There’s something that doesn’t quite add up in counselling...

We’re trained to be a blank slate…

and yet we’re also trying to build connection, trust, and a sense that someone feels understood before they even reach out.

So where’s the line?

In this episode, I’m joined by Rainbow Tomes, a counsellor, coach and trainer who describes themselves as a ‘mum on a mission’.

Their work is shaped by lived experience, a strong sense of purpose, and a drive to challenge the systems that don’t always support people in the way they should.

This is a really honest conversation about personal disclosure, visibility, and what it means to be ‘human’ in this work… without losing sight of boundaries.

So if you’ve ever found yourself wondering how much of yourself to share, this one will give you plenty to think about.

What we touch on

The tension between being a ‘blank slate’ and building real connection

What personal disclosure actually looks like in practice

The difference between what you share in a session and in your marketing

Why the therapeutic relationship can’t be one-sided

Stepping into visibility (even when it feels uncomfortable)

Systemic harm, grief, and why naming things matters

🔗 Links & Resources

Rainbow specialises in disenfranchised grief and loss, supporting experiences that are often unseen, unacknowledged, and too often not talked about.

She is the host of the Talking Grief podcast, where she explores these types of conversations in more depth

She is also the founder of The Mental Health People Ltd.

She trains and coaches leaders in more relational, human-centred approaches to mental health and performance. Her work is grounded in a humanistic, integrative approach, incorporating Internal Family Systems (IFS).

Alongside this, she runs a private practice, Rise with Rainbow.

Connect with her on LinkedIn

Start here - my free and paid resources (free resources)

Is the era of the blank slate counselor starting to shift a little bit? I for one, really hope so, because we're trained not to share too much of ourselves, and yet we're also trying to build relationships, run a business, help people to feel like, yeah, I think they really get me. So where does that leave us?

Well, today I'm joined by the fabulous Rainbow Tones, a counselor and coach and trainer who's really leaning into this idea of being okay with being human in her work. Now she has a powerful story. After the loss of her eldest son's father 16 years ago, she describes herself as a mom on a mission to make sure people get the help that they need when they need it.

And in this conversation we go into how she thinks about personal disclosure, why she believes the therapeutic relationship can't be just one person bringing themselves into the room, and how her own neurodivergence shapes the work she does and the way she sees the systems around us. This was a really interesting conversation and I think you're going to enjoy it.

Hi, and welcome to the Grow Your Private Practice Show. I'm Jane Travis, and I help counselors and therapists to get found by the right clients using clear human words on their websites and blogs. So if your marketing feels a little bit hit and miss, or if it just doesn't sound quite like you yet, well you are in the right place.

Hello, hello, hello and welcome back and if this is your first time here, welcome aboard. I hope you enjoy your stay and this is a really great time to come and join us if you're new, because this is a really special episode today because I have a, a guest with me, the fabulous rainbow Tones. I love it when I have guests. And today we're gonna explore a little bit more about personal disclosure. So let's get into it.

Rainbow. It is absolutely fantastic having you here. I've been looking forward to speaking to you now. We've had this booked for a couple of weeks, haven't we? And I've been looking forward to speaking to you because I really love what you do. I really love your positivity. I really love how. Driven you are.

And I sometimes think driven for counselors feels like a dirty word, but it's just about saying, I know what I want to do, I know who I want to help, and I want to get out there and do it. So I can't wait to have a chat with you today.

Oh, thank you. Yeah. Driven. Yeah.

Do you

feel pretty good? Yeah, I mean, I, I guess.

So, you know, it's always a story, isn't there when people work in mental health. And for me, it's nearly 16 years ago since my eldest son's dad died by suicide. And I think that was the moment when I became a mom on a mission. It was like, I, I think that's the drive is to understand mental health, to help people, to make sure people get the help that they need at the right time, that they need it.

So. So, yeah. Driven, definitely.

And I guess having something as, as big and traumatic as that, it does give you that purpose that goes Right. Okay. Yeah. I want to make this work. I need to make this work.

Yeah. And I, and I guess, you know, I do a lot of work supporting people with grief and loss, and I think, you know, it, it can be a great coping strategy to have.

A focus, focus. And for me, yeah, there's, it does still feel unresolved. Not, you know, no point, denying that because, sadly, my oldest son's dad died in NHS Care.and, and yeah, so that there is, and I guess it's important to mention that I'm autistic. I have a DHD, I'm dyslexic, and so what can come with that is this really strong sense of injustice.

