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Success Inspired - Vit Müller EPISODE 28, 31st October 2020
How to sell with authentic persuasion
00:00:00 00:55:46

How to sell with authentic persuasion

My guest today is a sales coach, author and keynote speaker. He is someone who has developed a way to be successful in sales, yet it doesn't make any sense on paper, his Parent's were anti-salespeople, he got degree in marine biology, worked at Microsoft doing tech support, even spent 4 years as a gov contractor. Yet here he is now running a successful six-figure sales consultancy in Fremont California where he trains and coaches sales teams and reps on how to succeed at inside sales. 

Special offer:

Go to www.authenticpersuasion.com/successinspired and use the code: SUCCESSINSPIRED to receive 20% off the Persuading Like A Professional program.


Highlights:

  • (00:01:01) - Jason's cool job tagging sharks as a marine biologist
  • (00:05:33) - Working at many what ever jobs when you're young is great thing to do
  • (00:11:40) - We're talking about sales confidence, skills, authentic persuasion and what your duty is as a sales person
  • (00:19:39) - How to overcome the 'how much do you charge' objection
  • (00:26:04) - Customer experience and how selling is an ongoing thing (not just to make $
  • (00:32:05) - What's below the tip of the sales iceberg? If you want to have a scalable sales machine, there's many parts you've got to do, right.
  • (00:34:39) - How do you go about building your sales team
  • (00:00:00) - Talk less, listen more, quality conversation always wins and has higher conversion rate (but you must aim to sell, not just chat)
  • (00:40:24) - Way to navigate, control and bring a sales conversation to a close
  • (00:44:54) - Wanna know more about sales? Check out 'Sales Experience Podcast'
  • (00:45:37) - One thing Jason wished he'd know earlier when he started his business
  • (00:47:08) - We talk about active, healthy lifestyle, intermittent fasting, importance of not going too rigid with diets and how to improve your sales performance
  • (00:52:39) - How to get in touch with Jason

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Full Transcript:


[00:00:04] Welcome to the success inspired podcast, a business and personal development podcast to help you accomplish more in life and realize your true potential. And nowhere is your host, Vit Muller.

Vit Muller: [00:00:16] hello everybody. My guest today is a sales coach, author and keynote speaker. 

[00:00:21] He is someone who has developed a way to be successful in sales, yet it doesn't make any sense on paper. His parents were anti salespeople. He got a degree in Marine biology, worked at Microsoft doing tech support and even spent four years as a government contractor.

[00:00:37] Yet here he is now running a successful six-figure sales consultancy out of Fremont, California, where he trains and coaches, sales teams, and reps on how to succeed at inside sales. Please. Welcome to the show, 

[00:00:50] Jason cutter. 

Jason Cutter: [00:00:57] Thanks for having me. I'm a; I'm looking forward to this trip. Fun. Yeah. 


Jason's cool job tagging sharks as a marine biologist 

Vit Muller: [00:01:01] Great to have you on the show. Great to have you on the show. The exciting career path you have, what compelled you to become a Marine biologist? 

Jason Cutter: [00:01:10] so I, it started because I was inspired by a teacher when I was in, middle school. And, it was a general biology class, and then we had a segment on fish, and we're dissecting things and studying fish and studying sharks, and he introduced me to some shark researchers and books. And at the same time, you know, this will date my age, but also shark week came out on discovery channel for the first time. And I used to record that on VHS tapes so I could watch it, you know, throughout the year and, just really fascinated with it and wanted to get into it.

[00:01:45] This is one of those childhood dreams. You, you get inspired by, by sort of a position that sort of a job, and then you pursue it. 

Jason Cutter: [00:01:52] sort of, I mean, it was a transition away from my childhood, you know, kind of a dinosaur phase into shark phase. I didn't know what I wanted to do with it. I just know I was fascinated by sharks.

[00:02:04] I mean, I didn't have a career path, but yeah. I mean, it seemed like a cool thing to study and go after. 

Vit Muller: [00:02:10] Right. So you just went and studied it and then, and then that led into going tagging sharks. 

Jason Cutter: [00:02:16] well, I went to an excellent school, UC Santa Cruz. And while I was there, I was able to, to work with a volunteer for a group called pelagic shark research foundation, fantastic group.

[00:02:27] They do a lot of tagging and, work for, you know, the department of fish and game and different agencies for schools, you know, helping out. And, yeah, so I spent a lot of time working with them, tagging sharks for my school research. And I couldn't even get an $8 an hour job scrubbing boats with lots of experience.

[00:02:47] Cause it was so competitive. I mean, this is the late nineties. Everyone wants to work at SeaWorld. Everyone wants to, you know, train dolphins and work, you know, with the seals and the sea lions and so competitive. I couldn't get any job even in Marine biology. 

Vit Muller: [00:03:00] Right. So even though you've done that four years of tagging sharks afterwards, that, that didn't wasn't enough credentials for, to, to, to get through the cracks.

Jason Cutter: [00:03:09] Nope. Not even the scrub boats, they gave it to a master student. So you had to be like working on your master's degree to be scrubbing boats for $8 an hour. And I was willing to live in my car if that's what it took and I couldn't even get that. So I was like, where do I go next? 

Vit Muller: [00:03:25] Now tagging sharks, that would have been quite an adrenaline job, wouldn't it?

Jason Cutter: [00:03:29] it is, it is quite fun. I mean, you know, we did everything, you know, two-foot, three-foot sharks, which most people would be freaked out with, you know, catching those by hand in shallow water up to, you know, 18 foot great white sharks circling the boat, which, you know, as I was the young guy on the crew.

[00:03:46] So I was the one responsible for making sure the shark didn't eat the bait, that was hanging off the side, and I had to push this, you know, 18 foot, 7,000-pound shark away from its purpose in life. And, yeah, so that's, that's interesting. 

Vit Muller: [00:04:02] Wow. Wow. No, that's that definitely would have been.

[00:04:05] Yeah, I can, I can imagine. And any exciting story out of, you know, out of those four years, 

Jason Cutter: [00:04:12] one of the most interesting was that for the longest time they thought great white sharks were just solitary. Like you only saw one great white shark in one area, almost like they had their territory.

[00:04:22] And then I remember one day and I started working with that group. They had upgraded boats, so they had a 21-foot boat. They used to have a 16-foot boat before I started. And so we're on a 21-foot boat, and there were three 18 foot great white sharks circling us at one time, which wasn't a thing before then.

[00:04:41] And it was fascinating, and we were radio tagging them. Cause at the time there wasn't a lot of satellite technology, but you would track them and watch where they were going and, to see three giant sharks circling your 21-foot boat, is, is quite impressive and very scary. 

Vit Muller: [00:04:57] How do you tag a giant shark-like that?

[00:04:59] You just shoot the thing with the sensor on it or the, the. Receive, the transmit this, 

Jason Cutter: [00:05:06] long pole. So it just, you get it to swim by going for the bait. My job is to make sure it doesn't eat the thing that it's trying to eat. I was sometimes pulling it up at the last second. It cruises by, and the person with the long pole has one shot at it to get it right in the right spot.

