Unlocking Value in the Federal Market: A Conversation with Deep Water Point & Associates | The Pair Program Ep52

In this episode, we dive into the complex world of federal market consulting with Greg Buckis and Meghan DiAndrea, leaders at Deep Water Point & Associates. Deep Water is known for blending government and industry expertise, offering clients tailored guidance to navigate the intricacies of the federal space. Greg and Meghan share insights into their unique business model and the values that drive their work. Whether it's helping clients write winning proposals or guiding them through acquisitions, Deep Water is all about empowering growth and delivering results.

They discuss:

• Deep Water’s innovative business model and their talent-first approach.
• How Deep Water leverages a consultant-heavy model to drive growth.
• The types of projects they undertake, from government-wide contracts to transaction advisory.
• The qualities they look for in consultants and the unique backgrounds they attract.
• Industry trends and emerging opportunities in the government sector.

Tune in for an engaging conversation on how Deep Water Point & Associates is shaping the future of federal consulting!

About Meghan DiAndrea: Consultant with more than a decade of government contracting experience specializing in corporate operations. She is a proven leader focused on driving enterprise organizational performance and translating business strategy into powerful people strategy. Since joining Deep Water Point and Associates she has advised on and led client engagements across the federal business lifecycle with primary focus on pre- and post-merger integration.

About Greg Buckis: Greg is the CFO at Deep Water Point & Associates and has held senior financial roles in various GOV CON businesses to include public company corporat controllers and private company CFO. He also was at Nasdaq helping them go public. Much of his career has involved change management, business transformation and Mergers and Acquisitions.

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Welcome to The Pair Program from hatchpad, the podcast that gives you

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a front row seat to candid conversations

with tech leaders from the startup world.

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I'm your host, Tim Winkler,

the creator of hatchpad.

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And I'm your other host, Mike Gruen.

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Join us each episode as we bring

together two guests to dissect topics

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at the intersection of technology,

startups, and career growth.

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Hey everyone.

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Welcome back to The Pair Program.

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Uh, Tim Winkler here with Mike Gruen.

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Um, so Mike, I was, uh, listening to

my, my business podcast this morning.

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I'll shout out Morning Brew, um,

love to kind of have them kick

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me off with, with my 30 minutes

of what's going on in the world.

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Uh, they, they highlighted that

there is a battle for toy supremacy

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that's happening as we speak.

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Uh, this week, the National

Toy Hall of Fame, and that is

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a, uh, a real organization.

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In fact, check that.

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They just released their 12

finalists being considered for

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entry into their sacred hall.

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Uh, and so some of the nominations

for this year were Hess toy

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trucks, Pokemon trading cards,

transformers, and like the trampoline.

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Um, and so in the spirit of, you

know, always liking to play like the

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greatest of all time, uh, toy with you,

what would you say is your goat toy?

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Mike Gruen: Not my actual answer, but the

first thing that jumped to mind was jarts,

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but the most, the most dangerous toy.

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Tim Winkler: I don't think

they make those anymore.

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Mike Gruen: They stopped making the,

yeah, the, the liability on that was huge.

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Yeah.

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They stopped with jarts a long time ago.

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Uh, what was my.

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I mean, like growing up as a little

kid, I played with GI Joe's a lot.

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I had a lot of GI Joe's.

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Um, it's going to be

GI Joe or Lego for me.

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I mean, that's, those are

the two that I probably spent

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the most time with as a kid.

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So yeah, pretty, pretty bland

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Tim Winkler: survey says no, for sure.

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Like, uh, GI Joe's I was super hooked

on GI Joe's, um, Legos as well.

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Uh, I went through, um, this was

really challenging for me, but I tried

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to narrow it down to the top three.

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And they would have been like

sports cards, like trading cards,

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um, Nerf guns and the Game Boy.

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And then if I had to land on just one,

I'm probably going to go with sports cards

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just because I still enjoy those today.

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Like kind of stood, stood

the test of time for me.

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So I'm, I'm sticking to, to that answer.

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I'm curious on you all, Megan,

any, any, uh, goat toy that was

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near and dear to you as a kid?

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Meghan DiAndrea: You know, it's

funny when you said Hastrox, I just

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like, It just brought back memories.

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Like every person would always just.

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It was never anything that I necessarily

played with, but it was always there.

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It was always present

in our, in our lives.

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And so that just stuck out for me.

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I feel like that's the one.

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Tim Winkler: Yeah, it was a Christmas gift

for me as a, an old school Hess toy truck.

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And I was like, man, those,

they don't make those anymore.

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Meghan DiAndrea: And my parents

probably have, you know, like

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hundreds of them in there.

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Tim Winkler: Just collecting dust.

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Greg, what about you?

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Goat

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Greg Buckis: toy?

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I really like the Hot Wheels.

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We tried to connect those orange

little plastic roadways and loop them,

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loop them so the car stayed on there.

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But it was a lot of fun.

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And you loop them around the whole room.

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So it's just fun to see it, you know, go.

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Tim Winkler: Yep.

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Greg Buckis: Love it.

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Tim Winkler: Yep.

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They used to have the ones where

you could dip them in water.

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They'd change colors.

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Real, real, real advanced at that point.

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Um, cool.

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All right.

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Uh, let's, let's, let's transition

to, uh, to the actual pod here.

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So we're going to fill the listeners in

on, on what we're chatting about today.

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Uh, we're going to be exploring a few

topics that I believe are top of mind

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for both job seekers and for startup

founders and this kind of unique, uh,

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economic market that we're in in 2024.

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Uh, those two topics are consulting

career opportunities for job seekers.

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And then mergers and

acquisitions for founders.

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And so I'm going to clarify

a little bit on this.

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So as most of you, uh, listeners are

aware, uh, you know, I run a recruiting

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business, uh, hatch it, you know, we focus

on connecting technologists with jobs

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that are at startups and small businesses.

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Uh, we've been doing this for over

12 years now, and we've seen a lot of

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patterns and trends fluctuate in the

startup job market, many of which, you

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know, will kind of mirror the macro

economic trends that are happening.

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Um, Um, but in 2024 specifically,

what we've observed on the job seeker

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side is this trend of more and more

candidates kind of looking for job

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opportunities that are flexible in

nature, uh, for example, like fractional

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consulting, uh, it's like a 10 99 or

flex hours or remote work, et cetera.

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Um, and, and these opportunities

versus maybe your traditional, you

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know, full time w two permanent

employee with the company, right.

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Uh, and on the startup side, we've seen,

you know, venture capital investment

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sadly kind of hit its lowest level of

activity and nearly five years in the U.

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S.

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And that's kind of created this

ripple effect for, you know, startup

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founders, especially those in early

stages who may now be facing like a

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shortened financial runway, uh, maybe

reconsidering their strategic options

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earlier than anticipated due to this

decreased availability of capital.

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And so now those options might be

pivoting to a merger or acquisition

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or some form of strategic partnership.

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Um, so I kind of wanted to just set

the table here, uh, on, on those two

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kind of topics, and then, uh, I'm

excited to introduce our, our two

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guests that are joining us that are

going to shed light on these topics.

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You know, both of our guests work

for a company that specializes in

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consulting, advisory and growth services.

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Um, a lot of which is

in the federal space.

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Uh, and that company is

Deepwater Point and Associates.

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Um, and our first guest is Megan

DeAndrea, uh, the vice president

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of people operations at Deepwater.

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And we have Greg Buckus, the chief

financial officer at Deepwater.

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So Megan and Greg, thank you both for

joining us today on The Pair Program.

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Meghan DiAndrea: Glad to be here.

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Thanks for having us.

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Tim Winkler: Awesome.

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All right.

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Now, before we dive in, uh,

we, we like to kick things off

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with our pair me up segment.

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Uh, here's where we all

kind of go around the room.

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We'll spit ball a complimentary

pairing of our choice.

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Mike, you lead us off.

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What's, uh, what's your pairing for today?

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Mike Gruen: So going way back to my

childhood, um, growing up, uh, we used to

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have this for dinner all the time and in

retrospect, I, what my mom was thinking.

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Uh, jelly, uh, blintzes with

chocolate powder sprinkled on top.

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It was, so the chocolate

powder and the jelly.

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Uh, blintzes were phenomenal.

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It's like a dessert.

