In this episode of 'dare to be more', host Anthony Perl speaks with Fiona Pow, Head of Students, and Andrew Taylor, Deputy Head of Senior School Wellbeing, about how MLC School develops confident, capable leaders who are prepared to step up and make a difference.

Fiona and Andrew challenge traditional notions of leadership, explaining that it's not just about badges and elected positions - it's about any student who steps outside their comfort zone, does the right thing at a difficult moment, or starts a new initiative. They emphasise that leadership opportunities exist for every student, just as they do for staff throughout the School.

The conversation explores the extensive range of leadership opportunities at MLC School, from the Cadet program starting in Year 8 and the Middle Years Leaders program, to the SRC, co-curricular activities, and the powerful Sonycamp experience where Year 11 students serve as companions for children with disabilities. Fiona and Andrew describe how leadership happens in both formal and informal settings - in classrooms, on sports teams, and through the Big Sisters program where Year 11 and 12 students mentor younger girls.

They discuss how MLC School teaches leadership through structured programs like the International Coalition of Girls Schools' 'Lean in Leadership' curriculum in Year 8, where students learn about values-driven leadership and aligning behaviours with values. The episode explores the comprehensive training that Year 12 captains receive, including vision planning and goal setting with external organisations.

Fiona shares inspiring stories of students who have taken initiative - from creating a midwifery club that sparked passion in others, to graduates who have gone on to leadership roles at university and beyond. She discusses how the School supports students in balancing leadership responsibilities with academic demands through weekly team meetings, staff mentoring, and a strong culture of peer support.

Andrew reflects on the unique advantage of an all-girls environment, where students don't need to compete for space at the table because they are the hosts. He explains how seeing strong women in leadership throughout the School gives girls something to aspire to, and how learning to advocate for themselves prepares them for the realities of leadership beyond school.

The conversation concludes with both educators reflecting on what 'dare to be more' means in the context of leadership - Fiona describing it as having the drive and initiative to step up and do something more, whilst Andrew emphasises the importance of risk-taking, stepping outside comfort zones, and not being afraid to fail as essential elements of developing resilience and growth.

About MLC School: MLC School is a leading independent girls' school in Sydney, committed to empowering young women through academic excellence, character development, and innovative education. Our mission is to inspire girls to dare to be more.

Connect With Us:

1. Website: mlcsyd.nsw.edu.au
2. Instagram: @mlcsydney
3. Facebook: @MLCSchoolSydney
4. LinkedIn: MLC School

Co-host: Anthony Perl

Produced by: 'Podcasts Done for You'

Developing leadership.

2

Welcome to Dare to Be More, the podcast

from MLC School in Burwood, Sydney.

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Today we're exploring leadership

development with Fiona Powell, head

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of students and Andrew Taylor, deputy

Head of Senior School Wellbeing.

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Discover how leadership isn't just

about badgers and titles, but about

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any student who steps up to do the

right thing or tries something new.

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Learn about the countless formal and

informal opportunities at MLC School from

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the cadet program and SRC to classroom

moments and co-curricular activities.

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We'll explore how MLC School prepares

young women to confidently take their

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seat at the table in a world where

they'll be the hosts, not just the guests.

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I'm your co-host, Anthony Pearl.

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Let's get into today's conversation.

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Well, hello everyone and

welcome to another episode of

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The Dare to Be More Podcast.

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I'm really excited about this

topic because I think it's a topic

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that people sort of understand but

don't really think too much about.

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So it's a good thing that we've got two

very special guests joining me today.

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Andrew and Fiona, welcome to the podcast.

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Fiona Pow: Thanks Anthony.

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LA

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Andrew Taylor: Thanks.

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Thanks for having us.

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Anthony Perl: Well, we better start off

by allowing you to introduce yourselves.

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So Fiona, do you wanna kick things off

and tell everyone a little bit about you?

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Fiona Pow: Yeah, sure.

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I'm the head of students at MLC School,

so head of students for 10 to 12.

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So I look after the whole student

from 10 to 12, working with them

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in wellbeing, but also across their

academic and co-curricular and just

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making sure that the girls supported.

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All the way through those important years.

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I've myself, I've been at the

school now for 13 years and worked

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in a range of different roles as

a head of year, and I'm also an

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English teacher, which I love to do.

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And before that I've worked

internationally and worked across

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different contexts in different

countries and in different leadership,

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student leadership systems as well.

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Anthony Perl: I detect a little

bit of an accent there still.

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Fiona Pow: It's definitely still there.

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Yeah.

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So I'm from the north

of England originally.

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Anthony Perl: Lovely.

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And Andrew, what about you?

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Andrew Taylor: So my title is Deputy

Head of Senior School Wellbeing.

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So essentially I look after all

facets of student wellbeing.

