Shownotes
Join Blair as she and Grant Garry talk about his inspiring documentary, Meet Me Where I Am. They dive into all of the lessons Grant learned along the way about grief and resilience.
Buy the books: https://theglobalresilienceproject.com/books/
Be featured in RESILIENT A.F.: Skin Deep Stories: https://blairkaplan.kartra.com/page/tattoo
Be featured in RESILIENT A.F.: Stories of Resilience Vol. 3: https://blairkaplan.kartra.com/page/RAF26
About the Guest:
Grant Garry is an award winning filmmaker, actor, and singer. He is the director of the documentary Meet Me Where I Am - available on Amazon Prime, Tubi, and Youtube Movies. Grant recently starred as “Beast” in Disney’s Beauty and the Beast at The San Luis Obispo Opera. Grant graduated Cum Laude with a Bachelor's Degree in Theatre Arts from Loyola Marymount University. Previous credits include NCIS: Los Angeles, Legally Blonde: The Musical, Black Cat, Night of the Living Deb, Sweeney Todd, Cinderella. He currently hosts the show The Where I Am Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and Amazon Music.
Links:
https://www.instagram.com/grant__garryigsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ%3D%3D&utm_source=qr
https://www.instagram.com/meetmewhereiamfilmigsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ%3D%3D&utm_source=qr
https://bio.site/MeetMeWhereIAmFilm
Gift: Here is Grant singing A Whole New World from Disney's Aladdin! https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cqnv--hpbFW/?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==
⚠️ Content Note: Some episodes may contain themes that could be distressing. Please take care of yourself while listening, and don’t hesitate to seek support from a mental health professional if needed.
About the Hosts:
Blair Kaplan Venables is a British Columbia-based grief and resilience expert and coach, motivational speaker and the Founder of The Global Resilience Project. Her expertise has been featured on media platforms like Forbes, TEDx, CBC Radio, Entrepreneur, and Thrive Global. She is named the Top Grief and Resilience Expert of the Year 2024 by IAOTP. USA Today listed Blair as one of the top 10 conscious female leaders to watch and she empowers others to be resilient from stages around the world. 'MyStory,’ which is a television show available on Amazon Prime Video, Apple TV+ and Google Play, showcases Blair's life story. She is the host of the Radical Resilience podcast and specializes in helping people strengthen their resilience muscle using scientifically proven methods and guides grieving high performers with her Navigating Grief Framework. The Global Resilience Project’s award-winning book series are international bestsellers, and her fourth book, RESILIENT A.F.: Stories of Resilience Vol 2, will be published in January 2025. In her free time, you can find Blair writing, in nature, travelling the world and helping people to strengthen their resilience muscles.
Links:
https://theglobalresilienceproject.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/blairdkaplan
https://www.facebook.com/blair.kaplan
https://www.facebook.com/BlairKaplanCommunications
https://www.instagram.com/globalresiliencecommunity
https://www.instagram.com/blairfromblairland/
https://www.facebook.com/globalresiliencecommunity
https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-global-resilience-project
Alana Kaplan is a compassionate mental health professional based in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. She works in the mental health field, and is a co-host of the Resilient A.F. podcast. Fueled by advocacy, Alana is known for standing up and speaking out for others. Passionate about de-stigmatizing and normalizing mental health, Alana brings her experience to The Global Resilience Project’s team, navigating the role one’s mental health plays in telling their story.
Engaging in self-care and growth keeps her going, and her love for reading, travel, and personal relationships helps foster that. When she’s not working, Alana can often be found on walks, working on a crossword puzzle, or playing with any animal she sees.
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Transcripts
Welcome back to another episode of Resilient AF with
Speaker:Blair and Alana, but pause the Alana and
Speaker:welcome Grant Gary. What's really cool is that I went
Speaker:from never talking to him to talking to him multiple times
Speaker:a day, every day for the last five days. So it's it's
Speaker:pretty cool that he's here. He's super cool and, like,
Speaker:very funny and loves singing, and he likes long walks on the
Speaker:beach and is an award winning filmmaker, actor,
Speaker:and singer. He is director of the documentary Meet Me Where
Speaker:I Am, which is available on Amazon Prime, Tubi, and YouTube
Speaker:movies. He recently starred as Beast in Disney's Beauty and
Speaker:the Beast at the San I don't know how to say this. How do I
Speaker:say it? San Luis Obispo.
Speaker:Obispo. Oh, that's what you were saying. Opera. You
Speaker:know, it's also super cool because he has other really awesome credits, including
Speaker:NCIS Los Angeles, Legally Blonde the musical, Black
Speaker:Cat, Night of the Living Deb. I don't know what that is,
Speaker:but that sounds fun. Sweeney Todd, Cinderella, and he currently hosts the
Speaker:show, the Where I Am podcast
Speaker:on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and Amazon Music. And in fact, he
Speaker:really does meet us where we are because Kara Sanchez,
Speaker:the editor in chief of Get Greasy, and I, we're both in LA at
Speaker:the same time. She's from Chicago. I'm from British Columbia,
Speaker:Canada. And, Grant came all the way from where he lives
Speaker:near where we are, and we podcasted in a hotel room,
Speaker:and he met us where we are. So here we are again meeting,
Speaker:where we are on Zoom.
