Shownotes
Dianna Muller joins State of the Second to explain the strategy behind the teal shirts and the slogan that defines her work: educate, not legislate. A retired Tulsa police officer turned professional competitive shooter, she walks host John through how she went from ignoring politics for most of her adult life to founding the DC Project and Women for Gun Rights. The turning point came when she stood in front of a congressman and asked whether professional shooters should be doing something to educate the people in that building. After Virginia fell in 2019, she realized the real fight was in the states, and she asked the women who had been coming to Washington to go home and meet their own legislators as gun owners.
Much of the conversation is about why the other side keeps gaining ground. Muller argues that groups like Moms Demand Action are intentional, organized, and funded, citing a roughly 60 million dollar annual budget on their side against a David and Goliath gap on hers. She points to the Biden administration's Office of Gun Violence Prevention as government money that helped states write red flag laws and universal background checks, and she describes asking the White House for a Second Amendment counsel so the movement's organizations can strategize and row in the same direction. Her answer to the funding gap is participation: become a 40 or 50 dollar member of every Second Amendment organization, take one new person to the polls, and show up for the midterms.
The episode closes on practical advice and a personal mission. Muller pushes listeners to be intentional, to study the arguments so they can actually answer why someone needs an AR-15 or why universal background checks are a bad idea, and to keep talking to people and media outlets even after being burned. She makes the case that women can carry the gun-rights message in a way legacy voices cannot, wants firearms and hunter safety education back in schools, and frames competition's pseudo stress as the real training that translates to carrying. She also shares the big announcement: Women for Gun Rights is moving to a paid membership model and launching a 501(c)(3) called Women for Gun Safety to reclaim the word safety, because in her words guns make you safer.
Questions this episode answers
What does the teal shirt 'educate, not legislate' strategy actually mean, and where did it come from?
It is the message on the signature teal shirts worn by Dianna Muller's DC Project women, who meet legislators as gun owners to educate them rather than push new laws. The idea grew from Muller asking whether professional shooters should be educating the people inside government buildings.
How did a retired police officer and competitive shooter end up founding the DC Project and Women for Gun Rights?
Dianna Muller spent 22 years with the Tulsa Police Department before retiring to shoot professionally, and she ignored politics until she stood before a congressman and realized shooters needed to educate lawmakers. She built the DC Project around one woman per state, then took it to the states as Women for Gun Rights.
Why does Dianna Muller say women can carry the Second Amendment message more effectively than traditional gun owners?
Muller argues that women can carry the Second Amendment (2A) message in a way legacy voices cannot, reaching audiences that traditional gun owners struggle to reach. She pairs that with a personal mission to build firearms that actually fit women rather than 'shrink it and pink it' versions.
How big is the funding gap between gun-rights groups and organizations like Moms Demand Action?
Muller describes a David and Goliath gap, citing a roughly 60 million dollar annual budget on the other side, and calls groups like Moms Demand Action intentional, organized, and funded. She says government money under the Office of Gun Violence Prevention helped states write red flag and background check laws.
What is a Second Amendment counsel and why is Muller asking the White House for one?
It is a coordinating role Muller has asked the White House to create so the movement's organizations can strategize and row in the same direction. She frames it as a way to close the organizational gap with well-funded, intentional opponents on the other side.
What can an ordinary gun owner do before the midterms to make a difference?
Muller urges participation: become a 40 or 50 dollar member of every Second Amendment (2A) organization, take one new person to the polls, and show up for the midterms. She also says to study the arguments so you can answer why someone needs an AR-15 or why universal background checks are a bad idea.
How should you actually contact your legislators, and who should you ask for when you call?
Muller tells gun owners to meet their own state legislators in person as gun owners, the same model that built the DC Project. Her point is that it is not enough for you to know their name; they need to know your name.
What new organization and membership changes is Women for Gun Rights launching?
Women for Gun Rights is moving to a paid membership model and launching a 501(c)(3) called Women for Gun Safety. Muller says the goal is to reclaim the word safety, because in her view guns make you safer.
Chapters
- 00:00 — Meet Dianna Muller and the road to advocacy
- 02:01 — The teal shirts and educate, not legislate
- 02:41 — A David and Goliath funding gap
- 03:12 — Paid membership coming in 2026
- 05:01 — Why women carry the message differently
- 07:42 — Government money and the fight in the states
- 10:57 — Be prepared to have the hard conversations
- 14:20 — Thirty years of the anti-gun message
- 16:14 — Take one person to the polls
- 19:07 — Building guns for women, beyond shrink it and pink it
- 22:25 — Winning hearts and minds in Virginia
- 28:55 — Soapbox: frustration with Republicans in power
- 31:37 — How to actually contact your legislators
- 42:46 — Firearms education and hunter safety in schools
- 51:13 — The 501(c)(3) reveal: Women for Gun Safety
About the guest
Dianna Muller is a retired law enforcement officer, professional competitive shooter, and Second Amendment advocate, best known as the founder of the DC Project and Women for Gun Rights. She spent 22 years with the Tulsa Police Department before retiring a little early to shoot professionally after picking up sponsorships. She started the DC Project by inviting one woman from every state to meet their legislators in Washington as gun owners, then expanded the effort to the state level under the Women for Gun Rights name. She shoots three gun: rifle, pistol, and shotgun.
Key quotes
"You'll see our signature teal shirts that say educate, not legislate." — Dianna Muller
"I want to be safe, and disarming me doesn't make me any safer." — Dianna Muller
"I love people when they say I don't pay attention to politics, but politics pays attention to you." — Dianna Muller
"It's not enough for you to know their name. They need to know your name." — Dianna Muller
"We're trying to take back that name because guns make you safer." — Dianna Muller
"But for the most part, girls don't care. We just want stuff that runs." — Dianna Muller
Transcripts
Welcome to the State of the Second podcast.
Speaker A:My name is John.
Speaker A:Today we're joined by Diana Mueller, a retired law enforcement officer, professional competitive shooter and second amendment advocate, best known for the founder of the DC Project and Women for Gun Rights.
Speaker A:Diana, thank you for joining us.
Speaker B:Thanks for having me.
Speaker A:So explain kind of your background and how you got into, you went from, you know, the law enforcement side, the competitive shooting side and then getting into that to a advocacy space.
Speaker B:Well, I think like a lot of Americans, I did not pay attention to politics for the majority of my adult life.