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Like there are a couple meals that

like looking back, it's like, yeah, I

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guess my mom was just sort of, she, she

admits that she was like, yeah, this

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is just makes kids happy and whatever.

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But uh, it was basically dessert.

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Uh, apricot jelly was my, was my jam.

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Oh, pardon the pun.

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Uh, and, and, uh, and grape jelly.

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Those were the two.

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Uh, and then chocolate powder.

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So that, that's it.

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That was the meal that

was, that was dinner

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Tim Winkler: sweet.

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It kind of reminds me of

like breakfast for dinner.

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Like, yeah, yeah.

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But this is, this is just for dinner.

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Has this, uh, tradition carried

on and in your household at all?

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You know, I would accept,

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Mike Gruen: um, I, you know,

um, I definitely do it.

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We did something similar.

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Also, uh, cream of wheat

with chocolate powder on top.

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I think I've used that

in a pairing before.

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Um, and so that my kids have

definitely experienced that, but

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the blintzes, I, um, I never learned

how to make the blintzes, uh, and my

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mom had like a little crepe maker.

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It was pretty cool.

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Um, as soon as she took it out,

I was like, Oh, this is awesome.

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I know it's for dinner.

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Like if I'm

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Tim Winkler: having

seconds, mom, that's great.

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Yeah.

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Um, cool.

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All right.

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Good stuff.

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Uh, I will jump in.

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So I'm going to go with.

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Increased screen time and

fantasy football season.

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Um, pretty obvious one here, but it's

that kind of time of year where, you

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know, football season's upon us and.

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I always get pulled into, you

know, it seems like a new, another,

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you know, league each year.

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So right now I'm managing teams

in three different leagues.

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Some of these have pretty

large buy ins tied to them.

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So, you know, for that reason, I find

myself spending a ridiculous amount

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of time on my, on my phone, you know,

primarily on like a Tuesday night, right?

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It's like waiver wire night.

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Uh, just kind of checking on injury

updates and who's coming on, who's

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going to come on the waiver wire.

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Um, I get, I get a little bit too deep

into it and I think my wife, it's a

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little bit, a little bit annoyed with

me, but it's just, you know, it's for

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these, you know, a few, few months

between the fall and the winter.

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Um, not entirely proud of that, but

I'd say it's probably a better use

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of my time than sitting there and

scanning, uh, Instagram all night.

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So I'm going with, uh, increased screen

time and fantasy football season.

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And that's, uh, that's,

that's a wrap for me.

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Let's pass it over to our guest, Megan.

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How about yourself?

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Quick intro and your pairing.

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah.

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Thanks for having me.

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Um, so I, um, Megan DeAndre, I.

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have been in GovCon almost 15 years

now, focused primarily in the human

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resources and recruiting space, corporate

operations, mostly for small, small,

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mid sized growing organizations.

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So I joined DeepWaterPoint

about two years ago.

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So pre purchase Legacy WilkGen,

um, and joined the post

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margin integration practice.

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So now I'm able to lean in

and provide that support to

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organizations who are You know,

experiencing growth post acquisition.

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Tim Winkler: Awesome.

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Meghan DiAndrea: And my pairing

going, it's, it's, I'm, I'm

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hoping for chilly weather.

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And so I leaned into, we're going to have

a fire in the fireplace and some bourbon

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and just relax after the kids go to bed.

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Tim Winkler: So great pairing.

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Uh, that's fantastic.

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Pairing.

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Meghan DiAndrea: I'm just waiting.

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I'm waiting for the humidity to pass

and then I'm ready, ready for a real

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Tim Winkler: fireplace

or is it a gas fireplace?

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Meghan DiAndrea: Oh, it's a gas fireplace.

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Unfortunately.

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Tim Winkler: You still get the, you still

get the feels of being by the fireplace.

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I'll give you 75%.

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Deduct one point, but

it's still a good answer.

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It's a great

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Mike Gruen: answer.

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This time of year, I'm usually,

uh, I love this time of year

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because I do a lot with firewood.

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I, with, uh, cutting it and splitting it.

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It's like one of the things I grew

up in a more rural area and it's

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just one of the things I enjoy doing.

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Uh, so anyway.

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah.

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We love it.

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We've got outdoor fire pit, but you know.

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Cool.

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Tim Winkler: Yeah, that's my

biggest pet peeve with my current

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home is we don't have a fireplace.

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We've got like one of those pellet stoves,

which I kind of, kind of scratched that

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itch, but something to be said about

having a nice fireplace, you know, the

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mantle right there and sit there and

kind of gather around, uh, winter night.

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Yeah.

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That's, uh, that's, that's, that's great.

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Uh, love the pairing and

thanks again for joining us.

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Uh, Greg, uh, pass it to you.

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Quick introduction and, uh, your parent.

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Greg Buckis: Sure, sure.

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I'm CFO here at Deepwater

Point and Associates.

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My background has really been a lot of

GovCon, so 25 plus years of GovCon, and

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then intermixed with that, um, their

bulb and technology related companies.

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Uh, but, uh, tech public companies.

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So helping taking them public has been

some of what I've done over my history.

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And I'm here really to help with the

growth of the company, um, since we've

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had a large acquisition and we're on the

path for more, so they want some internal

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structure and we're working on that.

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Um, my pairing is going to be pretty

basic, but, um, I have a favorite place.

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I'm trying not to plug it, but I'm going

to plug it in at Little Washington out

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there in a little Washington, Virginia.

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They have a really good pairing of food.

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They have an eight course meal and

each one has a different wine with it.

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So I must say that's probably the

best experience I've ever had anyway.

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So that's pretty standard, right?

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Tim Winkler: I've heard great things.

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I've never been, it's, it's on,

uh, it's on the kind of, You know,

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bucket list for my wife and I to

get out where we're big foodies.

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And, uh, what's it, what's the,

you know, do you have to make a

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reservation like months in advance?

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Is that kind of the situation?

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Greg Buckis: Yes.

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Yes.

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Months in advance, but it's well worth it.

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It's a lot of

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Tim Winkler: fun.

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Amazing reviews about the food.

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The chef is fantastic.

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And you know, why wine and food also

just to kind of traditional parents.

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So awesome.

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All right.

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Well, uh, thanks, uh,

for the, for the intros.

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Thanks again for joining us

and, uh, let's jump into the,

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the heart of the discussion.

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So, um, I gave a little bit more

context earlier to, you know, kind

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of highlight some of the topics that

we're going to hit on the conversation.

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Uh, we're going to creatively kind

of cover these topics organically by

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having our guests expand a little bit

more on Deepwater's kind of business

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model, uh, going a little bit deeper

into how they, uh, employ talent.

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Um, and then also we're, we're going

to go deeper into the transaction

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advisory services and, you know, some

of the impacts that these types of

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mergers might have on a company from

financial to cultural, uh, and so forth.

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So, uh, Megan, let's,

let's start with you first.

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Uh, can you just give us a little bit

more of the elevator pitch on, The type

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of work that Deepwater is delivering.

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Um, and then I'd like to expand a little

bit more on this kind of consultant

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heavy model that you all deploy.

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, absolutely.

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So, um, we're a growth focused strategic

management consulting firm, right?

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So we, um, help our clients.

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Grow both organically and

inorganically by coming in and really

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focusing on the value creation.

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So.

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Uh, for us, it's about getting in

deep with the client, understanding

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what they do and what their

potential growth factors are.

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And then how do we

support them through that?

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And that could be in a myriad of ways.

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It could be.

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Um, some fractional BD support, it

could be helping them capture their next

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big win, um, it could be in, you know,

helping them submit and write a, you

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know, a proposal for, um, their next big,

uh, GWAC or, um, you know, government

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wide contracting vehicle, right?

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But how do we get, how do

we help them open the doors?

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How do we help them get to the

next phase of their growth?

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And we can, we do that both

organically and inorganically.

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So, um, Transaction advisory

services is obviously the inorganic

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piece of our business where we, you

know, do everything from helping

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them source potential acquisition

targets to providing due diligence.

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And my favorite is post merger integration

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Tim Winkler: and vertical wise, right?

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So we obviously talked a little about

federal, um, you know, government,

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um, What, what are the other

industries that maybe, um, that are

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outside of that traditional kind

of wheelhouse that you work with?

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Meghan DiAndrea: I would

say that we're primarily in

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government contracting services.

