In this compelling episode of 5 Plain Questions, host Joe Williams engages in a thought-provoking dialogue with Dallas Goldtooth, a prominent Indigenous activist, actor, and comedian. Their conversation is framed by the pressing concerns surrounding the current political climate and its potential ramifications for Indigenous communities across the United States. Goldtooth articulates a clear and urgent call for awareness and action in response to policies enacted by the Trump administration, which he perceives as a significant threat to tribal sovereignty and environmental rights. The discourse is grounded in a historical context, drawing parallels to past governmental actions that have adversely affected Indigenous rights and resources, thereby establishing a continuity of struggle that resonates deeply with listeners.

As the discussion unfolds, Goldtooth emphasizes the importance of community engagement and grassroots activism as vital components of resistance against oppressive policies. He advocates for a collaborative approach between tribal governments and community members, underscoring the necessity of fostering strong networks of support and advocacy. The episode also highlights the significance of narrative control, with Goldtooth urging Indigenous peoples to reclaim their stories and perspectives in a landscape often dominated by external narratives that seek to diminish their voices. This aspect of the conversation is particularly poignant, as it speaks to the broader theme of cultural preservation and the need for Indigenous communities to assert their identities and rights in the face of external pressures.

Ultimately, this episode serves as both a sobering reflection on the challenges confronting Indigenous peoples and an empowering call to action. Williams and Goldtooth inspire listeners to actively participate in the advocacy for their rights, urging them to engage with their local leaders and the political process. The conversation reinforces the notion that informed and proactive community engagement is essential for safeguarding Indigenous sovereignty, cultural heritage, and environmental resources. As such, this episode encapsulates a vital message of resilience, solidarity, and the ongoing struggle for self-determination, encouraging listeners to reflect on their roles within this movement and to strive for a future that honors and respects Indigenous rights.

Hello and welcome again to another episode of Five Plane Questions, a podcast that proposes five questions to indigenous artists, creators, musicians, writers, movers and shakers and culture bears, people in the community that are doing great things for their communities.

I'm Joe Williams, your host for this conversation.

My goal is to showcase these amazing people in our indigenous communities from around the country.

We're going to do something a little different this episode.

Normally, while we sit down and we'll chat with creatives about their careers and the things that they're doing, we're going to be doing something a little different this season with a few of these episodes.

With the election of Donald Trump, his policies and his executive orders have become a real threat to Indian country.

And probably by my estimate, and the estimate of a lot of people, the greatest threat to Indian country since Andrew Jackson.

And so the spring, while I was worrying and fretting, like many of us in our community, I decided that I was gonna reach out to a number of professionals and the people in the know and to sit down with them and really talk with them about three things.

Number one, get an idea of what's.

Actually happening, get an assessment, their perspective of what's going on.

Number two, how can we as community members and as a community either push back or to manage what's happening?

And number three, and I think this is probably the most important thing, is to be grounded in what's going on and try not to panic or stress.

I think as long as we are grounded and level headed, we're going to be okay.

So with all the folks I've been talking to and the episodes that are going to be coming out this year, I wanted to start off kind of on a lighter note.

And so I've recently sat down with Dallas Goldtooth, actor, comedian, and sure, he's all of those things, but before he was any of those, he was a community activist.

He was fighting for environmental rights and for sovereignty of Indian people.

We marched in D.C.

together and he was absolutely, absolutely amazing, an incredible leader.

And so I sat down with him to get a perspective and to get his take on what's going on.

Very serious stuff.

But it's also Dallas Goldtooth.

So it starts off a little funny and we get into some really great things.

So please share your time now with me as I sit down with Dallas Goldtooth.

Dallas Goldtooth, thank you so much for joining us on this special episode of Five Plane Questions.

Hey, everyone, Dallas Goldtooth here.

I'm so happy to be here.

Yeah, let's jump into it.

All right.

Well, Dallas, I've got a few questions.

For you that I, our audience has a lot of concerns with the new Trump administration, the uncertainty that is not.

