Transcripts
. Dixie: Today we are gonna be talking
with a woman who is fighting to
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:save the forgotten residents of
Seoul's redevelopment districts.
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:These are the street cats who
once were thriving in this area.
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:Julie Choi is the founder of Youngsan
Cats, and she has rescued more than 200
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:cats from the demolition zones, often
racing the construction crews and working
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:alone to pull the lives out of the rubble.
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:She's turning a disappearing neighborhood
into a blueprint for humane rescue, and
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:today she is here to share how she does
it, why it matters, and what happens to
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:the animals when a city rebuilds itself.
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:So let's get into it
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:Hi, Julie.
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:Julie: Hi, Dixie.
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:Dixie: I'm excited to learn about this
'cause I had no idea about the cats in
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:Seoul or in these redevelopment districts.
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:So- … I would like
to hear all about this.
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:I think it's gonna be a very interesting
topic for all of my listeners.
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:I would like to- start with you.
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:Before these demolition zones, before
the headlines, what first pulled
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:you into caring for the street cats,
and when was there a moment that
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:you realized if you didn't step
in, then nobody was gonna help?
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:Julie: I have always cared deeply
about animal welfare in Asia, but I
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:honestly never expected it to come
this early on in my life, and I have
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:always been a dog mom, so I never
had cats before until the rescue.
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:And it all started on a snowy day
when I came across two little kittens.
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:I was simply walking back
from my work and I saw them.
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:I started feeding them.
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:But that one small act completely
opened my eyes to everything else.
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:It exposed me to the brutal daily
obstacles these cats face and the
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:intense social stigma against the
people who try to help them in Korea.
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:And I didn't set out with a grand
plan to build a massive rescue, but
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:I just wanted to help the animals
that I crossed paths here and there.
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:And I always believe that small,
consistent acts of compassion
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:are what eventually can shift
how a society views strays.
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:So ultimately, I want to create an
environment where if one everyday
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:person decides to step up and take
responsibility for a single life,
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:the government and/or society
actually rally behind them to help.
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:And this is because as I said, as I was
walking into the rescue scene, I learned
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:about Yongsan demolition site and truly
I've realized that how local authorities
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:and the existing big animal welfare
organization in Korea here generally
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:don't intervene deeply with rescuing
stray animals from the demolition site.
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:Dixie: When you said social
stigma, what do you mean by that?
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:Like, how are people treated?
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:Julie: I was very stunned because
I am coming from America as well.
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:I grew up there and I came to Korea a
few years ago, and I started feeding
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:the stray cat thinking that it is okay.
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:And what I quickly learned is
there are, of course, every
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:country has lovers and haters, but
there are a lot of haters here.
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:And they'll give you an eye, like a
glaze of the eye that makes you think
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:that what you're, whatever you're doing
is wrong, and plus on social media.
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:You know the crazy cat lady stigma
that is going around Am- America, too?
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:But I would say it's worse.
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:They believe that anyone, stray
cat moms or anyone who cares for
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:the cats are antisocial, no life.
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:Basically, they find their meaning
in life on only caring for their
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:cats because they have nothing else.
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:And I was very, I thought it was very
unfortunate because as I was rescuing,
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:I met a lot of people from diff- all
over the world and even inside of
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:Korea who is not part of that stigma.
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:Everyone is just living their life and
then they're sharing their warmth to
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:the lives that they want to care for.
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:But that doesn't, that's not
how it's presented at the moment
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:Dixie: Wow.
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:Yeah, that's interesting to to hear
that 'cause like you said, in the United
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:States we do have, crazy cat ladies.
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:Everybody looks at the people
who are trying to help cats and
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:have a lot of cats as crazy.
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:And so that's interesting- Sure … to
know that it's, in other cultures too.
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:Julie: Yes, definitely.
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:I was surprised as well.
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:And I feel like culturally, it does
hit harder in Korea because I think
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:in my perspective, American culture
is more independent of what…
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:every culture has nosy individuals,
but it's less in America, especially
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:because it i- it is bigger land.
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:But it is more common in Korea, and
it just was very hard because I had to
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:fight through not only social stigma,
but also occasional harasser who would…
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:Literally, I was feeding the cat
and then because- and I was feeding
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:them on a permissioned land, not a
random area where no one allowed.
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:Then I would find someone who lives around
the corner saying, "I'm gonna poison them
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:all," and he ended up having a cat, too.
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:So it was very stun- I was
very shocked because he had
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:his cats, and he didn't see…
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:he didn't-- I think it was, it
could have been only few people.
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:I'm not saying that, I'm not
generalizing that everyone is like this.