Speaker B:So I spent 22 years in Tulsa Police Department.
Speaker B:I retired a little bit early because I was start, I had started shooting and it was becoming, I was sponsored and it was becoming a little bit more lucrative.
Speaker B:And looking back on it, it was just a God thing, like he shut the door and he opened another door.
Speaker B:I made a hobby, a second career out of my hobby and started shooting professionally.
Speaker B:And I was doing that, living high on the hog.
Speaker B:And about a year later, the Lord put it on my heart, put me in a place where I was in front of a congressman.
Speaker B:And I said, is there something that we should be doing as professional shooters to help educate the people in this building?
Speaker B:So that was the original, you know, light bulb moment.
Speaker B:And as much as I resisted, I wanted to do something.
Speaker B:And we started the DC project.
Speaker B:We, we invited one woman from every state to meet me in Washington D.C. and meet their legislators as gun owners.
Speaker B:And as much as I resisted starting another organization, full blown organization.
Speaker B: e first time Virginia fell in: Speaker B:So I asked the girls that have been coming to Washington D.C. to go back to their home states and do something similar at the state level.
Speaker B:Go meet your legislators, show up at festivals.
Speaker B:That's when the teal for two a kind of came in.
Speaker B:You'll see our signature teal shirts that say educate, not legislate.
Speaker B:And as my advocacy grew, I saw moms demand action with their red signature shirts and how influential they were and how effective they were and how well organized they were.
Speaker B:And I really think that that's our niche is to countering groups like that.
Speaker B:You know, Bloomberg saw how important the female voice was to speaking about guns and he got in, you know, he got in behind them and, and got them under every town.
Speaker B:And they are like a 60 million dollar annual budget.
Speaker B:I can tell you that we are significantly less than a $60 million budget.
Speaker B:So it's definitely a David and Goliath situation.
Speaker B:But women for Gun rights now.
Speaker B:Now when we went to the states, we went ahead and named it something a little bit more appropriate than the DC project.
Speaker B:So now we have a full blown organization.
Speaker B: And what's new in: Speaker B:So as much as I have resisted having another organization in this space, I, I have, I have accepted the fact that we are a, we are a full blown organization.
Speaker B:We're going to go to a paid membership model which not, you know, I hope everybody looks at paid membership models like I do.
Speaker B:Like I try to throw money everywhere.
Speaker B:At least be a $40 member, 40, $50 member of all the Second Amendment organizations because that's not a huge investment and it helps them out so much.
Speaker B:So that's where I'm hoping that we're going to get infused with some funds and some revenue that will be able to magnify our message.
Speaker B:And that's where we are at with Women for gun Rights.
Speaker B:And there's a little bit of secret.
Speaker B:We, there's some.
Speaker B:But wait, there's more.
Speaker B:But we'll get into that in a minute.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean a lot of people look at gun rights organizations and, and go, why are you not doing more?
Speaker A:Why are you, you know where it is.
Speaker A:It does come down to the cash flow, unfortunately.
Speaker A:So you have to go kind of go into that membership model to get the flow because like you said, you're competing against every town and Bloomberg and the millions of dollars they pump into this to preach their anti gun message.
Speaker B:Exactly.
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Speaker A:So as you've seen this rise of female gun ownership and things going around, females, are you seeing more push on the state side from females to get more program legislation and how does that look for the future from your side?
Speaker B:Well, I think that that's why Women for Gun Rights is so important, is because we can speak to the Second amendment in guns and gun ownerships more than you can.
Speaker B:They've demonized the white guys and stereotypical gun owners.
Speaker B:So I think that's why our voices can be a little bit more impactful than your traditional gun owner.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And we can speak to people that legacy organizations cannot.
Speaker B:You know, everybody wants to be safe, and that's the bridge that we take is, you know, I want to be safe, and disarming me doesn't make me any safer.
Speaker B:So when you hear that from me, it's a little bit different than hearing it from you.
Speaker B:You know, you're a big guy, you can take care of yourself.
Speaker B:People don't expect you to have to have a gun to take care of yourself.
Speaker B:But when I'm going up against somebody like you, I was a cop, I can fight somebody my size and still get my ass whipped.
Speaker B:So I'm, I am definitely creating distance and being armed is going to be helpful to me.
Speaker A:So how do we kind of rewrite the narrative of women and gun ownership and showing that they are this, the next generation of gun owners?
Speaker A:Because we're seeing this big movement.
Speaker A:So how do we rewrite that narrative that gun ownership is just not white males, it's everybody?
Speaker B:Well, I think we have to be intentional.
Speaker B:And that's what I see from the other side.
Speaker B:The other side is very intentional about their strategy, their marketing, their structure, and they're organ, you know, they organize so well.
Speaker B:And you can see it going on, whether it be the BLM riots or, you know, there's somebody's putting money behind that to spread the message, get the eyeballs on the news at night and make it seem like everybody feels this way.
Speaker B:So with our limited budget, and I say our limited budget, but even collectively we have a limited budget because people don't give, you know, we don't go after the in, you know, we don't have NGOs, we're not going.
Speaker B:We don't get those government funds.
Speaker B:If, if you remember during the Biden administration, they had the Office of Gun Violence prevention, that was a 1 point or 1.2 billion if I remember correctly.
Speaker B:Office for four years that pumped money, that money into the states to run anti gun laws through their states and help them write red flag laws, help them write universal background checks.
Speaker B:So when Trump came into office, I was sitting there looking at that and I'm like, oh, please, please, please.
Speaker B:And I started calling around the legacy organizations.
Speaker B:I was like, guys, let's ask them to rename this the Office of firearms education and violence prevention and just shove it right back down their throats and then use that money that they use to run the ball down the anti gun side to turn it around and maybe use it for some education pieces and things like that.
Speaker B:So ideally that would have happened.
Speaker B:It didn't.
Speaker B:It got doged right away and.
Speaker B:But those are the kind of things I'm, I'm currently asking the White House for a second Amendment counsel.
Speaker B:I think that that would be wise for not only the administration, but I think it would be wise for our side because all of the second amendment organizations could kind of get in the same boat, discuss what we are all good at, and then grab an oar and row in the same direction in the same boat as opposed to sometimes it feels like we're in.
Speaker B:Everybody's in their own boats going in their, their own directions.
Speaker B:Maybe sometimes in the same direction, but we could get there faster if we worked as a team.
Speaker A:No, I couldn't agree more with that.