Just on the horizon, but is here now.

And I've asked a number of individuals across our community to share some thoughts and perspective on what's, I guess, where we are and maybe things that we could think about as, as we move forward.

So I'm going to throw some questions at you and I would really love to hear your thoughts on this.

All right, let's go for it.

So how do you anticipate the new administration's policies that will impact tribal sovereignty and self governance?

Well, I feel like we have a good idea based on the last time this administration was in office.

Right.

I think the administration went to great lengths to, you know, in their own way test the boundaries of tribal sovereignty, but in one particular arena and that was on land management and resource extraction.

Right.

And since then and during the Biden administration, there was a big push around questioning the jurisdiction of tribal nations around environmental regulations and their access to, in, in management or, or co management of travel of, of land.

And I think that we're going to continue to see that, we're going to probably see that on a whole new level where this administration is going to question and challenge the jurisdictional reach of tribal nations when it comes to, to land resources and land management.

I think that, you know, right now, you know, for those that aren't aware, like give like, hey, things are changing every damn day, right?

So like you have to kind of timestamp everything.

So right now we're, there's a big conversation around the funding freeze, around resources that have been going out and there's a big push within tribal nations to get tribes exempted from those funding freezes.

And mainly based on the argument that, hey, monies that are designated for tribal nations are not DEI programs because tribal nations are not ethnic minorities.

We are actually political entities and polit, not only that, but political entities that have treaty rights that guarantee certain amenities.

And, and so, you know, that's the argument.

I, from what I understand that's been somewhat successful because there are some people in this administration who have some familiarity working with tribal nations.

Doug Burgam is being one of them, former governor of North Dakota.

And so, you know, I think there's a number of like, valid concerns about the threats that tribal nations face.

Yeah, I, I, I, I worry, I don't know, man.

I think that there's, I feel like we have to be cognizant of like there's numerous battlefronts here, right?

There is the battlefront that tribal nations as entities, as governance, governance structures have to deal with.

Right.

The questions around, you know, again, jurisdiction, you know, program, programmatic work that they, the tribal nations do, the contracts that they have with the federal government, that's, that's all legit stuff.

A lot of it honestly is above my head.

But then there's also the cultural front and I think that's really where a lot of like the anxiety is faced with right now.

Because we're seeing a culture of fascism being heavily expressed openly.

And how do we confront that?

Right.

Because that, that fascism, the, the forms of white supremacy that we are seeing publicly expressed, it doesn't just affect us as Native people, it affects all peoples.

Right?

And so I think that there is obviously a culture war that is being promoted and advocated primarily by the conservative, by the right wing in such a way that we as Native people can't help but be involved in that because we are involved in that.

They're pulling, they pull us into it because in their eyes we are a part of the they, big capital, they T T word.

And so I think that's a, that's definitely a.

There are policies being created that play into that cultural war that I feel like I'm afraid of, like how.

I still don't know exactly how we will be involved in that, but we definitely will be as Native people in very practical ways.

Like the, the, the federal government has already are.

This administration has already signaled that it wants to expand resource extraction and obviously they can't.

They can only do that on federal lands.

Right, because it's the federal government.

They can only, you know, deal with what's happening on federal lands and then they work in conjunction with private entities on the private extraction.

But a lot of federal lands is either adjacent or on tribal lands.

There's a, there's a number of lands that are co.

Managed with tribal nations.

And so those things are all up in the air, right?

And so I think that's a definite a for sure impact is the expansion of fossil fuel extraction is definitely something that we're going to have to be looking towards.

This leads us to the second question is what, what steps can Native communities take to protect their environmental resources in light of these pot policy changes?

Again, it's twofold, right?

There's, there's the steps that tribal governments can take and then there's tribe this.

There's steps that the people can take And I feel like we have to be strategic in both those arenas.

And that oftentimes I feel like, you know, I think things are changing.

But tribal governments, I think really tribal officials and leaders sometimes discredit or don't give enough acknowledgment to the power of the people and the things that they can do that is beyond what tribal officials can do, right, because they got to be diplomatic sometimes, they got to do all this stuff.