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My role changed slightly

over the last year.

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I, I still work really

closely with Fiona and the.

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Heads of students and the heads of

year team, but my role is in more of a

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sort of strategic direction now looking

at the planning and the implementing

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of our wellbeing strategic plan.

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So that's my space.

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This is my third year at MLC School.

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I've been in girls schools for about

15 years now, and prior to being

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deputy head of senior school here,

I've been a director of students in

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other girls schools, and originally

I started off in P-D-H-P-E, so

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really strong interest there.

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Obviously there's a nice link

between P-D-H-P-E and student

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wellbeing and leadership, so

that's a bit of my background.

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Anthony Perl: Fantastic.

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Well, we're gonna have a well-rounded

discussion here based on all of that,

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uh, because it, the topic at hand is

developing leadership at the school,

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and I think it's a, it's quite a

broad thing is a starting point.

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So maybe we need to start off by

defining what a leader actually is.

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Fiona, what does that mean for you?

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Fiona Pow: For me, it's something that's

available for all students because I

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think it's any student who steps up.

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To either do the right thing at a

difficult moment or steps outside of

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their comfort zone to try something

new, or a student who might start a

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whole new initiative and really start

to push something big in the school.

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So I think that.

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When I think about leadership, I don't

think about the badge and I don't think

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about the students that have the titles

and that have the elected positions.

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I mean, I obviously do think of them,

but there's always opportunities

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for any student in the school to

become a leader in, in small ways.

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And I think that's true

of our staff as well.

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You know, some of us have

positions, but there's leadership

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all throughout the staff, and we

see that in our students as well.

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Anthony Perl: And Andrew,

what about for you?

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Because I think that's

a very interesting take.

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That leadership isn't

necessarily about the badges.

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'cause we tend to think of it in that way.

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I mean, you know, sports

teams are the obvious ones.

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Who's the captain of the team,

who's the captain of this or

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that, but it's beyond that.

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Andrew Taylor: Yeah, absolutely.

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And I guess on that note too,

it's really interesting, love to

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use a sport analogy, but it's.

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It's not always the best players

that are the captains of the team,

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and that's not what it's about.

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It's not better being the best player.

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It's about ones that have that vision or

that ability to influence other people.

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And I think that's what I think

about when I think about leadership,

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being able to positively influence

and guide others and support others

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and empower, empower other students.

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I think that's what resonates

for me when we think about.

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Leadership, having that ability, having

a vision, being able to, to bring people

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together to get the best out of them.

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Anthony Perl: I think it's an interesting

point that you made there, that

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leaders aren't necessarily the best

at whatever it is that they're in.

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The best player in a team isn't

necessarily the leader in the team.

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Andrew Taylor: Mm-hmm.

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Yeah, I, I absolutely agree.

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It's those e ai skills, those soft skills,

the being able to understand people.

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Having empathy is obviously a

really, really big part of that.

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Being able to recognize the strengths

and the qualities in other people,

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um, and then utilize those strategies

and bring them, draw them out of

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people to get the best outcomes

for the collective, for the group.

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Anthony Perl: So with that kind of

broad definition in place, Fiona,

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where are the opportunities within

MLC for girls to become leaders?

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Fiona Pow: Oh, there's, I think

there's countless opportunities.

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I think that we have a strong leadership

program all the way through from

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the young years up until the year 12

when we have our elected captains.

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But we have our cadet

program that runs from.

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Year eight.

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And so students can have

opportunities within the cadet

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program to lead in different ways.

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We have a Middle Years leaders program,

so we have elected leaders, then we

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have an SRC where students can nominate.

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We have.

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I'm trying.

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We have many different opportunities.

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We have a wonderful Sony camp at the end

in year 11 where students step up and be

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companions for children with disabilities.

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And that takes immense leadership to be

able to be a part of that camp and to,

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to really be able to advocate for others.

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And I'd say that within

classroom settings.

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Any day of the week, any student

can step up and be a leader.

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We have formal opportunities, but we

have informal opportunities as well.

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And within co-curricular activities,

there's lots of different scenarios

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where students can lead as well

and take on subgroups within teams

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and within dance, within drama.

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I think that.

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Uh, there's many, many opportunities

and like Andrew said earlier, it is not

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just about being the best, it's a bit

about being the person who could either

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energize others or see an issue and act

on it and be like an upstander or students

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who just really want to give something

a go and take others along with them.

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So I think we have many, many

opportunities and I love it because

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I've worked in different schools.

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Where they didn't have such a

defined leadership program or as many

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opportunities, and what I see is that

our girls just thrive on this and the

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way that they leave us at the end of

year 12, confident and ready to go and

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take on the world, I find that really

exciting and something that I hadn't

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really experienced in a school before.