So a lot of what I'm doing is to try and get that justice, you know? Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Sounds like a really horrendous period in your life, but you know, it's, I guess it's brought you to where you are now.

Yes, and I, and sadly, I'm not alone. You know, in the work that we do, we meet people, we hear their stories, and that can be really validating and also heartbreaking.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. That's the thing about being a counselor. It, it's not just a job, it's just so. I mean, I know it's not just a job, we all know that, but what it involves is so much more. Mm-hmm. So much more than, for example, I was gonna say, for example, a coach and I'm thinking, oh, if coaches listening to this, they're gonna think, oh Jane, you dunno about coaching.

But I think as counselors we have to learn about all of those bits. And it's so difficult and it's life changing for the client, but it's life changing for the counselor because your. You are learning about life in a whole different way that you've probably not seen before. And that's, yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's very growth inducing, isn't it?

It is. And yeah, I'm, I'm pretty sure this was something that was said as part of my core training was kind of, you know, your clients give you just as much as you support them, right.yeah, and when I think about the work that I'm doing now, as you know, we've sort of spoken about it before, but I'm in the middle of writing my dissertation and you can't help but think about all the clients that you've worked with and all of their stories and it feels like you are honoring what it feel.

For me. It feels like you're honoring their experience by doing something with it, you know?And it's not to say that sitting and listening to someone and being there with them isn't valuable. In fact, the research that I've just done shows how important that is. but to be able to do more with that, that's what I'd like to do.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Now we are here to talk about personal disclosure, so I think it might be, really helpful for people to know. Your journey into interpersonal disclosure, because you have, you've kind of got your finger in a lot of different pies, haven't you? Mm-hmm. One of these people you've, like you say you've got a DHD, which, which means that you kind of tend to flit a little bit, don't you?

So you've got a lot of things that you do. Do you want to just quickly reel them off for us and let us know? Yeah.

Mm-hmm. well, so yeah. It's interesting that you said about being a coach. 'cause that's where I started. You see, so I've worked in learning and development the majority of my career, which involved coaching and I always found myself helping people and hearing their stories.

I used to work in co contact centers years ago and that was, you know, gosh, if you wanna learn about people working in contact centers is a great way to do that. and so. I, I went through redundancy about six years ago, which was heartbreaking in itself. I worked for a company where I felt my values were so aligned to theirs.

You know, often talk about saving lives and things like that. And I was like, yes, this is, this is what I'm here for. And then went through redundancy, which was heartbreaking. but what that meant was that it, it pushed me. into setting up limited company. And so we deliver mental health first aid training, suicide prevention training.

We provide coaching, so we do maternity paternity coaching, access to work coaching. And then I found that there was this gap, for, well, for counselors, but also for, employers. Which was, you know, employee assistance programs can be helpful, but also the support that they can provide is can be limited, especially when we think about grief and trauma and things like that.

So we developed a brand, which is called the Grief Therapist, and then I realized that. I spent some time with, Dr. John Wilson. He's written a few books for us as, as counselors, and I suddenly realized the impact of disenfranchised grief, and that made me realize that we needed to do a podcast to show the impact of this and what disenfranchised grief is.

So we've had people come on and, and talk about pet loss. Late diagnosis of autism, late diagnosis of A DHD, so the, the grief that we don't typically talk about at work.so yes, we've been doing that. What else we been doing? And then I've been, I, what I really want to do, so we've got a CIC, which is called Choose Lives.

I recognize that is interest in, you've got a limited company and you can be quite limited by what you can do with a limited company, whereas community interest company. You can, get funding into that. And I, so I created this CIC and the view is to bring funding into the CIC to mobilize the research that I'm currently doing, which I hope to expand.

In September as well. So yeah, a few things going on, you know?

Yeah. But not just that you are also having a book written about you.

Oh yes. Yeah. Let's not

forget that.

Yeah. Yeah, that's true. I mean, gosh. Yeah. It's probably about a year since I sat down with Alan Hill. So Alan Hill wrote a book, called a Boy called Arsenal, and my dad read that book and told me that he thought it was good.

So.I reached out to Alan and I said, would you write, would you write my story? And he said, have you read the book? And I said, no, but my dad's told me it's really good. And he said, let's have a conversation once you've read the book. Now I told you I'm dyslexic. So that was, a challenge to get through that.