But I think that we definitely need to see more coordination and strategy between our tribal nations and governments and their officials and the people that they represent.

Because we all know oftentimes it's the people who are the rowdy ones who are willing to say some shit.

And you need that voice, you need that activism, that organizing, that power that, that really moves our nations.

So I think that the steps that Native communities can take is be.

Is prepared now for organizing, right?

We're going to see an increase in permitting of fossil fuel extraction across Indian country.

We're going to see an increase in more critical resources, critical metals and mining permits.

And a lot of those places are in sacred sites or places that have negative impacts on Native people.

So we have to be prepared in our capacity to organize our own people to come out to speak up and also organize our tribal leaders to speak up on our behalf.

One thought that comes to mind is the work that everyone did with the no Dapple movement out in Standing Rock eight years now, nine years ago, eight years ago.

And one of the things that I saw from the, the government side, the state side, is they put to work media for their cause.

They changed the narrative on the larger scale of why things are happening and really, really twisting what was going on there.

And this podcast is a result of that.

Because I wanted to set up a platform for our community to be able to share our stories in our own voices, not to be curated by either a non Native or someone who is not directly that individual.

And so a thought that comes to mind is, as these things are coming together and as we're coordinating, is to have media, whether it's not so much social media, but podcasts or non traditional media, to be able to sort of amplify the perspective and stories of the folks that are, that are really pushing back against these changes 100%.

We have to be able to control our stories, tell them on our own terms.

And so I think that communities that can invest in communication is essential.

I think that's a huge way.

I think you're spot on on that.

Joe is like in the fight against Dakota Access Pipeline, as well as Line 3 Communications was a huge arm of the struggle.

And there's, you know, historically been a lack of infrastructure within Indian country around communication.

Yeah, we have tribal radio stations, but how are we broadcasting our message beyond our tribal communities?

That's a big part of it.

How do we control the narrative on our own terms is a huge aspect of the work.

So there.

I think that communities need to be heavily invested or start planning ahead for that.

There's a.

Of course I'm not being paid for this.

But the only.

There's a communications firm called Pyramid Communications.

It's a native owned PR company that have, has done good work.

I've worked with them and they've worked with tribal nations specifically around PR work.

So there are folks out there that you could reach out to to get, you know, help, support and elevate in preparation for whatever fight there is.

There's one thing, I guess what I left out, what I didn't say is how can we.

To answer the question of how can we prepare for this administration in the next four years?

Our tribal leaders have, have to be more.

I don't want to say this because it's fucking patriarchal, but they have to grow some balls like our, our tribal leaders.

Like, if you have a choice between being passive and being outspoken, you need to be outspoken and not be afraid to hold to, to, to speak out on behalf of your people.

And I know people are like, oh, I do that already.

But no, like if something's happening, if, if there is a project that's happening on your people's territory that is detrimental to your people, get in the way, get out and get out and, and get spoken to.

Like the lobby work is important and maintaining open dialogue with, with state officials and federal officials, important.

But at the end of the day, you're there for your people and your people need to see you stand up and get in the way of something, should it come to that.

At Dakota Access Pipeline as a great example at Standing Rock, of course we, when we organize that official.

In the first few days, first few months, it was a small camp and we were planning maybe expecting maybe 50 people of our own.

People like, hey, we'll have some natives come through.

50, you know, 40 people come and camp here and there.

Um, and it started to grow a bit more.

But the pivotal moment, I want to acknowledge and recognize the big moment that really, really charged a lot of people beyond, like, there's a dog attacks and all this other sensational stuff.

But there was another moment where the tribal chairman, Dave Archambeau Jr.

Got arrested.

And now he didn't plan to get arrested.

He actually.

There was the, you know, construction was.

There was a construction site there, and he wanted to go look at it, and so he was gonna.

He went up to the fence, and then cops were like, stay away from the fence.

He's like, I just want to look at what's going on over there.

And the.