[00:05:22] You know, nearly by hand at the end of a pole. And, you've got another person doing the video, and as a spotter and, you know, you hope it goes well, you only got a few chances. Usually 

Vit Muller: [00:05:32] so then what happened?

Working at many whatever jobs when you're young is a great thing to do

 [00:05:33] So then you finished with Marine biology. What happened then? 

Jason Cutter: so moved to Seattle, ended up getting a job at Microsoft, doing tech support for a couple of years. Cause I thought, Hey, I'm good with customer service. I was working in restaurants, getting used to dealing with people. It's funny. Cause I, you know, you had mentioned the intro being in an anti sales household.

[00:05:51] I didn't want to deal with the public. I didn't want to get into sales. When I got a job at a restaurant, I wanted to be a busser, but not a waiter. Cause I didn't want to deal with hungry people. And then I moved up, and I kind of got used to it. So I moved to Seattle, and I thought, Hey, I am good with computers.

[00:06:06] I like computers. I can merge. You know, customer service, problem-solving and, you know, the tech side and, found out I didn't like it. I didn't want to do it, was there for two years. And, they started outsourcing all the jobs overseas for the first time. And that ended for a lot of people in my department.

[00:06:25] And, then I had to figure out what I want to do next. 

Vit Muller: [00:06:27] When, when did that restaurant Potter come in? Sorry, I didn't, I missed that. Was it. 

Jason Cutter: [00:06:31] It was when I was living in Santa Cruz, when I was going to college, you know, the volunteer Marine biology, shark tagging doesn't pay. So it was going to school tagging sharks and waiting tables all at the same time.

Vit Muller: [00:06:43] Wow. Okay. Yeah. Well, one thing, I think it's a great thing to do when you're in your teens. So when you were in your young adulthood too, do you have broad. You know, the experience of different, different jobs. Cause I've done the same thing. I've worked as a, as a cook in restaurants as well.

[00:07:02]I've then done like weird stuff, you know, back in Sydney, like I had to do some, you know, waitering for like hens parties and, and working in construction and I think it's a, it's a good thing to do because it opens up your horizons a little bit, like your perspective. Of what's out there when you do that when you when, you're young.

Jason Cutter: [00:07:24] yeah, I mean, I, I think two things are essential. One is, I mean, as my mom says, all the time part of life is figuring out what you don't want to do. So the only way to do that is to try lots of things. The other part is, and, you know, I would almost say this should be mandatory, but I feel like everybody, at some point early in their life, teens, early twenties should work in either a call centre, retail or a restaurant.

Vit Muller: [00:07:45] I mean the big thing here is that, yeah, try more things. Try work for many, many different jobs, do many other jobs because when you're young, you know, you're a sponge, you absorb all that. And that gives you a good, good experience into, into your professional career.

[00:08:00] Right? 

Jason Cutter: [00:08:01] It's a hundred per cent 

Vit Muller: [00:08:02] as opposed to somebody who's 18 becomes, you know, overnight success, or want to be, on YouTube. We're done any, anything else, you know, never done any manual labour. I think manual labour is the one that is missing. I think that's what kids should be doing.

[00:08:18] Like getting into construction, become, you know, labour for a little bit for summer. You know, use your hands work hard use know physical work because it makes you appreciate hard work. And, and the cool thing about that type of work is you get, see that you can see the result. Right. I remember when I was in Scotland, we used to do a concrete job, you know, you know, concrete in flooring for big, farmer sheds, 200 cubes of concrete, typically a job.

[00:08:43] And we had these, you know, these wouldn't think these rakes and we just manual labour just rake the whole concrete. So it's all levelled. It was hard work, but you finish at the end of the day, and you see the entire finished product, and you're like, this is cool. And this is going to stay here for many, many years.

Jason Cutter: [00:09:00] Yeah. And I'll tell you, that's one of those things where my whole sales career has always been about services, not even products. And so it's an idea of something it's helping somebody get something, but it's not like tangible, it's not selling a car, it's not selling something physical. But yeah, there are times on that same way where I'll do something physical, build something, fix something.

[00:09:19] And there's that just part of people in general, where it's just like you do it and you step back and go. That's pretty cool. I did that, right? 

Vit Muller: [00:09:26] Yeah. 

We are talking about sales

Now let's look sales fast forward. You are now running a consultancy, which is a six-figure consultancy out of Fremont, California. How long have you guys been around for?

Jason Cutter: [00:09:38] So, about 19 months, 

Vit Muller: [00:09:40] 19 months. And in for 19 months, you've been able to get to six figures. 

Jason Cutter: [00:09:45] Yep. It was, it was super interesting because when I started, I broke the two rules for becoming a consultant or starting a company. One of the rules is to make sure you have like 12 months of money laying around so you can float yourself.

[00:09:59] And then the second part is to make sure that you have a lot of people in your network that want to hire you so that you don't have to wait very long. And I had neither of those things, it wasn't something I had been planning for getting into, but then the timing was right. So I started it, and in fact, the first sale and I tell us, everybody, cause I think it's essential for people, you know, they have this dream, and this fantasy that it's straightforward and they'll go out there and they'll start any business, and it'll just be instant.

[00:10:24]the first six months was nothing. There was, there was nothing, it was just networking. It was building things up. It was growing; it was creating, it was, it was making a lot of effort without a lot of payoffs, and then it started to hit, but it was a solid six months of, of really just building and pushing and then, you know, it, it took off from there.

Vit Muller: [00:10:42] Wow. That's that's impressive. And how big is your team now? 

Jason Cutter: [00:10:45] it is me. I have one other person that works for me, and then I have a lot of subcontractors and various part-time assistants that help out generally in all the areas that I'm not so great at. So I'm good at sales coaching training. Do not ask me to make a logo or graphic design or build a marketing campaign for you.

[00:11:05]you know, so I have the team that helps with those. When we go into a company, they fill in all those gaps, 

Vit Muller: [00:11:10] get somebody else for those type of roles. That's, that's the best thing to do. You can't be, you can't be good at everything right. 

Jason Cutter: [00:11:17] No, and you won't be. Really the sooner you can figure out where your zone of genius is, anywhere in life for anyone listening to this, like as soon as you figure that out, And then get help on everything else and stay as much as you can in that awesomeness.

Vit Muller: [00:11:31] That's the 80% - 20% rule do the 80% of your time or of tasks that you're, you're making the most value in and you're' most efficient in. 

We're talking about sales confidence, skills, authentic persuasion and what your duty is as a salesperson 

[00:11:40] Now what type of customers do you guys look after? 

Jason Cutter: [00:11:45] it's generally small organizations, small companies where they have some kind of inside telephone sales team. So it's phone sales related.

[00:11:55] I mean, that's where all my background is. It's generally where it's also some kind of inbound lead or inquiry. I have been working with other companies where it's not just phone. Maybe it's face-to-face, it's different kinds of services, but generally, it's organizations where they're struggling to bring in training.