Speaker A:Now I'll ask you this.
Speaker A:Every town has really taken a step in trying to combat our push to protect the second Amendment with their own firearms training.
Speaker A:I want to get your opinion on that because I've read some of their stuff.
Speaker A:It's out there.
Speaker A:But for them to go into firearms training and try to take some of the, what we would call the fringe or in the moderate, the middle people, how do you feel that we have to combat that from a 2A community?
Speaker A:Because now they're going to train them and then preach their rhetoric.
Speaker B:Well, I don't know how we combat that, but whenever I get to speak to people I can say that I have experience with firearms and I have experience with violence as a police officer.
Speaker B:So you know, listen to.
Speaker B:I just wish I could have an audience with all of mom's demands membership because I feel like if they could just hear another message that guns make me safer and guns can help you protect your family and protect your kids.
Speaker B:That's the message that they don't hear.
Speaker B:So I think that we are up against the conglomerate of the mainstream media and the social media tech giants.
Speaker B:And it's just really up to us to work hard to push through that.
Speaker B:The censorship, the discrimination and you know, reach who you can reach locally.
Speaker B:But that's why I think it's so important for us to educate our base on what to say.
Speaker B:Like if you're a member of goa, if you're a member of Women for Gun Rights, you know, what can I do to reach my friends, my families and My neighbors, and actually give them practice points, talking points, things like that.
Speaker B:Be prepared, encourage them to have conversations.
Speaker B:You know, everybody.
Speaker B:It's a lot easier to just say, you're crazy and I'm not going to talk to you and I'm not going to have this conversation.
Speaker B:But I have so much respect for those people that are out there on the streets doing the man on the street interviews, because that takes some guts right there.
Speaker B:Like, I don't know, I don't even feel comfortable doing that.
Speaker B:But, you know, when you're talking, when you're talking about your family and your friends, you should be able to push a little bit into the constitutionality of the Second Amendment.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think that's something that we've lost over the last 20 years, maybe 10, 10 to 20, where that conversation that we used to have as a community and come together and be like, well, I don't agree with you, you don't agree with me, but we can still be friends.
Speaker A:I think that that rhetoric that's been pushed by the far left, that it's our way of the highway.
Speaker B:Bullying.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It just needs.
Speaker A:It's kind of ruin what.
Speaker A:What we would call a sense of community.
Speaker A:And I've talked about this before, but where I live, it's a very big transplant town in Phoenix.
Speaker A:And I don't know most of my neighbors.
Speaker A:I know one of them where I lived in Ohio, we knew all our neighbors.
Speaker A:You talk to them.
Speaker A:How do we move forward and continue to build that sense of community?
Speaker A:And how do we repair this bullying and go, hey, we can actually have a conversation.
Speaker A:We can disagree, but we can also be friends?
Speaker B:Well, I don't know how much of that is on us.
Speaker B:All I can encourage our side to do is to be prepared for those conversations.
Speaker B:And that's why I think goals is such a great opportunity for.
Speaker B:I love the education piece.
Speaker B:I know there's speakers, but there's an education piece of, like, how do I talk to my friends, my family, my neighbors about the Second Amendment and really preparing them, you know, hey, be prepared to get called names.
Speaker B:You know, they're gonna.
Speaker B:This is, you know, practice, practice while you're driving down the road.
Speaker B:You know, what if somebody asks me about why does Anybody need an AR15?
Speaker B:If you can't answer why anybody needs an AR15, then there's room for you to grow.
Speaker B:You know, if you can't.
Speaker B:If you can't answer why universal background checks is a bad idea, there's room for you to grow there.
Speaker B:If we, if we don't know.
Speaker B:I always compare this about, you know, being a Christian and talking about Christ.
Speaker B:If you don't go to church, if you don't read the Bible, if you don't know anything about Christ, you can't be a disciple for Christ.
Speaker B:If you don't know anything about the second Amendment, if you don't know, if you don't know the answers to the questions that people are going to ask you, you can't witness for the second Amendment.
Speaker B:You can't influence people and you can't give them the truth.
Speaker B:So that's the only thing I can encourage our audiences to do is to be intentional, study up and be prepared to have those conversations and step outside your comfort zone.
Speaker B:It's not comfortable.
Speaker A:No, I totally agree.
Speaker A:Now before the show we were kind of talking about the anti gun message and kind of when it started and we kind of pinpointed it to the assault weapons ban in the 90s.
Speaker A:Now that sunsetted, we saw this kind of resurgence of the AR15 and things like that.
Speaker A:How do we combat that anti gun message?
Speaker A:Because they've been pushing it down our throat for almost 30 plus years now.
Speaker B:Well, and I think that's what from our side, people don't understand the threat.
Speaker B:If you step back and you look at the threat to the second amendment and it's not just the second Amendment, it's self defense.
Speaker B:They don't want, you see what they did to Daniel Penney in New York.
Speaker B:They don't want you to defend yourself, they don't want you to defend anybody else.
Speaker B:But if you look at a couple of different things, one is just in the past handful of years the Democrats lost like 2 million voters on their polls and it came over the Republican side.
Speaker B:That's a swing which you know, welcome, welcome to the conservative side.
Speaker B:But I don't think they've ever changed their minds on the guns.
Speaker B:So the second Amendment is still taboo to them.
Speaker B:And that, that in and of itself is, is a swing and diluting our base.
Speaker B:Also there was a poll, CSF put out a poll and last summer and it said that overall nationwide approval of hunting and sport shooting was declined.
Speaker B:And I'm like, guys, the, the, the.
Speaker B: Since the: Speaker B:And that has affected people even with ours behind their names.
Speaker B:So that's why I think it's so Important for our side to prepare ourselves for conversations.
Speaker B:Show up, show up and run for office.
Speaker B:Like, for goodness sakes, just get engaged.
Speaker B:The midterms are coming up and I know there are people disenfranchised.
Speaker B:I'm upset by some things I've heard.
Speaker B:I'm upset by things that haven't been done, even when the Republicans are in the majority.
Speaker B:But this is not the time to go, you know, screw you, I'm not playing.
Speaker B:This is.
Speaker B:This doesn't matter.
Speaker B:This is a time I'm going to press forward and I am going to encourage everyone to take one person to the polls, make sure one person is registered to vote that isn't registered already.
Speaker B:If gun owners did that, we would.
Speaker B:If every one of us took one, it's kind of like $1, you know, just give $1.