The police escalated and instigated a scene where they ended up arresting the tribal chairman.

And he was like, fuck that.

Get your hands off me.

And, like.

And it became a thing.

But what that did for not only Standing Rock, but for other communities was so damn powerful because they're like, look, our leaders are doing something more than just passing resolutions.

So that might be charged what I'm trying to say, but I think that we need to see our folks out there with the people and taking action when and should it come to it.

Yeah, right.

Yeah, right on.

Right on.

Something that's incredibly important to a lot of folks, yourself and myself included, are.

Is.

Are about cultural and heritage sites.

What.

What are ways that tribes can safeguard, you know, these cultural and sacred sites under this political climate that we're in right now?

Yeah.

I don't know how much I can speak to because I don't have, like, the technical knowledge necessarily around cultural, historic preservation and, like, the.

The technical jargon that a lot of our.

We call them thpos up in the Midwest.

Right.

A lot of tribes have tribal historic preservation offices, and their job is to protect cultural sites and work with construction that may be impacting cultural sensitive sites.

I think that work is essential and is always needed.

I think that we need to continue to resource up those offices within our tribal nations to make sure they have the capacity to go to all these construction sites and make sure they're not digging up our ancestors or, like, they're doing everything proper.

I think one huge thing that is ongoing, of course, is us teaching our peoples what these sites are.

Right.

Just acknowledge the humility, like, take a humble acknowledgment of, like, there's a lot of stories that we've lost over the years.

And so one of the best ways we can protect these sites is by teaching our younger generations of, oh, that site over there, that's sacred to us because of this.

This place is significant to us because of this and that and that.

Right.

I think that's.

That's a huge effort is like, us telling stories about who we are and making sure we don't lose.

That is I think the big, a big core part of the fight.

The I was talking to one of the tribal, the temple officers up here and one of the ways a lot of these corporations are getting around having to report when they find a cultural site is that they cancel their federal funding that they're receiving on these projects because tied to federal funding is the obligation to report.

And so they can just sort of plow through these places.

And some of them have, have done this by returning the federal funds or we're not applying for them, you know.

And so that's a tactic that they've been using.

Interesting though.

Seedy bastards.

How can our communities effectively advocate for their rights and interests during this administration?

I'm a strong believer in collaboration and base building.

You can't build a successful movement without building your base and growing and bringing other folks into your movement and saying, look, this, what we're building over here is enticing.

It's beautiful, it's wonderful and it's going to make us better, healthier and happier in the long run.

Come join us.

And I think as native peoples we have.

We can only do so much within our communities to protect our sacred sites and protect our homelands and territories.

But I really encourage us to also build out and strengthen relationships with the other communities in which we live in relationship with.

I'm a huge advocate of land back right and my heart and the work that I do.

I'm a sovereignist.

I truly believe that the.

That I truly believe and work towards a future in which our tribal nations are true sovereign nations unto themselves, knowing that the realities of making that happen are so complicated.

But I still allow myself to stay in that dream aspiration and help that inform all my work.

With that being said, we still have to work in relationship with settler communities, settler culture and other communities that are.

That we may interact with, whether those are other refugee communities, to build a stronger base.

I think that is really essential because when you are being attacked, especially when we're dealing with fascism and white supremacy at a hundred percent, one of the mechanisms that is utilized to dismantle society and dismantle systems of health is by isolating ourselves, by isolating us.

And so it forces us to get into a defensive position.

We put up our walls and we say, you know what?

We're just going to worry about us.

We're not going to worry about you 10 miles down the road, we're not going to worry about you guys over there.

We can only worry about us because that's how that's our defense mechanism and that's how they pick us off.

That's how, how we are attacked because we're easily.

It's easier to, to dismantle our governance systems if we feel isolated and we act in isolation.

And so I think that it is essential for us to build, to strengthen our networks now.

Right?

How is your tribal nation working in collaboration with the other tribal nations around you?

How is you.

How is your community working in collaboration with other communities around you?