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:It's was that i- one experience that I had
was he had his indoor cat, and he believed
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:that his cat is different from the outdoor
strays because strays were born outside.
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:Dixie: Yeah, I get that 'cause I actually
hear that here, too you find out that they
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:have cats living in their house, and they
absolutely hate the cats that are outside.
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:And I don't understand that 'cause
how can you have them in your
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:home and at the same time you're
hating the ones that are outside?
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:Julie: It's shocking because I didn't
know that was a thing there, too.
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:Yeah.
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:Dixie: Yeah.
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:Julie: I think I just- Wow.
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:Okay.
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:Okay.
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:That is very interesting.
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:'Cause unlike America especially
the city that I'm talking about is
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:Seoul, and it is a very urban city.
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:And I'm some part of Amer- America
does have a wild nature where cats are
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:just roaming around, and it is they
can become real wild cats, I would say.
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:I could be wrong, but that is my…
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:because of the setting how,
it's very different from city.
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:But in Korea, most cats, I believe,
is cannot really become feral or
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:s- because 50% chance they're gonna
have someone who's gonna feed them.
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:And it's literally apartments next to
apartments, and where- wherever they're
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:living at is someone else's parking lot,
under the car, someone else's garden,
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:but not even like American gardens.
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:Just literally a small concrete space.
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:So- That's another thing is
environmentally in this, in the city like
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:Seoul, even if they are strays, you cannot
really categorize them as a feral cats
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:because they always have a regular feeder.
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:Even if they're not, they don't have
regular feeder, someone with a good
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:heart walks by and they'll feed them.
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:So they already know
that people feeds them.
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:So it's not…
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:And it's not very common for
them to-- Yes, they'll play hunt
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:pigeons, but then it's not common
for them to hunt for pigeons or
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:rat to make a liv- to, for food.
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:So it is a very different, uniquely
different setting, which is also why
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:that I started rescuing because we have
rescue over 250 cats within a year and
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:a half, and most of them were just stray
cats, and I have stray cats of my own.
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:And yes, it does take time, but what
I have realized, at least for the
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:cats that I have rescued, is first of
all, once they go inside of a house,
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:they get the full freedom to sleep
whenever they want to, eat whenever
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:they want to, and drink whenever
they want to, and they don't really
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:need to guard and always be alerted.
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:Second, with time, they do come around.
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:Yes, they weren't pettable initially,
but then once they realize that we are
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:safe, at least all my cats and all the
cats that I have rescued unless they're
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:in the early stages of adjusting,
I have been seeing working out.
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:So that's why I believe that especially
the demolition site cats, if they cannot
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:get relocated because that's not possible,
then ideally saving one more life will
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:be much better than leaving them behind.
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:Dixie: The demolition zones, I
would like to learn more about that
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:because, here in the United States,
if they're gonna demolish a building,
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:it's usually just one building.
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:So can you paint a picture of these
demolition zones and, like, how
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:large are these demolition zones?
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:Julie: So while we are struggling to place
our current rescues the tragedy is still
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:going on in the Yongsan demolition site.
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:It is-- Yongsan is a district in
Seoul City, and the destruction
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:is divided into five zones.
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:Took over 50 years to start and
over 18,000 people lived here.
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:And it is the most expensive land in
Seoul, where Samsung CEOs, most of the
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:BTS members, ambassadors, and just where
people with greater influence live.
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:What they're trying to do
is not destroy by building.
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:They're doing it entire neighborhoods
are being torn down, and an
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:estimated 1,000 community cats have
been left behind in the rubble.
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:That includes abandoned cats as well.
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:They face starvation, injury,
and displacements as the
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:bulldozer, bulldozers move in.
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:It's it's very sad because
they divided into five zones
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:and we rescue from zone three.
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:Within zone three alone,
there were over 500 cats.
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:And how they start the demolition
is initially they move pe- evacuate
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:people out, and then they start putting
X marks around the doors, and then
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:they start blocking the entire area.
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:Not ju- I'm inclu- I'm talking about
the roads too, where people walk
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:on, so no one can enter the site.
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:And they start breaking down the doors
and windows turn down their electricity,
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:and they start destroying the entire town.
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:So once at, let's say, around,
around the stage of three where
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:they start blocking the entire town,
no one can enter to feed the cats.
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:So if they're still inside, then
there's no way that we can save them
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:out unless someone tries to sneak in or
we get a permission, which is why this
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:is hard because The permission also
h- not is-- the s- land is not owned
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:by the government as well, which is
why it's really hard to get permission
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:because it's individually owned.
