In this compelling Pivot Podcast episode, we explore effective Gen Z spiritual formation through the lens of campus ministry. Eric Huseth, Executive Director of Emmaus Campus Ministry at the University of Montana, shares how his team creates authentic spaces for students to explore faith on their own terms. Eric describes today's college students as assembling a "spiritual jigsaw puzzle" influenced by diverse traditions and profound cultural experiences.

Discover practical insights on sustainable ministry models, ecumenical partnerships, and how to communicate faith authentically to a generation with what Eric calls "the biggest BS meter imaginable." Whether you're in campus ministry or leading a traditional congregation, this conversation offers valuable perspectives on forming disciples among younger generations.

Hello everyone and welcome to the Pivot Podcast, the podcast where we explore how the church can faithfully navigate a changing world. I'm Terri Elton and I'm joined today with Dwight Zscheile So on the Pivot Podcast, we discuss what we believe are four key pivots that God is calling many churches to make in the 21st century. They're a pivot in posture from primarily focusing on fixing institutional problems to listening and discerning where God is leading, a pivot in focus,

from membership to discipleship, a pivot in structure from one size or shape fits all models of ministry to a mixed ecology of inherited and new forms together, and a pivot in leadership from predominantly clergy-led lay-supported ministry to lay-led clergy-supported ministry. Today, we're excited to welcome Pastor Eric Huseth, the Executive Director of Emmaus Campus Ministry at the University of Montana.

Eric brings a unique perspective on ministry with young adults, having served both in traditional congregational settings and now in campus ministry. At a time when many churches are wrestling with how to connect with younger generations, Eric and his team are creating innovative spaces for authentic faith formation and community building. They're listening deeply to students' real needs and questions. They're fostering genuine discipleship, and they're discovering new ways of being together

as church on campus. Welcome, Eric.

Thanks for having me.

So Eric, let's start with having you tell us a bit about the ministry context of the University of Montana. How big is the university? Who are the students? I want to know if you can see mountains from there. What can you tell us?

yes, you can see mountains. In fact, the university is just at the base of a very well-known mountain here in Missoula called Mount Sentinel. And the most traveled trail in Montana actually goes from the campus of the University of Montana all the way to the Big ⁓ that we call it. So yes, it's a beautiful, beautiful place to live.

and forestry are kind of the big programs that we continue to attract students for. And now since the kind of change, education is changing, and so the university has been much more focused in recent years on research, medicine, and attracting

actually international students for those causes. Even though about over just 60 % of students at the university are Montana residents or from the university or from Montana, that the population of international students has actually grown quite substantially in recent years. So it is a place of tremendous opportunity for ministry.

And how did you end up there?

That's a great question. So I'm actually in my second year of ministry with Emmaus. I was actually pastor of a small ELCA Lutheran congregation just outside of Missoula for eight years, which for many of your listeners who are doing their ministry, their first calls, that's actually quite a long stint to have your first call. But there's very unique congregation there.

And as part of the ministry that I was doing with that congregation, I came in contact with Emmaus Campus Ministry quite a lot and actually served on the board for a period of time. so when my predecessor decided to, after 18 years of being campus pastor, he decided to move on.

I felt, in fact, it was kind of funny, I was on sabbatical at the time. So it was kind of this like Holy Spirit thing of, is this what I'm drawn to? And decided to put my hat in the ring and sure enough, the Holy Spirit has led me to be with university students. And it's just a terrific place to be.

So what excites you about working with university students?

That's a great question, Dwight. know, university students are some of the most open, thinking, way of, they have this vision of the future that can be infectious at some points. I mean, you cannot sometimes be with these young adults.

and thinking about their lives and who they want to be. mean, these are people that have come through a lot already, which we can kind of get into in a few minutes, but they have this view of themselves and their identity in faith and in wanting to know, how do I fit into the world? And that...

is extremely exciting to me because it is an opening to walk with them in incredibly real and I'll have to say raw ways that is, it's just truly exciting.

So as you've engaged with these students, as you think about what are their spiritual questions or needs, what kind of comes to mind? And maybe bring us into some of those raw moments or those maybe significant moments. Maybe that's a better way to say it.