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We do have some commercial clients who

are looking to break in or maybe have

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small business units that focus on golf

con, but they want to figure out, okay,

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how do we expand within this industry?

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How do we make more of an impact?

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How do we maybe bring a software tool

or a piece of technology to the space?

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So.

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Um, but, you know, GovCon is the

heart and soul of what we do.

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Um, we, you know, source both candidates

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I mean, that's really, um,

that's our bread and butter.

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Tim Winkler: And is it primarily

services companies or do you

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work with any product companies?

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, we do.

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We work with product

companies all the time.

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Um, as I mentioned, right there, there

could be a commercial product that they

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want to take to the government space.

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And how do they do that?

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How do they break in?

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How do they overcome compliance concerns?

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So, um, you know, we certainly

support, um, really anybody

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that would want to venture into

the government services space.

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We can, we can help them.

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Greg Buckis: Oh, yeah.

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We, we, I think we've founded or started

at least the deep water business on

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consultants who have an entree into

an agency, whether it's the defense

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side or federal government side.

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So we have folks who know who's

running those agencies and what type

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of work would be needed for them.

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And then if it fits with the client,

then they introduce to others

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and it helps them expand in their

market and grow their business.

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Tim Winkler: Yeah.

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And that's the fascinating

piece about this business model.

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It's actually what.

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led me down the path of, of reaching

out to both of you, um, was, you know,

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we, we, we kind of play in some similar

spaces, just kind of given our, our

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roots here in the DC area, uh, from a

talent perspective, you know, we're,

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we're usually interacting with, you

know, more, more technical candidates,

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but you know, that can also lead down

to more strategic level of talking BD,

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uh, types of roles at a high level.

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Um, and some of these individuals,

you know, that we talked to, um, they

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kind of, they're like, Hey, you know,

we're, uh, I'm, I'm trying to do more of

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like a consulting type of career path.

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And, you know, I'm, I'm talking to,

um, uh, deep water point associates.

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And so then I started to go down

the path of like, you know, just a

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little more research into, into your

all's, you know, company portfolio

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and, and the, the, the structure

of, of, you know, your employees.

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And I was really fascinated because

I don't see this too, too often.

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Again, I'm going to go off of like the,

the intro that, you know, we're seeing a

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lot more of this kind of, you know, push

towards consulting and usually more senior

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level individuals that, you know, have

maybe, you know, worked a number of years

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in the corporate setting and now want

to, you know, kind of either, you know,

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work a part time gig or, you know, try

to start their own thing, but they still

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need a way to kind of, you know, have some

revenue kind of coming through the door.

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So let's, let's.

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Dig deeper on, on this, um, talk to me

a little bit about, you know, one, you

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know, the types of individuals that are

kind of, you know, a good fit for this

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consulting, uh, you know, labor workforce

that you all deploy and then, um, you

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know, what are some of the skill sets that

are, you know, you find consistent, uh,

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if it's hard skills or soft skills, you

know, what, what are, what are some of the

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molds of profiles of these individuals?

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, so I

think our business model gives

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us the ability to be flexible.

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And to your point earlier, that's

something that's really seems to be

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really important in Um, in the talent

space right now, uh, you know, we've

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got experts who come out of who may

have helped organizations grow or

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been part of critical transactions

that want to continue to do that.

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Right?

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Um, there could be individuals who

come out of any of the branches,

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the military, any, uh, uh, service

within, um, the government, any

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agency within the government.

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So they are more mission focused, right?

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They want to continue to focus on

the missions that are important to

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them, the missions of their clients.

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So how do we match that together?

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Well, we've got a business

model that allows us to do that.

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They can come in, they can still live

post retirement life maybe, right?

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They've given their service to

the military or to the government

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and they want to continue to

support those missions, but they

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don't want to do it full time.

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Well, we have the ability to tap into

them, tap into, um, their subject matter

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expertise, whether it be around, um,

you know, critical, uh, new technologies

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that are coming into the space, whether

it be access, maybe clients need access

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to be able to figure out and understand

what it is that the next big thing is

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that this, this agency is looking for.

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So we can be flexible and agile.

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And I think that's what brings.

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the talent to us is they

want that flexibility and

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the agility that comes with

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a career at this point.

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And, and I say this point,

I mean, in the world, right?

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Like where we are as a society, where

flexibility is important and the

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ability to focus on things that you're

passionate about within your career.

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And so I think that the evolution

of that over the last couple of

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years has led to a business model

like ours being, being successful.

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Mike Gruen: Yeah, curious if you're

seeing, because one of the things I have

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a lot of friends that are in government

and they're, um, I'm older, uh, and

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so they're older, uh, and they're

getting towards that retirement age

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and the number of them are basically

retiring from government service and

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that flexibility, like, I know what's

driving them is the idea of becoming like

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digital nomads or just moving abroad.

415

Are, are you seeing that same

sort of trend of, yeah, it's, it's

416

That flexibility, it's not just

about contracting or whatever.

417

It's really about where

I live and when I work.

418

Meghan DiAndrea: Oh yeah.

419

A hundred percent.

420

I think that's probably more of a

driver, Mike, than any of the other.

421

It, how can I live my lifestyle

the way that I want to live it?

422

I'm still be able

423

Tim Winkler: or

424

Meghan DiAndrea: from the

beaches of Greece, right?

425

Like I want to be there.

426

I've got a home that I can be.

427

You know, for the next four months I

can go live there because I hate the,

428

the, the weather here in the DMV.

429

Okay, great.

430

Go do that.

431

What are the, what, what is it

that you want to do in that time?

432

Well, you know, if this project comes

up, maybe I'll provide support here.

433

Just let me know, right.

434

When you've got a client or

when there's an opportunity

435

that I can really contribute in.

436

And I think it becomes more

of a passion project, right?

437

It's those things.

438

It's the, the, the initiatives

that are important to them.

439

They want to continue to lean in on.

440

But ultimately their lifestyle is probably

the most important thing at this point.

441

Tim Winkler: So you guys kind of have

this ongoing talent marketplace of

442

how many individuals would you say?

443

So maybe, maybe for some context, how, how

big is, is Deepwater Point and associates

444

from a headcount perspective and breaking

that between, you know, maybe full time

445

internal folks versus the consulting team.

446

Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah.

447

So we've got less than a

hundred full time consultants.

448

that sit in house that support

our client engagements.

449

And we've got, we've got between

400 and 500 independent consultants.

450

And so those are the folks that we

can pull on, um, who bring subject

451

matter expertise, either, you know,

um, as an agency SME, as a former

452

military SME, or maybe it's a

technology SME that comes to the table.

453

So, um, we've got, you

know, a lot of reach back.

454

Tim Winkler: And you kind of have them.

455

You just kind of, uh, allocated in

a, in maybe a system that whenever a

456

client comes in and, you know, says,

Hey, we need some, yeah, we really

457

want to work with HHS, you know,

you've got the short list of folks that

458

have HHS in that background and you

kind of do your matchmaking that way.

459

Meghan DiAndrea: Absolutely.

460

We sit down and figure out how, how do we

deliver the best value to the client at

461

the end of the day is the ultimate goal.

462

And so.

463

When we resource allocate against that

value creation, we sit down and say,

464

okay, what combination of individuals

will get the most value for our client?

465

And to your point, exactly.

466

If we know that we need somebody

who's, you know, um, in been in HHS

467

for the last 15 years, well, great.

468

We'll find you that person.

469

Tim Winkler: So I'm, I'm always curious

in terms of, um, you know, it sounds

470

like these are folks that usually also

have, you know, good personal skills

471

or soft skills, you might call them.

472

Um, How are you all, um, kind of

vetting these individuals to, to feel

473

confident that they're going to go out

and represent, you know, the, the deep

474

water point brand, uh, even though

it's a 10 99 kind of engagement, uh,

475

what, what are some of the things that

you're kind of looking for when you're

476

sussing out some of like those, those

soft skills with these individuals?

477

Meghan DiAndrea: So everybody comes

in through our existing network.

478

Which makes it easy, right?

479

So if we're out at a networking event

and we're having conversation, we're

480

pretty, pretty quickly able to assess

whether or not that person has the

481

soft skills that we need, right?

482

Are they engaging?

483

Are they able to communicate effectively?

484

Um, not everybody is born a consultant.

