Shownotes
We're excited to talk about our latest episode featuring the insightful Bella Matta. We covered a wide range of topics, from the nitty-gritty of law school to dissecting current political strategies and scrutinizing economic policies.
Bella shared her firsthand experiences as a 2L at Capital Law School. One point that stood out was the emphasis on the Socratic method—a technique that terrifies unprepared students but molds them into sharp legal minds ready to tackle real-world challenges. We also touched on the political dynamics within the classroom; Bella noted that while professors generally steer clear of expressing their political opinions, the students make up for it with their passionate debates.
Shifting gears, Norm didn't hold back when criticizing some current economic policies. He labeled plans like a $50,000 deduction for small businesses and new parent monetary support as ineffective gimmicks. Steve highlighted the potential for exploitation, questioning the efficacy of such financial aids in truly benefiting those in need.
The political arena was, of course, a hot topic. We discussed the legal challenges and perceived political motivations behind proceedings against figures like Trump. Effective strategies for handling debates and biased media questions were emphasized, especially concerning controversial issues like January 6th.
We also had a lively exchange about the influx of Haitian immigrants in Springfield and its impact on local resources. It’s a topic that hits close to home for many Ohioans, illustrating the broader implications of immigration policies on small-town America.
Bella brought a fresh perspective, especially on how younger voters perceive key political issues. While debates may not drastically shift poll numbers, they still play a significant role in shaping public opinion—and it's crucial to be prepared.
Common Sense Moments
00:00 Commentary on recent developments and legal education.
09:51 Many law graduates pursued non-legal careers.
10:47 Law education's value questioned, economically out-of-reach.
20:39 Insurance rates soared in Springfield due to claims.
24:28 Assimilation isn't as forced as it was.
27:35 Kamala met expectations; Trump won overall perception.
34:44 Policy abuse often benefits those who don't need.
37:06 Missed opportunity for Trump to discuss censorship.
43:26 Crime, economy, young voters: Trump's unclear debates.
51:51 Governor DeWine exploited and concealed important information.
54:25 Death related to immigration and policy criticism.
Recorded at the 511 Studios, in the Brewery District in downtown Columbus, OH.
info@commonsenseohioshow.com
Copyright 2024 Common Sense Ohio
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nd/4.0/
Stephen Palmer is the Managing Partner for the law firm, Palmer Legal Defense. He has specialized almost exclusively in criminal defense for over 26 years. Steve is also a partner in Criminal Defense Consultants, a firm focused wholly on helping criminal defense attorneys design winning strategies for their clients.
Norm Murdock is an automobile racing driver and owner of a high-performance and restoration car parts company. He earned undergraduate degrees in literature and journalism and graduated with a Juris Doctor from the University of Cincinnati College of Law in 1985. He worked in the IT industry for two years before launching a career in government relations in Columbus, Ohio. Norm has assisted clients in the Transportation, Education, Healthcare, and Public Infrastructure sectors.
Brett Johnson is an award-winning podcast consultant and small business owner for nearly 10 years, leaving a long career in radio. He is passionate about helping small businesses tell their story through podcasts, and he believes podcasting is a great opportunity for different voices to speak and be heard.
Transcripts
Alright. We are good to go. Common Sense Ohio coming at you this week. It is September 13, 2024. It is already the fall. Football has begun, and we are kicking off is it the last quarter yet? Yeah. We're we're getting close to the Q4 for you accountants out there. Anyway, we've got a guest in the studio.
Steve Palmer [:We'll get to that in a second. But the typical stuff, commonsense ohio show dot com. You can go check us out on our website, commonsense ohio show dot com. Norm's blog lives there. My blog lives there. Although if you look for my blog, you will find nothing because I haven't blogged on anything. Brett's got a few things I believe. At any rate, that's where you can like, that's where you can, that's where you can subscribe and click.
Steve Palmer [:It'll take you to YouTube and Rumble and all the other places. If you haven't subscribed to the podcast yet, get it. Just do it. Share it. It helps us, because it is true that we come here week in week out, and we do this for nothing, because we like it. And the goal here is to, share a common sense viewpoint at the round norm there's a reason the table's round. Yes. Right.
Steve Palmer [:Because we don't want it to be at odds with anybody. We wanna share ideas. Yes. We want to exchange common sense ideas. Now that doesn't mean that I'm always right, and it doesn't mean that you're always right or vice versa.
Norm Murdock [:A circle is an infinite number of angles, and there's an infinite number of opinions that we can bring to a round table.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. So there you go. There you go. Now if you think that you can hang with Norm at the round table
Norm Murdock [:You can't.
Steve Palmer [:I have a hard time with it. I know Brett has a hard time with it. But, anyway, if you think you can hang, you just check us out at commonsense ohio show dot com. Send us a note. We get the notes. And and and if you think you're gonna out comment Norm on the social media, good luck with that too.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:But, we welcome the exchange. Brett is over in the producer's chair today because we have a guest, Bella Matta. Right?
Bella Matta [:Yes. Thank you
Steve Palmer [:for having me. A cool name.
Norm Murdock [:Belamata. Means beautiful.
Bella Matta [:Thank you. Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:I did. Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:And I think that fits.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. No. Absolutely.
Norm Murdock [:Why I may be so bold.
Steve Palmer [:So Bela is a you're a local law student?
Bella Matta [:Yes.
Steve Palmer [:Where Where do you go to law school?
Bella Matta [:I go to Capital Law.
Steve Palmer [:Capital Law. What year?
Bella Matta [:I'm a 2 l.
Steve Palmer [:2 l. So that's fancy talk. For those who aren't in law school, they talk about 1 l, which means your 1st year in law school, 2 l or 3 l.
Norm Murdock [:And that's your alma mater, Steve.
Steve Palmer [:I went to Capital University Law and Graduate Center when it was still at the old Grange building downtown here or on South High. Yeah. Yeah. Graduated in 95.
Bella Matta [:Okay.
Norm Murdock [:So old.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Not so. In November of 95, I was sworn in. I yeah. That's right. November of 95, I was sworn into the bar at Ohio. So, anyway, so law school is an interesting endeavor. And, where where are you from initially?
Bella Matta [:I'm from Cleveland, 20 minutes outside Brexville, Ohio.
Steve Palmer [:Brexville. What's the mascot in Brexville?
Bella Matta [:We're we were the Brexville bees.
Steve Palmer [:The Brexville bees. Cool. Yes. Like, it did did is the mascot like a guy wearing a bee suit the whole 9 yards?
Bella Matta [:Exactly.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. That's a lot of it. That's a lot of it. Awesome. So, anyway, you, you've got a political interest, and you are a law student, and you've got lots of other stuff going on. And I thought what we do is just sort of kick it off, Norm. I mean, I think, and I do wanna ask you about Springfield because not that you're an expert in Springfield, but you you've done a little bit of research there too. So we'll get to that.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. So here's how this works. Knorr gives us stuff to talk about, and then we talk about it.
Norm Murdock [:Or not. Or not.
Steve Palmer [:Or not. If so You
Norm Murdock [:know, like, if it's a boring topic, Steve will say, yeah. Let's talk about this Yeah. Instead. So, and that's fine. So we we we we just kinda throw pie at the wall and see what sticks.
Steve Palmer [:But you know what I'm gonna do before we do that? I wanna talk to her a little. I was gonna I'm gonna get I was gonna do this later, but we'll just do it now. So what's your now obviously, you know that Common Sense Ohio people would call us, like, super conservative or whatever. I don't consider myself ultra conservative or radical conservative or anything else, but I think I just look at this as a common sense approach.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:So without even asking your political views, like, what is it like in law school? What's the political environment in law school with, the left and the right, the Democrats and the Republicans? How does it work?
Bella Matta [:It's definitely more left leaning. I think a lot of people would expect that. But I think the Republicans are just more quiet. Yeah. But I did go to a Republican club meeting the other day, and the whole room was packed. So I think people are actually coming out now. But, yeah, my 1st year, I went to 1 and there were, like, 6 people there. So I think people are starting to, you know, voice their opinions more.