Speaker:That was, an amazing introduction.
Speaker:Thank you. Yes. You're welcome. I mean, it's an amazing
Speaker:introduction for someone who does amazing things in this world.
Speaker:And what I love is how much you love singing,
Speaker:and, and maybe you could do a little bit of,
Speaker:you know, beast. I I
Speaker:told you the other day, don't ask me to do acapella. Yeah.
Speaker:But on that same note, on that same note, we were
Speaker:talking about bands that we like, and I I mentioned the
Speaker:Goo Goo Dolls and how, like, how many hits they have. Yeah. And
Speaker:I neglected to bring up the song Iris in
Speaker:that conversation because Iris was
Speaker:written for the movie city of angels, which is,
Speaker:like, very much a grief like film.
Speaker:Yeah. And, those
Speaker:fur those first, like, few lyrics of that song,
Speaker:are so beautiful. Now I'm
Speaker:forgetting them. It goes,
Speaker:and I'd give up forever to touch you
Speaker:because I know that you feel me somehow. And then
Speaker:he says, you're the closest to heaven that I'll ever be. And
Speaker:I think that's, like, so beautiful. And
Speaker:we were talking about how in these moments, like, that
Speaker:people experience, like, in these hard seasons, in these, like, grief moments,
Speaker:that music can bring out, that
Speaker:can evoke those, like, feelings that are inside of us and help us, like,
Speaker:connect more, I think, with our feelings. I could be totally
Speaker:wrong, but that's just my interpretation of it, my
Speaker:understanding of it. I love that. And first of all, that
Speaker:song is amazing. I really digressed quickly, didn't
Speaker:I? No. And where did you digress to? We're talking about
Speaker:beautiful songs and and you're
Speaker:singing. And I think it's it's really cool that you said that, and it's also
Speaker:funny. And this is what I'm about to do is a complete digression. But we
Speaker:spoke about our favorite movies. And Yeah. This is crazy.
Speaker:So we were just for those of you who aren't following along, Karen,
Speaker:Ira, and Alana were at an Oscar's gifting lounge in LA handing
Speaker:out copies of our most recent book, Resilient AF
Speaker:Stories of Resilience Volume two, and our Resilient
Speaker:AF, sweaters to celebrities and media. And we had this
Speaker:one really interesting run-in. And this is funny
Speaker:because I shared that my favorite movie is Empire Records when we
Speaker:recorded your podcast. And you haven't watched it yet, but you
Speaker:will. You have to. So I shared that.
Speaker:And then after I went back to kind of look up who some of the
Speaker:celebrities that came through are. And this one
Speaker:guy came through wearing sunglasses, very, like, eccentric,
Speaker:came to our table. We shared our story.
Speaker:He was he didn't want a book. He's like, I I love this. Not gonna
Speaker:read it. I'm not gonna take it. Love your sweater, but I won't wear it,
Speaker:so I'm gonna save you one. And then Kara tried to give him a get
Speaker:griefy sticker for his water bottle. He's like, that's negative energy. Everything is energy. I
Speaker:don't want that. And so but he was really interested
Speaker:in my my necks my necklace, my neck stone, not my neck. My neck
Speaker:itself isn't very interesting, but the jewelry around it is. Anyways, it
Speaker:was a very interesting like, I'll remember this encounter forever. But,
Speaker:also, this person looked so familiar, but I was like, I don't know who this
Speaker:person is. And, after I looked him up and he played one of the
Speaker:main guys in Empire Records There you
Speaker:go. There you go. Everything's connected. Everything's connected.
Speaker:But, and that leads us to a great a great place. So I
Speaker:I've been recommended to chat with you by multiple people,
Speaker:and you even reached out about Meet Me Where I Am am
Speaker:through your on social media. And so I watched it, and I recommended it to
Speaker:my sister, Alana, who is a palliative
Speaker:social worker. And she's like, oh my god, Blair. I've seen it. It's
Speaker:so good. And, like, it was just so funny because, like,
Speaker:again, she's in Winnipeg, Manitoba and was looking for resources
Speaker:and found you. That's amazing.
Speaker:Like, I I know you mentioned that the other she mentioned that to me. I
Speaker:couldn't believe that she had already because I just feel like
Speaker:I'm like, is anyone watching this film? I'm like, I'm like,
Speaker:is anyone watching this film? Atlanta in Winnipeg. And it's it's
Speaker:just like that's that's just like I I love hearing that
Speaker:that people are seeking out a resource
Speaker:such as Meet Me Where I Am to maybe
Speaker:better their understanding or to help others. And that
Speaker:is, like, why we made the film. So let those
Speaker:people know out there listening and watching, like, what is Meet Me Where I
Speaker:Am? Meet Me Where I Am is it's a
Speaker:documentary about individual stories
Speaker:of love and loss and finding purpose
Speaker:and finding meaning in your life after loss.