485

And, you know, if you've been in the

same industry or doing the same thing

486

for the last, 15, 20, 25 years, maybe

consulting is not what you naturally

487

think of as your next go to, but

we bring them into the fold, right?

488

If you've got those soft skills, if you

have, um, the market entry that's needed,

489

if you bring the technology aspect,

those qualifications that we need to the

490

table, we're then able to surround those

individuals with The true consultants

491

who then can deliver to the client.

492

So we're agile from that

perspective as well.

493

Right?

494

How do we tap into these individuals?

495

Um, how do we give them the right

visibility without necessarily putting

496

them, you know, out in front of a client

that may not be what they want to do.

497

That may not be what they're best at.

498

So.

499

Um, because we have such a large

resource pool, we're able to kind of

500

lean in and, and, and get to know these

individuals and make sure that, you

501

know, they're truly able to deliver

what they want and how they want it.

502

I

503

Mike Gruen: think one of the

other things that's interesting is

504

Greg Buckis: The other thing is

the 4 star general, um, doesn't

505

have to be vetted too much.

506

You don't arrive at that position by

just being, um, a regular street person.

507

Mike Gruen: Yeah, that's right.

508

That's true.

509

One of the things, so as I, I not

that long ago explored the fractional

510

route and consulting and contracting.

511

And one of the things from my perspective

that was like a daunting challenge was

512

the like, the always hustle nature of it.

513

Like.

514

I don't want like my, my mom had her

own company very similar to Tim's

515

was a staffing agency, you know,

recruiting and 50 percent of her

516

job was just finding the next job.

517

And so rather than doing the actual work

that she really enjoyed, and for me,

518

like, that's daunting, like that would be.

519

And so I imagine that you guys

are very attractive from that

520

perspective, because there's a lot

of people that are skilled, capable.

521

But like that sales and marketing

aspect, just, they don't even want to be

522

bothered with, just tell me where to go.

523

These are the types of

projects I worked on.

524

I imagine you're seeing a lot of that.

525

Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, absolutely.

526

Tim Winkler: Yeah.

527

I think that's, what's really fascinating

and unique about this is like you're,

528

you're offering these individuals kind

of a consistent pipeline of leads.

529

It's like, uh, you know, you, you,

you consult with us and we'll, we'll,

530

we'll bring, we'll bring in the work.

531

Uh, you, you all help us deliver.

532

Um, so it's a really nice.

533

Yeah.

534

You know, mutually beneficial, uh,

partnership and, um, you know, I,

535

I, uh, I'll ask one last question

on this and then we can transition

536

a little bit more into like the,

the transaction advisory stuff.

537

But, um, you kind of touched on

this briefly, Megan, but, you know,

538

it's, it's, it's, it's, uh, a very

sporadic kind of level of engagement.

539

It seems like that's.

540

Different for every individual.

541

D is there a minimum threshold that

you, you, you try to request from them?

542

You know, if it's an hourly

threshold per month or what have you.

543

That, you know, you, you like

ideal and ideally individuals are,

544

are committed to, or, you know, I

guess, what are, what are their,

545

what commitments are there in place?

546

If any,

547

Meghan DiAndrea: I would say

there isn't really a threshold

548

commitment, Greg, correct.

549

Feel free to jump in and

correct me if I'm wrong.

550

I, we really try to meet

individuals where they are.

551

So some say, you know what, I really

want to do 20 hours a week or, um, More

552

of a part time consistent basis and

some individuals are like, Hey, listen,

553

you know, I really want to help you

on this specific engagement right now.

554

And that's going to be all of my energy.

555

And then, you know, to Mike's point

earlier, like, I'm going to go

556

disappear for the next 6 months and

go live my best life somewhere else.

557

Right.

558

And I will let you know

when I'm back and available.

559

So, um, it, so it really depends.

560

Greg Buckis: Some of the clients say I'd

like to, to get the knowledge and entree

561

with somebody in the business development

area for a couple of days a month.

562

Tim Winkler: So

563

Greg Buckis: the, the retired, uh,

Admiral can actually do the traveling

564

and family stuff they want to do

on, on the off time, their own time.

565

And then they can schedule those

three days a month with the client.

566

And they've got, you know, time on

their hands plus income coming in.

567

Plus they're able to share their

knowledge and still stay, stay

568

engaged in the marketplace.

569

Tim Winkler: Yeah, it's kind of

like a flexible advisory, you

570

know, board, board member that,

you know, come, comes and goes, uh,

571

you know, as the client needs them.

572

So, yeah, it's a really creative space.

573

Um, I'm, uh, excited to, to

hear that that's out there.

574

I think that that's going to be a, uh,

an area that continues to, to grow,

575

um, as you have, you know, some of

the, you know, folks transitioning, you

576

know, that are in the middle of either

military or government or even industry.

577

I think that you can really kind

of tap all, all different areas.

578

So.

579

Kudos on, on a creative outlet for them.

580

Um, all right, let's, let's

kind of, uh, you know, make a

581

little bit of a pivot here to the

second part of this conversation.

582

And Greg, I'll start with you on this.

583

Um, I'd love to take this conversation

down that path of the transaction

584

advisory services route, so.

585

First off, can you expand a little

bit more on, on what these services

586

consist of and, you know, maybe provide

a few examples or use cases as to

587

why and when this service would be

appealing to a customer or client?

588

Greg Buckis: Sure, sure.

589

So I have a business and it's 10 million

and it doesn't have a lot of capacity

590

for inorganic growth, uh, on its own.

591

It has a lot of capacity for

organic, but it's very slow.

592

So 3 percent a year, they, they can't

expand within their own compliment.

593

So they need different resources

or different avenues and, or they

594

need a larger, broader client

set that they can reach into.

595

So they're looking for that great company

that kind of merges with them and is

596

a compliment to their current service.

597

And it might be exciting to help

grow the company inorganically.

598

So our team goes out and looks for

the best kind of complement to their

599

business and targets those companies

and then they make a decision as to

600

which ones they're interested in.

601

Um, we would do the research for them.

602

We would help them with intel around those

markets and the companies themselves.

603

And they make a decision as

to they want to go out make

604

an offer to buy that company.

605

Obviously, there's a lot of

back and forth, et cetera.

606

Um, they make the decision

to buy the company.

607

Then, um, they ask us to help with

the diligence effort on the company

608

they want to acquire so that we're

looking at their books and records.

609

We're looking at the last

three months of sales.

610

We're looking at the last

three months of profits.

611

We're looking at their balance sheet,

their management team, all of the

612

HR and benefit issues around their

team, what kind of bonus programs

613

they have, retention of employees.

614

To see if it's a good compliment,

something worthy of buying and

615

what kind of growth have they

seen over the last few years.

616

So, um, if that Intel, the diligence

proves positive, and there's no gnarly

617

issues, if you will, out there, or there's

a few that can be corrected, whether

618

they're employment agreements or, um,

you know, they've had some tax issues

619

in the past or what have you, there's

ways to wall those off contractually.

620

Um, then, uh, that diligence

for them is a positive thing.

621

And they, you know, they like

the benefit of the service.

622

And then once the company's

acquired, the 3rd leg of this

623

is an actual integration plan.

624

So there's a lot around that.

625

Megan's team knows heavily that it's

critical to ensure the culture is

626

merged and that they can blend well,

and the communications are done right.

627

Um, but reviewing who has the

optimal benefits, who has the.

628

Um, whether it's a 401 match or it's

your medical coverage or other coverages

629

and life insurances and things.

630

Um, you want to try to make

it whole for the employee.

631

So there's not a huge, no negative impact.

632

It's almost favorable by merging the two.

633

And that's the kind of the

best way to be able to do that.

634

But overall, from a financial perspective,

obviously two companies blended together.

635

You, you might almost want one

plus one to be more than a two.

636

Uh, with the growth in the clients

and or the products and then sharing

637

clients amongst each other, um,

you could get 20, 30% growth on the

638

merged revenue of the two companies.

639

And likewise with the back office, a lot

of times human resources, it compliance,

640

um, finance, accounting, um, the,

basically you don't need two teams of

641

people to handle that kind of volume.

642

Usually if you're talking smaller

business, you know, 50 to 150

643

employees, you merged the two.

644

There were, there's probably some

capacity amongst the, uh, two groups

645

synergized, so you probably could offload.

646

Duplicative services like

two CFOs aren't necessary.

647

Two human resources directors

or VPs aren't necessary.

