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Ahsoka Part 4 "Fallen Jedi" Review
Episode 3 • 9th September 2023 • Ahsoka Review Podcast • Garry Aylott & Mark Asquith - Nerd Podcasts Network
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Hey, Ahsoka fan and welcome to Episode 3.

Ahsoka got spicy this week with some more tasty lightsaber battles, character reveals and THAT ending. Join us as we break down part 4.

About The Ahsoka Review Podcast

Welcome to Ahsoka Review Podcast , where we explore and discuss all the latest episodes, characters, and plot twists from the hit Disney+ series Ahsoka.

We are your hosts, Garry and Mark and every single Saturday we release a brand-new episode where we break down each episode of Ahsoka, giving you our thoughts and score.

Don't you guys do the Spark of Rebellion podcast?

We do! When we're not reviewing one of the Star Wars Disney+ shows, we drop a new episode every Saturday bringing you the latest Star Wars news, reviews and discussion from a galaxy far, far away.

Search for Spark of Rebellion in your preferred podcast app (https://www.sparkofrebellion.com/listen) or check out the website (https://www.sparkofrebellion.com/).

Now, go explore and as always... this is the way.

Transcripts

Garry:

Hello there and welcome to the Ahsoka review podcast.

Garry:

This is episode number three.

Garry:

So welcome.

Garry:

Welcome.

Garry:

I hope you're keeping well and safe.

Garry:

If you're listening over on spark of rebellion, that's our sister show,

Garry:

by the way, where we round out the star Wars news each and every week,

Garry:

then welcome to you guys as well.

Garry:

We're going to be chatting through part four.

Garry:

Fallen Jedi for the Ahsoka review episode this week.

Garry:

My name's Gary.

Garry:

I'm one of your co hosts.

Garry:

And before I bring on my other co host, just a wee reminder to make sure

Garry:

that you're following or subscribing.

Garry:

If it's the first time listening to the review show, then make sure you do that

Garry:

as you follow our thoughts and breakdowns as we go through the rest of the episode.

Garry:

And like I said, this is going out on our sister show as well, Spark Rebellion, so

Garry:

make sure you give that a follow and the like as well because we round out all

Garry:

the Star Wars news each week for the busy Star Wars fan that doesn't have to mess

Garry:

around with RSS feeds and social media.

Garry:

And all that jazz.

Garry:

So with that being said, I'm going to bring on the other guy, the other dude,

Garry:

my co, my co founder in nerdpodcast.

Garry:

com, by the way, which is part of the network that

Garry:

you're listening to right now.

Garry:

It's Mr.

Garry:

Mark Asquith.

Garry:

How you doing, buddy?

Mark:

What up, Dude?

Mark:

I am good, good, good, good, good.

Mark:

Star Warsed out this week.

Mark:

Good.

Garry:

Star Wars.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

It's a busy time, isn't it, for Star Wars.

Garry:

Books arriving.

Garry:

New Disney Plus stuff.

Garry:

Watching the animated gear.

Garry:

I'll read you.

Mark:

Yeah, there's a lot of stuff.

Mark:

There is a lot of stuff.

Mark:

And the books, there's always something going on with the books.

Mark:

Like they're just, there's a thousand of them, but yeah, it's pretty good.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Yeah.

Garry:

Good times, man.

Garry:

Good time.

Garry:

So we're going to dive straight into our review.

Garry:

And as we always do a quick recap on what we're about to talk about.

Garry:

So in part four, Fallen Jedi, we have Ahsoka and Sabine who have crash

Garry:

landed on the planet in the forest.

Garry:

They are after the, the star map, which has been which is now in the

Garry:

hands of Morgan and Bailin, et cetera.

Garry:

They need to grab that so that, they can, they can go and and either retrieve

Garry:

Ezra and stop Thrawn or destroying the star map so that nobody can get

Garry:

them, which causes a little bit of tension between Ahsoka and Sabine.

Garry:

While this is going on, we have Hera who's trying to get some support

Garry:

from the New Republic Senate, but is getting nowhere with that.

Garry:

So she just says F you to those guys, rounds up some X wing dudes and

Garry:

and goes to help those guys anyway.

Garry:

And then in the midst of that, we also have they The the, the Balin and Shin,

Garry:

those guys have sent to, to put a stopper on Ahsoka and Sabine progressing through

Garry:

the forest to get to the star map so that Morgan can make the jump in this

Garry:

new big Eye of Scion ship to go and retrieve Thrawn, et cetera, et cetera.

Garry:

So dude.

Garry:

What are your thoughts on a score off the bat for this one?

Mark:

Yeah, it was, this episode was,

Mark:

it's weird to say this, but it's almost like, to me, it's almost like it had

Mark:

a feel of like, The Last Jedi to it.

Mark:

It had a lot of sequel trilogy motifs to it, you know, the forest fights,

Mark:

the I'm not saying this because I want anyone to go, Grey Jedi!

Mark:

But I'm saying the grey areas in the force, especially with

Mark:

Balen and so on and so forth.

Mark:

Like, he's an immense character, a lot of grey areas to that guy.

Mark:

He's not as black and white as I am bad, you are good.

Mark:

He's very nuanced, and Ray Stevenson absolutely crushes it every time.

Mark:

Like, he's the standout, without a doubt.

Mark:

And it reminds me of The Last Jedi.

Mark:

It reminded me of that, because of all that.

Mark:

And all the sort of, all the, even all the connective tissue between the O.

Mark:

T.

Mark:

Like the shots in the X Wing are just straight out of the O.

Mark:

T.

Mark:

Like, literally, it's like they just pulled the film.

Mark:

And, and the space battles are outstanding.

Mark:

There was a lot of, like, obviously talk about the Scion with the Holdo style

Mark:

maneuver graphics and the visual effects.

Mark:

But then there was a lot of Rebels in it.

Mark:

There was a lot of prequel era stuff in it, as we'll talk about

Mark:

later as, as we saw that ending.

Mark:

So I thought it was excellent, man, and even before the ending, which I

Mark:

know we'll get to, because this is huge spoiler territory, so like, anyone

Mark:

listening, like, just, it is going to be spoiler citry, so, you know,

Mark:

you need to have watched this, and you need to be happy with spoilers.

Mark:

Before the ending, I was like, this is a, this is at least like

Mark:

an eight, eight and a half out of ten, because it was just good.

Mark:

And if you watch like the Master and Apprentice little eight minute,

Mark:

little mini documentary sort of thing on, on Disney Plus, Flowney says

Mark:

something that made me think, he was like, This is Star Wars now, so the

Mark:

lightsaber battles have to be good.

Mark:

That's their weapon.

Mark:

And like, the lightsaber battles were badass.

Mark:

Lots of little nuance in it, I loved the whole Sabine...

Mark:

You know, falling to the ground, trying to do that mega force thing that we

Mark:

thought would come to fruition, it didn't, but then Shin sort of, she

Mark:

moves her head back, like, sort of flinches it as if she's going to, and

Mark:

that's the realisation there's no power.

Mark:

It was, it was just very, very well done, every, you know, like the Hu Yang

Mark:

fight, like something out of real steel.

Mark:

Just, all of it was just excellently, excellently, excellently done, and

Mark:

that's before we get to any of the Scion stuff, any of the Sabine stuff.

Mark:

The ending, before we get to any of that.

Mark:

So I think, with the ending, which we'll talk about inevitably, with

Mark:

the ending, it's gotta be a nine.

Mark:

It has gotta be a nine.

Mark:

And that's not even anything to do with fan service.

Mark:

It's just because it was really good.

Mark:

It was like, it's sort of weird because when we look at like the Patterson

Mark:

cut of Obi Wan, we talked about it a couple of weeks ago, if we talk

Mark:

like, that is ultimate fan service.

Mark:

Like, you lose all the emotional beats.

Mark:

When you look at all the episodes of Ahsoka up to now, it's like a

Mark:

chapter is done, and they've taken the time to get to that chapter.

Mark:

If, it, like, it would almost be perfectly paced for a movie.

Mark:

If you were to watch it all back without the credits, just, but not

Mark:

edit it, and just watch it back without the credits, I think it would be a

Mark:

reasonably well paced movie, and this is, for me, this is the end of...

Mark:

I want to say the end of, like, act two.

Mark:

You know, the end of act one was, was for me last week and maybe that's the

Mark:

only pace, slight pacing thing if it was a movie is that maybe act two would have

Mark:

been a bit longer, but it feels like we're entering act three now with maybe a little

Mark:

digression next week, which we'll get to.

Mark:

So yeah, it's gotta be a nine dude.

Mark:

What about

Garry:

you?