Speaker:And I always I always, like, preface that
Speaker:with just because
Speaker:just making meaning doesn't mean you have to start some
Speaker:big organization. It doesn't mean you have to write a book. It
Speaker:doesn't mean you have to make a film.
Speaker:Meaning can be those little things, those little daily things as
Speaker:you move forward with your loss. Like, for some
Speaker:people, it could just be, like, getting out of bed and, like, taking a shower
Speaker:that day. Like, that's meaningful.
Speaker:The conversation you and I are having right now is meaning. You
Speaker:know? We're doing something. We're part of something
Speaker:right now. Mhmm. Does it look weird when
Speaker:I'm looking into the camera? I never know. Look wherever you want. I'm always
Speaker:everywhere. Like, this is me, like, feeling like I'm
Speaker:looking at you in the eyes, but this probably feels more like I'm looking at
Speaker:you. I'm looking at you in the eyes, and I'm looking at the camera in
Speaker:the eye. Yeah. Look wherever you want.
Speaker:So, So, yeah, I mean, it
Speaker:was it was almost two years of
Speaker:interviews. I think I interviewed about 30
Speaker:something peep was it 30? Somewhere around there,
Speaker:people. And it was just with every person, I learned something new.
Speaker:And I saw a lot of trends as well,
Speaker:in grief, which is interesting.
Speaker:And I talked to Colin Campbell recently, and he was
Speaker:saying how, like,
Speaker:Colin wrote the book, Finding the Words
Speaker:and which is a great book. And he was saying how I'm, like, totally gonna
Speaker:butcher what he said, but I I kinda found this myself in doing the interviews
Speaker:where there is no like, sure. There's no, like, two agreeburs
Speaker:alike. There's no right or wrong way to do it. But there is
Speaker:for a lot of people, not everyone, but there is sort
Speaker:of this, like, kind of universal
Speaker:trend where you're in active
Speaker:grief, and it feels like you're never gonna get out of it. It's
Speaker:the worst thing you've ever experienced in your life. You don't know
Speaker:how you're gonna move forward.
Speaker:And then you finally get to a place where you're living with that that grief.
Speaker:And that it's like it's, like, fused with your being more
Speaker:than the initial, shock of it.
Speaker:And you get to a place where you carry it with you, like, every day.
Speaker:And it's just in a different form than it
Speaker:was when it was, like, very, very fresh. And I think that's common for a
Speaker:lot of people that have gone through it and
Speaker:also, put work
Speaker:into, like, find their new version of
Speaker:it. Does that make any sense at
Speaker:all? It does a % because it's a visual of,
Speaker:like, this is grief. My hand is in a fist, and
Speaker:then, like, this is life. My hand is my other hand is touching it. But
Speaker:then as I learn to navigate grief and begin to heal
Speaker:my heart, the grief doesn't get smaller, but the, you know, it just life
Speaker:gets bigger around it. And that's
Speaker:I That's how I see it because my grief is still here,
Speaker:but I'm not thinking about it twenty four seven. I still think about it all
Speaker:the time, and I carry and it's heavy, but I also have now capacity for
Speaker:other things. Well, think of it like this. Like, you and I are both wearing
Speaker:glasses. Right? Mhmm. We're glasses buddies today.
Speaker:And I take out my glasses. I I can't see,
Speaker:like, really well at all. Like, let's say my bad eyesight
Speaker:is my grief. And now over time, I get this,
Speaker:like, somewhat of a correction. My eyes are still bad. The
Speaker:bad eyes are still there. Yeah. But I'm learning how
Speaker:to move forward with them in a little bit of a different way. I don't
Speaker:know if that's a good analogy or not. I get it. I get it. I
Speaker:get it. What what were
Speaker:some things that surprised you that you learned from 30 plus
Speaker:interviews?
Speaker:So I dealt with, like, a
Speaker:range of grief, different
Speaker:types of losses. I talked to a number of people who
Speaker:had like, their children, had been murdered
Speaker:even. And what was so
Speaker:interesting to me was to see the
Speaker:people that felt like
Speaker:they could never forgive their child's killer. And
Speaker:then on the flip side, the people that wanted to forgive them
Speaker:immediately because of maybe, like, a spiritual
Speaker:or a religious belief, believing that that was
Speaker:a way for them to release whatever they were holding on
Speaker:to regarding their feelings towards it.
Speaker:Another thing so that was, like, obviously, like, very heavy and
Speaker:and surprising to hear these. Just
Speaker:it just speaks to how like, for example, like, you and
Speaker:your sister have both had
Speaker:the same loss on paper. However,
Speaker:your experiences with that loss are different. Of course,
Speaker:they are. So it's always interesting just to hear
Speaker:how one person felt versus the other. Another thing that
Speaker:I always say that was so interesting to me is
Speaker:something Anthony Rapp said, which
Speaker:was you mourn the loss of them, but you're also mourning
Speaker:you and who you were to them. Like, your relationship
Speaker:as a husband or a brother or a spout like, just
Speaker:anything, because that goes with them
Speaker:too. And I never really thought of it that way,
Speaker:but you're the version of you that only
Speaker:knew that version of them is gone
Speaker:now too. And so how do we move forward
Speaker:with that? You know? That's really profound
Speaker:and also so true. And there's a lot of other layers to that
Speaker:too. Like, mourning what will never be
Speaker:and what you thought will be that won't.