Hmm.

George Floyd. And then probably most significantly, you have these people face COVID while they were in high school. And so I use that as a context of this is—they've come through a lot already in extraordinary ways. And so that really, I think—

forms the basis of their spiritual identity and who their questions, their ponderings. So what you get in a lot of campus ministries, not just at Emmaus, but at campuses around the country are people that are feeling the, we'll just say the

the death and rebirth of institutional faith in the church. They are experiencing and pondering different, more than any other generation, voices from other traditions and other faith practices that is really forming this foundation of questions for, okay, how do I piece this together?

I think when it comes to your question of spiritual needs, you have to be OK with helping them in the jigsaw puzzle of their spiritual life. Some of those pieces are not going to go together as well as maybe they would expect.

of a campus pastor as I see it is to be walking with them in trying to piece a couple of these pieces together for what faith means and what the divine means for them in service of life and service to the neighbor.

So what does it look like to speak the gospel into some of those questions, yearnings, struggles, losses, things that they're experiencing? And can you share a story of transformation that you've witnessed in your ministry?

So, ⁓

There are lots of stories. So Ames has a history of leading what we call faith service trips over spring break. in fact, I just got back two days ago, we were in El Paso, Texas, and discovering what faith in action means on the US-Mexico border, which was very transformative.

But last year I led a trip and took some students actually to the streets of San Francisco. And as you can well imagine, especially for students that had never been there before, the city of San Francisco is just a lot. And there's tremendous ministry going on there.

There's tremendous intensity happening there. One of our students, I took them on what's called a street retreat. And so what you do is you encourage them to get in pairs and walk the streets for several hours and just observe what's going on. And he had an incredible story of walking one of the streets in San Francisco.

and he saw this scene of a man on the side of the sidewalk, clearly what we would refer to as unhoused. And on one hand, he was preparing himself to put some drug into his arm.

with a needle, and he had that in his hand. And in the other, he had, of all things, a Bible that he was reading. And this student, after sharing the emotional intensity of that scene, he came up to me. He's a social work major. And he said, Eric, I've decided to go to seminary.

I want to be a part of something bigger. And I was curious about this event. What changed? How did this really set fire to you? Where did you feel the spirit? And he said, you know, I realized that this man didn't have anyone

in between the needle and the Bible. He didn't have anyone to encourage him in that life that there's a different way and to help him understand and learn what the Bible means. And I want to do that. And so when you talk about, in getting to your question, Dwight, of how the gospel is

really speaking to some of these young people. I would say that the gospel is speaking in terms of service to the neighbor. Who is our neighbor? And particularly in polarized times such as these, students are really, really in tune to making a difference for the world. And if they

are not able to make as big of a difference as possible with this one track, they want to seek another track. And that is what I've run into time and time again, a story of transformation and of real seeing faith in action in a different way than perhaps a traditional congregation.

So I want to go there for a second. This is probably along the list of they didn't teach me this in seminary, you know, how to either speak the gospel into the lives of young adults, but certainly not to be responsive and come alongside a student in that context, right? Like that's a pretty intense moment. What would you say about where have you learned or how have you learned how to take

the good news of the gospel and like strip it of all the jargon, right? The churchy things, the cliches, the whatever. And speak it with, you know, what I heard is an authentic kind of in the moment leaning in, asking questions, not over preaching or not over making it about this religious thing.

but really about the heart of what's at the transformation that comes in a life of faith.

Yeah, I think that that's a really, really good question. In fact, it's kind of interesting as you were talking, Terry, I think that that kind of reminds me of, as a season of Lent, really, and, you know, the way in which we, and I hate the fact of,

Sometimes we refer to Lent as like, well, I'm going to give up chocolate or something. It really has to do a lot with when we remove all of the stuff, what is left? What is at our core? And so in that same realm, when you talk about taking all of the aspects of the fluff from biblical story,

and what is left. think that there's a few things. So the first thing is that I'll tell you right now that the students that I work with particularly have the biggest BS meter that you could probably imagine. And what I mean by that is that if you are not

modeling the radical story of Jesus in your own life, that's going to be sniffed out. And you are going to run into some resistance. You're going to run into people just not showing up. So when you talk about and you read, when I do occasional Bible study,

on different stories of the gospel. It's kind of funny. We recently actually did a study on the book of Jonah and the beautiful way in which Jonah, the reluctant prophet of sin, and then against his own will he is irped up by this fish, and he goes, and he preaches the shortest

crappiest sermon that anyone knows in the whole Bible, and yet there's this response. It's kind of funny how a lot of, when really pivotal moments, if you can bring pivotal moments of scripture into students' lives right now. I can't tell you how many students I had when they kind of were reading this.