[00:12:12] And close effectively and then scale up in size. So that's one sector that I work with were it, maybe it's a small company. The owner, is it doesn't have enough help is trying to manage sales, but also run the business and they need some help to grow, and then they can bring in more help officially.

[00:12:28]and then the other side of my business is working with individuals, coaches, consultants, people like that, where they want to do what they do best. So they want to do coaching. They want to do consulting. They want to do fitness coaching, whatever that might be. But the sales part is the part they don't like, and they don't want to do.

[00:12:44] And they're struggled with, and no one ever taught them how to do. And so then what happens is they struggle to get those new clients, which is where they shine the most. 

[00:12:53] It's very common. That one, that's the skillset of being able to do to sell. And people don't feel very confident often, people who start a business, right?

Vit Muller: [00:13:02] Do you come across that a lot?

Jason Cutter: [00:13:05] So much. And, and the reason why, and if you look, one of my, favorite books is called the E-Myth revisited by Michael Gerber. And essentially he talks about why most small businesses fail, which would include solopreneurs is that they're started by either a technician, an entrepreneur, or a manager who thinks like, let's say a technician, somebody who says I'm good at building websites.

[00:13:26] So let me start a business building websites. Well, there's sales, there's accounting, there's marketing, there are all these other factors, and they're just not good at it. They wish to do that same thing with coaches and consultants. They just want a coach, and no one taught them how to sell. And most people grow up having bad experiences with salespeople who might be manipulating.

[00:13:45] And so they don't want to be that person. And you know, the kind of person you see in the movies like the boiler room and Wolf of wall street, they don't want to be that person. So they go the other extreme, which is nothing. 

Vit Muller: [00:13:56] Yeah. Or like more being more suggestive, like, so would you like to sign up or like, yeah, I mean, there's a fine balance.

[00:14:05] You gotta be, you gotta be, ethical around it. ultimately it's providing a service, right? Sales is a service you're trying to solve. Someone's problem is trying to get them from a to B. But let's, let's talk about that because I believe you've got a book. the art of, what's the name again? 

Jason Cutter: [00:14:21] So the book is 'Selling with authentic persuasion' and then the subtitle, which kind of goes to this point is to transform from order taker to quota breaker.

[00:14:30] And sometimes people get triggered by that, and they don't like being called an order taker. But you know, if you're kind of giving the brochure to your clients, your prospective clients, no matter if you're in a call centre or you're your own person, your own salesperson. You're just giving them the brochure and the information, and then hoping they buy.

[00:14:47] Then basically you're an order taker. And I feel like there's a balance there, like you said, where you can use persuasion from a place of being authentic and move people forward for the right reasons in a way that both doesn't feel like selling and feels like the right thing to do for you and them.

Vit Muller: [00:15:05] Because if you have a service or a product that solves a problem and they've come to you, then they've come to you for a reason, plain and simple, right? So it's kind of like, if you don't, if you don't close them, it just means that you just didn't do well enough of a good job, to, to, to navigate them through, through that, a thought process to, in that decision-making, right, to make that commitment, to, to see it, to buy into it, to see the value of it, and then signing up eventually.

Jason Cutter: [00:15:35] Yeah. And, and I take that and put stronger language around it, which is if you have a qualified person who's in need or has a goal, right. They're in pain or they have a goal, right. Positive or negative, and you have the solution to help them. And you could help them as a professional or as a company or as a service.

[00:15:54] And you don't. Help them buy something that would help them. You failed them and you failed your duty and responsibility as a professional. and you've essentially let them down. And the example I use all the time and people laugh at it, but it's true because we can visualize it. Imagine, and anyone who's heard me knows this, I say it all the time.

[00:16:14] Imagine you have a broken leg. You go to the emergency room, you go to the doctor, they examine you, they test you, they look at it, they say you have a broken leg and here's a brochure. Here's my business card. You know, let me know if you want help with this, you know, I can follow up with you next week.

[00:16:30] I'll send you an email, you know, just let me know if this is something you'd be interested in fixing. Right. No, they would never say that that's ridiculous. They say your leg is broken, I'm going to fix it. It's going to hurt and then you'll get better. Do you have any questions? Hold on. Right? Like that's what they do.

[00:16:45]and so that's what a professional should do. And if you can help somebody. That's the way you should be operating as well. 

Vit Muller: [00:16:50] Yeah. Yep. Basically what you're saying here is that in sales, sometimes you need to be a bit more direct to your prescribing the solution rather than advising and asking whether they would want it because sometimes people are not, they don't know if they need it.

[00:17:05] They might not even realize they actually need it. So you need to prescribe it. But again, being, being ethical around it, not, not really pushing people in a corner and nothing like that. Another good example is fitness, right? I mean, this is, this is, this is my, my area, right? It's selling fitness. You're trying to sell fitness, program or personal training because you want to help those people.

[00:17:27] And they come to you for a reason. They are, they're stuck in their life. They have failed. They feel, they feel unfit. They don't feel confident with, you know, their, how they feel in their own skin. And they've come to you for a reason. And if you. If you just go and try and sell them, Hey, okay, this is how much it costs and let's get you signed up.

[00:17:48] You're not going to really going to do much of a good job, but if you're going to start with, you know, building that relationship from the start and you talk to them, you get to really take effort to listen to their problems, and, and, and really understand where they're coming from. Then you can match those needs with the solution, and then they're more likely to sign up.

Jason Cutter: [00:18:10] Right. And the key is, is to move that conversation forward. I mean, you said it earlier, somebody's talking to you because they're looking for help. They want help. They need a professional to guide them if they didn't. And sometimes people say, no, people don't want that. Yes they do. Because if they didn't need that, they would just order it online.

[00:18:29] Or they would've just walked in to let's say to your fitness club and literally walked in and signed up without needing to talk to anybody. Right. That's why, you know, If it's somebody just wants it, they can go on Amazon now or go online and just order it if they're talking to you, that's because they need help in making a decision.

[00:18:46] And so then it becomes your obligation as that professional and then the other thing to always keep in mind, and this is the part, this is the one thing to remember is that you, your job as a, on the sales side of any conversation is to remember that their biggest fear is the fear of change. People have fears and you know, of, of fear of making a mistake, fear of all this and that but fundamentally, when it comes to a buying decision, it's a fear of change.

[00:19:12] That's the top of it. And our brains are programmed to keep us safe in our comfort zone, making a change, buying something new or different is scary. And our brain wants to protect us and keep us alive. you know, thousands of years ago eating the wrong Berry meant that we could get sick and die and, you know, joining a club, hiring a fitness professional, hiring a coach, eating different.

[00:19:35] That's change, change equals death. That's all our brain thinks about. 


How to overcome the 'how much do you charge' objection 

Vit Muller: [00:19:39] There's also an example of, when people don't don't know much about the product or service and they just simply come to you and ask for the price. Right. That's a typical one, but let's unpack that. What is the reason behind that?