How are you as an individual strengthening the relationship with those around you?

Right.

Those are essential coming out of the pandemic, right?

Dude, I watch so many videos since the pandemic of like preppers and like, and also, like, mind you, a lot of the videos I watch on YouTube, like, all these preppers are all white folks right there.

And it's obvious that they have resources to buy all this fricking gear.

But one flaw I see in, in all of that is that the vast majority of those perspectives is an isolationist approach to survival.

And if there's nothing else that we learn from it, from our, from our indigenous life ways and knowledge that's been built up over millennia is that you cannot survive by yourself in this world.

You need community.

We as humans are social animals, but also we've built up entire cultures around the collective and collective power and collective organizing.

And so I, look, we have to lean into that, not step away from that.

And, and, and the world's going to teach us to step away from that.

The world's gonna try to push us to separate from that.

What are, what are some resources and strategies that, that you would recommend to help alleviate our fears and strength and our resilience?

See, this is where I got, I gotta, I gotta actually read up myself more to get like that's a great question.

And I want, I wish I had a better, like, easier list.

Right.

But it's also, that's also a consequence of our culture, our society nowadays, where we want something easy.

Right.

What's the list of things that we could do?

I think that look into research and look into nonviolent direct action and peaceful civil disobedience.

These are tactics and tools that communities have used historically to push back against oppressive systems and structures.

There's a number of organizations that, that lean into that, that do provide trainings there so you, you can look out for it.

Look out, you know, Non Violent Direct action.

NBDA is the, the acronym.

There also are other organizations that do active organizing.

Native Organizers alliance is an organization that does that, that does trainings on organizing Indigenous Environmental Network Honor, the Earth Indian Collective are all organizations that have trainers around nonviolent direct action and peaceful civil disobedience.

There is a, a organization called IP3 Indigenous People's Power Project.

They're specific actually.

They are like go to folks around nonviolent direct action and a lot of those organizations contract them to help kind of do those things.

I think that, I think that a strategy that I now I'm thinking off the cuff here, but something that I've been thinking about for myself is, you know, having informed, healthy conversations with your, with your tribal leaders about like what's their plans?

Because that's I think really is what are your plans?

What is our plans?

Right.

Like I, I was going to post on my social media like asking tribal leaders like do you have a plan for worst case scenario?

Right.

What is the plan of if the, the Trump administration, let's say the Trump administration completely and utterly and directly ref.

Refuses to follow any orders from the Supreme Court.

That's a quote unquote constitutional crisis and leads us down a scary path to where it potentially could be like civil war could deal with something like that.

What's the plan for Trib when that all falls apart?

Right.

But also what's the plan if Trump and them continue down the, down the line and they say, oh well, tribal nations actually we don't have to follow treaty rights, we don't have to follow this.

Like there's a, I think there's so much belief and reliance in the system and what Trump has showed us is that it's all made up.

We make it up.

We make up the rules.

Like we make like our, our society is based on rules that we just make up and we have a common agreement that that' the way it is.

And what Trump has done, it shows you is that those in power can change the rules anytime they want.

And I think there's so much reliance on, oh, the system will figure it out.

Right?

We, we have checks and balances.

We, we, we believe in the Supreme Court and the rule of law at the end of the day will settle things out.

You don't know.

You don't know.

So what are you doing?

What thought have we put into to prepare for the worst case scenario where they truly start coming after start dissolving in their own eyes?

The, the, the relate the, the federal trust relationship between tribal nations.

So those are questions.

I think it's more like asking questions and having conversation.

I think that's one of the best Strategies that you could do to build resiliency in communities.

That's that last point is, is so spot on because you know those, those safeguards that are in place only work if those individuals occupying those, those positions have the courage and the wherewithal to, to push back.

And we're just not seeing that right now.

Exactly.

And like, like it, what terrifies me is like stuff like the Defense Secretary hexeth, his, his statements around Basically the way I read is like, hey, human rights.

Ah, it's like do we need to follow those or not?

You know, like rules of engagement.

We just made it up.