Speaker:It's The the morning the the morning what you thought you were
Speaker:gonna have, the grieving of future that you're not gonna
Speaker:have is a really challenging one. You know, people can say,
Speaker:like, oh oh, you know, your wife your wife died.
Speaker:Well, at least you didn't have kids with them. And it's like, well, maybe kids
Speaker:were supposed to be part of that plan. You know? So now you're grieving
Speaker:the family that you thought you were gonna make with this person.
Speaker:Even on a different, like, scale, like,
Speaker:perhaps a job loss, you know, changing the
Speaker:trajectory of your career, a life that you thought you
Speaker:might have had or were going to have. So there's these,
Speaker:like, major shifts that occur,
Speaker:with with with a law, with a major grief, with a major loss.
Speaker:And I think it's probably interesting for you in this journey
Speaker:to learn about all these different types of loss cause a lot of people who
Speaker:hear grief, they think someone died. That's it.
Speaker:Yeah. Yeah. And it's so much more than that.
Speaker:Can you. Okay. I'm gonna ask you a personal question.
Speaker:I did recently well, not recently, but I've done a training with doctor
Speaker:Claire Bidwell Smith. Loved her, and she had us do some
Speaker:exercises. And one of them was to list out
Speaker:all of the griefs I can remember. And, like,
Speaker:it's interesting because this was a while ago, and, like, I still have ones that
Speaker:pop in that are new. I'm like, oh, that was a grief. Oh, that was
Speaker:a grief. Do you can you,
Speaker:like, remember, like, as a kid experiencing any
Speaker:type of grief? It wasn't until I
Speaker:did that same exact exercise that you just mentioned.
Speaker:Not with Claire. I did it with David Kessler, and I
Speaker:told him about it on my my podcast
Speaker:that I think that was, like, the beginning of my grief training was
Speaker:he had he had us list losses, just list losses.
Speaker:And I went, oh, oh my god. I was like, that
Speaker:that was grief as a child. And, you know,
Speaker:I lost my I lost my grandpa when I was
Speaker:four years old. And it didn't,
Speaker:you know, it doesn't didn't hit me until later, like, what a grief
Speaker:that was and, like, how I missed out on
Speaker:more of a relationship with them.
Speaker:I had also it sounds silly,
Speaker:but I told David, I said, we had these pet rabbits.
Speaker:And I don't know why we had pet rabbits as a kid, but we
Speaker:loved them. And
Speaker:they one day, they both died.
Speaker:And it was, like, so traumatic
Speaker:as a child. Like because it was just like a fun,
Speaker:lovable, like, animal that we had and part of our family would run
Speaker:around in the backyard with us. And
Speaker:I didn't realize till years later that what I was
Speaker:feeling at that time as a child was
Speaker:grief. And so you
Speaker:kinda, like, feel for that younger version of yourself. Mhmm.
Speaker:You know? You feel you just feel for them in a
Speaker:way. Did you have any
Speaker:adults talk to you about grief when you were a kid? Like, when your rabbits
Speaker:died or your grandpa died? And
Speaker:I asked because we're sorry. I'm interrupting you. I'm asking this because we're the same
Speaker:generation, and I don't want my answer. It's
Speaker:Yeah. Yeah. I don't think I ever, like, heard the word grief.
Speaker:My grandmother passed when I was 15, and I remember thinking,
Speaker:like, something like, oh, the universe messed up. Like,
Speaker:hold on. This isn't supposed to happen this way. And that
Speaker:was very, very shocking. Like, that was a very, like,
Speaker:shocking grief for me. The word grief
Speaker:was, like, never mentioned. It was, like, a very, like,
Speaker:in our family, it was just, like, a very, like, standard
Speaker:like, it was like, this happened. Then we planned the
Speaker:funeral, and then people brought food over. And it was just a very,
Speaker:like, structured situation. And
Speaker:then you kinda are made to feel like, oh, once that structure,
Speaker:once those, like, steps come to an end, then
Speaker:you're supposed to be fine. And
Speaker:you're just not. I mean, you know, it's like
Speaker:so to answer your question, no. I don't think people talk to me about grief.
Speaker:I think, you know, my mom talked to me and still will talk to me
Speaker:a lot about, like, feelings surrounding it. So, I mean,
Speaker:our, like, I think we've gotten a lot better over the
Speaker:years. I also feel like at that time,
Speaker:we still felt like, you know, oh, I don't wanna say anything.
Speaker:I don't wanna bring it up to make other people sad, or I don't wanna
Speaker:share what's inside me. And it's just like, why? Why
Speaker:why not? Everyone's thinking something about it. Everyone's feeling something about
Speaker:it. Who you're just supposed to the expectation is just to keep
Speaker:it inside. That doesn't make any sense. It'll just manifest in more
Speaker:negative ways as you move forward. Yeah. No. Definitely.