648

Controllers, that type of thing.

649

So that your EBIT is if you earnings

before interest taxes depreciation and

650

amortization That's your target number

of what your bottom line cash is.

651

The merger of those two should be

also almost, um, 30 percent higher,

652

um, depending on the synergies you

can find between the companies.

653

Um, there's there's lots of other

metrics to look at, like, for

654

instance, a working capital targets.

655

If that's part of your contract,

you want to make sure that the

656

last 12 months of working capital.

657

If you have a negotiated

amount, that's a target.

658

Um, it is deliverable and you

don't pay more or less than

659

you should for that company.

660

Um, as well as the equity structure,

you want to make sure that if you've

661

taken on a bunch of debt, um, that

your covenants can be covered with the

662

long term forecasts of the company.

663

So, whatever you lock

yourselves into with the bank.

664

We definitely want to make sure that

you can deliver that with whether it's a

665

debt to equity ratio or a current ratio,

the current assets, current liabilities.

666

Um, they need to all fit

in with that acquisition.

667

Um, turnover, obviously, because of the

culture, you want to make sure that, um,

668

folks are happy, um, that that merger

is well communicated, as I mentioned.

669

Um, but if you start to see major

turnover and stuff, you've got to hit,

670

find out what that issue might be.

671

Why are the employees leaving

and that with the leaving of

672

employees comes revenue decreases.

673

So that that metric of turnover

is really key and particularly

674

early on to be watching for that.

675

Um, you know overall liquidity balance

sheet issues your cash flows All

676

of those things are important just

as the single company importance is

677

Tim Winkler: Yeah, there's

a lot to unpack there.

678

Go ahead, Mike.

679

Mike Gruen: I was just gonna ask

you, I mean, how do you help?

680

Uh, I assume you're also helping on

diligence around the products and

681

services that they offer as well.

682

I mean, I've gone through mergers and

come out the other side where it turns

683

out like, yeah, we just got merged with

a company and their technology is vapor.

684

It never worked.

685

And the one, whoever did the

diligence clearly dropped the ball.

686

Yeah.

687

Greg Buckis: Yep.

688

Yeah, absolutely.

689

So you're looking at the

actual contractual agreements.

690

Mm-Hmm.

691

and their customer set.

692

And there'll be a time where they'll

open that window and you can actually

693

interview the customers because you, you

definitely wanna kick all the tires before

694

you decide to make that acquisition.

695

Yep.

696

Tim Winkler: Yeah.

697

And I, I wanna, uh, unpack

a little bit more on that.

698

You know, the.

699

The cultural, um, kind of side of things.

700

Uh, but before we do, so it sounds to

me like you're approaching this from,

701

uh, customers that are looking to

do an acquisition, uh, or, you know,

702

maybe you're on the, you know, higher

side of the negotiating table here.

703

Do you have companies coming

to you that are looking to.

704

Get acquired or like, you know, they're,

they're, they don't have too many options

705

left in front of them and, you know, see

you all as an outlet to help or yeah,

706

how are you finding, like, how are you,

how are you finding that other company?

707

And then are they, you know, are they

in a short list in your system as well?

708

Like, all right, we're always

going to keep an eye out for.

709

You know, somebody that's

looking to buy or so forth.

710

Greg Buckis: Sure.

711

Um, likewise, we could also help them

with diligence, making sure their

712

financials are clean and solid to

prepare for a sale, um, or maybe a

713

divestiture of a piece of business that

they don't want to continue to grow for

714

whatever reason, but, um, for sure, we

could either help them source to find

715

a company that would like to buy them.

716

That's actually synergistic with

them or complimentary in some way.

717

Um, but we definitely would help them

to look through their entire financials,

718

their employee, uh, compliment, um,

their policies, procedures and practices

719

to make, you know, dust things off,

clean them up, make sure that they are

720

easily auditable, or they have an audit

in place, maybe, um, and look at those

721

audits and see what the outcomes were.

722

But, um, definitely you'd want

to help them create a full

723

deck to sell the business.

724

They usually call them a SIM

confidential information memorandum,

725

and that's kind of your little sales

portfolio from soup to nuts about the

726

marketplace and the size of the market.

727

And the, um, markets they're actually

in, um, and their, their customer set

728

and their financials and their management

team, all of that is kind of given at a,

729

at a high level, but enough information

to show that the business is worthy of

730

purchasing or looking further into it.

731

Tim Winkler: Yeah, such a, uh, a complex

event for, you know, both parties to go

732

through, you know, it's very emotional,

I'm sure, you know, these are businesses

733

that they've been growing for years,

you know, maybe they're, they're,

734

they're business baby, if you will.

735

Um, so I want to talk about that

sensitivity, Megan, and how that

736

rolls into, you know, the, um, uh,

just kind of like the, the cultural

737

aspect of, you know, one team and

integrating with another team.

738

How do you go about this?

739

And, you know, talk me through a

little bit more of like, you know,

740

you went through it firsthand, right.

741

With, with, uh, with

Wolfden and associates.

742

Um, so maybe you can lead in

with that on, you know, what you

743

experienced through that kind of merger

acquisition and how you apply that

744

to some of your customers when you're

helping with consulting with them.

745

Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, absolutely.

746

So, uh, you know, the first

two letters of merger are me.

747

Right.

748

And, and so when you talk about, um,

merging to services organizations,

749

the most important aspect of what you

sell every single day is your people.

750

And so we always, that was kind of a

critical piece of our merger internally.

751

And that's also how we lean

in when we support clients,

752

understanding and getting right.

753

And thinking about pre close,

what are the cultural aspects

754

that we need to be aware of?

755

How does the business get business done?

756

How do they communicate?

757

Do they communicate?

758

What are, you know, Greg mentioned it

earlier, what are the benefit plans?

759

Are we trying to combine two

organizations from day one?

760

Are we going to take a more timely

Um, structured approach to bringing

761

the organizations together.

762

So when we advise on a client,

ideally, we're always in the door

763

having conversations with them

before they even get to close.

764

There's things that you pick up

through interviews, they're sitting

765

through management presentations.

766

Where you think, okay, hold on a minute.

767

I think I heard they do business this way.

768

Let me make sure that I confirm that.

769

Um, when you get a management team in

a room, both management teams in the

770

room and you're able to sit down and

really truly ask them, what is it you

771

are looking to achieve here and what

is the end goal of this transaction,

772

you're able to start pulling out those

cultural aspects that are important

773

to make sure that folks focus on.

774

Um, we did a transaction.

775

We advised on a transaction where,

you know, um, the management teams

776

were trying really hard to pull

out the cultural integration.

777

They said, no, that's

going to be separate.

778

It's going to be different.

779

We're not going to

focus on that right now.

780

Well, everything you do is your

cultural integration, right?

781

How you decide how you're gonna

communicate with the group at large

782

is part of your cultural integration.

783

How you decide what benefit plans to keep?

784

Are we taking the best of both worlds in

both of these organizations to combine

785

and make new code that much better?

786

Or is this truly an acquisition and we're

gonna just Subsume everybody and all

787

the services and we're going to move on.

788

Right.

789

And so to your point, Tim,

a little earlier about their

790

baby, lots of founders.

791

This is their heart and their soul and

24 7 for the last however many years.

792

And so that is.

793

You have to be sensitive to that.

794

You have to understand

where they're coming from.

795

You have to understand

what is the end goal.

796

What is their goal after transaction?

797

Are they like, cool, I'm done here.

798

I'll see you at the beach.

799

Don't call me if you need anything.

800

Or do they want to

continue to be involved?

801

Because even those critical decisions

pre close affect what day one looks

802

like, affect what day 30 looks like,

and affect what day 100 looks like.

803

And those first 100 days are

the most critical to success.

804

Mike Gruen: I imagine there's a lot

of also just as the reality sets in of

805

what's actually happening, a little bit

of like some Rethinking or I'm sure.

806

Tim Winkler: Real estate all the time.

807

Like, uh, like, like seller's remorse.

808

I don't want to sell my home.

809

Meghan DiAndrea: Or, or you drive

past it right after you've closed

810

and you're like, Oh, that's my house.

811

Right.

812

No, it's not your house.

813

Or what did they do to the landscaping?

814

Right.

815

I mean, you,

816

It's the same when you talk about,

you know, a founder and, you

817

know, them, them kind of moving on

from their business, if you will.