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:And as I said, it is an expensive land,
meaning unlike other districts, it
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:moves fast, and every hour, every day is
money spent, so they want to do it fast.
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:And all the cats right now from zone…
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:So they're now starting zone two,
and zone two, starting November this
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:year, we won't be able to enter.
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:Right now, we can enter to rescue
or try to feed because there are
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:some people living there, and
I'm talking about like handful.
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:Actually, most people had to leave in
May, April and May, but there are some
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:people who are still staying, and they're
trying to kick them out, and it's taking
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:time, so we have time until November.
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:Once the November starts no one's
gonna be able to go in unless with
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:permission, but getting that permission
will be almost nearly impossible.
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:And that's only zone two, and zone
two still has about over 300 cats.
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:And one, four, five combined, it's…
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:You can estimate.
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:It is a challenging situation, but
what is most devastating is that
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:the city and major Korean animal
welfare organizations are completely
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:turning a blind eye to the crisis.
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:These cats are just getting trapped
in a war zone, entirely dependent on
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:whatever grassroots help we can gather
because the systems meant to protect
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:them are doing nothing, basically.
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:Dixie: Wow, that's amazing.
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:Now, when you say they have these zones,
are these like essentially almost like a
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:small city when you say a neighborhood?
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:Julie: It is Because we're comparing
to America, I feel like we shouldn't.
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:The size is different, but still I would
say it's like a one entire district.
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:So there's a huge city called Seoul
City, and within the zones there's
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:different districts, and it's
literally they're getting rid of one
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:of the portions of one whole district
where over 18,000 people lived here.
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:Dixie: Wow.
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:Julie: So it is big in the perspective
Koreans, and it is one of the largest
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:demolition happening in Korea right now.
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:And their goal is to finish this
demolition by:
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:It's really fast considering
the number of people and size.
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:But it is going on and honestly right
now I'm trying my best to share the words
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:out because with the limited resources
we have, realistically and financially
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:we cannot rescue out every cat.
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:And our goal is to raise awareness both
internally and globally so that when we
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:speak with the at least news media or
governments, we have one more eyes and
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:one more voice counting so that they
can save us time to rescue these cats.
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:'Cause what's very unique about what I
have been doing in here with Yongsan Cats
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:right now is our community are, over 90%
of our community members are foreigners
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:who is either living in Korea or abroad.
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:90% of our community members, adopter,
foster, supporters, and even donations
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:are coming from foreign community
that's inside and outside of Korea.
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:And yes, we are trying to spread
to Korean communities as well.
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:But what I'm trying to
do is connecting all…
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:Just I feel like animal lovers are
universal, and I want to connect whether
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:despite the gender, nationality, age,
I just wanna connect everyone who
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:has the same heart and try to work
together to change the stigma and also
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:bring a realistic change, even if it
doesn't have to be a big change, just
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:a small little changes where we can
change, really bring the difference
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:to the lives of the strays out there.
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:Dixie: Yeah.
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:I had no idea that this was going on
until you actually reached out to me.
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:And I hate to compare it to America, but
the reason that I'm doing it is because I
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:think as Americans it's hard for a lot of
us to actually understand and visualize
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:what's going on, if that makes sense.
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:Julie: Oh, yes.
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:Yes, I do.
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:Yeah.
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:Dixie: Can you walk us
through a typical rescue?
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:Like, when you go into these
zones, like, how do you start?
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:Julie: We have local cat moms who lived
there for over 10 years, 50 years, who
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:couldn't leave them behind and coming
back to the site to feed the cats.
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:And me is basically I walk into the
s- site and I work around with these
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:local cat moms and we monitor the cats
because there's regular feeding shelters.
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:And initially for what happened in zone
three was literally last May they gave
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:us two months to pull out over 200 cats.
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:That's how we did the massive
rescue because we had two months
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:and we had to get them out.
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:But the problem was I wasn't
a professional organization.
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:I was just a one person who just
had a heart and who just had friends
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:who can help us out together.
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:And what we did was we literally
set out-- we initially started
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:with having three traps and like I
said, we had to get over 200 cats.
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:And we had to go-- We have something
called Carrot Market, which is we can
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:either sell used items or we can rent.
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:And I posted on Carrot Market
and then I got-- I rented traps
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:from people, like rescuers.
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:So we had about 10 traps around and then
also the cat moms also had the traps, so
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:we brought in all the traps that we had.
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:And we s- we would set out the
traps everywhere around the zone,
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:and we would try to get anyone that
we can out, as many as possible.
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:And that includes whenever we
rescue, we don't try to leave
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:behind, just moms or healthy cats.