Steve Palmer [:I first learned about, the Federalist Society in Law School. A law professor introduced me to it at one point. I went out to a a convention or or one of their, events and
Norm Murdock [:Con Con Law professor?
Steve Palmer [:No. He's a visiting professor. Brad Smith. You know Brad Smith.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. I know Brad Smith.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. He loved him.
Norm Murdock [:I know of him.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. And he was a phenomenal guy. Genius. I mean, absolute genius. But he was,
Norm Murdock [:The former head of the Federal Elections Committee
Steve Palmer [:Mhmm.
Norm Murdock [:Commission.
Steve Palmer [:And did a lot of commentary in recent developments in some of the, you know, things that have been going on. But so, I mean, is it, but, you know, from my perspective, there's a way to teach the law that really is somewhat irrelevant, or there's gotta be some history there between the two sides. But is it, what what what's your experience there? Is it getting crammed down like maybe we hear in undergrad, or is it just the cases are the cases?
Bella Matta [:I have to say, I think the professors do a really good job at, not, like, speaking their political opinions. I think they kinda keep it out of the classroom. It's more of the students.
Steve Palmer [:Really? Yeah.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. I think the professors are pretty good about it.
Norm Murdock [:My con law professor, for example, was a screaming liberal, but he was very funny, old guy. And he took apart the Roe v Wade decision and said it was utter bullcrap. And it it kinda like Ruth Bader Ginsburg did and basically said it's intellectually dishonest, the decision. And he actually thought it was gonna be overturned just because it was underpinned by nothing. So there are those professors that are able to bifurcate their own feelings from their job teaching law. And, you know, that's really when you feel like that's a great professor.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:And he was. Right. You know, because we didn't have to agree. It's just teach me.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:Right? So, you know, I forgot to mention, though, Steve. Brad Smith is a professor at Capital. I think
Steve Palmer [:he might have retired. I'm I don't remember.
Norm Murdock [:No. He's still on well, he's on the website at Capital Law School.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:So maybe I don't know what well, I don't know what classes he teaches.
Steve Palmer [:When I was there, he taught, adjunct, and it was, I think some some form of civil procedure or advanced civil procedure or, maybe employment law or employment litigation, something like that. I
Norm Murdock [:don't know. I don't know. Elections law is pretty hot right now.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. He might have different different views.
Norm Murdock [:Can you imagine, right, with all of these like Robert f Kennedy wanting to get taken off of ballots and stuff like that. Brad Smith, your professor,
Steve Palmer [:I
Norm Murdock [:I if he teaches a course, that might be really interesting.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. He's a sharp guy.
Bella Matta [:I haven't had him.
Norm Murdock [:Okay.
Bella Matta [:He might still be there. But I think we just have a lot to cover in one class period that it's hard to be discussing all these, like, current political topics also.
Norm Murdock [:Do they still use a Socratic method? You know, like, where do they call on students?
Bella Matta [:Oh, yeah.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's just
Steve Palmer [:Just so everybody understands, a Socratic method means it's like this question and answer form of teaching where the the professors never tell you the answer. They ask you what the answer is and make you comment on it, and then they sort of zero in through this, I dare I call it, cross examination. But they'll just keep asking questions, and it's terrifying at times, isn't it?
Norm Murdock [:It's terrifying. Yeah. Especially if
Bella Matta [:you haven't read the book. For sure of moments where I wasn't too prepared. But it happens to everyone in law school.
Steve Palmer [:Me too.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Dozens of times. In fact, I think the professor could tell by the fear in your eye. Oh, that guy did not read it.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. You can tell.
Norm Murdock [:And some of them just
Steve Palmer [:get off on it. They love it.
Norm Murdock [:All of them love it. Mister Murdoch.
Bella Matta [:Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Have you ever seen the movie, The Paper Chase? No. Alright. That's that's the one way back. Series. Yeah. It was a TV series too. It was, who was the old bird in the paper chase? What's his
Norm Murdock [:John something?
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Kingsley was his name in the in the movie, but John, Houseman. Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:Thank you.
Steve Palmer [:We got our facts. John Houseman was a Yeah. Was the, law professor, but that was back in the days. Now my buddy went to Thomas Cooley Law School. I think that's close. That's up in Michigan now. But he went to he transferred into Capital, and he said, well, these guys, this is easy. Up at Thomas Cooley, we had to actually stand up, like, they would call on you randomly.
Steve Palmer [:You would stand up like in the old days and recite the case facts and the rule and what you learned from it. And they would chastise you if you didn't do it.
Norm Murdock [:Bella, have you done moot court?
Bella Matta [:I have not.
Norm Murdock [:That's coming up 3rd year? Mhmm. Is it okay.
Steve Palmer [:What so I mean, look. Not to put you on the spot here, but what are you gonna do with your lottery? Any thoughts yet?
Bella Matta [:I'm not completely sure yet. I do like family law. I'm in it now. I find that interesting. But
Steve Palmer [:I'm not Divorce work?
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Yeah. Adoptions. Mhmm. All that.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. No. No. I mean, you can say I'm gonna do adoptions, but you're gonna do, like, 3 a year. So divorce work is what you're talking about. Right. Yeah. So they don't teach I do have another series, called Lawyer Talk.
Steve Palmer [:I do a podcast. And one of them now is what they don't teach you or they don't teach you that in law school. So, like, you can say, I'm gonna be an adoption lawyer, but good luck. Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:You know, you're not gonna find any you're not gonna Unless you work
Norm Murdock [:for an agency, you know, like like, that's all they do and you're the staff attorney.
Steve Palmer [:A staff attorney or something. But, yeah, I mean, family laws and I've never heard anybody. This is true. I've never heard anybody say, I wanna go be a family lawyer.
Bella Matta [:Really?
Steve Palmer [:Ever. Ever. Now and And this is the funny part. My my footnote or my response to this question is typically, you're gonna do whatever your first job is. You know, that's that's sort of what it is. And that was true of me. I became a criminal defense lawyer because I walked into a criminal defense law firm one day and got a job as a clerk, and I fell in love with it.
Norm Murdock [:So the the stat when I graduated from law school was that and and that was 1985. The stat the stat was that over half of the graduating lawyers that year did not become lawyers. The the law school students went into a variety of other things. And the, speaker at my graduation ceremony was, the head of either Revlon or one of the major cosmetic companies in, New York City, and she had graduated from our law school at the bottom of the class. And here she was CEO Wow. Of and she never practiced the day of law. She went right into the business world and succeeded to the point where she climbed the ladder. Right.
Norm Murdock [:And so it's a great education for all kinds of things.
Steve Palmer [:Well, let me ask you. Because look, when I my dad was a law professor, and he used to say it's the best education you can get because you're gonna learn to do just about everything. And he used to say, I can do what you do, maybe not as well, but I can do what you do, mister accountant or, mister business guy or or whatever. But you can't be a lawyer. And he wasn't being a smart ass about it. 1, because the education is different, and 2, because it takes a license and it takes, you know, different things. But, I think that that is now no longer I think that factually, it might be true. But from a economic standpoint, I think it's probably out of reach.
Steve Palmer [:What so, like, are people going into debt for law school these days?
Bella Matta [:I would assume.
Steve Palmer [:I mean, it's expensive.
Bella Matta [:Right. Yeah. I know a lot of people have to take out loans, and I would assume majority of them do. I'm very
Steve Palmer [:I'm not asking you. Yeah. I know. So you don't have to tell us. But, no.
Bella Matta [:You're completely fine. Yeah. No. Definitely. People are going in debt
Steve Palmer [:over it. And and and my point is is that I is what's the mean salary now or the average do you know the average salary for lawyers coming out and starting? It's gotta
Norm Murdock [:be low. Right?