Speaker B:If all of us gave $1, there'd be millions of dollars.
Speaker B:If you just take one person to the poll that hasn't been a voter in the past and there's plenty of gun owners that don't vote, I think we could, it would be, it would be a landslide.
Speaker A:I think the last numbers I heard it was, I could be wrong.
Speaker A:I want to say 4 million or something.
Speaker A:Million.
Speaker A:Number of gun voters who.
Speaker A:Gun owners who don't go out and vote.
Speaker A:And seeing that the gun ownership rate went up dramatically during COVID and we had all these new gun owners, you know, you said bring one person to the polls and bring this.
Speaker A:How do we.
Speaker A:Is there other ways we can encourage people to go out and vote?
Speaker A:Because we, like we talked about before the show, as conservatives, we vote in the presidential election and we go, we won the House, we won the Senate, we won the President.
Speaker B:It's time to sit back and relax.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And the, the Democrats are really pushing hard this year for the midterms.
Speaker A:And we've seen this just recently in Virginia where the switch has happened and now all the anti gun bills are going in.
Speaker A:So how do we just push and get the, the people who in the past have just been like, we're good to actually go out and push forward to get these program legislations out.
Speaker B:Well, hopefully they're listening to State of the Second and they're listening to us and we're trying to convince them that maybe, you know, maybe this is the year that I get engaged and maybe this is a year that I go outside my comfort zone and this is the year that we make a difference.
Speaker B:Because the midterms, traditionally, whoever's in office, whoever's in the presidential office, the Midterms usually swings the other way.
Speaker B:So that's already against us.
Speaker B:But there's a lot of things that I think are the conservative base is disgruntled on and I am going to encourage you to not sit this one out, to press forward and really do.
Speaker B:Let's show out for midterms.
Speaker A:You've been doing this for a while as a firearms industry.
Speaker A:We're in the firearms industry.
Speaker A:We've seen kind of this shift of it used to be shrink it and pink it.
Speaker A:Now we're seeing specific guns built for women for and color waves that are a little bit better.
Speaker A:You know, do you think they're doing a good job?
Speaker A:Is there something they can do better or is there a way we could keep pushing them to get more into that demographic?
Speaker B:You know, I think there's a lot of organization.
Speaker B:Well, I say a lot.
Speaker B:I know that a girl in a gun and I know that shoot like a girl.
Speaker B:They are hands on gun owner type things and they, they have done an amazing job of training women in firearms.
Speaker B:I think that what you see when I go train with them or for them, you know, I mean, I like color.
Speaker B:I mean, I'm not opposed to the pink.
Speaker B:I am, okay, I'm opposed to the pink.
Speaker B:But we like that kind of stuff.
Speaker B:I love the, the anodized, I love the splash and stuff like that.
Speaker B:So I think that that's going to appeal to a certain amount of people.
Speaker B:But for the most part, girls don't care.
Speaker B:We just want stuff that runs.
Speaker B:We want stuff that is comfortable to shoot and that is accurate and reliable.
Speaker B:That's what, that's what women, that's what all gun owners do.
Speaker B:Should care about.
Speaker B:And I don't think that women are any different.
Speaker B:And I think dudes like the bling sometimes too.
Speaker A:I mean, I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker B:I mean you.
Speaker B:Have you seen my Genesis shotgun?
Speaker A:I have not.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:It's got, it's, it's got the P51 Mustang theme, it's got the rivets and it's got this.
Speaker B:So that's the kind of bling I like.
Speaker B:But yeah, it's.
Speaker B:I like, I like, I like the attention to great products that I support that support me.
Speaker B:So I like to do fun things like that because that gets a lot of attention.
Speaker A:No, I couldn't agree more on that.
Speaker A:As.
Speaker A:So a follow up question to that.
Speaker A:As you're training people, as you're talking to women who are becoming first time gun owners who are pushing stuff, you think the narrative in the Gun shops have changed where it was.
Speaker A:Y' all need a J Frame revolver?
Speaker B:I hope so.
Speaker B:I mean, I have.
Speaker B:I don't go into gun shops and, you know, it seems like I win my guns or I get my guns from my sponsors, so I haven't had to purchase.
Speaker B:But I have had experiences.
Speaker B:The little, you know, how's it doing?
Speaker B:Little old lady.
Speaker B:And, you know, you need something that's real small.
Speaker B:So I'm hoping that the gun stores really understand that A.
Speaker B:Don't assume.
Speaker B:Don't assume.
Speaker B:I don't know what I'm talking about.
Speaker B:But also, you know, just be kind, because it's not just women.
Speaker B:You know, you can see some.
Speaker B:You can see a newbie.
Speaker B:You can smell the blood in the water when the newbie comes walking through the door.
Speaker B:So I would just encourage, you know, people behind the counter to not be arrogant, to be kind, to be.
Speaker B:To be welcoming.
Speaker A:You mentioned the stateside, and I kind of want to dive into Virginia because we talked about Virginia.
Speaker A:How do we, as a community combat what's going on in Virginia and how do we stop it from happening in other states?
Speaker B:We have to be more intentional to win the hearts and minds of our fellow citizens.
Speaker B:They have been propagandized, too, and they have been brainwashed into thinking that guns are bad.
Speaker B:And we have to normalize and celebrate the Second Amendment.
Speaker B:And we have to be more intentional.
Speaker B:Like, they're more intentional.
Speaker B:Our side, we kind of like to just think that the truth is on our side, the Constitution is on our side.
Speaker B:So therefore, we don't really have to get engaged.
Speaker B:That's why I think that we lose ground and they gain ground is because they're out there beating the drum.
Speaker B:They're out there advertising, and we can advertise.
Speaker B:You know, the censorship and the discrimination against our community is terrible.
Speaker B:I've talked to Ms. Harmeet Dhillon and the DOJ about that, and, yeah, we're fighting an uphill battle, but I feel like it's important enough to try to.
Speaker B:I'm not going to stop.
Speaker B:I'm not going to stop until my last breath.
Speaker A:Is there a way we can combat some of the censorship with social media and with, you know, legacy media as well?
Speaker A:But how do we combat that?
Speaker A:Beside, you know, is it a grassroots effort?
Speaker A:Is it going and going to lobby days and pushing things?
Speaker A:How do we combat all that censorship?
Speaker B:Well, I don't know how.
Speaker B:We.
Speaker B:We are not really in control of that.