[00:19:54] Right. They don't know what to ask. So that's like a first logical thing to ask sometime. It's just that sometimes they're just literally shopping around for solution, but they don't really dig into, what the value is other than looking at the price, just the price. They're just a number they're making that decision on that.

[00:20:15] Right. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about typical objections and this is really good. One. How does, I think it will be used for a lot of listeners, lot of business people. How do you overcome this particular objection. Somebody rings you up. How much do you guys charge? 

Jason Cutter: [00:20:30] So this one is, is fun for me.

[00:20:33] And in fact, in the, in the book, there's a section about it. And I learned this one a long time ago when I was in the mortgage industry, the thing for salespeople to remember, and I've even told prospective people, this is prescription before diagnosis is malpractice. And I'll say that again, prescription before diagnosis is malpractice.

[00:20:52] You, if you went to the doctor, they wouldn't just give you a prescription without doing tests and examining and making a decision. Otherwise they would be in a lot of trouble. And so that happens a lot where people are just shopping on price. If you name a price, then you are now completely out of control.

[00:21:07] And you're hoping they see the value in it. And in my opinion, I label it this way. You've committed sales malpractice. You're just giving a diagnosis and a prescription to somebody, right. Without actually knowing what they need. and if that's the case, if there's one price for everybody, then that's not sales.

[00:21:22] Right. Then you're just like just handing out stuff. but for me, the biggest thing is I always say, I don't know. That's literally the answer I say all the time. What's the price going to be? I don't know. What do you mean you don't know? Well, I don't know. We haven't talked yet. I don't know what, what makes sense for you?

[00:21:34] I don't know what would be the best program for you? I mean, I don't even know if this is something that would be the right thing for you at all. And so I don't know what the price, well, give me an idea. I don't, I can't, if I give you a price, I could be high, could be low. It could upset. You could make you happy in and if it's low and then it turns out to be high, then you're pissed at me because you felt like it was a bait and switch.

[00:21:55] So I just honestly don't know. And then what I do and I'll stop here to explain it. But what I do is then go into a question. So I don't know what it's going to be. Let me ask you. So tell me about other times where you've joined gyms and what that's been like. Tell me about what your goals are. Tell me about what you want to do.

[00:22:11] Tell me how much you want to come in. Tell me what you're looking for in a coach. And again, I'm not going to give a number. And if somebody really pushes, I have a rule, like the third time they push for a number, I'll give them a number. I'll give them a range and I'll have that range be where the bottom of that range is probably what I'm going to charge them.

[00:22:28] So they'll be happy. So let's say if I set a hundred to 500 and I know it's probably going to be a hundred, their mind is hoping a hundred, and then I come in at a hundred and now I'm the hero. 

Vit Muller: [00:22:39] Right right now. And what are, what I like about that is that you, you deflect, that question, but before you deflect you also, there's a logical reasoning behind it.

[00:22:50] Like you said, look, I don't know. I can't give you that range or I can give you that price because I don't know what you need. I know what your needs are. I know we've got range of different offerings and they, you know, the different. Amount, right? So, so I really like it because that's that's uh, that's uh that's that's that ethical persuasion, right?

[00:23:06] Your, your logically explaining it, our logical brain understands it. You know, if I'm the one on the other side of the phone and you're telling me this, I'm like, well, it made sense. Yes. Okay. That's logical. That makes sense. Okay. Now and now you're asking me, so you kind of deflected that while now it's logical for me to give you that information so that you can give me better price.

[00:23:24] That's great. 

Jason Cutter: [00:23:24] Right. And, and, and I'll tell people that that's where memorizing that prescription before diagnosis is malpractice part is important because if somebody really pushes back and is like, no, I need a price. And it's like, I can't, I mean, it would be like going to a doctor and getting a prescription before, like, they'd be in trouble.

[00:23:40] I can't, I mean, let me, and then what I say, if they really are tough, just soften it up, say, Hey, let me do this. Let me ask you a couple of questions that I have. It gets some basic info from you. And then I'll be able to give you an idea on the price. So let me, let me ask you and then roll into it. Don't pause.

[00:23:55] Don't ask permission. Don't wait, don't do the deaf pause as I call it. Just roll into your questions, get your discovery gets your information. You need be the professional, be in charge, right? Like, cause again, here's the thing. I promise you, you throw out a price, they sign up. They're going to be terrible to deal with because it's only a commodity.

[00:24:15] They don't appreciate the value. If you give them price and you're wrong, they won't sign up. They're pissed. You, you lost it. Because you handled it that way, rarely ever wins. If you just go straight up on price, because there's no value.

Vit Muller: [00:24:28] As opposed, to really unpacking that whole value them really getting it, buying into it, really wanting it because now they see the whole value.

[00:24:39] Then it's actually a really pleasurable experience of completing that sell for them. Now they feel like, Oh, I've made the best investment. Now. They don't look at that number. They look at it as an investment. And when you talk about. which we'll get into the second, I guess, you know, a lifetime value of a customer and how long people stay and all that.

[00:24:57] Yeah. First impression is so important for, for any customer, any business, first impression out how they get onboarded in your program. It's, what's going to make them really love it. And that's resulting in so many other benefits, right, referrals and all that. But I just want to wind back a little bit as well before we get into that next step, because that is also exciting, but, I really liked the way you do it, because I haven't heard of that before saying I don't know the price.

[00:25:23] And so I really liked it because what I do, I usually say, look, I can't, I can't really tell you the price, because if I did just tell you the price of the bat, I don't know anything about you and you don't really know anything about what we do. I would do disservice and ultimately you've come here, because you need help.

[00:25:39] Is that right? I said, well, yeah, it makes sense. Or, or sometimes they push back, but yeah. So I like that. I like, that's a good one. I'm gonna use that. Yeah. That's a good thing. That's there you go. That's like, it's like a toolbox. You just have, you just have it just, I just added another tool into my toolbox.

[00:25:55] Another, another, another thing to use in my, in my, what's the, in the arsenal 

Jason Cutter: [00:26:02] in the arsenal. There you go. 

Vit Muller: [00:26:04] That's cool. 

Customer experience and how selling is an ongoing thing (not just to make $) 

[00:26:04] So let's, let's talk about, Customer experience because selling is not just what happens at the beginning in order to acquire that customer. Right. Selling is something that is as it doesn't just mean you got to sell in order to like sell something for X value of a dollar.

[00:26:22] Right. Sometimes you need to sell them on an idea and they may have become a customer. Now you still need to continue on selling them on an idea of, let's say, let's go back to fitness on changing their habits, eating healthier, seeing the value behind that. Right. Any other good examples? 

Jason Cutter: [00:26:42] No, I mean, I think that's important and I think there's two things and this is where I see a lot of sales people or people who are in their sales mode.

[00:26:51] Right. Again, if it's a fitness, professional selling is selling is the beginning of the relationship. It's not the relationship, right? Like if I sell you a car, that's the end of my relationship with you because now you have the car and now you're gone, right. If I'm signing you up as a client now, That's the beginning of our marriage for however long this thing lasts.