Bella Matta [:I think it's plummeting. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not positive. But, yeah, especially if you have undergraduate debt also. I mean Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:You come out staring at, like, $300 worth of debt or something. Right. That would be insane. And the other thing I wanna ask you about is AI. You know, I I have we didn't get to go to use artificial intelligence for our legal research or anything else. In fact, when I started, Norm, probably even you probably still use the dicennials in the old books in the library.
Norm Murdock [:Oh, we had no LexisNexis. There were no terminals in the law school. Yeah. I was There was no Internet.
Steve Palmer [:At the front. Yeah. And, you know, we we learned both. But how does AI play a role in what you're doing? And does does anybody talking about, well, wait a minute. All this research now can be done artificially. We don't need these lawyers.
Bella Matta [:Right. Yeah. The teachers have, like, thrown their concern out there about it, but we use Lexus in our writing classes. And Yeah. Really, you're just looking up the terms, and it'll bring you to it right away that you don't almost don't even need AI. But, yeah, I could see where that would be a concern for lost schools.
Steve Palmer [:How do they know? I saw this ad, this TikTok thing, I think, or some short video where this guy it was, obviously, a student age guy selling an app that said it was supposed to defeat AI detection software that the teachers were using.
Norm Murdock [:Oh, my goodness.
Steve Palmer [:So it's like it's this cat and mouse game.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Three-dimensional chess, like, you know, mister Spock.
Steve Palmer [:You can just write the name and sign it yourself, and it would be easier.
Norm Murdock [:Anyway Well, since we brought up, Springfield
Steve Palmer [:Let's kick it off.
Norm Murdock [:In your in your
Steve Palmer [:So Springfield is a small city in Ohio. Yes. And that's,
Norm Murdock [:Approximately 80,000 people.
Steve Palmer [:80,000. About an hour west of Columbus right off I-seventy Clark County.
Norm Murdock [:And the early reports were that 20,000 Haitians had been located there by the government under a temporary passport program that allows the president to use the his parole authority to bring in populations that he considers at risk. So that's what happened, and it happened in conjunction with, DeWine and Biden.
Steve Palmer [:So when does all this happen?
Norm Murdock [:This happened during the last 4 to, you know, 5 years. And here we are. They're now saying that because, you know, it's kind of like when when when people like in Dearborn, Michigan, when a lot of, Arabs, decide that they're gonna have a neighborhood in Dearborn, it attracts more Arabs who come in of their own volition. Yeah. And that's what's happened. So other Haitian, settlement locations around the country, many of the Haitians, about 10,000 more, are said to have come to Springfield beyond the original twenty. So they're saying it's more like 30,000, which means, basically, one out of every 3 people you meet in Springfield these days is a Haitian, which which I mean, that's a, you know, pretty dramatic.
Steve Palmer [:That's pretty significant. Right.
Norm Murdock [:You know, and and it's not about hating anybody from any country or it's not about race. It's just about the culture is so different. Many don't speak English. They speak French Right. Or or some, you know, some kind of variation of of French from the Caribbean. And Well,
Steve Palmer [:the pot's not melting anymore. That's what I think is really what you're saying. I mean, it's it's more like we have a bunch of different pots, and they're not melting together.
Norm Murdock [:And to concentrate so many people from one place into a small town like Springfield is I mean, I'm waving the unfairness flag. It's just it like, just sociologically, that just doesn't work. I mean, that's not a way to get people enculturated and get them to, as you say, melt into our culture. It's too many people, and it bowls over the support structure of a city. You know, government, apartment rent, you know, cost. Just everything gets overwhelmed. That's a huge number of people.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. I mean, for a small town. Yeah. So you said, Bella, that you had inform or you were following somebody who was following this before it became I mean, I didn't know anything about the Haitians in Springfield until, like, 2 weeks ago or a week ago. Yeah.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. I was, watching Anthony, Harris. He was the one that spoke at the city council meeting. His video kinda went viral. He was in the red sweatshirt.
Norm Murdock [:Yes.
Bella Matta [:He was on Facebook prior showing all the videos of all the car accidents, flipping cars, and he did a few live streams. So I was kinda keeping up with that a little bit. And then he was also talking about the ducks in the park and how they're cutting the heads off ducks.
Steve Palmer [:So he's the source of all this?
Bella Matta [:Well, there were a few families. I watched that whole city council meeting, and they were all coming forward. And it was
Steve Palmer [:By they, you mean, like, the the residents?
Bella Matta [:Right. Right. Yeah. The families in that community and just how they're, like, just impacted by this. They're camping out in their front yards and throwing mattresses in the front yards, and families are essentially just packing up and leaving.
Steve Palmer [:This is this is what this is this is what the problem is. So, you know, look. I we can I don't wanna do a deep dive into the debate, the Trump Harris debate? But Trump brings us up, and he goes, well, look. The people are saying it. But on the other hand, I think there's been this sort of whitewashing out of the media that says, look, there's not there's no verification of any of this. The city council has got their they're saying, no, we don't we're not gonna substantiate. But who is on the ground actually doing something to figure it out one way or another?
Norm Murdock [:So I'm not even interested in mis behavior. So that's not where I'm coming from. I'm just talking about the ability for city services of a small town. And there's a there's a town in Kentucky.
Steve Palmer [:That is the issue though. Right.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. So I'm not talking about eating ducks or cats. Or or no. Well, hang on. So I I don't care about any of that. That that's all nice apocryphal stuff to talk about. But, like, there's a small city in Kentucky where they they settled more Somalians in that town than there were people in the town beforehand. So, you know, if they get to vote at some point
Steve Palmer [:It changes everything. Right? I mean So what you're talking about is, look, we have a certain infrastructure in place in the site the in the town sort of it's not in one or the other. It's both sort of seesawing, I would think, at the same time. So as your population grows, the infrastructure and the budget grows, and the tax revenue grows, and you have the ability or a town or a city has the ability to sort of keep up.
Norm Murdock [:Yes. But if
Steve Palmer [:you just dump a bunch of people in it, it's overwhelmed immediately. It's overwhelmed. And the the misbehavior is a result of that. Right? You don't have the police on the ground to deal with this. You don't even know how to deal with this because you've never had to. And I don't know what the tax revenue is from a bunch of illegal immigrants or maybe they are illegal. I don't know.
Norm Murdock [:Well, they were brought in under this parole authority.
Steve Palmer [:So, presumably, they have some sort of
Norm Murdock [:Oh, yeah. They have temporary not unlawful immigrants. That's right. They have temporary passports. However, I was listening to, Lindsey Graham and and Jim Jordan, speak about that program. That program in in the federal code, that program says that each person who is gonna be paroled has to be individually assessed.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. And you know that's what's happening. Right?
Norm Murdock [:Well, no. No. They admitted they're not doing they're so Biden didn't do that. They're just not doing it. Now our governor is from Springfield and I find it highly interesting that the town that his family is from and that he's from, him and Fran and their, you know, progeny, that this is in that town. And I just wonder, you know, what are the possible explanations behind that?
Steve Palmer [:Who's making money?
Norm Murdock [:Right. I wonder.
Steve Palmer [:Who's making money? Where are these people living? Is it a housing project that's now getting money from the government? Is there a federal subsidy going to somebody?
Norm Murdock [:Well, as Bella mentioned, people are saying that they they have left or they're in the process of leaving because they can't afford the apartments anymore because, you know, section 8 housing. Right? That they're gonna they're gonna charge the max that the government's gonna reimburse
Steve Palmer [:Sure.
Norm Murdock [:For these,
Steve Palmer [:and that screws up the rental market
Norm Murdock [:for everybody. Up the rental market.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:And Springfield's not exactly a boom town. It's it's like where old military people from Wright Patt Air Force Base, for example, would move to Springfield for their retirement because it it was a Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:It's right in between Dayton and Columbus.
Norm Murdock [:Less expensive place to leave live in Wittenberg. Wittenberg. Right. Division 3 university there. Huber Heights. Those kinds of places. Yeah. So, you know, I got hit on the highway by 1, of these out of control immigrants where again, it was a traffic accident.
