It's Season 13, Episode 10, "Wayward Sisters." We are here not just to talk about this episode we both enjoyed, but also about its use as a backdoor pilot for a potential "Wayward Sisters" series that was ultimately not greenlit.

We discuss the fandom-driven origins and development of the "Wayward Daughters" concept, starting from social media campaigns to petition efforts. Then we go into the reasoning behind the show's cancellation: network decisions, scheduling constraints, and focus on other spin-offs like "Legacies."

Research Links

• Supernatural: Wayward Sisters | Supernatural Wiki | Fandom
• 'Supernatural' Boss Reveals What 'Wayward Sisters' Would Have Been (Exclusive)
• Wayward Daughters - Super-wiki
• How Supernatural's Spinoff Wayward Sisters Will Be Different - TV Guide
• Wayward Sisters TV Show Comes to CW in 2018 - New Supernatural Spinoff Series
• WAYWARD SISTERS Is Bringing Female Empowerment to the SUPERNATURAL Universe | Nerdist
• Wayward Sisters: One Year Later - Nerds and Beyond
• CW Boss Admits A Supernatural Spinoff May Never Work
• Why Supernatural Spinoff Wayward Sisters Isn't Happening
• Category:Wayward Sisters - Super-wiki
• Wayward Sisters: Why the Proposed Supernatural Spinoff is More Vital Than Ever - IGN
• Wayward Sisters TV Show Comes to CW in 2018 - New Supernatural Spinoff Series
• Supernatural spin-off Wayward Sisters: CW boss explains why network passed

On this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast, Mr. Werewolf gets a package.

And Dean Winchester makes lizard shish kebabs.

Yum.

Let's do this.

Welcome to this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast.

I'm Diana.

I'm Liz.

And we're Gonna Talk Season 13, episode 10, the Wayward Sisters.

Wayward sisters indeed.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Sorry, right now.

Of course the burp is gonna happen.

Of course it is.

That's how that works.

It's just like.

It's just like if I was in a restaurant and about to order or something that was eating food and you're a waiter coming up, asking me, like, how things were going.

That's just about.

About it was.

So what.

What have I been up to?

I have not been up too much.

I mean, just normalist things.

Hanging.

Hanging from things and.

And trying to finish the craft project from hell.

So Michael's is just evil.

So they.

I know a while ago I was very excited because Jonathan Adler came out with these.

They came out with these crafts for Michaels, and I was like, they're so pretty and they're so, like, so.

They're so grown up.

And I started doing this, like, diamond art project, which is a dotting thing where you take like these little.

Little tiny rhinestone type things and you put them onto, like, this paper in a pattern.

And I'm doing it and it's like all these cute bugs.

But the problem is, is I've done all the bugs and now it's just the same color over and over again thousands of times.

And my back hurts and my neck hurts, but I. I wanted.

I.

So the problem is, what happened was that Michaels also released some new crafts because.

Because of how Summerween.

Yeah.

And they released a whole bunch of really good diamond art kits and a whole bunch of really good paint by numbers that are all Halloween themed.

But I can't start them until I finish this tray.

And I don't think I've ever.

There's nothing left to watch.

Like, I've watched everything.

And so right now I think I just started a rewatch of Criminal Minds, so I just need something in the background so I can not really pay attention to it and just like through these stupid dots.

Oh, crafting is so stressful.

That's.

Isn't the point to be the opposite of that.

I know, but I.

There's part of me that just wants to say fuck it and put it aside and then work on other things.

But if.

I know if I.

If I put it Aside will never get finished.

So it powering through.

And I. I just keep trying to, like, change, like, the patterns that I'm dotting things, because it's mainly.

Also, it's a lot of straight lines, which is not satisfying.

So I'm, like, making it, like, my own little trails, like, along the bugs.

I'm like, oh, the bugs are walking this way.

So, like, dot the colors, like, going that.

That.

That's how insane I'm going with this, huh?

That's a lot.

Yes.

That's what I've been up to.

And what about you?

Just got back from vacation?

Yeah, babe and I went to Mexico, Los Cabos, and had a lovely, relaxing few days.

Ate pretty good food and went to.

Saw really pretty places and put my toes in the sand and a little bit in the water.

And we snorkeled and saw a sea turtle at a.

At a reef.

And that was cool.

And mostly just kind of laid around in red by the ocean and by the pool.

That sounds lovely.

Yes, I needed that.

It was good.

Dave was impressed with the amount of time that I just laid there.

So if I did that, we know it's like a good sign that I did that.

And also, I'm super like.

But also, like, it's like, how stressed out were you?

Like, how broken were you?

That is just, like, to the point where, like, I can't do anything but just lay here.

And I can try and read this book, but even that's really hard.

So I'm gonna half sleep, like.

Like have this book zone out and.

Read the same page four times.

That's basically what I did a lot.

But.

But, yeah, no, it was lovely, and I'm glad we got that getaway.

And now just getting back to real life, which is fine.

Our doggos missed us, and it's.

It's all good.

And we got a short week out of this, so I had two short weeks in a row, which, like, kind of sucks for, like, worky stuff, but also it's kind of badass because you're like, at least I don't have to go back in.

All in.

So I'll take it.

That is good.

Although I can't believe that it's Tuesday.

It's only Tuesday.

It feels like it's a Thursday already.

By the time people listen to us, it will be Thursday.

Is that weird?

I know.

That is a time things do.

But I didn't like last night, though.

I was in class and it.

So I was sitting.

I was up on a hoop, and they were like, oh, what did you learn in class on Sunday?

And I'm like, I don't know.

That was so long ago.

And I was like, that was yesterday.

I have no idea what I learned yesterday.

And eventually I remembered, but it took a while.

I was like, what did I do?

That seems like it was a week ago and it was just a day.

Yeah, I feel that today.

That helps.

Let's hear about this episode.

Okay.

So Wayward Sisters.

And my voice just cracked when I said that.

Is season 13, episode 10.

It was directed by Phil.

I don't attempt to say your last name anymore.