Speaker B:We are in control of who we talk to.
Speaker B:And our.
Speaker B:Our side, our industry has really we self censor because we don't trust you, so we're not going to talk to you.
Speaker B:So I think that we're going to have to continue to have conversations with people we don't trust and not self censor for sure.
Speaker B:There's a. Marie Claire is a magazine and I was just interviewed in that.
Speaker B:And it's very scary to agree to interviews with the people that you have been burned by in the past.
Speaker B:Not Marie Claire, but other major newspapers and things like that.
Speaker B:So I understand the concern.
Speaker B:I just want to encourage our side that we have to continue to have those conversations and we can't just close the door and say, you hurt me once and I'm not going to let you in.
Speaker B:We have to continue to try to have those conversations with mainstream media.
Speaker B:And that's what, you know, I don't know who we're talking to really or who could do that, but it's just being intentional.
Speaker B:We have to continue to have these conversations and, and not stop trying.
Speaker A:No, I, I don't disagree with that.
Speaker A:Now we've, we talked to kind of about how we saw all these new gun owners come in and we're, we're kind of seeing a small wave right now of what we would call moderate to conservative people on the left side buying guns.
Speaker A:But they're still under the impression they're just buying it because they're worried about something going on or self protection.
Speaker A:But then they go back to their, their morals or what they believe in or what they've been preached to is anti gun.
Speaker A:So how do we shift those people who are like, well I took the first step, I bought a gun, but I'm still anti gun.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I'll take it a step further.
Speaker B:Like what about the people who are.
Speaker B:The whole politically sanctioned violence that you're seeing, like they're recognizing that the second amendment is there for them too.
Speaker B:And it's not that I don't want it there for them, but I don't think that they are of the same cloth as your traditional gun owner, like who value life, who carried to protect.
Speaker B:I see, you know, when you see the antifa type being armed, I see them as more of the militant Marxist, you know, you're going to do it my way type thing, which is, you know, if you want to go down that route, cool.
Speaker B:Just that's why we want to stay armed.
Speaker B:Because you're not going to force your will on me and I'm not going to force my will on you.
Speaker B:Where everything, it really is an armed Society is a polite society.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's, that's the best way to put it.
Speaker A:An armed society is, it's just now.
Speaker B:That the government, now that the government is sanctioning one side to do violence and then persecuting the other side for doing any kind of standing up and just saying, no thank you.
Speaker B:That's where I think it's gotten.
Speaker B:And I, I'm really concerned about what I see that's going on in our, in our country.
Speaker A:I couldn't agree more.
Speaker A:It's a, it's that double standard.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And you can't have that double standard.
Speaker A:The second amendment is the second amendment.
Speaker A:You know, you can't sanction people for, or applaud them for doing rights in the street and then the same time crucify people on the other side for protesting.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're seeing it right now, we're seeing it right now with the couple out of St. Louis that got persecuted, tried versus what you see going on at the same way right now in Minnesota.
Speaker B:So yeah, it's, it's going to be interesting.
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Speaker A:Well, we are at the time of the show where we go from our segment from the Soapbox.
Speaker A:This is where we get super spicy.
Speaker A:Spicy take.
Speaker A:So what do you have for a spicy take?
Speaker B:A spicy take?
Speaker A:A spicy take.
Speaker B:I wasn't aware of a spicy take.
Speaker B:Like what's that mean?
Speaker A:Spicy as you want to be.
Speaker A:We talk about, you can talk about politics.
Speaker A:Your biggest frustration, Grapes with the atf, politicians, anything like that.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:My spicy take is this.
Speaker B:I'm frustrated with the Republicans that have control right now and they seem to not be delivering on what they promised.
Speaker B:And this is my team.
Speaker B:I'm telling my team that we need to get the ball rolling, especially with midterms coming up.
Speaker B:We need some deliverables.
Speaker A:I couldn't have said it better.
Speaker A:We got the small.
Speaker B:We've got.
Speaker B:We've.
Speaker B:We appreciate the deliverables that have come, but the deliverables that we want are.
Speaker B:We want Epstein stuff and we want to stop talking bad about the second amendment.
Speaker A:Agreed.
Speaker A:We got.
Speaker B:And I know they don't think they're talking bad about the second amendment, but when you say that you can't run around with a gun that's not supporting the second amendment.
Speaker B:I own a gun, but that's not supporting this.
Speaker A:That.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:You hit the nail on the head.
Speaker A:You can't say I own a gun.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:There's no but in the second amendment.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:It is written.
Speaker A:It's been written.
Speaker A:Those guys were pretty smart when they wrote it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And made it sure that shall not be infringed as in there.
Speaker A:But yeah, I mean, we got a small.
Speaker A:I wouldn't say small.
Speaker A:It was a big win, but $0 tax stamps was a big win.
Speaker B:But then they backed it off.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's it.
Speaker A:We're suing on that right now.
Speaker A:We're sitting on the.
Speaker A:From our side because you can't have a $0 tax stamp.
Speaker A:And we've got our big beautiful lawsuit.
Speaker A:So please donate to that so we can get this across the board.
Speaker A:I have to do a shameless plug here or there every once in a while, but I understand, but how so the Republicans in office right now, and I.
Speaker A:And I'll say.
Speaker A:And you're probably going to echo the same thing I say is now is the time to contact these people, especially with midterms coming up and going, hey, you got to do this.
Speaker A:You got to stand up for the second amendment.
Speaker A:You've got.
Speaker A:We've got a section on the GOA website where you can.
Speaker A:It takes 30 seconds to contact your senator and congressman.
Speaker A:You just put in your name, your address, and your location.
Speaker A:And it's a pre filled out form.
Speaker A:You can fill it out.
Speaker A:But for the.
Speaker A:The average person besides that easy way, you know, how do you tell them to get in touch with them?
Speaker B:Well, that's one of the things that I didn't do for 45 years.
Speaker B:I didn't know that I could call my congressman or that I should call my congressman.
Speaker B:And it's not enough for you to know your congressman's name or your senator's name.
Speaker B:Which a lot of you probably don't know your congressman's name or your senator's name.
Speaker B:It's not enough for you to know their name.
Speaker B:They need to know your name.
Speaker B:And it's not that you need to be bullish and it's not that you need to be an about anything.
Speaker B:It's that you need to be consistently showing up for your issue, whatever that issue is.
Speaker B:Our issue is the Second Amendment.