Norm Murdock [:I'm not saying anything about the person's, character or about their race or, I I don't even know what country they were from. But now that it's been revealed, I was at the Springfield exit on I seventy when this happened. So it probably was. And at any rate, I I think that, the other comments from the citizens is that their home insurance rates and their car insurance rates have gone spastic. And they've gone nationally. That's a story anyway. But in Springfield now, because of the damage and the claims that are being made, that it has dramatically risen, which increases the cost of living for people living there
Steve Palmer [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:You know, who were there before this mass immigration was was thrust on them. And what I don't get my my problem with this, I don't get that even if Biden is gonna do this, which I disagree with. Right? I mean, there are a lot of countries where there are destitute people. I mean, we could import half of Kenya. We could import import half of Greece. We could import half of Lebanon. We could import, you know, big chunks of the former Soviet Union. I mean, there are a lot of people who are in desperate financial straits and we're not importing 20,000 of them and plopping them in small cities.
Norm Murdock [:So what I'm what I am in disbelief about is that our governor and president Biden and the infrastructure didn't spread these people out. Like like Well, look. Why didn't they do that? Like, Minneapolis has this huge Somali population. Why didn't they put 5,000 there, 5,000 in Toledo, 5,000 in Indianapolis, 5,000 in Denver? Why didn't they spread this out? Why is it taking 20,000 people and putting them in one small city is bizarre to me. It's just it seems unworkable on the face of it.
Steve Palmer [:I don't have an answer.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. I don't have an answer.
Steve Palmer [:I mean, look, I got some speculation. So on one hand, it creates a power base that you wouldn't otherwise have. Right? Because the more people like you said, sooner or later, they're gonna start voting. Similarly, they're gonna start having some, local political control, and it grows from there. And that's sort of what's happening in that crisis happening in Deerpoint.
Norm Murdock [:Well, in in Ilhan Omar
Steve Palmer [:Yes.
Norm Murdock [:Out of out of Minneapolis.
Steve Palmer [:Right? So, look, I mean, if you could there's probably a constellation that you could connect that people would say, well, that's what their end goal is. But I think probably another like, Thomas Sowell has there's I think he wrote a book called I know he wrote a book called Race and Racism in America. And I think
Norm Murdock [:The famous economist. Just yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. But he he took apart this is this is going going a little sideways about bringing it back home. He took apart this notion of, segregated living. And apparently, he did a study, and I'm I'm shooting for memory from a book I read, like, 7, 8 years ago. But he there's he did a study on how people sort when they decide where to live, and it it's it's pretty normal for people sort with their own, ethnic background. So you're gonna go live with people like you, and the immigrants are gonna go live. So you had Italian villages. You had Mhmm.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. The Greek villages. You had the Jewish villages. You had Arabic. Even when, like, these initial immigrants to the Irish, and they would tend to sort. And it takes a long time to sort of break that up. Yeah. So there's another argument here.
Steve Palmer [:The counterargument is these people are just going where there other people are going. And and it makes sense that they're gonna sort and choose to live where they are where their friends went.
Norm Murdock [:Well, that's that that explains the additional 10,000 where they're getting the 30,000 number now is they put the initial 20,000 there by government edict. And then another 10,000 said, hey. There's a big community of my fellow Right.
Steve Palmer [:You're gonna be comfortable.
Norm Murdock [:That's right.
Steve Palmer [:They they speak the language. It
Norm Murdock [:makes sense. It does make sense.
Steve Palmer [:So in an encounter argument to my to what we're talking about is we got how does the pot start to melt? Like, what is the, like, what is the impetus for this? Right. And I think in the old days, it used to be that we didn't find that we, being the country, functioned in a certain United States identify identifiable way. You know, you spoke English, the classes we're taught, and so you just eventually were sort of forced to assimilate. But I think the difference now is that doesn't happen as much. Yeah. And people aren't forced to assimilate like they used to. So I don't think we're getting the traditional melting pot, at least not as fast as we as we might have otherwise.
Norm Murdock [:I agree.
Steve Palmer [:I think you used to be what? One generation away, you were you were sort of you were there. If grandma spoke Italian, you didn't even know Italian.
Norm Murdock [:So, you know, the Springfield school system is obligated to educate the children of these 20 to 30000 Asian people. And just imagine that if one out of every 3 people in Springfield now is a Haitian who wasn't there before and they have children, of course they have having children or already had children. Think of the hit on Springfield Public School System. I mean, just Right. I mean I mean, that's just one small little bit of this. And that's a that's a deleterious impact that the children in Springfield, including these Haitian children, they're just not gonna get a great education if the class size goes from 25 or 30 to 60.
Steve Palmer [:Whether it's education, whether it's infrastructure, whether it's housing, whatever it is, it dilutes it in a way that impacts everybody. So it just changes the dynamic for everybody. And I think that was the beef out of these the the people that you're watching. That was their beef. It's like, look, you took our town and changed it overnight Right. And we can't function. And I think, that it's it's bloated now Yeah. Beyond the resources of the community.
Steve Palmer [:But both infrastructure and cash.
Norm Murdock [:So I saw where governor DeWine dispatched, State Highway Patrol Troopers to help to supplement the Springfield City Police and the and the county over there, you know, to to to help them enforce the law. You know, like, they have some kind of civil order. Yep. So, now now it's a state issue as well as a federal issue as well as a local issue. Like, this is really and it became a a topic in the debate Mhmm. Between, the vice president and, president Trump. So,
Steve Palmer [:I mean, I hate to talk about the debate, but we sort of have to.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Well, you know, and I think we should. I I my biggest my biggest thing about that debate was, you know, you had one guy debating 3 people.
Bella Matta [:Exactly.
Norm Murdock [:And, you know, and and the questions were so, you know, like, mister Trump, it's well known that you're a racist. What do you think about you being a racist?
Steve Palmer [:Oh, sure.
Norm Murdock [:It was, you know, like, what kind of questions are
Steve Palmer [:It was it was certainly now unlike the first debate with Biden, I think, which easily could have gone that way, but it didn't. The commentators, I think, did a fine job.
Norm Murdock [:They did a fair job on CNN.
Steve Palmer [:So, Bella, what'd you think about the debate? Like, if you if you could say who wins the debate?
Bella Matta [:I think it went kinda how I expected it to. I think Kamala went in. She memorized her lines. You know? She did exactly what they wanted her to do or what they, you know, nominated her to do when they kicked Biden out. But I do still think Trump won. I think we were all waiting for him to go in and just have a grand slam because all I've seen of Kamala before was, like, her giggling in all these interviews, and I haven't really heard much from her. But I think she did better than a lot of people expected. But Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:I think
Bella Matta [:Kamala still don't think she fully answered a question.
Steve Palmer [:She didn't have to.
Bella Matta [:Right. Yeah. She could've walked off the stage. No one would have
Norm Murdock [:She didn't have to. Have handled it. Yeah. But I I'm I'm with you, Bella. I think the reaction about this debate is still rolling.
Steve Palmer [:Mhmm.
Norm Murdock [:I think people are processing a little bit about this as they think about it. You know, when she was asked to explain, for example, her flop on 3 different issues.
Bella Matta [:Mhmm.
Norm Murdock [:And she said, oh, but I wanna talk about this other thing first and then I'll come back to those. And she never came back to them.
Steve Palmer [:Of course not. But but they all do that on the stage. And the problem is that's a moderator problem.
Norm Murdock [:That's a moderator problem. That's why I'm saying he debated 3 people.
Steve Palmer [:You know, in the first debate
Norm Murdock [:fact checked him and in fact, their facts were completely wrong.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. They were wrong.
Norm Murdock [:Right. So so for example, the, the the the lady commentator whose name I don't know, I'd never seen her on on air. I had seen David Muir on air. But the lady commentator fact checked Trump on the abortion claim that, botched abortion babies. There's no state, she said, in which they're allowed to die. Oh, you're completely full of crap, lady. There's about 15 states that allow botched abortion babies who are born. They're a lot that's a live baby on the table, and you're permitted to let that baby die and not resuscitate.