And written by Robert Barront and Andrew Dabb.

And we'll talk more about them at the end of episode.

We kind of recap everything.

So a spoiler alert.

So there shouldn't be a spoiler alert at this point for this episode.

I don't think I have to worry about that.

So, you know, this was a.

A back door pilot for a spin off that never happened.

So we're gonna watch the episode and then talk about why that may have been.

And so that kicks us off into our recap.

And do you want to say what's playing in the.

It's a. I am the Fire by Hailstorm is playing, which I thought was a.

Interesting choice.

Yeah, it is.

So that's playing while we get Jody and Claire and Alex and Patience and Donna.

And we have them all being badass.

And then we get Jody and Donna's friendship, which is adorable.

Then we get Jack showing the boys where Mary is.

We get Kya the dreamwalker in her bad place.

Then we get the shipyard that's in North Dakota for some reason.

The angels, Kaia and Jack.

And Jack is with Mary.

Kai is on the side of the road.

And Patience is on Jody's doorstep.

And she had a vision that something bad is coming.

Dun, dun, dun.

And that was our recap.

And so then we go to Iowa where rare a girl is tied up and very scared.

Yeah, it's very creepy.

And there's some dude sharpening a knife.

And we get a cutaway to a big.

Like a mock.

A male box truck.

M A I L box truck.

Like driving it.

So I feel like I should clarify.

It sounded weird and then.

It just sounded weird.

So I thought I should clarify.

I don't know.

I felt the urge.

I love a hominid on the show.

So.

So the mailbox truck.

So I mean, wasn't it.

Was it.

Actually I just put box truck.

Anyway, so it was like a delivery Truck.

So yeah, there's another dude there.

So there's creepy dude sharpen a knife.

And there's another dude who's like gonna go tell this little girl who's tied up a knock knock joke.

And then of course he wolfs out to scare the out of her, which is just rude.

Quite frankly, sir.

Nobody wants a knock knock joke.

We don't.

So, yeah, the truck pulls up and the driver knocks on the door and says they have a delivery.

And we get a sneak.

Sneak peek that this is Claire.

And she looks really good.

Yeah.

And she tells him his name is right on the box.

And then he leans in and then really close in the box, it says Mr. Werewolf.

Which is adorable.

I wish there had been a little.

I wish there's been a little drawing of Mr. Werewolf on there.

That would have been the piece of resistance.

There have been.

But still, Mr. Werewolf is pretty good.

And then it's also his response is you hunter.

Yeah.

Which I thought was.

Was just classic.

And then she shot him through the.

Box with a really good scene.

Yeah.

So good.

And so after she shoots the dude, she verifies that the little girl's name is Amanda and that her mom's looking for.

And then she gets attacked by the other guy and he's like, who do you think you are?

And she's fighting back.

He's like, I kill monsters.

That's what I think I am.

Anyways.

And then she.

After she kills other dudes, she stabs him.

She unties this little girl and she.

The little girl doesn't warn her.

Just gets real big eyes and looks past her because there's another werewolf little girl.

But Claire is smart enough to recognize a look of distress on.

On little girl's face and turns around and.

And she shoots this other werewolf who has come out of nowhere who is just hiding.

And so then we go to Claire and she's just sitting in her car watching the kid reunite with her mom when Jody calls.

And so we get that kind of like, oh, like mother daughter thing going on because Jody's calling me when that happens.

And Claire actually answers the phone, but Jody tells her that Sam and Dean were missing.

And it cuts to the giant footprints in the ground and Jody says it's 17.

They're missing.

They were on a hunting trip and I haven't heard from them for a few days.

And this line is a call back to Dean's well known line from the pilot with Dad's on the hunting trip and he hasn't been home in a few Days.

So it was.

Tells Claire to.

To come home.

Yeah.

So Claire does drive back to Sioux Falls and she's hesitant, but basically we cut inside and Alex is talking to Jody and says that neither Donna or Walt have heard anything.

So.

So obviously they're.

They're reaching their network to try to find Salmon Dean.

And then Claire walks in and she's still bloodied up from her fight with the werewolves, which I think it's a little weird that you wouldn't wipe the blood off of your face before you do a road check.

We had some hunter hygiene questions with Claire and it's kind of early hunter phase, things of just like, where do you clean up and when do you clean up after your hunt?

And like, can you get some wet.

Wipes in the car?

Like, yeah, you can.

You can do a little.

Little roadside bath, you know, with some wet wipes and.

Or just stop at a truck stop.

Yeah, Showers.

Just saying, change your shirt something.

But so it.

Jody hugs Claire after looking at her messed up face.

And Claire wants to know when they became huggers.

And then Patience comes out and Jody introduces her.

All right.

Claire's like hunter, and Patience like, psychic.

And then Claire's like, cool, you're wearing my sweatshirt.

And there's an awkward scene about who's using what room and what.

The guest room is now storage.

And we quickly pivot away from that because Jody needs to play the voicemail she got from Sam.

And it was three days ago and it was when they were looking for Kaya.

And he gives like, Jody the lowdown on it.

So they.

They have already figured out.

They know that Kaya broke out of her court ordered rehab and has a warrant out for her.

As this is happening, we get a cool cut through over to where Kaya was on the side of the road, which, by the way, she's been on the side of the road for a very long time now.

Right?

Like what, three days or something?

A couple days at least now.

And someone has seen this girl on the side of the road and called 91 1.

That's nice of them.

Is that the first car that's gone by?

Did people ignore this girl laying on the side of the road?

Oh, you know, she was kind of in the bushes, you know.

And so Alex has already checked rehab centers and local hospitals and she's going to go to work.

And that annoys Claire.

And Jody is upset because of Patience vision.

Yeah.

And so.

And Claire's just really like, Jody's insisting that, like, hey, by the way, Patience is the real Deal.

I know.

And Claire is kind of pissed.

She's like, whatever.

You're just trying to be overprotective and da, da, da, da.

And your idea of.

Of, you know, pumping the brakes is sitting by and making the perfect plan, and that's how you lose people is Claire stance.

So.