And, and it was a challenge to get through that not only 'cause I'm dyslexic, but also. Reading about a man who's like late diagnosed autistic and the trauma, that he experienced. And that was difficult too. But I did it. I didn't meet the deadline, but I did do it. And then Alan and I had some more conversations.

And last week on World Autism Day, we got the news to say it's going ahead. Publisher wants to go ahead. And, it will be available in January. Gosh,

so exciting. So exciting. I can't wait to read it because you've got an interesting life.

Yes. Yeah. I mean, it's exciting, terrifying. All kinds of emotions.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah. And I, I guess that's a really good place to start talking about, you know, the idea of personal disclosure. 'cause you've actually, you know, this is like the pinnacle of personal disclosure, isn't it? You know, you've got a book written about you and your life. Yeah. So I suppose.

How, how do you broach that, you know, what's your philosophy around it when it comes to sharing the personal details that you do in, you know, in your book and through the other work that you do? How do you, how do you see it?

Well, hmm. I mean, it was therapeutic for me, I'm not gonna lie.

It was hugely therapeutic to go through that process and to go back and I learned things about myself that I didn't realize. I connected dots that I hadn't connected. So that in itself, was a therapeutic experience and I've always believed as a counselor coach that I wouldn't, I wouldn't do something,

let me try and get the words right. It is, it is that kind of, you know, for example, internal Family Systems. I, I experienced that as a client before I was trained in it. So I, I think it's really important to experience things. and so that was an interesting process to kind of really sit with your own life.

And, you know, we went through my medical records, my school reports, I mean, gosh, it was very thorough. but in terms of what does that mean? You know what came up for me when you said that was, and the research that I'm doing just shows it's really important for it to be, for us to be okay with being human.

Okay. And I don't think we are perfect as counselors.we are human and we all have our own stories. And because of what I want to achieve. it felt really important to explain my why, where this was coming from and why it felt so important. And I think therapy for myself helped me find my voice.

Mm.

It helped me to be able to do this. So, and it, and it feels very separate to client work because that, that is, that's my personal work. but I do believe that the, you know, if you are comfortable to share elements of your life. Then you will attract clients because of that. Because they'll, they'll resonate with something about you, and then they'll want to work with you.

Mm-hmm.

Or they won't want to work with you and maybe they're not, it's not the right match, you know, so, and I have seen that in my career. Yeah,

and that's not a bad thing. I mean, obviously I come at it from the marketing viewpoint.

Mm.

And if somebody sees something that you put out there and it's obvious that you are not the right person, then that's not a bad thing at all, is it?

It's FaceTime, doesn't

it? Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

So you've kind of compartmentalized the bit about the, the life story and the counselor sort of version of you.

So the way I view it in terms of self-disclosure and, when I think about, so I'm BACP, registered therapist. So when I think about the guidance, from BACP, it's, you know, when we are disclosing in a session that's very different to disclosing in a book.

So I have no doubt, and in fact I know it's happened.before the book's even, you know, been published, there will have been things that I have disclosed in a session with a client, very intentionally, very mindfully, with the view that that is of maybe of benefit to that client. So I think they're, they're very different, you know?

yeah.

Yeah, I agree. I think there's. I think disclosing like outside of the marketing room is, is. I think it's f Personally, I think it's fine. It's kind of a, a bit of a hill I'll die on really.

Mm-hmm.

You know, as long as we are not just making everything about us, as long as we're remembering that what we are trying to do is to let people see that we understand them, that we've got empathy and sympathy and compassion and all of those things.

Then it's fine. I think it's completely different in the counseling room because that's not what it's supposed to be about. So exactly what you are saying. It's about picking and choosing things that you might choose to disclose, using your experience, knowledge as a counselor to see that this might be something of benefit in some way.

The thing that worries me about personal disclosure is this idea that we've kind of, I know I had this when I was training this idea of always being a blank slate that we are, we are supposed to, you know, it's like in the counseling room, you've gotta be very careful of, you know, what, if anything you have on the walls, what knick-knacks you might have, what colors what you wear.

And I, I think we have to trust clients a little bit, that they'll be able to choose the right person. I dunno if that, I dunno if that kind of, I dunno. You've said that quite right. Yeah,

absolutely. Andone of the things that I've learned even more about, through, the top up degree that I'm doing at the moment and just finalizing the dissertation is around the therapeutic alliance.