Bella Matta [:And Tim Waltz spoke out about that.
Steve Palmer [:What did he say about it? He's for that?
Norm Murdock [:That's right. Yeah. They have that they have that. Insane. They have that in Minnesota. Right.
Steve Palmer [:But so abortion was one of those topics that I think if I'm looking at this, they they, being Kamala and the moderator, scored against Trump on this. Like, he did not come off as, like and I and I get it. He he was ganged up on a little bit.
Norm Murdock [:Well, he said the truth. He said it's up to the states now.
Steve Palmer [:He said it's up to the states now. But if if you this this is like I I just wish I could get in these people's ears and and and help them. Because, like, Trump's position on it like, he keeps going back to this that all the scholars, all the people, all the legal, but they all wanted
Norm Murdock [:to be back in the states.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. He doesn't need to do that. No. What he needs to say is, look. There is a divide in this country about abortion.
Norm Murdock [:Mhmm.
Steve Palmer [:And anybody who says otherwise is flat out lying to you. So if you're pro abortion, then you believe that and you and that's how it is. And if you're against abortion, you believe that that's how it is. And it's about it's pretty close to 5050, maybe 51, 49. Whatever it is, it's pretty close.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:So when you have an issue like that, mister moderator, what you need to do is give that to the people to figure it out. Instead, what you want to do, what these people wanna do, what they wanna do is cram it down on everybody, and that feels very authoritarian and a very dictator in is that the right word? Dictator in from the federal government. Mhmm. And if if the federal government is cramming down in a local place, some viewpoint that I don't agree with, it feels like
Norm Murdock [:Well, that's what Roe v Wade did.
Steve Palmer [:That's what Roe v Wade did.
Norm Murdock [:It was the federal government. Mhmm.
Steve Palmer [:What our court did, hand selected if that's the word you wanna use because the president does have the authority to pick Supreme Court justices. So call it hand selected, but when they pick justices, it's also hand selected.
Norm Murdock [:Of course.
Steve Palmer [:What our court did is they referred this back to the state so we could figure it out, so the people could figure it out, so each individual state could figure it out. And they're figuring it out in their own way, and it's gonna and Trump sort of made this point. But
Norm Murdock [:Well, he directly asked Kamala Then he goes, do you want you in favor of any restrictions?
Steve Palmer [:And what he did in polls?
Norm Murdock [:And she and she she wouldn't answer that.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:He said, what about the 8th month? What about the 9th month? What about the day of the birth? Can you still get an abortion right, you know, before the baby naturally is born? And she wouldn't answer that question.
Steve Palmer [:But she
Norm Murdock [:And the and the commentator the the moderators didn't follow that up.
Steve Palmer [:And and look, Kamala was well prepared for this, and that she did she her tactic worked. Like, she criticized Trump on his rallies and how many people were there and whether I was and and she immediately got in this case.
Norm Murdock [:Was she outright lied about Charlottesville? I mean, that old I don't
Steve Palmer [:think that works anymore, though. I think that's
Norm Murdock [:Well, the moderators needed to point that out. They needed to fact check her. No. Trump didn't say that white supremacists and skinheads are good people.
Steve Palmer [:Does anybody really think this anymore, though?
Norm Murdock [:That's not what he said. He was talking about people who were on both sides of whether a monument
Steve Palmer [:But it's been like
Norm Murdock [:should be in in the town square. He wasn't talking about the protesters, for god's sake.
Steve Palmer [:If you're Trump responding to that, it's like, why are you bringing up this why are you bringing this up again? Isn't it now been completely debunked what I said, yet you're bringing it up here? What are you trying to get people to think? Do you wanna talk about the real issues, or do you wanna talk about this trope that you and Biden keep slinging at me that's been debunked a hundred times. And you, moderators, why aren't you calling
Norm Murdock [:me wrong? That's what he did.
Steve Palmer [:That's what I would have said. I would have if they're gonna debate me, I would have debated them.
Norm Murdock [:So Newt Gingrich won South Carolina when he took on John King of CNN and said, hey, John. Do you want to run for president? I mean, why don't you come up your I mean, you seem to have a lot of opinions that you want to say are my opinions. So why don't you moderate or you run for president also? Pick 1 or the other, and then Newt won the South Carolina.
Steve Palmer [:Right. So this if I were in Trump's shoes, that's what I'd hand.
Norm Murdock [:Absolutely.
Steve Palmer [:This is what they teach you in law school. This is what the Socratic method teaches you. Absolutely. When you start getting barraged with that crap, you learn how to deal with it.
Norm Murdock [:Exactly. Right.
Steve Palmer [:And it's difficult because you feel criticized, you feel inferior, you feel like you're under attack. Right. Mhmm. But the law school method teaches you and conditions you to deal with that. So when you have a judge coming at you, you can you can be respectful, and at the same time, give it right back.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:It's like, no. Why is that question being asked of me? So why ask me that question when you're not asking her these questions? I feel like this debate isn't fair. I feel like I'm debating you and miss Harris.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:What say you, CNN or NBC or ABC? What say you to that?
Norm Murdock [:Well, she she rolled out a number of things. She had a lot of economic plan gimmicks. I'm I'm gonna give I'm gonna give small business people in their 1st year of of startup a $50,000 deduction. I'm I'm gonna give new parents who have their first baby $6,000 I'm you know, all of this all of this, you know, Santa Claus stuff instead of like, that's not gonna fix the economy.
Steve Palmer [:It's not even gonna come close.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. I'm gonna ope tips. I'm not gonna tax tips. You know, she stole that from Trump. All that kind of stuff. It's all ticky tacky, meaningless, like, feel good stuff that you would say on The View, maybe.
Steve Palmer [:So you know what I mean?
Norm Murdock [:Bunch of dummies to go, oh, you care about us.
Steve Palmer [:So Bella, here here's what I think. When I hear, like, she's gonna give small businesses a $50,000 deduction, I'm thinking, I think Common Sense Ohio is a small business. Oh, jeez. Right? So Wow. And I wonder if we can take a deduction here as a loss and then apply it to other parts or other businesses I have in my in my, in my livelihood. See, but this is what and the point of this is, like, as soon as you create policies and programs like that, people abuse the crap out of it. Of course. And it's not gonna be the people who need the money.
Steve Palmer [:It's gonna be the people who abuse it to get a deduction that they can apply somewhere else. And it's probably gonna be people that support her because that's why she's doing it.
Norm Murdock [:You also saw the big payoff of the Democrats' lawfare against Trump in all of these legal cases. When Kamala was able to say, oh, I'm the only person up here on stage who hasn't been convicted of a felony. And, you know, you're over there and you've been successfully pursued in civil court for sexual assault. No. You know, all of these things that have been conjured up and manipulated, the fruition came true during the debate.
Steve Palmer [:So if I'm Trump, you just turn and say you are a 100% correct. And I'm the only political target ever to be prosecuted
Norm Murdock [:By your
Steve Palmer [:by my political rivals.
Norm Murdock [:By your administration.
Steve Palmer [:By my political rivals. And I think, yes, I've been convicted of felony, but more important, more dangerous is the fact that your DOJ did it.
Norm Murdock [:That's right. At your behest.
Steve Palmer [:At your behest. Right.
Norm Murdock [:So so we Fonnie Willis came up to visit the White House. I think
Steve Palmer [:Why don't we talk about time. Why don't we talk about will you release all the communication between you and all these local prosecutors about my prosecutions. Right. Will you talk to us about that? Will you tell CNN that? Will you tell ABC that? Right.
Norm Murdock [:I bet you won't. Right. Why why am I being pursued for, records keeping violations?
Steve Palmer [:So he didn't need to go there, though. Because everybody knows that. So again, if I'm if I'm directing Trump yeah. But I wouldn't have to go there.
Norm Murdock [:But your administration, your president did worse. He didn't even have presidential immunity in his his garage next to his Corvette.