Yeah.

And so Jody is just really worried that Claire is going to die, and Claire storms out.

Yeah.

And so we hear something watching Kaya get loaded into the ambulance, and it's making weird gurgly noises in the bushes.

And I don't like that.

No.

Generally those are not good signs.

And.

But we go to the hospital where Alex is just doing a good job, and Claire is there, and she comments on Alex's scrubs, who tells Claire that she looks like biker Barbie, to which Claire says, thank you.

And, I mean, who doesn't want to look like Biker Barbie?

Right?

I'm like, oh, that's.

That's a compliment.

Right.

And I'm kind of mad that there never really has been.

Can someone please really make me a biker Barbie?

I'm just upset.

Like, there.

There isn't.

Like, think about it.

Have you ever seen biker, like, Barbie in a motorcycle jacket?

I don't think so.

I need a little, tiny motorcycle jacket for Barbie.

Okay.

All right.

Now, like, now I have something new to look for.

And so Alex knew about the vision thing, and she.

Then we get, like, there's, like, the sister relationship stuff that's going on here.

She's, like, digging into Claire.

Yeah.

They seem like a little bit.

Like, this is probably more of a glimpse of their sister relationship than we had previously had because we just kind of was like, oh, they aren't spending time together, but they obviously did.

And we're getting a little bit more of that, I think, here.

Yeah.

And so she says, you know, that she dismissed them to Claire by saying she is there for what?

Whatever Jody needs.

Like, if it's doing the dishes or the monsters, like, you know, I'm here.

Where the are you?

Yeah.

And Claire says she didn't want to stick around because Jody would worry too much.

And Alex just tells her that Jod didn't stop worrying.

Like, what the are you thinking about Claire?

It doesn't matter.

Wherever you're hunting from, she's still gonna be worried about you.

Correct.

Yeah.

So either way.

So Claire's like, fine, whatever.

Let's look for this.

Let's look for Sam, and let's look for this Kaya.

So they are going to go search the system, the hospital system, which is definitely A HIPAA breach.

Right?

Yeah.

Or at least this is.

It's definitely against policy.

Yeah.

And possibly illegal.

But they are searching the.

The system, the hospital system.

And Alex has already done the alias search.

They always do.

So now they're gonna go double check.

And there's a new Jane Doe that has just popped left up at their hospital.

Oh, that's convenient.

How convenient.

So they can finally go and just, like, look into that.

They finally.

This.

She's in a hospital room.

She's down the hall.

She just.

They just go and look in the window.

And they're like, that's that girl.

And they're like, why?

That girl's like, why are you looking at me?

Oh, yeah, right.

Kai's like, these are staring at me through the window.

Wtf?

So the second Kya gets a chance to run, she does, obviously.

And as soon as she gets outside of the hospital, there is the creepy gurgly monster waiting for her.

Well, she also meets Claire in the middle of that.

So K groups out her iv, and Claire comes in and tells her that she's a friend of Sam and Dean Winchester, which I don't think is a good thing to tell somebody who is on their run from them.

And that's gonna make them run outside into the gurgling monster?

Yeah.

So Claire is gonna fight this.

Try to fight this gurgling monster, but she gets thrown.

Luckily, who shows up but Jody?

And Claire is still fighting with that dinky knife.

Just that little short knife.

Like, it seems very short.

You have to be very close.

Close, you're right.

That's only for close combat.

And so Jody shoots at a bunch, and then Claire is able to jump up and stab it in the neck.

And that means you have to get really close to its neck.

And there's this weird, like, opaque blood,.

Like Flugo everywhere and squirts out.

And they're like, all right, so let's talk.

And so, like you do, Jody has brought the monster to her garage in.

The back of her sheriff's vehicle.

They've just loaded up the monster into her sheriff's.

Into her sheriff's truck.

Is it a Bronco?

What is it?

What is that?

I don't know.

It's an SUV of some kind.

Yeah, but yes, they.

They've loaded it up and they.

They have now made a.

A.

A. I wouldn't say they're doing an autopsy because it's not.

It's not a person.

So is it a necropsy?

What is it?

What do you call it when you do a A postmortem post mortem on a creature from another dimension.

Anyway, so this is happening.

Yeah.

And I. I appreciate Patience is totally grossed out and trying not to vom.

Which is fair because as they take off this creepy mask off of this critter.

So do you think that was like a respirator for it?

I don't know.

It was very.

I'll give it.

It's a little.

It was a little Star Trekky looking, right?

Well, it was because then underneath you.

We find the mandible thing underneath it.

So, I mean, I, like, had to keep them in or maybe.

Yeah, maybe like, they were so heavy.

They were like.

I have to keep it smushed against my face, against my face for some reason.

I don't know.

Or maybe it's like a retainer.

And like, they just.

They had, like, crooked mandibles and they were trying to straighten them out.

So it's like they're invisalign, but it's just for an alien.

We didn't know, like, we just thought it, like, we don't.

They.

We thought they must be using this to protect themselves and stay alive.

But no, they just wanted to straighten their mandibles.

So, anyways, outside, Claire talks to Kaya, who says, in the Bad Place, those things travel in packs.

Yeah.

And once they get your scent, they don't stop.

And she is not stupid enough to fight them.

She runs away.

But sometimes they catch her.

And that's why she has scars all over her body.

Yep.

And then Claire plays Let me strip and show you my sexy scars.

Here's a gold bite.

Here is a bar fight with a vampire.

And Kai is like, what about the split on your forehead?

Which is like, that's heroic battle with a doorknob.

I appreciate that one.

Yeah.

So Claire wants Kaya to.

To tell what really happened.

Though as this is happening, Alex is still, like, manipulating this monster and Patience is gagging.

So my note there says the monster has a vagina on its face, question mark.

Not with mandibles.

So Claire brings Kaya in and says, hey, by the way, Kaya is a dreamwalker, and when she sleeps, she goes to other worlds.

And I don't.

I feel like Alex is kind of playing with these mandible things at this point.

This thing is also, like a wishbone.