Speaker:Thank you for sharing all of that. And I'm sorry about your rabbits and your
Speaker:grandpa and your grandma. And, like, I think loss as a child is so
Speaker:confusing and devastating. Yeah.
Speaker:And my sister had a pet rabbit. It was so
Speaker:devastating when Blackie, she she wants to acknowledge that it
Speaker:was a different time. The rabbit was black. She
Speaker:she was so devastated when Blackie died that not only did she stay home
Speaker:from school, but my mom had to take a day off work.
Speaker:Like, loss is devastating. I mean Yeah.
Speaker:I I mean, what's really great now is that we're having these conversations.
Speaker:There's documentaries like, you know, the one you put out. We
Speaker:are finding the tools, learning the tools, teaching the
Speaker:younger generation the tools. So grief can be part of this
Speaker:conversation. And I actually had a meeting earlier, and I wrote down
Speaker:something that came to mind that grief is a privilege.
Speaker:Grief is a privilege because I believe we grieve because we
Speaker:love. To love is to have grief as part
Speaker:of part of having love in your life. And I
Speaker:think knowing that your love
Speaker:doesn't change, but but the relationship to the
Speaker:person might. Yeah. I, I was
Speaker:talking with Jana De Cristo Ferra, who's in the film as
Speaker:well. She works at the Dougie Center, and she hosts a
Speaker:great podcast, grief out loud. So check
Speaker:that one out. I was I think it was her that I was telling
Speaker:to. Like, I when I started the documentary, I was, like, trying to
Speaker:define grief, and we can get to that in a second.
Speaker:But I remember thinking, like, well, like, if someone wanted
Speaker:to avoid grief, how do you do it? And I came up with, you never
Speaker:love anyone or anything or you just you you get out of town as soon
Speaker:as possible. And, like, neither one of those seemed like good options.
Speaker:Mm-mm. So we endure,
Speaker:I guess. I mean, it's the
Speaker:full human experience. Yeah. It is. It is. And
Speaker:it just it seems like
Speaker:it's like I think she said this too once, which was,
Speaker:like, grief like, love is not
Speaker:promised, but grief is, and it should almost be the other way
Speaker:around. It's like grief should be, like, the optional thing, and love should
Speaker:be promised in our lives. Yeah. I
Speaker:mean, imagine. And, like,
Speaker:also, like, grief is so painful that love should feel like
Speaker:the complete opposite, but love has the spectrum of feelings with
Speaker:it. Yeah. It's so
Speaker:deeply complex and nuanced. I hate
Speaker:grief. I mean, it's a privilege. Yes. But, like,
Speaker:I fucking hate it. Like, it's just, the worst. It's interesting.
Speaker:You're when you were just talking about your grandma dying at 15,
Speaker:my so, actually, today, recording this on this March 4, it would have been my
Speaker:aunt's birthday. My aunt, my mom's oldest sister passed away
Speaker:from ovarian cancer when I was 21. And I
Speaker:was in the room with her at the hospital when she took her last breath.
Speaker:And, like, in Judaism, we do, you know, the Shiva and, like, there's these
Speaker:beautiful traditions, but no one really talked to us, the the nieces and the
Speaker:nephews, about grief. And this is my
Speaker:first, like, grief that, like, I remember really affecting me
Speaker:because right away after that, I went to, like, party in Greece. I was
Speaker:21, so I went to party in Greece with, like, my friend. And I just
Speaker:remember feeling so sad and off and, like, I can't have fun. I'm sad, but,
Speaker:like, not really tying it to, like, oh, my aunt just died.
Speaker:Yeah. And it's just kind of weird in hindsight to know, like, oh,
Speaker:like I was really because I was close with my aunt and I
Speaker:watched her die and no one talked to me about
Speaker:it. And it wasn't because no one wanted to, but maybe because it
Speaker:wasn't something that people did twenty years ago.
Speaker:Yeah. It twenty years ago, I think there was certainly, like,
Speaker:we approached it differently. It was just a very, like,
Speaker:I'm sorry for your loss. My condolences.
Speaker:You know, like, that's what people would do then. Yeah. Oh, I thought you're telling
Speaker:me you're sorry for my loss. No. No.
Speaker:No. I'm saying it was just, like, they Yeah. First of all first of
Speaker:all, let's back up. I am sorry that you had to go through that experience.
Speaker:Yeah. I am. I'm saying at the time. Yeah.
Speaker:That's all you. Just like that's all someone would say. And
Speaker:then they would just say, like, my condolences and then move on. And it was
Speaker:like, well, I said I said what I needed to say, and they should be
Speaker:fine in a couple months. Yeah. And I think
Speaker:especially too with, like, nieces and nephews, like, that
Speaker:relationship, I don't think we think
Speaker:of it as a major grief, like,
Speaker:the way we should. Like, I, you know, I had a
Speaker:similar situation. You know? My my mom's brother passed,
Speaker:and he was like the cool uncle. You know?