[00:27:12] And so one thing I see salespeople make the mistake on is they set the wrong expectations that can't be fulfilled or start the relationship off in the wrong way. And I use the analogy a lot with relationships and dating. I mean, you know, that's, if you set the right expectation of who you are and you're authentic, and this is how you operate and maybe you're messy, or maybe you leave the lights on, or maybe you have these other things, like if you don't share that with the other person, Then they're going to find out and it may or may not be drama.

[00:27:40] Same thing in sales, right? So you're selling somebody on what you're going to do for them. Make sure you're setting the right expectation. If it's going to be hard or they're going to struggle with making it in, or, you know, kind of the pitfalls that are going to happen, don't be afraid to set those things up and cover those people will appreciate that.

[00:27:56] You see a lot of people in sales. They don't want to mention the downside. And there's a downside literally in every product or service, right? Your service. If you're selling fitness might be 5:00 AM. That sucks. That's early. Most people aren't used to that, right. If that's what you're doing. So that might be a pitfall.

[00:28:11] And so address those things. And then remember that it's always selling every time, like say fitness from particular. You got to sell that person on showing up for the next. Then the next meeting, for doing the work for eating healthy, everything is selling and reselling and retaining. Like, it's always about doing this authentic persuasion sales process, like, and not even from a manipulation, but just like making sure your consta it's not autopilot once they become I'm a client.

[00:28:42] Yep. 

Vit Muller: [00:28:43] And also with that whole process comes marketing as well. Right. And marketing kind of goes hand-in-hand right. So then you might look at that as well. Like it's it's I guess. It's the same thing, like sales, like marketing and sales it's through and through every single step of that journey this year, you might be marketing them a new idea.

[00:29:01] Like I like to call it educational marketing, right. Where they've become a customer, but now you want to make sure that they really fall in love with that brand and have a thorough understanding of what's there on offer for them as part of the offering they've signed up for. Right. So they might sign up and you're going to do a series, an email, email series on, on like a welcoming series, right?

[00:29:22] So they, they start utilizing this and that. And ultimately, you know, that if people get engaged with all the aspects of the service, then they're going to get better results. And if they get better results, they're going to be more happier and if they're going to be happier, when it comes to that email asking for referral, they guess what you're going to get more referrals. Right. 

Jason Cutter: [00:29:45] Right. And, and 

Importance of consistent message across all aspects of your business so that customer's expectation is always met. 

[00:29:46] the big key that I always try to impress upon my clients, companies bigger or small is that it's one client, it's one customer and it's one conversation is how it should feel. So a lot of times there's marketing. Versus sales versus, you know, customer service, you know, long-term relational customer success.

[00:30:06]but it's one conversation with one person as you're moving through. So it's gotta be saying the same thing, right? Their impression of you and your brand or your company. It's gotta be the same feeling where they just, they know what they should expect. 

Vit Muller: [00:30:21] Hmm. Yeah. So the importance of consistency in, in everything, the way you, you, you informed them in your copy and your emails and, and the whole messaging, right?

Jason Cutter: [00:30:31] Yeah. And cause one of the challenges there's sometimes in organizations, there's a marketing person, then there's sales people. And what happens is marketing is telling one story and getting people excited. And then what happens is they might not be communicating that with sales, like what was done in the marketing or the emails or whatever, went out, their salespeople have a conversation on the phone or in person, and they're having their own conversation.

[00:30:53] Cause they think they know what they're trying to sell. But they don't realize there was a conversation already started in the head of this prospective client and they're, it's out of balance. It doesn't fit with what they heard and then it just becomes a mess and it's, then you're having to fight this customer to try to sign up, when you don't need to.

Vit Muller: [00:31:13] And they may have had different expectation. Good example is like doing advertising right. Where you're trying to understand that, like when there's so much noise, right. So much noise and you're trying to try to cut through the clutter. So you decided to do an advert with really sort of hyperbole copy, really pitching it in a painting that pretty picture using the NLP language or applying on the people's emotions and all that in order to get them interested, click and give you that and give you their contact details. Right? So, that's an inbound marketing, right? 

[00:31:49] In a way. 

Jason Cutter: [00:31:49] Yeah. So anything like that?

[00:31:50] I mean, that's the challenge, right? You've got this marketing piece, that's getting them hyped up, getting them excited and may or may not be true. Or even if it's true, it may not be what sales is then picking up and moving forward with that conversation. 

Vit Muller: [00:32:03] That's right. Yeah. So it's so important 


What's below the tip of the sales iceberg? If you want to have a scalable sales machine, there's many parts you've got to do, right. 

[00:32:05] now on your website.

[00:32:06] Oh really? Like the, the analogy of a, an iceberg. are you keen to unpack that a little bit? What that means for the listeners? 

Jason Cutter: [00:32:13] Yeah. So I call it the sales success iceberg and everyone's well, most people are familiar with icebergs. And the fact that what you see in an iceberg is above the surface is usually only like 10%.

[00:32:27] It's like five to 10%. And then when you look below the surface, there's this giant iceberg, and I'm not going to get into the science behind it, but most people know that. So if you look at the image, it's all what's underneath and you know, there's various other analogies where people use that for different things.

[00:32:41] I use that in sales because the iceberg in sales is that what you see above the surface. Is the closed sale, the closed transaction, the new client, the new customer. And that's what you see. And that's what everyone sees on the surface. That's what goes on the whiteboard when they ring the bell, you know, that's everyone high-fiving about is the sale.

[00:33:01] But what you don't see is everything below the surface, which is the marketing, the nurturing, the scripting, the conversations, the objections, the ripples, the lead points. Yeah, everything right from, from management to training, to corporate culture, to mission and vision and values. Like there's so many phases, things that have to go right to equal that sale, but everyone just focused on the sale.

[00:33:24] How do I get more sales? Well, you got to do all these other things or some aspect of them correctly. If you want to have a scale, you can get lucky every once in a while. But if you want to have a scalable sales machine, there's many parts you've got to do, right. to create that. 

Vit Muller: [00:33:39] It's like a, you know, your, your branding, your ecosystem of what you do and how you do it, right.

[00:33:44] It's gotta be consistent. Like you said, there's so much that goes into it.And that, and that, and that sort of brings us back to what you said at the beginning of that E-Myth of the book where you need to cover all basis. You need to be, you know, you have somebody who was really good as a technician in your business.

[00:34:00] You need to have a really good marketer. You need to have a manager, you need to have that entrepreneur and, and everybody working together in synergy. 

[00:34:09] By the way...

Jason Cutter: [00:34:09] a hundred percent. That's the way to succeed. 

Vit Muller: [00:34:12] By the way. I wasn't aware that there's a, there is a revision on E-Myth. So, because I quoted, that book so many times in my show here, I love that book.

[00:34:20] It's great. It's great.