And actually it's very difficult to have a relationship with someone if you are the only person that's bringing something to the relationship. So, and I, and particularly because I do tend to work with, Trauma. So I was diagnosed with C-P-T-S-D myself last year. I think it's incredibly important to know something, to have some details, and I think more and more clients are doing that due diligence around who are you?

How do I know I can trust you? How do I know that you are aligned to me and what I need? you know, that's why we've got lots of different types of directories. So, so yeah, I, I think. I'm not sat here saying that. I think all counselors should self disclose. I think it's about boundaries, isn't it? It's what are your boundaries?

What do you feel comfortable with, and what you feel comfortable with today may be different, you know, in the future. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, as I think, you know, I was adopted and I've been doing a lot of work on my adoption trauma. Mm-hmm. And part of that is I found a fantastic counselor and she was adopted, and therefore the, the relationship we had was, so, it was different to any other counselor relationship I've had.

Mm-hmm. Because. She did share a little bit about herself, which meant so much to me. You know, she'd have been blank slating it all the way through, but she did share a little bit about herself and that made me feel closer, and it also made me know that she really understood the stuff that anybody, any other counselor I'd have had to explain it in full.

But she'd got this shorthanded version and that. You can only get through that level of, you know, that level of, therapeutic relationship.

Mm-hmm.

And part of that, like you say, is that you are both in it.

Yeah, absolutely. And when you were describing that, it was, it was a memory came up for me on. The amount of times that I've supported, autistic people through diagnosis and, you know, it is so easy for people to say, what do you, you know, what do you need a diagnosis for?

On the surface, people will look at it and go, well, you can't get medication for autism. You know, why do you need that, this, that, and the other? but actually for me, having that confirmation of being autistic, even though I, I knew I was, I mean. Gosh, you know, part, part of the story talks about my family history and things like that, but when I had that confirmation, the confidence that it gave me to be able to a mask more where it felt safe is changed my life.

So, but that process, being in that process of being judged for wanting a diagnosis, but also the discomfort of the weight for a diagnosis and. You know, being able to, I guess it's advanced empathy, right? Is that you can go, yeah, it sucks. It really sucks.

Yeah. Have you ever found yourself disclosing something that afterwards you regretted?

Hmm.That I can think of, and I'll tell you why, and I think Internal Family Systems has, has really helped me in, in my own life, but also in my work with clients. And it, it's given me permission to stop and check in with my parts. You know, what part is saying, you know, it might be helpful to disclose this.

So, which is interesting when you think about, you know, the. Because I'm, I'm just thinking about being A DHD and impulse control and how that can be difficult. That we might just wanna say something straight away. But IFS has really helped me to just pause in a session and be okay with that and just to check in with myself.

Okay. You know? And to even say to a client, I'm just gonna take a moment here because it is really important to sit and think about, is this okay to say this now? And actually. You know, if you are really not sure, I mean, this is why supervision is amazing, isn't it? Mm. It's kind of, you don't have to do this on your own.

but again, you know, the moment may pass and then it may not feel relevant in future. So we are juggling a lot as counselors, aren't we? Oh, yes. You

really are. Yeah, yeah,

yeah,

yeah. Absolutely.

Now, for you, I know one of the things that you. Really want in your business and in your life is to be more well known to have that visibility, which a lot of counselors kind of would shy away from. how have you walked through, I mean, have you had any like, worries about that? And if you have, how have you sort of, you know, walked through that?

Yeah, I think it's. I know you know that because of what I'm doing through the research and what I hope to do to expand that research in September, you know, my ambition is to influence policy and law.

and to do that you need people to listen. Okay? So that means building your credibility, personal brand. and so I guess. It's, for me, it's a process of, I know this is something I know that I need to do to be able to get to, to where I want to get. So it's, of course there are parts of me that have been worried, you know, by being, so when I first spoke publicly about being autistic, for example.

There's a lot of misconceptions about autistic people that they're not empathetic. So there was a huge fear of, of mine, of, gosh, am I, am I gonna get any counseling clients anymore because, you know, are people gonna make that assumption that I can't do empathy? so yeah, those fears come in, but then there is this strong sense of, I know I need to do this and I know this is how that I need to, how I need to do it.

Yeah.

So the understanding that in order to get to the way you want to be for this passion of yours, to sort of move forward and really do that thing where of really wanting to help those people.

Yeah.

That's the thing that makes you go right. Well, there might be a few bits of it that make, maybe feel a little bit squirmy, but the ends justify the means.