So let's change the rules and lean more heavy towards like, you know, what is it called?

Like ask for forgiveness later.

Right.

Just do it now and ask for forgiveness later.

There's so much, there's so much that entails and it's terrifying to think of like the damage and death that could bring to, to, to innocent people.

Right.

Yeah, I, I, I actually would ask you.

Oh, that's a good, what like specifically on Department of Defense?

Because that, I don't know if you saw that on Facebook.

I asked like a bunch of vets, like I said, hey, this is the native vets.

Like how do you feel about the Department of Defense pick and the way our approach is going?

Because I really am, I really want to hear more around like native vets because I know there's also, it's a moment of conflict.

Right.

There's some conflict there.

Right.

Acknowledging that, but also like there's a lot of pride.

So how about you Joe?

Like what's your thoughts on it?

Like I want to hear.

How you feeling?

Well, so my military career was, was two parts.

The first part, the first half of my career I was, I was in a combat unit, very low level.

I was a sergeant working at the platoon level.

And one of the biggest eye opening things that occurred to me when I was in Iraq is we were working with some community members protecting the site and, and there was an older gentleman there and we worked together for about two and a half months or so.

And at first I was standoffish, you know, cause I was a soldier, you know, like I have to like be on guard all the time.

And the more we talked, the more we shared things.

We started talking about our cultures and where we came from and we started to build this real big connection.

And every night he would invite me to have dinner with him over in this tent area with a few of his colleagues and I turned him down.

Turned him down.

And finally one Night I thought, heck with it, just go, go sit, eat dinner with him.

And I go in there and there was this table, this beautiful spread of food.

And I think we were in there for about two, two and a half hours just talking.

And we really bonded over food and conversation.

It wasn't political, it was just where we were from.

And it really opened my eyes on their perspective of, of us being in their land and those folks trying to do the best they could to survive.

Not just the insurgency that was happening around them, but the American soldiers who were also killing a lot of them as well.

I mean, they were a terrifying place that I as a young 25 year old hadn't thought about at that point.

And so that really changed how I was looking at why we were over there.

The second half of my career, I'd become a civil affairs soldier.

So my work was based on helping communities that we were around.

And I moved up to a brigade level.

So I was around brigade staff officers sort of looked at things at a larger logistics and strategic level as opposed to like on the ground type of scenario.

And so working in Afghanistan and being in Kuwait later on, it was, it was less about, you know, the fight, but about sort of building trust within the community as, as maybe as tone deaf as that sounds now.

You know, that was the perspective.

Yeah.

When I see people like our current Secretary of Defense, I see a guy that never put the time in at the higher brigade level who never thought strategically he's a very like on the ground, let's fight mentality.

And so I don't think he's got the maturity or the perspective to be in a place to think broader term.

You know, I mean, he's on TV now, you know, doing these things where he's, you know, working out with the troops and doing all these sort of buddy slap things, you know, where he's, he's trying to like connect to the guys on the ground, but he's not really doing the work to, to connect with world leaders and people that are in his same positions in different countries.

Like he's, he's not doing that.

And that's very dangerous and very short sighted.

Yeah, he and the other people that, that are filling those cabinets now, it's very clear that they are, they are.

Their oath is to the President and not the Constitution.

And I think the short sightedness is leading us down a very slippery slope.

Not to be throwing out phrases like that.

But yeah, I don't think he's qualified, I don't think he's Got the experience to be able to not just run an organization like this, but he doesn't have the life experience or the career experience to be able to occupy a role like that.

No, I appreciate, I appreciate that input that.

Are that your thoughts on it?

I mean, I agree.

I, I align with a lot of that.

I think that it is, I think you're, you're spot on that this administration across the board are very micro thinkers and not macro thinkers.

Right?

Yeah.

And they're looking at the immediate wins.

They're looking at the, the immediate fight in front of them.

What they see as the fight with.

No, with a complete disregard for the bigger picture.

And where, where.

What are the tenets?

What is, what are the tenets of the Constitution?