You know, she's like, trying to, like, crack it open to see, like, which side is gonna be.

So.

Yeah, so she's playing Lewishbone of the monster's face badge.

And then Kaya tells them about Sam and Dean.

What they were doing and why they wanted her to open a door to another world.

And then they did, but things went wrong.

And now they know that the door must still be open.

Oops.

And so if they find the door, they can find Sam and Dean.

And Kai is just like, whatever.

If they went through.

If they went to the Bad Place, they're dead.

She is not confident in their abilities.

She is not.

And we cut to a lizard.

And Dean is cooking a lizard over a fire in the Bad Place.

And Sam is very annoyed and says, don't tell me it tastes like chicken.

And Dean cracked me up because he's like, no, Sam, it's a lizard.

It tastes like lizard.

I don't know why I thought that was really funny.

It was really funny.

The line delivery was great.

It also really was chicken.

It was chicken attached to the lizard, like, on the bottom.

Like, so they.

They had chicken to eat.

Nice.

So Sam's like, all right, we need to go find the door.

Last time, it didn't stay open very long, but it stayed open.

And Dean's like, that was just a few hours.

We've been here for days.

But whatever, you know, no one even knows where we are to look for us.

So we might as well enjoy our lizard, man.

Eat your lizard and shut up.

Sam is basically what he said, but.

But then we hear big stompy sounds and roar sounds getting closer.

So they do decide that they should go on the move.

But Dean does not leave his lizard snack behind.

No.

And apparently that was Jensen's improv idea.

I appreciate it.

It was good.

And so we see also, though, some new critter that's not the creepy gurgle monster and not whatever's making the big stompy stomp sounds.

And it's somebody that's dressed in a black hooded robe.

And you can't see their face.

And they have a spear and then.

A spear watching them.

Them.

Yeah.

And then we go from the Bad Place to Jody's, and patience is out.

She's just like, nope, nope.

I am done.

Like, mandible face badge thing.

That's just enough.

And so she's packing.

She's like, maybe my dad can take me back if I go back now.

But Alex is being like.

She's.

Alex is just being so wise.

You, like, kind of Moses episode.

She's kind of playing the adult in a lot of.

I think, a lot of situations.

And she's used to asking her if that's what she really wants do to.

You can go home and pretend it's fine.

And Patience is like, jody's in the backyard burying a monster, and Alex is just like, well, you've got to bury him somewhere.

Yeah.

And she's like, look, you.

You.

She's like, but Patience is like, look, I came to tell you about the vision.

I did that Claire blew it off, and I'm not a fighter.

And Alex is like, yeah, but neither am I.

We just help in other ways.

So Patience is like, still like, okay, bye.

And she's loading up in her Jeep, her bag.

And then she gets a.

Another vision of one of the creepy gurgle monsters breaking into the house.

So she's like, oh.

So she runs inside and is like, hey, y', all, we.

You know, we need to go.

We need to run.

There are lots of them coming now.

You in danger.

We're in danger.

So the.

The monsters break in.

Yeah.

She's.

They're like, well, they're saying that there's just going to be too many, and, you know, I'm trying to do the right thing, and y' all brush me off.

You think I'm f. That's fine, but whatever.

So we get this video.

Well, we see all these monsters breaking in, and all I can think is that they're breaking all the windows.

Windows are really expensive, y'.

All.

Did you know?

Have you gotten a quote on replacing windows?

It is insane.

And I'm pretty sure this is not the first time in the show that a Jody Mills house's windows have gotten broken, and they just destroy the house.

And what the girls are doing, though, is they're watching from Claire's phone because they've got cameras set up, and they have managed to escape.

Yes.

Goodness.

So Patience and Claire are right.

So they've split up into two cars.

They're driving, and they park by a lake.

It's got.

Jody and Alex are one car.

Patience and Kaya and Claire in the other in the.

In the Jeep.

And they're like, what are we here for?

And Jody's like, I called back up.

Patience is like, the National Guard.

No, not the National Guard.

We got Donna.

Yes.

Because a truck with a D train, Minnesota license plate, rolls in, and out comes Donna with the.

Hi, ladies.

And she has just brought the basics.

And this.

I'm like, what do we.

You can't have a team trunk.

It's like a team truck gate.

I'm not sure, like, what that would.

Be, but I don't know.

But she's got her own version of trunk, and she pulls out a box.

It's got guns, salt, knives, and ax.

And she just has all that because she's from Minnesota.

Yeah, that's why.

So.

All right.

So Jody's like, okay, Kyle, where were you?

With Sam and Dean.

And she's like, I don't know.

But she describes the place, and they figure out they can piece together from the geography that it's off of Route 14, where they were run off the road.

So they have narrowed this down.

So Jody and Donna are going to go check it out.

So Jody pulls Claire aside because we all know Claire gets real butt hurt when she gets left out and does dumb stuff.

So they.

Jody explains that Claire needs to stay behind and keep the other girls safe.

Basically, she's going to protect Kaya, Patience and Alex.

And Claire agrees, which is very Susan to me.

But yeah, she does.

And Donna asks who knows how to use a flamethrower?

Important questions.

And now I wish I did.

Yes.

So we go from there to back to the Bad place.

And Sam has deduced that they are in a different universe.

And then the hooded figure finds them and beats them with her stick.

Yes, stick.

And knocks them out.

And knocks it out.

Yeah.

So Jody and Donna are able to find Baby parked at the shipyard.

And they go out to the boat.

We do get a good shot of the melted angel blades again.

And the angel burn.

I'm sure they were like, well, yeah, we're.

We're using this effect more.

We.

We know we're showing this again.

Look at this.

Remember?

This is cool.

And also the wings on the walls, which is like.

Like this.

The way that they're.

They're scattered on there and then they overlap is just really well done.

I like that a lot.

Agreed.

And they.

But they are able to find the door Rift, Gold line, portal, whatever.

Whatever we want to call it the rift.

The rift.

So it's still there.

So that's good.

Good news.

Yeah, sure.

So as that's happening back where the girls are all hanging out by the water, Kai is like, I know you're scared, Claire.