Speaker B:So it's so easy to.
Speaker B:I mean, it's in my phone, programmed in my phone.
Speaker B:It's 202, 222.
Speaker B:Like there's a phone number and it's a congressional switchbo board.
Speaker B:And I can call in and say, hey, I want to be plugged into Senator Mullins or some, you know, whoever I want to talk to.
Speaker B:And I encourage that.
Speaker B:It's like that's what I missed.
Speaker B:For the first 45 years of my life, I didn't pay attention to politics.
Speaker B:But I love people when they say I don't pay attention to politics, but politics pays attention to you.
Speaker B:So if you don't do politics, they're going to do you.
Speaker B:And it's so easy, but it, and it's so important to contact your legislators.
Speaker B:So that's another encouragement thing is like, you know, find out who they are, find out their phone number.
Speaker B:I incur.
Speaker B:Here's the, here's a challenge.
Speaker B:I want you to call them and find the kid who answers the phone and ask for the Second Amendment who handles the Second Amendment portfolio.
Speaker B:That's who you ask for.
Speaker B:And then you write down their name because that's who you want to contact.
Speaker B:That's who you want to have a relationship with too.
Speaker B:It's not the member, the members not, you know, the member's gonna be busy and it's harder to create that relationship with them.
Speaker B:But yes, phone calls, emails, and when you're there and they're home too.
Speaker B:So you don't have to go to Washington D.C. to see these people.
Speaker B:And that's the federal level.
Speaker B:You've got a whole nother set of the state level people.
Speaker B:Like now you have to know not only your federal congressmen, but now you've got state and state senators and state representatives.
Speaker B:So you got two assignments.
Speaker B:Find those people and give them a call.
Speaker A:Well, yeah, and you hit the nail on the head specifically with the stateside.
Speaker A:You even I know.
Speaker A:So I live in Arizona.
Speaker A:Sin Lad is our Arizona state director.
Speaker B:Love her, love her.
Speaker A:But even me, I work for goa, but I work on the national side.
Speaker A:I read an article the one day about how they police evidence guns, they're going to destroy them.
Speaker A:And I'm like, well, that's weird because they're also supposed to be selling them.
Speaker A:It's written into our law that they're supposed to be selling these guns.
Speaker B:Oh, really?
Speaker A:And so I called sin and I was like, hey, do you know what's going on with this?
Speaker A:Is this good thing, bad thing?
Speaker A:You know what's going on?
Speaker A:I want to know.
Speaker A:So if I need to contact my representative, I can.
Speaker A:And she goes, yeah, let me look into this.
Speaker A:Gets back to me and goes, yeah, they're breaking the law.
Speaker A:They got it.
Speaker A:There's.
Speaker A:All they're trying to do is if it has to go down.
Speaker A:There was an officer who was shot and the gun was going to go up for sale and the wife didn't want to go.
Speaker A:And it comes down to the victim deciding if they want that gun back on the street and destroyed.
Speaker A:And I was like, well, that makes sense.
Speaker A:But also at the same time, like it is in our law that this is supposed to be sold.
Speaker A:It's Arizona law and things like that.
Speaker A:Even something that small you need to pay attention to because there's anti gun legislation or what can be perceived to be anti gun legislation in everything.
Speaker A:It's hidden in budget bills, it's hidden in small things.
Speaker A:You might not know, but there might be a budget bill that has red flag laws in it and you don't even know it for sure.
Speaker B:And it's tough.
Speaker B:And that's why it's so important for what the legacy organizations do for, you know, keeping their finger on the pulse of legislation.
Speaker B:I mean, I don't want women for gun rights to get into any kind of lawsuit type stuff.
Speaker B:We are glad to, you know, do an amicus brief or, you know, lend our voices when it's normal, but we don't have, we don't have the infrastructure, the finances to.
Speaker B:And you guys are doing a fantastic job.
Speaker B:So why would we do that?
Speaker B:That's what I want the Second Amendment counsel for.
Speaker B:So we can like, you know, strategize.
Speaker A:Yeah, we need to all band together and, and fight.
Speaker A:And we're working.
Speaker A:And that's the thing.
Speaker A:A lot of people think that we're.
Speaker A:Everybody's fighting each other.
Speaker A:We're not.
Speaker A:We're actually all pushing, trying to push towards the same thing.
Speaker A:And that's why, you know, people have gotten mad at us when other organizations hop on our lawsuit or we hop on their lawsuit.
Speaker B:I'm so happy to see you Know our legacy organizations really working together.
Speaker B:That just makes sense to me.
Speaker A:Yeah, it makes perfect sense.
Speaker A:A lot of voices at once.
Speaker A:We and GOA as, as an organization we sue on behalf of our members and that's, that's the backing behind all our lawsuits because it's our members, we gotta, we've got to put some sort of plaintiffs on there.
Speaker A:But yeah, you get to go to these state level events.
Speaker A:You get to go, you get to see the red shirts.
Speaker A:How do you fight the red shirts?
Speaker A:Or how do you kind of bridge that conversation when they're so pushing so far at you that you just come over and try to have that conversation with them?
Speaker B:I love coming face to face with the red shirt.
Speaker B:And I'll tell you a story about being in Florida when they did their constitutional carry ban a couple years ago, not ban bill a couple of years ago.
Speaker B:I was advised, I wanted to show up, I wanted the teal presence to show up to a hearing before that and somebody within the legislators like well it's a super majority, they're going to do what they want anyway, you know, so.
Speaker B:And it's going to pass.
Speaker B:What I wanted was going to pass and I thought we went anyway.
Speaker B:There was five of us in teal shirts and there was probably 100 red shirts.
Speaker B:But our five, well I think like three of us maybe testified but one of them was a 14 year old girl who had left public school because she didn't feel like anybody was capable and willing to, to protect her and, and that she supported her mom and dad being able to be armed.
Speaker B:And that's the first time I think those women and those kid, those other kids that were testifying because they were up there flailing about, you know, they're so scared and I get it, you've been, you know, but if you were my kid and I send my kid to school, I'm going to say, I want that teacher to say little Johnny, it's going to be okay because I'm going to stop anything that comes through that door.
Speaker B:You don't have to worry about anything.
Speaker B:But the leftists just destroy these kids.
Speaker B:So I see kid after, you know, college kids, you know, doing their drama, drama work about being so scared and, and so unprepared and then they see our 14 year old girl stand up there and say, you know, hey, I want, I want a teacher to be able to protect me and that we had conversations, you know, some of them, that reaches some of them.