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Anthony Perl: I wanna come back to that,

but Andrew, I wanted to ask you then

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about training girls to become leaders.

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Andrew Taylor: Mm-hmm.

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Anthony Perl: It's all very well to

say they've got this opportunity, but

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how do you actually develop that skill?

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Andrew Taylor: Yeah.

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I guess just to go off what Phil

was saying, there are there,

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there are a whole range of.

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Informal and formal opportunities, uh,

that we recognize across the school.

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And when we look at things like informal

opportunities, for example, all of our

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year 11 and 12 students are big sisters

to students in year seven and eight.

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And we have a year, six

to nine middle year.

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Buddy system we're

working on moving forward.

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So there are lots of those opportunities

for, they're essentially informal

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leadership opportunities, opportunity

for year 11 and 12 students to role

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model and to lead and to share their

knowledge and their experiences and

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provide support for our year seven

and eight in terms of teaching and

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how we actually teach leadership.

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So.

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To give you an example,

we start in year eight.

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Our year eight students actually

engage in a program from the

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International Coalition of Girls

Schools called Lean in Leadership.

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So we've adopted that this year and

we've incorporated that into our

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pastoral and wellbeing programs.

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So there our year eight students are

learning really early on all about

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leadership, what it looks like,

how we can demonstrate leadership.

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They learn about values driven

leadership and aligning our values

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with our behaviors and how we can

use that to enact positive change.

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So they learn about that in a really

structured, um, sort of formalized

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manner in their luminaries.

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But as I said, again, there's also a

lot of informal opportunities too to

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engage with other students, sub captives

of teams, luminary representatives.

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I know Fiona mentioned the middle

years leadership in the SRC.

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Students can join committees.

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We have lots of different committees

throughout the school where students,

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particularly younger students, get to

observe how our older students lead and

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our older students get the experience,

or our captains or leaders have that

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opportunity to lead the younger students

and actually provide support there.

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So there is lots of, lots

of opportunities there.

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So yeah, it takes place in the

luminary classroom, but it also

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takes place outside of the classroom.

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Uh, also we have workshops We

te send students on workshops.

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So there are formal training programs.

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Start of this year, we did a big program

with our incoming year 12 captains.

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We partner with some external

organizations to really

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dig deep and dive into.

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Whole school leadership and what we

would like to see, and our captains

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do, vision planning of what their

whole school goal is going to be and

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how we're gonna enact positive change.

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So it does take place in formal

settings, but it also does take place.

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The training or the learning about

leadership happens all over the school.

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Anthony Perl: And Fiona, how do you

balance then in a leadership position

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between doing that and all of the other

requirements you have of being a student

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at school to actually get work done?

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Fiona Pow: Yeah, I think that's a

good question because I think that

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students, particularly the elected

students, definitely, you know, they

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do with such earnest and they want to

do their jobs so well and they want to

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go all in, but especially the senior

years when they have academic demands.

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And the co-curricular, there's a

risk of it becoming overwhelming,

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but they themselves work together

exceptionally well as a team.

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They have a weekly meeting where

they're discussing what's happening

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in each portfolio, and they're

leaning on each other for support.

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They're asking for help, and that's

something that we encourage with them, and

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it's part of their leadership training.

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So either Andrew, myself, or the

head of year Andrew Renick, or b.

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In the team meeting to help them sort

of navigate that and to make sure that

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they're not overwhelmed with work.

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But then we also have mentoring staff

mentoring for the portfolio captains,

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and also year 12 students all have a

staff mentor as well who meets with

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the student to help them navigate

some of those challenges in terms of

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time management and responsibilities.

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And I think that's.

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That tends to work well because they have

staff looking after them, but they're

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really very good at leaning on each other

for support and making sure that, you

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know, when they need a hand, they shout

and people, they work as a team so well.

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So yes, it's about leadership and

leading your own portfolio, but the

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team and how much the team works

together is really key to that as well.

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And that's something that we work

on with the students all the time.

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Anthony Perl: I might just pick you

up on a point that you mentioned

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earlier on about how surprised you are

to see how great they are at the end

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and where they might go afterwards.

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So particularly you've been involved

with MLC for a number of years now.

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Have you got some favorite stories

about girls that have risen to the

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occasion of leadership, either during

school or as a result afterwards?

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Fiona Pow: Yeah, I think I

can think of a few examples.

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It was a few years ago now, but there

was a student who was particularly.

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Interested in midwifery.

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She had a different, she

wanted to do different things.

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When she first joined the

school, she wanted to join

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the circus, but that changed.

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She develops, you know, her academics.

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She decided that she really

wanted to do midwifery and she

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was applying to do midwifery.

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But what she ended up doing was.