Jason Cutter: [00:34:23] I think that one's, and for anybody that's in sales to business people, I always recommend reading that as well. because it helps you understand the mind and what they're struggling with, if you're selling to them because you can really help them. yeah. That's, it's such a great, it's such a great book. It's so fundamental 

How do you go about building your sales team

Vit Muller: [00:34:39] Now let's talk about sales. people. Because, again, somebody might be listening and they might not be very good at sales, but they have a business and they want to make it better. So they may be looking at hiring a team, what goes, and what's the ideal, recruiting for sales, sales, sales team.

Jason Cutter: [00:34:57] You know, if I had to sum it down without this being a three hour long episode for you. you know, I think the biggest thing is to look for people who go through your recruiting process in the same way you want them to perform in their sales seat. Right. Or in their sales role, people will always be the same.

[00:35:18] They can pretend all they want. They can put on a nice, shiny face and the good suit and try to, you know, use their best manners in the interview. But if you put them through enough paces, they will always show you who they are. They either talk too much. They talk to them, they ask questions, they don't ask questions, they follow up, they don't follow up.

[00:35:35] That's who they are. And I promise you when you hire them. And put them in that seat or put them at that desk or put them up in front of your store. They will be the same person. They only know who they are. And so what happens is you want to build your sales process similar to what you expect them or your recruiting process, similar to what your sales process is.

[00:35:55] If it's short, You could make it short. If it's long, put them through lots of paces, and then really pay attention. Do people follow up? I mean, I even know of companies where they tell people, people they want to hire. They'll tell them no, say no, we picked somebody else because they want to see who comes back afterwards and says, no, no, no, I am a good candidate.

[00:36:16] How can I get this job? What can I do to show you? Because I promise you. Customers will tell the prospects will tell them no. And that, and then do they fold and go sit under the desk or do they fight for the deal and say, no, no, you shouldn't say no. And here's why I promise you that's who you want.

Vit Muller: [00:36:36] That's I like that. That's really good. That's a really good one. I like that. It's a good little test there. 

Jason Cutter: [00:36:42] And I made that mistake early on when I was hiring salespeople, is this, this gentleman sat in front of me and was talking and talking and talking and I would ask him a question and he would talk for five plus minutes straight.

[00:36:54] He asked me zero questions. but he had a lot of experience. He had a great resume, seemed like a good fit. He talked a lot, so I'm like, okay, this should work out. Well, it's a telephone sale. So one call close it's about an hour long phone call. It should be great. He can talk, put them on the phone.

[00:37:08] Terrible. Absolutely terrible. Cause all he did was talk about himself. All he did was monologue. He never asked questions. His closing rate was terrible and I had to let him go because he did exactly what he did in that interview. And from that moment on, I learned like I pay attention when I'm interviewing somebody.

[00:37:24] Cause that's exactly who they're going to be. 

Talk less, listen more (but you must aim to sell, not just chat)  

Vit Muller: [00:37:27] Yeah. I mean, it makes sense. I mean, in, in sales you need to be a good listener too. Right? You can't just talk about yourself or whatever you talk about, but if you have a conversation, right. And if you, if you're the one who talks the most, Then that's not a good conversation to have because you're not really giving the opportunity to the other person to have their input 

Jason Cutter: [00:37:49] No and you know, the easy thing to remember is we have two years in one mouth. So listen twice as much as you talk. nobody cares about you seriously. Nobody cares about you or your opinion or your friends or your awards. Nobody cares. They care about themselves. So the best way to, to show them you care about who they are is get them talking, ask lots of questions, make them talk.

[00:38:10] If it's an hour long conversation, you don't have to say anything, right. Just get them talking. They will sell themselves. They will feel like you care about them because you actually listened. And you're the only person in their whole life who probably listens to them right now. And they will just want to buy from you because they feel like you care.

Vit Muller: [00:38:26] Now sometimes that means that conversation is going to be longer because you're giving it more, more, more focus, right? Giving it more effort you give in it. you're going through more questions and you're really giving that person opportunity to speak. So there's an interesting one because. With this one, because sometimes, businesses have a lot of leads, right?

[00:38:45] They come in through the, a lot of leads coming through and then that salesperson, if they don't have enough salespeople, they they're trying to get through all the leads. And then there might be sacrificing on the time they spend per lead or per conversation. Right. It's more important here having it have an, having a, a 10.

[00:39:02] Good quality conversation and having a better, you know, better conversion or just having a hundred leads and then showing, okay. Yeah. Follow up a hundred leads. But then conversion was really rubbish. 

Jason Cutter: [00:39:13] Results are all that matter, right? Is, is closed fields in this case, right? Same thing with sports. It doesn't matter how many shots you take in basketball.

[00:39:21] Did you guys win the game? Right? Some games you might take two shots. Sometimes you make, take 50 shots. Does it? It's all about what wins the game that day and same thing with sales. Did you close sales? Are you meeting the numbers? Are you hitting your goals, hitting your quota, making money? Is everyone happy?

[00:39:37] If the company is generating too many leads and you're stuck on longer phone calls that are effective and you're closing deals, that's a company problem. They got to dial it back because. They'll learn that they're wasting money on marketing or they need to hire more people. Yeah. but do whatever it takes.

[00:39:52] Now, the caveat with this and the part to watch out for is using that order-taker language. There's a lot of people who have long conversations, they're afraid to sell. They're afraid to move the conversation to an actual transaction. Yeah, no that's. Yeah. And so what happens is they chat and all of a sudden it, you know, half hour later, they're Facebook friends and they're talking about restaurants and are talking about life.

[00:40:14] And they've got nothing. you know, it's long conversations that result in sales all day, right? Like all do that all day. it's about quality over quantity. 

Vit Muller: [00:40:24] Yeah. 

Way to navigate, control and bring a sales conversation to a close 

[00:40:24] And there's a specific set of questions that you should be asking to navigate. And like you said, late, be in control of that conversation.

[00:40:31] You don't, you don't need to ask them about anything else. You really want to find out where they're coming from, what is their problem? Then you meet them halfway, you know, you're you respond back. To, to make them aware that you've listened to them. So they feel comfortable that you've listened. you repeat all those, their problems back to them, and then you provide a solution.

[00:40:48] You go through the program, you go through what the offering is, and then you've got those specific question. Okay. Well, is that something, what is that sound like? What you're looking for and you want to get the yes. And then you want to go into, I mean, I'm just sort of. Going off a typical script that we have in a gym.

[00:41:02] Right. But like you said, you know, the conversation is important to have that conversation and quality conversation go for it. If it's, if it takes longer, if you ask them a question and they keep on talking to, to unravel their answer, keep them talking because they're all really good golden nuggets. And while they're talking, you need to do only the only one thing and only is really pay attention.

[00:41:22] Maybe make notes so that you can then repeat it back to them just to summarize what you've listened. And then yeah, it makes you go for that sale. Right? I mean, it should be smooth if, if it's and, and the other really good thing is when you people, when you get people to talk is you, you get to find out, you know, the, the, the emotional desires their true, true why.