Garry:

Interesting.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

So my score's up there as well.

Garry:

I think my score's an eight and a half ish for it mainly because some of

Garry:

the things that you mentioned, it, it was production wise, just fantastic.

Garry:

Some really, really good stuff in there, like movie quality.

Garry:

Stuff going on, like the, the choreography for the lightsaber battles, the the,

Garry:

the, you know, Hugh Yang, like the way he moves, like, cause it's one

Garry:

thing to just have a droid sort of.

Garry:

Potter around and do stuff fairly static.

Garry:

It's another one to see them in combat and move around the stuff so that was

Garry:

really good and just the the atmosphere of the planet that they're on as well

Garry:

this this whole Forest thing and even when they go out to the outcrop where

Garry:

they've got the star map Stuff there.

Garry:

It's all just got a great atmosphere to it and it's done really well

Garry:

It's not one of those things where it's just white corridors, right?

Garry:

It's not it's not that OT in that respect, however, those nods that you

Garry:

mentioned to the OT were very, very cool, like almost the same camera

Garry:

framing as the battle on the Death Star Trench run and all that stuff, you

Garry:

know, when you see those, all the red group conversing and stuff like that.

Garry:

So bang on really cool felt Star Wars in that respect.

Garry:

And then the thing that just pushed it over the edge.

Garry:

So it was, it was about an eight for me.

Garry:

And then that thing that push over the edge is probably for you as well.

Garry:

Is when we see a soak at the end in what's likely to be.

Garry:

the world between worlds and seeing Anakin and stuff.

Garry:

So we'll, we'll chat about that stuff later on, but so yeah, probably an

Garry:

eight and a half, nine for me as well, dude, some cracking stuff in this one.

Garry:

Just want to pick up on the title just very quickly.

Garry:

Would you, did you like the, the the, the multilayered meaning behind the title?

Garry:

Cause I thought that was fairly cool because you initially thought it was just

Garry:

about Sabine, if that's your take on the show so far, or you thought it was about

Garry:

the literal meaning of Ahsoka falling.

Garry:

off the cliff at the end, or it was about Balin and Shin being, you know,

Garry:

you know, not like Jedi, or Anakin at the end, being the ultimate fallen

Garry:

Jedi in this era of Star Wars anyway.

Garry:

So that was kind of cool, I thought, for Baloney to come up with that title.

Garry:

That was very cool.

Mark:

Yeah, it was, man, and I, I, I, it was so many layers.

Mark:

I, I, I debate whether we're going to see Ahsoka return as something

Mark:

ever so slightly different with a different mindset, whether that is a

Mark:

mindset or whether it's a physicality.

Mark:

I'm saying that based on, and this has been thrown around for

Mark:

years, but the whole Gandalf...

Mark:

Ahsoka drawing that Falona did back in 108.

Mark:

This is, Falona is now at the end of his journey with Ahsoka and

Mark:

that original band of characters.

Mark:

I think he's got a lot more Star Wars in him.

Mark:

But I feel like he's, I don't necessarily want to say swan songing with his

Mark:

movie and with Ahsoka and so on.

Mark:

But I, I, the movie's gonna be led up to buy this series,

Mark:

without a shadow of a doubt.

Mark:

So it makes, and I think you're going to start to see Mando season

Mark:

four lead in to this as well.

Mark:

So, it's, you know, it feels like we're tying everything together.

Mark:

In an endgame sort of fashion.

Mark:

So yeah, I liked that, because I think it gives them scope

Mark:

to do something with Ahsoka.

Mark:

I think it was an interesting look at Balan.

Mark:

I think it was an interesting look at Anakin.

Mark:

It was an interesting look at Sabine.

Mark:

And, and, again, not wanting to kind of beat on about this one, but, you

Mark:

know, there's, there's Luke's Jedi Academy knocking around somewhere.

Mark:

You know, is, is this the opportunity?

Mark:

Because this, that goes sort of pear shaped in a few years

Mark:

from this timeline anyway.

Mark:

You know, is, is, does this foreshadow something, you know, is, is this the

Mark:

whole, like, the Jedi just aren't?

Mark:

Like, you, you, you can do what you want to try and bring it back to what

Mark:

it used to be, but it just won't be.

Mark:

It just simply won't be.

Mark:

So yeah, in short, man, I, I really like the, the symbolic nature of that

Mark:

title, because you could, like you said, you could look at that from,

Mark:

like, ten different perspectives.

Garry:

Yes.

Garry:

Yeah, true.

Garry:

And there was another, a lot of people have said that there's another Lord

Garry:

of the Rings reference in this episode where we have the whole thing with

Garry:

Elrond shouting to what's his name now to destroy the ring in the sort of prologue.

Garry:

To begin with, and you have a very similar thing where she's like, you

Garry:

know, destroy, you know, destroy it.

Garry:

And it's Sabine that's, that's the one cause she forms a kind of, a lot of people

Garry:

saying it's a, it's a weird alliance.

Garry:

And I think it's an alliance.

Garry:

I think it's cause there's a bit in the episode where Baylin very cleverly uses

Garry:

an emotional anchor to sort of say, look.

Garry:

Don't destroy the map.

Garry:

I'll help you.

Garry:

You have my word.

Garry:

I'll help you to go and do the thing we need to do.

Garry:

Withdrawn, you know, I'm not going to say that we'll just abandon the plan.

Garry:

We'll still go ahead with that.

Garry:

So you're still in the shit either way, but as an offshoot.

Garry:

You'll be able to get your friend back.

Garry:

So you have my word that nothing will happen to you and we'll do that.

Garry:

So she falls for that, gives him the star map and then they're on their way.

Garry:

And again, very cleverly, he destroys the star map so that nobody can track

Garry:

them because he's a, he knows now that.

Garry:

All the techs in place, the eye of Sion's ready to rock and roll.

Garry:

They have the coordinates, it's all ready to go so he can safely destroy it.

Garry:

So that was a really cool thing.

Garry:

And that kind of reference kind of leads into that really leans into that

Garry:

kind of, although there's a greater good and there's a greater thing to

Garry:

accomplish here, which would have been accomplished if she had destroyed the map.

Garry:

There's the ways that emotional thing, something to be gained, you know, which

Garry:

is kind of Tolkien esque, I guess.

Garry:

So your thoughts on Sabine in this one, and before we get to some of

Garry:

the other characters, because She was again, relatively pivotal in, in

Garry:

what happened and you can see why.

Garry:

Everything that's happening in this episode and the previous one, you can

Garry:

kind of see why there was that fracture previously between Ahsoka and Sabine

Garry:

there's, they've obviously got what looks like a common goal with things, but when

Garry:

it comes down to it, they're very, very different people with different things.

Garry:

So Ahsoka's learned via Anakin and via the previous Jedi that she's

Garry:

knocked about with the, the emotional attachment side of things is very, very.

Garry:

Difficult to balance as a Jedi, you know, we've seen that with Luke in the

Garry:

past and some other people, whereas Sabine, she can't seem to get over that

Garry:

thing, you know, although she tries very much to, to have the lightsaber

Garry:

moves down and, you know, she wants to be what feels like a Jedi up front.

Garry:

She just can't seem to get past that.

Garry:

So your thoughts on Sabine, you know, she's the emotional

Garry:

side of things is kind of.

Garry:

You know, not sitting well with Ahsoka, it seems.

Mark:

Yeah, and I think that's sort of an interesting character

Mark:

beat for Ahsoka as well, because, like, she's talking absolute BS.

Mark:

Like, she's got a massive emotional attachment to Anakin.

Mark:

You know, everything's about Anakin.

Mark:

It's like when you don't, you know, Oh, yeah, I'm over my ex, but

Mark:

everything is talking about him.

Mark:

You know, you see that all the time in Young'uns.

Mark:

And it's, it's, it feels the same sort of thing with Ahsoka.

Mark:

You know, she, everything is about Anakin.

Mark:

It always is, and she feels to me like pissed off Luke.

Mark:

You know, she has let in her mind herself down and everyone else because of that

Mark:

attachment to Anakin that she still can't get over and it's the same with Luke,

Mark:

with Ben in The Last Jedi, you know, he's, he's gone, he's gone pro hermit

Mark:

because it was his, it was his nephew and he, you know, however you read the,

Mark:

the, the interpretation of what happened with him, it went tits up, so I sort of

Mark:

get that what's interesting with Sabine is it's like, you know, Ahsoka's sort

Mark:

of saying, well, you know, we don't want you to be a Jedi, But like, do the,

Mark:

do the hardest bit of the Jedi stuff, instead of just get that like, instead

Mark:

of just be willing to fight and sacrifice stuff, like yourself, but, cause we saw

Mark:

that through Rebels, she's willing to.