818

Um,

819

you have to know what those expectations

are upfront or it leads to some,

820

you know, There, there could be some

really, um, strong personalities

821

that come out of the other side.

822

So,

823

Tim Winkler: um, and you don't want

to be tied to, you know, to that

824

negative kind of PR that comes from

whatever that is or what have you.

825

Meghan DiAndrea: Right, right.

826

The goal is positive, is going

in the positive direction, right?

827

It's another chapter for the organization.

828

It's another chapter for

the founders and the owners.

829

Um, and it's a, and it's a positive one.

830

And so, you know, all of those factors

have an impact on what the culture

831

of the new organization looks like.

832

Tim Winkler: I've got a lot of

questions around, uh, the process.

833

So, um, you know, I'm just play, play a

hypothetical and I was looking to, Uh,

834

acquire a business and, you know, I engage

Deepwater Point and I say, You know, I,

835

is there a certain number of companies

that you present and you recommend

836

like, Hey, look, make sure you're like,

I'm going to send you three or four, I

837

want you to look at these before, you

know, settling on this one or this one.

838

Um, what, what level of like guidance are

you, you know, for maybe someone that's

839

never done this before, you know, are,

are there like some, um, Some, you know,

840

kind of good, good standard practices

here that you might, that you advise them

841

on of, you know, Don't jump at the first

one or, you know, whatever it might be.

842

I'm curious on that process.

843

Meghan DiAndrea: So I think it

really depends on whether or not

844

they know the entity coming into it.

845

So if an organization comes to

us blind and says, Hey, help me

846

find a target to acquire, you

know, we sit down, we understand

847

what are they trying to achieve?

848

Is it, is it growth Greg

to Greg's point earlier?

849

Are we trying to gain

additional capabilities?

850

Are we purchasing technology?

851

We try to really dig down and

understand what is the Genesis

852

for this potential acquisition?

853

What are they trying to achieve?

854

And then we present lots

of candidate profiles.

855

Um, it's like matchmaking at

the end of the day, right?

856

Well, this 1 doesn't feel right.

857

The management teams got together.

858

The founders got together.

859

This wasn't really.

860

Didn't wasn't a good match.

861

Okay.

862

Why?

863

What are those reevaluation

criteria that we're going to

864

then go back and whittle down?

865

And so we're, it's an iterative process.

866

We're constantly having

conversations with.

867

With the ownership about

what makes the most sense.

868

Um, and there's lots of

companies that do, you know.

869

That that service the government.

870

And so, um, we're always out there

looking for, you know, additional targets.

871

And sometimes it takes it takes it can

take a really long time for a company

872

to make a decision about what that next.

873

Investments going to look like, um,

and sometimes it's quicker, right?

874

Because it feels right.

875

It feels good.

876

Everybody gets together.

877

It just makes sense.

878

Financially, it makes sense

from a synergy perspective.

879

It makes sense.

880

And they go for it.

881

Mike Gruen: Yeah.

882

Are they ever coming to you with

that sort of like that part?

883

Like I haven't come from the space.

884

I know that we've, I was a companies

that were acquired by company.

885

We knew each other.

886

Like we had been working together

for a long time and we're like, We

887

don't know how to make, like, we want

to merge our, and with that type of

888

situation also, they'd be coming to

you for helping with the, with that.

889

Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah, absolutely.

890

Lots, lots of clients that we support.

891

Those are existing relationships,

892

Tim Winkler: right?

893

Meghan DiAndrea: CEOs maybe have known

each other for a really long time.

894

Or they play in some of the same

spaces or they do some of the same

895

things, but for different agencies.

896

So they've crossed paths and

there's, there's already an existing

897

understanding and relationship there.

898

So absolutely, Mike, there's most of the

time, that's kind of what comes to us as,

899

Hey, we've already had this conversation.

900

We've been dancing around each other.

901

Help us come to the table, help us figure

out what the deal should look like.

902

And then how do we merge and integrate

these two entities to make sure that we

903

get the true value at the end of the day?

904

Tim Winkler: Cool.

905

I, you don't have to answer

this in specifics, uh, but.

906

You know, from a cost perspective, right?

907

Um, a couple of questions on that.

908

So are you all, how do

you all kind of charge?

909

Is this like a retainer

that you all charge?

910

Is it an hourly?

911

Is there a percentage of the

acquisition that gets filtered out?

912

Like how is it, you know, what, what, what

might a founder expect if they're engaging

913

deep water on, you know, how something

like this is, Service or charge to them.

914

Meghan DiAndrea: You want

me to answer that, Megan?

915

I can take it.

916

You don't have to say

the specific numbers.

917

I'm just

918

Greg Buckis: curious.

919

Well, it depends on what the request is.

920

So that a due diligence effort.

921

Depending on the size of the

company, we kind of know how many

922

hours and the people we would use.

923

So we try to give them a fixed price

and usually that works out pretty,

924

pretty well, and they can gauge and

know if they financially can afford it.

925

But if they walk away from the deal,

that fixed price is still owed.

926

It does.

927

It's not contingent upon

closing a sale or a purchase.

928

Tim Winkler: I see.

929

Greg Buckis: Yeah.

930

And likewise, though, there are

instances where we go out and

931

canvass the community and decide what

company they would want to acquire.

932

And if the deal goes through, we can get

say, um, more upside and do a succession

933

fee, so it's really costly to buy a

company and in the millions of dollars.

934

So, you know, a success fee for us,

even though we've done a lot of front

935

work for, um, you know, lower, lower

costs, if you will, on a perspective

936

of the whole deal, if it really goes

through and we get a success fee,

937

that's, it's a really a nice thing.

938

Yeah.

939

Tim Winkler: Yeah.

940

Yes, success fees on real

estate transactions are also,

941

you know, pretty, pretty lofty.

942

Um, you know, a lot of this

guy, you know, I, I just relate

943

a lot of it to recruiting too.

944

You know, when we do like an

executive search, right, it's, it's

945

a, you know, it could take up to six

months to find this right person.

946

And it's a lot of iteration

on, I thought we wanted, this

947

is what we thought we needed.

948

Now we think we need this.

949

And it's like, you know, having

that flexibility with the, With

950

the client, um, knowing that this

isn't an easy decision by any means.

951

And, uh, it might take as long as

it takes, you know, have having that

952

flexibility with them seems like something

that is super valuable to, to offer them.

953

Um, cool.

954

I think that's all I had

on the, on the, on the.

955

You know, the, that kind of side

of the, the transactional stuff.

956

Is there anything else you wanted

to add on that Megan or Greg, before

957

we transition to the final segment?

958

Cool.

959

Yeah, I think we, we, we

knocked out quite a bit.

960

Awesome.

961

All right, well, we're going to

close it out with a final segment

962

called the five second scramble.

963

This is a fun way to kind of, uh, cap

things off with, uh, some rapid fire

964

Q and A, some of it business, some

of it just kind of fun, you know,

965

personal stuff, not, not too personal.

966

Um, I, uh, I'll lead it to you,

Mike, to kick it off with Greg

967

and then Megan, I'll, I'll, uh.

968

Lead you off after that.

969

Mike Gruen: Here we go.

970

Uh, what's the biggest trend,

uh, you're seeing or a big trend

971

you're seeing in GovCon right now?

972

Greg Buckis: Okay.

973

Um, so we had somebody in house who went

to a conference and the Intel they brought

974

back was, uh, companies are leaning in to

try to get more fixed price deals versus

975

time and material, so they're pricing out

the job and estimating the amount of time.

976

But they're leaning towards more fixed

price deals instead of the time and

977

material, meaning pay by the hour and

then you just rack up and keep going

978

until you've got your end product.

979

Um, so that's kind of new.

980

Um, the other piece is that, um,

uh, companies in the consulting

981

space really also need some kind

of a bolt on whether it's a IP.

982

Piece of software that they also

can help to engage their client and

983

sell that furthers their business.

984

So many companies, even though they're

considered consulting firms, um, they

985

have 1, products that enhance what they

offer from a consulting perspective.

986

Mike Gruen: Is there a historical figure

who inspired you throughout your career?

987

Greg Buckis: Oh gosh um I love finance so

I think warren buffett is amazing He's an

988

investor that most people aspire to be.

989

So I read his book,

snowball, some 900 pages.

990

Fascinating.