Steve Palmer [:Gotcha. But I mean, he doesn't but that's everybody knows that. So but you have to point it out. It's like, I am curious what interaction you had with DOJ with respect to any of my prosecutions. Will you release all those documents? Or are you just gonna get stand up here and say nothing?
Norm Murdock [:The other very pregnant, kind of question that that could have paid off well was when, David Meir said, well, let's talk about truth telling, you know, by by, you know, in America. That that America has a trouble with the truth. And that was a beautiful and then he, of course, launched into j 6. But that was an opportunity for Trump to talk about all of the social media censorship by the FBI, Department of Justice, CIA, CDC, Department of Homeland Security that has been admitted to by Zuckerberg, has been admitted to by Elon Musk's Twitter releases, that our federal government under you, Kamala and Joe, have tried to silence discussion that you don't want us to have by the American so you wanna talk about truth telling. Right? You won't let us even talk about the truth. You're you're you're, you know, you're suppressing us.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Well, look. I mean
Norm Murdock [:Which to me is the biggest story. I mean, first amendment. You don't have first amendment. You don't have anything.
Steve Palmer [:Well, no. That's right. But again, Trump Trump needs a better answer to the j 6. Like, he I I I'm surprised he wasn't prepared for that. Do you regret anything about January 6? It's a it's a loaded question.
Norm Murdock [:I regret it happened, but I don't I didn't cause it to happen.
Steve Palmer [:Right. I regret World
Norm Murdock [:War 1, World War 2, Korea, Vietnam. I regret a lot of things happening.
Steve Palmer [:You have to be able to dice that question up. And again, and this is a law school. Right. Like, you have to say, I I you have to you have to call them for calling you on that question. Look, I've answered lots of questions about January 6th. Why are you asking me about that now? But since you did, yes, I regret that January 6th happened. But the way you asked that question, you're sort of implying that it was all my fault. That's not true.
Norm Murdock [:It wasn't his fault at all. Nancy Pelosi is on camera admitting it's her fault.
Steve Palmer [:And and to the extent that you're trying to assess sole blame on me, you're doing it to the exclusion of anybody else you could blame. So this is a cliche attack. And if you wanna go down that rabbit hole, why don't we schedule a news conference to do it? But today, I think everybody wants to hear about her and my views on where we are going forward. Like like, he should have that answer in his back pocket.
Norm Murdock [:Well, and in fact
Steve Palmer [:I didn't. I just made it up.
Norm Murdock [:He has not been charged nor prosecuted in any way for insurrection at all. None of the charges against Trump.
Steve Palmer [:Oh, that's right. Right.
Norm Murdock [:None of it involves insurrection charges. So it's all it's all just bullshit. And he did mention that Nancy Pelosi admitted that it was her fault in her daughter's own movie about
Steve Palmer [:None of that's catching. So part of me thinks part of me thinks that none of this is gonna move the needle at all.
Norm Murdock [:I don't think it will.
Steve Palmer [:Mhmm. I mean, where do you think like, what's your prediction on the polls going forward?
Norm Murdock [:The inside polling, according to the Trump campaign now, right, they're a biased source. So we'll we'll find out. I think it's still rolling out. They say he got a 3 point bounce out of this debate.
Bella Matta [:I did hear that.
Steve Palmer [:I don't I don't think we know yet. I think
Norm Murdock [:I don't think we know yet.
Steve Palmer [:She's gonna get a little bit of a bump, but who knows?
Norm Murdock [:I I think you're right. I think, actually, you're right. I don't think there'll be a result before either one of them. I think it was a draw.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. I I I don't even know if it was a draw. I think, comma 1 like, if I'm looking at debate performance No.
Norm Murdock [:I mean, for the campaign.
Steve Palmer [:For the campaign. Right. If I'm looking at debate performance, I have to give it to Kamala. I mean, look, she was well prepared. Yeah. The the now it wasn't necessarily fair for Trump because he was being he had 3 people he was debating, and they were in I it's not even that they were that they were pushing back on him. That's fine. Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:But they weren't pushing back on her. No. And I think, Bella, what you said is all her laughing and cackling and stupid mannerisms. It occurs when people push back on her.
Norm Murdock [:Well, her haughty, arrogant appearance, when she would look over at him and go, you know, it was like a wife and a husband in the kitchen bitching about each, you know,
Steve Palmer [:each other. So let's talk about this, though. You just said, why don't you
Norm Murdock [:take the thermostat up? No. I want it down. And then she looks at you like that. You look back at her. It was just ridiculous, the whole thing.
Bella Matta [:I really don't know if her poll numbers will go up, though, because
Steve Palmer [:Yeah.
Bella Matta [:The 3 main issues that people are concerned about, the border, economy, crime, Trump is leading by so much of the polls over that. And the only issue that she was very passionate about on the stage was abortion. And I I think we expected that from her, but we really wanted to hear her stance on the border and the economy, and she just did not.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. She has nothing substantive on those
Norm Murdock [:things.
Bella Matta [:She did not answer well.
Norm Murdock [:I don't think the needle's gonna move. We don't necessarily, in America, elect the best debater. They say Richard Dixon won the debate against John Kennedy if you listen to it on the radio.
Steve Palmer [:But on TV, he did.
Norm Murdock [:But on TV, he did.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. And yet, Kennedy won.
Steve Palmer [:Well, look, I I but here's what the the I think we don't necessarily elect the best debater, but we do, I think, often elect the people that we like.
Norm Murdock [:He looked way more serious.
Steve Palmer [:He looked pissed off. He they she got in his kitchen a little bit. He was he was fired up. He was a little bit of emotional. He had the adrenaline run
Norm Murdock [:and he spoke about some issues like the possible World War 3. We right now have Anthony Blinken meeting with NATO, right, today to discuss whether or not NATO weapons will be at long range weapons will be allowed to go deep inside Russia.
Steve Palmer [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:So you got NATO in effect using Ukraine as a, you know, as a proxy to attack Russia? Russia's got nukes. Can you imagine them bombarding and they have hit targets in Moscow, but if they really start bombarding Moscow, I think Putin's gonna push a button, man.
Steve Palmer [:So, Bella, what's your what's your take on this? Because I think
Norm Murdock [:That's crazy.
Steve Palmer [:Here's the big picture. I think Trump was right on these big picture issues. I think he was right about what you're talking about in the world. I think he was right about what's going on in the borders. I think he's right about what's going on in the economy. But I think the message he doesn't necessarily deliver the message very well. And what what what's your what's the take in your age group about how people really feel about that? Because I sort of feel like people don't give a crap about the issues. They just vote.
Steve Palmer [:They're, like, I'm gonna go with Kamala. And here, they don't even they can't even say why. And maybe the people voting for Trump, I think a lot of them are just because they hate Kamala. But, I mean, what's your take on do people really care about those issues?
Bella Matta [:I think so. I think I'm getting older, and I'm eventually gonna graduate school in about 2 years here, and these issues matter. And, I think Trump isn't the best at debating. I've said that for years. I think he tries to fit too many points in in one, and he gets lost. And it's hard for just average Americans to know what he's talking about or to keep up with him. But, yeah, I think the younger generation, like, we've lived through Trump, and now we're living through, Biden, And we could just see the difference in everyday life. So I think those, like, the crime and economy, they matter more than people think.
Bella Matta [:Like
Steve Palmer [:Well, it's sort of like fish don't know they're swimming in water. Right? I mean, it's like we had a great and and, you know, Norm, this is going back. How old were you? I'm not gonna ask how old you are, but I think there's a generation that didn't understand that the Obama years sucked
Bella Matta [:Mhmm.
Steve Palmer [:From an economic standpoint because they didn't have to worry about it. You know, they were in in school or their parents had to worry about whatever, but Right. It was like a regulatory nightmare. You know what I mean? It just sucked. Right. And then Trump comes along. It's like, unleash. You know, it's like, holy crap.