Mark:

Or, you know, learn the Jedi lightsaber moves, become an absolute badass warrior,

Mark:

cause you're already Mandalorian, so you're already pretty good.

Mark:

It's like, no, do the hard bit that none of us has been

Mark:

able to do really that well.

Mark:

You know, and even Yoda, if you look at Yoda, yeah, gave up attachment, did he?

Mark:

Like, did he?

Mark:

Cause he went into exile to wait for someone.

Mark:

I didn't, he don't, he didn't go to exile just to hide and to wait for nothing.

Mark:

He went to wait for the new hub in Luke.

Mark:

You know, and, and I know that, you know, Obie wants the same thing.

Mark:

Like, oh yeah, you've got no attachment to Luke.

Mark:

Well, don't take him toys then, you know, it's, it's, you can watch and

Mark:

you can guard and you can be the Jedi, but don't take him the fricking fire.

Mark:

Mm-hmm.

Mark:

. You know, so there's a lot of layers.

Mark:

I think they're building a lot of layers into what it means to be

Mark:

this kind of, you know, this Jedi.

Mark:

And it, I think what is interesting from Sabine's perspective is that she's,

Mark:

she's mirroring the Anakin storyline.

Mark:

She's doing everything that Anakin did.

Mark:

And, and believe in the word of, of someone that she

Mark:

clearly probably shouldn't do.

Mark:

And Palpatine screwed him.

Mark:

But I don't think Balen will.

Mark:

I actually don't think Balen will.

Mark:

I think they've written that character enough that his word is, is his bond.

Mark:

And I, I think he will kill Shin.

Mark:

I think he'll be the one that kills her.

Mark:

Because she doesn't necessarily get it, whether she's killed or not, whatever.

Mark:

But I think if anyone's gonna kill it, yeah, there's the building of the

Mark:

antagonism between Shin and Sabine.

Mark:

Maybe Sabine gets the, the edge on it.

Mark:

But I've just got a feeling Balor might be the one that just says, Look, you know,

Mark:

I said we're doing this, and you said you were not doing it, so you're out.

Mark:

And I just think he, I just think he will live to his word.

Mark:

Because, you know, Ezra's pretty much a Jedi.

Mark:

You know, he seems to love the Jedi.

Mark:

It didn't need to come to this.

Mark:

He's talking to a soer, didn't need to come to this, you know,

Mark:

he is gonna try and recruit ez.

Mark:

Really it.

Mark:

So, yeah, of course there's a few interesting things in it.

Mark:

So, yeah, no, the Sabine one I think is I, they're just right in a like

Mark:

Anakin, which, you know, emotional.

Mark:

Petulant, when there's emotion involved.

Mark:

Driven by what she believes is right.

Mark:

And if that happens to sort of align with what the galaxy needs, then cool.

Mark:

But if not, then fuck it.

Mark:

And so I do think there's a lot of, I think this entire series is very

Mark:

much about mirroring Anakin's fall.

Mark:

And, even almost to a degree, I think it will potentially

Mark:

end in a very similar way.

Mark:

Not necessarily...

Mark:

Sabine Fallen, but I think there'll be some, I think they'll, the ending

Mark:

will end up, you know, Sabine's...

Mark:

pretty much back on side but Thrawn's back, the Empire's back, and so

Mark:

on and so forth, and then you've got this time frame to deal with.

Mark:

So I think she's really interestingly written.

Mark:

I think she's really interestingly written, and I, I think what's

Mark:

lovely about it is, they've really nailed her from the Rebels show.

Mark:

Like, it's really tightly nailed to her characterization on that one, and there

Mark:

were a few little throwaways as well, you know, things like, you know, Balan

Mark:

saying, you know, you lost your family on Mandalore in the, which we can only assume

Mark:

is the purge that Moff Gideon undertook.

Mark:

Because they're alive and kicking, I think, in, at the end of Rebels.

Mark:

So you've got to assume it's the Mandalorian purge, which Gideon took.

Mark:

So, yeah, really well layered stuff,

Garry:

dude.

Garry:

Exactly.

Garry:

Yeah, exactly.

Garry:

That layered.

Garry:

And that's what Filoni does so well.

Garry:

It doesn't take it's not like a, like you were saying earlier, it's not a good,

Garry:

bad, light, dark thing with a lot of his stories, even when he did the rebels, like

Garry:

a kid show for all intents and purposes.

Garry:

It's A lot of the rebels episodes and especially the clone wars, but even

Garry:

rebels that some assume is a little bit more kiddy than the clone wars.

Garry:

I disagree to a certain extent, but even some of that was very layered

Garry:

and you've got the feeling that it wasn't just a, yeah, go to this

Garry:

planet, rescue these people, do this thing or, you know, liberate these

Garry:

people and that'll be all good.

Garry:

So, and I think that was lacking with some of the other star wars stuff

Garry:

that we've seen on Disney plus to a degree as well, like especially some

Garry:

of the book of Boba Fett stuff that wasn't, you didn't get the feeling that

Garry:

was as layered and multidimensional.

Garry:

It was very much a character was eaten, but not really came back to life.

Garry:

Now just wants to do this thing.

Garry:

You know, even though they try to weave in some of the bits from one of the books

Garry:

and whatnot, it doesn't, I don't know, like for lonely stuff, when he really

Garry:

gets in the zone, it just feels like.

Garry:

You could rewatch this stuff three or four times and like pick out like little bits.

Garry:

You didn't quite catch before a little bit.

Garry:

So, and Sabine's a great example of that.

Garry:

It's right from episode one.

Garry:

It's like, yep, here's the character from rebels, as you know, and

Garry:

love, but you know, a couple of bits have happened to her.

Garry:

And now she's like this as a result, but it's very, very

Garry:

consistent and laid, which is great.

Garry:

Yeah, so it's been was very cool.

Garry:

The kind of identity reveal for Merrick then.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

That was like a, that was a sweepstake almost thing that was going around the

Garry:

internet for the last couple of weeks.

Garry:

And, you know, we had the whole, is by some weird weird destiny, is that Ezra?

Garry:

You know, is Ezra back as this weird Inquisitor or whatever that might be?

Garry:

Is it was it Starkiller?

Garry:

All of those things, it turns out it was just likely a resurrected

Garry:

Nightbrother that Morgans, you know, has done that thing.

Garry:

So.

Garry:

A little bit gutted that that character's gone, because I think they could have

Garry:

played that for another episode or two.

Garry:

But a nice little reveal nonetheless, though.

Mark:

Yeah, I think they just cleaned house for the Force users.

Mark:

I think they just needed to, you know So, yeah, I was, yeah, I was sort

Mark:

of pleasantly surprised that it was maybe like Nightsister magic, you

Mark:

know, whether it was a Nightbrother, whether it was a genuinely resurrected

Mark:

Inquisitor you know, because he had, he had Inquisitor moves, didn't he?

Mark:

Whether we'll find out in some Canon book later that it was, he was just

Mark:

a Jedi that got killed as part of the, the, the, the, the pre return

Mark:

of the Jedi era, sort of, you know, inquisitor Jedi tussling going on.

Mark:

Or, or not, who knows, you know, I think we'll maybe get some of that, but I just

Mark:

like the idea it was anonymous, and I like the idea it was, it was a night

Mark:

of sister magic, it showed what Morgan Elsbeth can really do, if, if, if indeed

Mark:

that is how that's to be interpreted.

Mark:

But it was nice, because it would have been a distraction, wouldn't it?

Mark:

You know, I had all, there was all sorts of people saying it's Luke like,

Mark:

it's not Luke, it's not Anakin, it's not Ezra, it's not anyone, it's not,

Mark:

it was, I don't think it was ever gonna be, because if that gets revealed to

Mark:

be Ezra, it's like, it was too obvious.

Mark:

And then no way was it going to be Luke, because it's

Mark:

like, how do you explain that?

Garry:

That's a, that's a real edge one.

Garry:

How could

Mark:

it possibly be Luke?

Mark:

Well, everyone was saying it was the, the Luke, you know, the clone

Mark:

from the heir to the Empire trilogy.

Mark:

And I just thought that was wild, because suddenly Luke takes over again, and

Mark:

there's nothing wrong with that, if that's the plan, and, and, you know, like it

Mark:

was in Mando, it was brilliant to see, but it's a circus show, we've waited

Mark:

all this time, don't let Luke take over.

Mark:

And that's, you know, all joking aside, we've said it before, and there was

Mark:

a little meme, I think, with Anakin, where it's like, hello Snips, and in the

Mark:

world between worlds at the end, hello Snips, she turns around and is like,

Mark:

you need to call my fucking son quick.