991

Mike Gruen: Uh, what's the best piece

of advice you've ever been given?

992

Greg Buckis: Gosh, um,

work hard and learn a lot.

993

Mike Gruen: Good advice.

994

Uh, what's the biggest challenge,

uh, deep water spacing right now?

995

Greg Buckis: So we are getting solidarity.

996

That's why I'm at the company so we can

prepare for potential other acquisitions.

997

And we want to ensure that we, um, our

consultants are here for the long haul and

998

the employees are here for the long haul.

999

Um, so, you know, they like the

culture and we have adequate growth.

00:54:10,905 --> 00:54:13,505

Mike Gruen: Speaking of culture,

what's your favorite cultural value?

00:54:15,885 --> 00:54:17,905

Greg Buckis: I think we

have really good people.

00:54:17,935 --> 00:54:22,235

They care about each other and there's

some activities after work that we have.

00:54:22,315 --> 00:54:24,255

And so it's kind of a fun place to be.

00:54:26,455 --> 00:54:29,175

Mike Gruen: Switching gears a little,

what was your favorite meal as a kid?

00:54:30,945 --> 00:54:34,805

Greg Buckis: Oh gosh,

I would say spaghetti.

00:54:35,314 --> 00:54:35,894

Nice.

00:54:38,345 --> 00:54:40,685

Mike Gruen: What's the most

outdated piece of technology

00:54:41,155 --> 00:54:42,354

that you just can't let go of?

00:54:44,075 --> 00:54:47,005

Greg Buckis: Gosh, Excel,

but it's not outdated.

00:54:53,055 --> 00:54:54,155

It's phenomenal.

00:54:54,455 --> 00:54:57,865

I mean, I used to use WYSIWYG

and Lotus one, two, three.

00:54:57,865 --> 00:54:58,824

I'm aging myself.

00:54:59,624 --> 00:55:00,744

They were dogs.

00:55:01,105 --> 00:55:04,745

You could type in a string of 16

characters to get your printer to work.

00:55:05,135 --> 00:55:05,385

Come on.

00:55:05,385 --> 00:55:06,271

You can still play.

00:55:06,271 --> 00:55:06,493

You

00:55:06,493 --> 00:55:08,595

Mike Gruen: can play a flight

simulator game in Excel.

00:55:10,475 --> 00:55:12,105

Greg Buckis: I don't think.

00:55:12,465 --> 00:55:16,735

Yeah, we don't have technology that we

want to throw out the window yet here.

00:55:17,475 --> 00:55:22,235

Mike Gruen: Um, so, uh, what's

the largest land animal you think

00:55:22,235 --> 00:55:23,425

you could take in a street fight?

00:55:25,165 --> 00:55:25,985

Oh my gosh,

00:55:31,685 --> 00:55:34,175

Greg Buckis: I want to say alligator,

but I'd probably get killed.

00:55:37,055 --> 00:55:39,165

Tim Winkler: Yeah, I might put

money on that alligator, I think.

00:55:39,405 --> 00:55:41,655

Greg Buckis: Yeah, I don't,

I think I'd get eaten alive.

00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:45,260

Mike Gruen: Uh,

00:55:47,590 --> 00:55:52,070

what's, uh, that's not a fair, you

can pick a bunny rabbit or a turtle.

00:55:52,070 --> 00:55:52,950

It doesn't have to be a,

00:55:56,200 --> 00:55:57,050

Greg Buckis: that's probably more,

00:55:59,329 --> 00:56:02,300

Mike Gruen: um, uh, what's a

charity or corporate philanthropy

00:56:02,310 --> 00:56:03,219

that's near and dear to you.

00:56:05,689 --> 00:56:06,269

Greg Buckis: Yeah.

00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:10,569

So I was on, I helped with their

books and records for three years.

00:56:10,570 --> 00:56:12,160

It's a company called, um,

00:56:14,710 --> 00:56:18,050

gosh, uh, gaining.

00:56:18,610 --> 00:56:26,700

Um, changing perceptions, and basically

it's ex cons who come out of the, um,

00:56:26,720 --> 00:56:29,120

prisons, and they're trying to get work.

00:56:30,020 --> 00:56:35,619

And so I think it's really an admirable

cause, and it's a tough thing, right?

00:56:35,939 --> 00:56:39,770

You know, that you got these people

who paid their time, and they got that

00:56:39,770 --> 00:56:42,020

black mark on their, on their record.

00:56:42,575 --> 00:56:46,495

And so giving them a chance,

um, I, it was really great.

00:56:46,525 --> 00:56:50,805

A lot of the organization found them

jobs, whether it's a trash collector

00:56:50,805 --> 00:56:54,945

or starting their own business, or,

um, they actually clean the kitchens

00:56:54,954 --> 00:56:56,765

for all the restaurants, downtown DC.

00:56:57,724 --> 00:56:58,084

Yeah.

00:56:58,525 --> 00:56:58,925

Awesome.

00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:01,860

Mike Gruen: Um, in fact, 1 of

the 1 of the companies I worked

00:57:01,860 --> 00:57:03,590

with, we had our cleaning guy.

00:57:03,600 --> 00:57:06,250

He had gone through the prison

system, started his own company

00:57:06,250 --> 00:57:07,489

and still live in Baltimore.

00:57:07,489 --> 00:57:09,189

And basically, he only employed.

00:57:09,790 --> 00:57:13,289

Um, people from the neighborhood,

ex con, stuff like that, just giving

00:57:13,290 --> 00:57:15,379

them an opportunity to work and.

00:57:15,935 --> 00:57:18,495

And it was all cleaning services

and and stuff like that.

00:57:18,505 --> 00:57:19,105

It's pretty awesome.

00:57:19,735 --> 00:57:20,625

Very inspirational guy.

00:57:21,235 --> 00:57:22,675

Um, all right, last one.

00:57:23,045 --> 00:57:26,075

If you could live in any time period

in history, which would you choose?

00:57:28,045 --> 00:57:28,805

Greg Buckis: Oh, gosh,

00:57:31,424 --> 00:57:34,545

probably the 40s, I guess.

00:57:34,905 --> 00:57:38,130

And the reason is we didn't

have all the technology today.

00:57:38,130 --> 00:57:39,545

I think that the kids.

00:57:40,425 --> 00:57:45,825

Are so, um, used to trying to grab

technology to run their life instead

00:57:45,825 --> 00:57:49,324

of actually living, you know, with

the ball in the bat and going outside

00:57:49,335 --> 00:57:55,375

and, um, we're losing that internal

communication and care that we have.

00:57:56,135 --> 00:57:56,565

Mike Gruen: Nice.

00:57:57,105 --> 00:57:57,575

Tim Winkler: All right.

00:57:58,055 --> 00:57:58,544

Well done.

00:57:58,595 --> 00:57:59,095

Well done.

00:57:59,904 --> 00:58:00,175

Good job.

00:58:00,294 --> 00:58:00,654

Well done.

00:58:00,655 --> 00:58:04,485

I'm going to tee up with an alligator

fight here at the end of this.

00:58:08,375 --> 00:58:09,315

Megan, you ready?

00:58:09,445 --> 00:58:10,425

Ready to rock and roll?

00:58:10,864 --> 00:58:11,625

Meghan DiAndrea: I don't know.

00:58:11,625 --> 00:58:12,255

I hope so.

00:58:13,310 --> 00:58:15,360

Tim Winkler: We'll, we'll, we'll

be, uh, we'll be gentle here.

00:58:15,650 --> 00:58:18,160

I'm going to, uh, I'm going to tee

this up because I forgot to ask this

00:58:18,170 --> 00:58:21,790

in our conversation about, uh, you

know, deep water points products.

00:58:21,819 --> 00:58:28,340

So, uh, explain, you know, deep water

points, uh, product GWAC Northstar.

00:58:28,715 --> 00:58:30,905

To me as if I was a five year old.

00:58:32,175 --> 00:58:33,805

Meghan DiAndrea: Oh, as if

you were a five year old.

00:58:33,975 --> 00:58:34,585

Oh, gosh.

00:58:37,165 --> 00:58:39,675

Well, there's this thing

called the federal government.

00:58:42,835 --> 00:58:47,115

I would say, uh, GWAC Morestar is, is our,

00:58:49,224 --> 00:58:52,545

is our software as a service

product that we developed.