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:If it's a family, best friends
we take all of them out.
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:We take them together.
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:And if it's an old cat, we take them.
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:If they're a sick cat, we take them.
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:So that's why I did had a
temporary shelter in zone two,
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:which got evicted this April.
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:So- That's how we usually we go around it.
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:And what happens afterwards is I take
care of all the logistics, meaning I pay
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:for the medical bills for all these cats.
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:I do the transportation for the cats.
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:I try to find the foster
and adopter homes.
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:I do the interview.
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:I move the cats.
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:And if they're at foster homes, I visit
their foster homes to bring them to the
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:vet or find them an adopter and move them.
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:So yes, we do have volunteers,
but realistic- this is what I
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:mean by realistically it's not
very possible because I'm just one
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:person, and I am taking care of
currently about 56 plus cats right
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:now who are all at foster homes.
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:So due to the realistic situation
that has been happening that's-- w-we
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:don't h- that's basically our system.
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:It seems messy, but literally we
s- we talk to the cat mom or as we
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:are rescuing, we see the cats that
we think that has to be rescued.
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:We set up a trap we get them, we
deliver them to the vet, and because
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:now we don't have a shelter, we'll try
to find foster or potential adopter.
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:And if they say yes, then we pull them
out from the hospital, we bring them
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:to their house, and we monitor them
from their house, and that's how we
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:start And it is it is very challenging.
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:When we had a shelter, it was still
challenging because in a tiny space we
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:had to put in, at one point there were
80 cats because, like I said, we 200 cats
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:and instantly within two months is…
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:80 cats still was lucky because
we were able to find foster and
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:adopter for the rest of them.
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:And then with the 80 cats, we couldn't
bring in more cats, but because we had
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:a shelter, we would bring in the cats.
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:So at one point, the cats
numbers c- wouldn't change.
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:It was like 70 to 80 and
then back to 70 and 80.
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:But because this April we had to
close down, around the time when we
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:ha- heard we had to close was March.
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:They didn't give us time at all.
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:It was literally a month notice,
and we had about 40 to 50 cats.
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:And luckily, I was able to reach out to
some of the influencers and they shared
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:the words out and we got all the foster
cats, shelter cats out to the fosters.
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:But now we don't have the shelter,
so we cannot really rescue unless
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:we have a foster and adopter homes.
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:And even let's say if it's a really urgent
cat, then they have to be hospitalized.
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:I have a cat that has been
hospitalized in the vet for about
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:two and a half months is now.
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:And major reason is 'cause this
cat got into a car accident.
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:But afterwards, a month and a half in,
she could have gone to a foster home,
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:but we couldn't find anyone yet and it's
better for her to stay in the hospital
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:than hop her around when she's not ready.
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:So every day is different challenges,
but we're working around people.
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:So because we don't have physical
spaces, we're talking to each
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:other, communicating, trying to
find the places together and try
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:to see what we can do daily basis.
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:Dixie: Yeah, that's a lot that you're
taking on to being the person that's
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:transporting these cats for the
medical, coordinating the adoptions,
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:coordinating the foster homes.
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:So it seems like it's very intense
physically and emotionally.
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:What has been the hardest
part for you personally?
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:And then on the flip side, what
is it that keeps you going?
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:Julie: So the hardest thing is,
to be honest with you, is people.
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:Saving cats, rescuing cats yes,
it is physically difficult.
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:It is sometimes grueling.
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:But w- the best feeling is once you
walk into a great home and you transfer
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:the cat and you f- you know that you
feel that they're gonna have a great
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:new chapter, that's a satisfaction.
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:But usually when you are rescuing, I think
you may also know you cannot do it alone.
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:It has to be together.
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:But sometimes some people have
misunderstandings or there are people
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:emotions that you have to consider,
and that sometimes gives me a lots
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:of pressure and disappointment.
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:But also the flip side is
that people save as well.
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:So this is what I always tell
people is that yes, people
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:kills, but also people saves.
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:Without people it's
impossible to save any life.
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:And also, the reason why I can keep going
is because at every turning point, every
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:corner, I meet amazing human beings.
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:It could be foster mom, it could be
adopter, it could be a stranger, and
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:it could be anyone but who always says,
"Oh I may not be able to help fully,
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:but whatever that you're dealing with,
let me handle it together with you."
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:And that one s- it doesn't have to be
every cat, but just as some portion of
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:work that they take in for me together,
it gives me a hope and it keeps me going.
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:And it is also that's the o- that's
the major reason why we cannot
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:stop because whenever you want to
give up, there's always someone
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:who's like, "Okay, I can help you."