Mark:

You know?

Mark:

Because you would do!

Mark:

You know, the biggest threat to the entire galaxy.

Mark:

Your two Jedi that you had, Kanan and Ezra, they're gone.

Mark:

What are you gonna do?

Mark:

Like, who should we ring?

Mark:

I don't know, do you wanna...

Mark:

Do you think we should maybe tell, like, who do we know?

Mark:

Hmm.

Mark:

We need probably someone that's pretty good Jediing, good Force stuff, got

Mark:

his own ship, and we probably need someone that breaks the rules, and

Mark:

we might need someone that's got a bit of authority in the Senate.

Mark:

If only we knew three people like that, do you know what I mean?

Mark:

You sort of, and this is the problem, isn't it, with this era of Star Wars,

Mark:

is that you get someone as badass as Ahsoka, which is Mint, and you

Mark:

can see her taking on that battle.

Mark:

And you can see Hera taking on that battle and acting as the Han Solo of the group

Mark:

and being Phoenix Leader and all that amazing stuff that we saw in this episode.

Mark:

But, like, where's the Millennium Falcon?

Mark:

Like, if you need someone to go to the other galaxy, like, who are you gonna get?

Mark:

You know, it's, and it's just, so that's the problem with this, this era, isn't

Mark:

it, is that the threat can never be big enough to bring Luke in, you know?

Mark:

Yeah,

Garry:

I read you.

Garry:

It's like So it's tough, it's tough.

Garry:

Absolutely, yeah.

Garry:

And it It's, it's almost I wouldn't say it's a problem, but it's, it's almost

Garry:

an issue that you run into with not just this, but the video games as well.

Garry:

So I redownloaded Jedi survivor cause they've just released a brand new

Garry:

patch for it, which has apparently fixed all the performance issues and

Garry:

everything, which played at release.

Garry:

And that got me thinking, just as you mentioned it there about the whole Cal

Garry:

Kestis thing and what's going on there.

Garry:

It's like there's, it, it comes across like there's big shit going on.

Garry:

As is with this show here, but is it that big that you don't have

Garry:

the big guns in to sort it out?

Garry:

So you have to weigh that up, don't you?

Garry:

It's, you know, it's a big threat to the galaxy because the way that

Garry:

they're putting it across is thrown is.

Garry:

You know, as the name suggests from the old books, I've just

Garry:

pulled that vibe from the books.

Garry:

It's like, he's the dude that's now going to just upend all the, all

Garry:

the cool, all the cool stuff that's happening with the new Republic

Garry:

and everything now in the galaxy.

Garry:

So why aren't the big, you know, the big three involved to stop

Mark:

it?

Mark:

It's the same thing with like the Avengers and all that sort of stuff in it.

Mark:

You know, if, if you.

Mark:

If, if there is a Celestial in the sea, then there's absolutely not a

Mark:

way on Earth that not at least one of the Avengers is just gonna go.

Mark:

What's that then?

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Or the remnants of what would shield or whatever are not gonna clock

Mark:

fucking seismic activity, you know?

Mark:

What's that then?

Mark:

So it's, yeah, I think that's the problem when you've got these mega

Mark:

universes is that there's always someone that's the mega hero.

Mark:

It's a Superman problem, innit?

Mark:

If, if you're right in Justice League...

Mark:

You either write him out of it, or you do a Grant Morrison and embrace it,

Mark:

and just say, Well, yeah, he's the guy, so I'm gonna write everything so big.

Mark:

He has to be involved, and I'll think of good ways to do the

Mark:

other people that fit into that.

Mark:

You know, I'm, I'm not gonna try and make, it's like, It was one of the things

Mark:

that Dawn of Justice did well for Batman.

Mark:

It's like, okay, yeah, of course he's shit against Doomsday.

Mark:

So let him, let him go and do other stuff.

Mark:

You know, let him go and do this other stuff.

Mark:

So it's, yeah, it's a tough situation with someone like Luke, because you

Mark:

want to see as much of him as possible.

Mark:

But if he comes in...

Mark:

You know, if his, if his canon Luke is not really as powerful yet as,

Mark:

as Ahsoka, which, well, he certainly is not as experienced, whether

Mark:

he's as powerful or not as TBC.

Mark:

But if it's, if it's Legends Luke, he's almost stupidly overpowered.

Mark:

Like we said when I, when we talked about Heir to the Empire

Mark:

before, it's like, you know, oh, the microwave's broken on the ship.

Mark:

Don't worry about it, the force has got microwave healing power that

Mark:

I've just invented for this reason.

Mark:

And it, they do that, they do that with everything.

Mark:

It's like, oh, you need to hold your breath to get.

Mark:

This impossible swim, don't worry the force, I can do that with the force.

Mark:

So it sort of got stupid, you know, and that's why you

Mark:

can't bring Luke in, I think.

Garry:

Yeah, yeah, that's a good shout.

Garry:

Otherwise you just end up with crutch mechanisms that just...

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah, I know what you mean.

Garry:

Yeah, I know what you mean, dude.

Garry:

And I think as you move through this, it'll be interesting to see what

Garry:

they do after this whole era, because there's only so much stories that you

Garry:

can craft within this era before it starts to just get stupidly crowded.

Garry:

And then that just compounds the issue of all of this stuff going on, but yet

Garry:

nobody like Luke comes in and intervenes or knows what's going on and stuff.

Garry:

So yeah, be interesting to see what they do after this whole Filoni wrap

Garry:

up movie, you know, all that stuff.

Garry:

So okay, let's whisper another couple of characters before we

Garry:

talk about a couple of juicy bits.

Garry:

It's good to see Carson Teva back the, the X Wing pilot who who we've

Garry:

seen a couple of times, haven't we pop up in Mandalorian and stuff.

Garry:

And it's, he's, he's almost like the, the Poe Dameron almost, isn't he?

Garry:

Like the sequel, truly.

Garry:

He's like the, like the ace pilot, the do gooder, the guy that, you

Garry:

know, can see what's going on and doesn't always obey orders.

Garry:

But good to see him back, dude.

Mark:

Yeah, he's, he's becoming, like, the go to guy if you need someone.

Mark:

He's becoming, like they said, he's, you know Hera mentioned, Hera

Mark:

mentioned that, you know, Once a rebel, always a rebel, you know,

Mark:

so that, that's quite a nice thing.

Mark:

It shows a little bit of his background as well, you know, maybe he was, he

Mark:

was probably a rebel before this.

Mark:

And, I think on that note as well, it was great to see the squadron of X

Mark:

Wings, it was great to see the Ghost doing Ghost things, it was great to

Mark:

see Jason in there as the co pilot, the little Kane and Eastreg with the pitcher.

Mark:

A lot of people saying that's Freddie Prinze Jr., you know, maybe, we'll

Mark:

come to this in a bit, whether we're gonna see different timelines next

Mark:

week, maybe, probably, probably.

Mark:

Is Freddie Prinze gonna be in it?

Mark:

Like a 40 percent chance.

Mark:

So, there was, yeah, it was just nice to see, Carson and, and, but also

Mark:

all of them just doing ghost things, and I loved when the Scion jumped.

Mark:

Like, that was visually spectacular.

Mark:

It was like Holdo Maneuver, you know, style graphics.

Mark:

Really, really good stuff.

Mark:

I love how much it shook the crew.

Mark:

Love how much, how much it just, you know, it just blew them away.

Mark:

I loved sort of the fear on Jason's face, and I've got a bad feeling, and...

Mark:

Which is again another multi layered thing.

Mark:

You know, that was just a little throwaway, everyone says it, but also

Mark:

the guy's probably force sensitive.

Mark:

And then, I just, I loved that little...

Mark:

with Morgan Elsbeth, who's not really done that much this season yet.

Mark:

I really liked her when they sort of stood in the way of the hyperspace ring,

Mark:

and her answer was just, ignore them.

Mark:

Like, that was such a nicely written...

Mark:

Because it could have been, oh shit, you know, like, we need to open fire,

Mark:

take them out with the cannons, and then go, you know, then try and escape.

Mark:

And she was just like, yeah, ignore him, you know, and I just thought

Mark:

that was really a nice little detail that kept the pacing nicely done.

Garry:

Yeah, and it's one of those things that would have gone down in

Garry:

sort of short term history as well.

Garry:

It's like, yeah, we don't, we don't pull out this maneuver

Garry:

very often, I'll be honest.

Garry:

But you know, in the last year, so if you fast forward after this

Garry:

era, when you get to the sequel trilogy and you see yeah, hold on.