Speaker:And it was, like, towards the tail end of
Speaker:making this film, like, the film coming out. And I remember learning
Speaker:about anticipatory grief and
Speaker:how and we talk about in the Jewel Julie Shaw talks about it.
Speaker:Doctor Julie Shaw, who's on the poster,
Speaker:talks about anticipatory grief. And I remember this,
Speaker:like, super meta world I was in where
Speaker:it was, like, I was learning about it,
Speaker:showcasing it in the film, and also having
Speaker:it myself, experiencing anticipatory grief
Speaker:myself, which was just so challenging.
Speaker:You know? And, like, you were saying, like, she was take like, you were there
Speaker:when she took her last breath, so you probably had,
Speaker:understandably, had feelings leading up to
Speaker:that point. You know? It
Speaker:would yeah. It was just
Speaker:it was just one of those things where, like, I wasn't didn't know what I
Speaker:was walking into. Like, I knew she was dying. We got called to the hospital,
Speaker:but, like, I've never watched someone die.
Speaker:Yeah. It's a it's an interesting yeah.
Speaker:That's an interesting one. Watching someone
Speaker:it's it's almost in a way
Speaker:I don't wanna say beautiful, but there's some It's
Speaker:view there It is. There's some there's some beauty in
Speaker:being with them in their last moment
Speaker:on this earth, a moment in time that will never
Speaker:happen again, and you're part of it.
Speaker:It's a privilege in a way. I'm glad that the first
Speaker:person that I got to witness
Speaker:take their last breaths wasn't my mom or dad
Speaker:because I kind of felt more prepared for that,
Speaker:like, specific scenario. And Yeah. When
Speaker:our mom died, it was very peaceful,
:55AM, like, took her last breath.
:Her head rolled over. Her eyes opened, and a tear just dripped right out.
:And it was a really beautiful, sad moment, but it
:was beautiful. Like, she went very peacefully. And,
:you know, it's interesting because, like, all we had
:to compare it to was our aunts take our aunt taking her last breath.
:But I know not everyone has a peaceful ending. Like, there's people who
:die quite tragically. And Yeah. Like, I can't
:even imagine. I can't even imagine. I mean,
:like the best. I mean, if if I could choose my death,
:which I can with maid stuff, but it would be to go peacefully in my
:sleep. Mhmm. And I think that itself is a
:very beautiful thing that, like, it is something where the family could be
:there and, you know, you go on
:and yeah. Grief and, like, that's just,
:like, the beginning. That's just the beginning of, like, a whole shit
:storm that grief unleashes.
:Where where do you think the intersection is
:between resilience and grief? So
:that is so interesting to me. By the way, I should have said at the
:very beginning, like, I'm a filmmaker. I'm not
:some grief expert that has
:all the answers for everyone. However,
:I'm someone who does see the value in having these hard
:conversations. And as we talked about the other day, I think
:having long form conversations, exploring the nuances
:of grief is really where we could find healing
:and and and know that we are part of
:something, a bigger community of people together, and we're all more
:connected than we think we are.
:So getting back to your question,
:it's interesting because I've heard so many
:stories, and I've experienced, like, things myself
:where people will tell you,
:I know that this this situation is gonna
:make you stronger. And I'm like, stronger for
:what? The next time my mom dies or the next time like,
:people are like, stronger for the next time my
:wife leaves or the next time I'm you
:know? Like Yeah. It's so interesting because I don't
:know where it's coming from. And at, like
:and and at different times in my life, I'm like,
:why do I need be strong for what? Like, why do I need to be
:strong right now? You know? But then you realize,
:like, you you live through this. Like, you
:you serve survive is an interesting kind of word to use. But,
:like, you survive these things that you didn't think you were
:gonna be able to move forward through and with, and you realize
:that it gave you grit, and it
:feels good. And it's and it's interesting
:how you can now approach different things in your
:life in a much different way, than
:you normally would.
:Like, I, like, rare like, I don't know. Like, when I'm driving,
:like, I rarely like, I don't honk my horn at anyone when I'm driving,
:like, because I just, like, don't care enough unless it's like
:and, like, I'm someone who uses a horn in his
:vehicle when like, to alert a driver that they're about to
:do something very wrong. Or, like, don't hit me. Yeah.
:Yeah. Not to be like, hey, pal.
:Like and then get into some Yeah. You know? But I
:think stuff like that, it just, like, it, like, kinda reframes the way you
:view the world. I think that resilience,
:like, gets built through
:grief, and it allows you to approach different
:things in your life in a in a in a much different way than you
:probably would have done before. So
:true. And, like, I like to say that we all have a resilience muscle,
:and you can't see it, but we all have it. We're born with it.
:And like any muscle, there are things that you can do to make it stronger.