00:58:52,900 --> 00:58:56,090

Based on feedback and insight that

we got from our clients, which is

00:58:56,140 --> 00:59:00,910

that, you know, it's hard not only

to win one of these contracts, but

00:59:00,910 --> 00:59:04,429

then to manage all the task orders

that come out of it and I may win it.

00:59:04,430 --> 00:59:09,070

And then I don't have anybody to kind of

catch all of the, um, task orders that

00:59:09,070 --> 00:59:11,960

come out and vet them and figure out

whether or not I should go after them.

00:59:11,960 --> 00:59:15,910

And so lots of organizations wind

up not actually getting the value.

00:59:15,980 --> 00:59:18,030

So, GWAC Northstar is that.

00:59:18,030 --> 00:59:18,174

Yeah.

00:59:18,625 --> 00:59:23,645

supplement to your BD team that can

help take a look at all those task

00:59:23,645 --> 00:59:26,795

orders and determine whether or not

they're of value to you and whether

00:59:26,795 --> 00:59:27,814

or not you should go after them.

00:59:28,770 --> 00:59:29,820

And we do it in real time,

00:59:29,950 --> 00:59:37,309

Mike Gruen: very sophisticated five

year old, but it's not a fair question.

00:59:37,310 --> 00:59:39,260

Tim Winkler: Adults don't

understand our federal government

00:59:39,260 --> 00:59:40,973

and how it works at this point.

00:59:40,973 --> 00:59:44,130

So try a product to streamline all that.

00:59:44,130 --> 00:59:45,313

Yeah, you did.

00:59:45,313 --> 00:59:47,286

You did a great job.

00:59:47,286 --> 00:59:51,626

Um, give me, uh, your, your

favorite aspects of the company

00:59:51,626 --> 00:59:52,969

culture at deepwater point.

00:59:54,865 --> 00:59:58,915

Meghan DiAndrea: Gosh, I love the

fact that no matter who you are

00:59:58,915 --> 01:00:02,435

and where you come from, if you

contribute to federal government

01:00:02,445 --> 01:00:04,205

services, we've got a place for you.

01:00:04,535 --> 01:00:08,425

Um, we truly have some of the best, most.

01:00:09,175 --> 01:00:13,405

Um, you know, the best smartest, most

innovative individuals that we can

01:00:13,405 --> 01:00:15,525

tap into every day, and it just makes.

01:00:16,055 --> 01:00:17,775

Our work environment exciting.

01:00:18,215 --> 01:00:19,975

Uh, you never know who

you're going to walk into.

01:00:19,975 --> 01:00:22,585

You never know who you're going to

be placed on an engagement with.

01:00:23,065 --> 01:00:28,175

Um, so just constant learning, growing,

coaching, mentoring, it's, it's great.

01:00:29,624 --> 01:00:35,395

Tim Winkler: What would you say is one of

the most sought after, uh, attributes of a

01:00:35,395 --> 01:00:38,075

consultant that would thrive at Deepwater?

01:00:38,785 --> 01:00:39,435

Meghan DiAndrea: Ooh.

01:00:40,600 --> 01:00:42,230

Certainly the agility.

01:00:42,540 --> 01:00:51,080

Um, you know, not every consulting

firm, you're consulting one day on

01:00:51,129 --> 01:00:55,440

a 50 million company and the next

day on a 2 billion company, right?

01:00:55,530 --> 01:01:00,620

So the agility to bring your best

self, your ability to be confident

01:01:00,640 --> 01:01:04,490

in what you bring to the table,

um, to listen, to collaborate.

01:01:04,740 --> 01:01:06,210

Those are all really important.

01:01:07,625 --> 01:01:10,995

Tim Winkler: What kind of roles are

you actively hiring for a deepwater?

01:01:12,195 --> 01:01:13,525

Meghan DiAndrea: Uh, interesting question.

01:01:13,565 --> 01:01:16,065

So we're always looking for

the best and the brightest.

01:01:16,065 --> 01:01:21,115

I would say, um, we've got some

openings for some orals coaches, um,

01:01:21,245 --> 01:01:25,434

capture and proposal folks are always

technical writers, proposal managers.

01:01:25,444 --> 01:01:27,875

Those are always individuals that

we're looking at conversations.

01:01:29,915 --> 01:01:33,725

Tim Winkler: When it comes to meshing

cultures between two businesses, post

01:01:33,725 --> 01:01:38,725

merger, what's the biggest hurdle that you

see kind of impacting a smooth transition?

01:01:39,765 --> 01:01:39,775

Meghan DiAndrea: Misalignment.

01:01:42,190 --> 01:01:45,030

with what the ultimate goal is.

01:01:45,390 --> 01:01:48,760

So a lot of times individuals

or organizations will say

01:01:48,760 --> 01:01:49,820

we want to do no harm.

01:01:49,870 --> 01:01:50,730

What does that mean?

01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:52,270

Tell me what that means.

01:01:52,310 --> 01:01:54,810

It's different to every

single person, right?

01:01:54,890 --> 01:02:00,930

Um, or we, um, I'll just leave it at that.

01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:04,300

It's really hard to overcome if

there's misalignment from the

01:02:04,300 --> 01:02:07,480

beginning around what the ultimate

goal is at the end of the day.

01:02:08,230 --> 01:02:08,680

Tim Winkler: Good stuff.

01:02:09,360 --> 01:02:11,809

Uh, describe your morning routine.

01:02:11,870 --> 01:02:20,040

Meghan DiAndrea: Um, let's see, I

get up, I'm trying to go to Pilates a

01:02:20,040 --> 01:02:25,030

couple days a week, but mostly it's just

running full speed ahead into the day.

01:02:25,060 --> 01:02:28,880

Got two little kids, so we're, you know,

getting everybody dressed and off to

01:02:29,030 --> 01:02:31,120

school, breakfast in the car sometimes.

01:02:31,870 --> 01:02:35,630

And then, um, you know, my

commute from Haymarket into

01:02:35,630 --> 01:02:38,300

Tyson's and coffee along the way.

01:02:39,050 --> 01:02:39,430

Mike Gruen: There you go.

01:02:39,780 --> 01:02:41,410

Only one, only one coffee along the way?

01:02:42,509 --> 01:02:42,929

Meghan DiAndrea: No.

01:02:44,929 --> 01:02:49,259

Usually I have a coffee in, that I've

started before I leave the house and

01:02:49,259 --> 01:02:51,620

gets me most of the way through my drive.

01:02:51,640 --> 01:02:56,450

And then immediately upon entry into

the office, I am grabbing another one.

01:02:57,670 --> 01:02:58,110

Tim Winkler: That's right.

01:02:58,110 --> 01:02:59,029

That's right.

01:02:59,610 --> 01:03:00,080

Um.

01:03:00,450 --> 01:03:05,460

What's an area of GovTech modernization

that you're most excited to see

01:03:05,460 --> 01:03:07,450

in the next three to five years?

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Meghan DiAndrea: Oh, I'm not sure I'm

the right person to answer that question.

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Tim Winkler: No worries.

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We can jump that one.

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What's your, what's your

favorite app on your phone?

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Meghan DiAndrea: Oh, my

favorite app on my phone is

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this is going to be lame, but

probably my kids like school app.

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It keeps me, it lets me know

what I'm missing, right?

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Like it connects with my calendar.

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When are they getting home?

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What afterschool activities do we

have and those sorts of things.

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And so it keeps me straight.

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Um, so we've got, um, parent view

is the name of the one that, that

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our county uses, It like the teacher

connects into it so I can get,

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I get a text messages from it.

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And yeah, cool.

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Let's see what's coming.

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So don't work late.

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Those sorts of things.

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Tim Winkler: Interesting space.

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Meghan DiAndrea: Yeah.

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Tim Winkler: Um, what's a

charity or corporate philanthropy

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that's near and dear to you?

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Meghan DiAndrea: So I love to bake.

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Um, and I work with an

organization called cakes for kids.

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which donates birthday cakes

to kids in foster care.

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Um, and so for me, it's just about making

sure that even if you're in a tough

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situation, a non permanent home, you have

the ability to be celebrated that day.

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Tim Winkler: That's awesome.

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I, my wife's a huge baker, so I'm

gonna have to tip her off to that.

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That seems like a really neat cause.

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It's a

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Meghan DiAndrea: great organization.

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They've got really great, um, breach

here in the Northern Virginia area.