Garry:

She's like, ah, this has been known to them, you know,

Garry:

kind of worked in the past.

Garry:

Let's let's rack up the old hyperdrive and just blast through.

Garry:

So yeah, it was, it almost makes you question how many times has

Garry:

that been done in star wars?

Garry:

Cause this is like the second time that we've seen it now where someone's

Garry:

just, you know, whacked on the hyperdrive and regardless of what's

Garry:

in front, you know, off they go.

Garry:

So, but that was a really cool.

Garry:

It was a, it was a cool line because it shows her confidence more than

Garry:

anything, you know, it was that kind of I wouldn't say like nonchalant

Garry:

kind of, yeah, whatever, but it was just a, yeah, don't worry.

Garry:

We've got bigger fish to fry.

Garry:

Cause she knows if she gets drawn into a battle with the ghost and the X wings

Garry:

and so on, that's a potential, you know, the ship's getting shot down.

Garry:

So let's leave the small fry.

Garry:

Let's go after the big fish.

Garry:

And you, you don't often see that in Star Wars, to be honest, because they

Garry:

always make an opportunity to see a lightsaber fight, a space battle of, you

Garry:

know, whatever it is, they always take the opportunity to show those things.

Garry:

And get stuck in.

Garry:

So yeah.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Like that dude.

Garry:

It was very cool.

Garry:

Let's talk about Balan and the fight with Ahsoka around the star map

Garry:

because at this point they've split up.

Garry:

She's left Sabine to handle Shin.

Garry:

Those two are having a decent little scrap, but don't need to

Garry:

talk about much with that really.

Garry:

Cause you will, you referenced the best bit of the fight anyway.

Garry:

where they do the lightsaber bit and then Sabine thinks, right,

Garry:

I'll use the force in this bit.

Garry:

It's going to be badass.

Garry:

Doesn't quite pan out, you know, and then and then that's that.

Garry:

But so the, the lightsaber fight with Ahsoka and Balan, that's, that

Garry:

was the, that was very, very cool.

Garry:

And it showed a couple of little nuances that we hadn't seen before with Ahsoka

Garry:

as well, more than anything, because we're, we're Balan's character anyway.

Garry:

So we're not really sure.

Garry:

About the chops that he's got with lightsaber battles.

Garry:

It seems like he's got a fairly traditional style, a fairly like run

Garry:

of the mill sort of Jedi training, you know, that kind of thing.

Garry:

But Ahsoka we know is slightly different anyway.

Garry:

She wields two lightsabers.

Garry:

She holds them in different stances at times time.

Garry:

In this one though, she used one lightsaber the whole time,

Garry:

which is quite interesting.

Garry:

It was almost like she knew that Balin's style was quite traditional.

Garry:

So she wanted to match that perhaps.

Garry:

And there was a couple of really cool little force bits, and the two of them

Garry:

just played off of each other really well.

Garry:

Balan's obviously very experienced, whereas Ahsoka, although experienced,

Garry:

this was like the first time that she went up against somebody that was a

Garry:

bit of a match, which is very cool.

Garry:

The other lightsaber fight she's had previously, she had a little

Garry:

glint in her eye from time to time, a little grin here and there, a

Garry:

little bit of self confidence.

Garry:

She knew what the crack was, but so.

Garry:

This fight was the first time that she was tested in a while, it felt

Garry:

like, and like you mentioned earlier, Balan's such a good character, like

Garry:

psychologically strong, you know, pretty good with the old lightsaber, so to

Garry:

me, that was one of the best lightsaber fights we've seen in a while, dude.

Garry:

I thought that was very cool.

Mark:

Yeah, I agree, and it was, it was like, like you said, it was the first

Mark:

time she, or it felt like the first time she came up against an actual master

Mark:

which she's not gonna do that often these days, you know, the probably the

Mark:

last time she came up against a master was probably against Vader, really.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

So yeah, probably you'd think unless there's anything else that we've missed.

Mark:

But yeah, I, I agree.

Mark:

It was It was very well done, it showed her athleticism, it showed

Mark:

She had a lot of Anakin's fighting style in there as well, we saw

Mark:

that when she was fighting Shin.

Mark:

Sorry, fighting Marak, where she took Anakin's stance, the over the head,

Mark:

you know, very aggressive stance.

Mark:

But also showed her athleticism a little bit.

Mark:

There was a couple of weird things in there, like, you know, why is she

Mark:

running to get the map, when she could just get the, use the force on it.

Mark:

I know that they needed to, from a story perspective, to keep it interesting.

Mark:

But you just, you, why would you not pull it out with the force?

Mark:

Like, I just, that was sort of a weird...

Mark:

I get it, but it's sort of weird.

Mark:

I lo I loved the wh that whole sequence from that point in, you know,

Mark:

everything from her getting burnt you know, is the map burnt into her hand

Mark:

in some sort of Home Alone tribute?

Mark:

Do we get, you know, do we is that how they get there?

Mark:

I don't know.

Mark:

I'm alone.

Mark:

It's funny, isn't it?

Mark:

I mean, we're clearly going to see the Purgle do something.

Mark:

Let's be honest.

Mark:

The, the whole Ahsoka falling off the cliff thing.

Mark:

It was good because Balan switched his style up to be very Anakin.

Mark:

He was, he was just big, two handed, beat the crap out of you with power swings.

Mark:

Like, he was not out dueling her at that point.

Mark:

He was just hitting her that hard that she couldn't move forward.

Mark:

She could just move back and he just knocked her towards the edge of the cliff.

Mark:

Like that was a real, okay, I'm pissed off now.

Mark:

What have you done that for?

Mark:

And even the sort of, it didn't come to this.

Mark:

It shouldn't have come to this or whatever.

Mark:

It was unnecessary, whatever he said.

Mark:

That was all very Anakin.

Mark:

All very boom, boom, boom.

Mark:

And then, obviously the necessity for him to get rid of Ahsoka or chucking

Mark:

her off the cliff was there for Sabine, you know, he needed her out of the way,

Mark:

because otherwise she'd talk Sabine down.

Mark:

So you could, yeah, it was all, again, all very well done stuff.

Mark:

And I, yeah, I enjoyed all the fights in this one.

Mark:

I thought Sabine stood up to Shin a little bit too well, given how

Mark:

terrible she's been throughout this entire season with the lightsaber.

Mark:

She lost to a droid, not a highly trained force user.

Mark:

And then suddenly she's standing toe to toe with it.

Mark:

Granted, she didn't really do too much, and it was nice to see the

Mark:

Mandalorian, you know, here's, here's the, because she got all that gear

Mark:

from, I think, the last season of the Mandal, of Rebels, maybe Season 3.

Mark:

The, the wrist shooters and, you know, the genuine Mandalorian

Mark:

tech that she was missing for the first two and a half seasons.

Mark:

So it was nice to see that play out but I just thought

Mark:

it was all really nicely done.

Mark:

It was all, Balin was very Dooku esque, he was very, even Obi Wan in the OT, he

Mark:

was very, you know, you know, I respect.

Mark:

This and this is an honorable fight and it just felt it just felt in

Mark:

keeping with the character You know, there was no mega acrobatics.

Mark:

There was some from Ahsoka But it was very much a duel, you know a respectful

Mark:

duel, which I think says something about that character And then you know that

Mark:

ending kick him off kick Ahsoka off the edge, you know Which then leads us to

Mark:

where we are at the end, which we'll get to in a second It was it was it was just

Mark:

a means to an end for so many different reasons but it was You know, you've got

Mark:

to believe that he believes he's pushed her off and killed her sort of thing.

Mark:

So it was just all very nicely

Garry:

done, dude.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

And I love that the reference to them potentially being able to

Garry:

find their way to the other galaxy is the map burnt into her hand.

Garry:

I love that we have one of the most sort of another Lucasfilm thing

Garry:

with the whole Indiana Jones, Eraser Lost Ark, you know, the the staff

Garry:

of Ra that's burnt into his hand.

Garry:

I love that you went with home alone versus.

Garry:

You know, rather than Indiana Jones, which is probably more, but yeah

Garry:

that's got a player that's because when you see her hand afterwards, there's

Garry:

loads more detail that's burning, you know, so that's got gloves on as well.

Garry:

Exactly.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

You know, so that's like tarnished, you know, the material.

Garry:

So you can't get away from that at least.

Garry:

So even if her skin.

Garry:

or whatever, heels, whatever, the map is in the glove,

Garry:

basically, well, part of the map.

Garry:

So that could be a, you know, that could be a Goonies thing now.

Garry:

It's like, how do we align this part of the map with something else?