:And, you can be proactive. So when life gets hard, you have tools
:to move through that challenge faster. But it doesn't mean
:that when a challenge is thrown your way, you don't have it and you're not
:using it. And and so, you know and it's all like a
:spectrum because some people are born
:into a very hard, difficult life, and they have to make hard
:decisions and use their resilience muscle all the time. Some
:people walk through life and don't have to really
:think about it till they're later in life. And, like, what a privilege.
:Isn't that interesting, though? Like, I have a I have a friend where I'm
:just like, oh, man. They just can't catch a break. Like, it's
:just, like, one thing after another. And it's not even necessarily,
:like, always grief per se, but, like, now their
:car broke down, and now they can't get or now they,
:like, can't afford to fix
:something or just, like, all these, like, mini
:setbacks, like, one after another.
:And at the same time, it's like, how can
:you use those situations
:as setups for something bigger as you move forward?
:How can you reframe it perhaps?
:I don't know. Like I said, I don't have all the answers, but it does
:certainly make you think. Yeah. I mean, no one has all the
:answers, but that I think that's why these conversations, your
:documentary, your podcast are so important because
:someone might hear something and it inspires them to to take
:something from there that is the answer that they need. That's
:that's the one thing that I if if I could do anything
:with that movie, it was that I wanted someone to
:walk out of watching that film and saying, I didn't know that
:I could could view it that way, or I didn't I never
:thought of it that way. Now I can think of it that way or
:or just get validate. I tell people too, like I'm like when people
:ask me, like, oh, is is the movie sad? And I say that's such an
:interesting question because you're probably sad
:about your own grief, rightfully so. And
:so it might bring up Yeah. Some
:of your your own feelings, and it also
:might make you feel validated. Like, I want people to
:feel like it's all those things that you are feeling, they're
:perfectly normal. And chances are other people have
:felt very similar feelings as well. And so I just want people to know that,
:like, this is a per a very normal human
:experience, and it's okay.
:And it is okay. And it's okay to not feel okay. But
:you are going to walk through this life and experience griefs,
:many griefs and different versions of it and
:different, you know, every grief is so different.
:Yeah. And so you have this documentary of this podcast. What's
:next for you? Are you going to make more documentaries? Are
:you going to make a
:movie, like, a Yeah. I wanna with actors?
:Yeah. I mean, I want yeah. I mean, that was, like, my first, you know,
:my, like, act my my degree is in theater. So I
:do, like, musicals and, you know, a lot of theater
:stage and acting. And I haven't been doing film and TV
:acting as much. I want to get back into that space a lot more.
:And, yeah, there I mean, yes. To answer your
:question, like, there is another documentary that I want to do.
:I want to explore, like, different types of grief more. I want
:to explore, like, having harder conversations with people more. That's what the
:podcast is. The podcast is like a spin off from the film where I just
:sit with, like, authors, actors, like,
:comedians even, and just talk about
:their, you know, their the heart the the the
:lower times and, like, what they did and how they made meaning. You know, I
:wanna show people that, like, you can move forward through this.
:For me, like, grief has shown me a whole other world that I didn't
:know existed of, like, people and places and things. Like,
:people I did not know existed are now part of my life.
:And that is so beautiful.
:And so to remember that, like, to remember that, like,
:we only know what we know, but, like, we can, in some ways, get
:excited for what we don't know. You know?
:Like, excited for the new adventures, excited for the
:new people that may come into our lives, and that doesn't
:mean that it erases that grief. It doesn't mean that at
:all. It just means that, like, both can coexist, that you
:can have gratitude for new experiences and new people and also hold
:space for that for that grief. So,
:yes, I do I I I'm planning to do my dream
:is to do, like, a rom com, just like a
:silly, quirky, ninety minute rom com. So,
:yeah, I I I'm well, and I'm going to be in,
:The Wizard of Oz this, May.
:They just announced I'm playing the Cowardly Lion, so I'm
:very excited to be back on the stage doing doing that from one
:furry animal to another. I love it. What
:do you think the biggest difference between like, for you, what's the
:biggest difference between the heart of the beast and the heart of the
:lion? Oh, man. That's it.
:So the beast so the beast is, like,
:so so so tender and such a he has
:such a good heart. And he does, like
:I was telling who was I telling this to recently? I was telling Gina
:Mafa. Yeah. I was telling Gina Mafa this, that
:he knows what he has to do. Like, he knows he can't keep
:her there anymore. And I will get choked up every time
:I would have to do that scene because it was the grief of, like, letting
:her go. And he knows that that's, like, what's best for
:her. And he wants so bad to
:tell her that he loves her, but he knows that if he says that,
:she's gonna stay, and that wouldn't be right for her.
:And he just tells her to go. And it's, like,
:so that scene on stage was, like, so
:hard to play, because, like,
:you pull from, like, real life experiences too when for me at
:least, like, when you act. And, like, I think
:I've been able to incorporate, like, those griefy
:moments in my life into, like, characters like
:that. So he's you know, there are kinda
:similarities though now that you mentioned it because they both wanna put on
:this, like, tough exterior. But but but they're
:really actually, like, good hearted people,
:which kinda just speaks to, like, like, guy like,
:a lot of guys in grief. Like, we're we're, like, expected to, like, put on
:this, like, tough exterior. And I'm like I was telling Ryan Sickler the other day.