Speaker B:That's why I want to have a conversation with them.
Speaker B:So I Love coming face to face with them.
Speaker B:They have not always been great conversations.
Speaker B:They do their, you know, loud, yelling, bullish ways, but in the end, people are watching that, and people can decide whether they want to behave like a teal shirt or if they want to behave like a red shirt.
Speaker B:And so I'm hoping that that is the kind of influence that normalizes and celebrates the Second Amendment.
Speaker B:That's how you calm the conversation and make guns great again.
Speaker A:No, I couldn't agree more.
Speaker A:As somebody who went to a very liberal college, I went to Kent State.
Speaker A:You know, Caitlin went to Kent State, too.
Speaker A:I wrote my senior dissertation on campus carry.
Speaker A:I got big pushback from my professor.
Speaker A:He was like, I grew up in Texas.
Speaker A:We left our guns in the.
Speaker A:In the vestibule of the church.
Speaker A:I'm like, well, first off, that's really unsafe to just leave him sitting there.
Speaker A:But at the end, you know, just using logic and using things, I had a couple professors who were very anti gun, who were like, okay, you changed my mind.
Speaker A:Because it is.
Speaker A:It's that conversation and putting it in words and going, listen, this is why we need something like this.
Speaker A:But now, even today, we're seeing campuses ban pepper spray.
Speaker A:And you get.
Speaker A:The blue light bulb's not gonna save you.
Speaker A:How do we combat that?
Speaker B:You have to get to the women.
Speaker B:You have to use women.
Speaker B:Talking to women about being safe and actually being safe and not telling a woman that, oh, you're more likely to be hurt with your pepper spray or your gun, you know, I want to tell him the story about Mira o', Connell, who had a serial rapist get out of prison, break into her home in the middle of the night with a gun.
Speaker B:And she fought.
Speaker B:She took his gun away from him, and she shot him three times.
Speaker B:He died right there.
Speaker B:She didn't know it.
Speaker B:She ran out of the house.
Speaker B:She didn't know until later.
Speaker B:But that's the kind of mentality I want women to have, is that I can survive and that I can do things.
Speaker B:I mean, I don't get it.
Speaker B:The whole feminist movement and how crazy they are about I don't need a man and things like that.
Speaker B:Like, if you don't need a man, you definitely need a gun.
Speaker B:Like, you're.
Speaker B:You should be on our side.
Speaker A:I agree.
Speaker A:I 100 agree.
Speaker A:I mean, I've seen it.
Speaker A:As far as now, I'm not going to remember what state was trying to push this, but there's been state laws were if.
Speaker A:If your kid grabs.
Speaker A:And we saw this in Phoenix, a woman's pregnant single mom.
Speaker A:House got broken into.
Speaker A:The guy was attacking the mom.
Speaker A:Kid grabbed the gun and, and shot the bad guy.
Speaker A:There are states pushing that if your kid uses a gun in self defense to protect you or themselves, you're going to jail.
Speaker B:New York's crazy.
Speaker B:I don't know, I don't know if that was New York.
Speaker B:But you know, New York prosecuted Daniel Penny because, and he didn't have a gun.
Speaker B:He just ended up getting into a fight and guy dying and they didn't like that.
Speaker B:They don't like, they don't like good people protecting other good people.
Speaker B:That's a, that's taboo to them.
Speaker B:They just want to.
Speaker B:I don't know what they want to do, but it just doesn't seem right.
Speaker B:And I'm going to use my last breath to always push for what's right.
Speaker C:As liberty loving Americans, we know how important it is to put your money where your values are.
Speaker C:And that is why we are proud to partner with Right to Bear.
Speaker C:Right to Bear is a cornerstone in the community for self defense protection and we are proud to be offering an exclusive discount.
Speaker A:Use code GOA at checkout to save 15% off the lifetime of your membership.
Speaker A:Again, that's code GOA to save 15% off on the lifetime of your membership.
Speaker A:Now the last thing I want to touch on is you brought up education and the education system and how this girl was talking about that.
Speaker A:We've seen this new movement of parents and we've seen it at our convention at goals of parents taking their kids out of the public school system and in homeschooling, you know, where do we see our flaws?
Speaker A:Where do you see the flaws on the public school system?
Speaker A:How do we do we?
Speaker A:Can we fix them?
Speaker B:Oh, I think the public school system, it was a brilliant move by the Marxist or whomever is pushing the ideology that you see.
Speaker B:You know, it's planted probably 30, 40 years ago and now it's just coming to fruition.
Speaker B:But taking over our colleges and training the teachers that are teaching our next generation, that was a pretty brilliant move on their part.
Speaker B:How do we counter that you really stay engaged?
Speaker B:I think that Covid, when the kids came home from COVID and the parents actually understood what was going on in the schools, that was a big eye opener.
Speaker B:So I just, I can't encourage people enough to get engaged at a local level like in every.
Speaker B:It's not just the second amendment, it's what's going on at your school and specifically what we can do.
Speaker B:What I push for is, you know, A Faster Saves Lives is one of our, you know, if you want school security, it can be secured.
Speaker B:And we encourage Faster Saves Lives as an NGO that we support.
Speaker B:And when we talk to legislators, that's a solution for us and Kids Safe foundation and Eddie Eagle.
Speaker B:And there are things that, you know, hunters education programs.
Speaker B:Kids need to know how to be safe around a firearm.
Speaker B:It's no different than water.
Speaker B:We want them to understand, to respect water and to understand how to swim.
Speaker B:So I think it, I would love to see firearms education, hunter safety back in schools like it was when, when I grew up.
Speaker B:And I think that's, that's, that's one of the things that we keep asking for.
Speaker A:Well, we saw the Biden administration attack specifically hunter education in schools.
Speaker A:We're seeing states now legislate to get that back in school.
Speaker A:But you're absolutely right.
Speaker A:I mean, we lost even my generation.
Speaker A:We had, we had gun safety in school.
Speaker A:We were taught this.
Speaker A:And this was thing.
Speaker A:If you don't teach that, you know, now kids are curious.
Speaker A:It's a big thing if they're curious if there's a firearm in the house, they're curious if, if you don't teach that accidents can happen.
Speaker A:And that's part of the personal responsibility as gun owners that we take when we buy a firearm, for sure.