Garry:

You know, to get us to where we need to go, but...

Mark:

You know it's going to be something like that.

Mark:

It'll be like, we don't have a map, and then she'll be like, Oh, do we?

Mark:

You know, slow hand raise into frame, and you're like, oh,

Garry:

right.

Garry:

It's like you know, Harry Potter as well, when they're trying to find the Horcruxes.

Garry:

And he's got the little the little golden snitch.

Garry:

He doesn't realize that it opens, you know, he's like, Oh, I've

Garry:

got another bit of the puzzle.

Garry:

Amazing.

Garry:

So that's bound to happen at some point.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah,

Mark:

no, that's exactly it.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

That's always it.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Always

Garry:

happens.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

And the last thing I want to mention about bailing just very quickly is that.

Garry:

You still got the feeling that he didn't want that fight to

Garry:

begin with in the first place.

Garry:

There's a, there's a bit early on where Baylin's like,

Garry:

take care of them, whatever.

Garry:

He says, ah, whatever.

Garry:

And she's like, I can sense a bit of fear in your voice.

Garry:

He's like, no, not fear, just unnecessary sort of thing.

Garry:

So even though...

Garry:

Experience he said, isn't it?

Garry:

Exactly.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

It's like, even though, and this is the cool thing about the writing with

Garry:

these particular characters, these.

Garry:

You know, not Sith, not Jedi.

Garry:

It's that they're not just your run of the mill baddies, because if that

Garry:

was the case, they'd have been slicing people down left, right, and center.

Garry:

Do you know what I mean?

Garry:

And it was exactly the same at the very beginning of this show, when they

Garry:

go onto the ship to rescue Morgan.

Garry:

He didn't want to, like, take all those dudes out to begin with.

Garry:

He just wanted to go in there, bit of talkie talkie, pretend to be

Garry:

Jedi, get Morgan and off they went.

Garry:

And it's the same thing with Ahsoka, he's like, I don't want to cut down any more

Garry:

Jedi, I don't want the Jedi to be extinct.

Garry:

I just want you to get out of the way so I can put my plan in

Garry:

action, which is he thinks is going to benefit the galaxy somehow.

Garry:

We don't know what his grand plan is, but but that was another very cool

Garry:

little character sort of progression, I guess, where they just built on that.

Garry:

You know, I don't really want to fight Ahsoka, but she's getting in a way.

Garry:

So I sort of have to, you know, get it.

Mark:

It was interesting because he sort of said, like you said, you said

Mark:

experience when she said a little bit of fear and he went, no experience.

Mark:

And then when Ahsoka pulled a saber out, it was like.

Mark:

How inevitable so you and then when he said later, you're lazy, you know, like

Mark:

your masters He was very purposeful about saying masters whether that's Yoda whether

Mark:

it's classed as Obi Wan because they were so close Clearly Anakin because he invoked

Mark:

Anakin's name early But it does make you wonder I did some maths on this one

Mark:

around Probably Revenge of the Sith here.

Mark:

This guy would have been assume is 55 He would have been about 23,

Mark:

24, so just coming out of Padawan.

Mark:

Really.

Mark:

Younger than Obi Wan.

Mark:

Let's put that into context.

Mark:

Younger than Obi Wan.

Mark:

A young fighter in the Clone Wars.

Mark:

It does make you wonder, like, did he come up against someone?

Mark:

How has he stayed hidden?

Mark:

There's a lot in there that could be quite interesting, whether we'll get it or not.

Mark:

I think, because of the sad passing of Ray Stevenson, I think we're gonna

Mark:

see maybe a recasting for this guy.

Mark:

He's probably someone that could just about be recast if

Mark:

it's done really tastefully.

Mark:

Or...

Mark:

My bigger bet is on, I think we're going to get a book about Balin.

Mark:

I think he's, he's, he's almost nailed on for a book.

Garry:

Defo dude, we're absolutely getting a book.

Garry:

I imagine that's already done or halfway through.

Garry:

There's an author writing a book about that for sure.

Garry:

But a great fight dude, great characters, great fight on that one.

Garry:

Let's finish up with the ending.

Garry:

And as Mark mentioned earlier, spoilers on this one.

Garry:

If you've only watched a bit of the episode or you've not even seen it yet,

Garry:

this is the big one, the big spoiler.

Garry:

So fair warning from here on in.

Garry:

So she gets thrown off the cliff.

Garry:

We think she's dead.

Garry:

She wakes up in the world between worlds completely days to begin with, but then

Garry:

she very quickly has that look on her face, which is like, shit, am I dead?

Garry:

What's happened to me?

Garry:

I know where I am.

Garry:

Cause she's been there before.

Garry:

She's like, I know where I am, but why am I here?

Garry:

You know, exist.

Garry:

Is this like the bit?

Garry:

Am I just like the netherworld of the force?

Garry:

I was just wandering around now.

Garry:

Do I help other Jedi now who are alive?

Garry:

What do I do?

Garry:

And then just as quickly, she hears Anakin.

Garry:

She turns around, Anakin's there.

Garry:

And I'll come on to the very, very last few seconds, but for now I assume,

Garry:

because you're such a huge Anakin fan, I assume you're happy to see.

Garry:

Hayden Christensen back with a bit of de aging, dude.

Mark:

I wasn't fully expecting Anakin at the end of this.

Mark:

I wasn't expecting the World Between Worlds.

Mark:

I maybe naively didn't think that they'd do the World Between Worlds,

Mark:

because I think that's one of those things to the casual viewer, you've

Mark:

got too much explaining to do.

Mark:

Whether they do it next week and it's just like, this is the place we come where

Mark:

we see all time, you know, whether it's just one of them quick throwaway things.

Mark:

I just felt that there was maybe too much explaining to do that, that,

Mark:

that would get criticism from those that are saying, Well, you've got

Mark:

to have watched Rebels to see it.

Mark:

Seems like they don't give a shit about that and they're just leaning

Mark:

into it, which is cool for us.

Mark:

We love it.

Mark:

But I was expecting to see Anakin.

Mark:

I was, without a doubt.

Mark:

I thought, without a doubt, the last three minutes we're gonna see Anakin in this.

Mark:

I didn't know how it would occur.

Mark:

I thought it might be him doing something to help her out with Balin.

Mark:

Cause she was, she was getting beaten up.

Mark:

I thought that maybe that was the case.

Mark:

It turns out it probably is the case.

Mark:

You know, she was falling off a cliff to what appeared to

Mark:

be a pretty reasonable death.

Mark:

Or not, because it's Star Wars.

Mark:

Pretty reasonable.

Mark:

Pretty reasonable death.

Mark:

But someone's pulled her out into the World Between Worlds.

Mark:

Is it Anakin?

Mark:

Is it someone else who's put him there?

Mark:

You know, there's a lot of speculation we can talk about on that.

Mark:

But I expected to see Anakin.

Mark:

It was nice to see him in the Revenge of the Sith stuff.

Mark:

There's a lot of talk about, is that Vader's saber?

Mark:

Is it his saber, because they're in a dark place?

Mark:

It looks black.

Mark:

This is a prime example of you've never been able to please Star Wars fans,

Mark:

people bitching about the de aging.

Mark:

Pretty much the same people that went, Why didn't the de aging better in Obi Wan?

Mark:

Like, have a word.

Mark:

Everything about that entire thing was great, man.

Mark:

The framing of it, the, you know, hello Snips.

Mark:

The framing of the shot, which every time they see each other or leave

Mark:

each other, it's over the shoulder.

Mark:

You know, one of them is over the shoulder to the other.

Mark:

So there's a lot of different symbolism in this from a Filoni

Mark:

perspective, and it's all Filoni.

Mark:

And it's just interesting.

Mark:

You know, the line that I found most interesting was, Didn't

Mark:

expect to see you so soon.

Mark:

Because you can read that in a few different ways.

Mark:

Like, you know, this is a young death.

Mark:

Alright, that's the first, that's the most obvious one.

Mark:

It's a young death, alright?

Mark:

You're sorry that you've died so young, whatever, okay?

Mark:

And then, but then for me, there's the, well, he was in Revenge of the Sith garb,

Mark:

if this, and I'm not sure it is, but if this is indeed Anakin, and he's come out

Mark:

of time, he's probably only just left her on Mandalore to go and sort the Chancellor

Mark:

out, where he's off, at the beginning of Revenge of the Sith, and she's off sorting

Mark:

Maul out, in, in Clone Wars Season 7.

Mark:

Or there's nothing to it, so I don't know.

Mark:

But yeah, no, the whole thing was intriguing, dude.