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:And then it's just every corner, every
step, every chapter, there's someone who
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:comes in that you didn't even expect.
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:And even if it's not a ginormous
help, still it is great amount of
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:help, enough for me to continue
rescuing, continue helping the cats.
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:Dixie: As the redevelopment continues,
what is next for Youngsun Cats?
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:What do you need the most right
now, and how can our listeners
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:support the work that you're doing?
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:Julie: So my next goal right now is
to settle all the cats to an adopter
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:home, the ones that we already rescued,
and try to find ways to realistically
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:save out the cats that's left behind.
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:And it doesn't have to be us physically,
but even, like I said, there's
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:other shelters and organizations
in Korea, and I hope that they
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:also start making a move because
they don't have to take in 10 cats.
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:They can just take in one.
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:But if every shelter or organization's
taking a few cats at a time,
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:I'm sure it's gonna work out.
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:And that's why the most powerful
thing anyone can do right
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:now is lend us your voice.
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:You can follow us on Instagram or join
our Patreon, even just as a free member.
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:And the reason is simple.
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:When we approach government officials
or n- news networks or organizations to
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:demand intervention for these demolitions
site cats, numbers truly matters.
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:And every single follower and
free member is a tangible voice
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:that proves the world is watching.
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:And if you can donate, you are
directly funding a cat's medical.
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:But if you cannot, simply following
us and sharing our stories gives us
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:the leverage we desperately need to
force real, systematic change in Korea.
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:Dixie: And what is your Instagram
and then also your Patreon?
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:And I'll include links
in the show notes as well
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:Julie: it's Yongsan Cats, and it's
Y-O-N-G-S-A-N Cats for everything.
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:And website as well, yongsancats.com.
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:Patreon, Yongsan Cats.
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:Dixie: Julie, thank you for
everything that you're doing.
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:It's really eye-opening 'cause like
I said, I had no idea that this was
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:going on, and just the magnitude
of it, It is very upsetting.
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:And- … i'm so grateful that you're
sharing your story with us today.
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:Your work is saving lives that would
otherwise be erased, and it's showing the
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:world what compassion looks like in the
middle of a demolition zone like this.
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:It's giving hope to these animals.
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:Julie: It's very challenging, but yes,
I'm grateful that you guys invited
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:me to speak with you and c talk about
our issue because I know that it's
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:just cats or animals cannot talk
for themselves, and it has to be…
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:What I learned, biggest lesson I've
learned is, like I said, single voice, and
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:I was a single voice who wanted to rescue
just the town cat, and then suddenly
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:I jumped into the demolition site.
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:And if we don't speak up as a people
who cares for the animals, I know that
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:it's not gonna get reached anywhere.
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:And in order for a change to
happen and to save a life, we
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:need to let more people know.
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:And I'm sure a lot of the audiences
whoever that I'm gonna meet n-
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:next and the ones that I have met
before, all of us didn't know about
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:what's going on, and it's because,
not because we don't want to know.
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:It's just that the world is huge,
and you cannot focus on what's
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:happening for every possible animals.
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:That's why what I'm trying to do
is the, my portion of the issue
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:that I'm dealing with for the cats
in Korea, I just wanted the people
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:outside of Korea to learn about it.
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:So even if they don't physically
help, knowing about it will impact,
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:and it can really bring a change.
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:It doesn't have to be this year.
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:It doesn't have to be next month.
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:It could be just years later.
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:But I truly believe that one more
person knowing, whether they're in
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:Korea or outside, it does bring a
big change to at least one more life.
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:And it's just the connection that I
have felt with a lot of the community
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:members and even with you right now.
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:This is, this literally is giving
us a hope because at least someone
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:is willing to listen to us.
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:And yes it doesn't have to be
physically saving a cat, but this is
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:a hope that someone else can actually
hear about us through you guys.
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:So I'm truly g- grateful.
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:Dixie: It's so very inspiring, too,
to know that you took on this huge
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:project as one person and you were able
to get other people involved with it.
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:, It's just massive, and it's just so
inspiring for people who think that
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:they can't do anything to help animals.
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:Julie: I feel like it's just
initially I didn't know anything.
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:That's why I was able to do it.
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:But afterwards, I'm able to keep
going because there's more people who
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:I realize that have a h- same heart
and compassion and who wants to help.
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:I have met great people both in and
outside of Korea, and that is also
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:healing journey for me as well.
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:I feel like these kind of support
that you don't really get during
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:daily lives or while you're
working at a business setting.
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:So I feel like cats are also helping me
in a sense that I have a new perspective
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:towards everything now, and in a good way.
