,

even I am looking at that thinking, I'm

not sure. Would a large corp just rely

purely on that? No. And that's

the... No. And nobody that, at least

nobody I talked to in these interviews

was, right? They're saying they're using

it very... The greatest quote came from

Jill Kramer, who's the CMO of Accenture.

She said, AI is an amplifier of human

talent. And that was spot on. She's

saying, There are things that AI does

incredibly well, right? And it can be,

you know, obviously very analytical. It

can crunch data. It can process, you

know, a large amount of information, et

cetera, et cetera. But what it can't do

is it can't interject emotion, and it

can't be creative. And that's what humans

will always need to do. No matter how

good AI gets, those 2 things, like

creativity and emotion, I just think are

inherently human. And will always be the

job of the marketer. But her point is, AI

does a lot of these other things for you

so well, and so efficiently and

effectively, that it allows you to do

what you do well, right? And to focus on

that. You have more time to be creative.

You have more time to be strategic, to

inject emotion, human emotion, because AI

is taking some of the laborious and

analytical burden off of you. I think

that's probably the best way to think

about it. If you want to turn your

content marketing effort over to AI, good

luck with that, right? That's a recipe

for disaster. But if you use it as a tool

as an aid to improving that function,

there's a lot of potential there.

Mitch, if you're a senior leader in

branding or marketing in a large

corporate corp, what would you be

suggesting that you should be challenging

yourself with, you know, in the in the

next few days, next week, having listened

to this, having read the book, of course,

what would be the things that you need to

be thinking about and really considering

to make happen?

Yeah, there's a couple. 1 of which I

think we touched on a little bit earlier,

but it's actually, you need to begin to

experiment with some of these, if you're

not already, some of these emerging

technologies. Take a chance, create a

pilot, a scrum, if you will, and just

test it out in a low risk way if

necessary. But start experimenting with

what AI, what XR, even Web3 or

blockchain, which we haven't talked about

really as much today. These are things

that I think you can experiment with in a

relatively lower cost way and lower risk

way. So if you're not already doing that,

I think you need to because those are

only going to become more dominant in the

future. I think the other is another

common theme that came out from a lot of

these interviews was this notion that

control is increasingly being surrendered

from marketer to consumer, right? And we

began to see that a lot with the

emergence of the internet, especially

with social media. And it's continuing

now with a lot of marketing tactics such

as influencer marketing, right? And we

talked a lot about the shift from

influencers which are a little bit more

controlled by marketing versus creators

which are much more authentic and real,

if you will. And 1 of the things that

they all said is, wow, we've come to

realize that we need to surrender control

to the people who understand, the

consumers themselves and to the people,

In this case, influencers or creators who

know their audiences even better than

they do. And that's a real hard thing for

marketers to do. They tend to be by

nature a little bit more type A and

control oriented. But they said, we've

noticed the best for us. And these are

some of the Fortune 50 even companies

that we're talking about that are using

influencers saying, you know what, we get

out of their way. Yes, we have

guidelines, we do manage them. We choose

them very, very, very carefully. That's

critical, right? You gotta make sure you

know who you're aligning with. But once

we do, we need to kind of take off the

guards and let them do what they do well

because they know their followers. They

know their audience better than we do.

And as long as we help them understand

our brand, they can figure out what to do

with them. But that's not typical

marketing, right? And certainly from when

I was starting out, it's a very different

mindset.

Yeah, because you're too worried about

protecting the brand and following the

brand guidelines, etc, etc. But I mean,

what you've just said there is, it

resonates so well and it's so true. They

know better than you do.

That's why you're hiring them, right?

And as you said, it's about making sure

that you choose and select the right

person. So, fantastic. We could talk a

lot more. I did want to get into

influencers, but we've run out of time.

It's brilliant. Listen, if someone wanted

to contact you, Where's the best place to

find you? Where do you hang out?

Obviously, there's the future ready brand

book Where where should we be going to

buy the book?

So the book it will you can pre-order it

now. The book is officially released on

May 14th. It is on Amazon it's also on

our website, So my company is full surge

and my You can email me at m. Duckler MDU

CK LER at full surge comm And you can

also see the book there and more

information about the book and even

pre-order there as well Also, feel free

to follow me or or reach out to me on

linkedin send me an invite. We'd love to

hear from you

I all of the links and contact details

will be in the show notes as well. So if

anyone's listening or watching right now,

please do check the show notes for all of

the contact details. I forgot that it's

pre-order because I've already, you've

very kindly sent me a pre version, so

I've already read it. So, but I've

forgotten that it's still not launched,

so that's brilliant. So yeah, I would

highly advise to get a pre-order in

because it's full of fantastic

information. Mitch, thank you very much

indeed. And if you've been watching or

listening, this has been Jonny Ross

Fractional CMO. Thanks for joining us and

we will look forward to see you all soon.

Take care. Cheers Mitch. Thanks for

watching!