[00:41:42] And, and then when it comes to that sort of a last stage where you are going for the sale, you're starting to use those, you know, closed sale questions. you might get some objections, right. And. If you do all the, all the homework at the start. Well, overcoming that objection is actually quite easy because you can just come back to them and say, well, based on what you said, you know, it looks like it is really important for you to achieve X, Y, Z.

[00:42:12] So wouldn't it make sense to sign up or like yeah. Or like, you know, why would you justify looking at the prize? Just literally just the number that's goingto come out of your account over. this goal that you're trying to achieve, that you've told me that you've suffered, that you've struggled to achieve for last five years and making it's making you feel miserable.

[00:42:34] Right. It's an investment, right. Or like that, that, I mean, just that sort of stuff. 

Jason Cutter: [00:42:38] Yeah. And, and that's pure gold that you just talked about. and that's where a lot of people who are in sales, miss the Mark, because they don't actually know that they don't know why somebody should sign up and what the reasons are for them.

[00:42:52]and then when objections come up or price or anything comes up, they don't know how to tie it back to what they actually want. Right. You know, they, they, they don't have the ammunition. To confront those fears. Right. Cause it's just their fear of change that's coming up. So you just need to battle that because you know what they want, if you, if they told you, and then it just comes down to, Hey, you know, what would it be like if you were to lose weight or feel better or be healthy?

[00:43:16] Like what would that be like in your life? Oh yeah. I mean, does this map like, okay, well this seems like a lot of money. Let me ask you, what, what would it be like in your life? Let me just ask you, like, what would it be like and what have you tried before? What, you know, what happened last time you tried this on your own.

[00:43:31] Okay. So it seems like this would make the sense. And the only difference that I do a little different than what you say is I don't ask. I know I'm the professional. And so a lot of times it's asking for the close, I just say, you know, based on what you told me, this seems like the best thing for you to do.

[00:43:46]so the next step is I need you to fill out this form and then we'll get you set up and you just let me know when you want to begin, like next week or the week after. I'm not asking. I'm not asking. I'm just assuming. Right. So, cause I know cause I'm the professional and I care and I'm doing the best thing I can for them.

Vit Muller: [00:44:03] Mm. 

[00:44:03] Now somebody might still say, well, that's still sort of like very pushy. They still might feel like, Oh, this is very, you know, very direct. but I, I, I say no to that because, Again, they come to you for problem. You've solved it and like you said before, people sometimes it's that monkey brain, that little brain, that brain of fear is controlling them.

[00:44:25] And we are the ones who have to help them. Make navigate through it and make that decision. So, and sometimes you have to be directed. I love it. 

Jason Cutter: [00:44:32] Yeah. Cause you're the professional. As long as your intentions are pure, you want the best for them. You can actually help them. You're not selling them crap. They don't need, and you're a professional in some capacity, right?

[00:44:43] Whether even if you're just a sales person in a cubicle, you're a, you see yourself as a professional, then that in my mind, that's permission enough to move people forward with things that will help them. 

Wanna know more about sales? Check out 'Sales Experience Podcast' 

Vit Muller: [00:44:54] Hmm. Now we've covered fair bit about sales, and we've probably, could go more on as the things we could talk about, you know, average lifetime value of a customer and heap of other stuff and I enjoy talking about this stuff, but, for those of you guys listening, Jason actually has a podcast where he covers all this and it's called 'Sales Experience Podcast'. 

[00:45:15] So if you're interested in sales as a topic specifically, because my podcast is not specifically about sales, it's more about, you know, achieving success and it's more bigger picture, more broad, then go and check out the Jason's podcast. It's called 'Sales Experience Podcast' and he's got shorter episodes where he covers, you know, a little bits and pieces, little topics that are pertinent to sales.

One thing Jason wished he'd know earlier when he started his business 

[00:45:37] Now back to you, Jason, let's talk about you as a business owner and your journey, with your consulting business so far, what do you wish you had known when you started this? 

Jason Cutter: [00:45:49] so the biggest thing for me, if I could go back in retrospect and looking at it was to be more focused and really, Go into one niche.

[00:45:59] If I could, in the beginning, I wasn't sure what I want to do. The challenge I have is that everything in life is sales. I mean, I firmly believe that I can help anyone sell anything. Like I really know that because there's some fundamentals that apply to anything that you're selling. And so I, at first I tried to be everything to everybody.

[00:46:17] And so I went in a lot of different directions instead of being focused and, you know, that was just a journey. And then I started to get more focused and more niche. I think that's what everyone has to go through, but that would be the one thing is, you know, to, to, to. You know, a balance of trying lots of things.

[00:46:32] So you figure out what works in your business and the marketplace and strategies, but then also like finding your niche, finding your tribe, finding who you can really, really help. 

Vit Muller: [00:46:43] Excellent. That's some value bomb right there. So important to have that niche so important. And the other really good thing about that is once you, once you figure out what that niche is, when you start marketing, your cost actually goes down on cost per acquisition, meaning because you'd be more focused on the target audience, right?

Jason Cutter: [00:47:07] Yep. 

Active, healthy lifestyle, intermittent fasting, importance of not going too rigid with diets and how to improve your sales performance 

 Vit Muller: [00:47:08] Now I'd also like to, with these episodes of these interviews, I like to segue into fitness just a little bit. and it's more about like your own personal, you know, way, like how do you keep fit and, What that means for you? 

Jason Cutter: [00:47:22] Yes. So it's interesting. Cause my fitness journey, it's never really been about working out a lot.

[00:47:29] Like that's never been a big thing for me, working out and being fit like activity is always doing something. So something functional, more hiking and doing physical things than being in a gym. Although I have gone through those periods depending on what I was working towards. but for me, what I've learned the most is.

[00:47:47] You know, controlling of a diet. I, I, I wouldn't say I get away with, but I get away with not doing a lot of physical activity because I watch my diet. it started years ago, I used to eat six times a day because of low blood sugar. And I realized I was eating crappy food six times a day. And so that was the issue.

[00:48:06] And so I started doing intermittent fasting, you know, missing breakfast one day a week, which was crazy to me. And then I started doing it every day of the week and then fasting 24 hours a day, you know, every, every week and then doing 48 hours every quarter. I don't remember the last time I had breakfast.

[00:48:23] It's been probably eight years since I started kind of on that routine. And so I mostly don't ever eat breakfast. And, and then, you know, I focus on quality food when I eat and that, that really helps the most. And, that plus being active. 

Vit Muller: [00:48:37] Excellent. And as a result of doing that, your blood sugar levels have improved.

Jason Cutter: [00:48:41] It was the craziest thing. Again, I used to not be able to go anywhere without having a snack with me because I would start getting hangry blood sugar would drop. I get a, you know, get upset and maybe shaky. And now literally I could go 24, 48 hours on purpose. Right. But I can fast. For long periods of time, which when I tell people it's blowing them away, they're like, that's not possible.