And you know what I, what I think. Also feeds it is the positive messages that I get. The, you know, there's nothing quite like, and this is the tricky thing with social media, is that you can have people follow you. So I'm, more active on LinkedIn. I need to sort out mother socials more, but LinkedIn has, has always felt quite a safe place for me because there's that, you know, it is a professional.

Network is, is the aim, right?and so you have people that will follow you and read your content, but not necessarily interact with it.

Mm.

But I've had people personal message me and say, thank you for saying what you did, or, thank you for doing this, or, and you can't share that. Obviously, as you know, confidentiality.

That just feeds this sense of this is the right thing to do. You know, I need to name this. I need to say what's happening and I need to, use what I know and the research to, to make things better.

That's a really, really good point. Actually. That is a really good point because. So many times people are so worried about going on social media or being visible in some way, or sharing a blog or something like that, and they are terrified that they're going to get , criticized.

They worry so much and understandably, I, I feel it sometimes too. There's a worry about being criticized. There's a worry about somebody trolling us. There's a worry about being seen in some way and that it's not gonna end well. But I don't think we really remember about the fact that so often.

People will contact you. People contact me and thank me and so, you know, you, it was like you were talking to me and that feels so good. Yeah. And it's worth remembering that what we put out there, it's not gonna be blindly criticized by people. There are loads of people looking at what you say with interest, being interested in, you know, your story or how you describe it.

And we worry so much about being criticized that yeah, just remember there's loads of people that are, you will get messages from people saying, thank you so much for that. It was really nice to know that, you know, kind of normalizing it, I guess,

and the validation that

Mm,

you know, when you read something and I've, you know, I've done it myself, you know, reading other therapists content and things like that, and I might not interact with it.

but I'll read it and I'll go, gosh. Yeah, that is incredibly validating. And, and usually I'll screenshot it and I'll be like, that's great. You know, when I need, when I need that, I'll, I'll come back to it. Yeah. so, so, yeah. I, I, and it's so difficult, isn't it, because we don't have a measure. This is the challenge with the podcast.

and so my, as you know, my background is learning and development, so training. So when we deliver training courses, we ask for feedback. So you get feedback from people that attend the courses podcasting, whoa. It's, you are putting it out there and there's no kind of feedback mechanism that I'm aware of, and I'm very new to this, where someone can.

They obviously can rate your podcast, but there's no automatic, so what did you think of that episode? You know, and that's really hard 'cause you just, you don't have an idea of the ripple effect, the impact of what you are doing unless someone does reach out and message you. So we, we don't know how much of a ripple effect we're having.

Absolutely. And yes, with podcasts you don't, but it's the same with blogs as well. I mean, I think if you do social media, people might like or comment or something like that. Yeah. But if you put a blog out there, same as a podcast.

Mm-hmm. It

used to be that you'd open it up for comments and people could comment.

Yeah, but that doesn't really happen now. It's not the way that it used to be. I think because it, they used to, I know when I used to do that, there was so many spammy comments, and it's horrible the way. It's horrible because you put something out there that you're proud of and you think, yeah, that's, that's gonna hit home.

That's fantastic. And then

it's

like, you know, crickets. I think that what I do is I notice that when people contact me about something, they'll very often say, I listen to you on the podcast. It's great. Thank you. And it just, that makes me go. Oh, great. That's that's great. Somebody hears it. Yeah. So, so they do, and if they contact you, they'll say, I heard you on the podcast, and that will give you what you need.

Which is just that little bit of, a little nod to you to say, yeah, I've heard you, and it was great. Thank you.

Yeah. Yeah. And I, I wonder if there is this. This, I don't know, stereotype, persona of a counselor that, that we don't have the same human needs. It's kind of, oh, you know, they're, they're a counselor.

They're, they're doing this, that, and the other. so they're, they're okay. You know, but, but we need that as well, don't we? We need, we've got the same human needs, reassurance, validation, recognition, all of those sorts of things.

Yeah.

Yeah,

absolutely. Absolutely. I certainly have, you know, I'm just sat here desperate for people to reassure me.

Yeah,

I'll just, I'll just, get that, get rid of that on a podcast that's gonna not be there. Anyway, I'm joking, by the way. I'm

joking. I thought it was good. I thought that was really good because I, you know. Reassurance that we are doing the right thing. 'cause our, our intention is to help people. Yes. And if we're not helping people, let us know.