And Jonah is a funny book, right? It has these like humor. And how many of the students were like, my gosh, this is like, this is me. I mean, this is like, this is how, you know, I feel a lot. And yet, you know, I don't know what I'm going to do tomorrow. And yet it feels like I could kind of get irped up by the fish or, somewhere. And so modeling that insane, you know,

That's awesome. Let's see, let's have a moment of ritual, of quiet, that's unstructured, that's un-, and see where it takes us. See, kind of see where that leads to. That's, think, getting to your question, Terry, of how do we strip away and really form the basis of essentially what you're asking, what is the radical story of Jesus about?

death, resurrection, and if you can tease out things for them to chew on and for them to think about and for them to live, that's how you get traction.

So your ministry made an interesting financial decision to purchase apartments that help actually subsidize the campus ministry. Tell us about that decision and how it's impacting your sustainability. Because I know that many campus ministries do struggle with the overall business model.

Yeah, that's a great question Dwight. Being a campus ministry is hard from a financial aspect. Being in the way of students, your congregation is not able to quote unquote give.

if we're talking about the traditional structure of congregations, right, that can, in the United States, congregations give to pay their pastor. I mean, I'm sure you remember when you were in college and had about, you know, two pennies in your pocket. That's about how much these students have. And absolutely, right? Students, by the very nature, are financially stretched and strained.

Too many frozen pizzas. That's what I remember.

and are what I would argue even more so in this time. So you have a ministry that's based then on a congregation that cannot support you. how do you, financially that is, so how do you deal with that? And there are a lot of creative ways that the campus ministries try to fund themselves. Probably the most common way

is for a campus ministry to be a part of a church, for example. the individual congregation has a program that is run by maybe if it's a large program, a full-time associate pastor or something of that nature. And they are the ones from the congregation that are commissioned to go onto campus and to do ministry.

That can be a really good model. That can also have drawbacks because we all know pastors, I'm sure your listeners are well aware that pastors are stretched in congregations quite a bit. So you have other models of campus ministries. Emmaus being one of them. And we are what you would probably term as a campus-mentory center.

one of the congregations here in Missoula, St. Paul Lutheran. And these incredible, faithful women decided that we needed to have a presence on the University of Montana campus. And so they went around and they hired a bunch of, they took coins and money and they were able to hire a part-time pastor. And this pastor then lived in an apartment in a house close to campus. And that's how things got started.

You fast forward today through many different stories, but we were able to actually purchase that house that that original pastor had the apartment in all those years ago. And on top of that, we shared a second house next door with at the time a bunch of different ministries that

So we own two properties, two houses outright. have 11 students that actually live on the premise of these two properties. And that's made up of different community, individual bedrooms that share a community kitchen. We also have some apartments that we have created in the basement or upstairs that students share as well. So it's kind of a mixture of housing. And so,

What that has allowed us to do then from a financial standpoint is to be more stable in students paying rent. And so we strive to be a ministry that seeks to be slightly below market rate because we feel that that's really important to serve students. But from our standpoint, we feel that the ministry really thrives when you actually have residents

Bye.

But that's our challenge, right? And there's no silver bullet to funding ministries, and we all know that. And that's what we feel as a model has been really sustainable for us.

Yeah, I appreciate that and very forward thinking people a long time ago to do that and that has set you up for some opportunities today.

Yep, we stand upon the shoulders of those who have come before. And at least in Missoula, you'd be probably, maybe even surprised, but there's a huge Lutheran community out here in Missoula, Montana, that were very open-minded and progressively thinking in terms of what is next. And that continues.