Mark:

And it sets up, I mean, we know that this next year, next month, sorry, next

Mark:

week even, there's a theatrical release for a 49 minute Dave Filoni episode.

Mark:

It's gonna be massive, let's be honest.

Mark:

Yeah, just, there's a lot to unpack with that one.

Mark:

But yeah, I was delighted to see Anakin.

Mark:

And I think we're in store for something interesting next week.

Mark:

I've seen a lot of speculation about what this episode will be, which...

Mark:

We can probably spend a few minutes on, but I, I think it will be something

Mark:

to absolve Ahsoka of this guilt and we'll start to see the lighter heart

Mark:

of Ahsoka like we did Obi Wan as well.

Mark:

I think this is Anakin doing what he did for Obi Wan in a very different

Mark:

way, you know, maybe, I saw a rumor.

Mark:

I hope it's not true, because if so, there'll be less surprise for me.

Mark:

But I'll say it anyway, of where he's gonna show a different timelines,

Mark:

you know, and just saying he would have still fallen to the dark side,

Mark:

even if she'd have got involved.

Mark:

It would have been him fighting her on Mustafar and whatever.

Mark:

I sort of hope it's not that obvious.

Mark:

I sort of hope it's not, and I'm putting...

Mark:

We always predict these things, and we always get it wrong, because

Mark:

the writers are better than we are.

Mark:

But that's the, that's the persistent rumor that I've seen.

Mark:

And I just hope it's wrong.

Mark:

Just, I hope they do something deeper than that.

Mark:

So something more original than that.

Garry:

Yeah, you would hope so.

Garry:

And, you know, old Filoni behind the wheel, he's not, he's not

Garry:

let us down yet on Ahsoka.

Garry:

So we'll see.

Garry:

There are two things that I and I agree with everything you've just said.

Garry:

It was, it was great to see Anakin back great to see him in his prequel days.

Garry:

You know, before he starts to really, you know, before the shit hits the fan

Garry:

with all that stuff, the two things that I thought were really interesting is

Garry:

that you saw a soakers character change instantly for the first time in two

Garry:

in, because up to now, when someone's mentioned Anakin, she's always just

Garry:

dismissed it with a straight face.

Garry:

She doesn't want to get drawn into conversation about

Garry:

anything to do with Anakin.

Garry:

I think earlier on in the series, she mentioned something like, you know, I

Garry:

walked away from him and the Jedi and, you know, I left all that behind as soon

Garry:

as she hears his voice for real, if it is Anakin, she immediately is like, Oh

Garry:

my God, it's it's you sort of thing.

Garry:

It's so I think she was, she's kind of put up this barrier.

Garry:

Emotionally, she doesn't want to get into anything about Anakin

Garry:

previous to this point soon.

Garry:

She sees and hears him.

Garry:

Her demeanor completely changes, you know, and she's so that I

Garry:

thought that was interesting.

Garry:

And then second of all, when the music, so after they've done their little thing

Garry:

and they're kind of just looking at each other, the music at the end starts to

Garry:

play a few little notes of Anakin steam.

Garry:

But then when the screen goes black, it's the last few notes of Vader's theme.

Garry:

Exactly.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

And I thought that was really because a lot of people were just as soon as

Garry:

that's because there's a few seconds break and the screen goes black.

Garry:

If you've turned it off at that point, you might have missed a really important, like

Garry:

literally one and a half seconds bit of, of narrative there or some foreshadowing.

Garry:

So I thought that was also really interesting.

Garry:

It's like on one hand, here's Anakin, like good side Anakin

Garry:

before he gets too troubled.

Garry:

But.

Garry:

The theme at the end is like, that's a Vader's music.

Garry:

So that's like, do you know what I mean?

Garry:

So I thought those two things are really interesting.

Garry:

And next week's episode, I think is going to be just like you said, massive

Garry:

because you wouldn't whack that one in the cinema for just because it's

Garry:

like, you know, for the sake of it, or it's just midway point in a series.

Garry:

You wouldn't do that.

Garry:

And you've also

Mark:

got to think as well that it's gonna, it can't just be character.

Mark:

stuff, which we'd absolutely fucking love, you know, just, I don't, you'd

Mark:

take 50 minutes of just them two talking and sorting the shit out, like, and we'd

Mark:

absolutely, we'd be loving it, like, you've got a kid, Luke, I know, you're

Mark:

not going to believe this, but, and like, there's a lot in there, you know,

Mark:

there's a lot of stuff in there that could be badass just from talking, but

Mark:

for it to go in cinemas, it can't be, you're going to have lightsaber fights,

Mark:

you're going to have space battles, you're going to have the lot, it will

Mark:

be, In my mind, because of the budget that Ahsoka's clearly got, because

Mark:

the, the visuals on it are excellent.

Mark:

You, this will have elements of everything, in my mind.

Mark:

And I would maybe even say that you might get Luke.

Mark:

You maybe, you maybe might even get Luke in there as well.

Mark:

Just because, when, when is there a better opportunity to see Luke

Mark:

and Anakin on screen together?

Mark:

You know, and I just don't know if there's any better chance apart from

Mark:

maybe later day to the Empire if there's some, if Filoni decides to do the,

Mark:

I'll give, I'll show you all the Jedi.

Mark:

Forget Rise of Skywalker, I'll do it.

Mark:

You know, unless there's part of that.

Mark:

Like, so let's just have like two minutes speculating on this, right?

Mark:

Is this Anakin, is the first question.

Mark:

If it is Anakin, where's he from, how did he get there?

Mark:

Or is this Palpatine screwing with people?

Mark:

Is it someone else screwing with people?

Mark:

Is this Anakin, but he's already Vader, he's just slaughtered

Mark:

everyone at the Jedi Temple?

Mark:

Like, the questions are off the charts with this one.

Mark:

I think there's one thing that can be certain.

Mark:

It's probably, it's not, it's not, all is not as it seems.

Mark:

You know, you, you, you, you can guarantee the first thing.

Mark:

We left on a high this last episode.

Mark:

The beginning of the next episode has to be Ahsoka going, Ah, hang

Mark:

on, wait a fucking second here.

Mark:

The last time I saw you, you nearly killed me on Malachor.

Mark:

Right?

Mark:

So I know that's, I know that's you.

Mark:

I know that's how you end up.

Mark:

What is this?

Mark:

And I know she knows about the world between worlds, but

Mark:

yeah, just speculation man.

Mark:

What do you think?

Garry:

Yeah, I think, I think it is Anakin.

Garry:

I do think that, but I think it's, I think he's been pulled in

Garry:

there by the force to intervene.

Garry:

But he's unaware of that.

Garry:

That's my guess, because everything that we've seen up to this point,

Garry:

In terms of films and TV and even books, there's, it seems very unlikely

Garry:

that we've missed a gap somewhere.

Garry:

where Anakin just suddenly disappeared for a while, went off to the world,

Garry:

world between worlds, did this stuff with Ahsoka, came back, has no recollection.

Garry:

That seems too tidy.

Garry:

That's, that's like the whole Dallas.

Garry:

I woke up.

Garry:

It was a dream.

Garry:

It's kind of thing.

Garry:

So I think that was Dallas.

Garry:

Was it?

Garry:

It was.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

So that, that seems to a little bit too wrapped up in a nice little bow.

Garry:

We don't have to retcon anything to accomplish that, so I think it

Garry:

is Anakin, but it's another, some, excuse the pun, another force has

Garry:

driven that, and he's there purely on autopilot, if you like, via the force,

Garry:

to, to help out, that's my guess.

Garry:

I just

Mark:

wonder about that though, how do you reconcile everything that he's

Mark:

done as Vader, if that's Anakin before he becomes Vader, or even just as

Mark:

he's becoming Vader, because he's in Revenge of the Sith Clone Wars Gab.

Mark:

How do you reconcile the whole...

Mark:

Cause he'll just say, nah, I'll not do that, of course I'll not, I'm the

Mark:

greatest Jedi ever at this point.

Mark:

You know.

Mark:

Not necessarily.

Mark:

If it's any time pre Javader though, he'll just...

Mark:

He'll believe in himself that much, he'll just say, I'm not gonna do

Garry:

it.

Garry:

Not...

Garry:

Not necessarily because remember at this point if if that is revenge of

Garry:

the Sith Anakin, which it looks like it is at that point Remember, he's still

Garry:

pretty much tipping point Darkseid at that point So it's not like he doesn't

Garry:

have any kind of feeling or emotion to the Darkseid at this point Because he

Mark:

says you're gonna kill all the Jedi all the younglings and you're

Mark:

gonna kill Padme Oh, you're gonna think you kill Padme and you can

Mark:

have a fight with Obi Wan That's all.