You.

You know, you always want to go out.

And you know.

And Claire's like, yeah, I. I always want to go out doing something great.

And I knew I would die hunting.

But Patience vision kind of shook me.

Knowing that you're gonna die is a little bit different than just thinking that's how you're gonna go out.

But Salmon Dean saved her life, and she just.

It's really just hard to sit the whole thing out.

And Kai's like, well, maybe we can help save them.

Okay, Kaya.

Okay.

Now, like, you're kind of in it.

So we go back to the shipyard where Jody wants to go into the rift.

And.

Because.

And it's just kind of like.

It's.

So she wants to go in because if she doesn't go in, Claire will, and she can't lose another child.

Oh, it's heartbreaking.

It's so heartbreaking.

And then, unfortunately, D train hears noise, and one of the.

I wish we had a name for them.

One of these monsters is there.

I just call them gurgle monsters.

Gurgle monsters may be fine.

So they find a gurgle monster, and then there's a second one.

And they start attacking and they start shooting.

And there's a bunch.

It's not just one or two.

They're slowly realizing there's more and more of these.

More and more.

How many have come through this rift?

Quite a few.

And can you imagine coming through from the bad place to find this shipyard in South Dakota, Right.

That you come through on this abandoned ship.

You're like, this is where people live.

Like, how.

They don't even know what people are like.

So, like, this is just the.

What, you're inside of a big forest.

You're on a ship.

God, that would have to be Poor guys.

So there's some confused.

Not poor guys.

They're the monsters.

They're trying to kill everybody.

Very, very nice.

It's not like they're trying to be.

Like, hey, we're from another world.

Therapy today.

Turning monsters into good monsters.

So maybe that's it.

So anyways, so they start shooting the gurgle monsters, and then we go back to the bad place.

Yeah.

Sam and Dean are waking up tied to trees, and our hooded figure hits the giant.

So at the end of the last episode, we saw a giant skull on the ground, which I said looked kind of like a cartoon dinosaur skull, in my opinion.

Yeah.

And she.

The.

They.

The.

The cloaked figure hits it with their Speared.

Like a dinner bell.

And we start and.

And runs off.

And we start, and it makes a lovely sound.

I mean, I'm kind of like, gongs.

Like, who knew?

Like, if you.

I would like to go to the Natural History Museum and, like, hit a giant.

Excuse me.

Can I hit one of your giant skeletons with a spear?

With.

Which is sick.

I just want to know what sound it makes, you know, like.

So it doesn't have to necessarily, I guess, to really replicate it.

We Might well have to be like, did she hit it with a metal or with the wood?

So I think we need to try both.

So can I have more than one skeleton head to just smash?

I think this is how you get banned from the museum, maybe.

Is that your worst nightmare?

That is pretty terrifying, getting banned from museum.

Okay, so Dean says, you know, so they rang the dinner bell.

We go back to the lakeside where Claire is going.

Something's wrong because Jody's not picking up.

Then we go cut to the shipyard where Jody and Donna have taken cover in a car.

It's an old.

Could be a pretty cool car actually.

And all the monsters are kind of.

Passing them at first, which is good.

That means their hiding is working.

But then it's not so much.

They jump.

The monsters start jumping on top of the car.

And then we have fire.

Lots and lots of fire.

So much fire.

Because here comes Claire with her flamethrower.

Because Claire knows how to use a flamethrower apparently.

And they're all there and she says, I called and you didn't answer and we worried.

So they are going to.

They see clear though, looks around and sees the glowing doorway, which is where the rift is.

And so Claire has figured this out somehow and runs towards it and is not apt to wait as Jody asks her to.

So but they get into.

To the.

To the rift and oh hell, it's getting smaller, which means it is closing.

And that is bad.

That is really bad.

And so Claire says she has to save Sam and Dean and Jody is just, no, she knows.

And then we go to Donna loading a shotgun while asking patience as she has ever shot a gun before and she hasn't.

And Donna is just the best and she's just like, okie dokie, here you go.

Squeeze, don't pull.

And here's your.

Here's your shotgun, missy.

I mean, that is the right weapon choice for her probably as soon as she hasn't shot.

Probably.

But I mean, maybe a couple more instructions than that.

But I think, you know, it's.

It's fine.

It was just in the moment.

Yeah.

So they find the missing monster, but he has many friends.

Many friends.

There's more and more.

So the.

Donna's sending them all to go, kind of take cover, and yells for Jody to come help.

And as this is going, Jody tells Claire to go through.

And Claire grabs Kaia's hand, says, I'll protect you.

And Claire and Kaya go through the.

Rift yeah, that happens.

While Jody stays behind to help Donna, along with Patience and Alex.

And they are making.

They are shooting monsters and barricading the stairs and running for cover.

Yeah, they block the way up to the ship.

Like, with.

Like with a fridge.

Is that.

I don't know what that was.

I threw something down.

Something big.

Good for them.

And so we go to the bad place where Claire has freed Sam and Dean.

Sam asked out after Jack, and Kaya says he's probably in the other bad place with her mom.

Like, oh, right.

Okay.

So that's great.

And it's time to go.

We gots to go.

Yeah.

And as this is.

As this is all happening, we still have the fighting happening back on the ship.

But Claire and Kaya get Sam and Dean to the doorway.

But our hooded figure has reappeared.

And Kaya sees them just in time to push Claire out of the way and take the hit herself.

No.

And Sam and dinner pulled her angel blades.

But basically, Claire watches Kaya die.

And we hear a big footfall.

Big old stompy sound.

Big old stompy sound.

And something ginormous with red eyes is standing over him.

It's like.

It looks kind of like a giant troll.

I don't know.

What would you describe it as?

It just.

I just have giant monster.

And this is in the Bad place.

There is a giant monster.

And so Claire almost goes back and they stop her.

And so then they all three of them jump through the rift.

Yeah.

But they leave Ka's bodies behind.

Body, singular.

I don't know why I said it that way.

The body's left behind.

So we have Patience manages to kill a monster.