Yeah. So

let's talk a little bit about the collaborative ministry model or arrangements that working that you have with several churches in the area. Can you say a little bit about that partnership and how does that contribute to kind of ministry with young adults and in two ways, right, for the young adults as well as for the congregations?

Yeah, so as I kind of alluded to, we are not just a Lutheran ministry anymore. We are actually an ecumenical ministry. mean, I'm an ELCA pastor, obviously, and we are very much Lutherans. Lutheranism is the guide of definitely what we do. But we are also supported by the UCC Church, the Episcopalians.

as well as the United Methodists. And what I think that has really led to is, well, a couple things. So the first thing is you have these traditions that vary slightly. We're diverse church, but have come together to say, you know what, we really care about

students' students' faith, and how seeking and serving students can also serve the church. And there's tremendous amount of collaboration between the ecumenical partners in Missoula to do just that. And so what I find, you know, we do not, it may surprise you, but we don't have Sunday worship.

And that's actually by choice. The reason for our programming really happens on Wednesday night. We have dinner, we have conversation. I try to go kind of like every other week in doing some kind of worship ritual and doing some kind of topic discussion. And that always happens over food when you work with university students. You always have to have some draw of free dinner. But that...

that really forms the basis of our community, along with service and trips and all of that stuff. But what I have found is doing this in the right way of encouraging students, going with them at some points, to be involved in our partner churches. That has been so cool to see.

and we have four or five different churches that are direct partners with us who have three or four of our Emmaus campus ministry students who are serving communion, who are helping with worship prep and doing music. We have one at the UCC church who's actually helping with being a youth director.

What I have found is that if you have the right way of seeing ministry on those Wednesday nights and conversations with Tripp's and all of that, then opening it up to partner churches really allows the students to say, you know, really connect with these people at Emmanuel Lutheran Church. And that's my church. That's where I worship.

And I think that that has led to some really amazing programs that we have actually started to begin with intergenerational ministry, that a lot of campus ministries, when you worship on Sunday and just doing a student's worship every Sunday, you lose. And that is, that's something that we're trying to work at. And I think that's just the power of collaboration.

So how do you balance maintaining Christian distinctiveness while also creating some welcoming spaces for students of various kinds of backgrounds? And in your context of Montana, I'm curious how rural urban divisions or dynamics might play into that as well.

Yeah, so we definitely have that. In fact, the rural-urban separation in our state. In fact, I know you all are broadcasting from Minnesota. And I grew up in Min—you do. Absolutely you do. And I grew up in Minnesota. I would just add that in Montana—

We got a little bit of it here too. Uh-huh.

Because our geographical area is even bigger than Minnesota, you get what, you get even past the term rural. You get what I would argue as frontier. And that is communities in very, very rural Montana, communities of 150, 200 people, all of them ranchers or farmers or whatnot.

and very small and they are two hours from the nearest you know Starbucks and so that to me is real interesting dynamic. You also have a really larger proportion of our indigenous siblings.

who are living in very, very frontier rural parts of Montana that are a part of the university community and part of our campus ministry. So in that kind of realm of trying to bridge the divide, if I'm hearing your question right, Dwight, I think that there's a couple...

couple things. The first is that we are a ministry that is one of many on the University of Montana. In fact, I think I counted 12, 13, 14 ministries that are all registered with the university student government. But we are really the only

ministry that seeks to be open, inclusive, and safe for LGBTQ folks. fly a LGBTQ flag when I'm tabling. And we also have a very, very unique way of seeing biblical scripture in how we teach and how we live. And that is

some of the things in how I try to, when I'm tabling on campus, for instance, next to these other Christian groups, in our distinctiveness. The way I'm hearing your question is, what does Lutheranism, what does that tradition bring to this conversation in this rural, urban, diverse era that we live in? And it is not—

apologizing for who we are. think the Lutheran tradition brings a ton of value to students. And being forefront about that, of saying, you know, we see biblical scripture written in context, and how do we see the power of story. And getting to that modeling aspect and the BS meter, we see the primary

primary teaching of the Jesus story is death and resurrection and celebration to serve the neighbor. So many of our students then come asking questions of our campus ministry, of Christianity in general, because they've been on one of our trips, because they have come to one of our retreats. hear, you know, I took 23 students

last fall up to Flathead Lake, which is a big lake about two hours away, beautiful part of Montana. And about half of those students were international students. And the reason why they signed up was because they heard that we were going sailing. So I want to check that out. Yeah, sure. And then we talk about the Jesus story and that, So it's this dance of being authentic, being...