Mark:

He's that arrogant.

Mark:

He's going to be like, nah, I'm not, I wouldn't come to that.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah, that's true.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

I just, it feels to me like it's too convenient for him to purposefully

Garry:

go off and do that and come back and not one reference to it at any point.

Garry:

Exactly.

Garry:

You know, so I feel like something else is driving that.

Garry:

Like you said, it could be Palps, could be something else.

Garry:

I don't know.

Garry:

It could be an imposter.

Garry:

Yeah, you know, this could be could be anybody

Mark:

could be false ghost even this could be false ghost Anakin in in in the form

Mark:

Oh, yeah, yeah, you know, and it's just the world between worlds is accessible

Mark:

to force Maybe that's how they get

Garry:

around as in like return of the Jedi force

Mark:

ghost.

Mark:

That's what I was thinking I know a different robes on but you know,

Mark:

maybe that's just how he gets around.

Garry:

Yeah, like world between worlds ubers

Mark:

Exactly that just walk down there and you know, cuz they're all

Mark:

knock about together, don't they?

Garry:

They do, yeah.

Garry:

And also World Between Worlds, we don't know enough about it yet.

Garry:

We just know it's like this ethereal time travel, timey wimey.

Mark:

Yeah, all time is together.

Mark:

Yeah, so that, yeah.

Mark:

I don't know man, it's, but I just, I just feel like there's something more to it.

Mark:

I, I hope it's not as simple as, in order to show you

Mark:

spectacular, awesome, badass stuff.

Mark:

I'm going to take you through a what could have been of the timeline.

Mark:

And yeah, we're going to see some fucking awesome stuff.

Mark:

Like, we're going to see young Ahsoka again, and we're going

Mark:

to see Aidan Christensen, DH, fighting in the Clone Wars.

Mark:

It's going to be fucking awesome, right?

Mark:

That would be badass.

Mark:

But I just hope it's not a...

Mark:

Here's five of those, like, it's a wonderful life.

Mark:

Here's what could be, but I'll always...

Mark:

This is a fixed point, let's use Doctor Who vernacular.

Mark:

You know, it's a fixed point.

Mark:

It can't be changed.

Mark:

It will always come to pass that I'm the chosen one and this is how

Mark:

I fix things and balance everything.

Mark:

It's not your fault, Sokka.

Mark:

But I've shown you ten timelines that make for good viewing and amazing cinema.

Mark:

I just hope it's not that.

Mark:

I hope it's not as...

Mark:

Actually, I was gonna say I hope it's not as cheap as that, but if it is

Mark:

that, I hope it's done, and we've got, and it has to be that, then I hope it's

Mark:

done that well, that it doesn't, it doesn't cheapen it, you know, it's not

Mark:

just, here's, here's spectacle with no consequence, you know, I don't want that.

Mark:

Yeah,

Garry:

no, I agree.

Garry:

I think that would do a bit of a disservice to the long term storyline

Garry:

as well, because otherwise it would just be viewed as a, like you said,

Garry:

however badass it will be, it will be an isolated little bit of badass.

Garry:

Doesn't really do anything for the end game, you know, post that.

Garry:

So do you think Soca's dead?

Garry:

No.

Garry:

No, I don't think so.

Garry:

I don't think so.

Garry:

I think she will.

Garry:

She will die.

Garry:

I think, you know, don't need to be negative Ninny, but I think she will.

Garry:

She will die, but just not

Mark:

at this bit.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Do you think she'll come back as something else?

Mark:

You know, 'cause do you think she got pulled out before

Garry:

death?

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

If we're gonna play on the whole gal thing again, he comes back as the white.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Wizard after dying as the Grey Wizard, isn't he?

Garry:

Comes back as same dude, but just a different sort of thing about.

Garry:

So yeah, probably that would be my

Mark:

guess.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Yeah, I agree.

Garry:

Yeah.

Garry:

Has your score changed before we wrap up?

Garry:

Is it, is it still, after talking through it, it's still

Garry:

eight, eight and a half or nine?

Garry:

Yeah,

Mark:

I think it's got to be a nine for me.

Mark:

And it's, this is, I mean, it's only in small part to do with the World

Mark:

Between Worlds, lore, Anakin stuff.

Mark:

For me, it was just a very...

Mark:

Good bit of Star Wars.

Mark:

A very good bit of Star I honestly think that all the people moaning about the

Mark:

pacing of it will do the same thing that I've sort of done with Obi Wan

Mark:

and Andor when it's all done and look at it as one unit of work and think,

Mark:

actually, that was pretty well done.

Mark:

You know, and it's it, like I said before, if you put it against things like the

Mark:

Patterson Cut, which remove all emotion, all humanity, everything from Obi Wan, You

Mark:

end up with something that's like a fan fiction film, and I just think when you,

Mark:

you look at Rogue One, you look at some of the movies that it's got to compete

Mark:

with, and the audience is more critical these days as well, let's be completely

Mark:

honest, the audience is way more critical these days, because everyone's got social

Mark:

media and everyone knows what, thinks they know what they're talking about.

Mark:

I, I just, I feel that it will pan out in such a way that, It's it will

Mark:

realize that it's very well done.

Mark:

So yes, still a nine for me.

Mark:

Question for you.

Mark:

I'm sure your score has not changed.

Mark:

So I'm I'm going to ask you, do you think we'll see Zeb?

Garry:

I think we will.

Garry:

And this, this is very non Filoni for me, but I think we will just

Garry:

because I've blown some money on building a 3D model already.

Garry:

So I want to get some money's worth out of Lucas.

Garry:

Not Lucasfilm ILM, but I don't think we'll see him for like any big kind of story.

Garry:

He's not going to progress the story forward.

Garry:

He's just going to be there as backup.

Garry:

Yeah, I agree.

Garry:

You know what I mean,

Mark:

yeah.

Mark:

I think it'll end up, I think we'll end up with, with the rebels again.

Mark:

I think we'll just end up with the rebels crew again.

Mark:

Going and sorting the soaker out.

Mark:

You know, I can see Because we said, didn't we?

Mark:

We said that, Oh, it'll probably end up where the ship's knackered.

Mark:

And Hu Yang blew the ship.

Mark:

to alert Sabine and Ahsoka.

Mark:

So does the ghost just come and get him and they leave the Ahsoka ship there?

Mark:

And then suddenly, you know, you've got your rebels back together.

Mark:

So yeah.

Mark:

Dunno.

Mark:

We'll see.

Garry:

We'll see.

Garry:

Indeedy.

Garry:

So, our scores, unanimously, a nine, which I think is well deserved.

Garry:

It was a great episode.

Garry:

A little heads up, we won't be around this week.

Garry:

Mark and I are both on vacay this week, so I don't think we're

Garry:

gonna get around to recording.

Garry:

Our review for part five this week.

Garry:

So we will do that either next week as if we get time, we'll

Garry:

do a standalone one for that.

Garry:

Cause I think there's going to be so much in it.

Garry:

We'll need to talk through, or if not, we'll do a condensed

Garry:

one for parts five and six.

Garry:

So just stay tuned for what we're going to do for review for next week.

Garry:

But for now let's stick a pin in it for episode three.

Garry:

Thank you very much for listening to another episode

Garry:

of the Ahsoka review podcast.

Garry:

A really cool episode to to chat through on this one.

Garry:

Some very cool stuff.

Garry:

Let us know what you think.

Garry:

You can hit us up over on our spark of rebellion, social media, which

Garry:

is over on Twitter and Instagram.

Garry:

So just head over to spark of rebellion.

Garry:

com forward slash Twitter.

Garry:

You can send us a message or do a public reply there.

Garry:

We talk about star Wars each week throughout the week anyway.

Garry:

So Come and get involved over there.

Garry:

Make sure you're following and subscribing to this podcast so you won't miss

Garry:

our thoughts and reviews as we go through the rest of the Ahsoka series.

Garry:

And if you want to be kept up to date with all the Star Wars news and

Garry:

everything that's going on, listen to our sister show, part of nerdpodcast.

Garry:

com, which is Spark of Rebellion.

Garry:

And you can do that by doing a search in your preferred podcast app

Garry:

or head over to sparkofrebellion.

Garry:

com.

Garry:

Until next time, dude, it's been cool chatting through all the Ahsoka stuff.

Mark:

Always good, man.

Mark:

Yeah.

Mark:

Plenty to talk about anytime Fallone is involved.

Mark:

So excited to see what happens next week.

Mark:

And yeah, I'll see you on the next one.

Garry:

Silly city indeed.

Garry:

Until then, take care of yourself and may the force be with you always.

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