What was behind the Constitution?

What was behind all these balance checks and balances right there?

I, I think that's essential.

Right.

There's this whole like, narrative that's just so maddening to watch and we all see it for what, a lot of us see it for what it is, but it's still maddening to see nonetheless of like, you know, they're blaming migrants for the problems.

They're blaming so many people for these mass problems that they're just trying to find an enemy for people to, to focus on so that they can distract from everything else.

Right.

Yeah.

And, and yeah, like the, the whole.

I know this might not all make it into the podcast, but like the US Aid stuff is interesting because look, look, look, the US Government's up.

We have done some up.

We continue to do some up with our money.

We with, with, with our tax money.

We have supported the United States government to topple legitimate democracies because it is in our best interest, capital interest, to topple democracies to get dictators in place.

We've done that in the past and we still do it today.

That's legit.

And U.S.

aid is often used as an arm that's tied to these cointelprol CIA tactics.

I firmly believe in that there's some legit shit that's, that, that USA and other programs have been, have done.

But then also I understand the purpose of like, look, if, if we can send food to a country to deal with a famine so that it makes it harder for a guerrilla force to take control in that country, then I think that's, that's, that's worthwhile and meaningful work.

Right you are.

You know, the whole purpose of USAID was really to help absolve or help avoid future conflicts.

And it's just, it's maddening to me.

All, all of it like this, you know, the.

I just, I just saw this whole post about folks are talking.

So some people are realizing that some of the things on, on the chopping block with the new Republican budget bill is that they want to cut welfare and food stamps in wic.

They want to make, put some, they wanted to cut the budget to it.

And I'm like, wow, like, it's just so crazy to me that as a person, don't you see what they're doing right?

They're cutting your, your food stamps and they want you to blame migrants for that.

Not the corporations who are raking in billions of dollars based on your labor, not the executives who are raking in tremendous amount of money because of your labor and they want to cut your food stamps in your WIC and they want to, you know, increase the cost of your living, but yet give all these.

I'm going down the thread.

I'm getting, I'm getting worked up, Joe.

So I'm stop there.

I'm going to stop.

I'm ready to jump in with you because I want to make some points too, but you're.

Well, I guess what I want to say is that all of this big picture for me is that Trump's agenda, the current administration's agenda, it's not just Trump, it's all the cronies behind Trump.

What it does, it unveils.

It just reveals the precarious edge in which we live on and have lived on as native peoples, that all laws, all senses of legal norms are just things that we fabricate.

We make them up and we collectively agree to follow them.

But all it takes is those in power who say, you know what?

That doesn't give me.

That doesn't give me enough more.

That doesn't give me enough advantage.

I need more advantage.

I need to cap, I need to accumulate more wealth.

And so let's change these laws and norms that we all agree to on a whim and that, that all of this is how capitalism is supposed to work.

This is the very auspices of empire in motion.

And so when Native communities, when our people say like, oh, you know, colonization is ongoing, like the, the process of colonization hasn't ended.

We're not in a post colonial world.

We are actively still being colonized.

That's what we're saying, like you in power can change the rules so much, but we have to deal with the repercussions.

That's the world we live in.

And so the more that we can put towards speaking to speaking to that, addressing it, saying it out out loud.

It makes it gives us more.

More room to maneuver, right?

As if we make a.

If we build a common language around the systems in which we are being oppressed, and it helps us respond better.

I think that's a great place to leave this.

I think this sums it up.

I think this sums it up.

Dallas, that's it.

I mean, there's so much more to talk about, right?

There are so many more questions.

This is just sort of a brief of.

Of where to start from.

I don't know if you want to put this out there, but before we start recording, you talked about possibly doing your.

Your take on all this too, as far as a limited series.

Yeah, I, I, I've been thinking about how, like, so I'm, you know, I've been feeling.

I feel this weight of wanting to do something.

I think a lot of us feel that, right?

Where we, like, seeing all this happening, and we're like, man, I want to do something.

I want to.

I want to be a part of this.