beautiful part of Montana.

and how do we then incorporate some of these fun activities, some of these ways of being together and practicing community with our distinctiveness as Lutherans.

I love that. Let's close with what gives you hope about the future of faith when you work with these young people.

Can I share a story? So when I was I was tabling this last fall on campus like I was talking about before and it's kind of funny when we we table talking about the BS meter you know we have

I would love it.

We have the LGBTQ inclusive flag there. And we have a bunch of like, you know, pictures and stuff. I get a couple groups of students. get students that come up and say, my gosh, thank you. I did not realize that there was a Christian ministry that where I could feel safe. And thank you for being a part of the campus life. And then there's this other group of students that come up and

They, it's almost like they pose the gotcha questions of, yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay, you're going to fly the inclusive flag, but I bet that you're not who you say you are. And so I had one of these students come up to me this fall, and I could tell in her eyes that she was asking, okay, who you are and blah, blah. And she asked me, she said, okay.

Let me tell you, I am lesbian. I come from rural Montana and my family does not value who I am as an open lesbian individual. And in fact, when I was 13, I was raped.

I was raped by my cousin. And I went to my parents and I told them about that. Instead of going to the police, instead of opening up an investigation, they told me, well, it'll teach me a lesson. And word got out from that, according to her. And the church leadership heard of this happening by which the cousin

told the leaders that she was the one that came on to him.

And instead of, again, going to the police, instead of opening up ways and channels of support, they banned her from coming for the reason of having sexual intercourse before marriage. And they did not ban the cousins, which she told me. And she said to me,

So am I really well?

in your ministry.

I had to collect my jaw off the ground when she told me this. And I said, you may not believe me, you may not really want to have anything to do with me, given that experience, and I understand that. But I want you to know something, that you are invited, and that you are invited to

our place and that you will be valued and that you will be safe and that you will learn a way in which to see the divine as a loving presence for you. And so she took me up on that offer and is now one very involved with our community. So

When I tell you that, I tell you that in two ways. I tell you that for our congregations to know that our young adults, it's not just let's get the right pizza party and get them in the seats of the pews. We are dealing with trauma, huge spiritual trauma.

among young adults and university students. And I want that to be known too, that we work with that every single day. That story is not an uncommon one. And number two, however, where I find hope is students even in that mess, she still took a risk on the invitation.

And I continually see that, the invitation to students, students thinking about, know what, this can work. I can do this. We can make this happen. creative ways of thinking, creative ways of being. so that to me is what gives me so much hope from the younger generation, despite all that they face.

and all the challenges that are with them. They still take the risk. They are still willing to be a part of genuine, authentic community. We just need to be able to invite them in a beautiful way.

Yeah, thanks for that story and the power of the gospel to transform and our longing even in our huge trauma and brokenness to take a risk. I think the sense of community that embodies the gospel that you talked about is so powerful.

Amen.

Eric,

thanks for joining us and giving us a little understanding of what campus ministry looks like in Montana and just helping us think about new ways of being church and forming disciples in these kind of crazy years of the last 20 years. As you were going through that list, I'm like, yeah, that's a lot. I hadn't kind of put all those things in a string of events and thinking about the formation of our young people today. So thank you.

for inviting us into that today.

You're very welcome. Thank you for having me. It's been wonderful to share some stories with you all.

And to our audience, thank you for joining us on this episode of Pivot. To help spread the word about Pivot, please like and subscribe if you're catching us on YouTube, or if you're listening, leave a review on your podcast platform. It really helps. And the best compliment you can give us is to share Pivot with a friend. So for this week, this is Terri Elton and Dwight Zscheile signing off.