Steve Palmer [:We all we were all eating, Drill baby rainbow stew. That stuff. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, things were good. We were having, you know, we we we were everybody was making money. Things were just great. And I think your generation sort of smoothed right through that without understanding the difference between what it was before and what it was during Trump.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:And may what worries me is that well, maybe not. Maybe I think what you're saying is now they see, wait a minute. It sort of sucks now.
Bella Matta [:Right. Yeah. Kamala could say as many times as she wants that the economy is great, and we don't have a border issue at all. But we're living through it, and we could see through the lies that we clearly have an issue with the economy. People are struggling to put food on the table at night. So I think Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:But it's that comes down to that. That's price gouging. Right. Like, what do people but I'm serious. That that trope seems to work with people. It's price gouging.
Norm Murdock [:Sherrod Sherrod Brown's using that.
Steve Palmer [:And and I always say and my response is, well, why did they side to decide to start price gouging with Biden and Harris at the White House when they weren't price gouging before? Right. Like, why now? Right.
Norm Murdock [:And what are you waiting for? If you have all these brilliant ideas here in, you know, August just ended here in early September, you know, mid September, You know, why what what are you waiting for? Why don't you go like Trump said in the debate, why don't you waddle on down to Washington, DC, to the White House, and have Biden sign all these wonderful ideas that you you're espousing.
Steve Palmer [:Right. He had those were his moments where he scored some points. Yeah. It should have been his position the entire time. Yeah. But, yeah, you know, I I don't know. What is your bell? What is your take on the youth's understanding of these issues, like, really in-depth? Because we were talking off the air before where you'd see these videos on TikTok where where they'll go stick a microphone in the camera in some kid's face and say, who are you voting for, Kamala? What policies do you like? And it's crickets. They don't even know.
Norm Murdock [:I don't know.
Steve Palmer [:And I and I suppose you could do the same thing with people who say they're voting for Trump. It's, like, what's the really do you have an idea of what the in-depth understanding is of it? Or they just they're I mean, some of those are probably just cut out too. They're only picking the funny ones.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. I think, definitely the school systems are very left leaning, so the younger generation is just indoctrinated into that. And they think the main issues in the world are just abortions, and that seems to be people's main concern or at least girls. When I've talked to girls, they'll admit things were better under Trump. You know, day to day life, things were more affordable and, like, crime was better, but they'll be like, I just can't vote for him because of the abortion thing. So it's just such a heavy topic and
Steve Palmer [:Which is interesting because he's not really against it. Like, his position on I don't agree with it.
Bella Matta [:No. That's what I don't get. He's not even pro life, so I don't really understand where this is coming from.
Norm Murdock [:And Ohio has a much more radical pro abortion.
Steve Palmer [:Even nationwide, the law amendment.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. I think it's just the tactics of the media just constantly Kamala saying time after time, Trump's abortion ban. Trump's abortion ban.
Norm Murdock [:He's gonna sign a bill. He's gonna sign a scary bill. Yeah. You know? And he said, no. I'm not gonna sign any such bill.
Bella Matta [:Right. People my age aren't taking the time to, you know, research it and actually see what Trump's about. They're just seeing the headlines like Trump's abortion ban, and it scares them. And then they take it and run.
Norm Murdock [:You know you know, Bella, one of the issues that I thought the students would really, get drawn in by, and they seem to see through it mainly that it that it was a tactic to just buy their votes was the school debt forgiveness. Mhmm. Right.
Steve Palmer [:Let's let's see your take on that.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. Because you must be hearing that both having been an undergrad and now you're in law school, you must be talking to students that owe money. And I don't think they're really buying that the federal government's ever really going to gorge, or or, you know, discard their debt. Like like, say, broadly, you know, they've picked specific populations and situations, but they haven't been able to get past the supreme court, the Biden administration, to just do a wide Mhmm. Debt forgiveness.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:Right?
Bella Matta [:I never thought that would actually happen. When they first proposed that, I figured even if they did, there would be stipulations with it. You know? Yeah. So many years or, you know Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:National. Color.
Bella Matta [:Right. Yeah. I figured there would be a lot of different requirements you have to meet to get even stronger.
Norm Murdock [:The other thing
Bella Matta [:Trump could've So
Norm Murdock [:he could've jumped in on that race thing. You know, it's like, I'm obsessed with race. How about you guys?
Bella Matta [:Exactly.
Norm Murdock [:Have to be a certain color and gender to get federal benefits. Right. What could be more racist than that?
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:You know?
Bella Matta [:But you
Norm Murdock [:you think the students, they they're not falling for it.
Bella Matta [:I don't think anymore. No. I think it did tempt people at first. I did hear that from a few
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. I mean, the Supreme Court's knocked him down twice.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:And it's like, oh, yeah. Maybe Congress does need to authorize this.
Bella Matta [:Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah.
Bella Matta [:And it's just, like, unfair. My parents saved for my college since I the day I was born.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Bella Matta [:And it's just
Norm Murdock [:And they sacrificed.
Bella Matta [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:They didn't buy a boat.
Bella Matta [:Right. You know?
Norm Murdock [:They, you know, they they didn't go on
Bella Matta [:lunch or anything. Done. But yeah. Their main concern was getting us through school, me and my sisters. So, yeah, I think it's kind of unfair that some parents, you know, plan for that and set money aside and then others don't. And then they're just
Norm Murdock [:And graduates, some students really work at repaying early
Bella Matta [:Mhmm.
Norm Murdock [:You know, and they'll they'll pay off their their $100,000 or or, 300,000 or whatever it is in the 1st 10 years of their career. They pay that and then how fair is that to them having paid that back and the guy who's just lounging on the sofa in mom's basement who hasn't paid it back, they just magic wand.
Steve Palmer [:Right.
Norm Murdock [:You don't you don't know that.
Bella Matta [:I think also there may be encouraging too many people to go to school now just in Yeah. You know, high school counselors and stuff that we don't have enough people just out doing, you know, labor every day. So
Steve Palmer [:celebrated. Right? The the trades aren't celebrated at all. That's the
Norm Murdock [:Well and and and where where is the where is the help for them? Like, if you're gonna help the wealthier families that are sending their kids to school, to college, then why aren't you helping the blue collar families who kid kid wants to be a plumber or a roofer?
Steve Palmer [:Why aren't
Norm Murdock [:you buying him a van and a bunch of these tools?
Steve Palmer [:Right? Where where is the where is the subsidy? There's no equity. Where's the subsidy for the Snap on guy?
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. That's right.
Steve Palmer [:You know? Yeah. Because any mechanic knows that the Snap on guy comes around. They're they they yes. Some of these guys, they're $30 in debt
Norm Murdock [:Oh, yeah.
Steve Palmer [:For Snap on tools.
Norm Murdock [:Yeah. On a on a rotating monthly basis, they're paying interest.
Steve Palmer [:Snap on guy comes around, need this, need that, and it's like a a it's a it's a game and they get no help for that at all. So
Norm Murdock [:Do I have do I have time to impeach governor DeWine?
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. Let's do it.
Norm Murdock [:Okay. And then
Steve Palmer [:we gotta wrap it up.
Norm Murdock [:So, governor DeWine isn't the most favorite, governor here on this program. And I wish to point out something. He's a Republican. Okay? I'm a Republican. This is a Republican bashing a Republican. Take note people. Take note. See we're fair minded here.
Norm Murdock [:I don't give a crap what your party is or who you're voting for. I deal in facts and the fact is that governor DeWine exploited, knew ahead of time, helped arrange with, and has done public appearances with this Haitian bomb that was dropped on his hometown of Springfield. That's count number 1. He knew it ahead of time. He did not tell us. He did not give the people of Springfield any kind of vote or say so in the matter. They were simply victims of a decision made by his highness here in Columbus, about what their lives were gonna be like without them having any kind of democratic small d say so as to that happening. He did that with intel out in eastern Columbus, New Albany, Johnstown area.