It's her first, so she's.

That's pretty exciting.

She's popped her cherry.

And then Sam and Dean and Claire pop back through the.

The door way.

And we see Kai is still dead on the ground bleeding in the bad place.

So we have a lot of hugs have to happen now.

And as this happens, Jody is hugging Claire and Patience's vision changes.

I think that's what happened.

At least that's what I understood.

Well, no, it's not really that it changes.

It's that I think that is what she saw was.

This is the way I saw it, was that she's.

What she thought was Jody holding Claire's body.

Was Jody holding Claire because she saw like the same.

The same, this.

The same scene.

But you can have the two different perspectives of it of like, so, like she was holding.

Just holding her and crying.

And maybe.

Maybe it did change.

But I interpreted as she just read it wrong and that it was.

Wasn't her, but she was dead.

It was just that she was really sad because she couldn't to save Kaya.

Okay.

I think either.

Either interpretation.

Either.

Either interpretation I think is valid.

Yeah.

So we all go back to Jody's house, except Kai, because she did in the Bad Place.

And Sam and Dean are leaving.

And while that's happening, Patience and Alex are cleaning up a lot of broken windows.

I feel kind of bad for them.

This is messy and nobody likes cleaning up broken glass.

It's so stressful.

But.

So.

But Sam and Dean and Jody are discussing how.

How shut down Claire is.

Apparently Claire is extremely distraught about Kaya's losing Kaya and that they say that she's just gonna need some time and they want Jody to thank Claire for them.

But they're also really all really worried about what else might have come through the doorway, which I think is a valid concern with the number of the gurgle monsters and then knowing that there's some giant thing over there.

Yeah.

And it just seems like we're not really sure of what came through.

So maybe we should.

I don't know what that sets up.

So.

But Jody says, you know what, guys?

Like, we're going to cover Sioux Falls.

Like, I got this.

Like, you go take care of the rest of the world like you're doing.

And they're like, okay, cool, peace off.

And they.

They drive off.

So they just leave.

So Jody goes to visit Claire, who's crying, and Claire is like, look, you were right.

I didn't think I raced in without a plan.

I said I'd protect Kaya.

And now I get why you are the way you are.

Oh.

And Jody's just like, you just don't have to do it alone.

We're all here for you whenever you're ready.

So that was sweet.

But Patience and Alex are still cleaning up glass because it's a lot of glass.

This is going to take a while.

And so glad they don't have any pets.

Can you imagine trying to keep dogs or cats out of this?

Like, oh my God, stay out again.

So.

But why?

While they're doing this, Patience is just like, I killed a monster.

And Alex finds it very amusing and welcomes her to the family.

Yeah.

And then upstairs, Claire takes out her journal, which is just a spiral notebook, and writes that she came back to Sioux Falls to save Sam and Dean Winchester, but it was we that saved them.

And we see her we.

It sounds like her narration of her writing in her journal.

But we see her join the rest of the girls at dinner.

Ladies, women, I don't know, whatever you want to call them.

And she basically says, you know, she calls them her family and her army.

And she didn't know, but just how much she needed them.

But the thing that killed Ka is still out there.

I don't care.

I have to tear another hole in the universe.

I will find it.

And as this is happening, we see another rift thing open, and our hooded figure comes through it.

And then we hear Claire say, and I'm going to kill it.

And then we.

Our hooded figure pushes the hood back.

Who is it?

And it's got Kaya's face.

And that's our episode.

And that is the end of the episode.

Yeah, so that's how this ended.

Good, good.

Little shocker twist at the end.

There it is.

Yeah.

So do you have any cast you to talk about?

Casting couch.

It's the casting couch.

Were they on that show that time with that guy?

Yeah, I've got a couple.

Obviously, we knew the majority of our cast, and then a bunch of them are monsters.

So the few that we can identify.

So Amanda was a little girl at the beginning.

Her name was played her Amanda Fitz Martin was played by Eden Summer Gilmore.

She's been in episodes of Riverdale, the Good Doctor, and Nancy Drew.

She's also Sophia on Family Law, which she's been on, like, almost 30 episodes of.

One of our werewolf jerks was named Ed, who played by Matt Alfonso.

He's been in the Flash Magicians, the Eye, Zombie Yellow Jackets, Schmigadoon, and Virgin River.

The other werewolf was played by Shane Ladonn, and he's been in episodes of Izombie, Tracker and Fire Country.

Our nurse that was training Alex was played by Zaneda Telfair, and she's been funny enough.

She played a nurse in flash, and then Mrs. Fitzmartin was Amanda's mom.

We just saw for a second, but that was Maria Meadows.

She's been almost human.

Lucifer, iZombie Siren, brand new cherry flavor, Riverdale, and the Good Doctor.

Oh, nice.

Yeah.

Cool.

So this episode, instead of doing Lore, I thought, you know, we would just talk a little bit about the backdoor pilot that could have been the series that could have been and why it didn't happen.

So Wayward Sisters is something that came from Phantom.

The term wayward comes from the Kansas song Carry On Wayward Son, which is played during the recap of every season.

Duh.

And so Kim Rhodes and Brianna Buckmaster became fans of the project and that is Jody and Donna if you did not know.

And according to Supernatural Wiki, Riley Kressner said, I knew we had the numbers and so I put out a call to action through the fandom and Betty and I created the social media accounts and a petition so that we could funnel everyone's enthusiasm through a central outlet.

We called it Wayward Daughters Academy.

And that day Kim and Brianna both followed us and we discussed with them that we appreciated their support, wouldn't do anything without their consent and they were both on board and the rest is history.

16 On the creation Stands campaign site Kim was coded as saying wayward Daughters is a collaboration and we elected to support Random Acts.

I have personal reasons for this as well.

I have been wayward much of my life.

Often it was by choice, opting to belligerently pursue the road less traveled because it led someplace I couldn't go.

Other times it was by failure.

And I wind up sitting alone among the metaphorical thorn bushes, weeping and hoping for guidance or at least an end to the self inflicted pain.

I was judged.