Speaker B:So for all those new people, you know, don't think locking it up or hiding it is an answer.
Speaker B:You know, you really need to address how your kids, how you're going to have a gun around kids.
Speaker B:And it's totally doable.
Speaker B:I did it growing up, and we pass it on to my niece and nephew and we expect them to understand and.
Speaker B:But there's a lot of people that are probably new that don't even understand it themselves, so they don't feel comfortable, you know, sharing that with their kids.
Speaker B:So reach out to these legacy organizations that have programs that, you know, just, just, just do, Just be intentional.
Speaker B:That's my word.
Speaker B:Just be intentional.
Speaker A:Well, my favorite saying I used to say when I was doing concealed care classes is, you know, you were a kid once.
Speaker A:We were all kids once when mom or dad said, don't go into the cookie jar, you went into the cookie jar because you wanted that cookie.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's the same thing with guts.
Speaker A:Don't touch this.
Speaker A:You can't tell a kid, don't, because they just hear do.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:And so the education part is so huge on that.
Speaker A:Now, the other thing I want to talk about, we, we've seen you mentioned early on the, the Loss of hunters and people getting activated into the shooting sports.
Speaker A:How do we also encourage that and get more people into that?
Speaker A:It's a big push for GOA this year is getting more hunters, pulling in the next generation of hunters.
Speaker A:You know, how do we get more people involved in the shooting sports and into the hunting culture?
Speaker B:How do we do that?
Speaker B:That's the big question.
Speaker B:I, I mean I love the shooting sports.
Speaker B:I think they're so, it's so much fun.
Speaker B:But it like I shoot three gun rifles, pistols and shotguns.
Speaker B:So it's super expensive.
Speaker B:It's three times as expensive as just picking one gun and one sport.
Speaker B:So I feel blessed to be able to even do it.
Speaker B:But you know, introducing, encouraging people and sharing your stories about, you know, why do you do it?
Speaker B:It's fun, you know, it's fun and it gets me some time behind my gun, which translates into me ever needing it.
Speaker B:You know, I feel pretty confident that if I ever needed it, I wouldn't be fumbling around with a safety or, you know, I have so many, so much experience behind a gun that that part is on, on autopilot because in a scenario in the real world, I mean all your energy is going to need to be focused on what's going on and how do I get out of it.
Speaker B:And if the gun gets introduced, I don't want to even have to deal with that.
Speaker B:So I'm very blessed to have all that experience.
Speaker B:But that's what it can do for you.
Speaker B:Like, you know, things go wrong in competition all the time.
Speaker B:So you have to figure out how to, how to, how to do that.
Speaker B:You know, how to work through something going on with your gun on the clock.
Speaker B:It's that pseudo stress that you can't really get anywhere else.
Speaker B:You can't get it by going and shooting six rounds at a paper target and not time limit, you know, it's just, it's that pseudo stress that I think really helps you translate into really good concealed carrier.
Speaker A:I couldn't agree more.
Speaker A:Training under stress and going into competitions is a huge thing that people need to do.
Speaker A:I used to, it's been a minute because I've been busy, but I used to take at least one to two classes a year just so I could get under that stress and get, and get that training.
Speaker A:I've done vehicle tactics classes and the concealed carry classes and my favorite was the long range shooting class.
Speaker A:That was not for, for any handgun concealed carry, but that was just for fun because it's addicting.
Speaker A:But I highly encourage people just Go take a class, go do that stuff.
Speaker A:And look outside of the basic CCW class is great, but look outside of that because once you get some of those advanced trainings and things like that, that's where you'll get some.
Speaker B:And the meat and the potatoes.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Your concealed carry is like looking at a menu.
Speaker B:There's not a whole lot there you're not going to get, you're not going to get fed there.
Speaker B:But yeah, and then the sport of shooting is like something that everybody can do.
Speaker B:Like if you've got, you know, kids over the age of six, they could start competing.
Speaker B:It's not an eight.
Speaker B:That's just an age that I'm making up.
Speaker B:It's going to be different for every family.
Speaker B:But like I see families, it's not like they're going to the soccer game and one kid gets to play while everybody else is watching and bored out of their mind.
Speaker B:You know, everybody gets to play in the shooting sports.
Speaker B:So that's another reason I like it.
Speaker B:And we really do instill a sense of discipline and responsibility with our kids shooting sports.
Speaker B:Kids are the best kids on the block.
Speaker A:Oh, I couldn't agree more.
Speaker A:I used to run a youth rifle league, just a rimfire league.
Speaker A:And it was so funny watching the kid.
Speaker A:You go, hey, you've got five minutes to shoot 10 rounds.
Speaker A:So you've got plenty of time.
Speaker A:And half of them would be done.
Speaker A:They're like, I was so stressed about the time limit.
Speaker A:Five minutes is a very long time.
Speaker A:Like, well, I just got stressed.
Speaker A:I'm like, see, now you learn, you're gonna learn how to shoot under stress.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:Even though it was in a fun environment.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:They're learning like there is stress sometimes when it comes to competition and things like that.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:It's, it's such a great skill that you can apply across the board for the rest of your life.
Speaker A:Agreed.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, we are at the wrap up time.
Speaker A:Thank you again for being on the show.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Got one more thing.
Speaker A:Yeah, go for it.
Speaker B:So our big announcement is that we are setting up a 501C3.
Speaker B:So Women for Gun Rights is a C4, which means that it's more on the advocacy side and you don't get the tax deduction as an individual donor.
Speaker B:But Women for Gun Rights is going to start the membership paid membership model.
Speaker B:But we're also doing the C3, which is women for Gun Safety.
Speaker B:We're trying to take back that name because guns make you safer.
Speaker B:So Women for Gun Safety and it's a 501C3 that's going to be our education side and that complements our advocacy side on the Women for Gun Rights.
Speaker A:Diana, thank you for joining us.
Speaker A:As a thank you, we have our gift for our guests, so after the show you'll be getting an email.
Speaker A:Thank you, Palmetto State Armory for sponsoring our gift for our guests for season three.
Speaker A:Guys, make sure to like share and subscribe.
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Speaker A:Leave a five star review on all podcasting hosts.
Speaker A:Make sure to register today for goals the Gun Owners Advocacy and leadership summit happening August 1st and 2nd in beautiful Des Moines, Iowa.
Speaker A:Hotels are open.
Speaker A:Check out the awesome speaker lineup and we guys will catch you on the next one.