Norm Murdock [:Same thing. There were no zoning meetings. There were no advertisements that Intel's coming. It was just dropped like an atom bomb on the citizens of Ohio. Like it or not, the the skids are greased. Intel's gonna be in your backyard whether you wanna breathe the fumes coming out of their smoke stacks or not. Whether you want they're gonna add 400,000 new residents in Licking County because of intel. Yet not a single person in Licking County, except the other Republicans and some of the Democrats who signed NDAs, they're the only people who got to know about it ahead of time.
Norm Murdock [:Another thing, He he gaslights us. So over in Springfield, this Haitian who was drunk, who drove a school bus into a ditch which rolled and killed an 11 year old boy. Right? What does DeWine do? He says, I'm gonna appoint a blue ribbon commission to study safety aspects of blue of of school buses when that is not the proximate cause of how the accident occurred. The proximate cause is the unfeathered immigration, whether it's illegal or by this parole program of of people into the country who, a, don't have driver's licenses, don't have insurance, and are just driving vehicles. And that's what killed that boy. And and and it's not hate to say so. So his parents are very liberal and have come out and say, quit using our son's death. Hey.
Norm Murdock [:I'm not using your son's death. Right? Even if you don't think that your son's death was caused by immigration policy, I'm allowed to think that, and I don't hate anybody. I love Haitians, and and and it has nothing to do with where they come from, what the race is, what language they speak. I'm just talking about that death would not have happened but for the immigration policy. The, some of the other things. The COVID policies of his highness, for DeWine. A Republican house member filed articles of impeachment during COVID against DeWine because of his illegal shutdown of things like schools and restaurants, and I don't think we should forget that. And lastly, and Brett has brought this up, there seems to be some tie in with FirstEnergy, and their, passage of, jet relief on the nuclear plants up there that FirstEnergy owns.
Norm Murdock [:And, while it hasn't sullied, Mike DeWine, it has sullied the former speaker of the house, Larry Householder, and other people. And I wonder how high it goes. You know, that has not fully been addressed about people in the because DeWine signed the bill. He signed the bill that gave Oh, yeah. Right. Yeah. So was it just on good policy reasons, or was there perhaps some, you know, some other benefits?
Steve Palmer [:All I know did you get your call yet, by the way, Bella? No. From DeWine? No. To to to understand what you need and and and what your household's like and and and really figure out what's in your best interest. Because when he shut down the entire damn state, he said he's doing it for everybody's best interest. I'm still waiting on my call so he could get to know me to figure out what my interest actually are.
Norm Murdock [:Right.
Steve Palmer [:And and and we did it. Remember, Norm? As as We have done it before.
Norm Murdock [:As an excellent law student knows well. Our country is built on the basis our constitution, which Constitution Day was just a few days ago, our constitution is based on individual rights, not collective rights. Yeah. On purpose. On per and and for him to worry about whether or not I get sick, hey, hey, dude. That's my decision.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah.
Norm Murdock [:That's my you know, that's my decision. And and and if I wanna protect my family by having, you know, Uber bring me food and drop it on the porch and then I wait for the van to leave, and then I go out and get my food, and I just stay in the house for 3 years. That's up to me. Or I can not wear a mask and go to Kroger.
Steve Palmer [:Well, he knows what's in your best interest, Norm. He he he knows. So think of how absurd that
Norm Murdock [:He's absurd
Steve Palmer [:that He's from Springfield.
Norm Murdock [:Remember restaurants that had those plexiglass dividers? Somehow
Steve Palmer [:Who made money on the plexiglass?
Norm Murdock [:Somehow diners were very dangerous when they entered the restaurant and had the mask. They had they have the mask on because they were dangerous then.
Steve Palmer [:It just
Norm Murdock [:But as as soon as they sat down, they could pop the mask off and suddenly they're not
Steve Palmer [:We have the tools. What the hell? I remember the speech. We have the tools. We've done it before. We can do it again, which is really what he's saying. I'm gonna shut your asses down again and not let me let you earn any money while I get paid. Yeah. So anybody Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Don't even get paid.
Norm Murdock [:All the
Steve Palmer [:big part. COVID. Yeah. But my my the the same question or the same thing I told everybody else was, when you don't get a paycheck for the next 6 months, you can come talk to me about this.
Norm Murdock [:So this Haitian thing, guys, it just, to me, it's the last straw. The guy's gotta go.
Steve Palmer [:He's impeached. Alright. Well, look.
Norm Murdock [:He's impeached.
Steve Palmer [:Bella, thanks for showing up. Hopefully, we get to see more of you in the show.
Bella Matta [:Yeah. Thank you
Steve Palmer [:for having me. Thanks for listening to Norm.
Norm Murdock [:I'm always a bad guy.
Steve Palmer [:Right. Right. Right. No. He's not a bad guy. He is, but he's not. Anyway, so this is Common Sense Ohio, commonsense Ohio show dot com. And I should probably ask you, get some social media presence?
Bella Matta [:Yeah. Do you
Norm Murdock [:want to
Steve Palmer [:share it, or do you wanna keep it private?
Bella Matta [:My Instagram, TikTok, it's just bella mata.
Steve Palmer [:Bella mata.
Norm Murdock [:Spell it. You know, spell your last
Steve Palmer [:name, Saik.
Bella Matta [:L a m a t t a.
Norm Murdock [:Okay.
Steve Palmer [:We'll get you up on all the stuff at, thanks for coming. We'd love to have you back. We'd love to work with you here at commonsenseohioshow.com.
Norm Murdock [:One last thing, Steve.
Steve Palmer [:Alright.
Norm Murdock [:This is great. I encourage you guys and and our audience. Go see this movie, Reagan.
Steve Palmer [:I I saw it a
Norm Murdock [:couple days ago, went to a matinee. Fantastic. Fantastic. And and to your point, a lot of people didn't live during that are alive today, weren't around then, right, weren't even born yet. And it will it will show you coming out of Vietnam, coming out of that depressed depressed state of affairs with Jimmy Carter and the hostages
Steve Palmer [:Very similar time right now.
Norm Murdock [:Very similar time, you know, that But
Steve Palmer [:Trump's not Reagan. That's the problem.
Norm Murdock [:Well, he's he's patriotic. And that was the thing about Reagan that
Steve Palmer [:really Let's love our country.
Norm Murdock [:It made love of your country cool.
Steve Palmer [:Yep. You
Norm Murdock [:know? And it's a good movie. So I recommend it.
Steve Palmer [:And Dennis Quaid, I've heard him talk about this a lot. He's been interviewed all over social media.
Norm Murdock [:He did a great job.
Steve Palmer [:But he his I heard his performance was phenomenal.
Norm Murdock [:And it's also a love story for those that want a little romance in the movie, Nancy and Ron. It really does explain their marriage.
Steve Palmer [:But that book we read by, it was an Emmy Shea who wrote the book, The Great Society that we read about. So, it it start there's a lot of Reagan history in there from his days at GE and and sort of emerging in from the Democrat side to Right.
Norm Murdock [:More conservative. A Democrat. Yeah. Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. And, at any rate, it's
Norm Murdock [:And a union head.
Steve Palmer [:Yeah. AFL CIO. Yeah. Yeah. Really, really fascinating guy. So, anyway, commonsenseohioshow.com here with Bella Mata, where you can check her out on all her social media sites. I guarantee they're a lot more interesting than ours. No.
Steve Palmer [:But we hope to work with you again going forward.
Bella Matta [:Yeah.
Steve Palmer [:Thank you. And,
Norm Murdock [:and we don't get to have a Browns Bengals debate because they were both awful last weekend.
Steve Palmer [:Oh, they were tough.
Norm Murdock [:So I'm from Cincinnati.
Bella Matta [:Okay.
Norm Murdock [:Bengals, you gotta be a Browns fan. Oh, Pittsburgh?
Bella Matta [:No. I'm I guess I just don't really keep up with football, to be quite honest with you. I grew up with all sisters.
Norm Murdock [:So Well, good. We're not gonna we're we won't have any arguments on that.
Bella Matta [:I've been to a few games, but Okay.
Steve Palmer [:Alright. Well, we are coming at you next week right from the middle. And this week, we are done until now.