Yeah,

yeah, yeah. There's nothing worse than that. misunderstanding and being seen as something that you're not. I've had that recently myself, and it's absolutely thrown me. But anyway, that's a story for another time. So, if, if somebody's listening to this and they're thinking, right. Okay. I'm listening to Rainbow. I'm listening to Jane. They're talking about, personal disclosure and doesn't sound that scary as long as I know where my boundaries are. Yeah. How, what would you sort of recommend somebody might do to sort of dip their toe in.

I mean, I guess start small, right? You know, low risk. and just, and just see how that feels. And, you know, I wonder if there's. If you are not someone that's disclosing in your profile, those sorts of things. So if, if, if people aren't getting more of a sense of who you are through your profile, and then they come to you and, and then they do get that, that may be a, a bit of a mismatch.

So that might be something to consider. But also always part of that kind of contracting as well, you know, what is, what has been that client's experience? Because maybe they have had a negative experience where they felt like a counselor was, you know, focusing on their own agenda, their, you know. so I guess, I guess it's thinking about.

A bit of a review is kind of what does this look like in terms of my profile? How am I positioning myself? What would I feel comfortable disclosing? Where are my personal boundaries? But even then, I think, you know, you can, you can plan as much as you like, and it, it might just feel right in that moment, and you check in with yourself and it's like, yeah, absolutely.

I, I have a sense that this would be beneficial for my client. We could write all the, all our own kind of set of a kind of personal boundaries policy, and still end up adapting. And I guess that's what we do, isn't it? As counselors is we really do have to be adaptable.

Yeah. Constantly adapting. Yeah, I'm thinking as well.

I mean we were talking early, well you said earlier a really good point, which is, and again, I tend to come from a marketing point of view 'cause that's kind of my thing more now. But your supervisor, supervisor might be a good person to have a chat with. So if you're thinking, look, I think I'd like to share a little bit more about myself in my marketing.

I just don't know. Where AM might sit with that. Mm-hmm. Maybe a little chat with them would help.

Yeah.

And I guess it depends on your supervisor.

Exactly. And you, you might end up thinking, I need a different supervisor. And that happens though, doesn't it? Yeah, it does. You know, your, how your approach can change over the years.

So then, you know. Do you have a supervisor that is aligned to your approach and the way that you wanna work? So, absolutely. A, a kind of discussion around this is, this is where I'm thinking of taking my practice. you know, clients are wanting to know more than, you know, in terms of psychological safety and things like that.

And then working out, how does that work in your, relationship with your supervisor? Is that, is that going to work between you?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Lots to think about, isn't it?

Well, yeah, because things do change all the time, and like I say, with marketing, marketing has changed. You know, it's not like you just put something on the counseling directory and you have a bit of a website, you know, that's, you have to do something a bit more,what's the word?

Can't think what the word is, but you have to do something a little bit more. I can't think of the word, but you have to do something a bit more than that now.

Yeah.

And that means,

well that's, that's the nicheing nicheing, isn't it? Yeah.

Yeah.

A lot of people are afraid of that.

Yeah. I try not to use the word niche anymore 'cause it does freak people out.

They think, oh my God, it means I've got to turn people away and I can only ever see this type of person. It's like, no, that's not really what it is. But understanding who you wanna work with, is a really big. Big part of

it for you? Yeah, definitely. Because niching doesn't mean no, does it? It's just saying this, this is who I tend to work with.

If someone resonates with you and it feels right, doesn't mean you can't step outside of what you're putting out there.

Absolutely. So yeah, it's, it, it's changed so much and it will continue to change. We now have things like, ai, we've got better help that we never used to have. We have so many people in the counseling marketing.

I mean, you know, there's so many around, we have to pull our socks up, don't we? And try and, you know, be seen. And part of that is being visible. Otherwise, otherwise you'll just not be seen, I guess.

Mm. Yeah. And that's interesting, isn't it? 'cause that's what we're asking our clients to do, is to be seen is to, is to come into therapy and Yeah.

And

to share,

share thoughts. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So that's, that's sort of there, isn't it? So as you move more into the public role, and I really look forward to having your own, chat show.

That would be so cool.

That would be so cool. How do you want to be known? What would be the thing that, how would you like to be known?

Gosh, I mean, I think, I think that.

You know, going back to what we said at the very beginning, that mom on a mission, you know, really on that mission to, to make things better. So the, the topic of that I've been researching, I mean, I would say for 16 years, to be honest, I is is that topic of. systemic harm. So really understanding the impact that systems so families, you know, and institutions have on our mental health.