[00:49:01] And I remember when somebody told me about intermittent fasting, he's like, I could not miss breakfast. He said, yeah, you shouldn't eat carbs. Like go paleo. I'm like, I can't not eat bread. Are you crazy? You have to eat bread. And, and now it's just totally different for me. 

Vit Muller: [00:49:15] So you don't eat bread, you don't need cups.

Jason Cutter: [00:49:17] I kind of go 80 20 with it. So I don't really need to be in like super shape. I've never had like serious like weight issues. And so I avoid it, but then I also will have it sometimes I'm not like strict, pure. Keto paleo, like no carb. but I'm just mindful of it. Right? I, I, I it's like finances. Right. I save over here so I can spend over here.

[00:49:39] So I generally eat well. And then if I want some bread or if I want pizza every once in a while it gets there, but it's not a regular thing. 

Vit Muller: [00:49:46] Yeah, good. So I liked it because I don't like that whole, and I've been really, really strict and rigid with your diet. I see so many problems with that. and in my career, like I've seen people, you know, they, they jump on these things and they might be really good at it for a few months, but it's not.

[00:50:01] It's hard. It's not, it's not something that you can, what's the word, 

Jason Cutter: [00:50:04] maintain, right? You can't keep it up. 

Vit Muller: [00:50:06] That's right. Yeah. 

Jason Cutter: [00:50:07] It's very hard. I think the key is, is like, why are you doing it? Same thing with business. Same thing with life. Same thing with sales, with coaching, with fitness training, with anything, the fundamental.

[00:50:17] And this is what I talk a lot about in the book. Where it's the authentic piece is why do you want to do it? Why do you want to get in shape? Why do you want to be healthy? Right. And that's where it's a lot of times it's like, well, cause I should, right. People tell me I should, I should lose weight. I should be better.

[00:50:33] I should blah, blah, blah. Instead of like, when I made that decision and I was like, I want to do this. Like, I feel like crap. I was working out twice a day and I still felt like crap. And I was like, I got to do something different and I hurt myself working out. And then I was doing nothing. Started doing paleo was in better shape, not working out than I was working out.

[00:50:52] And it was the easiest thing. And I've never looked back. It's never been a tough decision. It's somebody who has an addiction problem. Right. And they make the decision in their mind, why they want to stop drinking drugs, whatever relationships doesn't matter. And they don't need meetings. They don't need support, like instant switch.

[00:51:07] That's always the goal. 

Vit Muller: [00:51:09] And also you didn't become diabetic, which is a bonus. 

Jason Cutter: [00:51:13] I didn't, I stopped before that. And, you know, my family's fairly healthy, but not, you know, just normal American. but, yeah, I mean, I'm super thankful that I, you know, I made a switch early on. 

Vit Muller: [00:51:24] Excellent. Excellent. and so once again, for those of you guys who are listening, I hope you get lots of value out of this, and I'm hoping taking notes because Jason is dropping some value bombs here. So important to him to live, to live active, healthy lifestyle. Because if you, if you want to be a good performer, let's say you're a salesperson. If you want to be good performer at sales, well guess what, based on how your mood is. It's going to be a direct reflection on how many sales you're gonna close that day.

[00:51:54] I know it firsthand. I know, days where I feel shit because I had a bad sleep and I feel, I feel down. I feel like, I mean, how can I sell it? 

Jason Cutter: [00:52:03] Right? Oh, you got drama in your life. And there's, there's, you know, relationship issue or money issues or some kind of head, you know, something going on in your brain.

[00:52:11] It's totally messing with you so hard to like, switch that, get on the field and play a good game. It's just, it's hard. 

Vit Muller: [00:52:18] It's hard, but guess what, if you, if you exercise, you're actually going to make you become more disciplined with controlling those emotions because when you're physically more fit and you feel better, it's a lot easier to, overcome those problems, those stresses in life.

[00:52:33] And there's always going to be something happening in your life, right? 

Jason Cutter: [00:52:37] Yeah, for sure. 

How to get in touch with Jason 

Vit Muller: [00:52:39] And on that note, let's wrap this up. Jason, how can people find you? 

Jason Cutter: [00:52:43] The easiest and simplest ways. If you go to jasoncutter.com, on, there is a hub with the links for everything. So instead of all the various websites and programs that I have, if you just go there, Jasoncutter.com, it has my online course.

[00:52:56] It has how to order the book, how to schedule time with me. If you want to have a discovery conversation to see if I can help, to my stuff on LinkedIn, to other videos, to free ebook that I have. And any other courses, simplest way to go. 

Vit Muller: [00:53:11] Jason are we going to do, some special for the listeners? w we, we sort of, we haven't unpacked that a little bit.

[00:53:16] We should have talked about it before the show, but what are we going to do? 

 Jason Cutter: [00:53:20] So I have a course, in particular I have one and, depending on, you know, what I have at the time, you know, there's, there's various things, it's called persuading like a professional. So it's an online course. you know, a lot of times getting a coach is difficult.

[00:53:32] And so what I did was I took. Some of the stuff that we talked about, but expanded on it. And it's about two hours worth of videos online course. And so for your listeners, you know, as a item for them is if they use a promo code on there, they'll get 20% off that online course. 

Vit Muller: [00:53:49] Excellent. Excellent. So I'll mention a promo code, SUCCESSINSPIREDPODCAST, in the show notes.

[00:53:56] And for those of you guys listening there, you have it use that promo code, jump onto Jason's website. If you want to know more about sales, become better at sales, whether you're a sales person or a business owner who wants to have a stronger sales team and jump on that deal and get 20% off of Jason's program.

Jason Cutter: [00:54:15] Yep. 

Vit Muller: [00:54:16] Jason, once again, this has been really great having you on the show. I think w my, my initial intention of this interview was to really sort of go in depth on the sales. And I think we did that. cause I don't think I've had a, somebody on covering this topic so specifically, and I want it to, so this is great.

[00:54:34] It's been great. It's been great conversation. And I look forward to hopefully doing another, another interview soon. Maybe in a few months time to just to follow up and maybe drill down a bit more depth on the other areas of sales. 

Jason Cutter: [00:54:48] Yeah, mate, anytime you want to talk about sales I've, I've embraced the fact that I'm a sales nerd.

[00:54:53] I love talking about sales. I love helping people get better at selling for the right reasons. So anytime you want to talk again, and hopefully this was good, hopefully people will and got some gems out of it. And I appreciate you wanting to help your audience get better in all areas and being well rounded.

[00:55:09] So, thanks for having me. 

Vit Muller: [00:55:10] And ultimately it's all part of that success story, right? We need, we want to be all success, more successful in life, and it's like a formula one team. You need to have all the aspects working to perfection. So 

Jason Cutter: [00:55:25] That's it. 

Vit Muller: [00:55:26] There you go. Awesome. Thank you, Jason. You have a great rest of your day and I look forward to a catching up on the flip side.

Jason Cutter: [00:55:32] Thanks Vit