I was scolded.

I was silenced.

I was mocked.

I was ignored.

But there was only one thing that ever brought me home.

An act of kindness.

It cost me nothing to be kind.

It gives me everything.

And practicing kindness is include now includes how I treat myself.

I still identify as wayward.

But we all do, don't we?

A little.

Isn't that cute?

Then Brianna said the movement behind Wayward Daughters is inspired by the idea that we are all capable of finding our greater selves.

Every setback, every time we fall, it gives us new opportunity to rise up.

But doing it alone can be tricky.

And that's why we need to band together to support each other, to be there to lend a hand when one of us is feeling too weak.

My dream for Wayward Daughters is that it becomes a symbol to silently say, go be you.

I've got your back.

Then fandoms got all excited.

The spin off was to be executive produced by Andrew Dab, Robert Singer, Phil I won't say your last name and Robert Barrons.

So if this is another quote, if weren't sisters had happened for me the most important thing, in some ways it was a little bit back to basics for Supernatural because you had this group of people, they weren't necessarily be dealing with angels and demons and certainly not right away.

Andrew Dab said to teach TV Insider.

So and then he said that was, you know, kind of Sam and Dean's Ballywick.

And he also said that they wanted to cross pollinate the two shows.

And so sometimes that would be with higher profile characters like Sam and Dean and Castiel, but sometimes that would be with other characters.

The other hunter, Chrissy, Safecracker, Alice or the brother and sister, which is Max and Alicia Baines and which was something I think about like oh man, we lost some more like possibilities of those characters.

No, no spoiler.

We don't see those come back.

So it would have been nice to have another show where we could have seen those characters getting played through because that would have been interesting.

It also would have been focused around Sioux Falls with Jody's house as a base as opposed to the roaming of the Supernatural Roadshow type thing.

So it makes for a different environment for sure.

Yeah.

Elle magazine quoted writer and co executive producer Robert Barrons is saying, once we were told the story of Jody sort of adopting Alex, the first wayward daughter, that was sort of planting a flag like, wait, there's a story here that's bigger than Supernatural.

Or I should say there's a story that's going to continue outside the frame of our own series.

It was a real combination of something that we built very consciously over several years and also something that developed very organically.

Barron's also conceded that the spinoff was partly in response to the criticism about the lifespan of women on Supernatural.

Wayward is an answer to that criticism.

And I think it did grow from a sense that there are these women we would love to see protected and nurtured in their own environment, baron said.

I think fans saw Wayward as an opportunity.

I think they were also pleased with the way these characters have been treated and developed over time.

So there really was, you know, this sense of the conversation that we don't hear it as much now after like the show has been over, but there really was a talk about why.

Why you, why you kill all your women Supernatural, you know, like there's, you know, to have something where you really was focused on on women.

And after 12 years of super testosterone, guys, we're excited about watching what the women can do.

Brianna also explained to Extra TV that the show was going to be like Supernatural from a female point of view and it's going to give the fandom, which is in large part female based, an opportunity to feel like they are telling the story and an opportunity to relate to these characters.

Yeah.

Like we said, it was watched by 1.87 million viewers, which was higher than the previous episode's 1.74 million.

And everyone was excited.

Everyone thought it was great.

Then May came and the executives of the CW said, we hear you, but no.

One of the reasons, given that there was only room for so many spin offs on the CW schedule and they wanted to place their bet on Legacies, the spin off from the originals, which was a spin off from the Vampire Diaries.

No.

CW president Mark Petowitz defended his decision.

We had really great material this year.

We're really excited about the five series we did pick up.

We are a big fan of the characters, the women who played the characters in the series, but we did not feel creatively the show is where we wanted it to be.

We felt we had a better shot with Legacies.

Legacies, really?

How well did that turn out for you?

So Patti was added that CW execs are big fans of the Wayward actresses and hope they continue on guest starring on Supernatural.

Speaking at the Television Critics association summer press tour in Beverly Hills, as reported by bw, Petowitz also said, we were very happy with the women who were in the Wayward Scissors spin off.

We had a certain number of slots this year.

It just did not get there.

Supernatural may be Jensen and Jared and there may not be a franchise beyond that.

That so really at that point saying like they didn't even know they could do a a Supernatural spin off without Sam and Dean being in it, which they they tried with.

You know, what happened with the Winchester so right.

The fan so did not take no easily.

Sadly, it did not work and the Wayward Sisters spin off sailed off into the empty and it shall never be made it's not gonna be paid.

So.

And that's just a huge bummer.

And that's a cool opportunity.

I think it was a cool opportunity.

And you know, I think they're right in that.

I mean I don't always be like it's like breaking the glass ceiling.

But it really is, you know, unusual to have a show with that many women leading it.

Especially having.

And Kim talked about this in other, these other points, you know, that she, and necessarily she was talking about herself but you know, being middle.

Middle.

She's a middle aged woman.

Yeah.

You know, and that's not typically, you know, there obviously there is a lot of the younger cast in there as well.

But having your main protagonist be middle aged women is not something and having them be badass like people who are running around being action figures, it's not something that is was usual for that time or for now.

That's really scary.

How long ago that, yeah, it's crazy.

Yeah, no that's, it's definitely something that's not usually done.

I think my, I don't want to be snarky but I couldn't make it through the originals so I never got to the Lego legacies.

But anyways, I've tried so many.

I know I watched part, I watched, I think I watched a season like a season or two of Legacy.

So, you know, and I can get behind a high school show.

And that was what it was supposed to be.

It's supposed to be Academy like so it's academy based.

They, the bit, you know, they turned the Salvator house, which is into a school and I'm like that house was not that big.

It was made for the Salvatore brothers and, and their uncle.

Like it wasn't made to hold like a whole bunch of werewolves, wolves.

But yeah, I can talk to.

Yeah, I never made, I never, I tried to finish the original so many times that I couldn't make it through and yeah.

And I think that just nobody really probably from this, from that time probably saw like don't get me wrong, Vampire Diaries and their spin offs are very popular but usually they're guests at other people's cons.