So, yeah, it'd be really cool to be the woman, mother, counselor, that really brings that into light. I think it's so easy to say that people aren't resilient when we are not acknowledging the systems that they're operating in.

That would be cool.

That would be very cool. It would be very cool. It is interesting talking to you now, just thinking about, like I say, with my own journey with Adoption that fits so closely into it, doesn't it? Because there's all that harm, but there's nobody there to help you with any of that. So you kind of just stuck with this systemic

Yeah.

Pain and hurt that, anyway, that's talking about me. We're not here to talk.

Well, we've talked about how self-disclosure is really important. Oh, we have, yes. That's So check out

self-disclosing

and and actually it helps us to form. Relationships and potential partnerships. You know, I know I can't do this work on my own.

it's huge. so I think it's really important what you've mentioned, and I think by saying it, it's recognizing it, isn't it? If we, if we don't name it, how can we recognize the harm and therefore how can people get what they need?

Mm-hmm. Because it's all over, isn't it? I'm just thinking about school bullying.

How many times have people been bullied and they're told, you know, everybody has to go through this and you know it, it's minimized off. Anyway, I am going off on my own right now.

Can you see, you? See you. You're, is this transference? I don't know. Are you, are you feeling. Mission. And you know, I've

always felt

your mission, isn't it?

I have. I have always felt your mission. I think this idea of people that have had to deal with some sort of crap, that's not their fault. It's been given to them and there's nobody there to say, yeah, that was, that wasn't fair.

Yeah.

Is, you know, I don't think anybody out there has not got a feeling of that in some way, shape, or form.

Mm-hmm.

So, yeah. Yeah, I have absolutely loved talking to you today. As you know, I always love talking to you, so, thank you for coming on. rainbow, I keep hesitating 'cause of course you name recently changed, didn't it? So my brain's just having to catch up a little bit.are you still looking for people to go on into your own directory?

So we are, in the process of expanding our grief therapist team. So that is something that we are looking at. and we are also, as I said to you, you know, with the CIC, the community interest company, you know, how do we grow that and how do we, because the way I envision it is, if you've been harmed by a system.

You are less likely to go back to that system for support. So, so where is that? So yeah, there's, there's quite a lot that is developing. yeah.

So, like I say, you do have your finger in a lot of pies. If somebody was interested in some of the things that we've talked about today, what's the best way to sort of connect with you or to see what's going on?

Yeah, absolutely. So, One of, so I run a regular newsletter, so emails, newsletter, which you can subscribe to on the mental health people website. I do hang out on LinkedIn quite a lot, so you know, if people are on LinkedIn and I am, as I said earlier, doing some work around my other social media accounts.

So yeah, I mean. We plan to grow, not just our limited company and the grief therapist brand. You know, we, we really are looking to grow, choose lives and as I said, I, I can't do this on my own. So we'll keep people updated with our progress and, you know, if there are elements that people would like to get involved in or hear more about, you know, definitely subscribing to our email newsletters gonna be helpful.

Sounds fantastic. Sounds fantastic. Rainbow. Thank you so much for coming here today. I'm sure our listeners have found that really useful and helpful. I always love talking to you as you know, you're such an interesting person. You've got such a lot of things. You're doing such an interesting task. so yeah, always good to talk to you and yeah, hope to speak to you again soon.

Well, thank you. Thank you for the time and the support. you know, I know we haven't spoken about that today, but it, we need people to support us in these missions and you've supported me tons, so I appreciate that.

Bless you. Thank you.

Rainbow. Thank you so much for taking time out of your very, very busy life to come and talk with me. I do really appreciate it and I've really, really enjoyed it and I've personally taken a lot from this as well. And I really hope that this has given you something to think about, especially when it comes to how you are showing up, what you share, and how you build that sense of connection before people even reach out.

Because this isn't about suddenly starting to share loads of stuff about yourself. It's about understanding what actually helps someone to feel like, yeah, somebody really understands me. Now, if you'd like to connect with Rainbow or explore more about her work, everything you need will be in the show notes, including the details of her own podcast. So do go and take a

look there.

And if you'd like to connect with Rainbow or explore more about her work, including her podcast, everything you need will be in the show notes. So do go and take a look there.

Thank you so much for finding the time to be here with me today. It's been a pleasure having you. And be sure to follow the show so you don't miss any future episodes. Have a fabulous week and I hope to see you soon. Take care. Bye-bye.