Push back, right?

And each of us have a different part to play in that.

And I want to encourage all of you.

If you're listening to this and you're feeling that drive of, like, I don't know what to do, but I want to do something because I feel this need to fight on behalf of my children and future generations.

Like, don't reject that.

Don't run away from that.

Like, lean into that and.

And.

And find your place.

And a lot of that times, a lot of that is finding it in others, right?

You're you.

We build.

You have to build power and collective and find others who think like you and work like you or who may be on the fence like you and, And.

And say how.

What?

Okay, I'm feeling this way.

You're feeling this way.

How about we kind of put our brains together and see what we could come up with, whether that's, like, tribe.

Can we put pressure on our tribal government to come up with a resolution to say, hey, we're.

We.

We stand against this, or we advocate for, you know, advocate for LGBTQ relatives, our two SPE relatives, and we want to make sure that our communities is known, it's publicly known, that our communities are safe havens, even though, of course, we have our own internal drama.

But we want to make sure that we make that known.

Those are things that you could do for me.

I struggle because I, I'm an actor now.

I'm a writer, but my heart is in organizing Like, I used to be an organizer for so many years, and so I'm trying to find my own place.

And one thing I've been coming back to is like doing a limited series podcast, potentially talking with legal, Native, legal scholars, tribal leaders around these same questions that you're asking, but like a little bit more in depth of like, what are we, what should we prepare for and what are we preparing for and what do we need to know about in regards to our, our continued indigenous sovereignty and self determination?

So that's what's in my mind, that's where I'm leaning towards is like, okay, that's my part to play in this and maybe having more informed dialogue so people can listen to other people and say, oh, that, that's.

That makes sense.

Legal scholars, this is what they're thinking about, all of this.

So, yeah, trying to.

I'm trying to find my place just as, Just, just as much as you are.

And we're in this together.

I think that'd be amazing.

Yes, yes, we're, We're.

We're all in this together.

But thank you, thank you for, for sitting down with me and just sharing your thoughts and giving, giving all of us, you know, something to think about and some perspective in all this.

I appreciate, I.

Wait, I appreciate it to the fullest.

Thank you very much.

And that does it for this episode of five Plane Questions.

I want to thank Dallas again for his time and his perspective that he shared with us.

Like I said at the beginning, we're.

We're definitely in an unprecedented time or at least in a place that we haven't been in, in nearly 200 years.

And so the, the courage and the clarity that Dallas has given us is something that I deeply appreciate.

So, you know, in the spirit of what he said, I just, I reflect the same thing.

You know, as community members, it's really on us to, to take action.

So that means contacting our officials, whether the tribal state or federal officials, and urge them to support us in the things that we need.

If it's the tribal level, you know, we're all caught up in sort of tribal politics and the drama and the pettiness and all of that.

Now is the time to set those things aside and to work towards a goal that protects our sovereignty and our autonomy.

And you know, that that means coming up with ways to.

Being able to, to craft legislation and laws to protect us and our families.

And that's, that's really what it comes down to.

So a more informed advocate is a more effective advocate.

So that's that's really what I want to say.

So, Dallas, thank you for for your time and I really appreciate that.

I also want to thank you for joining us and spending your time listening to what I feel is a very important story and perspective from our community.

So please join us next time as we speak with another incredible person.

I'm Joe Williams.

You can find me on Instagram and on Facebook and the official five plane coin questions website, 11warriorarts.com there.

You'll see this episode, past episodes and the the merchandise that's going to be coming soon.

But also too if there's someone that you think you want me to talk to, reach out to me, let me know who to talk to and I'll be happy to hear from you.

I also want to thank the Indigenous association for letting me use their podcast studio and I want to thank Jesse and Pot for good for producing this episode.

We have amazing images and sound now because of the great work that they do.

So Jesse and crew, thank you so much for all that you do.

Well, that's it.

We had a big conversation this week and I just want to thank you for joining us.

You take care of yourself and we will see you next time.

This has been an eleven Warrior Arts production.