I don't know if they have and I know they have a con, but I don't think it's quite the level of the supernatural con.

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

I, I, I've never gone to them so I don't know the level of their Fandom.

They could be crazy vampire.

I mean, they're stunned by creation.

Creation puts them on true.

So.

And you know, and the boys are still selling their whiskey, so they're still getting some fame off of that.

Yeah.

Ian's gotten.

It's impressed recently about how he's kind of like, stepped away from Hollywood in general to go be a farmer.

I'm just picturing.

Oh, I'm just picturing him and his, you know, overalls without a shirt on.

Oh, well, he has a very beat up straw hat in the photo I saw.

And I didn't, I didn't love the hat.

I was kind of like, don't do that, man.

Not that he shouldn't wear a hat.

I didn't like that particular hat.

Yeah.

But either way, that's disappointing that that was the pivot of it.

That was the choice that I went like, that was a reasoning behind it is that which, And I don't.

I mean, to me is like one.

I feel like the ignorant they were.

The, the execs were too scared to take a chance on this, obviously.

Yeah.

And it's just really annoying that you have this giant fan base and which we feel like is like.

And I know it's not millions of influencers.

Right.

And like, you know, like a petition with 80, maybe 80,000 signatures isn't a lot, but it's still a lot to get people to sign up, you know?

Do you think that now if this happened today, that there'd be more apt for a streaming service to pick it up?

Well, they were trying really hard to get Netflix to like, that was part of the petition too, was to get Netflix to, To pick it up.

And so I don't know.

I think it's probably, probably about the same.

I mean, this is certainly something that Hulu could have picked up.

I, I think there would be more.

I think there would be more acceptance of this now.

I think, I think something like Hulu would pick this up.

And I think.

I think it's something that they wouldn't be as afraid to try.

Yeah, that's.

That would be my thought.

I think if this were.

And I just, I think we've progressed that at least that far.

I think that, like, I think it would still be hard to sell, but I think it would be easier to accept.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, I think so.

I'm just saying, you know, like, the, the board.

The boardrooms of television executives haven't changed that much.

Besides the fact that I just like the.

I just like there's a Lot more straight to streaming programming now than it was 10 years ago.

And that's what I would say.

Like, oh, the opportunity for content.

And.

And.

And it would be bigger probably today.

But, yeah, it doesn't matter.

That's all hypothetical anyways.

In a different world, different universe.

I also thought that this really.

It really did originate from fandom, and I know, like, oversimplifying the.

The complex development of the story process and how all these things wove together, but, you know, really, like, having, like, oh, like, fans be like, oh, this is like.

I like this idea.

Wayward of Daughter's Academy and then it Becoming.

Becoming what it did.

Yeah.

That's really cool.

I'm not sure if I. I don't know if Wayward.

If sisters would have been the words I would have gone with either.

I mean, I don't.

They're like.

I kind of like it.

You like that over Daughters?

I kind of do because there's the.

I mean, the three.

But the song is Wayward Son, right?

It's not Wayward Brother.

It's not.

I don't know.

So.

I don't know.

Yeah, I.

It's a bummer.

I. I don't know what to say.

Beyond that, but it was a fun episode.

It was a fun episode.

And I wish.

Yeah, I.

It.

It's just kind of awesome looking back on it now when, you know, having the rug.

There was a rug pull out from under you.

Momo, that's crazy how much.

There was that much press interviews around.

Oh, yeah, we're doing it.

We're announcing a comiccon.

We're like.

Like, we're going forward.

And then just like, nope, not gonna do it.

And you girls go cry in the corner.

No, nothing for you girls.

Girls don't watch or buy things.

Like I said.

I don't.

I don't.

I. I don't want to break it all down to.

It just be like, boohoo, girls, go home.

But I do kind of feel.

I feel like that's a big part.

I think it was a big part of why they were scared.

Scared.

But that's just that.

I mean, that could be me projecting my own things on it, but I. I mean, base.

But I really.

I do think that is.

And, well, I just don't know why vampires seem safe.

I mean, they were, like, in their.

Well, they had already done a spin off.

That's probably why they'd already done one, and they felt safer to do a second one from that same.

Well, we can keep.

How good was originals doing at that Time.

That's a whole other thing.

That good.

Because it was.

Wasn't that good.

I think Clouse is so hot and I love, you know, they're both hot.

But their storyline sucked.

It was not a great storyline.

I couldn't get into it.

I tried so hard.

I tried so hard.

I don't know.

Someone was into it enough.

Enough that they were able to take the.

And I don't know.

I don't really feel like it was a competition to take the show away.

I mean, it's just.

And then interesting to see, you know, how like, well, what then what end up.

What happened to the scene cw, you know, so, yeah, I guess in the end we hit the last laugh.

I don't know.

We still get no Wayward Sisters.

All right, so on that bummer of I don't know, is it the episode.

It was a super fun episode.

I'm super excited to see what's gonna happen.

Sam and Dean are back in the regular world.

Whatever we're calling it, Jack, we know is somewhere off in the.

In the apocalypse world with Mary, but we don't really know much about that.

All we know is that that some chick that looks like Kaya and wears a cloak and tried to kill them and did kill herself.

I don't know, is now in the world.

Something else that happened during.

With this.

So during.

I don't feel like this is a spoiler.

So during the.

After the show aired, Bear, I think it was Barons.

Barons or singer.

One of them tweeted a little sign that said Kaya lives with exclamation marks on it.

It.

So that was given to the fans as well.

Just so you have that in there.

So Kaya's bleeding out on the ground, but the fans got at this time got a note from someone saying Kaya lives.

And this was also important because they were still at this point thinking that the sister the show and the show was going forward and that Kai was going to be a part of it.

Right.

Interesting.

Yep.

So Kyle lives maybe.

And well, yeah, we'll go from there.

All right.

All right, all right.

Cheers.

Jerk.

Cheers.

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Going up to the spirit in the sky?

That's where I'm gonna go when I die?

When I die and they lay me?

I'm gonna go to the place that.

Sam.