:I was like, hey. Like, it's so like, not telling him. I was
:telling him, like, how in general, like, it's okay for us
:as guys to cry. It's okay for us
:as guys to have feelings. Mhmm. You know? And so
:that's, like, part of what with the movie too, it's, like, part of what I
:wanna do is just, like, let other
:guys like me know that that's okay. Yes.
:Yes. And you know what I like to say? You shouldn't hold in your pee,
:and you shouldn't hold in your feelings. Yeah.
:That's true. All good for you. Yeah. Both of, yeah, both of those can can
:be very, very bad for you in the long run. I I think it's gonna
:be really interesting, like, as now that we are friends and I stalk you, how,
:you know, playing the Cowardly Lion's gonna unfold. And, like, I'm interested in, like,
:when the run of this is it called a run? When the show is done,
:really seeing the re like, learning more about the resemblance of
:those two characters because we know what Disney shows us or
:what, you know, what we know of them. But you playing both of them and
:embodying them, it's gonna be really interesting to see where that intersection is
:about, you know, their personalities and
:their their their their soul experiences. I was gonna say
:human experience, but that they're not human. But you are human.
:He the beast becomes human. Oh, yes. Right. I haven't seen that movie
:in a very long time. And, you know, he sings in the show in the
:show on stage, he the stage version, he sings
:this beautiful song, which everyone that knows me
:knows. It's my favorite song. It's it's called If I Can't Love
:Her. And there's one part that, like, he
:says, no passion could reach me.
:No lesson could teach me. And it was like
:it's so sad because he was so stubborn that, like,
:nothing could get through to him. And now she's got like,
:now it's ruined forever for him or at at least he thinks
:so at the time. Yeah. And so it's to me, like,
:that's about, like, having that humility and being able to
:be introspective while we still can.
:You know? Because
:you don't know what can happen. You don't know what's gonna come next. And
:so you don't wanna lose something that could potentially
:be beautiful and wonderful for you.
:Good life lesson right there. I don't
:know. I don't know what I'm saying. Okay. Let's you know what? We're wrapping up.
:So couple things. One, everyone, his links are in the show
:notes. Go check him out. Go follow him. Watch Meet Me Where I Am.
:Before I let you go Yeah. Share a piece
:of advice with our listeners from
:what you've learned mixed with your personal experience to
:someone who might be stepping into a very
:complex deep grief? You
:have to you have to I cannot stress this enough. You have to give
:yourself space to feel
:the feelings as they come up in those moments. I
:know it is not convenient. I
:know it can happen when we're at work or we're driving and we
:hear a song or something. It's so important
:to to set aside that time, to feel it when
:it comes up. And just like, you know, like, for me, like, I know I
:I would excuse myself and go to I'd
:go somewhere else in a corner, in a bathroom Mhmm. Cry for a
:minute, cry for five minutes, and kinda, like, reset. Like,
:it's really important to, like, take those breaks because it's
:so overwhelming, especially in the beginning. It's with you every second,
:every day. And and I know it sounds cliche, but, like, you really do have
:to take it moment by moment. Mhmm. Because the way you're
:feeling right now, you are not gonna feel like that an hour from now, two
:hours from now, a day from now. And one other
:thing to remember that kind of
:on that same note is, Cynthia
:O'Neil says this in the film. She says, I cannot promise you anything
:about grief, but one year from now, you're
:not gonna feel the same that you feel sitting in this chair right
:now. And that's I I think that's really true. It it it
:changes. It will change. You will change.
:That's beautiful. And I echo it. Like, I from
:personal experience, you know, like, after the
:miscarriage, Dave died and my mom died. The pain was so intense.
:Like, I was just like, I can't live like this.
:And I only had a few friends at the time who'd lost parents, and I
:called them. And the cons the common advice was time.
:You will start to not feel so much pain. You just
:need time. Yeah. I mean, it goes from it goes
:from, you know, you're thinking about it a thousand times a day to
:999 times. Yeah. Only a thousand.
:Progress. Only a thousand times. I love that. And
:you're just so amazing. And I am grateful to
:be in the grief sphere with you. And I love what you
:are doing, and I love the the tone that you bring to
:the conversations. So thank you. Oh, thank you. Thank you.
:I I don't I don't know what what I do or what I'm doing, but
:I I hope it's somewhat helpful. Yes. You do. You know what you're doing.
:And you know what? I never know where I am or what I'm doing. I
:build my plane while I fly it, and, like, maybe you are too. And that's
:okay. Well, and that's that's why it's important to, meet each
:other where we are. And on that note,
:thank you, and thank you to everyone who tuned in for another
:episode of Resilient AF with Blair and Alana, but no, Alana.
:Just Grant Gary, the one and only. You know, let us be that
:lighthouse in that storm for you. You are not alone.
:You do not have to go through the hard shit in life alone. Let
:us hold your hand. It's okay to not be okay.
:Just remember, you are resilient AF.