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Creating a midwifery club and they

would meet once a week and they would

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like read recent articles on midwifery.

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They would, you know, talk

about different cases and they'd

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look at like new developments.

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And yes, she did go off to

study midwifery, but so did

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some of her friends as well.

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And this student was

an exceptional student.

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Very, very capable student and I love

that she took on what she wanted to do

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and but took others with her as well.

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And it was a passion that she shared

with others and they developed that

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passion too, which I think is brilliant.

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Other students who have had formal

leadership positions have gone on

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to then, you know, we've had vice

captains go off and edit or co-edit.

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The student newspaper at Sydney Uni

and take on leadership roles in their

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university life, and then they're

stepping out into really exceptional

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careers and being successful and it's

always just, yeah, it's brilliant

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to hear those stories from students

where you can see that those, the

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sort of the fabric of leadership

that we've helped develop in them has

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carried forward into their future.

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Anthony Perl: Fantastic.

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Yeah.

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Andrea, I'm interested particularly

in your perspective of leadership,

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particularly afterwards because having

worked at a number of girls schools and,

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and seen that, the reality of course is

that we go into a business world that

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potentially can be very male dominated.

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So how do the girls go

in relation to that?

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Does this, you know, put them

in good stead by going through

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these kinds of programs?

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Andrew Taylor: Absolutely.

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Yeah.

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Look, I think, I think that's one of the

great things about being in a girls school

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in an all girls environment is that I.

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You know, we talk about

having the seat at the table.

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The girls don't need to have a seat at

the table because they are the hosts.

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Um, they don't have to

compete for the space.

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They don't have to share the space.

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So I think having this environment

is really supportive for our girls.

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They get to see.

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Leadership modeled from their older

peers, from our staff, from our

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school leadership all the way down.

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So there's a really clear idea

for them, or a clear visibility

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around what leadership is.

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They get to see really

strong women in leadership.

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Um, and it gives 'em

something to aspire to.

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I mean, yeah, absolutely.

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I think that's really important.

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I mean, we know the statistics and

the data around what it's like for

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women in leadership beyond school.

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I think they get a really great chance

to step up and to step into those spaces.

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I.

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And they learn to be competitive.

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They learn to advocate and speak

up and advocate for themselves

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and speak out for what's right

and speak out for what they want.

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And again, that's one of the great things

about being in a school like MLC School,

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is that, that our students can see that

and if they can see it, they can be it.

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And that puts them in really

good stead beyond school.

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Anthony Perl: Fantastic.

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I need to ask you both a question that

we're asking all of the guests who appear

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on the program, which is Dare to Be

More, which of course is the name of the

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podcast and the motto for the school.

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What does it mean in relation

to this topic of leadership?

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Fiona, if I can start with you.

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Fiona Pow: I think that in some ways it

probably lends itself best to leadership.

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Doesn't it dare to be more?

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Because it's about pushing

yourself the extra step further.

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Don't just sit on the fence, step

up, do something a little bit more

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for yourself, see something that you

want to do and go out and get it.

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And I think that's part

of leadership as well.

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Having that drive initiative and

knowing that you're in a space

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where the, where you can do that

and you'll be supported to do that.

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I think that's a lot of what makes MLC

special is that we support our students

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to do the things that they want to do.

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And so yeah, if they dare me more,

we'll help 'em along the way.

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Anthony Perl: Lovely.

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What about you, Andrew?

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What's your take on that?

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Andrew Taylor: I very

much agree with, with fe.

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I think for me, dare me more is.

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About that risk taking and about

stepping outta their comfort zone.

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Not being afraid to fail.

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Mm-hmm.

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Not being afraid to get it wrong.

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And we know for so many of our girls,

and we know particularly with the

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things around perfectionism and

particularly being judged and what will

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people think and how's it gonna look?

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And we know all of the

research around that.

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But I think, yeah, for me,

dare to be more is about that.

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Taking a chance.

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Not being afraid to fail, developing

resilience, learning, and then putting

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that into practice again as they move on.

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I think that's what it looks like for me.

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Anthony Perl: Excellent.

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Really enjoyed that discussion.

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Thank you both for being

part of the program.

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Fiona Pow: Thanks so much.

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Andrew Taylor: Thank you.

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Anthony Perl: Thank you for

joining us on Dare To Be More.

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If you enjoyed this episode, please

subscribe wherever you get your

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podcast so you never miss an episode.

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Your likes and comments also

help more families discover

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these valuable conversations.

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For more information about MLC School

and their approach to girls education,

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visit their website@c.nsw.edu.au.

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Check out the show notes

for more information.

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The Dare To Be More Podcast is

produced by podcast Done for You.

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I'm your host, Anthony Pearl,

and we invite you to join us next

343

time as we continue to explore

what it means to dare to be more.